Fansubbing

I really SERIOUSLY hope noone on Yea Forums thinks like this

>Which, since it is something that actually happens in English,
BUT THESE ARENT PEOPLE SPEAKING IN ENGLISH, THEYRE SPEAKING JAPANESE, FROM A JAPANESE CULTURAL CONTEXT
This is blatantly changing dialogue because the character's actions are foreign to the "sub" audience; just fucking put in jelly donuts while youre at it

Most of the awkward, stilted bullshit comes from people claiming to focus on localization as they come up with really shitty replacements for Japanese speech patterns and phrases.

The worse subs the better, it give you that push you need to stop being pleb and actually learn Japanese.

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>Fansubs shouldn't be for casuals who buy CR/netflix subscriptions
But user, if I don't make it casual then how's CR/netflix gonna notice my work and hire me?

Localization means making it so the dialogue flows naturally in a different language, therefore localizing it. Something critical to the very action of changing something from one language to another. Languages are incompatible on many levels, and so the basic concepts being conveyed need to be broken down and reworked into the new language while making the utmost effort to retain the same meaning. As opposed to directly translating what you see written right down to maintaining the same stilted sentence structure. But localization has come to be thought of as 4kids tier rewrites.

I'm thinking of stuff like writing "It can't be helped" every single time you see 仕方がない. Too often do I see translators just default to what they see as the textbook translation for something and put no effort into making it feel like a natural part of the conversation.

>huge sitting ass
>corset pushing boobs up
Good lord.

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First rule: shoot everyone who says "weeb". After the trash is cleaned up, you may begin listening to the opinions that are worth listening to.

Wait, the butthurt is only about honorifics? Nothing else? Cripes, with the pictures OP gave us I thought we were going to have another kitchen sink sort of fandango. Reading that thread has made me less of a person.

Not only that, but that torrent is for an episode that offers both a version without honorifics and a version with them. Some autismlord started wildly shitposting, some retard got baited, and the result was a total shitshow that exemplifies what's wrong with the cartel.

Why?

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The cartel wanted attention.

Yuuko not Yuko
Yen not Dollar
OP/ED songs lyrics + translation
Name order and honorifics
Typesettings
Why can't English subs be like this? sad..

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its now the most commented post on nyaa.si

I'm anal about having honorifics because it's extremely distracting to hear "Ikari Shinji-san" while at the same time reading "Mr. Shinji Ikari". It just completely clashes every time.
My brain needs a full second to understand what the fuck just happened and by the time im able to keep reading again, the subs have moved on to the next dialogue. Excessive localization is just as awful as a bad translation.
Cartel niggers want to sub anime but at the same time treats its japanese-ness like some filth to be scrubbed off.

>Casuals do not know what random Japanese words including honorifics mean.
It is completely idiotic for a hobby or medium to simplify things for the sake retarded casuals who don't know the first, most basic things about said hobby. Newcomers should be the ones to adapt to the hobby, not the other way around.

>Cartel niggers want to sub anime but at the same time treats its japanese-ness like some filth to be scrubbed off.
Exactly, theres this idea that anything cultural-specific can simply be replaced by something sorta similar in a western English-speaking context

>Newcomers should be the ones to adapt to the hobby, not the other way around.
EXACTLY, herkz and his ilk think gatekeeping is a bad thing, that subss (and anime by extension) should be easily accessible to anyone who has never watched anime. Sure if youre a "professional"subber working for CR and the like, but this is a fansub torrent tracker; you shouldnt need to worry about normalfags.

>Localization means making it so the dialogue flows naturally in a different language,
So, like I said, you're broadening the meaning of the word to the point of absurdity. That's not what it means and never has meant.

these are good guidelines, they make me hard

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You are the problem. You are stuck halfway into learning the language and its ruining it for you and people who cant understand a single iota of the language. Actually learn the language and fuck off entirely from the sub arena.

>anime
>hobby
And you wonder why people call you w**b

>I sure do wonder why vast swathes of professional translators, including plenty who live and work in Japan, disagree that honorifics are significant, then. Surely they can’t all be wrong.
The GJM guy is pretty retarded. Pointing at other people is not a replacement for an argument.

> ">anime
>hobby
And you wonder why people call you w**b "
>he says, on an anime forum
go back to r/anime

>Do thing for entertainment
>its now a hobby
Woooooahhh

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>fansubs

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And here we have a fine example of just how correct is.

but being gay IS wrong though

Since when has the word "otaku" been replaced by "weeb"?

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The word got co-opted years ago. I didn't notice until...2012, I think? Probably happened a bit before that.

since normalshits found out anime got them views and attention

Since the latest wave of ironic memesters (2015-) found a new hobby to latch on.

No way, it's what said. I wholeheartedly blame filthyfrank for teaching his underaged audience the word.

>user, Evangelion looks like weeb garbage.
>OH SHIT user IT'S JOJO FRIDAY! Let's watch the episode together! :DDDD
I HATE IT

>typesetting
That has to be the most time-consuming part of the script. I've been fooling around with Aegisub in my spare time in hopes of re-timing and adding typesetting to HS rips in hopes of adding them to a BD raw, but making shit look good like that is daunting. I have to think the cartel is using custom tools for this, and I doubt they're willing to share.

Recently I looked at Vivid's script for Amagi Brilliant Park, and the OP alone accounts for half the .ass file size. I find it hard to believe they came up with that on the fly, even if it only needed to be done once.

Otaku doesn't even refer specifically to anime you dumbass.

spats x thighgap otp

just translate shit.
localization should be done only in dubs for the brainlet
even games are suffering from this.

Pretend you're always right and never explain why (unless it's a fun fact).

based nii-sama. he makes herkz seeth every time he uploads

since normalfags invaded the hobby thanks to streaming services
even the thots from mt work watch anime now

Thank god nyaa.se is dead. The people who own nyaa.si at least have the decency to lock these comments and stay away from publicly posting.
Just remembering that moderator faggot on nyaa.se with the giant brony avatar flaunting his ego around the website still makes me want to die

Now if you add tl notes for the untranslatable it would be perfect.

>pic
What a complete fucking idiot.
>fast scroll through
>herkz and gjm sperging
Pottery.

patiently waiting for daiz to start posting without his trip and then seethe on twitter when people disagree with him

>reflect present day
>improve

Said the faggot who ignores that companies that hires "professional" translators keeps honorifics in many shows and manga series. But seriously when those faggots said "improve upon" they are just boasting their egos thinking they are relevant in any form, and just want to ignore what most of the community really wants. And then there's the deal with localization, not your subs aren't garbage because you remove honorifics, your are disgusting trash because of things like change "onee-sama" to "my lady", fucking retards.

>If you have to pause and google what -chan means, you either need to watch more anime, google those things and actually learn something and get your head out of your american ass (im american too), or just not watch anime if you dont want to deal with the CULTURAL product of a DIFFERENT culture

Marry me, user. :3

To be honest most translators don't know enough japanese or even english to properly translate everything. Usually these are the ones most vocal about "localization" since they themselves are lacking in understanding.

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Did herkz and company just want an excuse to seem relevant again or are the subs actually that bad?

>Since when has the word "otaku" been replaced by "weeb"?

Since fucking 2005 you fucking moron. You'd know that if you were actually from here.

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God damn Indonesian weebs are dedicated

I don't understand why you niggas keep giving that thing attention.

Isn't otaku is just nerd for japanese?

Spoiler: weeb is to weeaboo what normie is to normalfag.
If you really were from here, you'd know that you don't use weeaboo for everything either. Good job showing off your ED researching skills though.

>spoonfeeding
Retard.

No?
Weeb and Otaku actually had different meaning back then, until normalfags and ironicshitters spam the shit out of "weeb" word to refer to anything anime-related.

Depends on what you want, though I found that after a bit of getting used to you can do most things in an afternoon. Though it obviously depends on the level you want things since you can technically replace the whole screen with subs.

>get out of the sub andnime scene for years because real life kicked in
>this faggotry is still going and seems to be worse
this fucking community needs to be cleansed

rub a dub dub

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What did he mean by this?

based

we used wapanese newfag

Fuck, it's Russian hackers!

Why can't we just have literal translations? Just leave Boku, Ore, Watashi and stuff in, if it's a comedy series use TL notes for the jokes especially if it relies on puns, and I don't care if it sounds weird in English translate the script as literal as possible instead of this fucking liberal style of translating cause some retard can't use google or try to understnad the pure and righteous japanese culture

And the funniest thing is when they get so buttblasted by people who defend leaving small things in Japanese that they start saying that you might as well leave everything in Japanese.

Yeah it's so funny, they are always the first to mock someone for liking or leaving honorifics in but then they throw such a shitfest themselves when they see any Japanese word in the subs, it's hilarious.

All of these. No localization, just translation. You should strive to preserve the original meaning and form as much as possible, it should be clear that you're not reading an English text, but something written from a Japanese point of view for a Japanese audience. If I wanted something else I'd just be watching American cartoons.
Acessibility to the general masses who are not anime hobbyists is not important and I'd argue it's even prejudicial when a translator puts too much emphasis into it.

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Weebs in lots of countries outside the States are very dedicated. It's not necessarily a Western thing either because I know French subs are pretty good from what I've seen

wtf!

Localization should be about helping people understand what is happening in the current context, not completely replacing existing content and rewriting the script in order to appeal to whatever audience you're trying to market towards.

The Pokemon 4kids dub is a good example of utterly horrible localization. Apparently children which could perfectly understand electric mice and turtles with water cannons would be utterly confused by the novelty of a 'rice ball'. Rather than treat it as part of the pokemon world, and maybe part of the real world too, we got the infamous 'donut'. Horrible thing to do, and for no reason whatsoever.

Anyone who miss the fansub era is either a newfag trying to fit in, or is cancerous golem pulling teamsports shit. Choice is good, but not when you have 10+ choices all intentionally being wrong just to be contrarian or different from the others.

>please take away my ability to choose
as expected of cr zoomers

>mm yes please let me choose between cancer and aids, it's for FREEEDOM
Anglos really are mindless insects basing their insectile brain on concepts they ironically is squashing themselves, rather than the end product

I like to see retards like herkz complain about honorifics and such, saying they should be removed to make them more accessible to people, when in reality, pro localization staff used to remove them (and use western naming order) because they were paid per edits. That's not really the case anymore.

>choosing between cancer and aids is worse than being forced to get both at once

Sadly, the dialogue regarding translation standards has come to revolve almost solely around the presence of honorifics because it's very easy to tell whether they're used or not even if you have absolutely no insight into anything else and it's used as a way to determine what "side" you're on. It's basically a two-party political system where idiots look for whether you're Team Localization or Team Literal Translation and just assume everything else fits in line with their ideology without actually considering the other elements.

It's a real shame because it's a purely stylistic difference with very little relation to the actually quality of a release.

Can't wait for h*rkz to take a screenshot and post it on xer twitter

Based

>entire companies pay someone to change/rewrite your work so that retards can process it easier
Who is paying money for people to actually do this? Are nips retarded or did jews really manage to convince them that this is what we wanted.

4kids

Nips want money, they don't care whether gaijin actually get good translations. And western companies that license anime also want money so they must appeal to the lowest common denominator.

Don't be some self important attention hog who cares more about their ego than the target audience. This is nearly impossible because nearly every person that does these sort of things are pure narcissists that only do it for the attention in the first place. If they just wanted to watch the anime, they already know japanese. If they wanted to give eopel what they want they wouldn't make "Community-contrarian" decisions.

Its almost the same thing as someone making a mod for a video game and releasing it online, except there's the case of them making for themselves first and everything else is just secondary. If you know Japanese well enough to translate, there's no need sub it to watch it yourself, and would only do so that others could watch it because you're either a cool guy (and actually do what people like) or you just want your e-peen to grow (do what you want and scoff at everyone else).

Hell, look at all the shitty mangasites that do the same garbage. Yonkou does it for the attention and nothing else. Mangastream wants to get hired by Viz or who the fuck ever.

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>implying commie/gg's memesubs weren't good for a laugh
I'd post that scene from 8man but I don't have commie's subs for it anymore and they aren't seeding any of their old releases and I don't think commie's irc has a xdcc bot set up currently

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niggers*
Also yes, herkz is an annoying e-tranny

>DA JEWZ DID DIS
fucking retard, you belong on Yea Forums or /pol/ not here. Go back to your shithole

Please do not pretend to be a retard on that level, throwing away all your pride for a (You) is not worth it.

Yes but someone would have had to convince them that having some wannabe movie producer college dropout hack rewrite their story would be a profitable move first.
>subverts your cultures for over a millennium
>psh nothing personal kiddo wasnt us

Herkz is in here right now reading. I'm sure he'll screencap and try to post everything in here as proof he's right somehow.

>the cartel is using custom tools for this, and I doubt they're willing to share
They are and they are. Go search for Aegisub automation tools, they are invaluable for doing high-level effects. There's even a repository for auto-updated a bunch of them through Aegisub.

Whenever you see a million lines for something, it's almost certainly the result of them making one or two lines and automating everything else. It's still time-consuming, but they've often got dedicated people for it and existing work to pull from. We've just got ourselves, so we should at least steal from their work whenever possible.

None of the stuff in that screenshot is hard, though. It's just standard use of layers. The hardest part would be finding a good font if you don't already have a decent list of preferred ones, which you will once you do this for a year or so.

Are you a cute 2d girl?

k

>Yes but someone would have had to convince them that having some wannabe movie producer college dropout hack rewrite their story would be a profitable move first
There's no need for that. Western licenser knows a larger audience = more money, Japanese producer doesn't need to be convinced because it costs him literally nothing to license his work to a Western company and it doesn't affect his target audience in Japan.

Everyone here is a little girl, user.

That's only 'not what it meant' because you yourself decided that.
To the general populace modifying sentence structure and the like to better convey meaning does fall under localization.

Anyone know what the degenerate inbred that is herkz looks like?

I'm not.

>he lost the loli lottery
Pitiful.

Cringe as fuck, I get when companies do localization or even better transcreation (just make shit up that kinda sounds the same meaning, maybe) because they just want to sell the product but why would fansubs do that shit?

Btw as professional interpreter I can confirm that IRL people that engage in literary translation, localization, etc are retarded as fuck
They hide in indirect translation and make dumb shit up that most of the time is not going to pass through inspection by both sides but you put them face to face with 2 foreigners that want to communicate in complex matters and you are going to watch the dumpster fire that its going to unfold.

>If they wanted to give people what they want they wouldn't make "Community-contrarian" decisions.
>(and actually do what people like)
'People' like things done in one specific way?
Yea Forums is a fine example of this.
If there's 5 people, there's 5 different opinions about anything so doing 'what people like' will inevitably please some but piss off others.
'Community-contrarian' means shit when it's about few loudmouth full time complainers.
>bitching about people putting in hours for your own entertainment
I wish anyone doing it for ego reasons would drop everything immediately.
That would surely improve matters considerably.

Are you an onee-san?

that has been an issue with any content that gets an USA license first. you can go back to the 70s and 80s with shit like Gatchaman, Macross and what you can get

>I wish anyone doing it for ego reasons would drop everything immediately.
Spot on. This is the one and only cause of groups going to shit. Once someone gets an ego about translating fucking cartoons for free it's only a matter of time.

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>localization
I don't understand this. If I wanted localization I would be watching a dub. I want the original intent.

>driving normalfriend to get food
>friend knows of my powerlevel
>"Hey user what do they call weebs in japan? Since they are actually japanese you can't call them weebs for being into anime"
>get sudden urge to swerve into oncoming traffic, killing both of us

They got the metric system there, they don't know what the fuck a weeb is.

> 0% memes
fuck off

t. Commiefag

t. herkz
t. brainchild
t. GJM
t. Commie
t. Xythar
t. FFF
t. Crunchyroll
t. Hidive

Localization is always bad, and it only happens because people see Japanese cultural or historical references and don't understand them, immediately assume no one else will, and then change the dialog to something more western friendly.

No, you fuck off. I have no idea why people think that shit is okay. I can't wait for the new Fire Emblem to come out and be even worse about it than the last one was.

>you just don't know japanese xD

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I wish "memes" were still called "fads" like they were back in the YTMND glory days.

Nii-sama does do TL notes often. You obviously just haven't watched any of his uploads

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>. I have no idea why people think that shit is okay
"ironic randumb xd"
this shit got worse thanks to jojofags with commie and duwang during the first two parts

How did he do it? Nii-sama doesn't know Japanese at all.

The new fire emblem is 100% fujoshit pandering trash with a yaoi artist, literally who cares about that series anymore? All the girls are creepy and below average looking like they just spat in the face of all the good artists they hired to save that shitty series only to go back to making fujoshit garbage again after they finished leeching off artists they clearly did not deserve.

you can stop posting now, herkz

Literal translations are the only way to go
from now on 気を付けて will be "apply feeling"
no way around it fuckers

>fads
>not macros
please get these kids off this site chinkmoot

Localized subs only mean that normalfags aren't watching the same anime as me.

it's like leaving san or not (shall we say, doing a sub "sans" san) is not a big deal but everyone compares it to two extremes of changing all the meaning or leaving it all jap with many tls when it's fine if you don't do either extreme

>kampret sfx typesetting
Indonesian fansubs are pretty neat, huh. I 've only been watching English ones.

fad and macros existed at the same time.
macros were used for images and fad for videos

Damn, I never thought SEAmonkeys would be the ones saving fansubbing.

>Nii-sama doesn't even know japanese
>Asenshi doesn't even know japanese
>DDY doesn't even know japanese
>Mori doesn't even know japanese
>Vivid doesn't even know japanese
>Doremi doesn't even know japanese
>Doki doesn't even know japanese
Okay herkz, so who does know japanese? besides you of course?

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No, he's right. 2005 was when the word filter was put in to turn Wapanese into Weeaboo.

I prefer English subs too, but some of them are pretty bad lately, so I started paying attention to indo fansubbing scene to search for alternatives for my collection.
Melody (moe and idolshit) is the only one that's truly HQ in subs and video quality.
Anitoki (shounen and isekai) subs are pretty good and almost as fast or even faster than Horriblesubs, but the video quality is slightly downgraded for typical 3rd world internet speed.
and there's Walmart quality like Samehada that subs literally every airing anime, but they translate everything from English subs + adding honorifics
The other minor groups are either too slow, dead or just as localized as typical Funi subs.
There was Lolisekai subbing the likes of Gochiusa and other loli anime, but I think they're gone now.

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Do people really get mad over this or is like with /pol/ shit where people just pretend to be mad to make other people pretending to be mad actually mad?

I legitimately get mad when subbers dont use honorifics because "muh localization"

Is the Machikado you posted from melody?
>Translator, Editor, Typesetter, Encoder: bukan Naru
It's a fucking solo job wow.

>translating from English
Yeah, this seems prevalent. I watched Kimi no Nawa and Heaven's Feel in the cinemas and some lines are mistranslated/stilted, most probably from doubly translating.

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People have gotten mad over this since the beginning of time.

Who the hell is this guy?

Why even bother getting mad. All those localization shitters are failed authors who never got more than 10 hits on their fanfiction.net stories so now they fuck around with other people's work so they can pretend they had an artistic influence on it.

>subs

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Fuck you I have a lot on my plate right now

Your imaginary friend is right, though. You can't be a wapanese if you are Japanese.

I'm the kind of person who feels a need to provide the correct answer to something if I know it, even if I don't wanna. So I'd say it, but be super grumpy about it.

> people still don't get that there is no way to tell real peer counts on old nyaatorrents unless you have its domain name and bring back the tracker online
Stop trusting these numbers, you idiot.

I downloaded multiple of them. There are either no seeders or they up load at 4 kb/s

If you want these files, you need to wait more, look for batch torrents, and other means of file sharing.

If you want just the subtitles, us the fucking kitsuneko.

If you have time to watch anime then you have time to learn Japanese.

I watch anime to decompress my man, I can't do nothing but work and learn

I don't care what people say in English in day to day conversations, I care about what that character is saying in that moment.
I just need to learn Japanese already. I know enough that bad subs bother the shit out of me, but not enough to watch without subs.

It honestly pisses me off when fansubbers take artistic liberty with their translations.

Sometimes a character will say a specific word in a situation that means "hard" and the deeper meaning is implied.

Then the fansubber puts some shit like "I can't do this." as the translation and it fucking triggers me so hard.

Learning a language is not that fun, watching it is

>Weeb and Otaku actually had different meaning back then
Yes. "Otaku" was an insult used primarily by Japanese speakers in Japan, and weebs who thought describing themselves as "otaku" was an honorary title back in the early 2000s.

And as such, we called them weebs since the time moot replaced "wapanese" with "weebaoo". PBF user is correct, the answer is since 2005 or whatever the fuck the year was. "Weeaboo" lost its original meaning as a replacement word for "wapanese" really quickly like how "faggot" is meaningless past being a generic insult here.

People saying/thinking it was a recent thing are 100% wrong and are just outting themselves as latecomers via whatever random Internet avenue they came in from like .

It's a moment of pain for a lifetime of glory

This user gets it

Just "hard" sounds a bit off in english, but just subbing it as "It's hard" or "it's difficult" is far better than "I can't do this"

Tell me the correct answer to user's friend's question.

Threads like this really make me happy that in 2011 I noticed that I can understand japanese without subtitles.

I wonder if for episode 3, the mods will preemptively lock [NeSubs]'s comments or if theyll allow another shitshow to happen.

One thing that's particularly obnoxious about official/localized subs is how they keep adding idioms, hyperbole and colloquialisms that only are used that way by a select few people and sound awkward as fuck to everyone else in the world who knows English.

For example, every other line about being scared in the first season of SnK being translated as "DOOD THEY TOTALLY SHIT THEIR PANTS xD" comes off as incredibly awkward to any reader who's not an overly excitable teenager from New York or California. English is a world language, so you have to consider ESL audiences who will take lines like that literally.

A good group shooting themselves in the foot to follow in commies footsteps.

As a native tagalog speaker will malay be easy to learn?

Another show with a bad case of this is Kaguya-sama.
>and that's all she wrote
>anta jama (you're in the way)=three's/four's a crowd

I only need subs for infodumps nowadays.

What shocks me the most is that isn't one of the most egregious things h*rkz has ever said.

My disgust is immeasurable. I want to offer that guy a nice new pair of concrete shoes and take him out for a midnight swim.

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Trannies and faggots managed to usurp the digital world just from screeching real hard, something of proper merit such as the merits of subtitle culture for anime can easily do the same, you just need to stop being so scared and acting as if you're above such things. It's no different than knights claiming cannons and muskets are dishonorable, all you're doing is being in denial and losing any chance to gather support.

Even if everyone here understands, you forget that many newfags come along all the time lurking here and there. To provide them with proper enlightenment instead of letting them get brainwashed while not being pompous and coercive about it is a mark of true civilization.

We are living in an age where multiculturalism is being pushed left and right, and yet subtitle elitists are still not using this fact to push across the idea that translating should be more accepting to loanwords and formats instead of acting like the English language is set in stone and will never evolve past this point. And yet we have words like Sushi, Katana, Chow Mein, Foie Gras, you name it you got it all these loanwords could have been localized but haven't. In fact, no one in the western world even dares to call Xi Jinping by localization.

If any pro-localization faggot dares to truly argue with merit and righteousness, they should first convince the west to call Xi in western naming format in all their publications, no longer should you call him Xi Jinping, you must call him Jinping Xi, because Xi is his family name.

That none of you westaboos can even manage that proves your language is not sacred and the only reason you oppose is because you're likely dubtards who grew up with tumors in your ears. Imagine if you were an ESL and watching western movies and had characters like Bruce Wayne or Clark Kent or Peter Parker be called in reverse, do you think chinks nips gooks or whatever would like that? Do Asians call Donald Trump by Trump Donald?

NO.

Translations should be appropriate to the culture of the audience they are translating for. That much is correct.

The problem is when you then go on to assume that, because you're translating into English, your target culture is "all English speakers". It's not. It's "people who watch subbed anime". People who watch subbed anime know a smattering of otaku vernacular, they know what a rice ball is, they know that Japan uses yen and not dollars, they don't need Obon referred to as Thankgiving.

And when you do a weird overlocalization like that, or use awkward phrasing like "sissy" to try to cram everything into English despite it being a square peg hammered into a round hole. Instead of your target audience thinking "oh, she's a tsundere, I now understand what is being said", they have to think "what the fuck does 'sweet-and-sour' mean...? Wait, is that a weird bad localization of "tsundere"? Okay, she's a tsundere, I now understand what is being said". In other words, you've just made your audience menatally de-fucking-translate your translation in order to understand what the fuck you meant, and you did it for the sake of a wider "all English speakers" audience that doesn't even watch anime, and if one or two of them did, they'd still need to Google what the fuck you meant, because the only people for whom "sweet and sour" has the same shade of meaning as "tsundere" are the people who already know that it's being used to localize the word "tsundere".

>We are living in an age where multiculturalism is being pushed left and right, and yet subtitle elitists are still not using this fact to push across the idea that translating should be more accepting to loanwords and formats instead of acting like the English language is set in stone and will never evolve past this point.
Bad approach, people never care if you point out their hypocrisy. That's why they manage to simultaneously claim all of Africa's problem stem from colonial powers randomly drawing lines on the map and forcing different tribes that can't stand each other into one country while also hailing multiculturalism as the greatest blessing.

I just don't watch their shit and always recommend subbing teams that don't do localizations when someone asks which one they should pick.

>I see this often
>see
Tells you everything, the only communication he is with people is via twitter where it's all in text form. He'll never hear rather than see if though because no one fucking says that out loud.

Really feels like 90% of the subbing drama would stop existing if only herkz and gjm kicked the bucket.

I don't think you realize just how much and how badly the word has been misused on other websites the last 2-3 years.
It's obvious when someone who learned the word on a different website comes here and throws it around.

I pick the corset

There's a reason they asked to have the comment section of most of their Index III uploads locked.

Or course Herkz is sperging it up again. Such a sad, attention-depraved little animal. I wonder if he'll start posting screenshots of Yea Forums threads again so his anitwitter orbiters can tell him how great he is kek

I actually enjoy shitposting subs, For example, it made me enjoy oregairu.

because they actually dislike anime and japanese culture. they just stuck with translating (or rather localizing) it because nothing else they could do would ever get them that much attention again.

>but why would fansubs do that shit?
Attention. If you should do proper subs, you get maybe a dozen people commenting with "thanks" and that's it.
If you intentionally castrate it to piss people off you get 100 comments on nyaa and a couple threads on Yea Forums reaching the bump limit.

you can't put mental effort into it every waking hour of your day. I work in research, when I come back home my brain is fried. I can still watch some anime to relax but I couldn't sit down for another couple hours and grind Japanese

herkz is a retard, what else is new?

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Wow that is some better than the plebs attitude. How many days later did he get proven wrong? I am assuming he did not say anything regarding this tweet.

Pretty sure the official announcement was out the same day. And no, he obviously never followed up. He's incapable of admitting he's wrong, ever.

>check his account
>fucking 35500 tweets
that guy doesn't even exist outside of twitter as far as I'm concerned

He could’ve done something useful for the community like tagged 35500 works on the panda instead but what else would you expect out of a braindead localization bootlicker

I don't mind some localisation and I can even tolerate some memes. But fansubbers are some of the worst things about this community some times. Herkz, GJM, Commie, PAS et al only serve to incentivise people to browse /DJT/. Sub drama is some of the most embarrassing, annoying, and irritating bullshit in the anisphere and I hate those faggots with a passion.

Unironically based.

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They also create faggots who actually like localization.

> half of Yea Forums doesn't even know nyaa.si is run by the Cabal

Honestly I'd rather have no honerifics at all than having the characters call eachother Ms. or Mr. Or whatnot when they are in high school.

>the current state of nu-Yea Forums

You will loose the other honorifics with no english equivalent (e.g. -sama, -chan, -tan). Thus needing a full localization in order to fix.

By losing the honorifics, you have indeed to localise what is being said by introducing linguistic equivalents or facsimiles.

Thanks user. I'll look deeper sometime.

No, fuck you. If you watch any notable amount of anime for even a short period of time you are bound to pick up words and phrases that are repeated often without ever trying to learn Japanese.

Because cancer has to be fought tooth and nail as soon as it is identified or else it spreads and may even take over.

The first subbing rule for every subber should be to never ever use the phrase: "What's the big idea?" under any circumstances whatsoever.

It is lazy, inappropriate and worst of all annoyingly overused.

I miss "TL Note:"

Herkz should stop fucking around and get to finishing up the Mahou Tsukai no Yoru patch

Not the one asking, but as a fellow Indonesian, I thank you for your research.

I think the last time I saw them used was in Kimi no Na wa when they explained the Watashi, Boku, Ore thing.

Hakata Mentai! had a few.

>fansubs

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They don't localize enough, they should change the OP/ED to something more appropriate. Anime should have no trace of japanese culture of language. Hell, they should just mute the audio as well so we can't hear the Japanese.
files.catbox.moe/wdw63f.webm

Do you agree with this guy's argument?
ia.is.maiwaifu.jp/translating-honorifics/

>Whether or not honorifics should be preserved in a Japanese translation is a discussion as dumb as it is old. I’m not going to take a side on this one though, because there’s an even dumber argument out in the wild. “Honorifics are required in translations to convey meaning” is undoubtedly one of the most asinine claims I’ve ever had the misfortune to witness, and it really needs to be addressed.

>Honorifics are all but one tiny facet of describing one character’s relationship with another. I feel like many consumers have prized these small tidbits of Japanese that they can understand, and now imagine they are essential to the material when the author simply chose to use the ones most appropriate in context rather than as the deep, intricate tools of language that English readers make them out to be.

>For example, people love to talk about the amazing differences between the personal pronouns that characters use. To the author though, it’s the crudest way to introduce a character’s basic personality and character elements, which are then fleshed out via actual prose. No author would tell you they were pouring their heart and soul into choosing a character’s personal pronoun because ultimately, it is of extremely little importance beyond its use as a convenient identifier amidst the lines of unattributed dialogue.

>This is also true of honorifics. The relationships that honorifics define can’t be discerned from the honorific alone. A good example of this is “senpai”. The argument that there is no English equivalent is a popular one, but the fact of the matter is that it doesn’t matter.

cont.
>A “senpai” is your superior, but that doesn’t mean anything on its own. They could be your mentor, someone who is firm but fair with you, someone who teaches you and nurtures your abilities and growth but isn’t afraid to put you down where your peers might be hesitant or concerned about their relationship with you. They will be your superior by virtue of age or status within your shared institution, and will have no qualms about teaching you the right thing. Many will try and help you by drawing on their greater experience, or by doing something for you that only they could do via means unavailable to you. They can be good or bad, but an active one can have a major impact on your life whether it be at school, work, or even in life in general. They can be objects of respect, fear, admiration, learning, and affection—or hate.

>The thing is though, you can’t glean any of this by only reading a line of dialogue where someone is addressed as “senpai”. All of the aforementioned nuances only come about in the prose and context that surrounds the characters. The honorific terms of address provide little to no additional information. The author doesn’t choose to have a character call another “senpai” to emphasise these points, they choose to do so because that’s the natural way to refer to someone, exactly the same as calling someone by their name in English.

>There’s too much leeway within the term of address to discern anything meaningful about the relationship between characters from the honorifics alone. This must be done through the prose, and therefore can be explained without honorifics.

This is good.

cont.
>This is true for all honorifics, and really, all terms of address. Of course, I’m not saying that they have no meaning at all. If someone is addressed as “-sama”, then they’re probably important—or being ridiculed over their arrogance. See, even in this general example, it’s impossible to know without context. If someone is addressed as “-sensei”, they could be a teacher. Or they might be a doctor, an author, or some other kind of respected expert. If someone is addressed as “-kun”, then they’re probably a boy. Unless it’s at school or work, in which case it could be a girl. They’re also probably younger than the speaker, except when they’re not. You see?

>None of these honorifics provide any information on their own that can be demonstratably known without context. All of the important identifying information is in the prose. There is no way to discern anything about the relationships between characters with certainty by knowing only the mutual honorific terms of address they use with each other.

>There aren’t many kinds of situations where honorifics are absolutely necessary and critical to understanding the work. It would have to involve a piece that is heavily ingrained in Japanese culture, with plot points that revolve around honorifics, or that offers social commentary or criticism on the nuances of human relationships in a uniquely Japanese way, that relies on Japanese honorifics to convey. In an edge case like this, the argument for preserving honorifics may hold some weight, but most of the time there isn’t a good reason to do so. In your average battle manga or slice of life romcom, the prose is what defines the complex relationships and overall context of the work, not the honorifics. The author’s intentions can be entirely conveyed with prose alone.

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No. It's jarring to hear "Ikari-san" and read "Mr. Ikari."
Just like when a character says "nice idea" and the subs read "good idea."
If it's feasible, and fluid, subs should match dialogue as much as possible.
Anyone who has seen hundreds of anime will pick up on these things. Subtitles should not cater to casuals who barely watch anime. If they do, then English speakers will consume anime, leading to more power in companies like CR and Funi, which means they'll go after sites like Nyaa to shut down anime torrenting so people have to rely on them and buy a subscription so they make more money. Which leads to a greater western influence on anime, which as we all know will ruin anime.

What's the big idea?
But seriously, what phrase is this in the original?

>"it's not the only thing of relevance therefore I can just leave it out"
No, he's retarded.

This is an issue with you as a viewer, though.

Subtitles absolutely should cater to casuals who barely watch anime. That's their major audience, and it's absolutely laughable that you consider yourself above them because you think you know a few meaningless terms.

Do you think terms like ビッチ or スタイル should be "translated" to bitch or style because that's how they're read? Of course not, because both of those translations are WRONG. Complaining about shit like CR and Funi is also absurd, you lost the "culture war" a decade ago when all the fansubbers stopped bothering because they were all in the business for E-peen, and the first release is the only one 99% of people will watch.

Casuals who barely watch anime don't watch with subtitles in the first place. Also, you should be ashamed of yourself if you translate something that's shit enough that casuals would eat it.

>the main audience of anime subs are people who barely watch anime
did you think that through?

>I’m not going to take a side in the second sentence
>when he’s very clearly taking the anti side before he even made the statement and every word he writes afterwards
What is this SJW appeal to emotion rhetoric faggotry that localization bootlickers love to use?

I don't mind Mr. and Ms. stuff, but when they start shuffling first and last names around that's when it gets annoying.

I don't care about casuals.

Trying to seem aloof so that you cannot challenge them on their view because really they don't care anyway.
It's an emergency exit in case they start losing the argument.

>Casuals who barely watch anime don't watch with subtitles in the first place.
They absolutely do. Who the fuck do you think makes up all the paying customers of sites like CR?

>you should be ashamed of yourself if you translate something that's shit enough that casuals would eat it.
You should be ashamed of yourself for not knowing Japanese, faggot. I don't do any translation work, I'm not a fucking retard who feels like he owes anything to a bunch of bottom feeders like yourself who feel the need to beg and whine over translations all day.

As much as you'd like to pretend Yea Forums is still the awesome secret club it was back in the days where it was an ADTRW sub-forum, times have changed. Anime is more popular than ever, and you only have to glance at the userbase of this board to see its a shell of its former self.

That's great, I don't care about you either.

That's a lot of words to say very little. His main argument seems to be that any kind of information that gives you a quick first impression can be left out without losing anything because there's still more details that will follow later on.
That's like taking some piece of Western literature and having all characters refer to each other exclusively by their surname because "well, you'll find out what their exact relationship is in 100 pages anyway"

>Who the fuck do you think makes up all the paying customers of sites like CR?
Ironic weebs. Who would pay for watching anime and then barely watch anime?

>Guys, the people who watch anime are people who don't watch anime!

whoa

makes you think

It sounds literally as dumb as trying to murder someone and saying “I’m not trying to murder anyone” while you proceed to stick the knife into his throat and decapitate him, does he think that anyone above subhuman IQ is retarded enough to continue listening to him after doing this?

>As much as you'd like to pretend Yea Forums is still the awesome secret club it was back in the days where it was an ADTRW sub-forum, times have changed. Anime is more popular than ever, and you only have to glance at the userbase of this board to see its a shell of its former self.
Nothing you said has anything to do with the fact that you claimed anime subs are primarily aimed at people who hardly ever watch anime. It's a retarded statement, anime subs are aimed at people without Japanese skills who watch anime. Your prior "argument" was based solely on your own elitism where you seem to think someone has to watch 10 shows per season to understand honorifics and stuff.

I personally think the same. I use onee-san and onee-chan as a family honorific as is because they don't really have a near equivalent that doesn't remove the nuance. But when referring to a different nuance (non-family honorific as a sign of hierarchy/respect), I usually use "miss" or something. I always translate ojou-sama as "lady", "milady" or any similar that is close to the actual meaning.

I also tend to use the -san/chan on proper names, especially since there are many instances where the nuances of such honorifics are emphasized (e.g. chan/san/yobisute).

Generally, I just think of it as "localize as much as possible with as minimal impact on the change/loss of nuances". It doesn't have to be a black and white issue, it's more of a spectrume IMHO.

>That's great, I don't care about you either.
Really? Because you asked if I agreed with your argument.
>Do you agree with this guy's argument?

>does he think that anyone above subhuman IQ is retarded enough to continue listening to him after doing this?
You are overestimating people. They only believe what they want to believe anyway, my own Prof holds some really absurd views which I have explicitly proven to him are wrong (research related stuff) and yet he still sticks with them and does some retarded "uhh, I think that's a matter of interpretation" shit.

>people without Japanese skills who watch anime
Those people are the casuals.

>anime subs are aimed at people without Japanese skills who watch anime.
And the majority of these are people who hardly ever watch anime. I don't know why this is such a difficult point to process.

Yea Forums is like a Galapagos community of braindead weebs who think they're hot shit because they watched DBZ when they were 10, and started downloading anime rmvbs off limewire in the early 2000s, a practice that has basically gone unchanged for them for the past 20 years. Sure, now it's torrents, and now it's CR instead of fansubs, but the basic concept hasn't changed. You're still consuming watered down garbage.

It hurts.
I actually enjoy learning things and always appreciated a well timed, educational TL note. Then everyone tried to become very professional which meant catering to the most brain dead casuals.

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Subbing/scanlation is a weird thing.
The great majority of subbers and scanlators are massive drama queens and pissants who can't take critique at all.
But they also quite literally do it for free, and for audiences that are mostly made up of people who don't even deserve basic human rights, let alone the right to post on the internet.

You enjoy learning stuff? That's great, so do I. I completely fail to see why a translation should be treated as edutainment material, though. You can't look things up by yourself?

There are a handful of smaller, less established groups that genuinely do it for fun and aren't e-whores.
Only problem is they get literally run off the site by the administration/established fansub groups that lambast them over small mistakes.
Just look at the comments section on Nyaa for a group's first few torrents. Sure there are people that actually do give constructive criticism, but it's a shame to see the site's own admins shitting on them because they didn't blur a sign enough, or a line bled through by a few frames.

If you don't know Japanese then you probably don't even know that you're missing anything.

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>But they also quite literally do it for free
Do they? Piracy is usually pretty fucking lucrative. I guess a lot of them are just doing it wrong.

College is a liberal shithole anyways I wouldn’t expect anything but half-assed indoctrination there anyways.

I don't care about your retarded elitist bullshit about "muh Yea Forums of the past" or whatever. You have to be an absolute braindead mouth breather to believe that anime subs are aimed at people who hardly watch anime.
They are aimed at people who watch anime. That's why shows like Manaria Friends or Sounan desu ka who have zero mainstream appeal still get subs, even though your average JoJo-dude never even heard those titles.

>>If you don't know Japanese then you probably don't even know that you're missing anything.
If you don't know Japanese, you absolutely ARE missing something. TL notes or not.

Because you're viewing another culture's media, there are absolutely going to be things you don't know. Casuals don't care so they won't look it up. But actual anime fans do, and it's far more enjoyable and less jarring to get a quick 1-line TL note than to pause the episode, go to google, type it in, find a result, read it, then get back to the anime.
So it's not a problem if you're a casual, but subtitles should not be pandering to idiots.

>Sounan desu ka who have zero mainstream appeal
You think Bear Grylls with cute girls has zero mainstream appeal?

Some fansubbers have switched to doing hentai for money.
Scanlators are more known for crowdfunding.
Any fansub group that asks for money is absurd, never give them a cent.

I am pretty sure you'll have a hard time finding someone who is watching that show and not also watching at least 10 other shows this season.

>actual anime fans
Ah, the old "no true scotsman" fallacy.

Well, I think you can't be a TRUE anime fan if you don't know Japanese. So that unfortunately puts you in the fake anime fan group, which means you get lumped into the casual group that you so desperately pretend to not be a part of.

I don't understand localization. I think we should embrace other cultures and not whitewash them.

1/10 because I responded

considering that every time there's drama and shitflinging it's the same handful of people involved, I actually don't think that it's the majority of them who act like that.

>being this mad about differing political opinions

Might be.

==== Please do not repost this content without asking me first. ====

It's weird, you think subtitles shouldn't pander to idiots, but then you yourself are an exemplary example of an idiot. Why else wouldn't you know Japanese by now? Who on earth do you think subtitles should pander to?

Might be.
==== Please do not repost this content without asking me first. ====

>they don't need Obon referred to as Thankgiving
This happens?

It's an e-peen thing.
I've been fansubbing since 2011, have done around 20 shows, got trusted status, etc. I was on IRC with some groups until 2016 until left and largely did solo projects. There are a ton of people in the community, but the vocal minority (the people in large, established groups who bully others). Those are the people who are a problem. I genuinely don't understand why they're so bitter all the time. You can't have a normal conversation with them at all. And they're the ones who run nyaa and other anime sites.

Because nobody without mental illness would actually achieve positions like that. It's why all mods are completely insane, imagine actually having a life so empty that your only goal is unpaid work.

The hentai anime scene is filled with moneywhores.
Sakuracircle is the only group who doesn't put releases behind a paywall and doesn't monetize his releases by ads. You can openly get their releases with torrents and ddl without any bullshit like link shorteners. Heck, they don't even accept or ask for donations. They're also picking up and doing scanslations occasionally, so you'll know that they're doing it for fun. I'm sure that they could just apply as translators for bigger and lucrative hentai sites and earn like other old groups, but they volunteer instead for doing softsub releases.

Normies are like "HH saves hentai" or "hanime.tv" is the new savior, but people barely know sakuracircle has been carrying all the slack that erobeat/subdesu-h left for some time now.

(THREE SCREENS OF COMPLAINS ABOUT INTERNET ASSHOLES AND /RAGEQUIT.)

Also, your mailbox is full of angry suckers who blame you for spoiling everything.

Joshikousei no Mudazukai this season has a copious amount of TL Notes

If you're complaining about subs in 2019 you wouldn't have made it even 5 years ago.

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everything eventually gets taken over by self-obsessed idiots who do nothing but try to bring everyone else down.
because normal people who try to do stuff right don't have the time or nerve to deal with them and stop them from ruining everything.
and it's amplified a lot on the internet because here you can't just not invite them anymore.

Oh, right, I forgot about that one.

I was moreso referring to the kind of rhetoric they use but ok that works too

Honestly I'd go back to 2014-era subs. Back when most shows I'd watch had a fansub group doing them.
I'd even take groups just sprucing up CR. Putting honorifics back in, fixing name order, better encode, typesetting, fixed timing, OP/ED kara, chapters, editing, TLC. It's pretty easy to do when the timing/TL is largely done for you. Wish more groups did that.

Well, not like the translation teams that actually do get paid are save from that shit. Just look at Azure Lane where the translators are adding random pokemon and jojo memes, localize out of the ass and straight up leave untranslated lines in, but then go on a huge social media rant about how they cut out honorifics because it would look unprofessional otherwise and they have to think about their resume.

Same. HS typesetting is completely unwatchable garbage for shows where more than one person is talking at the same time, even some minor amount of editing improves it immensely.

It's weird, I've dealt with Fyurie a few times and he seemed alright. Then I see and makes you wonder.

I sometimes am extremely virulent when it comes to fansubbers just because of the vocal few. You're right in pointing it out and I apologise, I just have a burning hatred for some of these fuckers. Also, side note but you should use TL Note as much as possible, it's didactic and I've learned a lot about Japan through them back in the day. It's criminally underused nowadays.

I'm pretty sure that (Yea Forums) mods and devs receive some amount of compensation. Jannies are totally pro bono. They are all insane to some degree though.

I mean they were pretty relevant TL notes too, like how the fuck should I know what the stereotypes of Hokkaido school skirts are, is that even something that would produce google results in English?

wasn't even politics, it's physics. I ran the experiments, I showed him that his hypothesis is not supported by the results at all but he just brushes it off because he believed in that hypothesis for decades now and he doesn't want to put the mental effort into reevaluating it.
all people are lazy in some way, and most of them are especially lazy when it comes to self-reflection

probably just some massive pussy who wouldn't dare insulting you to your face and is only capable of throwing out vague insults that don't have any real target attached to them

Shit, this seems to really cover the bases.

ITT: people who know three words of Japanese get a panic attack whenever a translation doesn't leave those three words intact and instead, you know, translates them

Was this some undergraduate physics lab or something you were doing for your PHD?

oh shit the shills finally woke up

Yeah but that “it’s a matter of interpretation whenever I want it to be” is just classic liberal rhetoric just like these faggot localizers

Nice.

bros wtf my book has tl notes what a fucking hack wrote them

>11 sub groups this season
There's a few more, like Mad le Zissel
More than I expected, actually.
fansubdb.com/wiki/Summer_2019

Not leaving honorifics just opens the problem of
>A-chan
>stop using -chan!
>A-san then
>just A is fine, but okay
or the many variations thereof. Makes me wonder, was Index/Railgun translated officially? I remember reading Sissy for Onee-sama but I am not sure if ti was from official subs.

PhD work obviously. I'm not so full of myself that I'd think I could have run experiments without any mistakes as an undergrad.

Can you shed any more light on the experiment?

>sissy

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herkz put me in the screencap

It always gets me when reencode/BD groups choose HS instead of fansubs, in the cases where the fansubs are objectively superior. They could have at least copied the TS and Songs, but no.

>Lil' A
>Stop calling me little!
>Mister A it is then
>Just A is fine, but okay
Problem solved

>Lil'

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I don't want do dox myself so I'll keep it vague. It was about surface reconstructions under specific conditions. The hypothesis on how it works was developed when they couldn't probe it with a sufficient resolution so it's based completely on macroscopic observations.
New methods show the theory is simply wrong, that's not how it works. But he has done a lot of work based on that hypothesis so he obviously doesn't want to hear about it being wrong.

Ah okay. Yeah that sucks.
What were you using, SEM, TEM, XRD...?

Always baffling how people who violate intellectual property rights of other parties without being forced to pay a cent for the service provided to them consider themselves to be in a position to dictate what the fansub looks like. Beggers can't be chooser.

No one cares. If you care about the industry, by BDs/merch and unsubscribe from CR. CR is actively killing the industry, albeit slowly.

This reads like someone who has never studied language at all. "Full romaji" is a meaningless term, what kind of romaji? there's several competing standards. (Hepburn is shit)

"untranslatable culture words" is meaningless too. Manga is very easy to translate, but you might choose not to because it adds some flavour. The terseness of the language means you will have some decisions to make regarding some of the interesting things which are just nouns in Japanese but would be a sentence in English, but I bet they wouldn't leave the Japanese noun for "getting on a train and getting off at the end" in it's original form.

As for honorifics are they simply talking about name postpositions? if so why are they talking about something so limited and that is by and large nothing more than etiquette in daily conversation.

Yeah, i wonder why herkz and gjm are complaining about nesubs putting honorifics. Totally disrespectful

STM but that's getting pretty off topic.

Check the comment section on any subbed anime that simply stripped the honorifics and didn't completely butcher the translation.
Then check the comment section of a release where some dude put the honorifics back in and undid some localizations.
And then ask yourself who is actually constantly starting shit over this.

Gotcha.
Yeah, you're right. Keep up the good work.

God, these memes age like milk.

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You aren't supposed to translate things word by word, you're supposed to translate the entire work as a whole. English has ways of speaking that assume different levels of familiarity, you can do that most of the time. Sometimes leaving in the honorifics is the cleanest solution to a problem, but it definitely isn't the default thing to do every time.

Friendly reminder: The western anime community is the most pathetic you'll ever be acquainted with throughout your life. There is no community as obnoxious, entitled and downright suffering from mental retardation as this one.

post how you'd translate it

Nyaa comments are worthless.
They're dominated by a hivemind of admins and veterans who shit on anything they don't like, then lock the comments section and blame it because the opposition said mean things. While, in fact, they're far more guilty of that.

Where do i start user? I have watched 300 shows so i at least pick up some words

That's like a ridiculously cheesy thing, it's so over the top that it comes off as weird as it should in English.

Just wanna let you guys know that my target audience is Yea Forums so I fansub things for you guys.

>bruh moment
would be more correct

It's still a place where you can directly address the subbing teams rather than pointlessly screaming into the void and it's absolutely dominated by people who fucking lose their shit at anything "weeb".

Actually true

just buy or pirate some book on it. anything that gives you some structure in your learning process works, even if that structuring might be suboptimal.
but the biggest hurdle in learning anything new is not knowing where to start and how to continue.

Orr like how in Hitoribocchi, there was the whole deal about Sotoka wanting Bocchi to use -CHAN with her instead of -SAN; how do no-honorific fags deal with this?

The author of this claims that honorifics, along with pronoun-choice, are just "the crudest way to introduce a character’s basic personality and character elements, which are then fleshed out via actual prose." That just because theyre such a basic thing that the author doesn't really have to think about what pronouns/honorifics characters use with each other, they can be easily translated or just brushed aside because you'll get their relationship with the story. Well in this example, the honorifics ARE the story, they ARE the prose.

>There aren’t many kinds of situations where honorifics are absolutely necessary and critical to understanding the work. It would have to involve a piece that is heavily ingrained in Japanese culture, with plot points that revolve around honorifics
This example from Hitoribocchi is just some regular SoL, its not some high literature, and yet honorifics play a substantial role.

I like to imagine them translating a show set in tokyo, and writing out toukyou every time. That makes me chuckle.

Weebs really have little to no understanding of anything when it comes to Japanese, all they know is what they "like", and what they "don't like".

Best thing to do is support the smaller fansub groups that do subs how you like.
Larger, established groups aren't going to change and they're already in bed with CR, etc.
A simple "Thanks for the subs" goes a long way for the smaller, less established groups. They get turned off when one of their comments sections blows up because that invites destructive criticism, then they get fed up and quit.

Not being as liberal, leave in honorifics, don't be afraid to use a short tn note, and stop turning onee-sama into sissy.

Seriously where the fuck are these translators coming from where sissy is used as anything but an insult.

>Weeb audience
Directly. You just put in translators' notes for things that require a bit more understanding of Japanese culture/wordplay to understand.

Don't bother with Japshit and go to gym instead. Also the >2000 hours you'd have had put in this dying language would be better spent learning a trade or some shit so you can earn more money.

Keep it up then.
I wouldn't mind herkz and the rest of those inbreds so much if they simply said this is how they prefer to do things instead of pretending it's The Only Right Way To Do It™ and stopped shitting up the comment section on any release that violates their own guidelines.
Everyone can do subs for whatever audience they choose, but then they should actually stick with that audience instead of annoying all the other ones.

Why should a throwaway joke require an explanation? You don't get any of the humor from it if you read a TL note, you're getting a completely different experience.

>haha bro, a good translation is to simply refuse to translate most of the stuff XDDDD
Nice, these people really take thier work seriously. You can literally smell the cheetos from. These clowns simply are too lazy to properly translate dialogue and adjust the sentence structure accordingly, yet still need a week to translate a single episode. Why would anybody listen to these clowns? Leaving honorifics is bad, plain and simple. It's not a translation anymore.

However, given the nature of fansubbing, nobody should even care. It's a free service so I'll take what I can get, but claiming the highground because you're too lazy to actually translate is just real life satire.

Thank you Yea Forumsnon.

Wrong. Plebs will always be plebs, you can give them the absolute worst slop translations in the world, and they will continue to eat them up while complaining.

The only thing that actually pushes people to learn Japanese is a lack of translations. People don't learn the language to understand shows slightly better, they learn the language to watch and read shit they can't understand at all without doing so.

I don't leave comments simply because I don't have any accounts on those websites, but I usually keep seeding the stuff from smaller groups for a month or so rather than immediately deleting them once I'm done like I do with HS and so on.

Learning Japanese is hella hard
>Zero cognates
>2k+ kanji to memorize
>Unfamiliar grammatical structure if you're an Anglofag (agglutinative)

I've studied Ancient Greek, Latin, French, and Hebrew, and just started flirting with Japanese, which is rapidly turning out to be harder than all of them, including Hebrew.

>Seriously where the fuck are these translators coming from where sissy is used as anything but an insult.
IRC channels and nowadays Discord servers I assume. If they had any real life interactions they wouldn't think that anyone says "my sides" out loud.

I miss Coalgirls and Sallysubs so much

Attached: 1503654874239.png (828x450, 236K)

Nyaa is the place they built to exert power over others. It's an old boy's club of nepotism and moderator abuse.
I really wish Anidex or Pantsu were viable alternatives, but they were sabotaged by .si and the fans are too dumb.
I used to release to .si, pantsu, and Anidex, but you have to make separate torrents because .si's tracker has to be first in the list. I asked them about it, because the rules state that the torrent just has to have the .si tracker, nothing about it being first, and the answer I got was basically "Yeah it has to be first so you can't upload to other sites also fuck you."

I fully expect half the people who "learn" Japanese on this board can't actually tell you the details of wa and ga. Just the general idea.

>I like to imagine them translating a show set in tokyo, and writing out toukyou every time. That makes me chuckle.
It only makes you chuckle because the "Tokyo" romanization is the worldwide standard; if from the very beginning (when the name was changed) Westerners used "Toukyou" then noone would have a problem with it.

>leaving in just some culture-specific words
>hurr durr its not a translation anymore

>herkz is seething and posting in this thread RIGHT NOW

Attached: sankyuu hires.png (200x200, 70K)

Understandable, but a comment of thanks is far more gratifying than seeding for a month, while that is also appreciated.

Can a native Jap tell us the details of "wa" and "ga"?

I can't be the only person who has an easier time remembering kanji than words. I've known all the JLPTN1 required kanji after 6 months, but I struggle remembering new words because they all start to sound so fucking similar.

Language skills can also earn you more money, especially when it's languages that not every other random fuck on the street can speak. It can actually make up for a lot of other shortcomings, even if you are only 90% fluent. They'd still prefer having you talk with the client in a language where at least one of you is a native rather than both of you communicating in butchered English.
Unless you're an Anglo, in that case the advantage is greatly diminished.

Well, if that's supposed to be a 4-line long short story with no other context and the target audience is young adults who are interested in Japanese culture, then I guess leaving the honorifics in would be how I'd translate it. If it's just an excerpt from a longer work, here are some ideas that could potentially work:

>A! Hey, babe!
>please don't call me babe
>Mr. A
>Just A is fine, but okay

>[invented nickname for A]
>please don't invent a nickname for me
>Mr. A
>Just A is fine, but okay

>oh shit, it's A!
>please watch your language
>My greetings, A
>just hi is fine, but okay
(not very likely this one but I can imagine contexts where this would be a faithful representation of both characters and their relationship)

IRC servers were bad, but Discord servers are just awful.

They're native, they intuit their language. A none native person doesn't do that, you need to know more. That's why when learning you should learn from native and none native teachers imo.

Watching Belldandy call Keiichi "Mr. Keiichi" almost made me kill myself

Toukyou looks and sounds more like how it’s actually pronounced I don’t see why anyone would be mad about having more accurate transliteration except for EOP burgers.

>>leaving in just some culture-specific words
>>hurr durr its not a translation anymore
If you leave honorifics you refuse to translation. The amount of "culture-based words" is absolutely minuscule and limited to very specific cases. Manga isn't untranslatable for example. It stands for Japanese comics. Most of the other shit mentioned in this post is just as bad. These people are lazy pieces of shit, that's all there is to it.

>you refuse to translation

>t. Nintendo Treehouse

>calling a guy babe

If the nickname is close to sounding like the name, then maybe.

>4th line has the name spoken
>sub doesn't have his name in it

.5/3 please never fansub.

Make sure to change all the names to "Jack", "Sarah", "Alex" and stuff like that in order to not confuse the audience with Japanese stuff.
People just aren't smart enough to handle different cultures.

>No. It's jarring to hear "Ikari-san" and read "Mr. Ikari."
What about when subtitles add -san or -sama, but the dialogue doesn't have it? I have seen this in official subs.

I might actually start doing that then if it keeps them motivated.

Meanwhile, in Tarantino's plebshit, something that could not possibly get more mainstream
>fräulein
>monsieur

>Manga isn't untranslatable for example. It stands for Japanese comics.
Lmfao no one calls them Japanese comics you idiot. Everyone knows it as manga.

pretty based

Really? Any examples? That's pretty bad and probably just as jarring.

Spoken dialogue. Please don't pretend to have ever watched subtitles for Tarantino shit.

Because of the ease of you
>IRC requires some minor amount of work to set up, the average tech illiterate would be too lazy to do that so you know the audience is pre-filtered and thus judge it accordingly
>Discord requires two clicks on an .exe and even your mom could install it, so people are misled to believe their server is full of average people rather than inbred degenerates

>4th line has the name spoken
>sub doesn't have his name in it

This is not a problem. You don't translate things word by word, and you also don't translate things sentence by sentence or line by line.

It's jarring to read "Mr. Ikari" no matter what. Especially when it's a show of cute girls, who are all friends with each other, addressing each other as "Miss user" as if they were some ESL business people.

What about when honorifics become a plot point? Do Crunchyroll and Netflix just take a vacation that day?

of course he is, I am pretty sure that guy has a bot constantly monitoring if his name is being mentioned

...Have you watched a single movie in your life?
youtube.com/watch?v=Hf0xB5SWZ24

You don't make money learning Japanese, look at all that English teacher trash in Japan or the countless NEET translators that resort to begging at every opportunity.
If you really need to read the runes learn Mandarin at least. Japan is stagnating and thanks to the declining birthrates will be dead within our lifetimes, all while the Chinese century is upon us.

>This is not a problem
It absolutely is a problem. If I hear a character say "... Shinji..." I expect the subs to read "... Shinji... "
If I don't, it's jarring because what I'm hearing is clearly not lining up with what I'm reading.

We have this argument all the time, and every single goddamn time the only real answer is that you translate based on what your audience want. If you're targeting a broader audience, you do heavy localisations. If you're targeting an audience that watches a lot of anime and wants all the cultural aspects retained, then you do that. Otherwise you're basically arguing over whether to go down two totally different routes with totally different target audiences.

Yea Forums - Japanese cartoons and comics

>If you leave honorifics you refuse to translation.
You're retarded. Honorifics are important in showing character relations and can even be used as a plot point. There is no English equivalent for some in the context they're used and just cutting them out is what is truly lazy. For botht he translator and whoever is consuming the media but wants it fully americanized.

>The amount of "culture-based words" is absolutely minuscule and limited to very specific cases
And just because theyre only a small amount and limited to specific cases doesn't mean you can just brush them aside. If anyone is being a lazy piece of shit, it's people who refuse to learn a thing or two about a different culture just because they'd have to learn some new words.

In the end, we're talking about JAPANESE entertainment, meant for JAPANESE audiences; we may not be Japanese or know the language, we should try to approach the subject matter as if we were.

Yeah recent subs have been weird, where for example theyll have x-kun, but then y-sempai will just be left as y. I think I saw that in BokuBen, I'd have to go check

>using the desktop version of Discord
It's like you want your privacy invaded.

Manga just means "comics" in general, it doesn't have to be Japanese to be called as such.

Learn Japanese + another skill.

Japanese people deal with that just fine when they subtitle things. Why is it such a problem for you? the languages have fundamentally different grammar, making them line up is not trivial.

Attached: honorifics.webm (1280x836, 2.88M)

>teachers and translators
you apply for a job at a company that's doing business with the japs and handle the communication.
>will be dead within our lifetimes
not even if you were underage. why plan for something that might be of relevance in maybe a century or two if you'll never live that long?

>Or like how in Hitoribocchi..........
Seriously even some Western languages do this. French and Spanish have familiar forms of address, and English used to ("thou"). Anyone with a quarter of a functioning brain can pick up that -chan is an intimate/familiar form of address even if it's their very first anime.

Democracy has flattened most of the hierarchal tones of the English language away, but figuring out the honorifics takes less than five minutes.

Really makes you fucking think.

Attached: 1562607833540.jpg (475x433, 77K)

>you apply for a job at a company that's doing business with the japs and handle the communication.
From what I've heard, the best thing to do is to study a technical degree (business, law, engineering, whatever) and Japanese simultaneously, so that you're not just a Japanese translator, you're a Japanese legal translator or business translator. That's where the real demand is.

Learn Japanese + a Masters degree.

Is what he said actually true or is he just talking out of his ass? Because, for manga at least, a lot of professionals keep honorifics, shit even in my third world shit hole they kept honorifics in the LN they release.

Nobody in the west would call non-Japanese comic books "comics" or any variation thereof. In the west, they are just about always called manga and should be subbed as such.
Unless the manga in question is cleart western, then it should be subbed as comics.

You guys get really focused on honorifics when they're practically just ways to pretty up someone's name that in most cases people only say because they're expected to.

People using excessive nounal pronouns could be a plot point too but you're not riling up about that.

It's also retarded because it's pretending like this is never being used, when Kantō is written with ō. You would just write Tōkyō if it wasn't already established as Tokyo.

You're not translating shit by leaving honorifics and you're downright wrong about it being impossible for them to be replaced. The problem is fansubbers are too lazy to restructure the sentence or conversation accordingly.

That sounds pretty fucking weird, any examples of that? I don't see the point in that, just do accurate translations.

It's a bit of a mix. The current general trend is in favour of removing honorifics, but there's also movement towards including them again. It also varies between companies.

Based JSL romanization.

>retarded comedy
no thanks

Usually -san can just be dropped because it's just the standard way of addressing people, which in English is not adding any random shit to their names. The only problem is when the characters move to a more familiar way of addressing each other in the middle of the show but the English equivalent of the new thing is still just not adding any random shit to their names. There's still usually a workaround that requires a shitton of effort from the translator but nobody ever puts in that effort and either they leave the honorifics in or that substance is lost from the work.

>Japanese people deal with that just fine when they subtitle things.
Source? When they sub what? Western media?
>Why is it such a problem for you?
It's jarring as a viewer and decreases enjoyment.
>making them line up is not trivial.
Are you an idiot? Anyone with a firm grasp of the English language can easily rearrange a sentence to have it match up, and still be fluid and natural.

you're not translating your opinions, you're supposed to be translating character dialogues. and whenever a character says "manga", they refer to comics in general, not to your opinion.

Cope

>There is no English equivalent for some in the context they're used
So what?

There's no English equivalent for ワシ, or じゃ. Should these be left untranslated in text? They're far more important than honorifics, they instantly indicate the age of the speaker, which is far more important than some "character relation" bullshit you've invented in your head for something that is just basic politeness 99% of the time.

If you think honorifics should be preserved, but don't care about the 20 different ways you could say "I", then you're just a fucking retard.

Ah, the old "I'm a massive faggot please rape my face" fallacy.
I'm really impressed by how smart you are, user.

You mean rewrite the source material?

>, but figuring out the honorifics takes less than five minutes.
Exactly, it's easy to learn, it doesn't cost you anything to throw them out just because "oh i can think of a better english alternative"
If the audience knows honorifics and expects them in the sub, then just leave them in the sub. Ultimately, it does come down to this wow those "translations" are really jarring, i'd rather try to read the jap on-screen

Attached: 1534461168115.jpg (600x600, 333K)

>In the end, we're talking about JAPANESE entertainment, meant for JAPANESE audiences; we may not be Japanese or know the language, we should try to approach the subject matter as if we were.

That's not your job, it's the translator's job.

>i'd rather try to read the jap on-screen
You wouldn't, because you do not understand a word of it

>If I don't, it's jarring because what I'm hearing is clearly not lining up with what I'm reading.
You are watching subtitles, you mentally diseased fuck. Obviously what you're reading isn't going to match up with what you're hearing, are you fucking stupid?

Yes when they sub western media. And yes you can... but you'll usually end up putting the names in a different place. Or omitting a name, or maybe even putting in an utterance/pronoun where there is none.

Read the Nyaa comments under releases with honorifics and see how mad certain types of people get.

>his target audience is a bunch of retard normalfags

Attached: 1537253816007.jpg (388x410, 58K)

Stop being retarded on purpose.

People who don't want honorifics get mad at people who do? I always thought it was typically the other way around.

does this problem only exist with burger subbing teams? never saw it in my own language, there localization is kept to the minimum.

If I hear a character say "keikaku", I expect the subs to read "keikaku". If I don't, it's jarring because what I'm hearing is clearly not lining up with what I'm reading.

>I asked them about it, because the rules state that the torrent just has to have the .si tracker, nothing about it being first, and the answer I got was basically "Yeah it has to be first so you can't upload to other sites also fuck you."
this isn't even true, it just has to be in its own tier. If you're too fucking retarded to know how to create a torrent properly then of course you're being told to fuck off.

Explain why reading "shinji" instead of "shinji-kun" drives you into a rage, while reading "just as planned" instead of "keikakudoori" is totally fine.

I don't think he's willfully lying. He's absolutely seeing it, so I'd imagine it's a case of confirmation bias. The reality is that because of the shift towards stuff like Crunchyroll professional subs are all over the place and a total crapshoot. We're living in a point of history where you can get a translation as conflicted between being literal and interpretive as "Gundam wave motion dancing" for a term that's from English anyway.

>but you'll usually end up putting the names in a different place. Or omitting a name, or maybe even putting in an utterance/pronoun where there is none.
You misunderstand, you'd be arranging the sentence such that the clauses and pronouns line up with how they're spoken.
>character says "Clause 1, pronoun, clause 2"
>subs read "Clause 1, pronoun, clause 2"
Like that. If you know English you can ensure it's fluid and natural sounding.

>san and sama are the same and their usage isnever commented on by characters
commiedevs bored today?

Americans are very much all about destroying other cultures. That's what "melting pot" actually means.

I think the point is that most Yea Forumsnons know enough basic Jap to be able to match what's said to what the subs say. If you rely only on subs then you might as well be watching on mute.

I'm a burger and I'd really like to see how other language translators handle this, like

How did senpai address Yuiga in Bokuben anime in the subs?

For me it's because "just as planned" more or less completely renders the information conveyed by "keikakudoori", while cutting out "-kun" is cutting out relevant contextual information.

It literally is. Try and upload a torrent to nyaa.si with their tracker second and Anidex's first. Unless they changed it, it won't work.

legal translator requires a degree of skill that's pretty fucking hard to achieve. just being the middleman for communication is a lot easier.
also not everything in life has to be judged by how much money you can get out of it, I just wanted to point out that learning some less widespread language can still absolutely work as an advantage if you know how to capitalize on it.
even if it's some shitty dialect from an african tribe that has no industry some charity/NGO will want you

lol @ Yea Forums faggots who think Nyaa moderation is done by fansubbers and not a few autists with literally no horse in this race.

>Engage in japanese media
>Want all the japanese aspects and culture cut out

Attached: 1561601312466.jpg (1920x1080, 1.16M)

>>>san and sama are the same and their usage isnever commented on by characters
ワシ and 私 are clearly not the same, their difference has never been noted in a single subtitle I've ever read, and yet I have never once seen an EOP complain about them both being subtitled as "I".

It's almost as if you have no understanding of the language, and merely want a return to the "good ol' days".

You do realise how cheesy and over the top it is when things like that happen right?

That isn't how Japanese works in the slightest.

this

Heavenrend

>cutting out "-kun" is cutting out relevant contextual information.
No it isn't. Saying Shinji-kun in Japanese is the equivalent of saying Shinji in English. Saying Shinji-kun in English makes it sound like you're being an ironic weeb.

I too, have no horse in this race and I think herkz and the rest of those faggots should kill themselves.

He actually believes it and still hopes that someone will eventually pay him for translating shit so he tries to pander to them.
All the other "arguments" he's making are irrelevant, it's really just about trying to get money out of it.

Did you specify the tracker in its own tier? If you e.g. put a tracker immediately on the next line in qb's torrent creator instead of leaving a blank line, it means it's a fallback tracker and won't get contacted by many clients unless the other tracker fails.

keep pretending the cartel isn't real, retard

they'll probably join the 30% or whatever the figure is soon enough

ok ese me and the other cartel boys are coming for you, gringo

>That isn't how Japanese works in the slightest.
Doesn't matter, the viewer doesn't understand Japanese, and it's less jarring for them when things line up like that.

But why the fuck would he be glad they remove them? It's fucking ENTERTAINMENT media made to be enjoyed damn obviously, and they get mad because people like honorifics as a form tp "spice things up"? Are they that fucking retarded?

You're just a fucking retard.
>full romaji
It's very obvious what he means: Write the full romanization of the word instead of the retarded shortforms. "Tu" instead of "tsu" for example, is just fucking mongoloid.

>"untranslatable culture words"
Go ahead, give me the nice and neat 1:1 translations for tsundere, karoushi, hikikomori, seppuku and keikaku (several of which are actually found in the Oxford English dictionary now, because they're words that didn't exist in the English language.

t. faggot who studied jap and lived 4 years in Japan

>Be young Japanese boy
>get told you're supposed to say -san after people's names most of the time
>do it
>westerners think it's deep and meaningful

Bitch
Fried-chicken
Loser
Suicide
Plan

WOW THAT WAS HARD

I answered everything in your post in mine. Did you even read it or did you just pick keywords and lurch?

It would still be preferred to seeing not one but two languages butchered.

>I always thought it was typically the other way around.
Probably because on Yea Forums the majority of people wants to keep the honorifics. But especially on nyaa you always have people seething whenever they see a release that obviously has honorifics in it.
They are mentally diseased and can't stand it when anyone refuses to follow their rules, that's exactly why they bullied all the other alternatives into irrelevancy and made sure that their site where they hold all the mod and admin positions is the main one.

With regards to subtitles (since obviously I'd never use honorifics in real life when speaking in English), leaving in -kun is significant because it's not -san, or -chan, or something else. Also, a girl of the same age could refer to him as Shinji-san and it would also basically mean "Shinji" in English, but the cultural reasons for the difference would be obscured. I think in the end it's a matter of personal preference, like people who want footnotes in books and people who don't like them.

that's why you're not a translator. If you'll translate Shinji-kun as a plain Shinji, then how will you translate a "yobisute" which is plain "Shinji" without losing the nuance of dropping the -kun?

This is why JP-illiterate anglofags have no weight in their opinions on how translations should be.

Kill yourself.

>It's almost as if you have no understanding of the language, and merely want a return to the "good ol' days".
This reminds me of the (fictional) experiment with the chimpanzees and the ladder.

Around 5 years ago Russians had pro- and anti-localization teams, just like burgers. Don't know about now, but I doubt anything would change.

lol

You are so fucking retarded you must be a commiedev.

>tfw you sub a show and consistently release in under 24 hr but everyone just downloads HS instead and the thread dies before you release.

To be fair, and I say this as a 100%-honorifics, minimal-localization guy, it really would be ridiculous to try to somehow compensate for all of Jap's pronouns and all their nuances; I know anti-honorific fags will say something about "hurr durr thats lazy translation, its not even translation at all," but I think, I hope, that most Yea Forumsnons could hear a girl say "watakushi" and instantly know she's a rich ojou or something

>tsundere
>bitch
Dont post in this thread again

Way over your head, lad, take a Xanax.

How did karoshi become karaage?

They're glad to remove them because they've adopted a certain point of view and they autistically hate the idea of anyone wanting any different. Also in the first place people probably gave them a lot of shit for removing honorifics and this is their way of trying to get back at them. They've basically decided to back themselves into a corner and viciously attack everyone else.

>tsundere, karoushi, hikikomori, seppuku
Playing hard to get, dying from overwork, a shut-in, and ritual suicide.

None of these concepts are hard. Tu isn't a "shortform", it's just how people type.

How do you do, my fellow (((fansubbers)))?

Is saying señorita being an ironic spic? Is saying monsieur being an ironic frog? Is saying herr being an ironic nazi?

Please do kindly fuck yourself, user. -kun relates information about personal relation, hierarchy and other contextual information. Imagine you're translating Pandora in the Crimson Shell: Ghost Urn and you leave out Altman calling Nene "Nene-kun". Stop being an ironic contrarian, it is very off-putting.

>I think, I hope, that most Yea Forumsnons could hear a girl say "watakushi" and instantly know she's a rich ojou or something
Then why are none of them complaining about "I" not lining up right in their ears? They seem to do that a lot for honorifics.

>They've basically decided to back themselves into a corner and viciously attack everyone else.
this. they can never go back on it because they've been too fucking autistic about it on every single platform they use.

>Japanese name order
Alright. This is up to preference
>Honorifics
Eh. It really depends on the work
>Most untranslatable or culture-based words left in original form
Which? Last I checked, manga is a word in English too, tsundere is basically a part of even the newest of newfags vocabulary
>Food, proper names, nicknames are left in original form
This is fine, unless the translator is skilled enough to make it even better in English
>Full romaji in names
This is meaningless. There are various competing standards. Reminder that "Yoco" is technically valid romaji. So is "Ryuuzouzi", or to go full on VNDB-tard mode on it: "Makice Qurisu" or "Cingeki no Kyozin" for Attack on Titan.

>0% memes
What about the anime that incorporate memes? Pop Team Epic and the Science Adventure franchise especially.

>0% trolling
Same deal

>0% rewrites
Sometimes this will be necessary, for example, to change sentence order to make it flow better.

I am a translator, and the reason why I am a translator is that I studied it in university. The proper way to translate the difference between Shinji and Shinji-kun is to drop the -kun and to convey the substance through the context.

>tsundere
>Playing hard to get

This should be the true shibboleth: if you translate tsundere or not.

>most Yea Forumsnons could hear a girl say "watakushi" and instantly know she's a rich ojou or something
The funny thing is that back in the days of fansubs, you learned that information from TL notes.

Actually just read the source code and it can be literally in any tier as long as it's in its own tier
github.com/nyaadevs/nyaa/blob/e04bbdfbf9419f79ce79c54d8dd5bcffeda2289e/nyaa/forms.py#L488-L508

Based tech-illiterate seething pantsu tard

>You do realise how cheesy and over the top it is when things like that happen right?
Ah yes the old. 'W-well the audience would think it's bad/cringy so I rewrote it something I, a person with no comedic or literrary sense, think is good regardless of the artistic integrity of the work.' Rewriting is irredeemable. Like that one translator for a JRPG who removed the fact that a character was really misogynistic and crude towards women in his speech because they felt it was bad.

How would you translate yandere, kuudere, and dandere, while keeping it clear that they're all similar terms to tsundere?

Or the Gabriel Dropout english translations

>Is saying señorita being an ironic spic? Is saying monsieur being an ironic frog? Is saying herr being an ironic nazi?
Yes, yes, and yes, respectively. Nobody ever says any of those words in English for any other purpose.

With "Shinji", dude.

Say you were translating an English work to Japanese. Do you turn Harry Potter into Harry-kun? Or do you leave it as is, because English has no honorifics?

No I mean, it's a cheesy thing in Japanese, it's not some subtle nuance. It's hitting you over the head with a club.

>appealing to retarded authority
You can either insist on your stupid degree and your enlightened take on translation or understand what the community expects and needs out of fansubs.

>hurr durr i'm a translator because i said so
show the context, then, mr. "i'm a translator"

HS really has to drop the ball for people to be willing to wait. Either because they completely fuck up the typesetting like with JK this season which is unreadable, or because the localization is ass like with Index.

>Then why are none of them complaining about "I" not lining up right in their ears? They seem to do that a lot for honorifics.
First-person pronouns are tricky I'll admit, since Euro languages don't have these kinds of constructions; honestly it really is just a "sacrifice" to leave in "I, me" etc than try to import "watashi,boku,ore,watakushi/etc;" honorifics are much more simple and can be left in without causing much confusion, unless youre a braindead burger.

What do you want him to do? magic up a short story or something to give context?

>this problem is entirely about anglos being too retarded to handle other cultures
case closed then I guess.

Tsundere is absolutely not a 1:1 to "playing hard to get." One translation I read had it as "hot and cold girl", which is way better than that shit.

What I would like to know is why some people think that translations require turning every single thing into its English-language equivalent, or something as close to it as possible. If you look at university-level translations of literature you'll find that they're filled with translation notes to explain concepts that aren't easily conveyed, and in some cases, especially with philosophy, they'll leave in the entire foreign word and add a note doing their best to explain it.

>the community
You are a tiny percentage of a much larger audience. What's funny is that it doesn't matter how much you piss and moan. If that dude's translation is the only one out there, you're going to grumble and moan, and consume it anyway, because you have no other choice.

You're like a chicken complaining that the feed isn't very nice this week. Feel free to starve, dude.

Comparing none-fiction to fiction is ridiculous.

I understand full well that the community expects and needs fansubs to cater to their autistic obsession with bad translation.

The context is the entirety of Evangelion.

% memes
>What about the anime that incorporate memes? Pop Team Epic and the Science Adventure franchise especially.
what's up with this recent trend of pretending you are mentally handicapped and have zero common sense when it comes to interpreting statements?

Probably because a 20 minute TV show aimed at an audience of mostly teens doesn't really need a 500 page dissertation write-up.

CR wants localized subs so they can market anime to normalfags and make more money.

It readily applies to fiction, especially once you get into the classics.

Wow, you really are a jackass.

It's almost like those are aimed at scholars and not casual consumers.

Shame they are so damn annoying, they just can't shut up and let people enjoy their shit however they want.

>this problem is entirely about anglos being too retarded to handle other cultures

I wouldn't say that, it's more like those retards can't stand the idea of people liking honorifics for whatever reason and want to keep them because they like that specific part of anime and manga.

>a TL note is comparable to a 500 page dissertation write-up

That's fine and all, but what if the audience wants a highly technical translation? There are plenty of people here who want that level of detail and scholarship. Are they wrong to desire subs that give them that?

Lots of people bitched and moaned about the new Eva translation, which is a lot more "faithful" to the original.

And you really don't fucking understand your station.

I wanna watch jap dubs of Western movies now

INTERESTING THAT YOU CHOSE HARRY POTTER
Now I dont know if this is an old thing from Rowling's time, but in HP, a BRITISH cultural work, people outside of friends and family call each other by their last names, so Harry and Draco call each other Potter and Malfoy, respectively. Do you "translate" that, because in America people don't really do that, especially not between students?

actually I'm going to edit it and reupload the .ass so other people don't have to suffer through that garbage

my harry potter and robinson cruzoe were filled with notes and they're casual books

The classics are history as well, and usually have multiple kinds of translation done for varying different reasons.

>BRITISH cultural work, people outside of friends and family call each other by their last names

We do? this is the first I've heard of it.

Only normalfags and newfags watch Eva.

>That's fine and all, but what if the audience wants a highly technical translation?
That's why a variety of sub groups for a show is important, so specific audiences can be satisfies. It takes like 20 minutes to edit an episode's script.
>There are plenty of people here who want that level of detail and scholarship. Are they wrong to desire subs that give them that?
Absolutely not.

>Are they wrong to desire subs that give them that?

For the retards that sperg out at the sight of anything Japanese in the subs, yes.

I'm not a Brit, but if you read HP youll see students referring to each other by their last name, which of course sounded weird to me as an AMERICAN, but I just thought it was a British thing and carried on. Rowling is old so maybe things changed for you guys.

In that case discussion is impossible, and any attempt will inevitably end in pointless squabbling.

>I understand full well that the community expects and needs fansubs to cater to their autistic obsession with bad translation.
Maybe so. But regardless of your hot take on anime fans want or don't want, that expectation exists regardless. Your snobbish insistence on a "proper" procedure detracts from the enjoyment that many "autists" derive from their shows. Just stick with honorifics and put a TL Note if need be. Maybe CR won't hire you but people with appreciate your work.

>Tu isn't a "shortform", it's just how people type
That's literally what short form means, user.

>Playing hard to get
That's not what being tsundere means.

>dying from overwork
Fair enough, I'll take it.

>a shut-in
A stretch, since hikikomori, as defined by the ENGLISH dictionary and the Jap government, is "acute social withdrawal" leading to complete isolation from society for a period of at least six months.
That's certainly quite a bit more severe than just "being a shut-in".

>ritual suicide
Ritual suicide is an extremely generic term. It could mean anything. Both harakiri and seppuku are found in English dictionaries, because it's a specific ritual suicide intrinsically related to old Japanese warrior culture.

>Lots of people bitched and moaned about the new Eva translation,
Most of the bitching came from fujoshis who didn't want gay erasure and people who were mad about the fact that they took away Fly Me To The Moon. Most of the original line changes weren't talked about besides the Kaworu stuff. The only exception IIRC is "I'm so fucked up" into "I'm the lowest".

There's nothing wrong with wanting garbage. There's everything wrong with crying and complaining that large companies don't pander to your niche taste, because you live in an echochamber and you think everyone else must either think like you, or just not know enough to realise that your way is the "correct" way.

Just shoot Herkz and GJM in the head and all of this shitflinging will stop.

>Sup nigga, here's your localization files.catbox.moe/gjatur.webm

Well, yes. You can't have any sort of discussion with them as shown by the comments over at nyaa.

That's an interesting point, although I call my friends by their last names all the time anyways.

I can't believe the feminist SJW cartel is trying to steal my precious bodily fluids by making Tifa's breasts smaller through 5G and the Japanese 2020 Olympics.

What does that have to do with anything in this thread? Why create a strawman?

Yeah let's murder people over their opinions.

I really hate it when subs change Celsius to Fahrenheit and meters to what ever they use. I hate Americans.

Tifa is ugly as fuck to begin with and final fantasy is for normalfags. Try again.

>"I'm so fucked up" into "I'm the lowest".
It was a very good example of an excellent contextual translation but a pretty rubbish technical translation. There are times when translations become significant works of art of their own.

>There's everything wrong with crying and complaining that large companies don't pander to your niche taste
Who is? People complaining about big companies not following the bottom line and localising everything in order to pick up a massive audience are as stupid as those attacking people simply forpreferring non-localised subs.

I think it was a joke.

And we'll start with you :^)

I hate it when fansubbers use light-years as a measurement of time.

Shut up Soros shill

>There are times when translations become significant works of art of their own.

This is very true.

Couldn't it have been "I'm the worst." ?

people also bitched about sekuto being translated to a leftist terrorist organization

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.

So why did this drama take place in a dual subtrack anime episode release? Care to enlighten me?

Why do I even bother with this board still? Shameless and idiotic. Would you act like this IRL, user? Embarrassing.

Somewhat related:
The Norwegian translation of HP is the only one where the NAMES of the characters have been translated. Rowling was furious when she found out, but it was too late to change it back at that point (second or third book, I think).
It does actually make sense, though. All the Brittish names have meaning and connotations relating to the characteristics of the persons, none of which is comprehensive to someone who doesn't know English.

You are 10 light-years to early to say things like that, underclassman.

I hate it when George Lucas does the same but with parsecs, and people let him get away with it

it's the period of time it takes for light to travel for a year

>>That's certainly quite a bit more severe than just "being a shut-in".
Hardly. Shut-ins are people who don't leave the house, because of some kind of physical or mental disability. It's an apt translation, which is why you'll see it everywhere. I guess you could say "hermits" instead, but then you get the wrong impression of dudes living in the mountains. I'm sure hikikomori is used colloquially even for guys who don't leave the house on the weekend as a disparaging remark.

>Both harakiri and seppuku are found in English dictionaries
What's funny is they both have identical meanings. It doesn't matter what the ritual is linked to, it's not as if you really understand that from seppuku anyway. Suicide by disembowelment would be more accurate, but it's a mouthful.

I lol'd.

Yeah, but when you translate or edit things for extended periods of time your common sense can wear away a bit.

didn't they do that in dr. stone? I was wondering if that was the original line too since the guy is supposed to be smart when it comes to science stuff

Weebs were seething because the honorifics one wasn't the default track. They still haven't recovered.

>bump limit
OKAY FINAL VOTE
strawpoll.me/18334175
strawpoll.me/18334177

kek'd*
fucking reddit normies

Leaving in the term "hikkikomori" does let you throw in a TL note to get a good idea of the cultural context though. Some people want that, others don't.

I don't recall.
I know GJM made that mistake in Luluco.

Scanlator scene's only gotten worse recently, too, thanks to patreon and ads

Cartel were seething because the translator included the honorifics track

>character says hentai
>subs say incel

>the cultural context
It's not like shut-ins are considered wonderful productive members of society in the west, dude. The cultural context is fucking identical.

based

>Shut-ins are people who don't leave the house
Shut-in is just a very loose term for people who don't step out much.

>What's funny is they both have identical meanings.
Never said they didn't, user.
The point is that it refers to a special kind of suicide which only makes sense in the context of Japanese history (and therefore is applicable in various contexts in contemporary Japan, which is infamous for having high suicide rates).

>all those groups who pulled out of MD, claiming it tried to steal their work
>when MD is the only aggregator that even lets them delete stuff
Luckily they only had like three manga you'd actually want to read among them.

Which release was this?

>translating seppuku/harakiri
do people really do that?

>The cultural context is fucking identical.
Not quite, since the Japanese have the problem to such an extent.

>>The point is that it refers to a special kind of suicide which only makes sense in the context of Japanese history (and therefore is applicable in various contexts in contemporary Japan, which is infamous for having high suicide rates).
You are literally mentally ill dude, holy shit.

I can't even respond to a post this stupid. It's like trying to argue with someone who believes the sky is green.

>normies
you need to go back

herkz is waiting for the thread to die before posting on his twitter lmaoo

>tsundere
>"hot and cold girl"
tsundere = bipolar
tsundere confirmed for mental health disorder

It's linked in the thread. It's for the second ep of Karakai Jouzu Takagi-san season 2. GJM hopped into the comments and everything went to shit from there.

Nice argument.

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>going on Twitter
user-san, leave kudasai.

dilate

nyaa.si/view/1159176#comments
The release has two tracks, both with honorifics and without.
GJM waltzes in to be autistic about it like usual and throw shit everywhere. They just can't fucking stand it if anyone adds honorifics, everyone HAS to follow their guidelines.

localizing is in the same tier as dub trash that shouldn't exist

have sex

>normies
>you need to go back
God damn zoomie newfaggot. Normie is short for normalfag, a term that originated on this Bangladeshi carpet weavery forum.

This is your threadly reminder to love your TL Notes and to love your fansubbers who are kind enough to share their burning passion about some niche subject.

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>not having twitter to follow nip artist who doesn't update their pixiv
user..

Kill yourself normalfag.

>Garbage Job Media ever doing anything else but shitting up the place

>everyone HAS to follow their guidelines.
To me it feels like they decided a few years ago that since a bunch of companies decided to heavily localise, they'd jump on the bandwagon (and maybe audition to get hired to translate?) and get ahead of everyone else by proselytising, but since those same companies are now a bit indifferent on the topic they've decided to dig in and fight tooth-and-nail for the position they've decided to adopt.

I'm not a normalfag who uses normalfag social media.

Wrong, normie is a variant of normalfag that normalfags use on Facebook, Twitter and irl because you're not allowed to say "fag"
trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=normalfag,normie

please follow @CuntKoala for good (bad) content thank you

No idea. No one in my country would do that, but then again we always had pretty close relations towards the Japanese and there was a lot of cultural exchange.

More than a decade ago sub groups would put longer notes at the end of an episode, sometimes with illustrations and a bit of music on top.

>zoomie
I should not even have replied actually

And pepe is a funny frog used on Facebook to dab
Normies pick shit up and use it their own way, who'd have thunk it.

except pepe is also a hate symbol according to the ADL, an organization that still holds a lot of influence with normies

shut up faggot

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And yet no one ever hired them because even if their translations were top notch, you can tell with 5 minutes of googling that they are atrocious people you don't want to work with. Ever.

If I read it correctly that guy even added the no-honorifics track for the second episode because they were already being autistic when his release for the first episode just had one track with honorifics.

dude, you dont comment/read everyones comments heck you even need to post anything to keep the account alive

What is ADL?

He says as he keeps replying.

but don't you want to get inside scoops from (((the cartel)))?

>that guy even added the no-honorifics track for the second episode because they were already being autistic when his release for the first episode just had one track with honorifics.
His fault for not sticking to his guns, I guess.

Even making a social media account is bad enough.

So apparently this release is from a new fansubber who
>in episode one dropped honorifics
>QC said this may cause complications down the road (probably jokes/plot based on how you address someone)
>release v2 of episode 1 with honorifics
>no-honorificfags shit over the release
>release episode 2 with dual track
>no-honorificfags shit over the release again

What is Google?

Yea Forums is social media, (you)s are likes

If you have something to say, say it, user.
I'm not going to google shit to make sense of your shitpost.

Any reasonable site would’ve banned the no-honorificfags for trolling already.

He's just conjuring up organisations that /pol/ is eternally butthurt by, don't mind him.

Yeah, I know. I learned a lot from those endnotes. It was a neat way to be didactic and to explain shit you're passionate about. I remember watching X and the fansubber didn't translate "kekkai" as "barrier" but he explained the reason why. I may not recall the reason, but at least I have one extra chink word in my vocabulary and my enjoyment of the show wasn't lessened by translator-san's autism.

I don't even mind localising shows a bit or giving them a flavourful translation, than can certainly spice up a show. But people are insisting that standardising everything is a good thing when in fact what you're doing is just appealing to the normalest of normalfags and doing a shit-tier TL job for a community that may not speak Japanese but has a high enough understanding of what is going on to call you out on your bullshit.

Bring TL Notes back. And do endnotes if you have more things to say about the translation or even about the show itself. Things don't have to be approved by the cartel committee

But /they/ run the site.

You have already put more effort into asking than googling would have taken.

You could just use pantsu :^)

prove it faggot

some jewish cabal which tells normalfags what they should get mad about today I think

That’s why I said reasonable user

This isn't the hood...

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Yes, but I don't mind shitposting here and calling you a fag.
If you want to get some sort of message across you can spend your own energy on that.

The latest /pol/ meme, then

You're a dumb slut user, everything makes you hard.

DA JOOS

i really liked this post user

Attached: 1494930008131.png (448x468, 194K)

>dual track
>people are still mad
why are people pretending the honorific people are the trolls

In general I'd say that in spite of bad translations, people who watched fansubs and the fansubbers themselves wanted to learn more about Japanese culture (and those who went too far became weeaboos), and the subs reflect that.

> latest /pol/ meme
it's the Anti Defamation League, it actually is a Jewish organisation trying to classify what counts as hate speech and what doesn't. so it isn't really just a meme.
it's also irrelevant though, who even cares about those tards

I really like You!

Attached: youchoke.png (700x975, 575K)

t. herkz

because nowadays every argument is 99% strawmanning

herkz wouldn't use "faggot", you dumdum.

>TheAnti-Defamation League(ADL; formerly known as theAnti-Defamation League ofB'nai B'rith) is an internationalJewishnon-governmental organizationbased in theUnited States

It's literally a Jewish organization, user.

and why do you think the ADL has literally any influence over that stupid frog picture being associated with nazis when its actual association with nazis came from nazis using it like the culture-thieving niggers they are?

take your meds bro

(((You)))

epic comeback, Goebbels.

The last time I had fun watching a fansub (excluding PreCure) was when user was translating Hi Score Girl. He obviously had love bursting out of him for the subject matter and he genuinely wanted to share. It was the kind of ingenuity that reminded me of first watching anime and learning about the crazy thinks them yellows do in them Chinalands. And I really do have to ask myself: what the fuck is going on? Why are these complete and utter embarrassments going on evangelising about the "proper" way to do subs? Where has all the colour gone? All the genuine love for anime and Japanese culture? I just don't care at all for these "developments" and for these internet divas who fashion themselves as some sort of elite when in fact they're just an embarrassing and cancerous lot.

Actually the new owner is against censorship, unless it isn't censoring when it is "them" but only when it is (You)

What did user mean with this post?

The plain and simple reason is because companies decided to monetise subbing, and while policies are inconsistent the general American habit for decades has been to localise heavily. The only surviving sub groups (some got bought out, others just grew up and have other commitments now) probably smelled a chance to go legit and went for the kool-aid, ably assisted by the possibility of becoming internet celebrities. Mix that in with an already-existing autism, and you get where we are now.

Any encoders here want to help me out encoding a short (4 min) show?
Email is in the name box.

Not him but the media and the ADL are locked in a rather incestuous cycle where the media is fed lies based on reports by the ADL that the ADL in turn uses to corroborate their "findings". It's quite disturbing. /pol/tards may be scum for the most part but even the broken clock is right twice a day.

>It would still be preferred to seeing not one but two languages butchered.
You know that Japanese closed captions don't even contain the full speech half the time? They omit honorifics and such for brevity.

"American cable news is trash" is barely even a luke-warm take, but if you see a groyper avatar on twitter you can be 99% sure the person using it is some edgy /pol/ retard, so it's not like the ADL is outlandish in their assessment.

>God damn Indonesian weebs are dedicated
this is what english fansubs looked like 10 years ago

lmao he couldn't wait for it to die

I don't do Twitter but I would be suspicious of most frog avatars regardless. The ADL is a politically compromised organisation that is more disruptive than it is useful, its reports are more sensational than informative. And coupled with the incestuous and self-validating cycle that it enjoys with the news media it is quite troublesome. I would promptly disregard any reports issued by the ADL or at most would be seriously compelled to consider the opposite of what they're proposing. I don't have much sympathy for the /pol/creature, but I have nothing but contempt for politically motivated organisations like the ADL.

What fills these people with such vitriol?

Because: desuarchive.org/a/search/text/herkz/username/horriblesubs/

you should tweet the thread at him if you're going to bother us with this

Yeah, I mean I wouldn't expect unbiased opinions from any political think-tank because biased assessments are literally their bread and butter. It's just a bit silly to bring up ADL in particular in a thread that has literally nothing to do with it, and reeks of someone getting a little upset by their own persecution fantasies.

Which sub?

Just wait for Indonesian Crunchyroll.

Is HS leader associated with nyaa or ant cartel members?

rest in fucking peace, matt. ;_;7

pretty sure he's seen it

for posterity

Stop hating on herkz. He is in a deep depression right now and you guys aren't helping him. Other than the #nyaa-dev crew you guys are all he has. He can't take you guys constantly ragging on him. Yesterday I was on the phone with him and he was crying so hard, telling me how sick he was of this life. He went into a fit of rage and I heard things being thrown against a wall. He then hung up on me.

How is his HRT going?

Hopefully killing it.

>Fried-chicken
I'm dying

Yea Forums help me
I have fallen into the pray of just looking at horrible subs only for my downloads.
what other subs should i be looking at and how do i know for what shows there will be better subs then horriblesubs in 2-3 days?
i dont wanna miss out on threads, though i have one exception and that is symphogear. i will watch that shit life, maybe watch horrible sub and then watch the actual sub.

you will say
>just learn japanese
I am starting to get very willing, i am just not sure where to start with it at all.
i can listen to music for a large part of my job, is there some japanese like learning podcast or something i could listen to to get better fast?

Attached: depthy test.webm (1024x576, 631K)

Just search nyaa, and check the fansubdb wiki. For established groups you can check out their history on nyaa and see how quickly/consistently they release.
You'd be lucky to find many groups that release within 2 days.

Use Erai-raws instead of HorribleSubs as a default. Then do the good old searching at the beginning of each season to know what groups are subbing what. Avoid all the usual suspects. And set your RSS feed so that you don't have to go to nyaa every day like a nigger.