How shit is Ippo these days?

hni-scantrad.com/eng/lel/?manga=Hajime no Ippo&chapter=Chapter 1265#page=1

After retiring for the second time he'll have an awesome career as salsa dancer.
In fact we should call the Dempsey Roll the "Salsa Finisher".

>the boy, he isn't just madly running at the opponent while swaying side to side
>why, I've never seen such technique before

Coach is still being held on a pedestal despite Ippo seeing a fighter who literally was just an evil version of himself and the coach lose and possibly receive brain damage from just absorbing blows the face.

The coach will literally never be re-evaluated as anything but perfection, if you're hoping to ever see that happen then George will be willing to blueball you for the next 10 years.

Guess that's just the wonders of Japanese lack of self reflection.

But the coach has been reflecting on how much he let Ippo down for the past few arcs. They're covering his shortcomings, albeit slowly.

I think the coach himself might reflect, he already did once when talking about how Takamura literally didn't need him to be a prodigy.
It will just never be relevant to Ippo's development as a character, who will eat as many punches as it takes to show off dempsey roll 5.0 this time he thrusts his hips wildly edition to the coach.

It seems to be the opposite of what you're saying, based on what happens in chapter 1264

>Ippo eventually realizes he wants to go back to fight.
>But he made the promise to Kumi, who still doesn't know he loves her.
>He decides to man up. He'll tell her his feelings, but that he also loves boxing.
>This drives a wedge between them and she leaves him.
>He goes back to the ring, reflecting on past mistakes and doing things properly this time.
>He's now 100% full oxygen blanco y negro ambidiestro back to basis Ippo.
>But something changed. His heart hardened when Kumi left him. He slowly becomes a beast.
>He finally learns to be a butcher on the ring, but without losing control.
>That's not enough, though, Martinez is still beyond his grasp.
>When he's lost in despair he rekindles his romance with Kumi and fully masters the dempsey that can go right, left, back, forward, up and down.
>The manga ends after his fight against Martinez for the belt.

In what way, in that chapter Ippo completely blames himself while claiming he didn't truly follow the coaches teachings, meanwhile the coach seeths behind closed doors.

As things are, the coach would die to have him in the ring on one hand, but on the other he must respect his decision. Also, unless Ippo is 100% about coming back (right now even at his best he's half-assed about it) it would be very wrong to make him put his life in the line again.
I think many of the others feel like that too. But it's not something that you can joke about. If and when Ippo comes back it has to be his decision, not coerced by anyone. Otherwise it's best he sticks to his new role as mentor and leaves it at that. That's why the coach stops him. Right now he's on a dangerous line when he's thinking about coming back, but not really into it. And in the international scene he won't last three rounds unless he puts everything, his health included, on the line again.

>michael GOAT

Well, at least we all know that if Takamura is to lose everyone will say that he was the defeated by the GOAT, so it's nothing to be ashamed of.

Implying takamura is capable of losing to black boxers and without 200 chapters of buildup

Ippo should get oxygen implants to circumvent his condition

>Martinez still beats him since Ippo can't into lefts

>Thankfully, the dempsey meme is over
The dempsey will live forever

There's no way Takamura will lose to the goat, it'll be a comical ko as usual.

ippo gains [weather report]

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I wonder what would've happened if Takamura was still coaching Ippo.

ippo would never be national champ that's for sure.

That's like a farmer raising a pig so that he can eat it. Would probably make for a better story.

the pace has been a drag. we've had a shit ton of chapters just teasing if ippo will get back into the ring or not. im fine with a low point for ippo's character, but couldnt we hurry it up.

Despite what the other anons said, i think Ippo would've succeeded way more if Takamura was his coach, there are so so so many fights where Takamura is on the stands thinking "come on old man, have you really not figured it out" or stuff to that effect. If Takamura was his coach he would've won against Gonzales, but probably not Martinez, because even Takamura was shocked when he realized how bullshit Martinez was and he man handled Date like a child.

>tfw we will literally have to wait for Wally to gain 10 combates before having any hope of Ricardo going down

>implying Ricardo wont win because EXPERIENCE and SAVAGERY but also BOXER and CHAMPION

Hope does not guarantee victory user. It simply gives us hope.

>implying Wally won't jungle gym bounce his way through a black hole and reappear surrounding Martinez with 10 different Wallys from 10 different time lines from 10 different directions

NAIVE, Quetzalcoatl is the Aztec god of wind, air, and learning. Learning means that Woli would land a hit, but Ricardo would instantly learn how to counter it.

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>chapter 265
>he already warmed up in the waiting room
>it's a bold an effective strategy
This goddamn fucking coach. Somehow, Goat having warmed up before the match is unforeseen.
What the fuck is wrong with this coach? Isn't warming up before their event par for the course for any athletes whatever sport they practice?

It's a dishonorable strategy, as expected of a gaijin. A true samurai would never do something like that.

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Alf was the coolest guy. Fucking destroyed ippo

Mashiba's fight was pretty Kino.

Alf would've been way cooler if he didn't go full retard and go "MUH METIZTL DEATH GOD" and started trading punches.

final boss when?

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>He isn't.
The coach is genuinely bad and the people working for him are not better. Takamura already had the talent to take the world. Ippo honestly had potential but the techniques and stuff he learned with the coach are outdated and only got worse with time. Alf even wonders how the hell Ippo got so far using such techniques. The trainer of Woli saw the disaster that sooner or later was going to crash against Kamogawa and Ippo.

When Kimura trained for a season with Miyata he honestly got better than training most of his career in the Kamogawa boxing gym.

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>implying Kamogawa's Yamato Damashi isn't just the nip way of cultivating
Once Ippo masters the 720 degree 4th dimension Dempsey Roll he'll be able to convert his oxygen into qi, or dark qi in the case of shadow oxygen.

Migatte no Coach? UI (Ultra Ippo).

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No puede ser... ULTRA OXYGENO!?

Was that when he slapped a kid?

And this is go FURTHER BEYOND!!!!

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Yes, just like how chinks have their meridian system circulate the qi, Ippo will use his infinity Dempsey Roll to circulate oxygen. It's been in front of us all along.

It cannot be.... In Japan? Is this the legendary, no, the impossible.... Oxygen from all directions? The legendary omni-oxygen that every boxer has in the history of mankind has failed to obtain?

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The kid finally did it, this was what I looking for, the Ultimate transformation in power and oxygen. The legendary Super Oxygen god!

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>I dropped it around the time the Wally fight ended.
What's wrong? Can't handle the Mowgli style?

Fuck, I was still at 62.

I still say Kimura would be the perfect trainer. He has a deep insight in the sport and his only problem is that he has no power.

We've seen what Ippo Negro can do, he doesn't fuck around.

Is there actually any conceivable way anyone can beat Martinez at this point? Date was supposed to be a pretty damn good boxer, even Takamura admitted so and he rarely compliments anyone, and fucking ricardo barely got serious in their match.

Yup

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Ippo decided the reason he kept losing was because he was spending too much time dodging (hah!) when he should have been throwing more jabs with his left, which he forgot he could even do. Coach tells him that doesn't matter and he was right to stick to trying to force out the dempsey roll, even though it stopped working forever ago, because it gives coach a boner to see him using it.

So yeah its still shit. Also ippo shaved his head.

I like that that whole fight was basically just a "how the fuck did this complete gorilla even manage to get up to this point with this boxing"

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>without 200 chapters of buildup
His detatched retina and probable brain damage have been foreshadowed for over a thousand chapters.

No. Like you said, Takamura himself said that Ricardo was beyond even the world level.

Date got fucking destroyed and he was supposed to be Martinez' toughest opponent. Either you one shot Ricardo or you have to be a genetic freak to beat him.

the real asspull of part 6

Woli (10 combates)

Ippo is going to return to boxing once Sendo dies to Martinez in the ring.

No fuck you leave my boy Sendo alone.

Sendo is a Joe expy, Martinez is a Jose Mendoza expy, it was always destined to happen.

I used to think the same thing but i'm not so sure, because to get to Ricardo, Sendo needs to kill Gonzales, and would Gonzales really lose to Sendo? At this point i think it's more likely that Gonzales would defeat Ricardo, and then Sendo would lose to Gonzales.

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Sendo is Apollo

I actually decided to read the Date vs Martinez fight, and it's as fucking brutal as I remember it, but afterwards I found this little gem. Takamura fucking called it hundreds of chapters ago. Maybe he would've been a better teacher to Ippo, he basically had him pegged.

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Sendo will get destroyed if he ever fights Gonzales. The entire fight is objectively proof that Morikawa isn't a hack, and that the coach being such a shitter is entirely intentional, for one simple reason: The coach never realized Gonzales was an ambidextrous switch hitter. Pic related.
And it's not even a one-off panel, there's multiple pages showing Gonzales leading with his right, and in one page it's even accompanied by the Static visual effect that Miytata was getting in his fight with Randy, who was also ambidextrous.

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Ippo could have beaten Gonzales if he wasn't a complete retard. Sendo is also a retard, but at the very least his best move isn't his all-encompassing strategy.

To this day I still find it weird that Gonzales had a feeling that if Ippo had beaten him then Ippo would've been able to take down Martinez. Also, there's no way Sendo is beating Gonzales, Sendo isn't good with speedy fighters who won't crumble under pressure.

Even Sendo knows that Ricardo is stronger than he is.

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Ricky is basically a demigod in this manga. He beat one of the strongest characters in the series without even ruffling his hair.

I completely forgot about this, Sendo switching targets.

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Is Morikawa a secret genius? Is such a thing even possible?

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I hope Sendo doesn't get steamrolled to show off the fact that their type of boxing simply isn't viable on the world stage, that boy deserves better.

He is, Kamogawa is social commentary on why Japanese boxing culture is so inferior. Kamogawa isn't his author avatar, Kumi is.

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To be fair, Sendo's boxing is even stupider than Ippo's, his boxing is "i'll keep throwing punches like a madman and i'll hit you eventually, i hit like a truck so if i do i win lmao" and he just gets through fights because "instincts"

Is there some reason Ippo doesn't think he's capable of high level technical skills? He's never even tried. His whole strategy has just been nothing but turtling up, weaving, and punching. He hardly even does actual combos.

Because the coach told him that, over and over and over and over.

Martinez won't even accept a challenger that can't beat Gonzalez.

Insticts are important, and he's basically Ippo's equal in just throwing out punches above his weight class and eventually landing one. And that's why he's so likely to lose, there's no point of having both of them on the world stage.

Sendo actually learned to block though.

Pretty sure he did combos early on, i think that's how he beat Volg, combos just started disappearing after he learned the Dempsey Roll, but if i remember right i think he used all his moves to lead into the Dempsey Roll in his fight against Sawamura.

At least he's stupid enough for his reckless boxing to make sense, this is just how he fights and enjoys fight.
It was drilled into Ippo who's only slowly piecing together he needs to do more to get by.

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Getting punched in the face is the only acceptable warm-up for a samurai boxer man.

Has anyone compared Date's execution at the hands of Martinez with Ippo's over reliance with the Dempsey Roll? Date insisted on getting the heartbreak shot in and he paid for it dearly.

The mexicans must laugh about all the fancy "special moves" the Japanese come up with over dinner
>can you believe it? The boy sways left and right and calls it a technique
>wait til I tell you about the guy who just punches you in the torso really hard

He never really went for it. He tried to do it at the last moment and it actually worked. He was just to gassed to capitalize on it.

Even better if they actually like the frog punch because it looks like a lucha libre move.

You might be onto something, Gonzales and Ricardo don't go around claiming they have some magic super punch to win matches.

It's probably a combination of fatigue and his fist being wrecked (Martinez blocked the first HBS with his elbow and it injured Date's fist). It'll be tragic if they reveal Martinez' heart is actually on the other side so Date's move is nerfed from the get go (would still hurt but it wouldn't get the desired opening that he wants).

>I don't get it, he swayed from side to side for 10 seconds and I just jabbed him to death

Now that i think about it, i can't think of many fighters in the manga outside of asians having named magic punches, in fact that only one that comes to mind was the crocodile guy that Miyata fought, who had the "BLOODY CROSS" counter. Even Takamura doesn't, he tried to come up with one in a joke match though.

That'd be amazing
>This Aoki guy, he's on a level of boxing much higher than most of the Japanese
>He's sure to be a troublesome opponent someday

I doubt there's much meaning to it other than this being a shonen and so needing to have a bunch of gimmick fighters instead of actually well rounded opponents

How long do you reckon it will take for Ippo to go back to boxing

>Takamura himself said that Ricardo was beyond even the world level.
Is Ricardo going to try to become the Solar System champion?

That's why he doesn't want to retire, he is waiting for the ayy boxers to show up.

White Fang?

Oh right him too, and he learned the hien from YAMATO DAMASHI coach, now that i think about it, didn't the US champion(Mike?) mention that relying on one killer move was retarded?

Maybe that's the whole point, Takamura, the absolute peak of boxing finds those kind of gimmick punches silly and is still undefeated.
Everyone else out there trying to invent a single trick to take them to the world while the only thing necessary is just good fundamentals.

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This fight is an absolute joy to read

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Ippo can't do the "twist head with the punch" technique?

It's better now
We get Ippo slice of life and focus on other character fights
best outcome possible

Be honest. Is there actually any hope for Ippo as both a character and as a manga now, or is it actually just getting to the point where George clearly isn't all that interested in keeping up with it anymore and it seems like it might just spontaneously end?

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>It's okay because I'm getting punched in the head, not my face
Kamogawa's Grade A coaching.

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Wait and see

> a „sport“ where any serious participation results in severe brain damage
w h y
h
y

Because man craves violence

Only the case when your coach is retarded. Literally any sport is potentially dangerous, people even die playing Cricket professionally.

Because gladiator games are illegal now.

Honestly, the most ridiculous shit is still Hawk's duck back punch

At least he didn't give it a name like "the long arm of justice!"

>he doesn't belong to this world anymore, he is going higher and higher
Yes.

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Wasn't his style based on an actual dude?

youtube.com/watch?v=azEatWLF9hI
This guy i believe

Is this the dude that crushed cans and then got crushed when he went up against a legit champion, quit, and then got really fat?

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Women would never understand

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Naseem's biggest problem is that he never really tried as hard as he could and coasted on his given gifts. He didn't really have the right mentality, but that made him fun to watch.

>Naseem
Do you get to the Cloud-District very often?
Oh, what am I saying. Of course you don't.

So when is Ippo getting his brain-fixing dempsey roll?

Ippo cant do anything
By the time his last fight came around he literally knew nothing about boxing anymore, only muh dempsey rorru

I dont see any stance switching here, looks like just regular orthodox

The static effect is there though.

If it was orthodox he'd be leading with his left hand. In those images he's mirroring Ippo's stance, Gonzales is fighting Southpaw vs Ippo's orthodox stance.
Look at their hands in .
Ippo is throwing a left to the body which Gonzales is blocking with his right elbow, which he is leading with. He's fighting Southpaw.

Do you think anyone will ever actually beat Martinez?

Ippo will.

Kumi Blanco

Did Ippo start boxing too old? How old does a world champion usually start boxing?
I think he started when he was 16, in many other sports if you start so old you'll never do it to the big leagues unless your talent is exceptional, which doesn't seem to be Ippo's case.

He was fine, the most they do with a kid who enters the gym younger than that is conditioning, which he didn't really need.

>Unlimited combination
>Only able to be done from a certain style of movement
You might be able to go infinitely and an "unlimited number of hits", but the number of ways you can mix it up though cast have their limits.

Why not just, I dunno, not get so caught up in techniques that you end up making them coffins you either fight out of or die in? Learn to spontaneously change punches on the fly based on your opponents reactions like some actual high level boxers can do, or at the very least, learn to not be so tied to what the next punch should be, being able to make decisions on the fly?

Just maybe? Just MAYBE that's the reason he did the "ultimate punch" when his mind went blank? Yeah, i'm thinking he's an idiot and should have just listened to the coach when he taught him to "Strike first" so they don't have the opportunity to instead of "Let them get their's off, then give them back twice as much". That's a backup plan at best and making it your primary mode of attack is how you get brain damage and a shitty life after a short career.

Far from it, Ippo is actually pretty damn young. The whole idea of boxers having short careers is just more Kamogawa bullshit, tons of champions have held belts in their 30's and 40's, and some even into their 50's. Jack Dempsey held his until he was in his mid 30's iirc.

hes leading with that arm because he shifted his weight to parry the body blow, not because he switched the position of his feet

I think that when he talks about short careers he doesn't mean the champions, but the countless guys who quit boxing after realizing that they are not cut for it.
We all know about champions and title contenders, but in the middle there are many guys who don't reach those highs.

His right leg is forward.

His right leg is obviously forward though, look at the image. He is, by every standard, in a southpaw stance, and he spends half the fight that way, across several pages. Combined with the fact it's used alongside the same static effect that was used to demonstrate how hard it was to fight southpaws or switch hitters in the past, means it's entirely intentional, not a mistake.

what is exactly the static effect you speak off? The sound effect? Or the panel with the weird lighting pattern?

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The lightning pattern. That same imagery was used in the Miyata vs Randy Boy fight, alongside dialogue from Miyata where he described some sort of "static" in his rhythm that made it hard to him to land jabs. Randy Boy was also a switch hitter, as it turned out, not a southpaw. The fact that Morikawa brought the exact same visual back, in a fight where a fighter is clearly switching between southpaw and orthodox stances, makes it pretty obvious that Morikawa intended for him to be an ambidextrous fighter.
And Kamogawa completely missed it.

They do have short careers, but that's because your body peaks at 20. They won't fight until they're 50, but there are plenty of people in their late thirties.

dammit tokugawa! you can believe in ghosts and imagination powers but not the static effect?

what happened after ippo negro blanco (punished oxygen)

It's a legit tactic. You take some damage but the other guy might even break his hand. Here's Dempsey doing it against Willard.

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while true, as gonzales puts it, it's been phased out for a reason.

Can confirm. I have a 15 degree volar angulation of the fourth metacarpal from someone doing this exact thing. He lost the fight but I'd say I got the worse end of the deal. It was more than 10 years ago and it still hurts when I do anything strenuous with my hand.

Had basically this happen to my hand after punching a wall (retarded I know, didn't need pins thankfully they managed to set it first try), did you ever regain the full strength in that hand? I don't really have any pain but it literally feels like i have lost a finger and muscle below it even after training it for almost a year.

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F!

I have almost full strength in the hand (like 85%), but actually clenching as hard as I can hurts. When I work with my hands for an extended period, I get a dull ache in my hand, the type you get in your legs when you haven't been able to stretch properly for a long time.
Unlike in your case though, my hand was never set, it healed at a 15 degree angle which is where the discomfort comes from. It's fixable, but I can't justify 6 weeks off work for it.

im impressed how much Mori's art improved over the years

>Thread full of discussion and series analysis

It's rare these days, but I'm glad some places here can be this nice.

It helps that hippo threads are rare compared the the FOTM mangos, but yeah the balance between actual discussion and oxygen memes is perfect.

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Is no one gonna post it? Fine, I'll do it.

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What about Ricardo? Is he ambidextrous? Then again has anyone even pushed him hard enough to need to reveal such a thing?

This, Sendo is a legit retard fighting like a retard, it's his style. Ippo is (or at least used to be, before Kamogawa's brainwashing) a smart kid with fighting sense, it makes no sense why he wouldn't try to learn high level defense/combinations instead of following the old fart's prizefighting caveman style.

Nope read the fight again, Date planned it from the very start cause he had zero confidence in being the better boxer, especially after he started getting slaughtered. He hung in all those rounds because he had a trump card to rely on and even from the very start never made any punches that would give away his heart break shot. He literally fought Ippo and used it on him to test it out and see if it would work in the first place. Ippo being as strong as he is was what gave Date confidence in being able to steal a win from Ricardo.

Date had full awareness of how lopsided the match was going to be, and it makes sense. There's no way a guy who stopped training for so long and was already way behind to begin with can feasibly catch up unless the person ahead slows down.

>ayy boxers to show up.
>The ayy lmaos decide to fight against Ricardo because the entire Solar System knows of his power.
>One ayy from Saturn decides to teach his own version of the dempsey roll to Ippo, his Saturnian Dempsey uses the gravity of the planet as the engine for the attack.
>We discover the coach is actually an elder god from other dimension.

>Ippo could have beaten Gonzales if he wasn't a complete retard.
The problem with that fight is that transforms into a slugfest the moment Alf gets so mad that Ippo is such a dumb boxer that he decides to fight just like a retard too.

Honestly, that was the best shot Ippo had to defeat him. But Ippo lacked proper strategy and technique. During the technical part of the fight, Alfredo destroys Ippo without much of a problem.

I think it was implied that Ricardo already mastered that 'best punch' or at least comes close to doing so that Kamogawa told Ippo about during his fight with the underwater gorilla. The right angle, speed, technique, etc, all of it is what Ricardo strives to make his default attack. Think about it, to this day has anyone ever brutalized Ippo's face as fast and as hard as Ricardo? They can't even do it with their rights or a whole match, but Ricardo can do it within a single exchange of merely jabs. The only person who had as easy a time to knocking Ippo out was Takamura and the weight class difference is massive.

It went from half boxing half gag to full gag and boxing as a supplementary. There's nothing wrong with that.

I think Date was closer than anyone to get him serious. And even with that, Ricardo was still holding back because he genuinely didn't wanted to kill Date. After the fight ends, everyone mentions Ricardo looks so clean, that it's like if he never fought in the first place.

Well yeah he never got a scratch on him, he just had some sweat. Whenever he got punched you can tell from his expression that it's of shock, not pain, like 'What is this unfamiliar sensation?'. Guy probably doesn't even get stung by mosquitoes anymore.

>It's a legit tactic.
No one doubts is a legit tactic. The problem is that is such an old fashion technique that no longer works against modern boxing.
Doppo from Baki uses the same technique once against Muhammed Ali Jr. The difference is that Ali didn't had gloves or bandages and injured his hand. But Doppo didn't came clean, he had a serious injury in his head because of that.

Pretty sure Ippo even does it more than once in just that fight alone, he has a complete disregard for damage.

Yeah, going back to the example of Baki. Doppo mentions is a technique used in bare handed fights from 100+ years ago.

The most impressive thing of the fight is that Ippo came so far using just retard strength.

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>he has a complete disregard for damage.
And it all came back to bite him later.

What really came back to bite him later is all the people pushing him back to boxing despite his self destructive style. Like they won't be satisfied until he dies in the ring. Miyata even had a little emotional episode over Ippo not delivering on the comeback fight that Miyata himself cancelled.