What character do you think has the coolest powers?

Based Ueki

He has the blandest power I have ever seen, please be bait

>Of course Ywach & Uryu prove that bankai powers are basically irrelevant as long as you have more power than your opponent. If you do, you can negate them by sheer force of will.

I get Yhwach considering he's for all purposes unbeatable, Uryu's schrift is a lot better in theory than he is at actually using it though. Don't get what you mean by "sheer force of will" because in either case its just a matter of having a more broken ability than your opponent.

OBOETA

lmao at ur life shunsui

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zorojuro

would yhwach and uryu's abilities work on someone with more reiatsu than them both?
i recall sui feng's stinger not killing aizen because his reiatsu levels were absurd

It's not a matter of having a broken ability, its all about power. Ichibei's bankai technically can make any bankai in existent irrelevant because it can overwrite the name. But as Ywach went on to prove, he could undo it by basically just calling out more power--and he killed Ichibei before he awoke The Almighty.

Uryuu did the same thing when he fought Mayuri and broke the metal spoke on his glove. He sacrificed his power, but BTFO'd the captain's bankai with raw power. Ichigo did the same thing with Muugetsu, and BTFO'd Aizen completely. He only survived because of the Hogyouku; sans that he was dead.

Abilities don't actually matter, only power does. For example, if Ichigo was fully in sync with all of his powers, Kyouraku could go bankai against him and it would mean fuck all. Simply because Ichigo in bankai at that point would vastly eclipse Shunsui, and as such would overrule whatever bullshit conditions of said bankai.

explain me his power without sounding retarded

i also don't remember his power, i remember one sword was a woman or something like that

He has the power to learn any ability for the purpose of stripping girls down to their socks and gloves.

Read the thread

>i recall sui feng's stinger not killing aizen because his reiatsu levels were absurd
Because it requires piercing damage to activate, as we learned against the tiger arrancar. It couldn't pierce Aizen's reiatsu.

>and he killed Ichibei before he awoke The Almighty.
You're misremembering that entire fight. Ichibei didn't lose until AFTER Ywhach started using The Almighty.

>Uryuu did the same thing when he fought Mayuri and broke the metal spoke on his glove.
>Ichigo did the same thing with Muugetsu, and BTFO'd Aizen completely
Neither of these scenarios have anything to do with Kyoraku's bankai or this discussion. Neither Ichigo nor Uryu being stronger than their opponent actually neutralized their Bankai. Uryu still got poisoned by Mayuri, Ichigo was never even affected by KS to begin with.

>Abilities don't actually matter, only power does. For example, if Ichigo was fully in sync with all of his powers, Kyouraku could go bankai against him and it would mean fuck all. Simply because Ichigo in bankai at that point would vastly eclipse Shunsui, and as such would overrule whatever bullshit conditions of said bankai.
Headcanon.

See

based bleach loresage

Reiatsu difference has to be ridiculous to lolnope an attack. Soifon had already used her bankai, which normaly needs a week to recharge, twice that day

Except that's basically true. Aizen uses a fully chanted kido, and Ichigo breaks it like its the most casual thing in the world. Ywach sends a wave of black soul king blobs to devour soul society and Aizen hard counters with raw power. SS captains kill Gerard, he comes back stronger and with more power. They kill him again, stronger and even more power. They kill him a third time, stronger and even MORE power.

Grimmjow kicked Ichigo's ass first time, even when in bankai because Ichigo's raw power was pretty low compared to the cat who was completely in sync with his power. Next time Ichigo fought with him, he was more in sync with his power and therefore it was an even fight. Then Ichigo fought Ulquiorra who vastly eclipsed him in power and all his abilities didn't matter. He died, Zangetsu took over, and negated Ulquiorra's own abilities with raw power.

When Ichigo fought Byakuya the first time, in melee combat they were equal to better. Then Byakuya pulled out the stops with his bankai's ability and Ichigo got crushed under the weight off his own power, which let Zangetsu out. What did Zangetsu do? Curbstomped Byakuya with RAW POWER. The immediate difference was so huge, it was like a captain fighting an Academy student, Byakuya COULD NOT keep up.

The ultimate truth of Bleach is that abilities don't matter in the face of total power, but only as long as you can either bring it all to bear at once or can consistently deliver it endlessly.

You can't say that, now he has several powers that no one knows but could come up at any time, on top of just outright hilarious power scaling! So mysterious!

It works by playing games.

>The ultimate truth of Bleach is that abilities don't matter in the face of total power, but only as long as you can either bring it all to bear at once or can consistently deliver it endlessly.

No one said Reiatsu doesn't matter whatsoever. But you're saying reiatsu can cancel ANY ability, which is not true.

>abilities don't matter in the face of total power
Every example you gave are instances of power vs power, not abilities being overriden by power

Yeah.
One sword is his sword the other is his brothers wife's cursed sword.

That's exactly what I'm saying as fact and truth. Reiatsu is simply energy that a Shinigami channels from inside to a medium. Ywach doesn't have any special ability beyond sharing his power. He can only share power or throw it around. He hard countered Ichibei's bankai with just that.

Abilities are derived FROM power. Power is NOT derived from an ability. You don't NEED an asauchi to wield your power. Vasto Lorde hollows exist that can give a captain a run for his/her money. They don't have swords. They are pure power.

No. Kyoraku has two swords that belong to him, each sword has a spirit. Shinsui told one of those spirits to hide the sword of his brother's wife. Shunsui cant use that cursed sword, hes just keeping it safe

Yeah, occasionally having ridiculous scaling like Aizen is convenient, and then the line gets drawn.

>Ywach doesn't have any special ability beyond sharing his power. He can only share power or throw it around. He hard countered Ichibei's bankai with just that.

>>You're misremembering that entire fight. Ichibei didn't lose until AFTER Ywhach started using The Almighty.

>Ywach doesn't have any special ability
Seeing/changing the future

We will never get a reality where Liltotto consumed all of the other Quincies, gaining all of their powers, and became the new Ywach.
Bleach was a mistake

>gaining all of their powers
She can do that?

>that one time Liltotto took a bite out of a panel border

Yeah, in CFYOW. She states that she took Pepe's ability when she ate him, she just can't bring herself to use that one out of pride.

I'm not going to straight up say that's not canon, but Narita might have added that ability in the novel to give the character more flavor.

He can just keep going. There's no limit to this. He then proceeds to have a back and forth with Ichibei, gets "struck down" and realizes that he could see the end of the fight without having to awaken The Almighty. But does so anyway, and then NO Us Ichibei with a mere glance and walks one.

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Ichibei specifically notes right before this that his blade cuts into the name of things and says that Ywach's power is halved. He then goes further and says that both your power AND abilities both have been halved. Ywach proceeds to lolno and restore it.

Speed Reader detected. They said his power Grew considerably since his incarceration. He was far more powerful than he was when he faced Ichigo.

retarded

>and realizes that he could see the end of the fight without having to awaken The Almighty

He says that he was surprised that he didn't have to resort to the Almighty UNTIL that point; Ichibei had forced Yhwach's hand with his Bankai. Otherwise Yhwach would have been defeated then and there.

It's pointless to use Yhwach as the starting point for this discussion, he's broken so far beyond any of Bleach's rules to matter. He's the exception in this case, not the "rule".

Read, nigger

youtube.com/watch?v=2cBXsUh0DHs

Thoughts?

>mobage trash
Not worth a thought.

Except I meant Aizen's shikai ending up functionally nonscalar, but you tried

Yhwach was only beaten because Aizen's power had grown considerably. Aizen's power had become godlier in that it arrested visual perception whereas Juha's power is visually based: Paper smothers Rock. And the fact that Juha's actual future of Ichigo's Shikai killing him WAS CONFUSED AS DREAM! Lets repeat that, Yhwach confused an actual potential future as a dream because his number two's proficiency with Almighty was flawed therefore he didn't counter it with Almighty.

You dumb dumb, Aizen's Shikai was only used on Shinihamis and their equivalents. Aizen was already several times beastlier than Captains.
Post him becoming a hybrid none of the above no longer applied. And it was said that since his sealing his power had grown considerably.

*shinagamis

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>He could have it active on countless people, including all of the captains and vizards at once without any sort of time limit or drawback
>Kisuke with 100 years of prep time and Mayuri's additional option of assistance for one of them couldn't find a removal for it through ""SCIENCE"", and all of SS having a year couldn't at least reset KS's control through kido or one of their countless zanpakuto
Let's not pretend that it wasn't uniquely nonscalar for the sake of simplifying the writing. Book of the End isn't far off. Bach himself gets a pass for actually being a different tier of a being as his power origin

Okay what does that have to do with my argument though

Liltoto can't keep the powers of those she consumed forever though, they disappear as soon as the part she bit off is fully digested.

Book end curses you with alternate history. It's literally a form of Almighty but not OP. He curses Ichigo's bankai to always be there. Juha saw this outcome and reasoned he would break it again but couldn't because Aizen could affect visual prowess in real time. So again, he wiukd have undone book end but couldn't because Aizen countered the Almighty, His boy b messed up the message from Almighty. His boys A arrow from the silver out of his moms heart, and Ichigo being beastly even in Shikai brought down the beast.

No one's power is poorly thought out. Kite is the most consistent in power levels.

Crawler has better powers

That was never my argument? The entire debate has been about whether powerlevels beat abilities.

He didn't cure Ichigo's bankai though. He only said that his blade never broke. The consequence of that is that it essentially rolled back ALL the changes the Royal Guard tries to impose on Ichigo with an asauchi. The creator of the zanpakto had freaked the fuck out that Ichigo had basically roflstomped insanely powerful Shinigami and hollow using a blade that HE did not know of. He specifically said to Ichigo that he's aware of every single blade ever created in circulation.

Then by sending Ichigo home to know the truth of his own power, he forged a new blade for Ichigo which brought Ichigo under SS/Royal Guard control through that new blade as a debt to be paid through life and servitude. Ywach breaks that bankai the instant he understands the implications of that blade's ability through seeing multiple futures. The moment he does this, Ichigo is BACK to being bladeless.

Mayuri points out that the only way to repair a bankai is to reforge it. It CAN heal on its own, but its never the same strength as a result.

Tsukishima's action reset the state to a history where Ichigo's bankai did not break. Why state is that you ask? It's the state where Ichigo BECAME Getsuga, became the blade FOR Zangetsu who then used him as a channel to leverage Muugetsu. It's why when Ywach attempts to break Ichigo's bankai a 2nd time, what's revealed all along isn't TWO Zangetsu in shikai but the ORIGINAL Zangetsu he, Ichigo had carried with him all along--and it turns out to be THE BLADE which kills Ywach; the same one as his dream.

Further still, this blade is also the same blade which Ywach's shadow used Zangetsu, Ichigo's hollow, as an asauchi to forge and create new. There, Ichigo is essentially once again wielding a piece of his own soul. It's also why said blade couldn't be broken by Ywach. You can't break power, nor can you break a soul. You can just consume it or change its form to use as more power. SS and RG blades can break because they're physical mediums.

All Fiction is probably my favourite ability out of anything I've seen, cool name too.

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That's also because Kumogawa is actually one of the best anti-heroes in recent memory.

I like it when character powers are unique (in the story), and have to be used creatively to overcome obstacles.

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Just for clarity, I've had nothing to do with the Juha discussion. I didn't realize why you were referring back to him until now.
My point is solely that in the discussion of pure power vs effects, in Bleach it's the outliers that are seemingly arbitrarily allowed by Kubo to be nonscalar that can overcome a gap in power rather than an overarching power rule.

Kyoka Suigetsu's origin is just like every other zanpakuto. But it gets numerous exceptions that make it ridiculous solely because it's Aizen and Kubo wanted Aizen to be oppressive.
Book of End IS like a mini (and I use that word lightly for all it can do) Almighty, in spite of that being a divinity based ability and Tsukishima barely being given any indication of a reason he should be so much more special than the other fullbringers. Hell, it lets him learn things years at a time on top of just messing with people. It's flat out reality manipulation.
All the while a comparable MC would be Orihime, who's shield and healing have both been described as the ability to reject reality, and while it's descriptions have seemingly pushed it to something that would bypass a direct power struggle, she's still shown to have a limit where shear reiatsu actually does remove her potency- because it's not convenient

All the people in Blassreiter who got infected and didn't go crazy.

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>all this headcanon
Jesus

Explain Barragan.
He was full end boss of HM tier and would have probably been able to hard counter the captain commanders bankai with ease.

Not that user, but
>hard counter the captain commanders bankai with ease

I can't think of anyone in Bleach who could actually hard-counter Zanka no Tachi, and Barragan is no exception.

Captain commander is just an army of summoning undead and hella hot fire.

Barragan is rot and the end of time.
Fire is movement and death/entropy is unending cold.
He is a hard counter
Not only that, but he would have rotted his entire army of the undead and left them as little more then bonemeal.

It would litterally come down to martial prowess...and yeah. Captain commander would have slapped his shit.

You're entirely underestimating Yama, he'd kill Barragan in a single swipe of ZnT, doesn't even need the trillion skeletons (which would be immune to death as they're already dead and burning for eternity).

Yama's Bankai is basically Barragan times a thousand. If Barragan could take damage from Soi Fon's bankai he is absolutely not immune to ZnT.

Pein

Correct, but Yama's raw power completely eclipsed Barragan. Barragan's power is to rot everything into nothing. But well, that's just a fancy way of saying "with the swipe of my hand, Imma reduce you to atoms" aka Dr. Manhattan. Same shit, different character.

You can't destroy matter, that's a pretty fucking fundamental rule of the universe. Also, what's the hard counter to entropy and darkness? That'd be fire and light. Yama's bankai concentrates all that power into the tip of his blade. If you channeled the power of the sun into the tip of your blade and then swung it around, anything it touches would be vaporized in an instant.

Barragan was number 2, Aizen was stronger than all the Espada and Captains together, and even when Yama sacrificed his left arm, the ONLY thing that managed to do to Aizen was singe up his clothes and give him some mild burns. He sandbagged his raw power to hell and back.

Going back, Soifon tried to do a double tap kill technique on Aizen. First touch didn't matter, because his raw reiatsu overpowered her ability and second tap didn't matter either because he stopped her hand before it could reach him to prove a point.

>Going back, Soifon tried to do a double tap kill technique on Aizen. First touch didn't matter, because his raw reiatsu overpowered her ability and second tap didn't matter either because he stopped her hand before it could reach him to prove a point.

That had nothing to do with "canceling her ability", she just couldn't pierce his reiatsu, same principle why SS Ichigo couldn't cut Zaraki.

Yamamoto was the most BASED character and he got robbed by Kubo's writing

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Yama's defeat by Yhwach was actually really well done, props to Kubo

That's the fucking point. Cancellation is irrelevant, if raw power eclipses the attacking force. It's literally numbers. If you're attacking with 10 and I counter with 10 quadrillion billion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion. I win.

That's like saying "I attack you with a reality warper," and I counter with "well I'll just throw an infinite number of universes at you."

In more Marvel terms, imagine the attacker has the Infinity Gauntlet with all stones active. The defender doesn't need the gauntlet and can channel the raw energies simultaneously from anywhere in the universe. Even though technically both wield the same ability, Thanos would lose because his ability to channel all the power of the stones is ultimately limited by his own life--whereas the defending party who can do it without aid is theoretically limitless in capability.

It's all bullshit at the end of the day, but raw power always trumps any ability--because going back ability is derived from power and not power being derived from ability.

Your ability to run a 5k in under 30 minutes, is dependent on your endurance and the strength of your muscles: the basis of your power.

> It's literally numbers.
Bleach is not DBZ. Reiatsu is not a static power level, although its usually indicative of higher reiryoku.

>It's all bullshit at the end of the day, but raw power always trumps any ability
Not any ability; just any ability that is inherently derived from reiatsu. For example, reishi abilities like the Quincy use work on their own rules.

Actually I should add that even Reiatsu can't cancel out certtain abilities; for example, Starrk has a higher reiatsu than Shunsui's but couldn't cancel out his Shikai ability. Having high Reiatsu does help overall, but its not the only factor deciding the outcome of a battle.

Yeah, Kubo's whims are

>Yeah, Kubo's whims are

The internal logic of Bleach's power systems are consistent, don't know why you'd imply otherwise.

You are all forgetting that to cancel an ability the difference in reiatsu has to be enormous

DIRTY DEEDS
DONE DIRT CHEAP

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"Cancelled" isn't even the right word for it; basically reiatsu can act like a protective aura as we saw as early as SS, and even then you'd still be vulnerable to something like Kyouka Suigetsu.