Why can't modern anime look like this anymore? Do you think there will come a time when studios start using cels again?

It can still be done, but it requires skill, dedication, blood, sweat, passion, SOUL...something that few people have. It requires actual animators, not outsourcing shit anywhere. That along with the goodwill of the people of a studio that would or not greenlit something like this.

Are you a technomancer?

>kawajiri still does a bunch of animation work but will never direct anything again
wtf

>inb4: veg

For the same investment of time and cash youd need for a cel show, you'd be able to shit out like 14 new isekais and be way more likely to turn a profit.

this right here

In this day and age? Maybe not. I don't think there is anyone who wants to shell out the money for cels and acrylic paints.

Why cant movies look like this anymore? Why can't vidya look like this anymore? Why can't this look like this anymore?

Attached: intolerance.png (1280x720, 1.06M)

senile old fuck who can't even make a complete sentence that makes sense. that second pic is retarded as fuck.

VHD Bloodlust was the exception even during its time. Only a handful of anime movies during that era looked anywhere near as good.

There are dozens of movies that look better than it, retard. Bloodlust was """"animated"""" by BADHOUSE, which means there's virtually no noteworthy animation in the first place. Most of its """"well animated"""" sequences are worse than what you find in modern television. It's a 5 frames looping for 10 seconds straight.

is it worth to read novels about vampire hunter D? I mean they are not finished and a lot of them aren't even translated.

>Literal who

Attached: 1534213806631.jpg (1120x1536, 400K)

the limitation is marketing based, they've focus tested styles and the studios now produce so many animes that they need decent return from most of them which makes them more conservative with changes outside of those agreed upon styles and heat balances.

Attached: I don't understand, anon.webm (720x405, 2.04M)

Kawajiri still does storyboards for Madhouse anime but his modern output has been thoroughly bland.

What level of hatred is this?

Can't even find his modern stuff on Sakugabooru. Wouldn't be surprised if his age is catching up to him.

If you like gothic horror fantasy with over-the-top action and an awesome world; yes, just don't expect anything mindblowing. Most of the stories aren't even connected so you can start with any book whose premise catches your fancy. The books are firmly in the "flawed but fun" category,

Japan's studios failed to cultivate the next generation of talented animators, so no.

Slap a subtle grain filter to the entire thing and it's done.Modern anime doesn't look anything like that purely by choice. Japanese drawing style has been inbreeding for too long that's why more and more works all look so similar in style. Yoshitaka Amano has always been a rarity, but even more so now than a few decades back.

You can bet your ass that mixing and matching physical paints takes way more resources than doing everything digitally, regardless of the artstyle.

Attached: [DmonHiro] Sasami-san@Ganbaranai - Episode 03 - You Lose If You Work (BD, 720p) [5675B8B6].mkv_snaps (1280x720, 93K)

>talented animators
>refers to a BADHOUSE production with no noteworthy animation

>Still frame from a big budget movie / OVA made during pre-economic bubble burst Japan
Every single time

Poor quality bait

sakugabooru.com/post/show/30591

Not sure what we are looking at here. Barely animated. Half this cut borderline static. Do you understand what movie animation quality is? Probably not, otherwise you'd realize why noone takes BADHOUSE's "animation staff" seriously and why you'll never even see any of their production, not even Metropolis, which is miles better animated than Bloodlust, on any list praising animation quality.

>Do you think there will come a time when studios start using cels again?
I think one of to things will happen:
They'll either have to, because as global interconnectivity and accessibility to media only continues to increase, more & more people will be exposed to beautiful, cel/drawn anime. At the same time, the newness/wow factor of CG anime will continue to drop off. There will be a demand, and clever studios will meet it.
OR
The technology of CG will increase & evolve to the point where it's possible to completely mimic hand drawn cel anime with computers.

>They'll either have to, because as global interconnectivity and accessibility to media only continues to increase, more & more people will be exposed to beautiful, cel/drawn anime. At the same time, the newness/wow factor of CG anime will continue to drop off. There will be a demand, and clever studios will meet it.
This has to be the most retarded claim I've read in a while.

>The technology of CG will increase & evolve to the point where it's possible to completely mimic hand drawn cel anime with computers.
This will never happen, it's not possible on a technical level

>They'll either have to, because as global interconnectivity and accessibility to media only continues to increase, more & more people will be exposed to beautiful, cel/drawn anime. At the same time, the newness/wow factor of CG anime will continue to drop off. There will be a demand, and clever studios will meet it.
Ahahahahahahahahahahaha
I'm glad I will never be as stupid and delusional as this guy

2/10

Try switching up your keywords if you want to bait more people, and not so repetitive.

sakugabooru.com/post/show/31978

Because its hard and expensive. We chose to prioritize volume of media over grand scale (which can just be done with CGI anyways). I think the trick is to use modern techniques for their own strengths rather than try to make them look like the old styles.

Attached: LoA.jpg (957x713, 286K)

Trying too hard to fit in.

>cels
I don't understand why people point to good artstyles and then say "muh cels." The cels didn't make VHD look that way.

vampire hunter d is immaculate. i first saw it when my tv went down a rabbit hole of suggested videos on youtube when i was asleep. i woke up to this exact moment at 3am and had to know wtf i was watching

Attached: original.gif (500x285, 1011K)

>OLD THING GOOD

Digital animation is a problem when the conversion algorithms artificially round out the line art such that nuances are lost, most notably of faces which convey emotion.

You post something better then.

>2000
>old

Good to know Summer's here again so I can ignore 99% of all posters.

To be fair not many of Yoshiaki Kawajiri's contemporaries could match his directorial prowess during that era. Plus this was when Madhouse was at the top of the anime totem pole.

Efficiency, also the economic slow down.

>19 years old isn't old
What the hell is wrong with you?

I dislike how the "old good new bad" people and the pre-2000 anime general thread unironically believe that every pre-2000 anime was on the same technical and budget level as Macross Plus or Bloodlust.

I don't think Summer ever ended, user.
I think it's been summer for about five years, and there's no end in sight.

It's not cels. It's all about the color palette and style of line art. For the animation itself .

I would never make the claim that every pre-2000s anime looked as good as Bloodlust because then how would it have stood out?

Then why every pre-2000 thread or "why is modern anime shit" opens with the same screenshots of the same movies again and again and again and again?

can you explain why the movement in metropolis feels so janky? as i recall there was not a ton of movement overall and when there was (with some exceptions) i half-wished there wasn't any at all and that the movie was just an iblard jikan style panning on cool shots like the one-winged angel.

It really does feel like no one takes the time to actually learn shit anymore. CGI has been around for a good while now, there's really no reason it shouldn't be on average lightyears ahead of where it started.

Attached: Crusher Joe jets.webm (640x480, 2.9M)

I unironically believe that a return to silent era sets would be based

You could say cel animation takes too long to produce compared to how things are animated these days.

Just watched this, thanks for the recommendation

You could also say that reduced costs have made shit far too easy these days

There are plenty of talented young animators, but the issue is retaining them as industry conditions are really tough, especially for those who are starting out as a junior animator.

Because Yoshitaka Amano dosen't work on anime anymore

>thread premised on one of the greatest animated films of all time
Every single time. Every single time this kind of thread is made it's always GitS, this, or another of the quality > quality era, where it took 4-6 months (on average) for a movie to be released on VHS. Some took even longer. Movies got theater circulation for as long as they remained popular hits and only after a movie's popularity in theaters began to fade would it go to mass production.

There was an emphasis on high quality/grand scale projects because mass distribution was still not easily accessible. There was no internet. DVD wasn't a thing. The market was comprised entirely of creative people trying to outdo one another in terms of technical ability, quality, scale, etc. If you made something worthwhile, people went and saw in on the big screen regularly. That was the thing to do, it was part of the social norm, and considered a fun activity.

Now? Instant gratification is in. Mass distribution has never been easier. No production has the luxury of time to create notable quality when the market is saturated with quantity. No one wants to risk cutting perfect a diamond, only for it to be lost in the rough. And those who do risk it and don't see returns become horror stories and cautionary tales in the industry - additions to every other producers' 'what-not-to-do' list.

You aren't going to see anything like GitS or D for as long as this age of easy accessibility is around. Humanity has proven to be undisciplined and indifferent in controlling itself. It wants fast food. It wants weekly shows. It wants 3d-animation and anime. And it wants it now. It doesn't want to make the time for any more St. Peter's Basilicas, Colosseums, Mona Lisas, etc. Just give people something amusing, quickly. Something horrific, now. Entertainment first, quality thereof? afterthought.

Saw this as a kid when my weeaboo aunt was babysitting and I didn't know what anime was. Fuck, what a gorgeous movie.

>quality > quality era
assuming quality > quantity. but yeah, supply and demand are at all-time highs, growing as exponentially as the human race itself. i've got a feeling serious wartime will be a thing in our lifetime (next 30ish years). society is already getting hideously bent out of shape due to the integration and influence of media in cultures globally.

i digress: bloodlust was a massive undertaking. not quite on the scale of gits, but certainly far above the norm at the time of its release. it holds up today as a ridiculously beautiful movie. the conditions, salary, and job security that come with projects like that are, historically, not great. in fact, 2/3 are worse today - which 2 are dependent upon where you work and most of the time it's 3/3 anyway. the bottom line is that movies like bloodlust or lawrence of arabia don't get made because of the sheer amount of time and collective discipline/incentive to produce them. those films will always be timeless because you can literally feel the effort put into them, just like with a lot of old music and musicians.

they just don't make em like they used to, desu.

What alternative to cell animation is he talking about here? Just digital shit in general?

Why would any talented animators cultivate when the industry doesn't give enough incentives?
Even the ero artists earn more than those fucks probably

Digital colouring of course. I think Takahata adapted to the digital workflow very well, Yamadas and Kaguyahime are beautiful movies.

>The cels didn't make VHD look that way.
yes it was can you show me a show made with digital that has a the same color palette let alone the same artstyle

>The cels didn't make VHD look that way.

Actually they kind of did. There's a very real and tangible effect things like paint, celluloid and film have on the actual end result. The animators had to know how to create, for want of a better term, physical effects for their anime.

There was some DVD special showing the behind the scenes of an episode of Dragon Ball Z and in order to get things like glow and various other effects the animators had to actually use physical light boxes and other such external tricks. Nowadays everything is just done in after effects and it looks jank as fuck.

I don't think it's impossible for new anime to look good, but to say the cel has no effect is flat out wrong at best and incredibly dumb at worst.

It's absolutely gorgeous but the plot is really odd and kind of falls apart in the final like, third of the movie.

Attached: 4luBzGXvjJUfxfFZ.webm (320x320, 2.71M)

>But with Cel animation you're stuck in one style
Funny that because digital anime either all looks like the same featureless blob or it is so completely drenched in photoshop filters that it looks like it came straight from devianart.

Congrats on being a literal subhuman, exactly the type of parasite these shitty studios love to sell low effort digi trash to.

Fpbp

This is not hispachan you idiot

>Why can't budget TV anime look like a horribly expensive movie that took 3 years to make?
I don't think it's possible to be more of an insufferable faggot than the kind who cherrypicks examples from the "good old days" they weren't alive during and moans about how everything today is shit. TV anime back then were slideshows by today's standards.

>purchase
You mean torrent.

This, like sure they looked nice but they WERE made up of 90% still images.

>is it worth to read novels about vampire hunter D?
I read the novel the movie was based on recently and it was edgy shit.

>Do you think there will come a time when studios start using cels again?
Why go back to things that require effort when you can just pump out 200 low effort digital anime trash a year in the hopes that at least one of the will take off with the mentally ill wotaku trend of the week?

I mean just look at this parasite:
Subhumans like that user will gladly defend massively lower quality content as long as it appeals to their waifu niche.

This is now a Kawajiri thread.

youtu.be/XfFzkGAP02w?t=2949

Absolutely not, the actual plot itself is dogshit.

Actual cel animation is not only obsolete for the purposes of 2D animation, but was never cheap, and time consuming.

>TV anime back then were slideshows by today's standards.

See, on the one hand you're right. It really isn't fair to compare TV broadcast anime to high budget OVAs and movies. But on the other hand THEY ACTUALLY USED TO MAKE HIGH BUDGET OVAS ALL THE FUCKING TIME! So fuck that comparison.

is this better in motion? the screenshot doesn't really look noteworthy.

The shadows are fucking trash so the whole scene looks flat. Also whats wrong with her body? Is that her collarbone? Her breasts? The vampire doesn't have a cheekbone and looks retarded. The floor is nice. The image as a whole sucks and I wouldn't watch an entire OVA of this.

itt: NEET angry people dont work hard

Holy shit, this. I should stop waiting for the next masterwork and just enjoy what I have.

Attached: 1530821257653.gif (444x250, 974K)

they fucking nailed it. the upper body is a piece of meat with a big horizontal vagina on it. or a fat person's bent knee. good work animators.

Attached: wow.jpg (884x729, 97K)

stylistic preferences have changed, right now anime seems to be heading towards more simplified style and more fluid animation, with some exceptions aiming at detail

I miss the deep shadows done on older shows new shows dont do

>right now anime seems to be heading towards more simplified style and more fluid animation
aka modern anime is focused on making bishoujos and little else

VEG looks better than OP's pic desu

>It can still be done, but it requires skill, dedication, blood, sweat, passion, SOUL...
Personally, if they're going to be using all of those things, they might as well put them to good use on other areas. Although anime is an audiovisual medium, its main purpose is to convey a story and to bring characters to life. Even if a show is beautiful, it's all for nothing if there's no story worth telling through it.

it's too bad the shading on his ear is more detailed and has more depth than his entire face. i understand his face is meant to be downcast and in shadows but that doesn't mean it should have fucked up perspective and bad shading on it.

also the jacket is way too big and wide. look at the way her hand and his head disappear into the big ass collar. this shit is trash.

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VEG looks like shit compared to other series in the same season, stop trying to push your turd and stick to Yea Forums if you can't understand art.

yes but not necessarily, look at Masaaki Yuasa's work or Pokémon Sun and Moon, they have simplified style but they're not cute girl anime

wrong crop. but yeah, the angle and size of his head coming out of his clothes is entirely unnatural. it looks terrible.

Attached: wowww.jpg (2634x2160, 431K)

You are currently living in the are with the most copy-pasted, generic factory-made anime ever made. Hundreds of these shows are made every year and they have the lifespan of a season at best. Hell, most shows are forgotten and dropped halfway through a season.

You are completely delusional if you think studios took the things that Cel animation required and put them to good use elsewhere. What actually happened in reality was that studios took the opportunity to drop all pretense for quality and started pumping out vast amounts of factory made digital anime season after season. It doesn't matter if they make 99 garbage ones because all they need is 1 hit.

it's so convenient when all the bad old anime don't exist and you only remember the hits.

>more fluid animation
o i am laffin

>more simplified style
Veteran animators think otherwise though, and they are right. Older anime on average had simpler character designs, stuff like Vampire Hunter D is more of an exception. A lot of shows these days have unnecessary lines in the hair, eyes, and costume designs which makes it challenging when most shows are TV anime on a tight production schedule. Animation designs should be simpler to allow for more expressive animation; animators aren't illustrators.

Designs used to be simpler and animation was more fluid back then

People only remember the hits because there were much more of them, and much more memorable ones. There was vastly less anime being made in the 80s, 90s and 2000s. There were more hits and general and orders of magnitude less garbage.

in terms of shading, though, I would argue it got simplified

I wonder what it would cost today to make a cel shaded anime while paying animators 70k USD a year.

Probably in the 300 or 400 million range.

How does cel animation limits you to a single style of animation ?

It sound like you're under the impression that anime was only ever good when it was drawn on cels and that there has never been any amount of innovation or experimentation with newer technology, with everyone always aiming for the safest choices all the time, when that absolutely has not been the case whatsoever.

That's wrong though. Because there were far less anime in the past means there were far fewer shows to choose from, meaning people would watch those shows and discuss them in greater numbers than they would have had there been other alternatives to appeal to them, but otherwise the number of hits stay the same, but the number of garbage also does not pile up as quickly. Therefore, you only believe there was less shit back then solely because you saw there was less trash compared to what you saw was good, but this has always been an additive problem as people have had the same fucking criticism of the industry for decades.

>he pays for Yea Forums

Why is that making my screen glitch

The problem is that there are too many animators, every single country on Earth has about 4 or 5 animation studios and they build their talent around them, Japan has maybe 4 or 5 kinda large studios but not quite large enough to compete for industry awards, and then there are over 100 p that produces absolute rubbish that nobody will ever watch.

i don't think you were alive before the 2000s. current good and bad anime have more visibility because of the internet now so you might be more aware of them, but trash anime has always been abundant. they didn't disappear just because you're not aware of them. you have nostalgia for something you weren't around for.

There is a very easy way to vastly reduce costs in the anime industry:

>Make less anime per year.
There were 200+ anime shows released last year. In 1996 there were 70+. Go back to treating each and every project with care and treat is as a big release for your studio, not just generic seasonal trash #924829874.

>Stick with digital.
Even though I prefer cel, I know that digital can also look great if given the right amount of effort. Instead of jumping from one seasonal project to the next focus on making one show with really good digital art.

>Abandon physical media.
This is already happening. Sales of BDs and CDs matter massively less these days than they did 10 years ago and a show selling few BDs has no bearing on whether it will get a sequel or not.

>Stop adapting LN trash.
LN license costs money.

>Dude you can only use real paint and pens so everything must look the same

>The problem is that there are too many animators
The problem isn't that there are too many animators, but that animators are being treated like slaves and that they're spread too thin among all the studios to reliably animate everything in-house, relying too much on contracting work out to foreign studios. What needs to happen is that studios should become more independent from the design-by-board paradigm that's deeply ingrained in the modern animation process, but because studios barely make as much as the companies contracting them on average, they don't typically have the means to grow to match demand.

>LN license costs money.
Still more convenient than having to create something original and good.

Honestly, in addition to cutting the number of projects, making them all completely 3DCG (or even cheaper, 3D with 2D backgrounds) would cut costs drastically. Yaoyorozu's shown that it's possible to make a whole season's worth of episodes in a year with 3DCG animation and 2D backgrounds on a budget normally allotted to a standard digitally animated 24-minute episode. If you want to get even cheaper, go the Teekyuu route and have one guy make 8 seasons of 5 minute episodes.

Attached: firsto kissu.jpg (581x480, 55K)

What a fucking hack.

>Go back to treating each and every project with care and treat is as a big release for your studio, not just generic seasonal trash #924829874.
You do realise that'd just mean the SoL and Isekai stuff would just end up with more budget.
Just look at the top 10 selling anime from each season and just imagine they're all that are made but just with a higher budget, as already successful shows would likely be the sort of ones to gain focus in that sort of situation. I feel anime would be significantly weaker if that happened.

Digital animation, coloring, CG backgrounds (2nd link is one of his films)
sakugabooru.com/post/show/16226
sakugabooru.com/post/show/14395
sakugabooru.com/post/show/54415
sakugabooru.com/post/show/66522
sakugabooru.com/post/show/5935
sakugabooru.com/post/show/16423
sakugabooru.com/post/show/39495
sakugabooru.com/post/show/39494

>can you explain why the movement in metropolis feels so janky
My guess is you simply dislike Tezuka's character designs. I've recently rewatched the film and it's easily one of BADHOUSE's most well animated feature films. Although the film tries to look way better than it actually does. Debris and effects animation mimic a lot of movement because new element's enter the frame, but said element barely really rotate around their own axis, so the animation is limited to them sliding up and down. But as usual, BADHOUSE cut a lot of corner. See the second link. Only 2 character react to the elements entering the frame while the rest remains static. Maybe that's why you think it looks cheap at times.
sakugabooru.com/post/show/7369
sakugabooru.com/post/show/50485

Because I'm sure it took more than 5 years just to make that movie and it didn't make that much money.

Attached: V01.webm (1280x720, 991K)

>just imagine they're all that are made but just with a higher budget,
>all CGDCT anime become Joshiraku and Nichijou
Yes please.

Bloodlust is digital animation and you fucking know it

It took 3 years. By comparison, Kaguya took 8, A letter to Momo technically took something like 10, Redline took 7. It's animation that consumes time. Something Bloodlust doesn't have a lot of.

As much as I'd like that we'd have lost out on great series like Anima Yell, Slow Start and Comic Girls from last year for the sake of a higher budget Yuru Camp and YnS considering they were the only ones successful enough to count in that cut-off.
I'd rather shows use shortcuts like filtered photos for backgrounds if it allows them all to exist.

Attached: [HorribleSubs] Comic Girls - 09 [1080p].mkv_snapshot_06.57_[2018.05.31_18.16.02].jpg (1920x1080, 1.04M)

Slightly awkward. Guess they painted cels just to sell them, then.

>You do realise that'd just mean the SoL and Isekai stuff would just end up with more budget.
No they wouldn't. Nobody gives a shit about visual quality and the amount people are willing to shill out is limited. Where does this misconception come from that Japanese don't buy merch anymore? Anime has been thriving for a long time. Many of the best selling shows of all time are from the digital era and look like dogshit. Do you not understand that the average consumer doesn't give a rats ass about animation? The production company has no incentive to increase budgets if the RoI is unlikely to increase significantly.

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You are probably right, but that's more to due with the changing generations of anime fans. The average anime fan of the 90s and 2000s got introduced to anime via action, sci-fi and adventure shows as those were way more common and much more popular back then.

The average anime fan of the 10s, and now 20s, almost certainly got into anime solely for the bishoujo/waifu-bait shows and little else.

>>The average anime fan of the 10s, and now 20s, almost certainly got into anime solely for the bishoujo/waifu-bait shows and little else.
Yoooooooooooooooooo

OLD MEN GOOD
NEW MEN BAD

Attached: 1550188878322.gif (512x512, 510K)

>Do you not understand that the average consumer doesn't give a rats ass about animation?
It's almost as if the quality of writing, direction, and music are also equally, if not more important factors in an anime.

This is so sad, really.

because you're comparing TV anime to a movie that took 4 years to finish
fucking retard

came to say this

Digital apologists frequently argue that thanks to advances in the past decades, tv anime is closing the gap. I guess not, huh?

Yes, that's why 0079, SEED, Love Live Sunshine, Granblu, Bakemonogatari, Osamatsu, Nadesico, CGL, Yuri on Ice and Fate/Zero are some of the best selling anime of all times. Because people care about writing and direction.

Takahata's movies made with digital colouring are his best-looking ones though.

woah tv anime that needs to pump out episodes every week doesnt look as good as a movie that took 4 years to finish
wow
really
amazing
mind blown

Various TV shows have better animation than Bloodlust. Not sure what you're on about, you incel tumblr retro cuck. But you wouldn't know, because you neither know what good animation is, nore do you watch anime.

Thought it'd take more than that, the fights it does have have more detail per frame and it still looks way better than those other movies in my opinion.

It's not about good or bad though, just the facts. There is a massive difference between the generations of anime fans.

>If you want to get even cheaper, go the Teekyuu route and have one guy make 8 seasons of 5 minute episodes.
It's a shame we can't get more things like YnS with some episodes having different solo key animators. It shows it is doable at least.

Attached: YnS3_1.webm (854x480, 1.48M)

I'd say those shows did something right given how much people loved the characters. Great animation alone can't make people love a character.

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why would you waster such talent on highly detailed animation of tying a shoelace. Priorities man

I'm glad that action faded away as the major anime focus considering how boring I find it.
I enjoyed Akira in the 90s as a child but quickly stopped caring about action shows as an adult. I doubt I'd have ever got properly into anime if that's how it had continued.

>the fights it does have have more detail per frame
And they almost have barely any frames, that's why.

sakugabooru.com/post/show/30590
First 3 seconds loop
0:06 - 0:09 loops
0:10 - 0:12 essentially loops
0:13 - 0:16 loops
0:17 - 0:21 loops
0:22 - 0:24 first few seconds of actual movement

followed by
0:28 - 0:31 loops
0:32 - 0:43 loops (11 second loop of 5 frames)
0:44 - 0:53 loops (another 9+ seconds of 5 looping frames)

followed by 10 seconds with more or less movement in between. "Animation".

YnS has a reasonable amount of information considering it is in part trying to encourage people to climb. Getting them to animate how to tie that sort of lace was important enough, and a good chance for the animator to show off.

Attached: [Asenshi] Yama no Susume Third Season - 02 [3C4D8183]-[10.02.310-10.17.534].webm (1280x720, 2.1M)

oh okay that makes sense in the context of the show. It is troubling though that a lot of shows like eromanga sensei put really talented animators on shit cuts

Looks absolutely amazing.

another clip:

sakugabooru.com/post/show/30592

You will never get this kind of quality in any modern anime.

i'd say the prevalence of cg backgrounds has made the animation less impressive as well

>Posting porn on Yea Forums

Who are you to determine what cuts deserve good animation? And Eromanga Sensei's distribution of good animation fits the show's purpose and target audience; the animators clearly aimed to make scenes cute, erotic, or funny.

There's also the 50 different photoshop filters crammed into every scene as well. And just to be clear, I don't actually agree with the OP's premise. I think digital can look great if done well. However, digital anime has degenerated into CG backgrounds, photoshop filters and featureless characters.

yeah the filters shit is really getting out o fhand and is actually getting into the public conscientious with OPM2. I personally miss the charm of early digital animation like those janky makoto shinkai shorts

If it's not already screencapped.
>No one wants to risk cutting perfect a diamond, only for it to be lost in the rough.
This is a diamond in the rough.

The gradient overlays are what piss me off. You have a shot with strong colors and contrast, and then someone puts a gradient overlay on top of it and now the colors are muddy and partially desaturated and the contrast is gone.

this. Kuuchu Buranko has a fantastic style using filtered photos and real faces.

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>Japanese drawing style has been inbreeding for too long that's why more and more works all look so similar in style
I think you might be onto something. Anime styles have stagnated. Back then, anime took big influences from other media, like American action movies. Maybe the decline of the west has caused the newer crop to not look here as much, killing a source of inspiration. Idk it's a stretch

There is a general stagnation in all forms of media in general.

I mean to be fair a lot of western media has stagnated or gone to shit too. I mean if my options where to recycle whats already popular or copy like, I dunno, Steven Universe shit, I'd probably go full incest too.

harsh but honestly the truth, fuck capitalism

who was it that said anime producers should be more outward looking in their influences? It was either Anno or Miyazaki

Miyazaki

You tell them comrade!

Cel animation means that you need to paint on a plastic sheet, wich means that you're automatically limited by the pain colors that you can purchase. Mixing colors is out of the equation since there's too much risk of getting a slightly different color between two frames or scenes.
Wich means that youre completely restrained to a handful of colors for skin tones, etc. And the more colors you have the more paint you have to purchase. If you fuck up you have to throw cell and paint wich means even more wasted money. And all of that shit takes space. A Shinbo anime on cell would be an absolute nightmare because of that. Wich is why it's infinitely easier to just restrain yourself to one or two styles of colouring when you're doing cel animation, and that's also why lots of cel shows use the same colors.
On another hand, with digital coloring the possibilities are endless. You have as much colors as you need without any added cost, no space problem, you can experiment for free. And the bonus is that if you really like the old painted colors, you can just replicate them in digital and have that old look you're so fond of.

There's litterally no reason to prefer cell over digital except for "MUH GRAIN".

underrated

You mean digital color correction?
cracked.com/article_18664_5-annoying-trends-that-make-every-movie-look-same.html
If not, can you show an example of what you're referring to?

Don't forget cels limit the amount of drawing layers possible as there's only so many cels you can overlay in front of the camera before they get blurry. You can't get modern Shinya Ohira's output with cel animation for instance.

>except for "MUH GRAIN".
Various digital shows even utilize grain. It's a stylistic choice I wish more directors would make. It has the potential to really add to the atmosphere and visual presentation of the work.

Yeah I forgot to precise that as well and it's incredibly important. Not only you can't have as many layers (so less background layers and characters layers on screen, wich limits the "space" you have), but the layers can't have modern post-production effects.
You can't have a layer that strenghten contrasts, change saturation, etc. wich further limits your creativity.

Yes it takes effort and a lot of work to make something look good. If its so much easier to produce quality animation with digital where are all those quality animations? Its like saying real sets, props and practical effects are too much trouble so just use greenscreen for everything.

>digital era show has artificial grain as a stylistic choice
>BD encoder fiddles with it to remove it

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Go and try to tell me that it'd possible to emulate near the same atmosphere as seen pic related through digital coloring. The truth is, it would be a oversaturated mess with not as much impact. Digital animation is more practical in this day and age but, when Cel animation pulls out the big guns, it tends to blow it out of the water... There's just something about the effort that went behind the process for each frame that just makes it that much more admirable

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We just had Mob Psycho last season.

>where are all those quality animations
Maybe stop posting on Yea Forums and watch some anime instead. There isn't a single pre-2000s TV show that even comes close to the X most well animated TV shows from the digital era. Most of them are also better animated than the vast majority of pre-2000s movies and OVAs. Just because you're aware of nothing but the most well animated films Japan has managed to preduce, doesn't mean that everything looked like that.

My guess is you're mentally underdeveloped and appreciate nothing but sci-fi. A genre that has been fading into irrelevance for a reason. Then again, the new E7 Hi-Evo films have pretty ridiculous. animation

Can't say I've ever seen this happen. Then again, I probably wouldn't notice.

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kino robo

FUCK YOU

It's not about hard work, it's about investments. You can decide to do bread by growing your own cereals, building your own mill, making your own flour at the mill, and then making your own bread. Or you can just buy flour at the store and use all the free time you now have to do more important things.
It's the same in animation. Digital has more color choices than cell, cost less than cell, is faster than cell, give more creative options than cell. So now you can put all that time and money into animation, backgrounds and post-production in order to make more unique looking anime.
You can make a great 90's style show with digital, but you can't make a great 10's style show with cells.

Practical effect vs FX is different because the digital FX can't perfectly fit with the actors. This problem does not exist in colouring in anime since everything is digital anyway so the digital colouring have nothing to clash with. It would be a proper allegory if you were talking about the mix of 2D and 3D in productions, wich often DOES look bad.

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Until a technology comes along that allows animators to replicate cel techniques without the use of keyframe animators (such that you have the ease that 3D animation enjoys by using physics sims to make keyframes that are fluid but with the appearance and control over every line and motion like in hand drawn cels), hiring talent in an essentially lost art is a pipedream even to the biggest studio on the planet (disney).

>Go and try to tell me that it'd possible to emulate near the same atmosphere as seen pic related through digital coloring.
user, your picture is data, it's DIGITAL. The very fact that it's showing up on your screen means that it'd be possible to emulate the same atmosphere through digital coloring. There's nothing in your picture that can't be done in a colouring / animation software.

This. Akira is obviously cherrypicking since its one of a kind in terms of quality but until someone makes a digital animation that looks this good I will continue being unconvinced about its supposed superiority.

>There's just something about the effort that went behind the process for each frame that just makes it that much more admirable

Couldnt agree more, the fact that it took so much work and any little mistake could fuck up a lot of it makes it much more impressive.

>itt: boomers vs zoomers round 283787381
Dudes, just enjoy anime ;)

>All these dumb arguments
Dude that style died off because it required insane amount of hard work and thus money which most anime failed to make back. Why would any studio intentionally pick a production style that is almost guaranteed to put them in the red? It's as simple as that

He fell for 4k meme
Hhahahahahah

Tomino

>You mean torrent.
Good luck torrenting a cloud service old man.

>no shadow

It's not that bad if the studio puts effort into it, it's usually only used to cut costs though..

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Bumping for more quality discussion

i hope so

kill yourself spamminger

Actually learned something from this site

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>There were 200+ anime shows released last year. In 1996 there were 70+
The average show length today is 12 episodes. The average show length in 1996 was 36 episodes. And that is not counting OVA productions. So while there is an increase in anime production, the gap is not nearly as big as your poor estimate implies.

>It's almost as if the quality of writing, direction, and music are also equally, if not more important factors in an anime.
Stop it there is no way you really believe this

>There were 200+ anime shows released last year. In 1996 there were 70+.
There's similar amounts of content. You're too retarded to understand that modern numbers are heavily inflated because every show is chopped into multiple seasons. Back then 2-4 cours were the norm. Now you get 2 1 cour shows instead which count as individual titles.
>focus on making one show with really good digital art
There are various every season. Stop being a newfag who doesn't actually watch anime.
>LN license costs money
LMAO. Jesus Christ, you are beyond retarded. The studio does not choose to adapt an LN. It's the publisher, the TV station and usually a bigger production committee consisting of investors who PAY the studio to adapt an LN.

Conclusion: double digit IQ newfag who knows jackshit about anything

SEVEN YEARS HAND DRAWN

>you're automatically limited by the pain colors that you can purchase
lie
> Mixing colors is out of the equation since there's too much risk of getting a slightly different color between two frames or scenes.
true but only for Studios weren't willing to take risk
>why it's infinitely easier to just restrain yourself to one or two styles of colouring when you're doing cel animation
true and yet this is not what happened

>it's DIGITAL. The very fact that it's showing up on your screen means that it'd be possible to emulate the same atmosphere through digital coloring
this is disingenuous and you know it

>The average show length today is 12 episodes. The average show length in 1996 was 36 episodes
Where did you get theses numbers?

I don't find veg to actual be that impressive. The character designs are pretty generic blobs most of the time and limited animation, the show over relies on cg effects for lighting or fluids to make it seem like there's more going on than there really is.

>go to wikipedia
>go to anime tv series by year
>calculate mean
Easy.

Using cel animation again isn't going to magically bring back the artstyles and themes from 30 years ago.

WOAH. No no no this can't be!

>woah
Whoa

Bloodlust is from 2000.