Will the anime industry ever change?

I’m glad I learned chink instead of nip

>the majority are manga and light-novel based
And it fucking sucks because most of them are glorified advertisements.

Sure , Ming.

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Stop making garbage anime. That would fix the industry and increase the good series that sell

Dude they still use fax machines and shit.

>all this for 16 minute slideshows i download for free
man i feel bad now

Minus quantity, invest in quality.

>fewer but better anime
How is this a bad thing?

They really should just cut down on how much anime we get a season.

japan is not a capitalist society

>Twitter thread
Enjoy your vacation, faggot

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What it means is that we will get 5 shounen shit a season and thousands of people out of work. The industry dies as old talent dies off and the lack of talented animators makes animation quality decrease. Its a massive downward spiral, not that the current model is very sustainable, but the alternative is the death of animation in japan. China will pick up the animators and then we have to listen to their horse speak.

Maybe if they expanded their market beyond overpriced BDs they could get enough money to finance higher productions.

Its both funny and sad to see how some indie bands in the west get 50k+ sales on their releases while big budget studios get

>quantity =/= quality
>therefore, lack of quantity == increased quality
>this makes sense in my mind

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Foreign market is set to overtake domestic market for anime, thanks to streaming. The money isn't really enough to improve wages or conditions, but its harder to be a flop now that you got the west and china paying licensing fee's.

right now there's a lot of good talent spread out across a huge number of studios working on the 30+ shows that air each season. cut those numbers in half and consolidate the talent together and the quality of productions would absolutely improve

It already has changed. Why do you think you never heard of this kind of shit 15 years ago?

>No Guns Life adaptation will be either absolute shit or never happen because Madhouse is on a downward spiral to suicide
truly the worst timeline

>quality of productions improving
No one said that.

Anime is a worthless medium anyways.

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Well no, they don't make it with American audiences in mind. Nothing you could do would help the industry, unless you want to host a service of your own to boost international sales.
The issue with streaming is that the funding is always concentrated. A lot of shows will inevitably be ignored because of low foreign appeal, so studios will either have to suck up to Americans or keep overworking themselves. Also, foreign merchandise sales are undoubtedly less relevant to a studio's success due to lower margins and lack of demand.

Imagine how badly the employees at JC Staff are doing

Hope it dies so all the normies can fuck off out of the medium and I can just go back and watch the old shit I missed and re-watch my favourites.

There's enough anime. There doesn't need to be anymore. It's all been done at this point.

Anime has devolved into glorified advertisement for manga or light novels. Let it crash.

Can we get Mitsuo Iso's new show at least?

>Anime has devolved into glorified advertisement for manga or light novels.

This is actually less the case now than it was several years ago.

>China will pick up the animators and then we have to listen to their horse speak.
Doubt it, they at least have the sense to acknowledge that Japanese voices are better. A growing number of chink mobage are using JP voices. I believe the same will apply for animation too.

>Well no, they don't make it with American audiences in mind. Nothing you could do would help the industry, unless you want to host a service of your own to boost international sales.
That's not true at all. Durarara's creator outright said season 2 was made entirely because how well merchandise sold in the US for example and that the foreign market is becoming increasingly more viable to studios. It's not the only factor in an anime's creation but there's a reason the market has shifted so much in the last twelve or so years.

They are lazy and shitpost here. That's the reason Index 3 was trash

Here’s some old man wisdom. When they expanded the NHL past six teams and just kept adding more and more fucking teams every two years for over a fucking decade you saw the same kind of thing. Hockey is basically kept running by people from Canada and a few industrial midwestern cities, just like anime is kept going by a mere handful of deviant Nips, because, face it, Japan is not a society known for iconoclastic innovation. With six teams, every Canadian, even though they were few in number, was fighting tooth and nail for very limited slots so you only got defensemen who handle the puck like forwards and wings who check like defensemen. But when you expand from six NHL teams to thirty fucking two, first you drain every farm team and then you even start pulling in players from high schools in Arizona and quality of play goes to shit and you never see anything but people dumping the fucking puck into the other team’s zone. When you expand from a few anime studios to 300+ shows each year you start sucking in every zipperhead who can put a pen to paper and then you wonder why there is no more creativity. The next phase is obvious from hockey’s lesson. They’ll pull in the chinks and every other variety of slant to fill the gap with their incomprehensible ching-chong jibber and none of those fucking people have even the abysmal creativity of the Japs, much less the interesting historical and societal tradition. Eventually they’ll even have barely civilized jungle asians making what they’ll call anime. That’s not the worst. You’re already starting to see the worst. Hollywood kikes are getting in on the action. No slope of any variety can match a fucking Los Angeles hebe for lack of creativity and bankrupt cultural tradition. In conclusion, we’re fucked.

ITT retards thinking quality will improve because there are less shows

Really have to appreciate Japanese work ethic. I wish I had it.

Merchandise is one thing, but as a whole the American streaming industry is far too unstable for foreign investors. The majority of shows aren't worth licensing, and the really good ones usually get bought up exclusively, which is a catastrophe.
Not just that a single customer isn't going to change very much, but that if you were to pay for your shows it would probably be worse for all parties in the long run.

And It ain't gonna change if unions are formed. They will just double down on what sells, aka isekai, CGDCT, and shonen anime.

>using Twitter

I've heard rumors of Japanese people searching out foreign capital which makes me think immediately of China.

That doesn't change the fact that the industry itself has gone all in on this system. And that's not the only way the industry has changed in an attempt to get more money out of foreigners. Shows are more likely to get second seasons now, simulcasts with foreign territories are more or less the norm, studios are directly releasing shows on their own in foreign areas and circumventing US licensing companies as to strengthen their overall brand, companies like Netflix are willing to fun projects entirely, and more and more shows are being produced than ever despite Japan itself buying less blu-ray discs than before. It's a huge shift.

I do agree the American streaming industry is unstable but Japan is truly investing in it anyway. Even with merchandise far more shows are getting merch exclusive to the states these days then ever before. Hot Topic and Spencers were carrying The Testament of Sister New Devil merchandise of all fucking things at one point. Whatever percentage they're getting from the rest of the world is clearly very important to them.

Tell that to the Japanese.

Is there no unions in Japan?
A lot of this could easily be avoided if animators had fixed wages and working hours and not "just work until you collapse".

this desu, this season is pretty much proof that you can churn out 30 different anime and have almost none of them be even remotely enjoyable

i wouldn't mind that number getting cut in half if it meant i didn't have to see gachishit and isekai garbage anymore

I bet you if they even did have unions they would still be forced to do the work until you collapse shit.

>pay $10-20 for an album you'll probably listen to hundreds of times vs ~$500 for a 12 ep anime you might rewatch once or twice in a decade.
I wonder why one sells more than the other.

I wish anime was made by a people less retarded when it comes to picking up trends

Who the fuck uses fax and office boys nowadays ffs.
not to mention the entire retardation of caring about physical sales in 2019

Japs.

>twitter screencap thread
Free market will decide.

Good.
Anime is moving toward the cinema/theater direction anyway. Kyoani already released most of them at the cinema, bypassing TV medium directly.

It's the old men at the top. They still region lock shit and it's not just the anime industry.

>Renato Rivera Rusca

Wow that's very Japanese.

>only 13h/day and people are kicking up a fuss
sometimes I forget how many europeans come here

I have bad news for you, as those anime are the ones that will survive the purge, as they still make bank. Expect less seinen, josei and original anime to be made if the anime industry ever decide to cut some unnecessary fat.

I think the last 2 episodes of Mob Psycho were shown in theaters too. Probably so they could break even on the amount of money they dumped into them since it had some of the best sakuga we've seen out of the medium in years.

I don't think it solves the issue of overworking, which was the topic. This business model still promotes cranking out more animation, so the problem won't solve itself. Paying for anime won't help these studios and streaming companies find better business options, so the only option for them is learning the hard way that they've been doing things wrong for the longest time.

Do they miss the 80s so much that they pretend its still the 80s?

I believe that is the case
No wonder Abe can do shit about their recession when they live in the past like that

quit it with the fucking babyspeak

Aren't this kind of threads the trademark of /pol/ Yea Forums Yea Forums? Is Yea Forums finally joining the group?

assuming an average 30-day month, 393 hours is 54% of that. you think it's normal or healthy to spend more than half of a month working?

Subordinates having power over boss is probably most anti-japanese idea ever.
Submission to authority is part of their mindset.

Then the work would be outsourced to vietnam or the studios would close. Unionizing when you hold little to no cards is a mistake. You'd have to get the big shots and directors in on it to have a chance at all but those guys never want to be caught with the small fries.

Anyway, besides whales no one spends money on anime. Not actually anyway. Some people in here are alluding to the 80 and 90s with more variety but that was literally the worst point and why the production committee style of anime production came about, to guard against studios literally tossing money into the garbage bin. Anime is an format in which the labor costs more than the demand unless the labor is artificially devalued by "passion" workers

The fuck are you on about?

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People aren't supposed to be working 7 days a week. If you are a normal person who doesn't work on weekends, that's almost 18 hours a day. The recommended amount of sleep for adults is 8-9 hours, so there isn't even enough time to consider your physical health. and even if you work all week, you would have at most around 3 hours of free time to eat and spend time with your family.

Oh boy looks like the "I'm a slave to my job and proud of it" American has joined the thread

If you want to work in a prestigious industry like anime, you got to make sacrifices.

this is you
you're not saying anything that using animation wouldn't convey, you're just dropping japanese terms for the sake of it
go fuck yourself

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they're crossboarding here. report and move on.

They mandatory 12 hour work days + 8 hour weekends where I used to work if they are short anyone, thats 76 hour work weeks. If you are 4crew you could get stuck doing 84 hour weeks of people call in or have vacation with no weekend off.

Just have them draw cgdct, i too would want to kill myself if i got into industry only to be put working on some western pandering crap.

WITH NO SURVIVORS

That's not inherently true. It's a sign of poor business management if they can't turn a profit without overworking their employees. And it's hardly prestigious when you're treated like a slave.
Japan has a 5-day, 40 hour standard work week. Anecdotes do not justify the practice or change the truth; this is a terrible thing to do.

>anime
>a prestigious industry

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The term sakuga is basically synonymous with the word "animation". There's no point in being a pedantic little fuckhead about somebody else's wording when you can't even type out a single sentence without using proper punctuation or paragraph spacing. Suck my dick, choke on it.

But if you try to do anything about this you're called a communist. The masses have been lulled and drugged into total subservience. You already see this 996 shit catching on in countries that normally worked less hours.

youtube.com/watch?v=mhfp6Z8z1cI
I would say to make actual good shit and hire a Westerner for storyboards, but that would just invite SJWs.

Are you stupid? Animation is a bottom of the barrel job.

Oh look, another literally who on twitter thread.
Fuck off, cunt.

It just needs to crack and fall apart, so it can be rebuilt.

maybe try that one again bud

And I'll call you a fucking retard, not a baka, until you stop being such a fag.
>when you can't even type out a single sentence without using proper punctuation
>can't
>without using
thanks?

>Renato
>Rivera
>Rusca

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Sacrificing the number of shows per season for better conditions for the creators and better quality seems like a no brainer. Who even watches a quarter of the dredge that airs each season?

Worth a read every time

nice argument, retard

Why the hell are the Chinese so fucking shitty?

Why is this shitty twitter thread still up?

well you somehow misinterpreted the meaning of my stupid greentext post, which leads me to believe that this is your first day here

That's literally what user was >implying you retard.

If you're buying physical you're in it as a collector ,so you value the shelf space more than the content

Its not an anecdote all 3ms do this, I know vermeer has mandatory 10 hour days as well as well as weekends. All factory work in middle america USA, definitely harder and more exhausting than anime work. I wouldnt be suprised if places like amazon warehouse has long days.

Are you neet or some richfag/lucky bastard who somehow landed dream job?
You honestly sound like you have no idea what work times and whatnot does average job entail. Sure, it's not healty, normal or anyhting, but i can asure you, nobody gives a fuck.

joke's on you I've been here all summer

Please take your fucking autism pills so nobody else has to read through your asinine bullshit for the rest of the day.

I also have buddies who pull 80 hour weeks in construction too.

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Because it doesn't matter that it's a twitter screencap. The same discussion would be had if the OP just copied and pasted the posts. Try having your own opinions for once instead of parroting "twitter bad!"

>it sucks but that's the way its always been done so if you complain you're a pussy
found the american

Stop typing in wapanese if you don't want to catch shit for it.

Yeah but are you productive all the time? I can't even imagine you being efficient at work 100% of the time while working '13h/day'.

>parroting "twitter bad!"

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Mama anime will save the industry
Screenshot this

>China
If there's one thing I've learned about the Chinese is that they don't have a single creative bone in their body. They're bugmen and incapable of producing anything but money. If it was up to the Chinese to make an anime, they would fund a Japanese studio to make it.

Make me, faggot-kun.

In alot of places there is a 'rate' or 'production sheet' or 'units' that are your targets, nobody in any environment can be absolutely efficient because shit happens.

Yeah, it seems that to compete with cheaper foreign workers you need to devote all of your time to labor. Standardizing hours increases production cost, but on the other hand it isn't a sustainable model. I think Japan's government should work to maximize foreign profits by investing in modern distribution. TV and physical media are rotting away, but that's how these studios make their profits. A simple online distribution that's compatible with international markets would help to increase foreign revenue, and profit margins as a whole. But as of now there are just streaming sites that most people would rather pirate than pay for.
That was his point.

maybe the shit would happen less if they weren't working slave hours

Literally killing themselves to make their bosses rich. The normalization of overwork has to be stopped. People fought and died in the past to secure our labour rights.

Yeah its tiring working 12 hour days, you spend all day at home then go back to your house to get some sleep. Its not always like that either just at the beginning of every quarter, then towards the middle to end they stop making you cover OT or make it optional.

>Conditions have to change, wages have to increase or the system will collapse!

lol, more likely animation studios will find some way to make the uber of anime of anime where suddenly everyone can be a freelancer animator and get paid pennies to animate between key frames and quality will continue to tank

The future isn't apocalyptic collapses or radical changes, but you can always bet on boring dystopia.

Or just hire more chinks.

It's an anecdote when you cite personal experience, citing an industry practice is a bandwagon. Both arguments are fallacies, and don't prove the practice to be ethical. Amazon gets its fair share of criticism for employee mistreatment.
The 40 hour work week is standard because employees suffer and become less valuable when pushed beyond that. Keep in mind that once upon a time there were riots because of overwork, and that's why these standards are in place.

My point was that if you're work schedules are ridiculous like 13/day one, you won't be at your maximum work potential.
Your lifestyle is ruined, your body is ruined, your health deteriorates, you're mentally stressed and the list goes on.

>nobody in any environment can be absolutely efficient because shit happens
Yes they can. As long as they're given enough rest days/hours to recover and gain energy before the next shifts, an employee would always be at 100% efficiency level at work.
A good business are aware of this and will implement such policies so that their employees are at max efficiency level.

man I dont know I just watch the stuff

>less anime
>better quality
>better work conditions and pay for workers
>which in turn helps produce better anime
It's not that hard, it's simply less is more, quality over quantity.

what the fuck

Yeah but if you're not working that job some alien will do it

Somebody has to do those jobs, you can always look elseware but when it comes to doing things like that you wont make near as much money.
Ill give you the anecdote part, but its not a bandwagon when its factual. I'm also not defending the practice because it kills worker morale and Ive been there, Ive seen it tear people down psychologically and watched them collapse on the floor in 140 degree temps.

Well, it's up the individuals to decide if they want that shitty job or not.
No one's forcing anyone to apply for such jobs with shitty working hours.

Why the fuck would the government be involved?

>as long as they are given enough
Thats not the kind of efficiency or 'shit happens'I was implicating, I meant as your machine going down a conveyor fucking itself, the robot breaking down for the 8th time today ect,

And again, nobody gives fuck. Hey, you are free to try find the job that will treat you well, hope you don't end up under bridge first tho. You really are incredibly naive or lucky if you think those "standarts", are the real standarts. Not even the people who should oversee that shit give fuck, because they would have to close about half of factories and wouldn't be able to pat themselfs on the back about low unemplyment rate.

How to fix the industry:

- Create a Netflix of anime (with all the studios) and make it global simulcast season and previous seasons.
- $9 monthly, no regional locks and shit
- Profit

Have you tried not living in a third world shithole with no labour standards?

>Create a Netflix of anime (with all the studios)
so crunchyroll

too many madlads

That sounds like a way to kill something rather than save it

just like how netflix fixed TV being flooded by a bunch of low-effort, no-budget crap, right?

Daisuki.net tried this and died.

Just make less Anime.

Last time i checked EU was first world, as unbelievable as it is. Feel free to tell me where it's different tho, i will gladly move.
But i'm pretty sure your average joe gets shit on anywhere just about the same.

those isekai LNs aren't going to sell themselves

Shilling is not banned anymore, like not even a instance? Nobodies can just come in and self promote themselves?

None of your points have refuted anything. It's a bandwagon fallacy to cite the industry when you have given no reason to believe that it's ethical for it to take place.
The government is responsible for labor laws. If they can find a way to stop people from overworking, it's their obligation to do so.
Work on your English some more.
Factories have been moving out of the USA for that reason, so I'm not saying it isn't an issue. I would just rather have fair labor laws than more local production.

Crunchy is a jew experiment with few anime and shitty western garbage. I said a proper Netflix japanese with all the industry (Pushed by gov or the nippon animators studios)

Selling $500 boxsets BD is killing the industry, having a shit of licensing tv deals is killing the industry.

Just take all the studios, put some money and create a streaming service who is more Easy and better than pirate anime from torrents or illegal streaming sites. Thats why Disney+ gonna kill Netflix and others.

This logic is objectively flawed, and any ambition based on it is wasteful. Simply put, it won't happen, the industry will never produce less shows.
The 300+ shows produced every year aren't just the result of the increase in demand by the committees, but rather the creators themselves.
People rarely bring this up when discussing the overproduction, but a huge chunk of the projects are actually pitched by the creators (the producers and directors) to potential fund suppliers/sponsors like TV stations, music labels, and such, and only then is the committee formed by whoever had their interest piqued by the pitch.
This applies to most manga and light novel adaptations as well, although many times it's the other way around, but studios agree to terms so they're still responsible.
Satou Yumi, one of the founders of studio Shuka, stated that once an anime producer becomes big enough within a studio, they'll aim to make their own studio, and that is pretty much true. Most of the 300+ shows produced every year are done by recently founded studios, studios that would have not been founded if staff members don't dispatch from bigger studios once they believe they can handle a show by themselves, which in reality they can't, and they resort to outsourcing to outsourcing exclusive studios, which is already gets lots of requests from the bigger studios, hurting the talent pool.
For example, studio MAPPA, which is founded by Maruyama, a co-founder of MADHOUSE and the reason it once went bankrupt and bought by NipponTV, produces excessive amounts of shows, most of which has talented main staff but is completely outsourced otherwise, resulting in a lackluster product most of the time, and this doesn't look like it's stopping with the upcoming studio DURIAN on its way.
This resulted in the bigger studios struggling to meet ends, which forces them to rush projects to produce more and younger indviduals rarely speak up because it's their passion and they want to climb up the ladder.

>300 anime titles a year
>I barely watch 5 anymore
I must be too old for this shit

but they will

>The government is responsible for labor laws.
And what does that have to do with them making streaming sites to distribute cartoons?

Nah, anime has just gotten so shitty that there's hardly even 5 shows worth watching in a given season.

>casuals and newfags who give studios way more importance than they have as usual

You just listened to a parrot. Everybody knows that. Besides, that kiddo is dumb just look at this
twitter.com/RENATOLOGY/status/1115980294819987457

Crunchyroll doesn't have anywhere near all the studios, and they typically don't license blu rays or older shows that have less current interest. There is no incentive to paying for the service, when you can have a better experience by downloading illegally.
Daisuki went out of business because they couldn't compete with aggressive licensing tactics, and I don't think it was very good as a service to begin with.

Selling BDs for less will just reduce profits because there is a very limited audience for them.
Most studios are irrelevant because they don't own any of the shows they make.

he probably thinks centralizing anime production and distribution through the government is a good idea

You, like everyone edgy kid in the thread, don't like the medium. Just that.

>There is no incentive to paying for the service, when you can have a better experience by downloading illegally.

That will be the case for any streaming service.

I agree that 300 anime per year is way too much. 80%+ anime are shit anyway. I'd be fine if they cut it by half if that would mean we'd get more high quality ones.

name 1 good anime to come out in the last 5 years

And this hypothetical service is somehow immune to the issues Daisuki had?

>None of your points have refuted anything
Im not sure we are understanding each other, at what point did I defend it. Its still not a bandwagon fallacy, its like you are trying to argue from the subjective clause of what is inherently morally acceptable in accordance with labor laws there is something called overtime pay in which the government uses to justify the increased labor hours, of which (You) are defending. Ive also said and will reiterate once more I dont agree with the practice because Ive been in the situation.

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VEG

Stop shitting out so much anime every season, is that too much to ask?

>twitter /m/tard
When will they learn

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>mecha
>sonic
>spiderman
>spic
Jesus Christ. This fucking thread.

>durr not enough manpower
Just get foreigners to do it. Americans don't even pick their own crops anymore.

how does the pre-requisites of his solution being nontrivial invalidate the solution itself?

>japanese work ethic
>393 hours worked / month
>actual work done 160 hours a month
>actual productive work done 40 hours a month
>actually useful productive work done 10 hours
It's true.

So why doesn't capitalism solve the problem?
Are jap workers too exploitable?
Technologically inept to build the infrastructure for internet streaming services?

When literally every studio is throwing labor ethics out the window, I do think it is an issue that the government should take steps to resolve. Obviously they can't set a maximum hours worked limit, since that would cripple the industry. Development of online infrastructure is also partially the responsibility of governments, so they should be using that to modernize their economy and globalize the industry so that profit margins are high enough to allow for better working conditions and greater funding.
I don't. However, I do think when labor and copyright are the fundamental roadblocks, the government is the only entity that can resolve the issues.
That's not really true. Many people pay for Netflix because they don't suffer from as many of the library restrictions that anime services do. Not an example of an ideal business, but I doubt that piracy levels are anywhere close.

You forgot to add
>After few decades of wageslaving and not having a family commit suicide in some forest and be forgotten until some american tourist finds you