Puella Magi Madoka Magica

>is Madoka peak X?
The answer is always yes.

>Disliking Gargantia
What did Urobuchi do to you, user? Gargantia is maximum comf.

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If I remember correctly Butcher didn't really write Gargantia, he only did the premise and like one episode didn't he?

>Gen Urobuchi explained on the official website that the message of the story is aimed towards those in their teens and 20s, who are either about to enter into society or recently have, and is meant to cheer them on and to encourage them that "going out into the world isn't scary". He also said that the feeling of this work will be different from others he's been involved with.
He's the only one with a writing credit.

is Yea Forums going to try magia record's EN server?

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That's not Kikoukugai

what happened? why is everyone shilling this recently?

Agreed. Taiwanese puppet show is peak Urobuchi

Wikipedia says he only specifically wrote first and last episode. I can't be arsed to verify or look up more informative sources. But my memories from the time that it aired tell me he was less involved than he was made out to be.

>everyone shilling this recently
Lurk for two years before posting.

No.
It's unironically peak anime.

Suisei no Gargantia you barney

Nanoha was better

It's peak Shaft.

Thunderbolt is peak Urobuchi.

Yes. Also Anime of the decade.

I love Madoka but lets not get ahead of ourselves when shows like pic related exist.

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>Emiya Kiritsugu’s right hand continued its work of writing while his left hand mechanically shoveled his nutrition – hamburgers from a fast food restaurant he bought while investigating – into his mouth. For nine years, Emiya Kiritsugu had eaten at the table of the Einzberns, who were merely a hair removed from royalty themselves. He had grown tired of the cuisine. This fast food, filled with the sense of slaughter, was more suited to his tastes. Being able to eat without interrupting one’s words or thoughts was better than anything, no matter how you looked at it.
This is what peak Urobuchi sounds like.

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Yes, it beats even almost-peak-but-second-to-madoka Fate Urobuchi

How was episode 10 so effective at turning everything on it's head?
>you initially thought that Kyubey was the good guy
>Homura's an evil edgy magical girl
>episode 10 shows Homura dindu nuffin wrong the entire time

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>Kyubey
Wasn't obvious he was the villain from the beginning?

That´s is Aldnoah zero

It was both Aldnoah and Gargantia. Butcher was in his post-Madoka phase where he was the hottest shit and production committees paid him to slap his name on shit.

Fuck everything that Magia Record stands for and fuck Aniplex USA
but yes

But Kyubey is still technically a good guy, without him there would be no miracles, no mahou shoujo, no modern human civilization, and possibly no universe.

Also Homura did do everything wrong. They just gave you an entire episode of backstory to sympathize with Homura, because she kind of needs it.

For me it was episodes 8 and 12. Sayaka's emotional collapse/fallout, and Madoka's wish coming into fruition define the show.

Kyubey was obviously shady before then and it was already pretty clear that Homura had her own sympathetic motives. Episode 10 is still incredible though

>you initially thought that Kyubey was the good guy
>Homura's an evil edgy magical girl
It was painfully obvious Kyubey was evil from the start and it was heavily implied Homura had a good reason for antagonizing the other girls.

The fiery/red girl is the only character that makes sense. Everybody else is written poorly.

Homura was a good character until the movie ending re-wrote her into some dumb demon lord.

>no modern human civilization, and possibly no universe.
You fell for his deception. Congrats.

SHE LE DID LE NOTHING LE WRONG LE ESKDEE

Mami was underdeveloped (because she fukken died) and Kyouko's arc was rushed. Madoka, Sayaka, and Homura were all extremely well written.
Rebellion is entierly consistent with her character

I mean the entire point to Madoka's is not how it's about Madoka but how Homura will go to endless lengths to satisfy her obsession with Madoka, so the ending makes perfect sense. There's a reason Madoka is by far the least developed character in the show and Homura is the most developed.

Before episode 3, Madoka Magica looked like a typical Magical Girl show and Kyubey looked pretty innocuous.

>peak Urobuchi
Saya no Uta is better, though.

Homura from the original thing was content with how things turned out the chances to the universal laws Madoka did.

t.speedwatcher
Everything Homura does in Rebellion is 100% in line with her character

>Homura is the real MC!
>Madoka isn't developed!
brainlet

I like, even love princess tutu, the atmosphere and especially character interactions are godly, but Madoka feels more compressed to the essential, while tutu especially during the start of both halves drags a bit unnecessarily.
So I'd put Madoka as a better anime objectively, although I probably like them both equally

Madoka is very well-developed but speedwatchers miss her characterization. She's somebody with a very content life; when Kyubey offers her a wish, she literally has nothing to wish for. She's also smart enough to realize that if she does make a wish it shouldn't be used frivolously. She feels guilty that she has no wish worth giving up her soul for, and this feeds into a martyr complex. She has the least reason to be involved with the world of magical girls, but she can't help but be drawn into it.

>martyr complex
That doesn't mean what you think it means.

ITT: brainlets who didn't understand Madoka
inb4 there's nothing to understand

Madoka has an internal conflict.
She wants to preserve the life she is so happy with, but she also wants to help for various reasons. She feels that without her intervention, everything will go to shit, but if she intervenes, she'll lose her happiness. This causes her to hesitate in taking action, but also extreme guilt for not helping or not going far enough. She eventually discovers an even greater good that was worth sacrificing herself and her happiness for.

If you think Rebellion doesn't fit the series you are a huge brainlet that didn't understand the characters at all.

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You're so awake to the truth user, but villain Kyubey makes the story a lot less interesting. All the choices of the characters no longer matter, because aliens deceived them.

>magical girls show but instead it is edgy and has a tiny bit of Roadside Picnic-like setting

Incredible, what you are wishing for doesn't translate to what your soul actually wishes for. Too deep.

>All the choices of the characters no longer matter, because aliens deceived them.
Don't know why you think this. The characters' choices still do matter because it creates drama, even if they weren't fully informed. They also give valuable and interesting insights on their mentalities.
Also, Kyubey is a manipulative, deceitful sociopath. He may not be a villain, but he rides a dark shade of grey.

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His face is frozen in a blank smile and he speaks in a creepy monotone. He was a red flag that it wasn't a typical mahou shoujo.

I agree that it's one of Madoka's greatest strengths how compact the story is. You can hardly find any plot point or personality trait of the characters that doesn't lead to another important development. If perfection is achieved when there's nothing left to take away, then Madoka is certainly close to that ideal. However, Princess Tutu is a completely different kind of story, one where a more extensive style of story telling is no disadvantage. It's a fairy tale both as a genre of the anime and even within the story itself. And fairy tales live from repetition. Breaking out of the ordinary and disregarding genre expectations was a major point of the show that you couldn't have told in any other way.

To be fair, pre-episode 3 episodes had a sort of ominous "fucky" tone, like something wasn't quite right with all of it. The opening scene had a big part in this.

>Is this peak Urobuchi?
That would be Godzilla for me. It's flawed. But it's amazing when it works and the characters are no less developed than your typical Urobuchi casts.

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This. What people seem to miss most often about Madoka's character for some reason is her normal and natural egocentrism in a genre where this is an exotic trait for a main character. There is a scene where Sayaka literally begs Madoka to become a magical girl to fight by her side but Madoka declines, simply because she is too afraid and concerned about her own well-being. Yes, at other points she wants to become a magical girl but is stopped by Homura. Her decisions are largely based on her contradicting emotions. She wants to help others but doesnt want to be in danger herself. She sways in one or the other direction depending on her mood.

Saya no Uta is peak Urobuchi.

Madoka was clever enough (or stupid if you to see it that way) to not fall for the trap like Sayaka did. If she was so egocentrical she wouldn't erase herself to change the laws of their universe for fuck sake.

If she was not egocentrical why did she literally turn a request by her crying, desperate friend begging her to help her? And just to be sure I'll mention again that egocentrism is a normal thing and the anime portrays it as such. In the end Madoka finds something she can accept as greater than herself and becomes a "god". Note the imagery here: Madoka becomes a god through sacrificing herself for others, showing how it is possible for humans to overcome there egoistic nature.

Man, I wrote this one too fast. Sorry for the shitty grammar.

He meant "natural egocentrism" as in "I don't want to die," and "I don't want to lead an unhappy life." These are things she factually thinks. Don't get it wrong, he's not contesting that her nature isn't altruism. He isn't saying she's narcissistic.

>possibly no universe
>falling for the heat death meme
Wow, just goes to show you need to also know basic astrophysics to understand Madoka.

Heat death is a very real possibility for the end of all life in our universe. Just not the only one.

Yes, in about 10^100 years. 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 years for math-challenged anons. Universe is 13,772,000,000 years old.

Guess who would benefit from a universe that lasts longer than 10^100 years?

Technically everyone, but especially immortal aliens who can't concieve what it means to suffer.

No, only immortal aliens and possible lifeforms living 10^100 years from now. So no, not everyone. And I can guarantee you that Kyubey does NOT care about the lifeforms that may live 10^100 years from now. He does not care about anything BUT Kyubey, and it would be inherently irrational if he did. No, Kyubey is NOT good. He is the absolute selfishness and evil to humanity.

Not to completely contradict your point, but I see things a little differently. Madoka IS a selfless shojo protagonist. We're shown this explicitly in episode 10; when Homura isn't around, Madoka immediately accepts Kyuubey's contract. On a second watching of the show you'll notice that Madoka is constantly about to do the "heroic" thing, but Homura shows up and defuses the situation before she has time to. (The most obvious example I can remember is the Sayaka/Kyoko fight, but it happens a lot. Often multiple times per episode.)

Homura is the egocentric cog that breaks the machine. By forcing herself into Madoka's life she is able to stop Madoka's self-sacrificial tendencies, but she does so at the cost of Madoka's agency. The Madoka we see in early episodes is meek and wishy washy. This is deliberate misdirection, subverted by the strong and decisive Madoka we're shown from episode 10 onwards. The weak Madoka is the product of Homura's well-intentioned meddling. Homura is forced to learn that she can't protect Madoka without taking away the qualities that make her worth protecting. Homura accepts Madoka's sacrifice, not because it was the right thing for Madoka's safety, but because it was what Madoka truly wanted.

Rebellion is a "what-if" story about what would happen if Homura refused to accept that she can't protect Madoka without taking away her agency. She decides that her own concept of Madoka's happiness is more important than honoring the decisions Madoka has made, simultaneously creating an artificial paradise and becoming a devil figure to counterbalance the god Madoka has become.

In Madoka the QBs have canonically prolonged the heath death several times. What makes you believe that in that universe the fact that it's so far in the future isn't precisely that. Also, while it may take 10^100 years until the last black holes have evaporated, local effects on various galaxies will becomes apparant much much sooner.

How would she fare in Mitakihara

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>In Madoka the QBs have canonically prolonged the heath death several times
[citation needed]
>What makes you believe that in that universe the fact that it's so far in the future isn't precisely that
Because there's nothing in the series to contradict that. When a series does not directly contradict laws of physics as we know them, we can assume that they apply as well.
>Also, while it may take 10^100 years until the last black holes have evaporated, local effects on various galaxies will becomes apparant much much sooner.
Moot point. A black hole is all that's needed for life to continue.
>much much sooner
Which is still zillion times longer than the current age of the universe.

Then why did she turn down Sayka? As far as I see it, Madoka is character strongly driven by her immediate emotions. If she's not directly afraid she can find the courage to become a magial girl. But shake her up emotionally and she will falter. She saw how desperate Sayaka was and that made her vary aware of the danger she would put herself in. In the end she overcomes that because she's on the verge of losing everyone.

>He does not care about anything BUT Kyubey
This up to interpretation. They could be selfish rationalists. Or they could be so rational they don't care about anything in particular not even themselves.

>They could be selfish rationalists. Or they could be so rational they don't care about anything in particular not even themselves.
That depends on whether the existence itself is inherently rational or not. Since Kyubey exists, it's clear that he concluded his continued existence to be rational, otherwise he would self-terminate.

>[citation needed]
the show? It is stated that QBs harvest emotions on earth for millenia. Do you know how many years they get per girl? It might well be a gigantic number. And of course it's possible for it happening on various other planets as well.

>Because there's nothing in the series to contradict that. When a series does not directly contradict laws of physics as we know them, we can assume that they apply as well.
We literally made up a never observed form of energy (dark energy) to explain physical phenomena we have zero idea of how they work (increased expansion speed of the universe). In a universe where energy is canonically created out of nothing by aliens, we might as well attribute that energy to the magic.
>Moot point. A black hole is all that's needed for life to continue.
A vague idea, no one knows what is beyond an event horizon. Also the QBs could obviuosly have an interested in preventing the end of galaxies etc. Why do you assume say should just act at the last moment rather than thinking ahead?
>Which is still zillion times longer than the current age of the universe.
Depends on your scale of events and at what point exactly you want to intervene. Stars dying? Galaxies dying? Block holes dying? Protons dying?

The only thing we gathered is they want to prevent heat death. From that we can tell they think continued existence is rational. But they might think so in general. It may not matter to them what exists. They'll not self-terminate because that's one less thing existing (plus they have to prevent heat death). They would if that meant two other things existing AND they'd also prevent heat death. As long as anything exists, it's a-ok.

>"Madoka IS"
That is your problem right there. You are selling Madoka Magica short as art if you try to just nail it down to what IS.
You must realize that Madoka can be seen from two distinct narratives:

Madoka as a shoujo protagonist who sacrifices herself and does the good that she does because that is what she truly wants.
Homura as an obsessive well intentional friend who wants to hinder Madoka from going away or growing up for secretly her own sake.

OR

Madoka as a self-sacrificing naive child who lives in a world that is too cruel to allow her to be stupid and idealistic.
Homura as the adult who has seen through the system and realized that Madoka is just going to get herself killed(or worse) if she is allowed to run stupidly into her own doom.

You must realize that the difference between those two "interpretations" is not the story or the characters.
It is your own values.

"On the other side of the secretly opened door
Lies a world on the verge of crumbling
(...)
Have you noticed?
Something like the truth
Only exists in the past
Things like hope and the future
Are just egoistic tales of a faraway garden
Written by someone
But no one knows it yet"

-- Kimi no gin no Niwa, Rebellion

Do you think it is absolutely valuable that Madoka sacrifices herself for the greater good? And why do YOU value that? What even is the point?

Do you consider stability and order more important than desire?

Individual or society?
Some of the real and true depth of Madoka Magica is to actually nail down those positions as abstracts and to understand how you relate to them.

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They were okay with all of earth being exterminated after Madoka became a witch in one of the loops.

That must have given them a lot of energy though, think of how much heat death was prevented.

You're falsely assuming the Incubators value the universe as it exists in its current form. They don't need stars or galaxies or even black holes. they just need a farm of an emotional species to serve as their personal perpetual motion machine. Humans are an experimental means to how to optimize such a farm. Humans aren't fully "domesticated" which is why they are fine with a finite quota from Earth.

Because she had nothing worth wishing for in the current timeline. Homura experienced many timelines where Madoka was a magical girl.

The point of the whole mediocre story is that you should be content with how your life is and that you should learn to respect it.

That was Homura fucking up the timeline though.

>the show? It is stated that QBs harvest emotions on earth for millenia. Do you know how many years they get per girl? It might well be a gigantic number. And of course it's possible for it happening on various other planets as well.
You made it sound as if heat death would have already occurred without Kyubey. Again, a moot point because:
>Do you know how many years they get per girl? It might well be a gigantic number. And of course it's possible for it happening on various other planets as well.
It doesn't matter. 10^100 is the lifespan without Kyubey's shenanigans. With Kyubey it might be 10^101 for all I care. It does not change the fact that it's at least 10^100 regardless.
>A vague idea, no one knows what is beyond an event horizon.
Nothing at all to do with harvesting energy from black holes, which is a perfectly valid concept.
>Also the QBs could obviuosly have an interested in preventing the end of galaxies etc.
That's completely irrational. No they don't. Galaxy is just a bunch of space dust. It's not a living entity.
>Depends on your scale of events and at what point exactly you want to intervene. Stars dying? Galaxies dying? Block holes dying? Protons dying?
Again, a moot point. Black hole is all that's needed to sustain life.

>The point of the whole mediocre story is that you should be content with how your life is and that you should learn to respect it.
It is literally the opposite of that. Although you can construct this Aesop out of it also.
You will not find a stronger endorsement of the credo "Take whatever you want by force", in fiction period.

I know this phrase is overused, but you LITERALLY did not understand Madoka.

>yuritrash

>They don't need stars or galaxies or even black holes.
Citation needed. I don't think we know that exactly what incubators are or want. But even if you're correct. Why would the incubators just wait and sit around? Once there are only black holes there won't be any humans to get emotions from.

Madoka is also not yuri, btw. Nice try.

>It may not matter to them what exists
That sounds very irrational to me. Kyubey does not care about existence of an entire spieces, why would he care about an existence that can't be experienced by Kyubey?
>They'll not self-terminate because that's one less thing existing
They didn't care that they indirectly wiped out humanity's existence.

>Because she had nothing worth wishing for in the current timeline.
You completely missed my point. This is not about the wish. It's about her friend begging her to do it for her. If your best friends begs you to do something under tears you will usually comply unless you have a good reason not to. What was that reason for Madoka? Fear.

Homu's a massive dyke though.

Yes it is. The single greatest yuri of all.

Also every girl is gay for her.

I mean you are just trying to look into things to make them much deeper than they really are. Even your favorite Homura learned to do it by the end of the series and it made sense for her character to do so. This is why people hate on Rebellion so much.

Stop being autistic. She didn't became a magical girl under those circumstances because the plot demanded so. Up until episode 9 or 10 the viewer had no idea why Homura is being the way she is but was fed tiny bits of information that she is fond of Madoka and is trying to stop her from becoming a magical girl too.

No, I'm really not. You just don't understand.
People hate Rebellion because it is the best-known example of pearls being cast before swine.

Whatever, shitpost as much as you like about your perfect 2deep4us memeshow.

>Stop being autistic. She didn't became a magical girl under those circumstances because the plot demanded so.
M8, she literally told Sayaka she wanted to help her but just can't. It would be hard to spell this out any more clearly. Also it made perfect sense considering her personality as shown in the previous episodes. I recommend you watch the scene again, it's pretty obvious.

>They didn't care that they indirectly wiped out humanity's existence.
As I said before, they only care that SOMETHING exists. Humanity not existing is not a loss if the energy gathered from this means two other random things existing in its place.
>That sounds very irrational to me. Kyubey does not care about existence of an entire spieces, why would he care about an existence that can't be experienced by Kyubey?
They are aliens from a branch of rationalism but we don't know what it is (altruist or selfish-leaning rationalism). Naturally a right-leaning rationalist may still hold self-preservation and self-experience as their rational prior. But we don't know about a more altruist, or rather don't care rationalist. They may even consider this to be arbitrary. This is just as likely since they don't feel emotions so they may regard this as an emotional response. As emotionless creatures who only follow an idea or archetype of what is the rational thing to do, which to them is more things existing overall, they may not be selfish if only because heat death or w/e is more important.

The incubators are some sort of hivemind or other form of shared consciousness. Even if one of them gets killed, another one replaces it that has its exact memories and "personality". They seem to have some sense of self-preservation (as they run away from Homura in the first episode and from the Clara Dolls in Rebellion), but there's no consequence to them if their individual bodies are killed.

One dyke doesn't make it yuri

Didn't they run in ep 1 as merely an act? Though the fact they're ok with getting replaced already makes it a fuzzy issue.

Kyoko is also a dyke which is one reason why her and Homura get along so well.

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It's possible, but they also run from the Clara Dolls and at that point they have nobody to fool.

How about Madoka who sacrificed her life that she knew and the happiness she wants not only for the ideals she believed in but also to help those who are suffering

Magia Record has an actual canon dyke and her "friend" who'll literally die for her.

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That is the first version of Madoka 100%, you could add that to that description.

This.

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There'd be no Madoka Magica if Homu wasn't the biggest dyke in the universe

Did the guy who drew pic related draw that

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>and she is merely one among a plethora of new hets

Do not insult Kyouko like that.

Someone with taste in the sea of autistic madotards.

No, F0 was and this is an established fact

Madoka is literally the sequel to Fate/Zero.
Homura is Kiritsugu after he gave up on Utilitarism, ever thought about why it begins in medias res?

But she is merely one, and her dykery is not the focus.

There's only three hets, and Kyoko proves that megucas are straight until they get wet

reminder

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The most prominent straight girl is the rapetoy of a lesbian high school girl

Batshit insane Alina just uses her as a nude model. What the fuck are you meming about?

The most logical assumption is that the Incubators want immortality. A necessary requisite for immortality is a perpetual motion machine. Stars and galaxies and black holes are not perpetual motion machines. Emotion (specifically the transition from hope to despair) seems to be the key to a perpetual motion machine, though it is unclear whether it is of the first or second kind (i.e., creating energy from nothing versus producing work in thermal equilibrium). They don't need humans specifically to provide that emotion, in fact, humans are very inefficient in that regard because only a small fraction produce enough to be useful in terms of power.

Thus, a requirement is "optimized livestock" to provide that emotional transition. Such livestock would be psychologically engineered to manifest it in all individuals. It need not reproduce, as the Incubators would construct replacement individuals themselves. It need not even be biological in nature, the livestock could very well be virtual. Providing energy to that livestock could be as simple as using the Incubators' waste heat itself, bypassing the need for celestial bodies, and indeed, much more efficient. The wasted power of the Sun is 10^13 times more than the used power, and the amount that actually went towards magical girls is a few orders of magnitude lower. The efficiency rating gets even worse when you consider that there may be only a few emotional species may be produced per galaxy. Obviously, the Incubators would produce their livestock using tightly controlled means, not natural astrophysical processes.

They're not waiting around, they're gathering data so that once all the stars and black holes die, it won't be a problem for them, because they have their own alternative energy.

If Magia Record is canon than the PSP/Vita games are canon too, and Madoka gets pretty damn gay for Homura in certain timelines. Don't forget how touchy-feeling she got with Homura in the second timeline.

Sayaka is bisexual and not-Fuu just needs to find her own Kyoko

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Wrong

Even if their bodies are replaceable, it's inefficient and wastes energy.

>Sayaka
>bisexual

They hated user because he told the truth.

>If Magia Record is canon
it's not
>the PSP/Vita games are canon too
they wouldn't be even if it was

No.

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She clearly wants the Violin-Kun dick.

>Madoka
Pretty much gets turned into Homura's pet by Rebellion
>Sayaka
Eats red carpet by Rebellion
>Aimi
dumb het
>Mifuyu
Rapetoy for Magius members
>Momoko
Raped gay by Mitama
>Hinano
het

Oh fuck he got some

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She doesn't see Kyoko that way.

youtube.com/watch?v=AmOg3-f9z0A
Accept it
Also user forgot the lesbian pedophile Yachiyo and her JC harem

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Leave it to fucking /vg/ to derail a good discussion with yurishit.

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Why are hetfags so fucking dumb? No wonder they can't understand Rebellion.

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>memes are canon
ho ho ho oh boy oh boy

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Why are yurifags so dumb? All they care about is how gay they think the girls are. They don't really appreciate the story for what it is.

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They think that the girls will want to fuck them if they aren't gay, so they can't understand a story when there is a gay girl in it. Just notice how most of this thread is waifufags reeeing at people stating facts.

Yurifags like to project their delusions onto others, see

Samefag

Because they need to see romance in everything in order for them to enjoy it. The fetishize lesbians, and they project that fetish on to everything they consume. Any female friendship they see must be a secret romance. If there's one gay character, they claim everyone is gay. It's very starnge behavior.

Stay mad

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Damn dude you got me

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The Madoka fanbase is one the worst. Discussion is always ruined by shitposters.

You are only proving my point.

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The only reason why Madoka isn't chained to Homura's bed is because Homu is too soft to claim her rightful property

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Such a good show

I think the incubators are a species of individual hiveminds. Kyubey is one such hivemind.
To put it a different way, each individual incubator possesses and controls multiple bodies.

>Madoka isn't a yuri anime
And here I thought Yea Forums couldn't get any more retarded.

>187380300
Why won't you fuck off with your delusions already?

The time for baiting is over, user. The storm is over.

fucking wasted get.

Will you play Madoka Magica Magia Record when it comes out in English this summer?

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Blame waifufags for being the scourge of literally any franchise.

But is madoka edgy moe?

It's not even close to edgy, why do people think this?

Madoka Magica is clearly an edgy yuri moe anime. Everyone knows this. Get the fuck out of here, retard.

She needs to fulfill her promise and rape Madoka.

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>Is blatant copy of Kamen Rider Ryuki peak Urobuchi?
No. That would be really lame if it was. Even Gaim is better.

Thunderbolt fantasy is his obvious peak.

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Kore.

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Best Urobuchi villain

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Anime of the decade, nothing has approached being even 3/4 as good

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It's already been surpassed

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PMMM's autistic little sister is so cute when she tries to be important

>yuyuyu gets a successful second season that resolves the main plot
>madoka is still in cliffhanger hell because urobuchi still wants to play with his taiwanese puppets

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Is this worth a watch? What's your honest opinion on it? I've heard nothing but bad.

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It's very good, but it's similarity to Madoka is only superficial. It's a very different show with different themes, and it takes a much different stance to the notion of self-sacrifice than is common in anime.
If you somehow haven't been spoiled on it then I'd recommend you watch it asap so that you can experience it fresh.

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I guess I should also mention that I say this is a huge Madokafag. It's difficult for me to comment on its themes without spoiling some of the plot. It also has great visual design (although graphicswise it clearly has a much smaller budget than Madoka), and it has an amazing soundtrack by Keiichi Okabe and Monaca.

Also the obligatory black-haired lesbian is a great character and is really really gay.

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I guess I'll give it a whirl then. I wish there were more things as quality as Madoka, I'm starting to get tired of my monthly rewatch after 8 years of it but nothing else scratches that itch.

I will say that one of the biggest differences between Madoka and YuYuYu is the group dynamic. In Madoka the girls are usually in conflict with each other and the way that the grief seed system works basically prevents girls working together. Meanwhile the girls in YuYuYu are very good friends, and there are a lot of scenes of the girls just hanging out and having fun. Your enjoyment of the show will probably depend a lot on how invested you get in the Hero Club. In my opinion the characters are extremely lovable, but of course you may have a different opinion.

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I like the idea of a tighter knit group, thank you for the opinion user

>peak Urobuchi?

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>peak Urobuchi
THE LAND IS CLOAKED IN DEEPEST BLUE

No, it's Walmart Madoka. It takes all of the elements of Madoka but doesn't know how to handle or execute them so it comes off as corny and bad.

For example, Madoka very prominently featured the idea of magical girls as a system enforced by an otherworldly power. This is central to the show's plot and themes because it's about the cruelty of the universe running on this system, and the ultimate resolution is really about upending this system, not beating the big bad witch or even Kyubey.

YuYuYu rips the magical girl system off wholesale but it never gets paid off or resolved in any meaningful way whatsoever. The existence of this system and its perpetrators aren't addressed by the story and it's a very conspicuously unresolved loose end. It feels like that element is only in there because Madoka had it. That's why it comes off as poor execution, and I felt like there were lots of aspects of YuYuYu that came off similarly.

It also has the most contrived and ridiculous melodrama I have seen, maybe ever. There's this ridiculously drawn out phone conversation where a character spills her guts about all of her now-dashed dreams and aspirations and it's so on the nose that I had to pause because I was laughing so hard. Maybe it's worth watching just for that.

Madoka's magic system essentially involves a girl's soul being removed from their body and a girl being able to use the emotional power of their soul to fight. Kyubey sets up the process but everything else is up to the girl.

The Hero System involves the girls being granted divine power by the Shinju, which is a conglomeration of Shinto gods, with the Taisha essentially acting as intermediaries between humanity and the Shinju. The drama is not about the actual system of magic, but about the need for young girls to be tasked with such a responsibility.

Also fuck you Episode 9 is one of the best single episodes of any recent anime.

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I don't like YuYuYu, but I see why other people do enjoy it and that's fine. However, because it's so blatantly a post-Madoka magical girl show, its fans getting insecure and trying to stack it up against Madoka is misguided.

Everything in Madoka has a point and ties into the theme and plot. It's an extremely structured self-contained story to convey big ideas, about the universe and god and all that kind of thing. There are no extraneous elements and it ends, tying everything up and closing the story off. Rebellion went back and examined the ending and sort of completed a ying and yang after the fact, but it too had ideas it was trying to get across. It's art.

YuYuYu lifts a lot of the setting and ideas from Madoka, but the complexity of what it all meant in Madoka is lost, because the show is clearly just about cute girls suffering. It's got more slice-of-life, more extraneous subplots, and more blatant Bokurano-esque cruelty. The show is less cerebral than Madoka in both its twists and its tone, because it's all beat-you-over-the-head stuff. As a point of comparison, Sayaka rubs a lot of people the wrong way because her whole zombie outburst suffering has a lot of character nuance that people don't understand and can't empathize with. But the goofy looking bitch drops a lot of hints as to what her thought process is and why she's going down a misguided path of perceived self-sacrifice. Contrast that with the phone recording and it's obvious how YuYuYu approaches suffering with the subtlety of a hand grenade. This different approach is why, in a wet fart of a conclusion, YuYuYu takes all of these big, heavy implications lifted out of Madoka and then does nothing with them. Nothing besides the immediate big bad threat is actually dealt with. Because it's not a story that is going to conclude with a message, it's entertainment that can be dragged out for as long as it's profitable because the show says nothing meaningful. It's product.

Canon Alternate Universe.

YuYuYu is for people who liked Madoka for it's surface level plot and characters but it's not really a good fit if you actually want to dig into the substance of the show. You can't really analyze anything in YuYuYu to the level of something like the relationship between Kyoko and Sayaka. Not to mention all the references to both Nietzsche and Faust that are constantly present within the series. Madoka can get very complex with it's writing but it can also convey it's story and characters in a way that the average viewer can understand which is why it's such a great show. Something like Eva will confuse the average watcher on it's tiny details causing them to miss the big picture.

>YuYuYu lifts a lot of the setting and ideas from Madoka
The setting and themes of Madoka are very different. Madoka takes place in a modern and very urban environment, while YuYuYu takes place in a quiet suburban environment that's actually a post-apocalyptic Shinto theocracy.

Subtlety isn't always automatically the best way to approach a situation. Fuu and Itsuki's subplot is something that builds throughout the entire season, and throughout the entire season there are lots of signs of how deeply Itsuki losing her voice is hurting her. Yet despite being the youngest and most delicate girl in the group Itsuki bears it all without complaint. The scene isn't so much about Itsuki's dreams being shattered as it is Fuu realizing that it's all her fault, and just realizing how she inadvertently fucked over everyone, a realization that had building ever since Episode 5 (when she had already been feeling guilty about the situation when Tougou called her out in Episode 2).

YuYuYu replaces the Faust and Nietzsche stuff with Shinto mythology

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