Is there a stronger fire user in anime or manga than Yamamoto?

Unironically Natsu.

That entire part was one of Bleach's highest points, even rivaling the SS arc big time

Yhwach

anyone ever wonder how the fuck the story of bleach fights ever occur?
like,
enemies are somewhat always countered by an asspull?
how did this series get away with this?

ace from one piece

>Ryujin Jakka
>Ryu
>Phoenix theme

Lolwut

What are you talking about? Are you just memeing or do you have a fight in particular you're referring to?

every. fucking. fight

So you're memeing, noted.

no him but did you even read the last arc?

What even happened at the end of Bleach? I kind of stopped reading one week around the time they introduced the Zero Division

Not him but can you stop being a faggot and support your argument?

Escanor

here's an example faggot; Kyouraku and Nanao vs Lille Barro

>every. fucking. fight
>gives one example

ESL-kun please leave

Are you fucking stupid? I'm not going to name you almost every single fight from the last arc. I just posted the most obvious one.

Elaborate on what part is supposed to be an "asspull".

Because you literally have no argument

Is there a character that could even possibly EVEN TOUCH Madara Uchiha? Let alone defeat him. And I'm not talking about Edo Tensei Uchiha Madara. I'm not talking about Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara either. Hell, I'm not even talking about Juubi Jinchuuriki Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara with the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan and Rinnegan doujutsus (with the rikodou abilities and being capable of both Amateratsu and Tsukuyomi genjutsu), equipped with his Gunbai, a perfect Susano'o, control of the juubi and Gedou Mazou, with Hashirama Senju's DNA implanted in him so he has mokuton kekkei genkai and can perform yin yang release ninjutsu while being an expert in kenjutsu and taijutsu.

>nanao just so happens to have a perfect sealing shikai

>keeps using buzzwords
>no, you have no argument!
stop posting

Probably a Saint Seiya character who has fire powers.

Black Zetsu

>gives backstory that is built upon plot points that have been established throughout the manga
>"asspull"

You do also realize "asspull" is a meaningless buzzword, right? Sad desu

Take your own advice, imbecile. Why mention "every fight", post one example that could be asspull, then say "I'm not going to mention every fight". Are you seriously this retarded? If you're going to mention "every fight" make a full list and argument to defend yourself, otherwise, stop talking.

So, how does that apply to every fight in the last arc?

This motherfucker right here would blow him up alongside the planet in a single FAFNIR/GRAND VIPER/GIRLFRIEND/whatever
>inb4 random hax your character comes up with
Sol no sells it. Whatever it is he's just gonna punch you in the face.
>inb4 not anime
But the all-time classic Guilty Gear SEX special exists
youtu.be/jNRnL4fjFXU

Attached: Order_Sol.png (713x1150, 734K)

vizards jobbing to luchadore man
IMAGINE dying from imagination
squad zero being hyped up then getting off-screened
unstoppable thor quincy guy only dying to the light
espada doing fuck all in final arc

That's what i got off the top of my head. Also just realized that it's been nearly three years since the end of bleach. Where did all that time go Yea Forums?

>bad guy specifically says that he can't steal Yamamoto's Bankai because he doesn't properly understand it
>Yamamoto proceeds to activate his Bankai and systematically reveal every single one of its multiple abilities, allowing the bad guy to steal it
>bad guy ends up being defeated without ever using it, despite it explicitly being powerful enough to destroy all of Soul Society when improperly used
The last arc of Bleach is like a mobius strip of frustration.

i dropped the game because of him, this fight is beyond my capacities as a human being

Wow, none of the things you listed are asspulls

Not a single one of those fights have anything to do with the post I replied to...?

This is beyong speedreading

>>bad guy specifically says that he can't steal Yamamoto's Bankai because he doesn't properly understand it
Nope, that was Yamamoto's incorrect theory.

Bad guy was lying. Also The Almighty makes ZnT look like a joke.

>Bad guy was lying
He wasnt, Yhwach didnt say anything about how the medallions work. It was all Yamamoto´s assumption

Every fight featuring le wacky science man is won via asspull because none of his fights are won with his actual abilities. It always ends up being some stupid science horseshit he prepared off-screen that wins the fight.

>LOL ALL MY ORGANS ARE FAKE AND ALSO I INJECTED POISON INTO MY BANKAI/ASSISTANT

And no, "HE'S A SCIENTIST SO IT MAKES SENSE HE'D HAVE COUNTERMEASURES READY" isn't an excuse. Just because you have a degree in asspulling doesn't mean your asspulls aren't asspulls.

>dropped the game at the ending
it's just an old guy bro look up some guides

>Toshiro, Byakuya, and Kenpachi all reveal new abilities against giant viking man and spend a gorillion chapters fighting him
>none of them defeat him
>he's just randomly killed later on
Really happy they dedicated so much time to a literally pointless fight desu

Escanor.

Science and preptime are his "abilities", dumbass. Your argument boils down to "I don't like it so its an asspull". Mayuri is no different from any other character except that he specs in research and development.

>"HE'S A SCIENTIST SO IT MAKES SENSE HE'D HAVE COUNTERMEASURES READY" isn't an excuse
Yes it is

I think (You) missed the point...

Stop arguing with bleachtards, it's useless.
Some user made a joke about bleach being a good, but underrated manga and newfags thought that he's serious.

That's fucking retarded, he could retroactively present a solution to any problem and the fact that he's a scientist would be a valid excuse? Those are some low fucking standards right there.

Wow ad hominem, what a convincing argument

>Stop arguing with bleachads, they use arguments

What, that Toshiro, Byakuya, and Kenpachi are all shitters even when they're trying to be cool and show off new abilities? Or that giant viking man was designed solely to waste time and pad out the arc's length?

He's pretty much limited to biological functions because thats his speciality, also in cases like the Bankai stealing power he didn't have an immediate solution either. Hell, his win over Syazel was acknowledged as an accident, same with Pernida. Why don't you actually pay attention to the manga so you don't make baseless assumptions?

i died like 20 times before learning how to circle the fire moves

black flame > all flame

Attached: 2Q==.jpg (258x196, 10K)

>Toshiro, Byakuya, and Kenpachi are all shitters
Thats one way to put it

>fire user
>summons skeletons

Attached: 1475821439324.jpg (608x648, 50K)

>pad out the arc's length
Literally the opposite was the case though? Everyone knows the ending was rushed. The point is that the Soul King's Heart isn't something that can be overpowered. Its basically MC plot armor except the bad guy has it.

And this is a problem because...?

Ayaka Kagari after getting a kiss from Takamiya-kun.

Attached: 741.gif (500x261, 973K)

>Science and preptime are his "abilities"
But the problem is that they don't operate within reason. He had no background info on Szayel but just randomly showed up with all of his organs replaced with fakes? That's pretty fucking convenient, isn't it? A solution to a problem with no foreshadowing or logical explanation is functionally identical to an asspull.

Like, what if he got mismatched and went up against someone who didn't happen to play into his random fake organs like Nnoitra or Zommari. Would he have gotten steamrolled or would he have had a solution to that problem too? If the answer is the latter then he's just an asspull machine.

>Hell, his win over Syazel was acknowledged as an accident, same with Pernida.
The author going "TEE HEE THAT SURE WAS LUCKY" doesn't make an asspull something other than an asspull, though. If it had been established from the very beginning that Mayuri had fake organs because of an accident or experiment or something and then happened to fight Syazel way later then that would be an acceptable response. If he pulled out a gun that said "CAN KILL AIZEN IN ONE SHOT" and shot Aizen with it, would you be satisfied if he turned to the camera and said "BOY, I SURE WAS LUCKY I HAD THE GUN THAT COULD KILL AIZEN WITH ONE SHOT IN MY POCKET!"?

Wouldn't it be plasma instead of fire by this point?

Attached: 6410823-5002539488-64104.jpg (760x1200, 436K)

>Hell, his win over Syazel was acknowledged as an accident, same with Pernida
That might work in-universe but in terms of writing that's complete trash. A planned accident with no foreshadowing is an asspull.

>He had no background info on Szayel but just randomly showed up with all of his organs replaced with fakes?
In many cases its implied his entire body is a "fake".

>Like, what if he got mismatched and went up against someone who didn't happen to play into his random fake organs like Nnoitra or Zommari
Yeah, probably. Mayuri tends to pick his battles carefully though.

>If it had been established from the very beginning that Mayuri had fake organs because of an accident or experiment or something and then happened to fight Syazel way later then that would be an acceptable response.
Making entire bodies is what R&D does, do you not remember Gigai from the very first arc? Just admit you're a speedreader because oh boy does it show.

Its actually good writing and shows the difference in the two characters philosophies towards science. Just saying its bad writing because you don't like it isn't a valid argument.

>having your characters win their battles by accident because you just happened to have them do something that perfectly countered the abilities of an opponent they had never met before and knew nothing about is good writing
okay

>He had no background info on Szayel but just randomly showed up with all of his organs replaced with fakes?
Speedreader

OH HOW MY BLOOD BOILS! FACE ME SEKIRO!

fire is cooler than goo

Mayuri put on fake organs because he saw the fight via surveillance bacteria he planted on Uryuu

That isn't what happened though. Syazel simply made a mistake in thinking that Nemu was just a normal human instead of Mayuri's walking drug mule. The entire point of this is that Syazel thought his technique was perfect, whereas Mayuri believes perfection is pointless (because it leaves no room for improvement). Its the complete oposite of your assumption that Mayuri hard counters everything, further proven by the Pernida fight which he also almost lost for the same reason.

Haschwalth theorized that it wasn't actually fire, just the appearance his reiatsu took

Its also possible that his organs have always been fakes and that he was just fucking with Syazel.

I'm still pissed he died in such a retarded way

>english
yuck

Haschwalth or Yama?

What about a sun made of ice?

Yama

>dcu.ie/ncpst/about/what-is-plasma.shtml
>The lowest temperature at which plasma can usually be seen is a few tens of thousands of degrees, but many plasmas are much hotter than this. Plasmas can reach temperatures of hundreds of thousands or even millions of degrees.
Seems so

That was kind of the point though, you were supposed to be upset because the bad guy cheated the win.

Well congrats to Kubo then I guess

Attached: C_K3r94XgAE6hr_.jpg (674x960, 123K)

That’s what I remember the subs reading

For the sake of the argument, the word "asspull" must be defined. According to tvtropes:
>An Ass Pull is a moment when the writers pull something out of thin air in a less-than-graceful narrative development, violating the Law of Conservation of Detail by dropping a plot-critical detail in the middle, or near the end of their narrative without Foreshadowing or dropping a Chekhov's Gun earlier on.
>Provided it's actually true and not a lie he made up to mess with Ichigo, Aizen's claims toward having been manipulating Ichigo's entire life might qualify. Other examples include Yammy being the Zeroth Espada, Hitsugaya's bleeding and talking ice clone during his fight with Harribel, Ulquiorra having a second resurrection (which goes against the basic concept of resurrections), Ichigo's ultimate defeat of Ulquiorra, Sasakibe knowing how to use Bankai (which was only stated posthumously and long after he was effortlessly beaten by a bare-handed Ichigo), and one Sternritter having an identical twin appear out of nowhere. Two different characters independently received the power-up of being dead, thereby making them immune to an enemy's power. The final Big Bad is killed thanks to an arrow made of silver that allegedly clogs the heart of people he purges, even though several victims were Stripped to the Bone or actually survived while simply having their powers weakened

Science and preparation only go so far to excuse the plot when they're actually hinted at in advance OR when they represent a logical conclusion based on available information. Kubo unfortunately relies on extremely generalized skill sets to justify characters like Urahara and Mayuri doing what they do, i.e. mad scientists that deal with bodies.

>according to tvtropes
fuck off shill

>negate
>he looked scorched all over
Yeah, no. He was bullshitting. Thankfully for him WR's healers are apparently competent.

Was Rukia's bankai ice based or temperature based? And if it was temperature based could it counter Yamamotos's?

Attached: Rukia_Bankai.jpg (760x1200, 177K)

Going to ignore your literal copy-pasting from a literal cancer website for starters.

>Kubo unfortunately relies on extremely generalized skill sets to justify characters like Urahara and Mayuri doing what they do, i.e. mad scientists that deal with bodies.
Care to back that claim with actual evidence from the manga?

I'd wager temperature.
And no.

>Was Rukia's bankai ice based or temperature based?
These aren't opposing concepts.

>And if it was temperature based could it counter Yamamotos's?
With 1000 years of improvements? Possibly.

>silver that allegedly clogs the heart of people he purges, even though several victims were Stripped to the Bone or actually survived while simply having their powers weakened
Uryuu's mom fell in a coma that took months to kill her

The difference between it being ice or temperature is because if it was ice based it would evaporate before doing anything like Mr. Fujobucks's

Well its described as Rukia lowering her physical body temperature to the point of causing earthquakes and such, so the latter is more accurate (as she has minimal actual manipulative control over the ice she produces).

Shana.
Prove me wrong.

Attached: spirits_0_roy.png (528x624, 420K)

Roy is as weak as a wet noodle it is the sword of seals that is OP

Ikki

Stronger? Probably
More based? Hell no

he said he could but was shown burnt black by them in the aftermath of yamas fight

Which still makes it incredibly stupid of Yamamoto to have explained it.

It wouldn't have made a difference.

...which still makes it incredibly stupid of Yamamoto to have explained it

I mean, he was just making a wild guess as to why fake Yhwach hadn't stolen his bankai.

But was what he explained all there was to explain?

>explain the thing that doesn't matter because it would have mattered if fro some reason it didn't not matter
Wew

Iroh

He didn't know it didn't matter
as far as he knew, revealing that would have been an error

Again, it literally would have made no difference, even if Yama's theory was true, because Yama still had not revealed his Bankai's final technique. Do you still not see the error you've made here?

Yama didn't explain his last technique, he just used it and inflicted lethal damage to fake Yhwach

You absolute twit how do you still not understand? Yamamoto BELIEVED that understanding a bankai would let them steal it. From his own perspective, the logical thing he should be doing is refusing to explain a single thing. Do you get it now?

Every single character in Fire Force is a fire user. Author gets really creative with it, I love it.

Main antagonist of this arc was especially crazy with his powers.

Attached: 1552348661711.jpg (1066x1600, 220K)

And the way MC one-upped him was insane.

Attached: 1532393691360.jpg (1066x1600, 265K)

>he doesn't know about based Evankhell

Attached: Inferno_-_flaming_ecstasy.jpg (700x1305, 393K)

...

Attached: Index_v20_001.jpg (1165x1600, 558K)

>Supreme commander, what is your plan?
>Simple, I'm going to explain all but one thing about my bankai to them, this way when they die they'll be really steamed because they nearly had it
>Genius commander! What if they survive, and have someone with some unusual information gathering skills which would make it much easier to uncover the secrets of your last technique?
>Shut the fuck up. I am the general I gotta flex on them.

My problem is that the author stretches fire powers so far that they somehow become even more generic than if they just had different powers to begin with.

No one tried to steal Yama's bankai, which is why Yama had that theory to begin with, implying the enemy would have already had that ingormation, hence why they didn't try to steal it in the first place. Which all of course turned out to be untrue.

You're literally incorrect on every possible level of this discussion.

With the range of abilities displayed in Bleach why are you just jumping to the assumption that every possible one that could be used to gather information would have done so before the fight started? You're as dumb as the old man.

You mean like the guy that turns fire into ice?
Dunno, I liked how all of them have pseudo-scientific explanation.

Tower of god is better than 110% of current manga Yea Forums shitposts about. Its absolutely one of the best.
Rak is best character
Yea Forums is filled with fucking turtles

Ace, akainu,

>the vandenreich is somehow not privy to how their own technology works

So you're just going to continue to jump to an even more specific conclusion every time you get proven wrong... wew

what the fuck makes you think either of them are stronger than Yamamoto

Not really. It's pretty good, but the pacing is atrocious.

If their leader is in danger fighting Yama why wouldnt they use them immediately?

Exactly like that. Might as well be the same as every other ice power at that point. I dropped Fire Force very early so I'm sure the author has better ideas than I'm giving him credit for, I just got that impression. Doesn't help that everything else was just as cliche.

>the vandenreich is somehow not privy to how their own technology works
Please read my post again until you actually understand what I said, because I said nothing remotely close to that.
Because the ability has limitations like literally every other ability in the series, perhaps it can for one of a million reasons only uncover one fact about his bankai, and so using it on him was pointless until the dipshit revealed everything else about it.

Speaking of fire users in Bleach, remember Yoshino and Goethe?

and remember how the anime kept filler characters and kept them in the arrancar arc?

Attached: Ep74YoshinoProfile.png (680x540, 306K)

Hes a bitch just like you

>So you're just going to continue to jump to an even more specific conclusion every time you get proven wrong

>because I said nothing remotely close to that.
You didn't have to, and that you have no rebuttal confirms it.

>perhaps it can for one of a million reasons only uncover one fact about his bankai, and so using it on him was pointless until the dipshit revealed everything else about it.

>So you're just going to continue to jump to an even more specific conclusion every time you get proven wrong... wew

Bount arc was retarded

>very early
Oh, that explains it. Maybe you were reading it as it was translated, it's pretty good if you binge it. Ice user is also the only ice user in the series, it's just there for variety.

Obviously my main man Fire Punch

Unless the anime is sakuga I don't see me going back to that series.

Exodus is one of his weaker spells, for hardcore shit you can look to Black Sabbath or Halloween