Rebellion, once again

>for ALL of them
Yes, but ultimately, Rebellion is a story of Homura and Madoka. Everything is for Madoka's sake, after all. Everyone else were invited into the barrier for Madoka alone. Therefore, I don't think the other girls have much, if any, significance in the overarching symbolism of Rebellion.

Ok

cont.
Also the fact that the movie especially deals a lot with dualism. It's one of the central themes.

I will be honest right here. I absolutely don't like the interpretation of dualism.
I get why people think that. But it is bothering me.
But if we get down to it there is not much disagreement between Madoka and Homura.
I mean, forget the misunderstanding.
If Madoka and Homura actually talked it out.
Do you really think that there would be unacceptable differences?

Homura is not some kind of evil sociopath who is only focused on Madoka as some people like to portray her. That is not how she is interacting with the other girls AT ALL. I mean, look at how she treats Kyouko for example, they are entirely genuinely friendly, and she absolutely cares about them.
She even has a monologue where she sympathizes with Mami.

Her goal AND method of operation are very similar to Madoka's.
I don't see how this is duality, beyond the simplistic color-coding.

>Do you really think that there would be unacceptable differences?
No, and I agree with your interpretation of Homura. But here's the thing. Rebellion absolutely does deal with dualism. It's ever-present in themes and symbolism. BUT - it also rejects dualism, precisely for the reasons you stated. And as most things in the movie, it's not exactly spelled out, which is why, as you mentioned, some people misinterpret it.

>I'm looking forward to my next rewatch, what will I see then?

Keep an eye out for the appearances of a roll of pink thread, I suppose ? If you haven't noticed them already.

I have seen the spool in previous watches already that's why it is not listed.
However, I am very uncertain about its meaning, espacially when it merges with Homura's soul.

Madokafags are fucking cute.
youtube.com/watch?v=WtWnYhyF2yY
Almost made me cry

I found out about the chairs in my last watch.

The Bokurano chairs in Episode 11?
I don't know the chairs in Rebellion

>one of the most important anime movies of all time referenced some shitty obscure anime
>doesn't reference any other anime though
Nice meme, ever heard of 'Pareidolia'?

The dualism throughout the anime and rebellion is not only hope and despair, but also selfishness and selflessness. The series presents that things are not so black and white nor mutually exclusive, and that things can be both, even someone who seems as purely altruistic as Madoka. Homura's fateful decision at the end of the movie is the ultimate example of this. Black and white morality is woefully inept at explaining Homura's actions there.

Yeah. They represent peer pressure and feelings of obligation to others.

>exactly the same chairs 1 to 1
>pareidolia
Also
>doesn't reference any other anime though
What?!?
It also references Eva, Tutu, MLA, Fate/Zero, Saya no Uta, Card Captor Sakura, Devilman and Kannazuki no Miko, and that are only the really obvious ones from the top of my head.

I agree with everything said in this post.
I guess its mostly semantics that I have a problem with.
Like,
>not only hope and despair, but also selfishness and selflessness
100% true.

I guess I mostly have a problem with dualism in the Christian sense of God and the Devil.

That could be just justified in-universe as Homura worshipping Madoka but hating herself.
Meta wise, it's just propping how they're seemingly different but still reconcilable.

>hating herself.
That's, for example, a thing I don't get at all.
Why do you people think that Homura hates herself?
I mean, sure she is brooding, and she is damaged and hurt, but that does not make her hate herself.

>I guess I mostly have a problem with dualism in the Christian sense of God and the Devil.
Why? If I look at the story objectively, I don't find it black and white at all. Was Devil really in the wrong? I, for one, don't think so. And, unlike the Bible, Madoka Magica is not preaching what's right or wrong.

Oh, I don't know. This whole scene.

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Made dame yo is a cryptic reference to Inception.
Think about it: It's a dream of a god within a dream within a soul gem of a magical girl who got trapped by aliens from another dimension

And along with the fact that she won't let herself be happy with Madoka despite there being no problem in doing so.

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Not him, but that was before she kidnapped Madoka. She may very well hate herself in the epilogue, but it's far from certain. She's very conflicted - that much is clear.

Homura is frustrated with the world, that's what this scene is about. And she is despairing about the impossibility of saving Madoka.
But why would you hate yourself over something like that?

Where is the connection?
There is no reason for her to hate herself over.
Like, most characters who hate themselves hate themselves over a flaw or a mistake.
What would that be exactly?

I can see the argument for her hating herself over pulling Madoka down from heaven - but never ever before that. And even that is questionable.

>despite there being no problem in doing so.
No, that is not how it works.

>I can see the argument for her hating herself over pulling Madoka down from heaven - but never ever before that
She hated herself for allowing Madoka to become a god.

Or maybe "hate" is not the right word. But she certainly despaired over it - and, of course, ultimately witched out.

>but never ever before that
How about failing countless times to save the one thing she cares about in this world?
Or for thinking she defiled what was the good and pure intentions and wish of Madoka?

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Forget the second part i had a brain fart and forgot you said before

In Homura's eyes, "God" is perfect and good. Homura is not. Homura loves "God" to the point of contempt for herself.

>witched out.
What? Homura witched out because QB would otherwise influence Madoka.
Or do you mean before Rebellion even happens?
Well Homura just drained her battery somehow, she had no purpose left in the world, so it's understandable that she would despair over it.

>failing countless times to save the one thing she cares about
Why would you hate yourself over this?
Like, sure, imagine you do your best and fail, but then you stand back up and try again, and again, and again...
People who hate themselves over failing like that are defeatists.
Homura is the theoretical extreme polar opposite of that.
Do you think someone who gets up, again and again, hates himself?

I don't even think that Homura thinks that Madoka is necessarily perfect. She just loves her.

>Why would you hate yourself over this?
Perhaps because it's the one purpose you dedicate your life to and you suck at it?

>People who hate themselves over failing like that are defeatists.
False equivalency. You can hate yourself for failing yet keep trying anyways.

>What? Homura witched out because QB would otherwise influence Madoka.
She started witching out before she was put into the isolation field. How the hell do you think she created the barrier inside her soul gem?
>Well Homura just drained her battery somehow
That's just your headcanon. She witched out because of her grief for failing to save Madoka.
>that she would despair over it
And here you're contradicting your previous statement about her "battery".

Homura deifies Madoka more than anyone else. It's she herself who suggests that she should be called the Devil for opposing God. She likely thinks Madoka is flawless, other than being maybe "too kind".

If you love someone as much as Homura loves Madoka (which is impossible, of course), there is no such word as a "flaw".

Well, that's retarded.
If you fail and then get back up, then you are angry with yourself, but you don't hate yourself.
Otherwise, every single person on planet earth would hate themselves to death.

semantics
She thinks she's a piece of garbage for being a waste.
You get the fucking idea, user.

This Homura does not think Madoka is perfect. She loves everything about her, so it does not matter what flaws she might have. But that does not mean that she is unaware of them.
Otherwise, she would tell Madoka to her face that she pulled her down from heaven - because a flawless person would understand that, right?

Why are you trying to argue dishonestly with me, if you perfectly understand what I meant?

>a waste
of what?

You are talking about someone who went through hell and improved themselves to the best possible version of themselves.
Homura knows her own positive qualities.
She is not fucking Shinji.

>dishonestly
Unaware of doing that. You said
>Well Homura just drained her battery somehow
which is clearly not the case. Maybe it would help if you explained yourself clearly instead of getting offended.

!akemi by my command spell i summon thee

Well "rained her battery somehow" probably by "despair over no purpose left in the world".
And
>headcanon
There is no canon available - not even the wraith arc manga shit goes into it.

This guy is so fucking dense. I'm done.

>she went through hell to improve herself
and yet she's still failing
and now she's finding excuses to still say she failed
in the beginning, she thought she was a useless in the beginning
then she thought she was a ueseless failure
now she's a terrible person for defiling god and still a failure (though to a lesser degree)
Even her familiars reflect how she feels about herself. Look them up.
she doesn't think she deserves happiness
You cannot be this ignorant.

Homura hates herself because she let herself believe that Madoka was truly happy about becoming god and stuff, after talking with madoka she realized the truth
In the end madoka and homura are pretty much the same, they both would rather suffer themselves than let someone else suffer, the problem is that this kind of sacrifice in itself would make the other person suffer.so there no perfect solution

>Even her familiars reflect how she feels about herself. Look them up
Yes, back to you.
Look
them
up.
And then actually read them.

Replace "hates herself" with "was shocked" and then I agree with everything.
Hating yourself is a very strong term, it's really not something to throw around lightly.
Like, OH, I did this, now I HATE MYSELF.
Or OH, I messed up, now I HATE MYSELF.

If that was how humans worked, then you would mess up 2-3 times, and then you would kill yourself.

Well, Homura specifically despaired over not being able to save Madoka from fate worse than death - that much is told during their space hug. Sure, Madoka seemingly convinced her that it's okay, but imo as the flower scene implied, deep down Homura knew all along that it was a lie.

Very tragic, it makes me sad just to write about it desu.
>wraith arc manga
That's fine, because none of the manga are canon or even worth discussing.

I know what I'm talking about. I don't know what freakish interpretation you're using, but it's clearly fucking wrong.

You just know they did it in one of the timelines.

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I had a feeling you'd fixate on that. Now I know you have no argument.

>tries to "bait" once
>no one replies
>keeps trying harder and harder
>will delude himself into thinking anyone who replies at all is "baited"
This is what you call pathetic.

>2-3 times
Try messing dozens and dozens of times, and those mistakes always result in the person you love dying.
Now add that on top of an already sad person.

For most people i would agree that hating themselves for that would be too extreme but Homura spent 100+ years with nothing but madoka's happiness as her drive to keep on going so an extreme reaction like that is to be expected

You fags brought up the familiars. There is no better resource to decide what Homura thinks about herself than that.
Everything else is under the bottom line just going to be opinions and interpretations.
So, let's get over the 15 familiars.
Do you agree that the 15 familiars represent the flaws that Homura sees in herself? No?

You're almost there user... next rewatch you'll notice the lizard, and it will all make sense...

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Your boogieman will never be real, and you will forever be a mindless pathetic retard.

I think there's a case to be made that while Homura's love of Madoka started as friendly or romantice, take your pick love, it grew along with her obsession and eventually turned into worship, or a love of god. I'm not sure Homura at the end of Rebellion could possibly see any real flaws in Madoka. Hell, I'm not even sure she sees Madoka as a person at that point.

>Hell, I'm not even sure she sees Madoka as a person at that point.
She likely sees Madoka as an ideal rather than a human being with real flaws. I think Homura barely even knew Madoka in the first place.

What do they mean by this?

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>I think Homura barely even knew Madoka in the first place.
I wouldn't go that far. Maybe she didn't know her particularly well in the first loop, but by the last loop she'd spent years and years repeating the process of getting to know and getting to be closer to Madoka. It's likely she eventually got to know her pretty well.
This is purely headcanon, but what if Homura would change her interactions with Madoka in the earlier loops in order to get to see different sides of her and get to know her better?

oh, pleb.
Madoka is hesitating because she does not remember.
But her friends are there for her, so Mami comes from behind and pushes her to action.
It's like a reverse trust fall.
It means that Madoka can rely on her friends.
It's not hard and not that deep, and obvious to everyone.

>It's likely she eventually got to know her pretty well.
Not even close. For every loop after the 3rd, she's protected Madoka from a distance, not becoming close to her at all. In the breakdown scene by the fountain in episode 7 or 8 (i don't remember), she has no idea why Madoka repeatedly tries to sacrifice herself. She doesn't know what makes Madoka tick, yet we the viewer do.

>100+ years
Homura is canonically 22 years old. Not 100+ years

26, if my math is correct
She's done about 100 loops that are 45 days long

>8 years
>people still get into heated arguments about Madoka Magica

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That's how good it is

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That's how you know it's good.

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2519: Future Historians finally solve Rebellion, it reveals the secret to the meaning of life and allows Humanity to transcend the physical plane

Will the MagiReco Anime surpass Rebellion?

No.

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"If you think you understand Rebellion, you don't understand Rebellion."

Attached: Richard_Feynman.jpg (220x311, 13K)

Obviously not, how could you even ask.
Madokami and Homucifer NOT Iroha and gachashit okay
Madoka bless

Yes

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whats the name
of that spectral theory dude from cali

>pleases old men for

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Max Stirner

We interrupt this Rebellion thread to bring you new Madoka animated scenes by SHAFT.
youtube.com/channel/UCTZ4nEiebnr47o2Rf8VAWFw/videos
youtube.com/watch?v=58GTOPVuris

It already has.

oh goodness the VA on that hooded pink girl isn't good

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Don't insult Mocho!

brb you need to get impregnated

oops wrong guy haha my bed

>For every loop after the 3rd, she's protected Madoka from a distance
Granted, it's been a while since my last rewatch, but I don't think that explicitly stated in the anime. Obviously since by the end of episode 10 the show was in its climax and they couldn't simply cut to a regular SoL scene with Madoka and Homura at a coffee place or something, but I don't think it was ever implied that nothing like that happened in any of the loops.
>She doesn't know what makes Madoka tick, yet we the viewer do.
I took that more as a cry of despair over Madoka's repeated sacrifice rather than an actual question. I think she fully knows what makes Madoka tick, she just refuses to accept it and let her sacrifice herself.

Scenes like Madoka getting coffee with Homu to request her help probably happened, but they probably never became actual friends again.

This. Even in the final timeline she still got very close to Madoka eventually. Homura knew Madoka better than Madoka did.

more like she knew every possible outcome so that strengthened her resolved to rectify the entire situation

No they fucking didn't.
Their terms went from complete strangers to comfortable acquaintances, but they were not close.

>brb gonna jog out into a fucking hurricane to save my comfortable acquaintance from an eldritch horror by sacrificing myself in the process

Here is a thought: Homura actually likes Kyouko more than Madoka.
She just got stuck up on her because of the first timelines.
Forget the memes.
They have a much better chemistry tbqh.

>Implying she went out there just to save Homura
Fucking idiot
Homura was out there busting her ass to save Madoka's life, and Madoka appreciated it. Madoka still didn't know who Homura was at the time. Only after Madoka got her memories back did she realize how much Homura meant to her. She took her ass out in that destruction because she was trying to save everyone, not just Homura.

You guys are forgetting one major thing. Madoka herself, when she became a goddess, told Homura that she now realized that she was her best friend. And remember, Madoka now knew everything from every timeline. I don't think she would call Homura her best friend if she felt that Homura didn't know her at all. They may never have gotten to "best friends" status in any particular loop, but they got close enough over the total of them that Madokami considers her her best friend.

I love this game.

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>shipping cancer retardation
>saying the word "chemistry" and "tbph"
This is the level of person you are.

>Fucking idiot
No better way to declare that you have no actual argument than by starting your sentence with namecalling.

You can be close with someone and know how they operate, but still not fully know why they operate the way they do.

My apologies. Please read the rest of my post. I'll refrain from insulting you at the start of my post on this mongolian basket weaving forum.

>you have no actual argument
Way to project. I don't see an argument coming from you, user.

The most important question is, did Homura ever get to tap that?

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Can't counter-ague a non-argument.

No.

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>falacy falacy
And we have a loser, folks! You're out!

Changing your file names manually does not make you look like a new person. Because it's not impossible to change your file names on purpose. So you are obviously faking it.

I still don't see you adressing his points.

Why do you think it has taken them so many loops? I know I would take my sweet time if it means being able to taste her cute and beautiful self in her prime for so many years... As a matter of fact, I don't even know why Homura "gave up."

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>Homura got to fuck 14 year old pussy for 12 years
No wonder she restored Madoka back to her schoolgirl self when she had the chance

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>yurifag enters thread
>it dies
pottery

I like this thread.

Reminder

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Madoka should her soul to save a cat.

Episode 12, mang.

sold*

>power levels
>homura pwned witches casually thousands of times despite inferior stats
yeah whatever

Good thread user. Rebellion is an amazing movie.

Just think of what the MagiReco Anime will do to the Madoka Fanbase when it airs.

I would've absolutely taken a couple loops off to enjoy myself if I had all the time in the world

Witches are different than magical girls.

She wished that she could go back in time and save Madoka so if she took a timeline off she might now be able to travel no more.

Why not?

Simple summary for part 3 of chapter 10:

Iroha made a wish to let the dying Ui recover. Touka on the other hand learn of PMs from a book written by her uncle. The girls get caught up one day in a witch barrier and witness Iroha hunting witches and sees QB as described in her uncle's book.

QB approached Touka for contract, and the latter tried to hack QB for info, but Earth tech is too weak to understand the complicated QB network and the attempt fails. Touka gets info from QB using the good old Q&A instead.

She shared what she learnt with Ui and Nemu whom are all horrified with what will eventually happen to Iroha. Ui especially since she sees her sister exhausted ever since she recovered back to health. They all wanted to ensure Iroha survives, so Touka shares with them her plan:

They all contract to become PMs and take take away each component of QB's function, Ui taking away the ability to convert malice, Touka to transform malice to energy and Nemu materialization. They will form the cycle and pass the energy to the universe as well, ensuring no witches, happy PM while keeping the universe alive. At the same time, they can recover from their condition and the 4 can tour Kamihama as they like.

QB is surprised by their wish, but warns them that they might lack the causality to power their wish. The trio decides to gamble for their sister and for themselves, and QB is reduced to an empty shell and took the form of little QB.

Unfortunately, the power is too much for Ui and she gets corrupted really quickly as she absorbs malice from around the world. Touka cannot transform the malice fast enough and is close to corruption, and Nemu is unable to materialize stuff to use the energy. Alina who happens to be lured by the malice (knew Ui and Touka by chance) cast a barrier since she do not know what is happening.

The only way to save Ui is to hide her existence in an empty shell, and this is where little QB comes to play.

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retains all abilities + enhanced
and a reality marble

While Touka and Nemu fear of the unknown if Ui's existence is removed, they fear even more of her death and corruption into a witch, so they seal her inside small QB while her original body becomes Eve.

Without Ui, the world starts to fill in the blanks themselves, and the plan to save Iroha and PMs gets perverted by Alina's desire to create chaos to get more of people's negative emotions of her art, while losing the Tamaki sisters' positive influence turned Touka and Nemu into selfish brats and twist their wish into the lines of Alina.

The key to restoring Ui and their memories is to have one who has Ui's existence carved into her deep into the soul (Iroha) and little QB come into physical contact with Ui, and this is what happen this chapter.

As Yachiyo and the rest are still down though conscious from Eve's malice beam, Iroha shoots herself to the gem which is trapping Ui. She and Little QB coming into contact with Ui restore Touka and Nemu's memories, and they three teamed up to free Ui from Eve.

The succeed, and Ui is awoken. She notes that she knows what has happened since it was like a nightmare. While Touka and Nemu apologize, they did not regret of the plan to try save Iroha and PMs, though they regret on how it eventually became as Ui gets comatose and the city and other PMs are also caught in the mess.

The sisters understood they did whatever they could back then, and they all agreed that before pointing fingers, dealing with The Night that is coming is top priority. Eve is down for now since it lost her operator.

Most likely Alina will fuse with Eve for the final showdown since she is the most messed up one.

youtube.com/watch?v=58GTOPVuris

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Because it would be against her wish. Even if that’s not the case if I was Homura I would never even take that chance because if it was the case she’d fail with no going back.

No she doesn't. She's a good girl who just wants to be loved. She needs to be loved by Ria.

Given that half the fun of Madoka was the Speculah and not knowing how the series was going to unfold, how will MagiReco, where we know everything that's going to happen, be able to hold the same level of attention and grip?

We honestly have no clue. It’s popular to hate it right now but a lot of people don’t remember Madoka wasn’t supposed to be that good either. It was supposed to be a typical magical girl sol anime. Look at some of the first previews for the show. There’s no telling if they’re pulling the same thing again and pulling a trick at the last second.

There was some people who knew it was going to be good when they heard who was working on it but I don’t think anybody expected THAT.

>posts bait powerlevel image
>someone takes it
every time

Except we know Magireco's story isn't good. Madoka Magica was an original story, so nobody knew what would happen.

What do you mean “we” know that?

As in everyone.
Everyone either knows it's not good or is in denial.

I certainly don’t know anything about it besides Mami is evil.

You don't even play the game.
You just copy and paste what you see other people say in the /vg/ thread and repost it here to pretend you have an "excuse" to make yourself known and post shipping cancer.

I think it's good. Do you want my player code?

Time stop and infinite weapon cache are broken as hell. Homura just has OP main character powers, she could be a total weakling but still survive because the story needs her.

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>tfw she had to collect these weapons unlike mami that can make weapons out of nothing
damn

Yeah but Mami makes lame single-shot weapons

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I guess so. The point is that Homura may be weaker, but she has time stop and can conveniently steal weapons or make bombs that are just as powerful as any magic.

Mami had to learn to make that old one-shot musket weapon she uses, likely because it takes little magic power.

smug
both enhance the existing weapons with magic but mami has the edge on str and agility
and her ribbons are hard to rip

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Madoka has the most raw power in all the timelines. Other girls need not apply.

Even if the game's story is shit, keep in mind that Shaft has a record of fucking with the source material and doing something completely unexpected (Negima, Fate) plus some other gacha game adaptations have an original story so there is at least a tiny chance it could turn out good, especially since it is their IP.

Her eating is essentially a form of mental self-medication. Remember that her backstory involves being poor and constantly starving. For her food is an ultimate goal, something that makes her feel safe and in control. If she's anxious, she can eat and feel like her problems aren't so bad for a while.

Nice points OP. This one guy actually gave a whole lecture where he referenced a lot of this.

youtu.be/-udm4U2fLL0
the guy is me and I love discussing this movie too fucking much

I think these are both valid but I think another interpretation (although a less contextualized one) is in combination of the general metaphor of Kyubey representing someone bad like a drug dealer who got naive people into a lifestyle they can't get out anymore, the food being a symbol of still being addicted, or rather bound to the choice they made. Still makes sense for her being able to stop now that she's happier like in OPs argument.

Kinda hard to call them lame and then post the coolest action sakuga in the series

Interesting, I watched some of it. How many people sat through your panel? It's funny that Madoka and Rebellion are still discussed to this day.

I'd say it was somewhere around 75-100 people. The room was pretty big surprisingly.

Also, before I'm rightly accused of confaggotry, I promise you I'd be saging these posts if I could.

Madoka Miki
Kyousuke Miki

That's pretty good, user. Though I disagree a little with your analysis on the stinger.
I don't think Madoka was literally split in half, like there is now a God Madoka and a normal Madoka at the same time now, but Madoka was just taken from the LoC. Like God is made up of two parts: Madoka the person and the LoC the law of nature. Homura took Madoka out of God, so now it's just the LoC.
I think it's more symbolizing that despite Homura having Madoka with her now, she still isn't close to her. Homura and Madoka aren't friends in Homura's universe. That's why I think the moon/world is sheered in half; Madoka is still missing from her life.

No

This is pretty good, I don't agree with all of it but a lot is very insightful and it's nice hearing somebody analyze the movie while remaining grounded in reality instead of being full-on schizoposting.

What about the time she spent in frozen time?

We have no way of knowing how much time she spent during frozen time.

>homuhomu is a pedo virgin obsessively fixated on the first person who showed her kindness, a 14 year old girl
makes sense

To be fair, that girl is Kaname fucking Madoka.

>tfw friend saw all my Madoka figs and is convinced I'm a pedophile now
They just don't understand

Tell them it's actually hebephilia

I'm sure that'll make it all okay

I just tell myself that she'd by my age if she were to age since the show aired so it's all okay

That's what I'm trying

Why are you obsessed with yurifags?

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I almost missed it

>not watching Rebellion at 0.32x playback speed

Thanks, I am going to watch that. It's amazing that someone does this! You are doing gods work, mate!

The good thing about Madoka is that Madoka is Madoka.
As soon as we see the Opening for MagiReco we will instantly know if it is going to be good or not.

Madoka's 3 Openings are all tragic.

"I will never forget the promise we made"

"The hope summoned pursued us and surpassed the world"

"The heart of mine you touched shined, becoming a brilliant color
So I took flight, carrying my hopes on my back,
And assembled them underneath the sky that extends forever
If you go on protecting those wishes
You can go on to a tomorrow no one knows"

And the imagery is beyond amazing. In all of them.

Compare that to this:
youtube.com/watch?v=GsD8ZUgas_k
There is nothing. Nothing. In the imagery, it beyond generic.

"I regret being scared until now, I'm giving that up...
and becoming my true self. Let's smile together.
You're not weak. You're not weak. You're not weak at all!"

This is a story about, overcoming your own weakness.
WOW.

Connect and Colorful are unironically declarations of Homura's will to power.
"I will"
"I take flight"

That's not even the same category. It is so many magnitudes apart, that it is instantly obvious to everyone.

Nanami Family or JS Wives?

TrySail and Kalafina are both good. I think the Reco anime will be great.

>comically missing the point
Neither writes their own lyrics.

If YuYuYu is Walmart Madoka, MagiReco will be Aliexpress Madoka.

A revolutionary new brand of Madoka?

Sounds good to me. MagiReco really is bringing it all back.

We all know you gachashitters have incredibly low standards.

I just grew to like the story. It's a great addition to the Madoka series.

I just don't understand how someone could think that THAT is an addition to Madoka. TO MADOKA.

All I know is when the it finally starts airing, I'm gonna completely disappear from here. Sure I'll probably have a blast viewing it and watching fags suffer mental breakdowns after seeing there sacred cow being "ruined", but it's gonna be bad.

It's going to be like with StarWars.
People are just denying the Disney canon.
And so will it be with Magi Reco, its just not canon, like those fucking manga with wraith arc and shits.

It's a canon alternate universe.

I enjoy the game and the main story and I'll be here to enjoy it.

Fate/Kaleid is also a canon alternative universe.
If its going to be Madoka/Kaleid
Or Shaft Carnival Phantasm, then it's not THAT bad desu~

It doesn't need to be that. It can be MagiReco.

It already is.

And that's why it's great. It is MagiReco.

>I enjoy the game and the main story and I'll be here to enjoy it.
I'm glad you let us know several times in every thread how you will enjoy it.

I don't understand the intention of these caps.

That's because you don't understand Rebellion.

Don't the 19 familiars of hers each represent something she hates about herself?

Always of service.

There is literally a scene where where she's ironically monologue-ing about how much the creator of that world is a traitor to Madoka. The reason why she realizes something is wrong is because she goes
>Wait a second, I'm happy. That can't be right. I'm only allowed to be miserable.
Her Witch form is just her being dragged off to be executed over and over.
She styles herself as the devil at the end because she can't rationalize her opposition to Madoka as anything besides pure evil.

Homura has issues, man.

They are not purely negative.
Among them are Pride and Love.
Also, you have an army of tin soldiers that represent duty.
And Teeth with a hardness of 10 representing her will power.
Also, with herself has arms on the back that try to pull her back from getting to the execution, representing Homura's desire to live.

The whole thing together does not represent Homura's "opinion about herself", it represents her character as a whole.

And if you ACTUALLY read the Chara dolls, the following things are listed:
Laziness and Cowardice.
in HOMURA.
Whatever the argument, Homura does not see herself as lazy and cowardly, because that's just not true.
Those are her normal human emotions that she also has as normal humans do.
And it explicitly states that the "tin soldiers ignore them".
Nowhere is it said that "those are the things she hates about herself", it just does not fit.

>monologue-ing about how much the creator of that world is a traitor to Madoka
BEFORE THE FLOWER SCENE

So I just watched a Magia record explained video and they went into details on the story and how the anime will start and what will might and might not take place. I don’t get the memes of people saying the story is going to be bad. It seems amazing. This anime is probably going to be really really good all things considered from what I just heard. It almost makes me think the nay sayers are false flaggers or people turning down the series from the start because it’s not Madoka s2 or a sequel to Rebellion.

Attached: 65832F80-99F8-4CFA-B694-9366A34F4A96.png (1280x720, 1.22M)

2/2
I’m not saying it’s going to be as good or better than the original but you’ve to to remember. A series doesn’t need to be an all time greatest anime of all time to be good.

>A series doesn’t need to be an all time greatest anime of all time to be good.
And that is exactly the problem.

Madoka right now is unironically with a huge margin the greatest anime of all time.
Or at least that is my and a lot of other Madokafags opinions about it.

And because of, anything that is not "greatest of all time", WILL desecrate Madoka. It's that simple.
Like, how would you react if some modern artist decided to "add" something to the Monalisa? I would probably join the massive riot that would form in the streets.

And because of that*

This, anything other than GOAT is a comedown.

No one understands Rebellion. The first step to understanding Rebellion is to admit that you don't understand it. To understand Rebellion you would need to understand Homura's feelings, which is literally impossible.
>Madoka right now is unironically with a huge margin the greatest anime of all time.
This. Nothing comes even close. Know what? I'm going to go ahead and say that Rebellion is the greatest movie of all time.

Attached: mpv-shot0003.jpg (1920x1080, 565K)

I’m not trying to brag but I understand Homura.

I understand Sayaka.

Attached: sayaka sip6.jpg (316x397, 112K)

Magireco shiller needs to fuck off and go back to his own thread.

Ok, and I understand quantum mechanics
>I'm going to go ahead and say that Rebellion is the greatest movie of all time.
agreed.

And you don't seem to understand...
youtube.com/watch?v=yO4myLCfN-Y

Then you don't even understand what you don't understand.

Attached: mpv-shot0004.jpg (1920x1080, 360K)

Anyway, who's the dude lying on the left?

NAKAZAWA-KUN

Attached: 43797970.png (1060x1280, 733K)

Ah, right, that one. But how the hell did he end up in the barrier?

The same as everyone else? He 8 the b8

No, everyone else is an important character in the story, while he's a literal who.

Every single morning of every single loop that idiot teacher would say some stupid thing and shout HAI, NAKAZAWA-KUN?!
I imagine it made an impression. Also he sat next to her.

Hey! She’s not an idiot!

Poorfag-chan is also there

It's been forever since I've rewatched it so I might forget a few things, but:
1. It was seen floating aimlessly and lost throughout the movie the more surreal scenes.
2. It was obtained by Homura in the end, and she transformed it into her Dark Orb after she consumed her own Soul Gem.

Something that was lost throughout most of the movie but fell into Homura's hands in the end, likely taken from Madoka.

It's likely the piece of Madoka's memories that ties her to the original timeline. Without it there is no link between her and the wish that made her a god. Recognizing that she is able to isolate and remove this part in her barrier where most of the movie happens, Homura removes it again from Madoka at the end and seals it away. This is the fragment of the Law of Cycles she mentions taking when Sayaka accuses her.

Since this is literally part of Madoka, Homura dancing with the Dark Orb at the end is really her playing with a substitute of Madoka that consists of their treasured memories.

Homura crushing her corrupted Soul Gem and creating the Dark Orb from the spool may be symbolic of her destroying what's left of the core of her old self in favor of her obsessive love for Madoka, making this love the new 'core' of her being.

Interesting.
This youtube.com/watch?v=cECj6R-B410
has the spool as a reference to Freudian psychology.

I personally like to think that the spool represents spun up threads of fate, aka magic potential.

As I said, I am very very much not certain about it.

I think it's the thread of fate. In her victory, she finally takes fate into her own hands. I don't think we're meant to take the spool becoming the orb literally, though.

Do you think Urobuchi is using the taiwanese puppets to cope with the fact that he will never write another masterpiece that will be endlessly discussed even a decade later?

They’re probably waiting to see how well this anime sell before they ask him to do Rebellion part two.

What anime? Surely you don't mean Magica/Extra: Last Pebble, do you?

This thread gives me hope that when a real Madoka Sequel comes we'll go back to 2011 again.
But it also gives me great despair because there's too many newfags who don't know the madoka thread tradition now.

That gachashit anime is going to suck.

She at the very least has some sort of mental problem.
She is cute though.

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>when
More like " if ". I don't think we'll ever get a sequel. And maybe it's for the best.

The gachashit is DOA, just like Fate/Extra.

It's one of 4 things, ordered by best to worst.

1. Shaft carnival phantasm
2. Madoka/Kaleid
3. Madoka/Extra
4. Secretly a sequel to Rebellion, hahaha gachashit actually takes place in Homura's barrier ha ha hahahahahahahaahhahahah aaha hhaha hahahahaaaa AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>1. Shaft carnival phantasm
Only as long as it's a crossover with Hiadamaris. I don't want my Megucas to interact with Gatarishit.
>2. Madoka/Kaleid
That would be alright if kept purely SoL. The moment they introduce story it'll go to shit, just like Kaleid.
>4.
I'd declare jihad in the name of Madoka against Shaft.

>Hiadamaris
Hidamaris*

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Behead those who insult Madoka!!!

In that case we'd be beheading Shaft for making MagiReco.

>be Homura
>loop 87
>fuck it, I'm going to take to loop off
>kills Mami and Sayaka with a time stop ambush shots to the soul gem, fucks Madoka, and spends the rest of the loop getting high on apples and sticks with Kyouko.
>later
>loop 100
>Madoka becomes God
>I remember all the time you kept fighting, just for me... and that one time you raped me, you Monster.
Do it once, lose your soul forever, you never recover from a Genocide Run

They have to be careful with it.
We have a lot of insane people on Madok/a/ if Shaft desecrates it, then they are unironically in big trouble.
There is honestly a good chance that someone will shoot up the studio desu~

Shit I didn't think of that. Would Madoka really hold that against her if it was only once?

Gatariniggers are already in MagiReco, so don't be too surprised if that happens.

I only have a pistol but I'll do my best guys, I promise

>implying Madoka wouldn't find it at least a little bit hot

It depends on what she does.
If she just kills Mami, Sayaka, and Madoka cleanly, and then goes off to get high with Kyouko, just once, then Madoka would probably forgive her because its a calculated effort. And if the alternative is that Homura breaks down and lets Madoka die forever, then it's just rational.
If it's actually something that traumatizes her like raping her, then no.

Shaft has branded Type 88 Surface-to-Ship missiles so that might not be enough

Please spare Ume.

How do you get that to Japan?
Besides, if you are American, then you can just get an AR-15 at Wallmart.

I don't agree with you that it's the greatest movie of all time as I see the themes expressed in madoka (Love being frankly the only one) as very naive and childish in terms of analysis. Most of the highest critically acclaimed movies of the 21st century explain a bigger more complex analysis than that shown in Madoka. (Plus saying that Rebellion is better than any Kubrick film is a fucking disgenuine opinion). Even literature by late 18th century and post-war Japanese writers contain a more in-depth analysis of love for than anything of Rebellion. By nature anime is very easy to digest and easy to invoke and analyse so I can understand the hyperbolic nature of deeming it the best piece of entertainment conceived but humbly I find it a good step towards more maturity in the medium not much else.

Madokahu Akbar!
>4.
Madoka is unironically a Religion at this point, if they did that, then it's like that movie about Prophet Mohammed, that got Muslims riled up and kill the Americans at Benghazi

>To understand Rebellion you would need to understand Homura's feelings, which is literally impossible.

This statement is also false. It's not impossible to understand Homura's feelings. It's called unconditional love it's a fantasy that all human's go through. What Homura expresses to Madoka is very selfish, childish, and narcissist but it's human at the end of the day. What you're doing right now in saying this statement is for example an unconditional/selfish love towards the movie and thus you're experiencing the same thing as Homura towards Madoka. Congrats you're achieved the impossible faggot.

Well, Madoka will get her virginity back once Homura resets so it shouldn't be a big deal

Can't lose virginity in a yurisex.

Can you lose your virginity to tentacles? Are tentacles pure?

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>this statement is false
>proceeds to back it up by his shitty opinion masqueraded as a factual analysis for that sweet pretence of credibility
Alright, pseud-kun.

Tarkovskij>Kubrick

Madoka Miki
Kuro Akemi
Mami Nanami
Kyoko Azusa

>shitty opinion
>factual analysis
Something can't be an opinion if it's factual you fucking dumb nigger.
>Tarkovskij>Kubrick
Okay faggot. let's do this then because I also like Tarkovskij work alot.
Tarkovskij>Kubrick>(Power Gap of 10,000 niggers)>Urobochi

The Gacha anime is going to be great. I can feel it.

>Kubrick film
>Love beeing frankly the only one
Oh, then did you understand that Rebellions Ending portrays the same thing as 2001 a space odyssey - just arguably better?
Namely an existential triumph over the world itself.

Rebellion has may themes, but some of the biggest are:
Moral Nihilism(selfishness vs selflessness, and the personal moralities of all characters against each other),
Surrealism and Existential Nihilism(the fact that no one questions surreal elements in the world, until they recognize them, the value of the truth and of values apriori vs happiness).
Cosmic Nihilism,
Absurdism, as Homura faces the same things again and again, and this gives rise to her love for Madoka(which is a mix out of amour fati and agape, and I do not really understand it) until she embraces her absurd existence and overcomes the world,
Dualism,
Hope,
Will to Power,
Justice,
And may more and ALL in context to each other.

And some of it is debatable, and some of it is not clear cut. But there are a lot of themes here.
The fact that you think that it is "(Love being frankly the only one)" is YOUR problem, not the movies.
You did not get it, you don't even know how much you don't know.
And then you go on to spout about "Oh, the 18th century", "Oh, Kubrick", without even having the balls to name explicit examples PATHETIC.
I have never seen a more obvious pseud then you.
Go and watch Digibro.

I would not mind if the addition was good which is exactly what MagiReco is.

I'm sure this guy would

Eh, you think SHAFT care about what Yea Forums thinks? They are already having lots of fun with Madoka and taking in the dash considering how often they tweet about the game for special occasions.

You are never "triggering" anyone.
You are especially not "triggering" anyone by making it blatantly obvious you're from tumblr.
That retarded "xdd lol they married have last name lol!!!!" is something that literally only "people" on tumblr do.

Homura is going to break Madoka's hymen by fucking her with her favorite sidearm

See I believe in SHAFT. They have enough money to hire guards.

>Something can't be an opinion if it's factual you fucking dumb nigger.
I said "masqueraded", you actual illiterate.

You literally cannot understand Homura, because you did not spend decades in a timeloop seeing your only loved one die time and again. Homura spelled it out for you

No this is all hyperbolizing of themes not created in the movie. This is all just idealic instead of the tangibility that atleast Kubrick showed through cinematography. Atleast if you don't want to believe me or atleast what I'm saying then go ahead and see an academic database or even literature published on the subjects behind Kubrick's work and then claim all your points here are greater processed in Rebellion than in any of Kubrick's films. What matters at the end of the day is the impact of the movies in respect to their medium's over time and I'm pretty sure that Kubrick is gonna win in the long run faggot. If you want to continue being disgenuine towards established work then be just like Homura does in YOUR favorite movie, a childish naive little girl.

She will also take Meiyu, Natsuki, Kuro and Ria's virginity.

If that happens, then ACK is unironically going to shoot up shaft, so they should be beware

>underestimating autism

These threads will never go back to 2011 because of one madman who gave up everything to go on a delusional crusade. All you have to do is post say SayaHomu and the thread is hell.

Unironically, at the rate it is going, real Madoka threads will be on those other boards.

So what? What makes Homura action of time looping claim that her emotion of unconditional love is different than what is known by any human? You haven't explained. Also if it's not possible for anyone to fucking understand Homura then how the fuck did even Urobochi write her in the first place. I don't understand. How can an impossible to conceive character with impossible to conveince emotions be conceived in the first place? I would love to hear your excuse.

Homura's love is a mix of amour fati and agape.

You are replying to your own post, and like always you are trying insanely hard to pretend you "trigger" people. Because this is all you have in your life.

>No this is all hyperbolizing of themes not created in the movie
>they don't exist because I say so
Not very convincing argument.
>how the fuck did even Urobochi write her in the first place
Author's intent is irrelevant. Ever heard about the 1000 monkeys with 1000 typewriters thought experiment?

>Homura's love is a mix of amour fati and agape.
This is a good way to understand and conceive the love of Homura yes. Thanks for this.

>this bullshit again

>Also if it's not possible for anyone to fucking understand Homura then how the fuck did even Urobochi write her in the first place
hahahahaha, this takes the cake.
You have just proven yourself to have no idea what you are talking about.
user, Stanely Kubrick said that he does not understand the end of 2001.
Many artists don't understand their own art.
Do you really think all art is intentional?
Nietzsche deliberately wrote the end of Zarathustra as a metaphor, because he himself does not understand what an Übermensch would look like.
Homura IS that Übermensch, no one knows how something like this could be created.
But that is what is portrayed there.

>1000 monkeys
wrong argument. It is mostly subconscious.

>I don't understand
This is the only true statement you said in this thread.

They’re pure!

>this pretentious faggot who overblows the quality of Rebellion misinterprets every piece of symbolism fills the thread with his autism
I think I know why people don't like this fanbase now.

>I don't understand
was from
again

>big tits
disgusting

Do you mean OP?
I think he made some good points

>Not very convincing argument.
Then you misread my argument I claim that all your examples of false placed themes in the movie don't have a good bearing in the technicalities of the film themselves so they lack a true ground to stand on for claiming their actually continuity in the film itself. I never claimed they don't exist I called them IDEALIC. I'm just saying that most likely the literature and academic basis on most themes behind Kubrick's work lies itself in the film themselves instead of externalized hyperbolized themes that are just of as an user pointed out And that's about it.
>Author's intent is irrelevant.
Author's intent is atleast the most objective thing that you could discuss because she/he's the one that created the work in the first place.

>wrong argument. It is mostly subconscious.
I did not say that Urobuchi wrote Homura by a chance. Only gave an easy to understand argument why author's intent is irrelevant.

Funny, because amouri fati and agape are things that you can not understand.

No, not OP.
Unless OP is the one currently going on about how Rebellion is the deepest, bestest thing in the world and that nobody understands it, and that everyone's interpretation of it is wrong but his.

No, the most objective thing we can discuss is what we can perceive. Not some unknowable and abstract notion of 'author's intent'. You can not know author's intent. Author himself may not know his intent. He may not even know that he doesn't know.

>externalized hyperbolized themes
could you define what this means for you?

which one? There are currently at least 3 anons with different opinions who think that as far as I can count. Why do you want to prevent people from discussing what they like? Who hurt you, user? Did some Madokafag trigger you in the past?

I wish there were more doujins or fanfics about Homura raping Madoka

>Stanely Kubrick said that he does not understand the end of 2001.
Source
>Do you really think all art is intentional?
Never claimed this conception instead a purposeful intention.

Still thought I appreciate all the discussion I still think the movie is a bit overrated by zealots like you and I think there's better movies out there.

If there's a wiki made for the concept of amour fati so yeah I can understand it.

Perception is subjective. If I look at a clock for 12 hours then time is going to very slow but If I fall asleep for 12 hours then time will go very fast. Though you could claim if you try to fall asleep for 12 hours then time will go very slow and then you could then claim that looking at a clock for 12 hours will go faster. I just see it that author's intent atleast gives us the most ground to work out of with atleast an end goal in sight.

>Rebellion is the deepest, bestest thing in the world
>Implying is somehow isn't.
BEHEAD THOSE WHO INSULT MADOKA
user is going to get you

user, there is a difference between understanding the dictionary definition and truly understanding something.

It's like you don't understand the concept of color as a scale to measure the wavelength of light.

Rebellion unironically IS the deepest, bestest thing in the world though.

Amour Fati:
Everything that happens in life, including suffering, is good and/or necessary. That is not to say that someone who believes this would not try to alleviate suffering or improve their situation.

>Rebellion is the deepest, bestest thing in the world
yes.
>And that nobody understands it
yes, that too.

No I get it it's fine.
I'm just making a point that if atleast the conception of a subject is able to produced into articulated thought then understanding it's inner workings is pretty obvious. Please don't take me as I'm just apathetically taking in subjects.

now get out

>if atleast the conception of a subject is able to produced into articulated thought then understanding it's inner workings is pretty obvious
I can give you a simple counterexample:
f(n) = n/2 if n is even
f(n) = 3n+1 if n is odd
The question is: if you apply f recursively to a natural number n, does it reach 1 for all numbers?

Understood? Good!

Do you think the inner workings of this are trivial? Far from it, that is the Collatz conjecture one of the hardest unsolved problems of mathematics.

>Perception is subjective
While that's necessarily true, adding author's intent into the equation adds yet another layer of subjectivity and unknowable.

Why.

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I know but what I'm claiming is that author's intent if known will provide a single path of analysis, It won't have problems of perception where there are infinite amount of them. I'm not claiming that author's intent is better than perceptive analysis only that one holds more objectivity than the other that's all.

Because amour fati is like that, sure, you can describe it. But what it would take someone to actually do it has a whole bunch of other things in it. It's an unsolved problem of philosophy, just like the Collatz conjecture is an unsolved problem of mathematics.

>there are infinite amount of them
There are not infinite amounts of them, and they are not arbitrary.
That's a lie you have been told at (((uni)))

why?
I honestly believe I am selling Rebellion low here.
People are saying that it's the best movie of all time, and I agreed with that, but somehow it just does not do it justice how great Rebellion is.

Rebellion is the greatest piece of art of all time.

There I said it. Now all is well with the universe.

Also, this.

Ah, I see what you're saying now. I appreciate the description I just needed a better description of it.

Careful this one is an big one.

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Please explain it anyways. You're way smarter than I am and I'm sure you can put it in digestible terms so we can at least know what you're talking about.

He’s being cocky in the way that he says it but I agree with the basic point.

Sorry I'm not a /pol/lack like you. No thank you.

Do you really think that I was being ironic?
I once said that it's divine revelation and that the people who created it danced to the made tune of creation in order to give birth to something divine.

And then, as I am now, 100% unironic about Madoka - I would never dishonor myself by talking shit about it.

I'm pretty sure that you are the faggot who got triggered really bad by that and then got completely BTFO in the debate that followed. That was a few months ago.
Does it really still sting that badly?

>He’s being cocky in the way that he says it but I agree with the basic point.
I can agree is a great movie worth multiple viewings def one of the best anime movies of decade up there with Princess Kaguya in my list. I wanna see more Urobochi work in Anime format after he stops playing with his fucking dolls and shit.

Rebellion is just cheap pandering by Shinbo who wanted to push Sayaka and sell more merchandise by introducing Nagisa.
It was pure eye candy with no plot and is a betrayal of the concepts set by the original Madoka.

>People don't think Sayaka is best girl.

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>there is someone in this thread RIGHT NOW who unironically doesn't believe Homura is self-loathing despite a mountain of proof

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There are as many of them as a number of combinations based upon near infinte amount of singular smallest points available to differentiate. Arbitrary or not is different matter entirely.

>holds more objectivity
Perhaps if you want to win an argument. But ideally speaking, we don't discuss art in order to win 4channel arguments, but to further our own understanding.

If you perceive that a movie spelled out 2+3, you will obviously conclude that the movie meant 5. But then the author goes out and contradicts it by saying that it actually meant 6. Would you bend your own perception in order to shoehorn in the author's intent, even though your own perception disagrees?

I'm sure there's a more elegant way to formulate it, but I lack the necessary verbal faculty. Basically, you are free to interpret art in a way most consistent with your own perception, because your own perception has the least amount of unknowable.

meant for

>But ideally speaking, we don't discuss art in order to win 4channel arguments
>order to win 4channel arguments
>4channel
Bring back, m00t.

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>185623643
Time to update my filter with yet another tripnigger whore.

Amour Fati, is the love to fate

Nietzsche said, that the world is doomed to repeat itself endlessly because there are a finite amount of physical states.

This means that everything in your life will repeat again in exactly the same way and has already happened an endless number of times. And you are doomed to the same course in all of them, like a leaf in the wind.

That the hardest of all things according to Nietzsche is to understand this, and to love fate - even if we are doomed to repeat our mistakes again endlessly.
To embrace life, even if it is meaningless and there is no hope.

I'm actually insanely offended by this post.

I think you should probably never step foot in another Madoka thread. You obviously don't belong here.

Get out.

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Do you think all of those interpretations are equal?
Or is there perhaps a difference in kind?

Sayaka May technically be the best looking magica but she’s still the one that did the most wrong. She’s pretty much the only one I don’t like as a person.

I am right here, you are very welcome to directly respond to my last post right here:

She's the only one that acted age appropriate out of any of the girls.

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While i see and accpet why people can believe that, i cant honestly say that Rebellion is best art piece of all time, it's definitely up there for me, but i will sound arrogant to presume that while not inspecting every single one of them, which is impossible obviously. What i can say for sure is that Rebellion contains just as much symbolism as film can without it being called pretentious, just on the maximum edge, which is a achievement in itself. But the problem is the complexity - i believe a movie with actors and all that could potentially be more complex which can in turn raise the bar exponentially.

By acting age appropriate, you mean doing really stupid things in the hope of getting her crush to pound her pussy?

She probably would have just enjoyed a hand holding, but yeah, kind of. She had the idea of what an ally of justice is and does. She wanted to save the boy she liked and be a hero to everyone else.

Things just didn't work out that way like they don't work out in real life. Sayaka got bitch smacked by life.

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Is Yea Forums going to like her?

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You've already admitted you couldn't comprehend why someone can be determined to succeed but loath themselves for failing at the same time. Perhaps you personally would never feel that way, and you're projecting it on to Homura, which is why you can't understand.

You've also denied the reality that the movie itself put forth ( ) and substituted your own. You cannot interpret this scene any other way. For all your talk of high philisophical concepts, you fail to comprehend something as simple as this.

Bitch slapped so hard she was turned into a Lesbian.

That should be the opposite. Sayaka tried to do the most right, but she is the dumbest looking meguca.

I love Sayaka's sweaty and delicious armpits.

Rebellion is non-canon so nothing like that happened.

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But how can Amour Fati apply to Homura if her entire reason for being was to oppose her own fate?

>Rebellion is Non-Canon

Rebellion didn't make Sayaka a lesbian you stupid tripfag

they only be called equal in a sense that you (the judge) need to be outside of system to rightfully order them. Which is impossibly since you cant escape being a part of said system. A human cant escape subjectivity no matter how hard he tries, all scales and kinds are subjective, just in different amount.

Reminder that Rebellion is canon.

what can you expect of a sayakafag.

Homura made sure your waifu eats Kyouko's pussy every night

Just like DBZ.

It ruined parts of her character. Like the handholding BS.

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No, objective reality exists.
And human judgment is flawed, but it is very strongly correlated with objectivity.

The handholding part was fine.69 user. You obviously don’t know the context behind it because you’re jumping to conclusions.

Everyone who deals with absurdism does, that's the point.

What is the worst thing the new Magireco anime will do to the franchise? Will it ruin any of the girls by making the inconsistent?

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What are you going to do if MagiReco doubles down on SayaKyou?

Magireco is doubling down on Kyousuke x Sayaka, that's for sure

>Telling me that I don't know the context behind it.

Please. Just stop.

Retaliate against Japan.

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Why are people replying to tripfags that aren't dishing out content? Anyways, I'm also looking forward to re-watching Rebellion this week as well as MagiReco coming out just to see these threads devolve into chaotic evil shitposting

Objective reality exists but not objective value. Value is assigned by a mind.

She need not be a lesbian to love Kyouko romantically. It's not an uncommon concept in anime for a character to be gay for a specific person. I find it quite romantic personally.
>objective reality exists
Not him, but how can you know? According to relativity, there's no absolute frame of reference. Just look at how light behaves from different frames of reference - all observers measure C, no matter their relative velocity.

You just not remember the Madoka threads.

She doesn't love Kyouko romantically. Don't pretend you didn't know what I meant.

>but loath themselves for failing
>hating yourself
that is not the same thing, user.
You can be disappointed and loathe yourself for failing without hating yourself to the point that you think you don't deserve happiness.

I'd personally like to know why there are so many newfags in these threads.

Is it because of the stupid gatcha?

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Objectivity is like death - when it exist, a human a subject, consciousness dont, when a human exist, objectivity doesn't. Since you can achieve it, it's existence or not doesn't concern you and therefore strictly it doesn't exist, like a cog in a machine cannot grasp the nature of the machine it's part of.

Self-hatred and self-loathing are synonyms.

>She doesn't love Kyouko romantically
Yes, she does.

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Nope.

Well, the makings of a good story are there, so that's a step up from the rest of magireco, at least. Here's hoping the anime can tone down the more ridiculous plot points and build up the characters enough to make their decisions feel natural rather than plot tools.

They do look cute together though.

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can't*

Delete this non-canon BS.

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>all love needs to be romantic
Found the yurifag.
It's platonic. It's sisterly.

It seems our interpretations are irreconcilable. What now, fag?

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This one picture has more history on Yea Forums than some of you here.

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I honestly don't, were they really that bad compared to what's on the horizon?

Post more smugdoka, of course.

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No, they are not. They imply different degrees.
Ok, then lets phrase it differently.
You seem to be unable to comprehend the concept of a scale.

So how much does Homura hate herself?

1, Homura is a narcissist.
10, Homura hates herself so much that she kills herself because she feels like she does not deserve to exist.

Light Yagami would be a 1.
A normal Human is a 5.
Homura is maybe a 6 or 7.
Shinji would be a 9 on this scale.

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A narcissist could hate himself so much that he would "condemn" himself to "existing"

Yes, they are synonyms. Look it up. A lesser form of self-loathing is self-deprication, where someone knows their flaws and will gladly point them out, but they do not dislike themselves. A person who is self-loathing dislikes themselves and feels they are undeserving, y'know, like Homura.

Are you actually dodging the main point right now?

The main point is that Homura loathes herself.
You're basically just saying "She doesn't hate herself as much as Shinji so you're wrong."

>They imply different degrees
Untrue. Hate and loathing are both extremes of dislike. Homura is a 9. By the end of Rebellion, she considers herself the greatest evil in existence and actively sabotages her own happiness precisely because she feels undeserving of it.

You see the problem now?

The problem is you, user.

And btw. That would be a 10.
Homura is not a 10 on that scale. Sure, Homura has issues. But is nowhere near as bad as you faggots claim.

Are you suggesting that Homura does not consider herself the greatest evil in existence and also does not actively sabotage her own happiness?

yes, exactly.
If you asked Homura: Who is the greatest evil in existence?
She would say: It's QB of course, are you retarded?

Are you really denying what that user just said? Because everything he just said can be found in the show itself. This isn't an interpretation, it's fact.
Your waifu fucking hates herself, user.
Don't be fucking retarded.
Who does Homura consider the most evil if not the most evil person in the universe but the girl who proclaimed as herself the existence known as evil and a demon? I'll give you a hint: It's Homura.

I disagree, I think Homura considers herself the greatest evil.
I also think she isn't necessarily a 10 on the self-loathing scale, but she does harbor a fair amount of hatred for herself

No, you didn't understand the way the word "evil" is used in this context.
Please rewatch the ending scene, and ask yourself, are the things that Homura does there really evil? As in what you would consider evil?

This. She's seems more conflicted and maybe unsure about the morality of her actions, rather than outright self-loathing. Ultimately, she knows that she did the best thing for Madoka. But if there's one thing she would regret (and possibly hate herself for), it's her failure in preventing Madoka from making the contract in the first place. Maybe that's what generates dissonance in her mind, preventing her from embracing the happiness of the brave new world she created.

Read this:quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-Good-and-Bad-vs-Good-and-Evil-in-Nietzsches-The-Genealogy-of-Morality
This is the way "Evil" is used here.

Nietzsches isn't needed in this context.
Homura defines evil as defiance agains God (who we assume she thinks is the ultimate good). Therefore, as someone who defied God and split her in half against her will, Homura is now considers herself the embodiment of evil.
It's really that simple.

No, this is clearly the Nietzschean use of the world.
Homura uses her will to power over the world, that is exactly what she does.
And that is exactly the Nietzschean definition of evil.

And Nietzsche is directly quoted in Rebellion with "Gott ist tot"
You can NOT understand this without Nietzsche

Which goes to show you have a faulty understanding of Homura's morality.

Homura's morality is Madoka-centric, and not simply that Madoka is good, but rather that good is Madoka. Her existence is to serve Madoka. Homura's existence is to serve Madoka. However, Madoka has conflicting desires: the desire to find purpose through self-sacrifice, and the desire for love from friends and family. Even though they are irreconcilable, they are both aspects of good that Homura is morally obliged to uphold. But despite that moral obligation, Homura must violate one in order to protect the other, and that is a fundamental betrayal of her own self-imposed morality no matter the circumstances or result. Such a betrayal is irreparable, unforgivable, and by committing it, she also embodies it. Homura is not merely calling herself evil, she is defining evil as herself.

The Incubators are not the greatest evil, simply because enmity is a lesser sin than betrayal.

She is definitely conflicted, but she puts a huge amount of blame on herself, and is extremely unfair to herself. Everything stems from her repeated failures to save Madoka.
Even when she has control over everything, she denies herself happiness because she's afraid Madoka would hate her for what she did. That's how guilty she feels about her actions.

>Homura's morality is Madoka-centric, and not simply that Madoka is good, but rather that good is Madoka. Her existence is to serve Madoka. Homura's existence is to serve Madoka. However, Madoka has conflicting desires: the desire to find purpose through self-sacrifice, and the desire for love from friends and family. Even though they are irreconcilable, they are both aspects of good that Homura is morally obliged to uphold. But despite that moral obligation, Homura must violate one in order to protect the other, and that is a fundamental betrayal of her own self-imposed morality no matter the circumstances or result. Such a betrayal is irreparable, unforgivable, and by committing it, she also embodies it. Homura is not merely calling herself evil, she is defining evil as herself.
Shit, user, thank you for putting this into words.

10/10 post. You hit the nail on the head.

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>guilty
That's it. She's not self-loathing - it's the burden of guilt weighing her that people mistake for self-hatred.

Guilt is one of the largest psychological factors in self-loathing.

This. Legit made me tear up. Screencap taken for future generations.

Homura - after the flower scene - never once mentions that it is bad or immoral to create the Labyrinth.
Homura ends up agreeing with Sayaka that the world in which Madoka can be happy is not that bad.
She changed her mind after that point.

Homura has realized that she is the witch of the Labyrinth, and is having her Monologue about how it is "unforgivable because it goes against Madoka's sacrifice", she is contemplating her position.

But then, Madoka appears and jumps at her, and then the flower scene happens.
And then Homura realizes Madoka's true feelings and CHANGES HER MIND.
After that, she calls Kyouko, and in the background, once again, connect is playing - the song about how she is going to save Madoka.

Homura once again resumed her purpose of saving Madoka.
After that she never again questions that it is necessary to save Madoka at all costs.
I don't even think that she has any doubts what so ever that it was right to pull her down and save her from being the LOC.

I was about to say this.
Guilt contributes to self-hatred and often the loathing can eventually eclipse the feeling of guilt, to the point where absolution is impossible in the mind of the guilty because they think they do not deserve it and need to suffer.

I wanted to put in an >inb4 because I just knew someone would bring that up. No, self-loathing is not a prerequisite for guilt. You absolutely can feel guilty without hating yourself.

I would say that Homura hates herself at the same level as Simon from Gurren Lagann.
Not even close to Shinji or the ridiculousness that you wrote up here

>Homura - after the flower scene - never once mentions that it is bad or immoral
When she apologizes to Madoka while she's in witch form, which is a double entendre for both her desires in manifesting the barrier and what she's about to.

>it is necessary to save Madoka
>it was right to pull her down
Necessity is not necessarily the same as righteousness. Homura is put in a situation where she must choose which of Madoka's desires to betray and which to uphold. Regardless of the outcome, she has committed a moral transgression, even if Madoka is happier as a result, it's unforgivable.

What kinds of intellectual discussion on this level will MagiReco inspire?

Except user did not even mention self-hatred and I'm pretty sure he's one of the anons here who disagree with the notion that Homura's defining trait post-Rebellion is self-hatred.

>You absolutely can feel guilty without hating yourself.
Which is true but not in Homura's case.

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What's so ridiculous about that post? It's entirely correct.
None if /vg/ is any indication

The picture does not prove anything. Yes, you could probably say that Homura does hate her weak self, because her weak self couldn't protect Madoka. It has no bearing on post-Rebellion Homura whatsoever.

Jack shit most like. Honestly I'm not interested in new girls, I want a resolution to the end of Rebellion that doesn't shit all over it. As impossible as that seems.

The kneeling Homura isn't Moemura, but the current (witch) Homura, who knows she is about to split Madoka.
Homura condemns herself in all forms she takes.

"Kill the boy, John Snow, kill the boy and let the man be born!"

Go to any FGO thread to get an idea.

the BRAID!!! It's Moemura.

you right

I came to the understanding that BOTH of those interpretations are valid.
And intentional.
Rebellion is explicitly designed to put those two perspectives against each other.

Because that is the fundamental nature of morality. It is contradictory.

I absolutely disagree with that. Weak and kneeling on the ground. Not to mention the braided hairstyle which always represented her 'Moemura' self.

You seem to be under the false impression that Homura's selves are disparate. And post-Rebellion did fail to protect Madoka('s desire for the strength to save others).

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What do you think this scene represented?

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I was explaining Homura's rationalization of her self-hatred in that post. Homura's defining trait is to protect Madoka's happiness at any cost, even if it means she must commit actions that will cause her to hate herself.

How do you pronounce Madoka? I say it wrong in my head constantly

The entire scene or just that specifice moment?
If the latter, that represents Homura losing her innocence, so to speak. She became cold, distant, and jaded with her repeated failures.

growing up

Ma-do-ka

Muh-do-ka or Meh-do-ka are wrong

Muh doke

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That no matter the mask she wears, she is guilty of failure.

So basically we agree?

I disagree with both. I interpret it as Homura forcibly throwing away her weak self in order to protect Madoka, yet still failing to do so.

No, it's a different user. I am

We don't necessarily disagree, though. What you said is compatible with what I said.

That is interesting, because I agree with that post completely, yet I can not agree with the notion that Homura hates herself. Just goes to show how subtle our seemingly irreconcilable difference is.

Did you miss the part where Homura's (braided) selves are literally "looking down on" her?

You mean this ?
The braided versions are standing by, powerlessly.
They look sadly at the splat where Madoka once was, and she is there dirt.
They are not looking down on her, they are looking at the splat.
And then Homura gets much much larger, more powerful, and rages against it. But she can't put Madoka back together.

Fair enough, but going back to the original topic - let's grant you for the sake of an argument that (assuming you're that user, if not then the other user) symbolizes what you say it does. It's still not a relevant argument to support the notion of Homura's post-Rebellion self-hatred, because her conflict post-Rebellion is different from her conflict in her barrier.
I did not. Care to elaborate how does that scene tie into our argument?

Those a clearly disaproving glares.
That fact is further reinforced by when Homura smashes herself

On top of that, the moemuras are menacingly towering over Homura, as if to say "I'm better than you."

How do you explain Homura's severance of their relationship? Homura concluding that Madoka would be happier not knowing her requires a negative warped self-image.
How do you conclude that if Homura's self-image is independent of her betrayal against Madoka and her own existence? That she's gratified by defining evil as herself?

good and evil are not what you think they are.
Understanding Nietzsche is a bare minimum prerequisite for rebellion.

That does not make sense at all.
In what aspect are they even better?

Let me raphrase
"You are worse than I am"

>How do you explain Homura's severance of their relationship?
Guilt, no matter how extreme, does not imply self-hatred. As such, I don't see the need to introduce this variable, when already described it perfectly without.
>That she's gratified by defining evil as herself?
I'll go with whatever the other user said when referencing Nietzsche. He knows more about that than me and I don't see any contradiction in his interpretation.

My apologies, I can't keep this up much longer - my verbal fluency is starting to slip. Thanks all for the interesting discussion nevertheless. I'll read the thread in the morning.

In what aspect?

Cold, uncaring, distant, and brutally practical. Willing discard the lives of others *cough*Sayaka*cough* and use them as a merely means to an end *cough*Kyouko*cough* to serve her goal. These are things she became in the name of practicality rather than as ideals.

I really don't think Homura thinks back to the days when she was Moemura in a positive way. That's what she does not like about herself.
Homura has a problem with how she was not good enough to save Madoka, not with what she has become.

She hates both "versions" of herself
her past self for being weak, foolish and a failure
and her current self for the reasons i just mention and a failure.

Take the metaphorical meaning of "look down on": to cast inferiority upon.
Moral cleanliness: even through Homura's Madoka-centric morality, her "past" selves are more "Madoka-like" and therefore more good. Based on that, she has the (false) perception that Madoka approves of her "past" self moreso than her "resent. Additionally, magnitude of failure: Madoka suffered worse fates in later timelines rather than earlier.
>her conflict post-Rebellion is different from her conflict in her barrier
Pre-Rebellion is the failure to protect Madoka's desire for human happiness (among other things), and post-Rebellion is failure to protect Madoka's desire for the strength to save others. That Homura succeeded one one front does not mean her self-hatred magically disappears.

>Guilt, no matter how extreme, does not imply self-hatred
Guilt in the extreme is almost certainly indicative of self-hatred.
> when (You) already described it perfectly without
To take my post and conclude that Homura does not harbor self-hatred requires additional variables.

Then allow me to rephrase myself while omitting any mention of good or evil.

Homura's self-worth is tied to upholding her purpose of protecting Madoka. Homura goes against Madoka's desire to be strong to save others. She does not protect Madoka in her entirety, only in part. Even considering that she chose the path of least failure, the magnitude of failure was such that it diminished her self-worth to the point of self-loathing.

>438 Posts.
>Almost no trolls.
>Serious Discussions.
>No Eva fags, or other spics.
Good thread.

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I don’t think there’s any thinking about it. I though the anime made it pretty clear Homura didn’t like herself at all. She had absolutely no self worth until Madoka scarified herself for her. A girl that she thought was amazing gave her life away so that she could live. That’s what the song Colorful is about. She seen Madoka as something she could aspire to be like and it gave her purpose.

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Enjoy. After MagiReco comes out, I doubt we'll get another good Madoka thread again.

Canon yuri rape soon

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>total absence of VEG vs Eva vs Madoka bait shitposting threads all day today
God(ess) is good

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It’s not canon if it’s not rape. That’s what we say around here.

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>She does not protect Madoka in her entirety
I get how it could be interpreted that way. I really do.

However, consider the following perspective:
Homura is a 26 years old adult, she knows that Madoka has a martyr complex because she sacrificed herself in every single one of the 100 loops, and so she herself took responsibility to allow her to live a happy life with her family.

She wants to be happy with Madoka, that's why she asks her, knowing what the answer would be once again: "do you consider order and stability more important than desire?".
She wanted for Madoka to say: "No, I just want to be happy or something along those lines". But she didn't. That's why she knows that their differences are irreconcilable.

But even if she becomes her enemy, she will still wish for a world where Madoka can be happy.
Homura understands Madoka, the real true Madoka, not some made up concept in her head.
That is what Kimi no gin no Niwa is about:
"Hopes and dreams and the future, are all just a selfish story... of a faraway garden"

This interpretation is perfectly self-consistent and contradicts nothing from the source material.

>That’s what the song Colorful is about.
Colorful is a declaration of Will to power.

"So I took flight, carrying my hopes on my back,
And assembled them underneath the sky that extends forever
If you go on protecting those wishes
You can go on to a tomorrow no one knows"

Also, watch this: youtube.com/watch?v=j0oEJgJA6hc
It's really well made.

>Madoka has a martyr complex

I fucking hate it when people say that because that means they don't actually know what a martyr complex is.

A martyr complex is when someone craves being a victim for some psychological need, so they enable or tolerate a bad situation just so they can continue being a victim. That's why it's nicknamed the "victim complex." For example, a wife is suffering under an alcoholic husband complains to her co-workers about it, who giver her their sympathy. The wife does nothing about the alcoholism of her husband or even enables it in some ways because the sympathy of others and the suffering she feels makes her feel like she's fighting the good fight.

This does not describe Madoka at all.

Your video doesn't even have the good part of Colorful and that's the part that confused me the most.

youtube.com/watch?v=bNtWQm2-mgM

When I first saw the OP, I thought they drew a midget Homura, not that she was on her knees.

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Oh my god user please don't.
It's just what that user said. Madoka made her feel worth something and gave her the strength to save her. That's what the song is about.

They replaced a very important part of the song at the very beginning. It’s supposed to be goddess Madoka looking down on everything as stars (tears) fall as they hit earth. This is made more clear by the rain following right afterwards. She’s separate from the Madoka in the world Homura is daydreaming about during the video. I think this shows they both have different ideas for what they want. The entire illusion world of the song is what Homura desires. It also goes to show that despite what it may seem like Homura cares about the other girls happiness as well. You can see she’s standing at the teacups and imagining Sayaka and Kyoko living carefree.

2/2
m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ji1vV_flUPg
Here’s the correct version.

My Orwellian country does not allow me to see any of those videos... and my unblocker stopped working, fuck me.

I agree.

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>It’s supposed to be goddess Madoka looking down on everything as stars (tears) fall as they hit the earth
There is no such scene in colorful. Are you sure?
I looked it up in Rebellion.
It starts with Madoka running to school, and then she touches the desert world and it turns into a garden.
That symbolized that Madoka makes the world meaningful to Homura,
and without her, the world is just an empty desert.

You’re watching the wrong version.

Correct, canon version here.

>Homura is a 26 years old adult
Implanting years of memories into an underdeveloped brain does not an adult make. Even if you remove the physical component of the organ itself, the "image" of that mind is still immature, not to mention damaged by PTSD and depression.

>she herself took responsibility to allow her to live a happy life with her family
Which, as I have been saying, is the logically correct course of action. The issue lies in the cost of attaining that under Homura's evaluation of self-worth.

>Homura understands Madoka, the real true Madoka
Almost. She understands that both of Madoka's desires are equally true representations of Madoka, which is why Homura acts as she does. What Homura misunderstands lies in her own self-loathing: she believes Madoka favors her past self, and projects her own self-imposed unforgivabilty onto Madoka.

A bit of an unrelated tangent: Madoka's reply is unconsciously hypocritical: she mentions breaking rules when making her wish in episode 12.

What the hell, why is this different from the version that's actually in the movie?

No, I literally opened the movie itself. That is not the version there.
Also, it is fucking blocked. REEEEEEE

Cheer up, Sayaka-chan.

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>Implanting years of memories into an underdeveloped brain does not an adult make.
Homura is Meguka, their brains work differently. They are apparently able to predict the trajectory of hundreds of projectiles, so this is not really a reasonable complaint.

>Madoka's reply is unconsciously hypocritical: she mentions breaking rules when making her wish in episode 12.
It's ironic.
Compare this with OP's 6th point:

You. Guys. Are. Watching. The. WRONG VERSION!

Yes, what you’re looking at in that video is the actual Version.

How is it the wrong version if it's literally what's in the movie? Explain yourself.

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Ok I managed to open that now.
It actually is different
W
T
F
Where the hell is this even from?

This is right before that. Literally seconds before. Did you ever wonder what the stars falling from the sky meant or why they were there?

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Her eyes being covered is another clue as to what’s happening. That’s a common trope.

That shot is not in the movie version. That's what I'm asking about.

You must have a newer version.

I checked three separate versions, including the original camrip of the theater showing. None of them include that shot.

Alright. I know that this is a taboo, but fuck me,
this
www2.9anime.to/watch/puella-magi-madoka-magica-the-movie-rebellion.xxn3/47w9x7
is the stream of the version where are talking about. And it most definetly does NOT have that.
ARE THERE UNIRONICALLY MULTIPLE VERSIONS OF REBELLION?!?
What else did they change!??!!??!!??!?

What the hell? Is SHAFT trying to delete evidence of the actual version? That’s the one I remember.

>Homura is Meguka, their brains work differently
Perhaps, but raw computational ability isn't equivalent to emotional maturity.

>Compare this with OP's 6th point
I might even go as far as to say that if Madoka had a complete knowledge and understanding of Homura's actions, rather than forgiving Homura, she'd say that there's nothing to forgive-- that it was Madoka's own lack of understanding of Homura that put Homura in such a position.

Where did you watch it?

>I might even go as far as to say that if Madoka had a complete knowledge and understanding of Homura's actions, rather than forgiving Homura, she'd say that there's nothing to forgive-- that it was Madoka's own lack of understanding of Homura that put Homura in such a position.
I absolutely agree. And I think that Homura herself knows Madoka well enough to know this. And that is why I don't see her hating herself over it.

I watched it online when it aired.

This is from Meguca subs. I can check the physical disc if it's different.

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God this shit is so good

Well there were definitely changes between the theater version and the BD version, but this isn't one of them so I'm a bit confused.

This is frustrating. Now I bet we’ll never find it. Why the heck is there so many version of the movie.

Fun fact, Gothloli Homu's blanket was pure white in the theater version, but they made it all rainbow-y in the BD.

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That scene was so cool.

>And I think that Homura herself knows Madoka well enough to know this
And that's where I disagree. If Homura believed this, then there'd be no need to tamper memories, or, at the very least, Homura would befriend her normally.

Another fun fact: this is the cutest version of Homura.

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As this thread draws to a close, we bring in a big finale. A dump of chapter 4 to 5 of the MagiReco manga translated into Chinese as no-one has translated this into English yet.

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Fuck off. Why would we want shit we can't read?

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Oh boy, I love Chinese.

Why would I want to make a second Madoka thread when I can use this one? Also someone said people wouldn't mind.

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DVD version (my computer doesn't have a Bluray player).

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Did you know that Madoka actually isn’t Magica? She’s Modoka Technologica because magic doesn’t exist in this universe. It’s advanced alien technology.

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It's Madoka Magica because her Kindness is magical. Even though, it's actually technology magic does exist in their universe, as it does in ours.
I mean if it didn't why is Rebellion then so magical?

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You fucking MagiRecordVGJew, I fucking hate you. Goddamnit, all you niggers should be gassed.

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