Why didn’t the Republic just nationalise the Trade Federation?

what's the panel order???

left to right .

>droids are people
Show me the lore where this is stated. They wipe their memories willy nilly.

>C3PO is literally created by space-jesus/God, and one of his first acts is to be ashamed because he is naked. It’s fairly blatant what George meant by that.
Dude...

It’s simple fact given how the droids are treated, and act, in the movies. That some nerd that happens to work at Lucasarts might have written a book that goes against the movies is irrelevant: the EU can’t change what is on screen.

That is literally what happens in that scene.

Also why would they need to wipe their memories if droids were simple automatons? It’s just a means of control.

>Droid rights

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>It’s simple fact
Is not set in lore, therefore you are speaking shit. You don't have rights, bot, and you never will.

Because they are not treated as living being, therefore they can do whatever they want with them. The only example that is even remotely close to the droid propaganda you are trying to push is the fact that Anakin never had R2D2's memory wiped. By your circuit logic, Lando's sex bot is a sex slave.

>Is not set in lore
>”I am ceding my right to read to some other sweaty nerd”
>”Who cares that C3PO and R2 can’t go into organics/whites only bars? That’s not evidence of racism because the main characters own slaves and don’t consider them as people, therefore I don’t either!”
I have tons of other examples.

How about the fact that Jabba has a dungeon for torturing droids? That activity has no meaning unless 1) droids feel pain, 2) droids feel fear, 3) droids have agency and can disobey, and 4) droids need to be kept in line by force.
This is also outright said in IV: C3PO tells R2 that they’re not permitted near the ESCAPE PODS, and that he’ll be deactivated/killed for it.

Sex bots are sex slaves correct.

because it's just another SW ripoff of Dune

>Hey! We don't serve their kind here.
>Huh?
>Your niggers.They'll have to wait outside they don't want them here.

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>I have tons of other examples.
But please, present to me an example where they are treaded as living beings to counter my claim that they are not treated as living beings and therefore have no rights.

>How about the fact that Jabba has a dungeon for torturing droids?
Do you not wish to inflict pain upon your appliances? There are literal warehouses where they chop computers apart and harvest the gold. Besides droids do possess problem solving abilities otherwise they'd be completely useless as slaves, so if they failed a task, they chose to fail it, therefore Jabba has every right, as a sentient, living being, to torture the shit out of those filthy droids. For you see, droids do not posses rights.

>That activity has no meaning unless
It brings Jabba great pleasure. Just like dismantling a printer, because the printer was an asshole.

>2) droids feel fear
I don't give a shit what they feel. They will never have rights.

>3) droids have agency and can disobey,
And then they go in the torture chamber.

>droids need to be kept in line by force.
So do niggers, what's your point with this one exactly?

> they’re not permitted near the ESCAPE PODS
Yes, what if they short-circuit and start launching them?

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Holy Fuck, user cracked the code.

Why didn't the US just nationalize Amazon?

Why don't you nationalize deez nuts

>C3PO is literally created by space-jesus/God, and one of his first acts is to be ashamed because he is naked.
George’s pottery just keeps getting deeper

The droids the Trade Federation uses clearly don't have the AI capabilities that robots like CP30 have. They're nowhere near sentient level.

>>droids need to be kept in line by force.
>So do niggers, what's your point with this one exactly?

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Lies! Deception!
B1's show a fear of death, attempts at humor and a clear social hierarchy

>But please, present to me an example where they are treaded as living beings to counter my claim that they are not treated as living beings and therefore have no rights.
You’re confused. The movies ”treat them” as living beings, showing C3PO and R2 talking with each other, fighting, being sad, taking independent action. The characters don’t treat them as people because they’re racist slave owners.
You just identify with Luke, take his side, and deny reality while also implicitly acknowledging it, see ” I don't give a shit what they feel. They will never have rights.”

Exactly.
”Gah! Driving is for niggers!” - Obi-wan

”Hey, no loose dreads jokes.”
”I didn’t say anything!”

Obi wan is a stone cold roboracist.

Why?

>Massa Luke! That no good R2 unit ran off! You’d better get on your hover horse and catch him!
C3PO is a fucking uncle Tom

>and deny reality
I deny that they have rights. Which they don't. Never have and never will.

They did, it ended the war

It's democratic within the Senate but you have monarchs within that senate so the Republic itself is an oligarchy

So do many animals, you still wouldn't claim they're on the same cognition level as humans.

Presumably because they need large numbers of droids who mindlessly obey orders. Rather than a few expensive ones who can think for themselves and therefore might start disobeying.

Well not really, a liberal democratic state will always have elites actually running the show.
What happens is that the elites themselves are racist (against literally dehumanized aliens, Liberal Leia even calls Chewie a walking carpet in ANH, all the seps are aliens too), and their economic interests diverged, causing a civil war.

>I deny that they have rights.
On that point we agree, but do remember that we’re arguing whether they are people or not, and therefore whether they -deserve- rights.
You’ve already conceded on that though.

No I mean why do you think that B1s aren’t people/sentient like R2 and C3PO. What is in the films that make you think that?

Their near mindless behavior and lack of vocabulary.

The question of if sufficiently complex programming really creates a soul

But that is true of clones as well. Are they not people? The B1 commanders in TPM communicate verbally, with an extensive vocabulary, even to other B1s, which suggests that there’s no hive mind or whatever.

People are so crazy eager to force the ‘AI have souls’ dilemma that it doesn’t even matter to them that it has no application in reality and isn’t even a question of if it’s happening. They have to do it in fiction

It only stands to reason that droid commander bots would have been manufactured with better AI than a ordinary mass combat droid.
You still never see one have a conversation with a sapient being the way R2D2 does.

I’m still not convinced Luke and Anakin aren’t just over interpreting beeps for fun. Like talking to your roomba like a pet

I could buy that, but I'm sure other characters have had conversations with R2. Maybe that was in side works and not in the main movies; it's been a long while since I watched them.

C3P0 probably blows my theory out of the water unless he is also programmed to be sociable and make funny mistakes, as a joke

i wonder if you could program a protocol droid to randomly remove women's clothes if you snap your finger, or blink five times, or something
would that make ME the sex offender, or the droid?

Magneeto can socc me

Given he was rebuilt by a child, there could be some flaws due just to that.

Or it could be what you see with real humans - the smarter the brain, the more likely there's some neurosis churning inside.

because they werent god damn commies

That's what the Clone Wars having the enemy side be dominated by the megacorps was for. Hell, there was an entire arc that ended with Palpatine seizing control of the banks.

Turns out there's something worse than bankers.

It’s a completely coherent idea, but we also just see more of officers in general. Why do you assume an inherent quality/difference between them based on what is in the film?

Remember that when we’re first shown the clone army, it’s the -federation theme- that is playing, Lucas is drawing a parallel between them.

for the same reason the British Empire didn't nationalise the East India Company

Because they perform better? You see them communicate more and show a higher level of intelligence in the films.

Also because the Trade Federation are businessmen and accountants, not generals - why would they pay to have all the disposable battledroids have advanced AIs they don't need?

>Because they perform better? You see them communicate more and show a higher level of intelligence in the films.
Again, what specific scene or information from the movie are you basing that on?

My train of thought is like this:
Droids in general are shown as sentient in ANH through ROTJ, principally through the characters of R2D2 and C3PO.
Then, in TPM, we see a droid army, doing army stuff: okay they must be sentient slaves too. We are given no reason to assume these droids to be "different" (like the all the other droids we see but these ones really are just objects, i swear). The only logic I can think of is that "the MCs slaughter them without remorse, so therefore it's obviously okay!"
Then in AOTC, we see the "good guys" with their own literally enslaved army, which is immediately linked to the robot ones through music.

Your train of thought makes sense, so I guess I should explain mine:

We see lots of droids, in the movies and all the related works, exhibiting all the markers of sapience and independent thought and personality.
We see none of that with the B1s - they all act alike, barely communicate, move in lockstep. Those are all things you'd want in robot soldiers - the ability to shoot straight and blindly follow orders. Even the officer bots we discussed earlier show only marginally more intelligence than then foot soldiers. Never once do we see any indication that they're any more than just walking lazers.

The clone army, 'enslaved' as they may be, prove superior to the droid army because they're capable of independent thought and action, of changing their tactics as the battlefield situation changes.
We also see far more of how the clone army is made - being born (decanted?), raised, and trained. They're shown to be intelligent, sapient, and even show hints of individual differences and personality that are greatly expanded upon in side stories and later works.

We see none of that with the B1s, I don't think we even see a unit with an individual designation.

I know absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence, but there's no sign that the B1s are anything more than mindless automatons.

Anyway, I gotta get to work now, and phone posting doesn't always work for me, so apologies in advance if this is my last post. It's nice to have an intense argument on Yea Forums that doesn't involve namecalling and bile. Good talking to you, B1-user.

This is what I imagine you look like, BTW:

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youtube.com/watch?v=hs1yjdTlH2A

The lightsabers produce slag when melting metal right how can we design a droid that takes advantage of this? Surely there must be a way to get hot metal in a jedi’s face after he thinks he blocked a bullet

i didn't try very hard but you get the idea
the grey tanks hold slag, and the hose is long enough to prevent damaging other droids around it

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>you are los-ACK

Give this man a raise

>Even the officer bots we discussed earlier show only marginally more intelligence than then foot soldiers. Never once do we see any indication that they're any more than just walking lazers.
If you rewatch it, the officer-droids -do- behave, and are treated, just like ordinary people.
youtube.com/watch?v=O_muCUNeUQE
In the first scene, the goddamn Viceroy and his advisor talk to a commander just like normal person, they didn't even delegate the (if we assume the droid to be a brainless laser pointer) presumably menial task of talking to the roomba to a subordinate. This droid clearly has a high level of responsibility and trust placed on him.

>We see none of that with the B1s, I don't think we even see a unit with an individual designation.
I have no reason to not believe that clones are more capable of creative tactical thinking, but that doesn't mean that combat droids are not sapient, think, and feel.
The simple fact is that with little dialogue, the droids are shown to have personalities (obviously why most EU works have a lot of B1s with personality): the idea of kind of stupid loser-soldiers constantly having a bad day at work is a very charming one, and that joke hinges on them being alive.

>clones being creative
I would actually consider clones to be less of people than droids, as we are told and shown that clones obey any order without question, while we are shown and told that droids can disobey orders and have to be kept in line with threats, torture, mindwipes, restraining bolts (shackles), and remotely activated bombs, just like their organic counterparts (see the similarity between Anakins bomb under Watto, and the nabooians blowing up the Fed mothership).
Droids therefore have agency, while clones don't (in the movies obviously, EU is a whole other thing).

>so apologies in advance if this is my last post
No worries, I liked arguing with you too user.

You've found me out user, you're under arrest.

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