What are some good books on Yugoslavia? I mean the formation, life inside and just in general including the dissolution...

What are some good books on Yugoslavia? I mean the formation, life inside and just in general including the dissolution. /his/ seems to not care or be slow.

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Sorry OP, I don't have any recs for you although the topic is close to broad personal history interests (19th/20th c., modern China, history of science).

Thats okay thank you for bump.
Here is the national anthem it sounds nice no?
youtube.com/watch?v=vhL2UJtkxmI

Black Lamb and Grey Falcon good enough?

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What is it? Fiction?

Milovan Djilas has written some books that might interest you. "Wartime" is about Tito's WWII partisan force

Not fiction

Anything by Danilo Kis (fiction).
Slavenca Drakulic has a travelogue.

There is genuinely not many good books written, in terms of english speaking authors. Very few of them are objective either, if we're talking about non-fiction. Don't even get me started on anglo authors who try to paint the serbs as the evil boogeyman, citing CNN as their main source. Noam Chomsky is an absolute meme as well, for other reasons.

As for fiction, we have quite a few authors but the english translations are meh. But maybe that's because Serbian is my native language.

In general you won't find many good books from the period itself or now on Yugoslavia because Tito and the commies ensured heavy revisionism, especially against the (patriotic) Serbs. There hasn't been many good non-fiction books written in the meantime either even in Serbian, let alone English, since time has barely passed.

This is why most great yugoslav authors like Ivo Andric stuck to mostly historical settings and non-political themes. Really, most of our best authors are from pre 1945. Death and the Dervish is a good novel which does have political themes, but it still has a historical setting.

This is coming from a Serb, but of course butthurt croats or albanians etc would call me delusional. Take it as you will.

Haven't read this but heard about it. Seems somewhat decent. Just don't fall for the Yugoslav meme some western authors tend to push. It was always a meme identity and even the most faithful of communists had to delude themselves into believing it (and even then they didn't).

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I'll look into it thank you. Why have you guys read about Yugoslavia or are you history buffs here?

Even non english is fine. I'm Diaspora.

bump

I hate you, please leave the board again

There isn't that many good books on it. However there is a TV series called Crno bijeli svijet (black & white world) which pretty much sums the last decade of Yugoslavia. I'm not sure if there is translation for it though, however it is uploaded on Youtube on original language.

Any language is fine. What did you guys think of Yugoslavia? It seems I am not the only diaspora in the thread.

Depends. If you're diaspora you're unironically better off talking to family (unless they're retarded komunjari kek) or even watching movies would give you a better sense of what daily life was like and so on.
If you're looking for over-arching historical works, you're out of luck. The best you can do is put together bits and pieces for yourself from our most important authors.

>Yugoslavia
Something that will live on as the greatest mistake in Serbian history. We could've simply united all Serbian lands in 1918 but threw it away to delusion. It has haunted us for the last century and will continue to do so.
But hey
>u titovo vreme se moglo na klupu spavat
kek

>u titovo vreme se moglo na klupu spavat
I will ask the rents later. See if they have anything from then.

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It was pure shit like any socialist country. Except we were living off the western world while the Iron Curtain made other socialist countries worse than us. Nationalism made sure the country would get ripped apart even if it weren't for the meme ideology we had.
It's better that there is no more Yugoslavia, I couldn't bear to give half of my GDP to feed the mongoloid southern Serbs.

Aren't the balkans ethnically all pretty similar?

My father is a full-blooded Croatian but he doesn't know any language. He was weened off by his parents so he could assimilate into Australia easier. I believe it's important to study and to connect with your past, not for any patriotic sense, but to appreciate the lengths your ancestors took for you to get here. Yugoslavia is also one of the most complicated and interesting experiments in history.

/end blog

Yes.

>brings up gdp
t. konjušar

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Isn't it sad then to hate each other? I feel the balkans are so insignificant alone. I worry about their future since they are so small.

>I worry about their future
Worry about yourself westerner. We survived 400 years of Turkish occupation, we can deal with this.

I diaspora.

History buff.

And I’m an anarchist, I don’t believe in nationalistic identity. It’s the name of a region with many different types of people. I don’t think communists deluded themselves about it, just held it together their way

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Most of your ancestor would call you a race traitor for leaving your country behind. There is no importance in studying a country you came from, no real values in that. The Balkans were always shitty and full of inbred villagers who started to try and be at least somewhat modernized. It's like if you took the culture of western Europe and mixed it up with pure nitric acid shit. It's just horrible, there is tons of superstition and a completely wrong understanding of Christianity. Mother Mary is literally more important than Jesus for most old religious people (which are only old women). Seeing a religious old men is a rarity and, if they are, it's mixed with ultra-nationalism (God is a Serb and he will help us/God and Croats). All music is either made to be played in nightclubs or just an extremely cringe attempt to imitate western music but to no avail as there simply isn't enough competition to filter out trash. People constantly blame the politicians and the politicians only for all the problems of our country while at the same time choosing only 2 parties (like the U.S.A) which offer the exact same shit just with a little bit of difference in left or right. The main problem are the people who are the niggers of the white race: lazy, stupid, materialistic, "war veterans=God among men", nationalistic about the wrong things, thing that every accomplishment in Sports is the best thing in the entire fucking universe in all it's multiverse variants, and just sucking the cock out of the fucking west.
My favorite thing is when Croats talk about how much pride they have about the nature/monuments in their country. All of it was not made by Croats :). The only Croatian thing about Croatia is some shitty medieval customs that nobody really fucking cares outside of Croatia.

Well, sorry there's no IDs. You must have a poor understanding of history if you say that though. It's not just the balkans that are at risk of losing their identity, everyone is. That's globalism.
You should read Seobe by crnjanski to see what Serbs went through and yet still managed to keep their identity. Funnily enough, forced assimilation was pushed harder under Austria than the Turks. Regardless though, for 400 years we safeguarded our tradition, even if it meant being at the bottom of the social rung. Now I don't think the same can be said for Croatians, for a number of reasons, but that's another story.

Any study of history will show that we will be alright, the East in general will be. It's the west that should worry in this regard.

>let me tell you about your people
kek, retarded tripfag. lying was the name of the game in communist yugoslavia. i think even zizek describes it well, where actually being a hardcore communist who believed in the teachings of marx, lenin, etc (later on, like 60s and 70s) was actually a major disadvantage to getting ahead. it was all one big lie.

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I love you butterfly. Please come to Slovenia and I'll meet you with Slavoj Zizek and we can talk about your sex life.

You are a genuine retard but you're right on croatians kek.
In any case, what can you expect after 50 years of communism? It has truly killed the mind and soul of most people here and produced a sort of schizophrenia.
We will recover though, like we always have.

No we won't. We'll die together with the rest of the western world. And don't talk about having survived the Turks because the Serbs today are nothing like the ones before.

>your people
>communist
>Marxist-Leninists
>statism
>anarchists with filled out name fields on anime porn sites for retards
Keep assuming stuff

>the Serbs today are nothing like the ones before.
Untrue. Unless you take your example to be our politicians and drugosrbijanci. There are still plenty of us who keep to our traditions, especially those living outside Beograd. Croats and Slovenians will die along with the rest of the west, but Serbs won't. Deep down, we are not truly Faustian, just like Russia. Spengler identifies the fact that Russia will live on despite the West and there's little reason to think we won't either. Orthodoxy will carry us through rough times, as it always has.

What the fuck you talking about? Its just a matter of time before we get invaded by hordes of muslims and niggers. The Balkans will be ottoman again because of our ellites and passivity

your literal inbred villagers are your future then.

Kek what are YOU talking about? Migrants don't want to come here because we have no gibs. Yes I know we have some migrants but they won't stay long. Migrants avoid the East and for good reason. There is nothing for them here.

Either way you're missing my point. Sure, we might get occupied (we are currently anyway), invaded, whatever. That's not the point. We are a small people, who can't easily defend ourselves against large nations like that.
The real battle of Kosovo was the 400 years following it, where Serbs refused to give over their identity in exchange for material status. This is what it means to be Orthodox. This is the only way we will survive in the long term. Njegos writes on this quite clearly.

Yes, actually. Serbia reclaimed its nationhood due to our villagers. Who was Karadjordje other than an illiterate, inbred villager? And yet Napoleon held him in high regard.

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yawn.

This is progressively being invaded by gypsies and Albanians.If you think that the orthodox faith will keep our identity, bad news, people are starting to be atheist based on the continuous influence of America. Its a matter of two generations and there will be no concept of Serbia or Croatia.

"So Help Me God" by Vojislav Dosenovich

>gypsies
Honestly not terrible, we can live with them in peace. The ones outside the cities aren't bad.

>Albanians
kek as soon as NATO collapses they will cease being a country. nothing to worry about at all here. we will take care of them quite easily.

>people are starting to be atheist
Drugosrbijanci are not people kek. In any case, the situation here is much better than the west. Over time, the people will return to the church. Communism only destroyed our souls temporarily.

would also like to know, or other similar places in that era

I dont know if have looked around you but a modern Serbian has no roots to the land, they are not much different from an American, only care about money, fashion and sports.

Communisn didnt just destroy our souls, it took them away.

I am diaspora but I've never been to Serbia. Will they be rude to me if I'm absolute shit at talking in Serbian? I can understand it

OP, just listen to Djordje Balasevic
youtube.com/watch?v=Uomlftk3AD8

stvarno...?
You don't think I notice this?
Anyway, already mentioned this earlier, Beograd is not the center of the planet. The further away you get from Beograd, the more Serbian it becomes funnily enough, na Kosovu, RS-u, itd.
Don't wanna type in Serbian because I've gotten banned for it before on here kek but you get the point.
And as long as there is a few of us, the traditions will survive.
I don't have much else to say, gonna bump this one more time. Maybe more anons can contribute some interesting books.

Of course not, but it's never too late to learn. Diaspora, especially younger diaspora moving back would help save this country kek. I know some younger people who were actually born overseas but moved back here after university.

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What are Drugosrbijanci?

Liberal, progressive (elite) of Beograd who HATE everything Serbian, who wish Serbia wasn't the way it was, that Serbia didn't have the history that it did, and that blame Serbians for absolutely everything that occurred in the balkans. Believe yugoslavia to have been a golden age and that Serbs ruined it all. Many of them work for western institutions, but many are just genuinely retarded. Many politicians fall into this category.
There is a similar phenomenon in Russia, it's quite interesting.

I once met an old man in Detroit who asked me my ethnicity, and when I told him, he angrily began to insist that no one is Bosnian, Serbian, etc. and that we were all Yugoslavian and that's the only thing he'll call himself.

Reading this as an outsider/diaspora is interesting, how can you blame Serbs for everything that happened? Seems strange. My family is Serbian and Bosnian and they'll blame everything on Ustaše because they were living in Croatia when the war happened. Do you know if there's still many Ustaše supporters in Croatia?

Not a book, but the film WR: Mysteries of the Organism

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>Ustaše supporters in Croatia?
My friend, Croatia today is just a continuation of the WW2 fascist state. The average Croatian is taught in school and unironically believes that only a few thousand Serbs civilians were killed in concentration camps during WW2, while the real number is closer to a million. They unironically believe that Dalmacija is Croatian, even though for literally all of history it was not. And they justify kicking out 250k serbs from Krajina.
>inb4 butthurt hrvati

And as for our liberals, they blame serbs because they see serb patriotism as something toxic, this is just what they were taught in communist times and by western propaganda today. They believe cetniks are worse than nazis, and that Orthodoxy is somehow jihadism.

>that's the only thing he'll call himself.
KEK, that's what we call a komunjar. aka delusional boomers who believe yugoslavia was perfect simply because they had a job and an apartment.

The collapse of Yugoslavia is a complicated subject, but it doesn't interest me very much. What interests me much more is how we could've made the fatal mistake of creating such a country in 1918. All of this could've been avoided.

It's kind of depressing that I'll never go and get to see the places my parents, my grandparents grew up in, while I see Croatia growing as a vacation spot for people who want to see where Game of Thrones was filmed. It's ghoulish. Is there a Croatian equivalent of Drugosrbijanci? Also, is it true that Bosnians are becoming more and more religious? My mother told me that any woman who wore a hijab would have been seen like an Amish woman in North America, just really old-fashioned, but I'm told it's increasing?

Yes, I went to Bosnia (Federacija) this summer, because my family lived there during Yugoslav times, but got kicked out during the 90s.

Went around to Sarajevo, Mostar, etc and it's sad now. You see so many women in full hijabs (the one that covers everything but eyes). They're building more mosques than ever. Mostly funded by Saudi Arabia and Turkey. These are people who, just a century ago referred to themselves as muslim serbs. The made up identity of "Bosniak" didn't exist back then. It makes me very sad.

And as for Croatia, I don't think so. Anything not conforming to the anti-serb narrative gets thrown out/pushed aside.
But hey, they got what they wanted. They are the most ethnically clean country in Europe :^).

>Not a single book rec
this is what happens when you ask for books on something that is connected with leftism.

there were a bunch at the start of the thread

This is so interesting to hear about, I feel like I don't know anything about what's going on in the Balkans nowadays. Is there anywhere in Serbia you would recommend visiting? You seem to dislike Beograd people a lot. I feel like I'd embarrass myself, I probably talk like a Croatian toddler.

Also, what do you think of Zona Zamfirova? I haven't seen it in a long time, but my grandma really loved that movie.

Seems like leftypol would've been better place to ask this for op, but 8ch is down, isn't it?

It's an interesting film, but funnily enough I prefer Yugoslav films. One of the few good things to come out of Yugoslavia.

Well I dislike Beograd because of what it's becoming/has already. Just another vapid, metropolitan capital, local govt destroying the city daily; although it isn't all that bad here. There are still good people and the city itself has a lot of fun things to do, from nightlife to museums, etc. Problem is the people here act superior to the rest of the country, especially the south. All the resources end up here.
As for the rest of Serbia, depends what you're into. Vojvodina has some of the nicest Austro-Hungarian architecture and history. Subotica and Sombor are my favourites personally. There's quite a lot of castles but they're not well kept, some like Golubac are. There's also monasteries if you're into that. Eastern Serbia has some amazing nature, especially the Danube on the border with Romania. In general there's quite a bit of nature stuff but I won't rant, you can google.
I would recommend Crna Gora as well. A lot more touristy things to do there and Kotor is absolutely breathtaking the first time you go there. The pictures don't do it justice.

>leftypol
>that commie /pol/
bruh, this thread was fine

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Thank you user, I will keep all of those in mind, I especially love old Austro-Hungarian architecture. I was thinking of visiting Vienna one day, but I think I'll try Vojvodina first. It was nice talking to you.

The Impossible Country: A Journey Through the Last Days of Yugoslavia

bunkerchan exists as the new home of /leftypol/
a concrete bunker for every ma, woman, and child, provided by the state at no charge

what's the name of that alternate history novel in which Yugoslavia never broke up?

can i come instead, i live like 3 hours from ljubljana or however it's spelled

libcom.org/library/yugoslav-self-management-capitalism-under-red-banner-juraj-katalenac

>Mother Mary is literally more important than Jesus for most old religious people (which are only old women)
Do you seriously think this?

>Orthodoxy will carry us through rough times, as it always has.
I've always had the feeling (judging by the people I meet and see) that Orthodoxy is almost completely gone from Serbia and remains only in some villages. Most of the people who tell you they are "Orthodox" aren't practicing any of it, and by that I don't mean that they aren't going to church but that they are living a hedonistic lifestyle.

Danilo Kiš is based as fuck. Patrician recommendation.

Can you provide a little more context? I'm interested

Ignore that God forsaken place. Everything there is held together by duct tape to this day. They had writers because the country needed them, not because they were in any way good at what they were doing. It's a monumental waste of time to read cheap copies of Tolstoy or Heine or any other important writer. Notice that I didn't use the word "influence", but cheap copies. It's the same with any art form there. If something worthwhile comes along it's once in hundred years and can't be called an exception, but an anomaly.

They were last at everything. They were even the last place in Europe that was reached by nationalism and they run with it to this day like it's their invention.

No :3

Every identity, in the way you are using that word, is made up. The different nationalities are based on fiction.

What do you think history is? A gathering of facts?

I swear every time I stumble upon someone from that place and they start rambling about their heritage or whatever, it's like talking to apes.