/ThG/ THEOLOGY GENERAL

There's no point in having these generals without any direction. Try to make it into a reading group or something, otherwise you're just going to get nonsense like this:

>Dude I'm right just trust me bro.
>If you don't you'll experience an eternity of unequaled torment and then you'll really feel sorry!

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Islam will save the west from its own heresy.
While Muslims are heretics themselves obviously, them being dominant in the western world will force everyone to return to a more traditional lifestyle, women will have to cover themselves again, people who like to get "stoned" will get stoned and God will return into everyday life.
I can't wait desu
Someone should write a book about this

How is it?

>implying European muslims aren't closet fags with political agendas who don't give 2 shits about their own convoluted doctrine

Are you an incel?

I don't know any books on the problem of evil besides those ones. I'm open to suggestions.

God here AMA

>Are you an incel?
Obviously but what does that have to do with anything?

>Old Testament uses words to refer to God in the most traditionally Semitic Diety sense, YHWH, El, etc.
>New Testament sets about referring to God in a now trifold nature that uses Greek philosophical metaconcepts like the Logos and Pneuma
Am I mistaken here or is Christianity almost a Hellenic religion with a Hebrew background foundation
and that's fucking cool

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Why do think the greek roman slaves liked it so much?

i used to enjoy theology, but the mental gymnastics involved became mind boggling. and of course because nobody can really understand aquinas or most other church fathers (it's difficult and requires time and context) apologetics has become popular; however it falls completely flat to me.

i suppose i just dont understand how the religion became so popular. the world doesnt seem to be much of a better place despite billions of people following the religion and its offshoots. i was raised in the tradition and can't shake the whole hell thing either, even knowing its logically ridiculous.

To anyone who feels like answering, I have a question. How should I best express my faith? I believe in God, believe in most of the Catholic doctrine, but also (due to personal experience as real to me as my daily routine) believe in some form of reincarnation, and other "mysticism" of various stripes that renders me incompatible to Catholicism. To ignore what I've seen is dishonest, to assume that I'm somehow better than every other believer and thinker, that I can be an "exception" is egotistical. Either knowing or not knowing scares me to death but I know that there is something worth knowing, and this keeps me up at night.

How to proceed?

Do you know what the St Paul says is better: faith, hope, or love?

I have an overwhelming fear of going to Hell, and when I think of standing before Christ I am filled with terror at the thought of not being worthy enough. Theology for this feel?

>>Dude I'm right just trust me bro.
>>If you don't you'll experience an eternity of unequaled torment and then you'll really feel sorry!

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no they wont

>fear of going to Hell
you'll go to hell for that

Is the Bible perfect and complete?
Why?

>>>Dude I'm right just trust me bro.
>>>If you don't you'll experience an eternity of unequaled torment and then you'll really feel sorry!

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Yes

It is a factual record

how can i get closer to god

I believe in the veracity of the Holy Bible. I don't believe it to be the be-all-end-all of Christian teaching.
There's a gap from ~400 b.c. to the time of Christ. Jesus makes allusions to prophecies that aren't seen in the O.T
Paul refers to writings that are nowhere to be found. Surely there are teachings of the other apostles lost to time.
The Bible itself makes no claims to be complete nor a perfect record.

If one honestly seeks the Truth and the Good, yet dies before they reach Christianity, are they going to suffer for eternity because they didn't find the truth fast enough?

If the records are lost then they will likely never be found which makes it still complete

There's also the Book of the Acts of Solomon which is alluded to in Chronicles I think, and most of the information in those lost books is found in the Bible I believe.

While one day we may recover some of them, the Bible is complete enough of a record that they would be unnecessary. I also think that many of those books were done away with by the Church because people used them to convert to Judaism

no

Eat, drink, and be merry. If you enjoy life, others will come to try and crush it for you. When they do, ask God to help

But isn't the only way to Heaven through Christ? Doesn't one require baptism?

Is baptism Christ?

You're pushing awfully close to the exact error the Jews made--forcing the Law of God on people in attempt to exert power over them, when you say that only through baptism can one get to heaven.

God Himself said that the people like Job got to heaven through their own righteousness, not through sacrifice. Baptism is a sign of goodwill to God, not righteousness.

Jesus will have to verify said righteousness if you want in, I'm sure of that.

I'm just going by what I know of Catholic doctrine and discussions i've had before

Im not a Christian, but I am open to it being the truth. I just struggle with the idea that one would go to hell for not being a Christian even if they had their heart open to it but lacked the faith.
I do not believe myself worthy of heaven, mind, nor do I only wish to be good to avoid hell. I'll just try to seek the truth and the good and hope for the best for myself and others.

There is part of the Bible where God says if you do not warn someone of sin, you are guilty of the sin they commit, not them. Same goes for knowledge of Christ

Who's to say they're lost as opposed to purposefully omitted due to the personal agenda of one of the compilers of the Bible? Sola Scriptura has doctrinal roots in the idea that leaders of the Catholic church were fallible and had deviated from the teachings of Christ. Why could they be incorrect and not the post-apostolic leaders who determined what would be canonical? God is perfect, not the Bible. To claim so is idolatry.
Even the word Bible comes from Greek 'Biblios' meaning books and indicating plurality. The Bible is a collection of writings and as such is incapable of referring to itself, so the idea that it is sole authority comes from without- Sola Scriptura is not in the bible and logically cannot be.

John 3:5, right out of the mouth of Jesus.

Good post

The Holy bible is fundamentally true through its entirety. Ask anything that bothers you. Lord Bless.

People that are in hell aren't able to pray for themselves, so it's important to pray for them and ask god to have mercy on them.

i thought that one was about the normal process observed during every human birth. or something

Many jews of the first century AD were speaking greek, the biggest part of the new testament was written in greek. pneuma that you mentioned just means 'spirit', logos can be translated as the 'most high'. its not a hellenic approach its a different languange approach.

That's the stated misinterpretation by Nicodemus. Read the whole chapter for more context, there's a pretty good explanation in it.

how are you cunts smart enough to use a keyboard but not to realize there is NO EVIDENCE for your belief and faith has nothing to do with facts.

the only basis you have for 'trusting' your bible, is eye witness testimony. a few people claim to have seen the resurrection. read your hume. which do you think is more likely, that a few people lied/are deluded (as you believe with the other bibles), or that the laws of physics were violated? People lie all the time, the physical laws are pretty fucking consistent. This is what you're basing your beliefs about the world on? let me guess, you hate fags too.

>people use the bible as proof of god
>hating fags is bad
dilate

Finished reading the Sayings of the Desert Fathers the other day. I wonder if we have become too liberal in our (human) offering of salvation. For the fathers, it seemed to be a continuous struggle their entire life.

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further proof God is an evil cunt
im not gonna worship that prick

The more I read that book the more I desire the monastic life. The idea of putting away the trappings and comforts of modern life and seeking an intimacy with God while alone sounds very spiritually appealing.

Bump

of course it does you hedonist scum

Am returning back to my muslim roots lately, life is looking up

>Matthew 28:18-19, Mark 16:16, Acts 2:38, 22:16, Romans 6:1-11, Galatians 3:26, Colossians 2:11-13, 1 Peter 3:21

Does any of this make baptism sound like its purely a sign of goodwill? The righteousness is from Christ but baptism certainly appears to be necessary nonetheless.

Have you looked at any monastery in particular?

>People that are in hell aren't able to pray for themselves
Why ?

Whatever experiences you may have had may be attributed to dark forces.

Why not read Hitchens and Dawkins instead? Catholicism without the pretension and padding, down to the Demiurgic misanthropy.

Follow the straight path of Islam and be rewarded in Paradise.
Inshallah you shall all yet see the truth of Allah.

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Insha Allah I'm on my path. I don't think I'm ready to take oath yet though. I pray for His guidance. Especially since I look at haram porn sometimes. Pray for me brother.

Brother, during times of temptations you must think, 'The Sahabah were tempted but did not fall', for Allah protects those who believe and gives them strength.

Thank you brother. I have much reading to do about Sunnah and the Quran. Thankfully my thoughts on women are changing. I've stopped seeing them as pieces of meat.

I have had a religious experience in church yesterday. They played Bach's Mass in B minor, and when it ended I felt shaken to the core, I was gasping for breath, my vision went blurry and my limbs went numb as I applauded, and at that moment I felt something clicked and took hold of me but could not make it out. I still cannot make sense of it, or tell how genuine or meaningful it was. Any resources for this? Was it real, was it "the moment"?

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I believe, and this is where Christianity can get really weird with multiple theories of time, that the soul of men experience aevum or "angel time" after death, meaning they can't really change or repent as they are now more like a single being stretched over an eternity rather than a changing entity experiencing material linearity, so if they enter aevum as sinners that is what they are.

I could be very wrong about the specifics here, don't take me as an authority. Hopefully someone who knows more will chime in.

no you just enjoyed the Bach
I think religious experiences are a meme, people of every faith experience them, are yours the only legit ones?

If this is your idea of a joke I'd like to be subjected to a tragedy.

God is universal you pleb, experiencing his love is not limited to one faith.
Religions doctrine comes later as a sort of guide.

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>pneuma that you mentioned just means 'spirit', logos can be translated as the 'most high'.
Proofs?

Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ λόγος, kαὶ ὁ λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν θεόν, kαὶ θεός ἦν ὁ λόγος

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>God is universal
whatever you say, enjoy burning in hell for picking the wrong doctrine though :)

You are correct

Logos CAN be translated in that way, but generally isn't, and for good reason. It reduces and constrains the concept. Pneuma means spirit, why you qualify this by saying "just," as if this is a trivial statement or definition, is beyond me. Even between different Greek philosophers, the way they treat the concept of pneuma varies greatly. Its not like there is some mundane definition that has been ignored by Christian thought.

Where do I start with Thomas Aquinas? what book?

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>>>>Dude I'm right just trust me bro.
>>>>If you don't you'll experience an eternity of unequaled torment and then you'll really feel sorry!

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I'd say his catechism to review the basics then move on to his greater works

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Holy Teaching by Fredrick Bauerschmidt. If you want to start reading him directly without any commentary then start with his Compendium of Theology because it was written to be understood by the layman. If you want to go deeper his commentaries on the Physics and Metaphysics are a good next step. You could jump into the Contra Gentiles too. There's no wrong way to go about it.

As far as secondary literature goes check out the One and the Many by Clarke Norris, Introduction to Scholastic Metaphysics by Edward Feser, and the Thoughts of Thomas Aquinas by Brian Davies. Brian also has some commentaries on the Contra Gentiles and Summa Theologia which look very good but I haven't read them.

>implying

youtube.com/watch?v=jxYbA1pt8LA

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What the duck is that channel

Problem of evil is best dealt with by Athanasius in "Contra Gentiles"

No BS, if you read that you will find the answer for evil and why it exists.

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Yes I have but I cannot join. It says on their website you need to be physically and mentally healthy and I am neither.

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absolute chadtism

I know monks have to be checked by a psychologist in order to detect "dark hidden desires" but nowadays monasteries are in need of novices, even "popular" monasteries in my country get like 50-100 requests a year and the valid people can be counted with one hand anyway; if you truly feel it's you vocation just go there, if it's truly your place, God will let you in.
I encourage you to read St Benedict Joseph Labre and Saint Joseph of Cupertino biographies, they also had the problem you describe
Good luck

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is this the /cath/ replacement thread janny keeps persecuting

Proofs of what dude? I'm greek. im translating the words in their literary sense.

my point was to constrain the concept of pneuma cause its really a bit dumb to move it further than what it is. my point was that the concept of pneuma is embeded in the old testament also! its not a new testament thing.

The Problem of Pain is one of Lewis's better works in my opinion, so that was a good choice.

As a greek, are you able to read Koine greek without much difficulty, similar to how we Anglos can read the King James English or Shakespeare for the most part without much trouble or the occasional footnote, or did you have to study it for a while?

Why is that tho? /cath/ threads were pretty civil. They deleted the threads I was making and even banned me for nothing.