Has anyone read this? I think its unfairly characterized as a departure from Cormac McCarthy's style, when in actuality it was published before McCarthy had a definitive style at all.
Anyway, I think its his best work. Even surpassing Blood Meridian, and the Road (even though No Country for Old Men is better than both of those IMO). It is an American Ulysses and it furthers the argument that Cormac McCarthy is the best living author.
I've only read Blood Meridian but Suttree is the only other book of McCarthy's I'm particularly interested in. Why are his other works worth reading, and why is this work better? Does Suttree have strong transcendentalist ihfluences the same way Blood Meridian does, what with the protagonist's departure from settled living from wild wand'ring, or am I mistaken in that assunption? How is it Ulysses-like?
>Why are his other works worth reading, and why is this work better?
I find his other works worth reading for their being accessible but still containing important and universal themes. I find this to be better because while it lacks the accessibility of his other works it has that "x-factor" which marks great books of years past.
>Does Suttree have strong transcendentalist ihfluences the same way Blood Meridian does, what with the protagonist's departure from settled living from wild wand'ring, or am I mistaken in that assunption?
There is certainly a departure from settled living, but I wouldn't call it transcendental. The book is semi-autobiographical, but I think the disdain for settled living comes more from Suttree's almost nihilistic rejection of meaning in life.
How is it Ulysses-like?
It shifts narrators, and narration style, often without warning. Sometimes evoking the stream of conscious of Ulysses. The biggest difference being that it takes place over ~5 years rather than one day.
McCarthy's prose is pretentious and affected, and the sentiment in his novels is anti-depression commercial tier.
A bit of bias from me aswell. It is the essence of Southern Gothic. I grew up in the American South and was traveling through Tenesee, Kentucky, and the Carolinas while reading it.
>McCarthy's prose is pretentious and affected
I can see why you say that but I disagree.
>and the sentiment in his novels is anti-depression commercial tier.
I don't understand this
>Why are his other works worth reading?
I don't really think they are. You can make an argument for The Crossing, but even there you'd be better off only reading select passages from it. His other books are fun but unremarkable
>Does Suttree have strong transcendentalist influences?
Absolutely. It's very cynical about the whole idea of transcendentalism, though, and about the protagonist's reasons for "transcending" his upbringing. It is less of an allegory than Blood Meridian, and also less of a social commentary.
>How is it Ulysses-like?
I'm not sure anything is quite like Ulysses. This book makes effective use of stream-of-consciousness, unreliable narration, and interiority (as a theme) - it's only like Joyce's novel in theory.
This is a wonderful book. It will always be a personal favorite of mine. Can't recommend it highly enough.
Non-Americans will literally never understand the spirit of McCarthy
It might be worth noting that the more purple-y / affected sections of the book are the inner narration of the protagonist, whose thoughts are (sardonically) florid. The first three pages are a good example of this.
Everyone saying "pretentious" should be ignored.
That's because non-Americans aren't niggers, and cannot comprehend the negro mind, whereas all Americans are niggers.
I found the witch and hospital scenes towards the end to be almost unreadable because of this
Well we went 10 replies without being derailed
>shifts narrators
Fuck, am I a brainlet? I never noticed this.
Suttree might be McCarthy's best. I grew up in SC, it always gives me strong nostalgia vibes.
Really? Man, not even No Country for Old Men? Harsh.
lmao. You weren't the only one. Purposeful noise is still noise, after all
The narration changes person several times
I spit upon your so called "American Spirit", you son of a dark skinned person. Your mother was a Walmart Janitor, and your father smelled like a McDonalds deep fryer.
the "narrator-switching" is mostly just between Suttree and Harrogate, so you probably did pick up on it. there are some ambiguous moments where we possibly enter the minds of certain minor characters, but that's mostly conjecture
Mexican here. Love McCarthy.
Mexico counts fren
OH, gotcha. I noticed the Suttree/Harrogate switch. I don't feel too bad now thanks anons
based. if anything, Mexicans have even more reason to appreciate McCarthy
>Harrogate
I don't think so, especially given that he was absent for the latter half of the novel
true. the perspective switches to what's essentially first-person / inner monologue Harrogate immediately before the watermelon scene, however (if I remember correctly)
beep beep pseud alert
I think that Harrogate is treated as more of a major character than he seemed to me while reading. I understand that he's important for humanizing Suttree, but other than that I think Ab Jones is more important than Harrogate.
Yes. It's great, possibly greater than Blood Meridian (it's really a matter of taste). Nothing else but Blood Meridian is worth reading from him. I don't get Cormac completionists
I wouldn't call myself a completionist, but I think Anton Chigurh is one of the best characters in the last ~100 years of literature and for that reason I think No Country is worth reading.
I agree. He stands out for his effective comic relief and memorable scenes. Some critics read the Suttree/Harrogate relationship as one that might exist between father and son: Suttree acts paternal towards Harrogate in a way which he failed to do for his own child, and which his father mostly failed to do for him. In their minds, it's supposed to be Suttree's "salvation" from his indolence and agonizing.
That's a bit of a projection IMO. Suttree is "saved" from himself (the so-called othersuttree that's closely related to his dead infant brother) and his despair (the symbolic hounds he keeps mentioning) by following part of his own father's advice: making peace with the establishment, giving up his alcoholism, and forgiving himself for his bourgeois upbringing + survivor's guilt. Like the author, he flees Knoxville and the doomed East to find a more authentic life in the West. Whether he succeeds at conquering his depression and inner demons there is up to the stars.
Great to see this book discussed on Yea Forums - it's one of the few I've read several times, each one in sheer bliss. IMO it rivals even the best Faulkner.
>I think Anton Chigurh is one of the best characters in the last ~100 years of literature
Well, then you're a fucking idiot. Really? 100 years? Do you know how much is encompassed in that period, you absolute drooling retard?
>Do you know how much is encompassed in that period
Not very much worth mentioning
Great counter, you should be proud
Try jumping into high speed traffic, some time. It'll be the one act in your miserable life worth mentioning
Just doing my part
>and which his father mostly failed to do for him
Can you elaborate on this? I don't recall much mention of his father outside of the one quote you mentioned
Well, the picture I got of Suttree's father comes mostly from intermittent thought fragments, a long with a direct quote from a letter he sends Suttree.
Suttree's father is some kind of important upper class guy. He is likely in the legal profession, either as a lawyer or a judge. He married a member of his household cleaning staff (possibly after knocking her up) to the chagrin of his family. She had twins, but Suttree's infant brother is a stillbirth - he doesn't learn this until he's 6-9 years old, when his uncle (mother's side) gets drunk and tells him.
Suttree and his father seem to have had a warm but distant relationship. There is a brief flashback scene in which childhood Suttree has a fever and his father comforts him. As an authority figure, his father looms in his mind: the narrator mentions that the most fear Suttree has felt in his life was of his father, while "in the aftermath of some child's transgression" (like breaking a lamp while playing). Suttree grows up witnessing the contempt and class disparity that exists between the two sides of his family. He has at least one living brother, likely from his father's previous marriage. As adults, they are said to be polar opposites, and likely received unequal treatment as children. Suttree internalizes his class alienation: in a conversation with his Uncle John, he claims that "when a man marries beneath him, his children are beneath him," and that he was "expected to turn out badly" by his father's family. Several dream sequences reveal that Suttree pictures the "superego" part of his psyche as having his father's face, and that he fears leading a dead existence as part of the so-called Southern gentry. He reveals a youthful fascination with the lower classes, including an early friendship with good ol' boy Jim "J-Bone" Long (at one time employed by his father). Suttree develops a deep contempt for what he perceives to be his father's bourgeois hypocrisy; he identifies with the dregs of society, and cultivates the belief that he is no better than even the lowliest of them. This is the beginning of his self-imposed asceticism on the Tennessee River.
When Suttree ends up in the workhouse (after being a drunken accessory to a drug store robbery), his father all but disowns him. After a time, he dissuades his wife from trying to contact her son. He is too proud to seek Suttree out in person, and likely only writes him for the sake of his daughter-in-law + grandchild. Suttree's contempt for authority is partly due to his father, partly due to the false erudition he observes in his college professors, and partly due to his experience in the workhouse + his association with lovable degenerates. He despises the arrogance which the rich, the clergy, and those in charge (like cops) use to place themselves above society's detritus. He likely feels that his own child would be better off fatherless than with a father who is anything like Suttree's, or who is as jaded as himself.
I agree. Anyone here read his early stuff? Did he ever have restraint? I get the feeling he's at the point in his career where people don't dare suggest he's too far up his own arse.
I enjoyed blood meridian more, but suttree really stuck with me. I can't decide which I like more, but suttree is really funny and an absolute joy to read.
The scene where he has to help his friend move that corpse was one of the funniest things I've ever read.
Isn't there something snobbish in disqualifying things you don't like as being hard to understand and thus anyone who attempts to understand it are stupid?
Do you know what pretentious means
I don't have anything to add, but this is a great analysis. Thank you fren, heres a (you)
Fuck yeah dawg I loved this book. Definitely ranks as my favorite McCarthy. I was really into the violent slice of life thing it had going for it.
>tfw browsing the catalogue and see a thread for your favorite novel
I don't have the words to tell you how much of an impact Suttree had on me. I can now look back at my past and see it neatly segmented between when I had not read this book and after I read it. It set off a certain chain of events in my life. I created an album of music based on where my life went after reading it. Perhaps because it is so deceptively dense, the book is one of the best kept secrets of contemporary literature.
Last year I had the opportunity to stop in Knoxville. I did not have much time but there was something profoundly spiritual about walking those streets, walking down to the river, walking beneath the massive concrete bridges. As the sun set and the dim evening faded into the young night. Standing about where that houseboat must have been. Limn in the very same twilight he lived in sixty-five years ago.
>Nothing ever stops moving.
As someone that has lived in Knoxville most of his life, I love Suttree. I went around to every location and reread the events that happened there it was great
The Crossing was better.
Suttree is probably my favorite book period. It's the only book that I reread probably about once a year. I've read all McCarthy's books except Cities of the Plain and a couple of his non-novel publications and honestly I applaud Blood Meridian for being unparalleled in scope and high concept but in terms of actual enjoyment it's in like the 50th percentile of his books. IMO Suttree has far more beautiful prose and is overall his strongest release, but I might be biased because I much prefer his appalachia shit before he went full western
Hey thanks for a reasonable counterargument friendo. Consider suicide you’re outside too hyuckhyuckhyuck geez thanks.
>not George Smiley
The easy answer is that McCarthy has devised an American rhetoric after Faulkner/Hemingway/Steinbeck at a time where that mostly relied on some external schtick (like Phillip Roth being a northeastern Jew), and this makes him extremely readable without necessarily being polarizing. I thibk of it like I do Steinbeck’s minor stuff; it might not be worth much culturally but it’s a good way to kill four hours and not fry your brain. One book I’m surprised no one has mentioned is Child of God. While I’d agree it definitely falls short of any of his secondary works (perhaps No Country, parts of the Border Trilogy, and The Road), the intensity of its prose style is pronounced and ought to be studied closer. I think the same for The Road but solely within the bounds of understanding how and why American critics are just not turning to ecological themes in texts as blatantly ecological.
It was a good book but I preferred Blood Meridian and No Country because I'm Texan and those settings are more relatable. Nonetheless Suttree was a great read and I intend to read all of Cormac's works
I've read four of his novels and have decided only recently that I'm going to read the rest. I took a year off from him before deciding that. Give it time. He's the kind of author that takes time to write, so his work should be given time to be read
Interesting. I'm Texas born but now live in Appalachia.
yeah Suttree is fucking great
No Country over Suttree is weird. No Country is definitely among his worst.
How are you liking it as compared to Texas?
The movie was great and the sheriff narration sections in the book were also great. I just finished Suttree whereas No Country has been in my life long before I ever heard of Cormac McCarthy. Maybe I'll appreciate Suttree more when I reread it. Blood Meridian definitely needed a second read and it was worth it. I might even read it a third time