Has there been a shift where villains are actually just victims of what the company considers "outdated" cultural and...

Has there been a shift where villains are actually just victims of what the company considers "outdated" cultural and societal aspects of the family model? Both Disney's Encanto and Pixar's Turning Red came out pretty close together and had an almost identical message of "you are old, let the youth become the matriarchs of the family as they are better people than you".
Do you think this is going to be a constant trend moving forward or was it just coincidental?

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Maybe it's the globohomo agenda of "your tradition bad, our values good"
Maybe it's just a coincidence and you forgot your meds again OP

Encanto
>Mirabel's door is the front door to the house, making her one of the most important family members
>everyone gets to enjoy the miracle
>Abuela is a bitch because she survived a war
Turning Red
>Mei's whole family is permanently exiled from their family's historical and cultural legacy
>Ming is a bitch because of grandma
>Grandma is a bitch because... she just is!
Why is Domee Shi so cruel to her own family?

>Mei's dad is based as hell because Domee's dad was supportive irl
>which means her mom was probably a domineering hellcat

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Not OP but since you mention it I think that's exactly what they plan, how insidious

There's been a general shift to have less outright evil villains and more morally gray antagonists, Mei's mom and Mirabel's grandma are examples of over controlling family members who realistically would never accept they're wrong, but it's fine because it's a fictional movie so whatever with a sympathetic reason for why they are the way they are.
>you are old, let the youth become the matriarchs of the family as they are better people than you
I'd argue that wasn't exactly the message, the young ones didn't become the matriarchs of the family, they just needed less expectations and more freedom.

oh hi, mommyanon.

I don't have much to say here, just that I hope this thread doesn't get deleted.

And that Turning Red is a very personal story.

I know they tapped into the Chinese culture thing a bit, but in the foreground Ming was really just a mother who had a tumultuous childhood and was afraid of "losing" Mei, so she was very clingy and overprotective, which is not only a parenting issue but a personality issue.

Rather, it's understanding between generations. In neither movie do family traditions end.

A lot of Canadian chinks are like this. They can't go back to China because China won't take them, and they know Canada laughs at them for being chinks, so they are bitter about their lives and have to double down on "muh tradition is the real thing" and work extra hard to conform to Canadian standards, even if Canadian standards for chinks are basically clowns with deep pockets

I don't know, but I'm already sick of "family drama is the villain"

dichotomy of teenagers

Mirabel from Encanto only breaks the rules to save her family and her home.

Meilin Lee from Turning Red is just fed up with her mom's bullshit and wants to do whatever the hell she wants. but she still wants to be loved by her mother of course.

Most of the Wu branch resides in Florida in the US. I think Ming and Mei are the only ones who are Canadian, and it's because Ming fled from the rest.

I'll just consider Turning Red as the capstone on it...

or... maybe Grandma Wu just retired there?

Just a thought.

Unless you're really hankering for the prequel "Seeing Red" to be set in Miami.

>the Lee-Wu clans are dramawhores
>meanwhile based Abby the Korean and chad Tyler the Viet are well adjusted and beloved

So is it primarily a Chinese issue and not an East Asian cultural issue?

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I have seen most negative audience reviews say that since Meilin is unlikable/annoying, the movie is bad.

Did find maybe one review that said since Ming is so bad, she can't be redeemed... unlike Abuela from Encanto!

Also some reviews that said because Mei and Ming's relationship was so toxic, the movie was bad.

Also some reviews that said the movie was just "angry" in nature.

>Tyler the Viet are well adjusted and beloved

is he though?

A lot of artists have family drama stories to tell, it was just a matter of time really.

>"They fuck you up, your mum and dad..."

This shit happens everywhere. Encanto also deal with it and Encanto are spics

The entire family says they came all the way to Canada to "assist" Ming. Who, of course, despises all of those cocksuckers and wishes they wouldn't show up. She definitely tried to cut them out of her life because of how they were all spoiled while she felt abused.

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I thought Encanto's message was how a family can be torn apart if you don't treat each other like family and only care about how productive each member is being. People don't leave families if they're not toxic like Bruno does.

yeah but who tf immigrates to Canada... that's a big leap. Not saying it's a bad idea, but it's hard to do. Wouldn't it be easier to just move to a different corner of the USA, if Ming is indeed USA-ian born?

It's pretty funny that the films essentially lead to a debate on Twitter about racial issues and western supremacy. Westernized people saying the women are abusive and irredeemable, while actual Asian and Hispanic families saying "fuck off, that's just how things are, we don't need you to talk down to us and try to act superior".
All because of Disney movies directed towards second and third generation immigrants.
THE RACE WAR STARTS NOW

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Yeah I appreciate the new territory for these studios, but I've had my fill

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Isn't it harder to immigrate to the States than it is to go to the Provinces?

There are a LOT of Chinese in Canadia.

You rather it be like Raya and the Last Dragon?

Speaking of Raya, all three of these films are getting graphic novels next week. I hope they look good.

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>There are a LOT of Chinese in Canadia.
OK what I meant is there aren't that many USA-ians who actually become Canadian citizens. but maybe I'm full of shit.

No, I’d rather it be a good movie.

OK edgelord lol.

How about you chill and look at what non-immigrant Chinese people think of the movie?

It's really chill.

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>what non-immigrant Chinese people think of the movie?

have seen some informative videos from a mainland Chinese pair of youtubers (don't ask me how they circumvent the firewall)

and someone from Taiwan who gave context on xiào or 孝, which is in the first shot of the movie.

You already know it was reviewbombed in the west and east for different reasons though.

huh? You think the score in China is artificially low?

I agree that it's suspicious in imdb and rottentomatoes audience, but what do you see wrong with Douban?

I remember having a friend tell me beating your children is okay if you're a minority because that's how things are.What the fuck is wrong with people.

ever think he'll have one of those days?

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have heard some complaints from Asian people that the movie is slightly inauthentic culturally.

Like it's not quite the pap that 1998 Mulan was, but it's not the straight dope either.

My perspective is that it's a movie, and it functions as wish fulfillment.

He's a masochist.

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kek... I bet you were telling your friend to go full Meilin on his mom's ass.

Douban as a movie rating site is basically chink imdb, but Douban forums is a whole different animal.

>Douban forums
oh... well I know absolutely nothing about that

shitt... Disney villians used to be gay dudes. Now it's moms.

Time marches on.

>"Ming, maybe we should trust her..."
Well damn if that's not something that could have ended the movie right there...

>godddamnit Ming so sick of your bullshit but that panda pussy game ridiculous

Abby is a sociopath and once she's older everyone starts slowly backing away from her

antoganist =/= villain you fag

she's cute when her freakouts don't involve humiliating her daughter

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don't talk to a mother who won't let her children watch a Pixar movie like that.

I just want bad guys to be bad guys because they are bad and we're supposed to not like them. Why is that so hard to do now?

oh hey! Sassy hand movement there.

"Who do they think they are? Celine Dion?"

Sassy hand movement in Meilin.

"You're getting the panda!"

shit someone should make a webm of that or something.

>I just want bad guys to be bad guys because they are bad

>...duh!

Billie Eilish really is everywhere... bad guy song used in Sing 2, and Bad Guys of course... then she co-writes the songs for this movie.

The Jin and Ming relationship is actually pretty interesting because it is realistic in a very depressing way. He wanted to "save" her but this isn't a fairy tale (so to speak). She was already broken by the time he found her, and he just added more stress to her life by causing her to try to kill her mother to keep him as a supportive friend and lover. They managed to separate themselves from her toxic family, but she didn't really get better. In fact, in some ways, she became worse, and took on the traits of the woman she hated so much. Plus, it seems as though she either fell out of love with him or really struggles to display her love for him. The only characters she ever defends or shows affection towards are her daughter and the demon trapped in her necklace. Mei seems incredibly shocked to discover the reason Wu and Ming had a falling out was to defend her father; it seems almost impossible to her, because all Mei sees is how demanding, controlling, and cold Ming is to him.

However, he never stopped loving her and even mastered the way to seal her dark side away in case of emergencies to get his wife back. So he's both a beta and a chad.

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I'm just tired of this tragic villain trope. It's been done to death.

honestly I think Jin just functions as a therapist for Ming... or maybe he used to.

BIG
PANDA
BUNDA

You'd be surprised to see the lengths of suffering and bullshit men will go through if the woman is worth it.

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>It's been done to death.

so you want the stuff they did 30 years ago back. Good stuff.

Not saying either is good or bad.

definitely sassy

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just imagine Jin giving an epic speech to Ming every night for years on end... just like he did for Meilin.

oh hell yea, thank you webm user

>Jin encourages Mei Lin to attack Ming
>says "oh noooo" very unconvincingly when he notices Ming's guardian seal is broken and she's transforming
>immediately goes into action to save the day as rehearsed
>Mei and Ming and Wu are all grateful and loving towards him and he's the hero of Toronto that stopped the SkyDome assault

He was playing 4D chess and everyone else was playing checkers.

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It's just another ruse by corporate america to divide families and make children and yound adults reliant on corporate products rather than their families.

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he gets to say nice things to her every day to make her feel better

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I know you're right. I will never forgive this actual degenerative behavior. Unfortunately, it will work. It's almost impossible to avoid.

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Man, Jin is a lucky SoB. Gets to actually live out the savior fantasy many of us only dream about without the girl getting all disgusted with the "ick" and leaving him.

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