Why did the joker wear this tourist outfit for the killing joke when he shot barbara?

Why did the joker wear this tourist outfit for the killing joke when he shot barbara?

I’ve heard some people say it’s because he took pictures but that seems kind of low effort

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He thought it would be funny.

Ummm because he the funny? And killing someone in that shirt would be... funnee?

I think I always thought it was sort of a "disguise" but you know not really since he wasn't actually trying to hide that much.

it goes with the camera to make a tourist ensemble. kinda weak but that's what we got.

he didnt kill anyone in that shirt

I decided to look up the script Moore sent Bolland to see if it explains why, and this is what I found:
>He can be dressed however you please (since he has to have a camera later in the script perhaps some loud and ghastly tourist gear would look appropriate, with a Hawaii shirt and Bermuda shorts and the camera slung round the neck. If that doesn't look any good then dress him how you please and feel free to put the camera somewhere else).

So did he intend to paralyse her and not kill her or what?

How did he immediately know she was paralysed when he shot her? (He even joked about it)

Jeez. You can tell Moore really didn’t care about the Killing Joke as much as his other work. He often had pages detailing panels for stuff like Watchmen or V for Vendetta. Bolland was the one who asked him to write for this comic IIRC, and he has said himself he didn’t do as good a job he thinks he could have.

It’s funny because it’s still a great comic it’s just mediocre for Alan Moore. (Ignoring his shite like necronomica or crossed)

Killing Joke is all the better off because Moore wasn't trying to make a deconstructionist statement and because Bolland's art did most of the storytelling.

Yeah, you’re not wrong. He wasn’t trying to make some grandstanding moral point or deconstruct things. it was Moore just telling a fun story with the joker and Batman as their natural selves.

Especially since he even did it in a kind of “what if” mode. Specifically writing an out if any other author didn’t want that backstory for joker he showed.

Was it even made canon that Barbara was indeed paralysed at the time or was that only after the killing joke sold very well?

he got back from vacation I thought it'd be funny if he just shot her when he got back

He wanted to insinuate that hurting batman is like holiday for him
He enjoys it

>Was it even made canon that Barbara was indeed paralysed at the time or was that only after the killing joke sold very well?
I think it was always canon. She had been semi-retired as Batgirl for the past few years. DC seemed to want to get rid of her, probably because they saw her as a reminder of the Adam West show.

>Killing Joke is all the better off because Moore wasn't trying to make a deconstructionist statement
The entire comic was a metacommentary about how Batman and Joker will never have and ending because their characters are not allowed to change. It was Joker giving up on flamboyant traps, fart balloons and jetpacks for shooting Batgirl in the spine and raping her then being sad because he hates his life. It was Batman trying to talk with Joker and having a heart-to-heart saying how he doesn't like punching mental patients and wants him to rehabilitate.
What the fuck are you on bullshitting that it wasn't "deconstructionist". You've constructed such an elaborate boogeyman in your head that you fail to see it where it actually is. Killing Joke is the most deconstructionist comic in mainstream DC.

It felt more like it reinforced the status quo if anything, that Batman and joker will always be at odds. Gordon doesn’t break. Batman doesn’t give up. Joker shows the tiniest hint of humanity and then remains convicted to his path

Moore's own words
>"I don't think it's a very good book. It's not saying anything very interesting".[41]
>"The Killing Joke is a story about Batman and the Joker; it isn't about anything that you're ever going to encounter in real life, because Batman and the Joker are not like any human beings that have ever lived. So there's no important human information being imparted...Yeah, it was something that I thought was clumsy, misjudged and had no real human importance. It was just about a couple of licensed DC characters that didn't really relate to the real world in any way."[43]

It's like Alan Moore makes the Youtube video essay takedown of his own books.

>raping
Why do people keep insisting that he raped her?

Moore is fucking retard. I love the guy but he’s just kind of a dumbass

He also said this about CROSSED. when he decided to write for it

>HMS: When you first approached Crossed, before you necessarily decided to write something of your own, what about it struck you as being "real" or significant in some way?

>AM: Well, I'm ashamed and embarrassed to admit that the first time I started reading Crossed I got maybe 1/3 of the way in and I had to put it down. I just thought, "This is too horrific, it's too brutal, I'm an old man, don't do this to me. This is just really upsetting". And I spoke to Garth [Ennis] and Garth was accepting that it was a point of view, he also said it was a pity that I hadn't persevered with it because they'd put all of the most deliberately upsetting stuff up front to get respect, if you will. And then they were exploring the different issues afterward. By that time, I was convinced in my admiration for Garth's work. I think that he is one of the finest writers in the medium. So I went back and read it again without my squeamish revulsion, and I found that actually it was one of the most profoundly moral pieces that I'd read.

How the fuck is CROSSED morally profound lmao. It’s torture porn. How is Garth Ennis one of the finest writers he’s known? I love his punisher stories but crossed is just a masturbation session of depravity

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It seems probable. The images they used were sexually suggestive

>How is Garth Ennis one of the finest writers he’s known? I love his punisher stories but crossed is just a masturbation session of depravity
Well, he is the best hellblazer writer. Was always sshocked Moore never did hellblazer

Because they themselves would have raped her

It is amusing, because joker definitely just took pictures of her. He was a massively asexual character. Especially during the killing joke era before Harley

It’s just people assuming he MUST have raped her because he took naked pictures of her wounded body.

It even happened in the animated movie, they took one panel from the shot of Batman talking to prostutes (wordlessly in the comic) while searching everywhere in Gotham for the joker. In the animated movie the prostitutes said joker always visited them after he got out of Arkham. But not this time. Implying he fucked Barbara instead

he joker visiting prostitutes is ridiculous. He never came across as a sexual being like that. And what prostitute would take the joker as a customer lol.

I know it wasn't Moore's intention, but the context is pretty obvious. She was definitely as least sexually assaulted by being stripped.

Moore disowned TKJ soon after publishing it. At every opportunity he talks about how it was a mistake. Not only did it ruin Batgirl, but also was one of the penultimate "ow the edge" comics that Moore doesn't really appreciate. Remember, Watchmen was his greatest work, and that story laughed at exactly the kind of stuff TKJ spawned.

seems more likely a guy would just take humiliating pictures. it'd feel ooc for him to suddenly turn rapist.

IIRC Moore didn't intend for it to come across as rape either, so that just reinforces my head-canon that it didn't happen.

I disagree. I think he just stripped her and took pictures while laughing.

Joker just wasn’t a sexual entity, at least then

Also the bullet piercing her was enough of a penetration. I don’t think sticking his dick in her would make much difference so who cares

>I don’t think sticking his dick in her would make much difference so who cares

I agree, and would say it's haunting in a different way. She was in the palm of his hands, but all he did was expose and leave her to die after shooting her.

Feels much more joker-y for the event to be more of a:
>I could have done anything and everything to you; yet, I didn't! Ha ha!

Because it was a joke

Yep. As far as joker knew. She died five minutes after he left. Or was paralysed. He didn’t care.

He obviously only cared about tormenting a Gordon for his specific goal. I think Gordon not knowing if his daughter was alive or dead is worse than saying “haha I stuck my dick in her lol”

per Brian Bolland that was never the intention nor he thinks he left contextual clues towards it. what he did leave clues about though, he says, was that it was gordon who was raped instead

>what he did leave clues about though
Such as?

>opens with batman interrogating the Joker in Arkham
>turns out its just some random inmate wearing Joker's clothes
>Joker puts on a disguise and shoots Barbara Gordon and kidnaps her father
>goes back to his hideout and dons a spare set of joker clothes

I always saw it as Joker being some sort of outsider, where a domestic setting such as a warm house is foreign to him whilst the abandoned amusement park feels more like home. Also, he sees humans more like zoo animals than actual people.

Once you go Clown you never back down

>>turns out its just some random inmate wearing Joker's clothes
>jokers clothes

Since when was random Arkham asylum jumpsuit “jokers clothes”

he was also stripped naked and we seven see him on a leash like some bdsm freak

I'd say its more because its Bolland's book, so he'd feel guilty having him draw something he didn't want

I guess cause crippling (and raping maybe) is like a vacation for Joker I guess? Has Moore ever given an explanation other than "blurgh blurgh magix comics should be about Marxism blurgh" yet?

I mean he does have Barbara and Gordon stripped naked. Why not just capture them? Or just kill them? Why torture them naked? Cause its assault that's why

Some women are sexually attracted to clowns actually

He always wrote very detailed notes but gave his collaborators total freedom you complete dipshit. Look at the Watchmen scripts and notes it’s the same. He’s literally describing one panel with a whole paragraph what do you want.

>Joker's not sexual meme
I only hate the "Joker and Batman are lovers" meme more.

>but that seems kind of low effort

Joker's not as funny as he thinks he is

It is OOC of him to rape, but he's done it in other comics, which retroactively makes him a potential rapist. Just like the retarded Three Jokers retconned his Killing Joke backstory as being such an abusive dickweed the entire Gotham PD helped fake his wife's death.

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Azzarello Joker is basically Elseworlds though. Not really proof of Joker being canonically a rapist. They said unfortunately modern Joker's relationship with Harley is canonically abusive so he does do shit to women regardless of the story.

the location of the bullet.

I would love if a movie about their relationship would end with Joker getting access to a nuke or having someone dear to him or someone else as an hostage and Batman has no way out.

He is tied up and the Joker gave him a gun to shoot at him with and make him break his rule. But, this time, in complete desperation and even madness, Batman raises it and shoots the Joker.

Just as the Joker was about to blow up Lois Lane or Alfred in a comedic manner, the empty gun keeps clicking as Bruce keeps trying to shoot him.

The Joker for the first time in the mythos, stops laughing and looks legit sad and calls off his plan.

"You...actually tried it.
Just like that."

>Realizing that this was a "We're done" from Batman, the Joker starts to cry out of both satisfaction and legit sadness as he simply walks into an open balcony and looks back at Bruce.

"It was...fun...nny."

>The joker jumps to his death and Batman eventually escapes, and without a word he just frees the hostage and leaves.
He abandons being Batman since he no longer feels complete without the prince of crime. Every criminal was nothing compared to him, not a challenge nor a battle of morals or wits, just petty people trying to get shit for free.
In the bat cave, he simply a couple of months later, he posts a selfie of himself wearing the bat suit to Twitter and then shoots himself in the chest with the Joe Chill gun


-----

A couple of weeks later i get my Oscar.

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>that seems kind of low effort
The simple answer is usually the correct, he is a tourist taking some shots.

Why not what else he would be wearing for taking pictures? a black trench coat?

its lefunny and lolrandom
I really cant explain it any better.

Abusive doesn’t mean sexually abusive. He’s clearly beat Harley physically but that doesn’t mean he’s raped her or anything

Yeah like a paparazzi outfit. Especially if he was in disguise.

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why the fuck did other american comic book writers kept the crippled batgirl because of Killing Joke? are those people retarded?

It started off as a Batman/Judge Dredd proposal, and when that fell through Moore just let Bolland choose what he wanted to do a comic on and followed him.
Honestly I agree with Moore on his thoughts about it. It's not a massively pleasant or enjoyable comic and despite how ubiquitous "one bad day" has become, it doesn't really have anything to say like Moore's other books. It's just nasty for nastiness' sake. Bolland's art is probably the best thing about it, and judging from how he doesn't want the original Higgins colours, he's not the best authority on it either.
The only thing about TKJ that really sticks with me is Batman's "I've been thinking lately" speech, which comes into my head every so often

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It's Moore, rape is to be expected. It's like people wondering when Mohiro Kitoh was going to have half the characters in his volleyball be raped and/or killed by humans or cosmic beings.

Dress like a tourist, moran

Agreed. Moore is great because for him this was a favour for a friend more than anything. But

>one bad day
>Batman’s speech pleading for the joker to try reforming because otherwise it will end badly

Are still fantastic

Jokers actual “backstory” is pretty banal. I just think the idea that Joker was a normal man once is essential to his character

If he was a ruthless killer before the chemical dip like in BTAS, what’s the desperation for Batman to hope he returns to sanity? So he goes from insane serial killer to sane serial killer?

Joker being a semi-normal man once is the most interesting interpretation

I wonder what Moore thought of the Joker movie

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That’s actually pretty good. The only thing I personally might differ on is Batman killing himself because Joker died. But I guess it would make sense given how many times Bruce has saved Joker’s life in the comics.

I think the point was for Joker to be like a tourist “shooting photos” both literally and metaphorically. And the juxtaposition of tourist Joker against a heinous crime is kind of darkly comedic and in-character for him.

This is also something I’ve wondered. To my knowledge Killing Joke was meant to be a one-off yet writers wanted crippled Batgirl to be canon?

>Realizing that this was a "We're done" from Batman, the Joker starts to cry out of both satisfaction and legit sadness as he simply walks into an open balcony and looks back at Bruce.
Kek isn't that sort of how the Lego batman movie began?

The Killing Joke wasn't out of canon or anything. They had to ask for editorial permission to paralyse Barbara, and then once it was released to critical and commercial success everyone else incorporated it