Was the New 52 the end of DC? While COIE did a good job of streamlining the universe into a new continuity...

Personally, I would argue Identity Crisis and Infinite Crisis are stronger signifiers of DC’s decline. After their release, DC barely had any real notable works. There were exceptions such as Morrison’s Batman and All-Star Superman, as well as Johns’s Green Lantern, but aside from those, most of the company’s output was either mediocre or downright bad. The New 52 did see a brief resurgence in quality with a select few titles, but nothing on par with DC’s works prior to both of the aforementioned events.

The New 52 needed another Secret Origins type book. Something to lay down what the new canon was. As it was it was a mess

it always amused me that right almost after JLA/Avengers was over, DC came out with Identity Crisis and Marvel with Avengers Disassembled.

Of course in the long run Marvel managed to turn the Avengers into what the X-Men used to be, but Disassembled was a clear break of the more "classic" Busiek era and the brief Johns era. IC was just sad to read, even in the Goodwin-edited Starman the subject of rape was handled in a less lurid way.

I don't think so, they just launched Earth One the year prior and that was doing huge sales.

All Star "failed" in the sense that not only did both books were extremely late (it was expected that Quitely would be late but somehow the book with Lee/Miller was way more delayed), but the other books planned were also delayed (Adam Hughes' All Star Wonder Woman, Geoff Johns and JG Jones' All Star Batgirl, and possibly some others) and never got made or released.

It's way more of a Frankenstein Monster than you'd think

You have Jim Lee and Wildstorm aesthetic
You have Didio pushing Silver/Bronze but darker
You have Geoff Johns trying to do his thing but no longer has the reliance of the old continuity and is also busy with overseeing DC movies and TV at the time but still has some kind of say in things (Shazam, etc)
You have Bob Harras and his trusted people from 90s Marvel
You have editors who used to work for Wizard
You still have 00s DC editors like Berganza

I think 1998-2000 was the transitional period
Goodwin died
O'Neil retired
DC buys Wildstorm
Johns does Stars and STRIPE and joins JSA
Warren Ellis and later Mark Millar write Authority
Superman 2000 pitch gets rejected (which has huge ramifications for the comics industry because it leads to Millar working at Marvel at the right time he could've thrived there)

Maybe 1998-2002.
In 2002, Mike Carlin retired as executive editor and was replaced by DiDio.

Wildstorm died for nothing.

It seemed like after IC most of the mainline declined badly during the 00s. Superman was fine when Johns and Busiek was on it, but went off the rails with New Krypton. Green Lantern is fine if you liked Johns' take, but if you don't you're one of those people crying about it on the Comicon boards or something. Same with Morrison's Batman. JSA was alright until Johns leaves and then it goes off the rails.

The ones that were decent were usually out-of-continuity stuff (All Star Superman, New Frontier, Secret Identity, Batman Year 100, The Spirit, etc) or stuff that wasn't affected much (Jonah Hex).

im still angry they botched rebirth so much
2016 DC comics were good for like a year

I think what amazed me was not that it got botched, but how badly everything drastically got botched during the Bendis to COVID era

>New 52 was 11 years ago

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I wonder what a good capstone to DC Comics as a universal whole would be, story-wise. COIE? Final Crisis? Blackest Night?

no

Perfectly fine may be upselling it. DC was in decline post Final Crisis and Blackest Night. The New 52 was partly due to influence from the new corporate structure but also due to an aimlessness after the "architect era" faded out.

OP may be upselling it, but as the New 52 continued on, it got way worse than post-FC/pre-FP era DC.

That's tough because a lot are not really satisfying endings.

COIE ends with a merged Earth but with everyone still the same as before in personality so I guess if you pretend it ended there maybe it could work, if you don't care for the post-COIE era of DC.

Infinite Crisis ends with the big 3 deciding to take a break, the survivors of COIE either killed and/or defiled, and a new history for Earth, with the parts that fans didn't like, unresolved.

Final Crisis ends with Bruce stuck in the past and still leads into the rest of Morrison's Batman run.

Blackest Night ends with only a few characters brought back to life and it's not really satisfying when so many other characters remain dead.

They did that with the whole issue #0 that explained the origins of the characters.

Bump

Why? All that’s been said is all there is to say. Newfags will claim It wasn’t that bad anybody who was reading DC before it will rightfully say it was the end of the company.

They made a half assed effort at fixing it in 2016 but having so many weirdos on staff who watched trump win meant they all refused to keep the “return of joy and optimism” and instead went right back into misery and hate and destruction because they’re babies. Y the time Bendis arrived and stabbed Superman in the chest to close out AC1000 before an ad with his face rather than Clark’s it was all over and downhill. They’ve been a twitching corpse since.

The sudden abrupt ending of GL was really stupid. Were all comics ending like this because of New 52, aside od I think Batman?

>COIE did a good job of streamlining the universe
Crisis was the real death of DC.

>While COIE did a good job of streamlining the universe into a new continuity,
Actually no it did not.

Batman Incorporated
>It never ends. I don't think it ever will.

>it gave us some good to great books (most of which were not the capeshit or the usual characters)
All of them could have happened without a universal reboot.

But they didn't.

Court of Owls is the one newfags gush over and that was supposed to be a Dick Grayson story

This

>Personally, I would argue Identity Crisis and Infinite Crisis are stronger signifiers of DC’s decline
Brad Meltzer was a mistake, as was trying to push that they hire real mature writers to write real mature stories.

I still don't understand why they hired Bendis of all people. Why? Just why?

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>real mature writers
Who were the others?

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>Gold lantern works on hapiness
Bendis is unironically retarded

>All that’s been said is all there is to say
Maybe for DC but a few anons still remember Wildstorm and are mad at DiDio and Lee for destroying the property and its legacy. Fuck those guys, fuck them.

>All Star Wonder Woman
>All Star Batgirl
Got more info on those series?

How it ended?

Prior to the New 52, Hal is discharged from the corps and left in the middle of nowhere. This is because he kills Krona. He’s later reinstated in the New 52 though.

DC One Million

All star Wonder woman was a Adam Hughes production; writing and art. You can imagine how slow that went.
All star Batgirl was Geoff Johns and JG Jones. Was gonna be Barbara Gordon's origin story involving her and Arkham Asylum. Around this time JG Jones wife was being taken by Dan Didio before being given to James Robinson, and Johns was getting busy with the Lantern stuff.

>Around this time JG Jones wife was being taken by Dan Didio before being given to James Robinson
wut

>Supes 2000
Give me a quick rundown please

>It seemed like after IC most of the mainline declined badly during the 00s. Superman was fine when Johns and Busiek was on it, but went off the rails with New Krypton. Green Lantern is fine if you liked Johns' take, but if you don't you're one of those people crying about it on the Comicon boards or something. Same with Morrison's Batman. JSA was alright until Johns leaves and then it goes off the rails.
Even the Johns/Busiek time was messy. Johns took a huge break and what should have been a quick arc ended up being a big status quo (with Chris around), which just soured people Johns actually finished his part and Chris was quickly written out since it was never meant to be a long lasting story.

>While COIE did a good job of streamlining the universe into a new continuity, the New 52 seemed poorly planned in comparison.

COIEs had all the same issues as the New52, just dealing with less past continuity to mess up with at the time, like how the story ends with everyone remembering everything and that had to be retconned afterwards. Or characters like Superman, Captain Marvel Hawkman getting reboots a few months/years later in spite of coming out of it with seemingly no changes.

>They made a half assed effort at fixing it in 2016 but having so many weirdos on staff who watched trump win meant they all refused to keep the “return of joy and optimism” and instead went right back into misery and hate and destruction because they’re babies.
It has nothing to do with that. Didio in his post-DC interviews has outright talked about how in hindsight he thought Rebirth was the wrong direction and tried to do away the with mistakes Rebirth was trying to bring back. It was always destined to be sabotaged with Didio in control.

It is interesting how DC's possible "end" is so much less clean than Marvel's, even though DC has the big multiverse-changing events and Marvel doesn't. Like in the below link where some guy was able to come up with good justification for ending every character's story within a few years in the early 90s even with the lack of a Crisis to make a clear dividing line:

originalmarveluniverse.blogspot.com/2009/06/omu-end.html

>Was the New 52 the end of DC?
Zack Snyder DCEU was the catastrophe that started to kill DC comics the last thing was the woke agenda, gay characters, end of cheesecake look how Birds of Prey and Wonder Woman look today it's like fans, readers don't matter anymore

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Funny thing is the people in charge making all this shit decisions are fans like DiDio.

just Meltzer lol

>even though DC has the big multiverse-changing events and Marvel doesn't.
No, it's because DC has so many that they're such a mess. On the other hand, Marvel's just gone on and on, with only Secret Wars 2015 as an obvious The End point.

>Was the New 52 the end of DC?
What an entirely asinine question seeing how DC was still going 10 years after New 52.

>before that we had good books and continuity
No we didn't, we had books like Brightest day and Red Robin.

glad to know i'm not the only one. the problem is hard to put into words, but new 52 destroyed to connective tissue of dc. it's the same problem marvel has with x men/ everything else, but magnified. it's hard to have a decent grip on what's cannon, where everyone is at, where everything is going in relation to everything else.