Self improvement is masturbation. Now self destruction

No
It's like turning a block of marble into a statue
It's not rampant self destruction for no sake
It's the destruction of things that aren't necessary. Pride. Ego. Fear. Shame. And so on

Why is the Narrator wearing Bane-core?

That's still not self-destruction. It's shedding undesirable traits, which is, by defition, improvement.

Self improvement is self destruction. Now masturbation...

>It's true though. The sort of self-improvement touted today (yoga, bodybuilding, meditation etc.) are all masturbation and do not improve your contribution to anything. Self-destruction, on the other hand, especially the kind that strips away at your luxuries, turns you into a primal force that can survive anything life throws at him.

Self destruction IS the luxury. Eating shit, having bad finances, not prioritizing family in favour of material goods, etc etc.

Also, prioritizing the health of your body certainly isn't masturbation. The opposite is true.

If self-destruction ends in an improvement, than it's an arbitrary term

Wrong
Look at the climax of this film
It's not self improvement. Tyler doesn't make a new type of credit card with no interest rates
Rather he destroys
I think it's more easy to understand it as self refinement Vs self destruction. Self improvement is a vague turn of phrase that doesn't quite capture his message.

If what you say isn't what you mean,then why bother saying it at all?

>what are semantics, for 500 Alex

DOCTOR DURDEN

He's saying what he means
You don't understand so I'm trying to reframe it so you do

Looks like someone took a quote too literal;
>man can not remake himself without pain, for he is both the clay and the sculptor
Good effort for sounding smart though.
Self-destruction is self-destruction, it leads to only destruction. But just because a journey is painful or difficult does not make it destructive if the goal - and result - is improvement.

Sure. But there's another thing
The freedom of self destruction. If you own a condo, you have an obligation, to pay your mortgage, maintenance fees, take care of the apartment and so on.
By destroying it he frees himself from that obligation

No, you're being THAT kid. If your self destruction improves you,then it is self improvement, and you are masturbating, probably even moreso than just someone honestly trying to self improve because you're being an edgy queer about it

just shut the FUCK up you retard. you clearly have no idea wtf you're talking about.

And then the movie ends and he's fucking jobless and has no money. But that's SOCIETIES fault I'm sure

This system deserves to be destroyed. Modern society simply isn't as fulfilling.

The Amish were right.

Destruction isn't a bad thing
There's an economics term. Creative destruction. Describes when something new comes along that destroys the previous
Like the way the automobile destroyed the horse and buggy market
You're acting as though self destruction can only be wanton. Never targeted

Why so mad? Because you got btfo?

Yes. And having accomplished is goal

shut the fuck up, just fucking shut your fucking mouth you fucking retard

Sure, but then you're no longer talking about self-destruction.

Okay. Let's try it from another angle
Do you agree or disagree with his statement that self improvement is masturbatory?
When you buy nicer clothes?
Buy a nicer car?
Work out 20 hours a week?

>And then the movie ends and he's fucking jobless and has no money.

You're so retardedy materialistic it's sad.

What the protagonist in Fight Club has at the end of the film is something that money or material wealth really can't buy. You can buy mercenaries, but they'll fuck off as soon as you don't pay them or someone offers them more money.

What he has is akin to what Hitler, Lenin or Jesus had: a loyal cadre of men that would die for him.

If you're destroying your pride that is more accurately described as self destruction rather than self improvement

What's even the point of self-improvment though? I stopped working out, reading books and learning things and yet I still can pick up girls at pub. Can have an interesting conversation with other people etc. Self-improvment is a meme.

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Holy shit, you're getting progressively more butthurt with each post, why is that? Because you got UTTERLY btfo like the little bitch you are?

>and yet I still can pick up girls at pub

That speaks more about the level of women you're fucking than yourself.

Self-improvement only goes as far as yourself. If you're satisfied with who you are and your ultimate goal is to pick up chicks at bars then of course you don't need to improve yourself.

ITT: young white suburban male armchair philosophers

This was easily the peak of Norton and Bonham's careers. Burton throws her bones but they're all terrible

Chances are you're young, these choices are some you'll look back on with shame and longing for that lifestyle.

If you're not changing, you're just having one day blend into the next and not really living your life
Years will pass without you noticing

the guy that wrote it is gay, which is the most masturbatory thing you can do.

Who cares normie

>picking up pub girls
>this is an accomplishment

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>Self improvement is masturbation
HNNNGHHHH I'MMMM GONNA COOOOM
OOOOOOOHHH I'MMM COOOOMING

Dude that is exacly what they meant. Bot are improvement of self. But "self improvement" in Tylers sense was making your good parts shine better, jerking off to how good you are. Self destruction in Tylers sense was shedding the bad parts, even if society deems them good.
But you guys have to argue about semantics

The problem lies in the assumption of the existence of self-improvement itself. Can't change your IQ, can't change your bone structure, can't change your face, can't change your height, can hardly regrow hair, can hardly gain more wealth. The idea that by lifting weights, reading books, and pursuing mastery you're travelling some golden path onto becoming a god is a fallacy. You're either born a god, an average human, or trash, and no amount of "self-improvement" is gonna change that.

I do
Look unless your routine is THAT good, change it up

Well, I don't pick up girls lower than 7/10. Sometimes it's 6/10 if I'm too drunk.
Fair enough.
Well, 20-25 is old enough I guess. I have no shame for having fun in life at least sometimes.
Even if you change yourself, days will not change, mate. It will be groundhog day all the way.
It's not?

i was thinking about this the other day, when walking by a huge construction site in san diego (next to one paseo)...all the workers are men. same was true for the construction site across the street.

men have to maintain a level of physical fitness for these jobs, which are occupied around 99.9% men, and then guess who moves in as office tenants....women, faggots, and worse of all, blacks (who are hired because they are black and not for their actual superior skills).

so yes, you are contributing to society by doing concrete work, but recognize that our society is incredibly sick. just look at the movies/tv shows and you will see how fucked our culture is.

everyone can benefit from getting exercise. you don't have to look like a male model or body builder. just not being a fatass feels good in itself.

p.s. to jannies, yes this comment is relevant to Yea Forums....entertainment distracts us from realities, which perpetuates this idea that we each have to be hard-working white knights.

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>t. defeatist
Low IQ or not, you can still acquire knowledge through great effort. The problem is that you're comparing yourself to the people around you.

Tyler is lying to Sebastian (the real name of the Narrator). Tyler is actually looking to destroy the mind and body of the Narrator so he can take full control.

>Well, I don't pick up girls lower than 7/10. Sometimes it's 6/10 if I'm too drunk.

I don't mean their physical appearance. I meant their intellectual irrelevance.

Is it? Look at the thread and look at the retards vehemently debating that.

>Well, 20-25 is old enough I guess.
You're in your golden years, and you're squandering them. Enjoy your regret 5 years from now.

the point of self-improvement, the value of it, depends on what you want in life. if you just want to pick up slags at the local pub, then based on what you said, you don't need self-improvement.

but some men have a desire to learn and grow, and if they value those things then they learn. what i hate most about the "self improvement" fad is that yes, it has become a meme, with tons of faggot youtubers and women FLAUNTING their self-improvement plans/blueprints online. shit like that is annoying.

but if you want to read/exercise/swim for your own betterment, go for it, and if you don't, then don't. simple as

real redpill: self improvement is self destruction

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So your entire goal of self improvement was to get laid? Pathetic

Looks at the heroes and protagonists worshipped in today's media. Which of them was not born with a genius mind and extraordinary ability? Which of them was initially presented as an underdog, but turned out to be a natural prodigy all along? Why is it that no one cares for those who put in great effort, but for those who achieve great things?

Sure, you can cope by averting your eyes and focusing on yourself, but that only really makes sense when you assume that by not distracting yoruself with others you can focus further on your path of mastery. But that's the problem, there are limits to what you can do, and as much as you would like for things to be different inside your la la land, if you have low IQ no matter how much effort you put into certain things you are never going to succeed.

>You're either born a god, an average human, or trash, and no amount of "self-improvement" is gonna change that.

Understand why Adolf Hitler was the leader of the NSDAP rather than people that were richer, more decorated in WW1 or had a better education.

Hitler was a hobo prior to WW1. Let that sink in.

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>not engaging in both to their fullest extreme

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Buying nicer clothes or a nicer car isn't improvement, dork. Those things are masturbation, getting good exercise and taking good care of yourself is improvement and not masturbatory.

Yes, exactly. Hitler was born with a wily mind so he knew that desperate people were more easily controlled. He easily ascended past his own shoddy circumstances through the gifts he was born with, a classic tale.

>women
>any intellectual relevance.
What?
It's not like I have better things to do, mate. I don't have any opportunities in my country anyway.
Well said, mate. Thank you.
Name better things to do then.

i always thought the self destruction part meant to shed bad habits. you're not actively seeking to improve, but you do improve by doing such a thing and thus it isn't self-masturbatory.

>dude superheroes
No, we're not doing this.

>if you have low IQ no matter how much effort you put into certain things you are never going to succeed.
>succeed
Sounds like you just have the bar set too high, you expect to be a millionaire or what?
Regardless, you have knowledge at your fingertips, low IQ or not, knowledge is readily available, maybe you won't get to enjoy the shade of the tree - but perhaps your children will. Or you can just lie down and die with no one ever knowing you existed.

>Name better things to do then.
Get off Yea Forums and raise a family

> I went to a community college

>Now self destruction...
...prepares you for society.

So much strawmanning and assumptions being made. Argue with me once you're done masturbating to your stoic ideal.

Why would you pick up chicks based on that?

Your "argument" is "woe is me". There's nothing to argue.

>When you buy nicer clothes?
>Buy a nicer car?

Engaging in materialism on this level is undoubtedly pleasurable, but the endorphins released as a result of the acquisition is ONLY temporary.

i love watching this film atleast once every year. feels like i learn something new from it everytime and it helps ground me.

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B-because I want smart kids.

Why?
Both feed into the self image.

I can't do that here. I have barely enough money to buy booze.

There's definitely tons of gymcels on /fit/ who only lift to attract women(women don't care about muscles) yet will tell themselves its for "self improvement" for improvements sake.

Going to a public speaking course to combat their social awkwardness would probably go alot further towards getting a woman.

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Exercising makes you healthier, in a natural way your body feels better when you do things like breathe and walk, and it's not even in a self image way. Your body functions better when you are in shape, you live longer, and can do more without getting tired. How simple do you have to be to think that every single person who exercises just does it so people will 'mire their gains?

>women don't care about muscles
While it's true for most women, some of them really like muscles. When I was fit (I'm still is, but lost weight due lack of decent food), some of them were always complementing me. And A LOT of them now asking me why I'm skinnier than before.

Stop buying booze too

No, my argument is that you're clearly avoiding the truth in order to support your failing ideal. You didn't address why effort is no longer valued in modern culture, you didn't address incapacity for success but rather hyperbolized it by equating success with being a millionaire, and finally you implied that despite the obvious limitiations the vague statements "knowledge is readily available" (what knowledge? will an idiot be able to study quantum physics by downloading some books from genlib?) predicates some inherent virtue found in family, even though 30% of men aged 18-30 are now virgins and a genetically unfortunate but hardworking man is hardly in demand.

>While it's true for most women, some of them really like muscles. When I was fit (I'm still is, but lost weight due lack of decent food), some of them were always complementing me. And A LOT of them now asking me why I'm skinnier than before.
No doubt that some do, but most don't. Muscles are a secondary characteristic to what women do find attractive, that is taking care of yourself. I don't think its the muscles themselves, but in that those muscles display an aspect of the mans character.

You literally can't survive without getting drunk in my country. This place is epitome of depression.

Maybe everyone is depressed because of all the booze...

Sure. Perhaps I wasn't going far enough
Maybe not 20 hours a week
What about 60 hours a week?
What about acting like Zyzz?

I think it's more because of the fact that the most popular and common theme of our culture is suffering. But it's cycle. You drink because you're depressed - you're depressed because you're drinkig. So you're right too.

>You didn't address why effort is no longer valued in modern culture
How is it not?

>you didn't address incapacity for success
What is success?

>what knowledge
Whichever you'd want, coding for dummies, complex math, language-courses, DIY - you accuse me of using hyperbolic language and then jump straight to quantum physics, ironic.

>the rest of this drivel
Do you deny that creating a family is a great priority for most humans?

Okay sure but now we're having a conversation about moderation and not the true nature of self improvement

So many smooth brains here. If self-improvement is masturbation, wouldn’t that mean masturbation is self-improvement? How could jerking off in a corner alone producing nothing be self-improvement?

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That's true. Just don't be ugly and have a decent personality. Muscles are just a good bonus.

What I was trying to exemplify was that all those things are considered improving aspects of yourself, materially or physically, and were also in some way masturbatory

No.
You're making a logical fallacy
Pit bulls are dogs
This doesn't mean dogs are pitbulls.

But again, direct materialism isn't self improvement. Exercise is. Tyler even says "you aren't the car you drive" so obviously the car isn't really a valid extension of self, it's not self improvement. Now we can venture into the idea of destroying people's supposed perception of self, but that isn't self destruction if we already presuppose that your materials are not a proper extension of self

Yes! Don't become fit, physically or mentally strong! Take meth instead!

Taking care of yourself and family while making good decisions is just masturbation. Now amphetamines...

I think his critique was that materialism was considered self improvement, from that autistic scene about IKEA furniture

>self destruction
>has a costly leather jacket, beard trim, haircut, clean teeth, neck training

that's a big yikes for me

And what AFTER self destruction,amigo??I've been throught enough fucking traumatic experiences,drugs and alcohol in my life.Sorry,fag but none of that is true.Had you tried improving your body,mind and spirit and witnessed how everything suddendly falls in place you would see this cringy shit for the whoo whoo bullshit it is.He reminds me of my
anorexix junkie meth addicted suicidal "friend" who seriously believes he could take any muscle dude because he "has the heart for it".Textbook definitionof cope,homie

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>has a costly leather jacket, beard trim, haircut, clean teeth, neck training

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Smoke pot everyday.

Don't sleep for a month

Is this what construction cucks tell themselves? They contribute to society? Lol a trained monkey could dump concrete on a sidewalk. Do something that actually improves society

This. People who side with Tyler here think that "bad things just happen to me and it's not my fault I'm poor and get drunk all the time" we all know that chick who is frequently and intentionally making shit decisions and then turns around and wonders why her life is a fucking wreck.

Are you retarded? Yoga and meditation come from Buddhism and old Vedic ideas of destroying the idea of the self. You mutts have no clue what you’re talking about.

A sidewalk might not contribute much, but it's still something tangible rather than a service that makes up like 80% of the economy.

>Yoga and meditation come from Buddhism and old Vedic ideas of destroying the idea of the self.

Yeah, I'm sure that's why thots and soibois practice it in the West.

Like I said, you mutts have no understanding of anything.

Is he CIA?

yeah put the motherfucker to the right saying the same shit and see how catchy self destruction becomes, jesus you are in a Yea Forums board and you can't even realize how hollywood works, you are probably braindead, lmaoing at you because this series was written by a faggot who knew how to impress other men

>muh it's not real Yoga and Buddhism!

who cares about the real yoga and buddhism, it's fucking dead and asianmen are fucking delusional, most of asian men who go to the west can get laid for shit and die in the bottom of the barrel unless they make money because they are dedicated, we only care about how people do the things not what they say it is, because people are full of bullshit, i bet you don't even know what FOMO or FUD is

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The actual message of Fight Club is very Buddhist in itself

Take your meds user

Appropriating other cultures for penance is a very real phenomenon in the West.

>The actual message of Fight Club is very Buddhist in itself

That's the funniest shit i have ever read this week, holy fuck you people try to make sense out of anything, you are like jordan peterson trying to make sense out of american football

They’re pretty obvious allusions brah. It was a trend in the 90s. See movies like Truman Show and Matrix. All about questioning the idea of the self, removing yourself from possessions, escaping the monotone cycle of samsara, finding peace in a community that follows the dharma (“sangha”), etc...

Not my fault you’re a brainlet.

Yeah,fuck self destructive people.There's the kind of people who have gone through horrible shit that was out of their hand and have grown and don't make it their whole persona and then theres fucks who do shit that they know is self destructive and they will regret later but they don't care because without shit to bitch about they would be nothing but empty shells.

Hmm sounds a lot like the altright

The eternal coomer

SPEAK ABOUT DESTRUCTION

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Congrats, you've figured it out. All the copes being pushed by virgins is just that, a sham. If you're desirable to women then you've won, you don't have to do any of the retarded shit they do just to get some pity crumbs.,

t. bootlicker

This is actually good advice. Meth rules.

source?

>he doesn't realize the trend was done because modern viewers are interested in that and that there are lots of movies in the 90's that aren't considered trendy nowadays because modern viewers aren't interested in those

You ok there buddy?

Based Schizo.

came here to post didnt read a single word

kino

this, but depends on the intention of doing either of those

fucking lol

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Jesus fucking christ how wrong could you possibly be? All those things make you healthy, body mind and soul, not to mention it actually strips away all that ego shit. The most shallow and least thought out post I've seen in a long time and that says something.

>all these virgin cope replies because you don't practice their ascetic incel fueled self-improvement religion
You can't make this shit up

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