Of all the dumb arguments against The Last Jedi...

Wwhat the fuck movie series have you all been watching? This is a series where outer space dogfights adhere to the rules of World War II aerial combat films, and people block laser bolts with laser swords. And there is sound in space.

There’s something profoundly unimaginative, and monotonously cold and spirit crushing, about the nitpicking of this particular scene in this particular movie. It speaks to a larger distrust of poetry and flights of fancy in popular culture.

It’s also one of the best examples I’ve seen outside of politics of how reactionary videogame “logic“ is selectively & and unequally applied to “prove“ a point that’s entirely, I suspect, about a deep emotional reaction the viewer doesn’t want to interrogate. I would go so far as to say that the only way to reject this particular scene as legitimate and aesthetically pleasing is to make a decision to interpret it in the most ungenerous and unimaginative way possible, closing off “what if” and any sense of wonder.

I’m just so very sick of this particular argument, mainly because of how it exposes a disturbing, small minded tendency that seems to be creeping across the totality of popular culture year-by-year.

Because that movie was spearheaded by an autistic fanboy who begged George for 10 years to make a movie based around the concept of using leftover cut cockpit footage of the Yavin battle to make a prequel to ANH.

Have sex incel.

Star wars has a history of about 25,000 years that involve space combat yet this is the first time ever that this was used

Its not about expensive ships you fucking retard, the physics can be broken down to mass x speed.
It doesn't matter what fucking mass you accelerate, you could simply use an asteroid.
You think that in the thousand of years since they had engines that can go over the speed of light, nobody thought about that idea? That would mean EVERY SINGLE FUCKING SOUL in the whole STAR WARS universe has an IQ lower than 70.

fantasy doesn't mean you can't be internally consistent, you dumbfuck. and with that, i know you're a retard so this is your last (You) from me

Internal consistency is a word you absolute fucking shill.

Go back to discord.

>lol dude just turn off your brain

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Cringe

Shut the fuck up rian

>it's a soiposters arguing about starshit physics thread

Worth it. He made sure the special effects were on point. It’s the best looking Star Wars film to date.

I honestly don't understand why Disney went for it, but that space battle over Scarif was 10/10 entirely worth the price of admission alone.

I like to think it's just an unconscionable act. Shooting ship debris at light speed that would be apocalyptic to any planet it hit.

Even the bad guys value life in the galaxy more than that.

Probably to advertise the shit out of Vader one last time.

He's going to be in Episode IX and you know it.

Official answer is that they have thought about it but it's "outlawed".

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Why didn’t somebody associated with the series think of doing it sooner? Because they didn’t. The history of franchise filmmaking and the history of military combat are both filled with moments where somebody came up with some outrageous, surprising tactic that no one had thought of doing before. Why is it so hard to accept that this might not be one more such case?

As an acclaimed author and film/movie critic, I have far more sex than you ever will.

twitter.com/mattzollerseitz/status/1142460062247653376

>Someone invents FTL travel
>Doesn't conceptualize that infinite speed = infinite mass
>No one in the thousands of year history of FTL travel even accidentally collides at FTL
retard.

Yeah you’re probably right.

...

>no one had every thought of crashing one object into another at high speeds even though they are smart enough to travel space
Are you sure you're not Rian himself?

It really is amazing just how little Disney cares.

So if it looked pretty enough, it would've been fine if Holdo had shot fleet killing lasers out of her asshole?

If you can't solve your problem in the confines of the universe you're working in you are creatively bankrupt.

>even bad guys who would use a superweapon that literally blows up planets value life enough to not shoot lightspeed objects at planets
??????

no fucking way

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25000 years of space combat.
It took humanity 20 years to go from fragile double decker to industrial kamikaze planes.
You think nobody of those Scientists who build an hyperdrive engine wouldn't immediately think about weaponizing it? Are you fucking retarded?

>Why didn’t somebody associated with the series think of doing it sooner?
They did, you fucking retard, and came to the conclusion that combining lighspeed with real physics would mean every fucking pilot with an hyperspace engine basically has access to the destructive power of a hydrogen bomb and this would fuck the power balance in the SW universe too much, so they wrote the lore so that it wouldn't work. Then came Rian Fuckhead Johnson.

Why didn't US just nuke
>korea
>vietnam
>iraq
etc etc

Why didn't the empire just outlaw the rebellion wtf?

And don't forget, Tie Fighters don't have a pressurised atmosphere inside them, it's why the pilots where the full helmets with the tube.

The FO TIEs have atmosphere and shields, they are a very progressive government by the looks of things.

>holdo
what a stupid name

>make a missile with a hyperdrive
>most powerful weapon ever made, cheap as chips
>cheap, easy and mass produced deterrent presence stops most serious war
But it’s a fantasy story, not a fucking simulation, so it doesn’t need to make sense

Imagine tying your personal sense of self-worth to some balding manchild's fanfiction character.

I think the argument was 'why wouldn't they put a hyperdrive on a 50 ton slab of tungsten and set it on autopilot' but sure, your argument isn't retarded at all.

no HERE'S the only logical reason

1) the rebel alliance can't afford anything larger than that ship, and that ship cost a billion fucking dollars
2) the rebel alliance is the only force that could use it
3) the empire didn't have any large targets they needed to attack, so they never used it

excited for the new movie to immediately establish why they will pretend it never happened again tho

Based and Holdo-pilled, but you have to realize that star wars fanboys are actually just genuinely dumb (you have to be unintelligent to be a fanboy of this overrated trash in the first place).

You're not supposed to think about it

Have more sex

>get asteroid
>strap some rockets to it
>topple any empire

>Size entering into the equation at all.
X-wings are capable of FTL travel, and the original mass of the object moving that fast literally does not matter.
>Empire never had any large targets to shoot it at.
The plots of 4,6 and 7 revolve around then building fuck off huge bases at extreme cost to do what? Blow up planets.

wew

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Any mass at all traveling FTL will work. Just make tiny ships with FTL drives and have droids fly them. Nothing, even a fucking planet, is safe from this.

Dude hyperdrive missiles lol

dude one ship took out dozens, the cost-effectiveness is crazy
more to the point, why don't they just have hyperspace missiles? even more cost-effective
the whole thing is fucking stupid and there's no rational explanation
yeah it's a great shot, but it's also the shot that killed star wars forever

2 ships 2 death starts. 3 starkiller base 4. snowden mega ship one ship. So 4 large ships compared to 4 mega weapons and the loss of several fleets of rebel ships that had to be lost fighting this monsters. Ramming is a cheap way of winning just replace the ships with metsl balls with light speed engiens and droid cores to make the jump. Lol get fuckt op ramming is cheap

Lmao have sex

>Why is it so hard to accept that this might not be one more such case?
because the hyperdrive has been around in the star wars universe longer than recorded history on our planet. you don't just have to make the argument that no one did it intentionally, you also have to argue that for tens of thousands of years no one did it accidentally.
>the Star Wars movies are filled with moments of self-sacrifice/suicide, intended to turn the tide of a losing battle, by colleagues a little bit more time to finish executing a plan
when? all 3 of the main character make it through the OT. Almost everyone makes it through the PT. Only Padme dies. when was self-sacrifice ever brought up in Star Wars? Literally never happens.
>This is a series where outer space dogfights adhere to the rules of World War II aerial combat films
you miss the point. the point is that they did have rules. rules that most people followed for the previous 8 films.
>Is it really realistic that Obi-Wan Kenobi could ride a wild bird lizard into combat
nigga, it's an alien. the jedi where never trained as soldiers and never equipped as soldiers.
>that a giant worm could live inside of an astroid in the vacuum of space
nigga, it's an alien.
>How could anyone take issue with the maneuver itself when it produced arguably the most beautiful shot
because most of us aren't plebs and know how to keep the brain stem attached.

>cheap, easy and mass produced deterrent presence stops most serious war
actually, it's the opposite. FTL weapons create an apocalyptic scenario. deterrents can't exist in a world where you literally can't see the thing that killed you. the only move to make in a world with FTL weapons is a first strike.

Sounds like no matter what people say you are dead set on the idea that writers cant possibly overlook a logical error in a script, and that if its in the movie proper then it MUST make sense.

Several times a deathstar has been made, TRILLIONS of people died because noone decided to drive a single ship into one of them? The enemies flagships are constantly in the open, one ship is all it takes to cripple an entire fleet of ships, just 1 fucking ship. You mustbve noticed that every other Empire ship in range of the flagship was destroyed too user, this attack has massive range, you can wipe out an entire army in a single strike, why is noone doing this or endevouring to make it a possability to do this attack at every opportunity. What if you drove a ship through a planet? Cant we have a droid control the ship too, noone even needs to fucking die. Come the fuck on user, it was stupid introducing this shit, it looked cool but logically it has introduced problems with the intelligence of the people within the movie for not doing it before, or simply not remembering you could do it.
>noone is willing to sacrifice a ship
Why not, entire planets of lives are on the line and noone wants to throw a fucking ship away to save them. Really.

the implicit assumption here is that it's not FTL or even "c" travel because the entire fleet would be fucked
so, it's just going "fast," and the larger it is the more effective that maneuver would be. I mean, otherwise they'd just fucking fly fighters into each other at warp speed, right? How the fuck are they going to explain this shit next movie besides saying "uh that was a software bug in our ships but we patched it"

IS ANYBODY IN THIS THREAD *ACTUALLY* GOING TO WATCH THE NEW STAR WARS

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this picture shows that every TLJ apologist doens't have the intellectual capacity to discuss the implications of the film.

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Top kek and trips checked

That presupposes that retaliation is not possible after the first strike. Unless you totally annihilatie all opposition, you’re gotta get shit pushed.

Yes after it release on the internet

Oh boi here we go

>Some of the ships in those movies are so gigantic that if they existed in our world they would cost 100 times more than an aircraft carrier, and people are actually on here asking why characters aren’t constantly flying them into other ships.

How to make cheap hyperspace ramming ships:
Step 1: build a small hull/acquire a sizable, dense rock
Step 2: strap hyperspace engines to said hull/rock

>Also somehow this complaint avoids addressing the fact that we’ve now had eight of these officially canonical films and nobody thought of doing this on screen until now. Why didn’t somebody associated with the series think of doing it sooner? Because they didn’t. The history of franchise filmmaking and the history of military combat are both filled with moments where somebody came up with some outrageous, surprising tactic that no one had thought of doing before. Why is it so hard to accept that this might not be one more such case?

Hyperspace engines existed for the extent of the entire prequels, original, sequel trilogy and for thousands of years before BBY, so the idea that none of the billions of persons came up with this before Holdo is just silly. The effectiveness of taking out one Titan ship + escort with a single carrier/cruiser is too good to not have been thought of before.

Also, just because Ep VII mimics the (((genius))) plan arch from other movies does not equal good execution.

>As I’ve said in other threads, the Star Wars movies are filled with moments of self-sacrifice/suicide, intended to turn the tide of a losing battle, by colleagues a little bit more time to finish executing a plan, etc. This instance is completely consistent.

It’s fine that episode VII follows the sacrifice theme, but did it have to be executed in a way that breaks the established rules of the trilogy? Congratulations, you managed to stay true with the theme of self sacrifice but you made countless plot holes in the process.

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For me? It's Opera Spider

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yeah the bad guys in star wars would never harm an entire planet like that

>Make a small, metal tube with a lightspeed engine in it, roughly half the size of an X-Wing
>Doesn't even need to be stabilized, just capable of entering an atmosphere
>Drop it onto a planet you don't like that has an oxygen rich atmosphere from your space carrier, then warp away
>The timed device you have inside of the tube goes off roughly 1 mile above the surface
>The superheated missile you just fired at a planet approaches infinite speed and crashes into the surface of the planet, raising a cloud of dust high enough into the atmosphere to block out the light of 2 suns and 15 moons for millenia, for about 1 attosecond before the superheated bomb you just launched with a near infinite amount of energy ignites the oxygen-rich gases covering the planet, incinerating everything living or non-living and melts the upper crust off of the entire planet in a blinding white hot flash
>"why come this scene retartad u dum lol"

Fuck of Rian

Remember that retarded scene in TFA when Solo ligthspeeds through Starkiller Bases's shield?

Remember that retarded scene in TFA when Solo lightspeeds inside a hangar

>How could anyone take issue with the maneuver itself when it produced arguably the most beautiful shot in Star Wars history?

First of all, have sex.

Secondly, Star Wars' hyperspace technology is an elegant solution to the narrative requirement for a FTL propulsion system that can't be weaponized.

Ships in Star Wars never actually go faster than the speed of light while in realspace. They use a hyperdrive to "jump" into, then move through, hyperspace; a parallel dimension in which they can travel faster than light. While in hyperspace, ships do not interact with objects in realspace, so relativistic collisions are avoided.

HOWEVER.
If a ship in hyperspace passes through the gravity well of a large object like a planet, star, or sufficiently powerful artificial emitter, it is pulled back into realspace, possibly colliding with the large object *at sub-light speeds*. This is what Han Solo was referring to when he warned Luke about the importance of calculating vectors before making "the jump".

This also justifies Han's boast about the Millennium Falcon making the Kessel Run in 12 parsecs (a unit of distance). The Kessel Run weaves through an area of the galaxy filled with black holes, around which ships must take wide, circuitous paths in order to safely navigate. Piloting closer to the black holes reduces the distance traveled, but is incredibly dangerous as it places a greater demand on the hyperdrive.

Additionally, it's worth noting that the defensive shields of ships in Star Wars are robust enough to render sub-lightspeed ramming an ineffective tactic.

Wtf how did holdo do it if it was illegal???

Wow you sound just as annoying as Star Wars fans who complain about the Holdo maneuver

you'll end up living in a bizarro world where a dr strangelove device is a practical solution.

>strategic bombing vs carpet bombing
Save the morality shitposting.

Even the atomic bombs were dropped on military targets.

Continuing
>As for the physics or relative “unrealism” — what the fuck movie series have you all been watching? This is a series where outer space dogfights adhere to the rules of World War II aerial combat films, and people block laser bolts with laser swords. And there is sound in space. Is it really realistic that Obi-Wan Kenobi could ride a wild bird lizard into combat, or that a giant worm could live inside of an astroid in the vacuum of space?

We are not asking for realism, we are asking for the movies to follow the rules of it’s universe established in prior films. All they had to do was not do something as retarded as hyperspace ramming. When people complain that it is “unrealistic” they:
1. Forgot that the physics/universal rules of Star Wars do not adhere to real world physics/rules
2. Mean that the move goes against said rules, I.e. “unrealistic to the Star Wars world.”

So while space combat mimics WWII aerial combat, that there is sound in space, and that there are wild bird lizards are fine and do not contradict SW. The introduction of the hyperspace maneuver makes the majority of space battles utterly pointless as you can ram a number of smaller, unmanned vessels into the larger targets for maximum damage, thus breaking the rules and realism.

As for why you should take SW seriously, you don’t have to. We all have a sliding scale for how we see things, thus what may be realistic for us is nonsensical for others.

>How could anyone take issue with the maneuver itself when it produced arguably the most beautiful shot in Star Wars history? Fanboys are weird.

Beautiful? Yes. But as the saying goes:
>beauty is in the eyes of the beholder
Meaning that beauty is paper thin when held up to writing and directing.

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>it's another starwars thread

have sex

>the history of military combat are both filled with moments where somebody came up with some outrageous, surprising tactic that no one had thought of doing before. Why is it so hard to accept that this might not be one more such case?
Kamikaze attacks are not a bold new surprising tactic. Them not existing within the Star Wars universe until this moment would be a ridiculous idea. A kamikaze attack fueled by space magic is still a kamikaze attack.

she's a rebel

t. disney mom

YO LIL DONNIE

No kidding using fully functional ships for the manuever would be retarded. But you're implying that no one in the history of space travel has considered connecting the bare minimum power and equipment for a hyperspace jump to any massive object (e.g. an asteroid) and having it programmed to travel at an enemy fleet? Out of the trillions of life forms none has ever considered this obviously efficient method of warfare before captain lgbtq? And if it has never been considered before (including by the people that develop hyperspace equipment as part of their job) how did she know it would work?

>How could anyone take issue with the maneuver itself when it produced arguably the most beautiful shot in Star Wars history?
literally mfw

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>NO, STOP ATTACKING THE TRILLION DOLLAR MEGA-CORPORATION FOR MAKING SHIT MOVIES I WONT HAVE IT

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based and checked

Based

RRKV has been a staple of the Golden Age of science fiction for nearly 60 years or more. Though it does not belong in SW, it does look good on film.

youtube.com/watch?v=s2hM1tyEL0U

Real nigga trips

This is the faggiest post I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

>RRKV
wat

>t. Reean Johnson

You’re a fucking moron. If Hyperspace worked like Retard Johnson showed it working, they’d have building missiles designed to do that very thing for thousands of years. The Emperor would have never even seen the point in building the Death Star because you can destroy a planet with a hyperdrive and a fucking rock. It doesn’t just invalidate the past battles in the films, it invalidates thousands of years of back history.

It will forever after be the question in everyone’s minds - “Where are their hyperdrive missiles? Why aren’t they using them? Couldn’ t that X-Wing end this whole fight right now?”

...and you still haven’t presented a counter argument to the main conversation at hand. only nonsequitors, ad hominem, and changing the subject.

>all eight films would be filled with people constantly committing suicide in large vehicles.
You're a fucking idiot. That's not what the argument was. The argument was that hyperspace ramming kills the continuity of the universe because now any ol' fucker with a hyperdrive can create a relativistic bomb by slapping it do a droid controlled vehicle. Didn't even read the rest of your post btw.

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Based "dude, it's fantasy" poster; trying to ruin all media by apologising for shit writing. Shine on.

REMINDER: Hyperspace is a parallel dimension. It isn't lightspeed like Johnson and the rest of Disney would have you believe.

Here's an autistic comparison to help explain it to you discord trannies and reddit transplants.

Hyperspace = Minecraft Nether Travel
In MC every block you travel within the Nether = 8 blocks traveled in the Overworld.
Creating a Nether Portal = Jumping into Hyperspace
Traveling through the Nether = Traveling through Hyperspace
Exiting to Overworld from within Nether = Jumping back out of Hyperspace

There is no faster than light travel involved. It's closer to using wormholes than ftl. You jump into hyperspace and while within that dimension the actual distance traveled in "real" space is much much farther than the actual distance you've gone within hyperspace.

Relativistic Kinetic Kill Vehicle, sorry, meant RKKV.

This

fucking THIS

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Shills are weirder. Have sex.