Why did D&D hate him?

He's a white man. Jews hate him

Look user you just kept saying have sex, you never specified what kind.

Dab and Dabid are Renlyfags and are contrarian edgelords. Why else would they whitewash morally deplorable characters like Tywin, Cersei and Renly while throwing shades at honorable characters like Eddard

He's too legalistic for most people. You follow the law to the letter every time, for what reason?

Stannis confused my friends who had a hard time "getting where he was coming from" to them he sought the throne because he wanted power, not because he felt as if it was his duty whether he wanted it or not

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Also to add, D&D did have a scene where he flat out said "I didn't ask for this, we all must do our duty" so that angle was covered. It's not like that helped people understand him, it seemed.

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10/10 contribution to thread. Would read again.

>Isildur.png

because he hated the show and the character, he was getting so sick of people asking him GoT questions when working on other projects that he just wanted to get out asap. He also made it pretty clear he hated the fanbase too

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He was against hedonism which D&D being Jewish is how they make their money

I miss him bros...

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>white man
>not a stark or a lannister
>not awesome or ebin to watch
He had to die

>litterally the only person he loved and truly cared about was his daughter
>LOL GONNA BURN HER BECAUSE OF SOME SNOW

Of all the beautiful rapes, what Hack&Hack did to Stannis was the worst.

It's very simple - D&D are jews and as such they do not understand the concepts of honor, self-sacrifice, selflessness and heroism.

Why do you fucking peons make everything about race

That pic actually fits with the story pretty well, neat

They were right to fear his strength

D&D hated character growth which is why the majority of characters end up in the exact same place they started.

Because he's very easy to hate. He's like if Macbeth and Richard III had a son with male-pattern baldness:
>embittered younger brother of the jolly and beloved king
>lives on a dark island constantly surrounded by storms
>tries to take the throne for himself
>allies with a mysterious bloodmage who fills his head with delusions of grandeur
>has his brother murdered so there wouldn't be another pretender to the throne
>is willing to have his nephew be burnt alive in a blood sacrifice
>will almost certainly burn his daughter alive at some point in the books
If we never had the Davos chapters, we'd despise him. But since we see him from the perspective of a guy who practically kisses the ground he walks on, we have a far more favorable view of him.

Get back in the oven Dabid

>tries to take the throne for himself
By the laws of Westeros he is the rightful king.
>will almost certainly burn his daughter alive at some point in the books
You know nothing, user.

>Stop defending yourselves and die already reeeee

>will almost certainly burn his daughter alive at some point in the books
There are two possible outcomes for him in the book, either he wins against Ramsey and thus doesn't need to burn her, or he loses and thus dead.

based desu

>tries to take the throne for himself
It's his by right.

You forgot that he also is an example of how centralized dictatorial power can be used well, and who ascribes to a religion for pragmatic political and military reasons but which also represents a better belief system than the domestic one. In the context of a show about feudalism this is interesting and makes sense, but Jew & Jew are too low IQ to get that and also liked renly. Not because renly was competent or smart (it's made abundantly clear he was Robert 2.0), but because he was a fucking faggot. And so having Stannis BTFO their favourite fag, all while being too nuanced for them to understand, plus Stephen Dillane thinking the writers were idiots and their excessive nude scenes shit, meant they had to destroy his character for shock value.

He's at his best in the Theon/Jon chapters though.

Culture warriors are obsessed with race.

they unironically thought Renly would be the best king
youtu.be/mWQMqaFm5X0?t=265

>personal hardships like kinslaying for a literal demon

>it's made abundantly clear he was Robert 2.0
Renly was all the flash of Robert but none of the bang, he'd never match up to the man himself.

He was literally the biggest Mary sue on the whole show you retarded incel

This is the main point. In interviews they make their lack of book knowledge painfully apparent. They literally say Stannis is power hungry when it can’t be more obvious in the books that that isn’t the case. One of those retards also said Arya couldn’t give up needle because it symbolizes her vengeance, when the books make it clear needle represents winterfell and her family

D&D are retarded and felt the need to simplify GoT into basically just being "starks vs lannisters". In their eyes, Stannis was a thorn in their side who threatened their dichotomy, and so they wrote him out of the show in the most hamfisted way possible, with Twendy Goodman and ARRRRGGGGHHHH

The Shireen stuff is show-only, so is fanfiction

Renly had it coming as an usurper, and the sentence for usurpers is death. Also book Stannis didnt know that his sex ritual with Mel would have ended with a shadow killing him

>tries to take the throne for himself
He doesn't want the throne, but it's his by law and he wants to do his duty

stannis wasn't even conscious of what happened to Renly, and he's pretty torn up about it after the fact. Not to mention Renly was a traitor anyway.

What I meant is just that, as a ruler, he'd enact the exact same kind of inefficient cronyism. Aside from that it's obvious they liked him because They didn't read shit, they just wanted shock value. Also apparent is their starkfaggotry. Hence why almost all Starks got a good ending for no reason

Dont tell D&D that. They hated Stannis from the start and the only time they built him to be good they then went outta their way to destroy him. And their love for the fag is nakedly apparent

The producers strongly suggested the actors to do not read the books.

It's common among movies based from books, as for example an actor which is playing a tracherous characters may not be able to act like a trustfuly for the audience knowing that later it will show he is a traitor.
Clarke for example may not have been able to sell an innocent an naive girl, if she knew from the beginning she would have turn into an arsonist war criminal

I don't remember him being torn up about it. He grit his teeth and went "well should've bent the knee" after his waifu birthed a shadow to murder his own blood
The kinslayer is abhorrent in the eyes of gods and men

I never read the books, but do they even give Renly any form of justification for crowning himself king, or having more bannermen come to his side rather than Stannis? In the show this made no fucking sense to me, and the only justification I remember his character giving was some bullshit like "oh yeah well I'd be a better king so fuck you". I mean, by that precedent everyone in the seven kingdoms can throw their hat in the ring.

>Hmm should I have to put effort into killing my enemies???
>Nope just magic them all to death with no consequence
Stannis was a complete Mary Sue

Intelligent characters requires intelligent writing.

So you can see the problem.

>“Renly offered me a peach. At our parley. Mocked me, defied me, threatened me, and offered me a peach. I thought he was drawing a blade and went for mine own. Was that his purpose, to make me show fear? Or was it one of his pointless jests? When he spoke of how sweet the peach was, did his words have some hidden meaning?” The king gave a shake of his head, like a dog shaking a rabbit to snap its neck. “Only Renly could vex me so with a piece of fruit. He brought his doom on himself with his treason, but I did love him, Davos. I know that now. I swear, I will go to my grave thinking of my brother’s peach.”

He's not sobbing over it but he really does wish he didn't have to kill him.
Melly did the magic, not Stannis. Stannis actually was devising a military plan to take on Renly.

Presumably, he was more thorough in explaining his tax policy

meant to reply to

But it's perfectly legit and legal if the kin rebelled against you, as a king and as an older brother. Stannis haters always conveniently forget this

You keep using that word

Stannis' line wasn't legitimate anyway so it doesn't matter, he was the brother of an usurper.

>Hot magic lady worships him for no reason and magics all his enemies to death with no effort
Yeah, like I said, complete Mary Sue

It's himplied that's was a mix of personal ambition and Tyrell manipulation via Loras, who loved him but was also forced by his family to gain some advantage for being the king's brother lover.

In the book the original plan was to denunce Cersei kids and present Margary to Robert in order to arrange a marriage. But Robert got BOAR'd and they change the plan marrying her with Renly

>for no reason
Her god literally tells her to.

Renly is essentially a Tyrell puppet in the books, and all of his initial support comes from them and their Bannermen. The Tyrells are one of, if not the most powerful House in the land, ( something the show did a terrible job at illustrating ), and after seeing how much support he has the other Stormland Lords flock to him.

Additionally Renly was just more charismatic, while most people dislike Stannis for his cold, stiff personality.

>Haha that's right titles totally dont get conquered by Houses
Play 10 minutes of CKII and you'll see you're wrong and dont understand how feudalism works

Right of conquest is a legal way to obtain anything in Westeros. Aegon did it and nobody batted an eye. Now if the Lannisters actually killed Stannis Joffrey would have been the factor the rightful ruler by right of conquest

user I'm not sure you know what that word means.

No fan girls

>Stannis is LITERALLY God's chosen hero who sends him a hot gurl to solve all his problems with magic

he's literally not though. Melisandre is just crazy and thinks he is. And he only solves like two of his problems with magic, the rest are all by him.

Renly's justification is that people like him more and he would be a better king and Stannis doesn't even like ruling or KL anyway so he should just step aside and let him do it. The underlying cause of it all is the Tyrell manipulation, they have Loras fucking him and they've got him trying to convince Robert to dump Cersei and marry Margaery already, Stannis is too autistic for them and already married to a Florent but if they could get Renly on the throne they become the kingdom's rulers through him.

Your bait is shit and you should kill yourself

Because they didn't want to acknowledge that the hereditary monarchy that was in place at the start of the series was actually the best system for the realm. If Kings were really as corrupt and bad for the people as they were made to seem, then a better system would have risen to replace it naturally, like what happened in our own history. As soon as Robert died, and the 7 kingdoms were made aware of Joffery's true bloodline then Stannis would have been the best immediate replacement. Stannis is passionless and cold on the outside, but is actually a very perceptive and sensitive person, exactly what a good king would be in my opinion.

D&D had to villianize him to put him in line with their writing ability.

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Only two people in the entire world liking someone doesn't make them a Mary Sue.

Loras truly love him tho. I like to think that, knowing that Renly was gay (it was an open secret) and Loras too, they specifically send the boy as squirrel to Renly in hope they fall in love, so to control the King's brother with the power of love

>God did it
Wow so stannis is literally hand picked by God. Doesn't get more Mary sue than that.

He literally never has to try once to complete his goals. They all just magically happen.

>Wow so stannis is literally hand picked by God
No it abandons him for Jon.

Lrn2b8

>has to hold Storm's End for an entire year starving to death and keeping his men disciplined enough not to mutiny
>outwits Ironnniggers and destroys their fleet
>Makes the decision to go North to try to recruit Wildlings to his cause, using a feint to catch Mance Rayder unaware
>Starts rallying Northern lords to his cause by returning their lands to them
all done without magic

youtube.com/watch?v=4iimpkprnTk

for anyone who still doesnt understand him watch this, especially the jaime part and yiull understand what kind of man he is

Buy he never completed his goals, Tyrion stopped him from taking kings landing.

>Everyone loves him so much they behind his cause
>Even fucking wildlings
Mary sue

because he was a strong white male haha hollywood (jews kikes) hate white males and stannis was king of white males btfoing shitskins and manlets okay?

Talking to normie show viewers shatters my faith in other people. The masses love a basic bitch story. Like the tards who thought Littlefinger's death was satisfying. They're their to root for the good guys, not take in a compelling drama

>Everyone loves him so much
Now you're just being retarded.

>Run headfirst into a huge battle
>Survive for no reason
Wow stannis does it again.

But user they don't join him. Did you even watch the show?

So everyone rallies behind him because they hate him? You fucking incels are so sex deprived it's making you retarded

All the great houses who are meant to be his subjects are either in open rebellion or plotting secret rebellion. He gets completely blown the fuck out on the Blackwater and routed out of King's Landing by the people who were supporting the man he had assassinated. He gets completely blown the fuck out by Davos when he smuggles Edric Storm away and calls him out on being a hypocrite. The North all hate him and only start coming around to considering tolerating him when he liberates their cities from the Ironborn exiles. The only goal he didn't have to try to complete was killing Renly, and he got fucking rekt at the Blackwater as a direct result of it.
>Everyone loves him so much
Even his own people don't love him. His fucking wife loves Melisandre more than him. Have less sex and read a book.

it really makes no sense in the show that Robb doesn't declare for Stannis when the knowledge that Ned intended to declare for him is public.

>So everyone rallies behind him
No one does, he basically had to bribe half his forces.

>So everyone rallies behind him
No one does, it's like half his story.

Robb went for the guy with 100 thousand men instead of a few thousand, and who would let them keep the north it was the better option.

The idea was Robb wants an independent North and Stannis would never allow that, but Robb only declared himself king in the first place because he was too much of a pussy to say no once Greatjon got everyone riled up.

That's been my experience as well. People dont want nuanced characters who aren't outright likeable. The show went out of its way to portray Stannis on a bad light, even when he wasn't doing anything wrong (like when he arrived at the Wall). Even Stephen Dillane wasn't able to savage the character from the horrible writing they imposed on Stannis. He would have been great as the character's book counterpart.

Look I get that some liberties were taken to make Stannis seem a bit less sympathetic than necessary.

But what I don't get is what you fags unironically believe is supposed to happen to Stannis. If he gets what he claims he wants, the story is boring as shit and wouldn't make a bit of sense, so surely you agree that regardless of whether his character is assassinated, he's gonna end up dead in more or less the same kind of circumstances of desperation.

How do actors actually get away with not even understanding the subject matter about their scenes?

Stannis would absolutely not accept the same terms. He already considered Robb as much of a traitor as Renly for crowning himself king in the North and would have punished him for it, or tried to take away northern autonomy. In order for Robb to have a workable alliance with Stannis, he would have had to have tried to make it before his men crowned him. Once that happened, there wasn't much to be salvaged. That's why Robb/Catelyn tried to broker the alliance with Renly, because he was more flexible/amenable. But they never would have gotten the agreement from Stannis that they got from Renly.

Renly wouldn't have let them keep the North, he wanted Robb to swear him an oath of fealty. He'd be "king' in name only.
Yeah but he only wants that in the books at least because he has no clue who he should support otherwise. It's not commonly known Joffrey is a bastard, nor that Ned wanted to declare for Stannis.

I dont mind his death, contrived as it was it was a fine scene, it's the butchering of a character I enjoy I hate.

Pretty based that he was one of the best actors in the show but barely knew what was happening

Robb wouldn't have wanted an independent North in the first place if it was public knowledge from the start that Ned wanted to declare for Stannis and that Joffrey was a bastard. They didn't even get an agreement with Renly, Renly wanted Robb to swear fealty.

This always annoyed me. Only reason Robb went the whole KING IN DA NORF route was because some of his men started chanting it and egged him on.

And yes, Cat was putting together an alliance with Renly, but then he got BTFO. If Renly's troops could move over to working with Stannis, so should Robb. He never should've declared independence and agreed to swear fealty to Stannis.

problem is that Stannis declared too late. Robb got crowned king b4 stannis declared himself as rightful ruler

It's not the destination, it's the journey. Stannis will never sit the Iron Throne but his whole character is about desire and duty, characterised through the struggle between Melisandre and Davos. In the show he's just a fire nut who believes and follows everything Melly says, and Davos is just there.

In the books it's not widely known that Ned was going to declare for Stannis, nor that Joffrey is a bastard. The rumor is started by Stannis, who for obvious reasons isn't seen as a reliable source of information.

In the show it's like common knowledge Ned wanted Stannis so it's retarded.

This. It's not some fucking reality TV gameshow and it doesn't really matter who "wins" or not. What matters is how a character is presented and how their story arc plays out. I wouldn't have minded Stannis dying if it was in a way that made sense to his character. Instead we get some utterly hamfisted bullshit with Twenty Goodman and burning his only child at the stake.

I know Stannis isn't going to win but I wish he could at least sit the throne briefly.

How is anyone even a Renlyfag? He's just as scheming as Littlefinger. The same people who love Renly hate Littlefinger when it's obvious they were working together.

White male vying for power.

Stannis will never sit on the throne he'll instead be the 1000th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch.

Regardless of whether Renly accepted the terms or not, there was a higher chance Renly might accept them more than Stannis which is why he sent Cat to negotiate with him instead. Stannis is famous for being a rigid autist. Robb knows full-well that Ned would declare for Stannis because that's the honourable thing to do, but Ned wasn't pushed to be king of the North and Robb is not Ned.

name a bigger retard

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>Regardless of whether Renly accepted the terms or not, there was a higher chance Renly
There was no chance of it, and it was Catelyn's idea not Robbs, and she only has the idea because Renly has more men, not because he'd be easier to strike a deal with.

And of course, she can't strike a deal with him. No King wants to give up half of their kingdom. At best Renly lets him keep the title but be his bitch anyway.
>Robb knows full-well that Ned would declare for Stannis because that's the honourable thing to do
No he doesn't. Joffrey being a bastard isn't known at the time, and the person who spreads the rumor is Stannis, who most people think of as biased. For all Robb knew, if Joffrey was deposed Tommen would be the rightful King. If Robb had all the information Ned had, he would almost certainly declare for Stannis.

Fucking hell user don't tease me like that

I think that man runs my local newsagents

Special emphasis on the fact that he's white of course //rolls eyes
Why aren't these obvious OBVIOUS /pol/cuck threads banned on sight?

Don't forget Renly had the bigger army, this was a key factor.

I think you're oversimplifying things based on the memory of one really out of place moment that everyone on this board hates. Despite burning the princess, in many previous scenes they did depict exactly the kind of personal struggle you're describing using Melly and Davos, even putting them in frame over his shoulders on at least one occasion like angel and devil. They didn't just make him a fire nut until the moments before his death. Even then it was more like he was sacrificing his daughter to prevent literally his entire army of supporters from being slaughtered to the last man. The show put him into a position where he had no choice just for some shock value really, and that's somewhat detestable, but since Stannis was going to end up dead anyway in almost exactly the same circumstances, with Shireen also dead, it wasn't like it was some big thing that ruins the show. That's my point. There are far far worse offenses even before that point.

So what have they Ironborn been up to between their rebellion and the events of the series? They always talk about how they do not sow, and now they don't produce anything of value and are all about raiding and pillaging, but I don't see how that works when they're one of the constituent kingdoms not in open rebellion. Or does Westeros just allow one of the kingdoms to just raid the others or something? doesn't make any sense.

>There was no chance of it
There was a better chance of negotiating a deal with Renly than there was with Stannis. This isn't up for fucking debate user, this is a simple fact, Stannis is famous for being a rigid law autist (this is specifically why people don't like him) while Renly is known for being more aloof. Regardless of the end result, it was a better play and Cat explains this to Robb and it's why he agrees to it.

>//rolls eyes
Go back faggot.

and after death, the second Night King.

Kys alitafag

>There was a better chance of negotiating a deal with Renly than there was with Stannis.
This is like saying there's a better chance of living without your heart than your brain. Yeah, sure, I guess but you're fucked either way. Neither of them were going to allow the North to remain independent, it just wasn't happening. Maybe Renly would've been open to it if he was more desperate, but by all accounts he was the favorite to win the war, so he had no motivation to allow this.

It's the better play purely by Cat because Renly has more soldiers. Even if they did ally with Stannis, it would give them nothing since he had no support.

Reddit: the post

We Do Not Sow and muh Iron Price and muh Old Ways is mostly Iron Boomer jingoistic rhetoric. There's plenty of farming that goes on the Iron Island and plenty of houses in the Iron Islands that don't want to constantly reave and rape and war to make end's meet. In the books, Asha(Theon's Sister) is the face of these houses.

Balon and his brothers are just insane fucks.

I am only starting to read the books recently but this is also something that's bugged me from the moment they appeared in the show. When they stated their house motto, I laughed out loud. We do not sow. Do you also not eat? The only way to make them make sense is to also make them autistic wannabes and hypocrites. Which maybe in the books is exactly what they are.

Except honoring the legacy of Ned and doing the right thing. Instead Robb goes full secession, then laters a broad just cuz he banged her and gets rekt anyways. Honestly deserved it all do all the traitors in the kingdom
Stannis should have sat the throne, full stop.

You should genuinely look into killing yourself

>based on the memory of one really out of place moment that everyone on this board hates
No user, not at all, burning Shireen is bad but that isn't the true ruination of Stannis. The paper shield shows how D&D truly feel about Stannis. In the books Davos smuggles away Edric Storm after having already attempted to kill Melisandre, and Stannis sentences him to death. Davos shows the letter from Maester Aemon begging for aid at the Wall, and later Stannis reflects on how Davos made him see that he was putting the cart before the horse; he was trying to take the throne because he is the rightful king, but he was forgetting that the duty of the rightful king is to protect the realm. He spares Davos' life because of this, and takes all his troops North to answer the call to aid. In the show he says,
>lol who cares
Until Melisandre tells him that the 'true fight' is North, then he says,
>okay we'll go but you still die Davos lol
Until Melisandre tells him that R'hllor needs Davos alive (for some fucking reason) at which point he says,
>thanks the red bitch for your life you smelly onion fucker, haha, you're in his army now

THAT was the assassination of Stannis Baratheon by the Cowards Benioff and Weiss. Everything else was just icing.

The problem is in the books Robb didn't know that was what Ned wanted or that Stannis is the rightful heir. Jaime and Cersei's incest isn't widely known and nobody aside from LF know Ned wanted to declare for Stannis. For all Robb knows, Joffrey is the rightful king.

If Robb knew everything Ned knew, again he'd probably declare for Stannis.

They're a good source of fish and seafood and the name "Iron Isles" should clue you in on their main export.

Victarion isn't *that* insane compared to Damphair and, especially, Euron.

i liked his quote about him just figuring out that he should've been a good king so he can take the throne rather than take the throne so he can then be a good king

the fucker wears plate armor on a ship because he thinks he can't drown, he's pretty out there but yes he's not as insane as balon or euron. more just stupid and super religious.

marlon brando strats

Based and redpilled
Except Robb going full secessionist even on that basis was retarded. Limited war for limited gains such as toppling Joffrey in such a case makes sense, in which case who should be king? Still Stannis. The decision to fuck off and take the Riverlands while they were at it guaranteed a war of annihilation. They had nothing to gain and everything to lose and that's what they got - rightfully

Victarion would be a truly formidable contender for both the driftwood and the iron thrones if only he wasn't such a complete fucking idiot.

Redditniggers kys and go back.

> in which case who should be king? Still Stannis.
No, Tommen would be, then whoever Myrcella married. He believed that they were all Robert's trueborn children.

If Robb gave an ounce of a fuck about what Ned wanted Robb wouldn't have declared himself the king of an independent North. Winter is Coming is meant to be a warning, this is why Ned loved those words, it's about preparing for the hardships to come, whereas Robb actively fucking summons it.

How would he go for the Iron Throne, the Ironborn seem to be unable to conquer and hold even a small part of the North.

>stop it guys srsly :`(

How is Stannis different in the books? Is he less corrupted and delusional? Is that why people like him so much?

>If Robb gave an ounce of a fuck about what Ned wanted Robb wouldn't have declared himself the king of an independent North
Why would Robb think Ned would have an issue with this? All he knows is that his father went South and was executed by an insane Joffrey claiming that Ned was a "traitor". For all Robb knows, Joffrey is the hardship.

Cat goes to Renly because she thinks he has the men to draw Tywin out of Harrenhal. At no point is Stannis even brought up, nor is it because she thinks Renly is easier to make a deal with. It's just because Stannis doesn't have anything to offer.

Anyone planning to depose a king through open war against his house without also planning to depose his house is a fucking retard.

I guess there's more ammunition in that side of the argument than I gave credit for, but I still don't understand what specifically needs to be changed to the overall narrative to make people happy other than making Stannis look slightly more good (but still not just straight up good) before still killing him in almost the same manner after all desperate attempts to achieve his goals finally fail. Do you think he had something more significant to contribute before dying other than not having his motivations depicted out of alignment with the books? Is having Stannis speak out of character but still ultimately taking the same actions he would anyway (besides probably burning Shireen) such a sin that it *kills the show*?

Robb thinks Tommen is a Baratheon and is of the same house as Renly and Stannis. Why would he be trying to depose all of them? I doubt Robb would be okay with killing a child.

Read this:

>is he less corrupted
Definitely. His dynamic with Melisandre in the books is much different than it's portrayed in the show. While he takes her advice into account and values her, he's hardly her puppet and will outright disregard her when he feels it. The show made it seem like Melisandre was calling all the shots, which is just not the case in the books.

The entirety of the North's problems come from Robb declaring himself king. If he had backed Stannis he would have won the Blackwater. If he had backed Renly the alliance formed between the North and the Tyrells after his assassination could have taken King's Landing. The war of the five kings was long and brought ruin to Westeros, mainly the North and the Riverlands. The war of the four kings would have been short and easy.

>The entirety of the North's problems come from Robb declaring himself king
It was that or just let Ned be killed scot free.
>f he had backed Stannis he would have won the Blackwater.
Stannis had no men and no support for most of the war before Blackwater. Additionally, as far as Robb knows Tommen is Joffrey's rightful heir and Stannis is just an assravaged usurper.
>If he had backed Renly the alliance formed between the North and the Tyrells after his assassination could have taken King's Landing.
Renly has even less claim in Robb's eyes. You guys keep assuming Robb has more information than he does.

You don't have to kill someone to depose them and King's Landing was clearly and completely under Lannister control through Cersei and Tywin flying fucking lion banners while Renly and Stannis were openly rebelling against them. Acting as if there's any universe where anyone thought Tommen was the same as either of the other Baratheons is just stupid.

Pic related makes Mr Dillane look very unprofessional. He begged and begged for motivation and direction and was not given it. In the end he had to rely on Mr Cunningham and by then he had given up. He put into the show what those above him put in.

In the books he only burns people who would be in line for execution any way. For example, when marching on Winterfell, he discovers some of his troops are cannibalising the fallen and orders their death by fire.

He tells his wife to fuck off when she wants to have Shireen beaten for not being receptive enough to R'hllor.

When some of his troops want to burn randos to make the Lord of Light happy, he tells them to stop being whiny little shits and pray harder. If he burns non-believers, all the non-believers will desert, which means half his army.

Show Stannis completely misses the point of the character after about S3 and deliberately character assassinated him with the burning of Shireen.

Shireen apparently is slated for burning in the books, which is fine. However, she's at the Wall and Stannis is at Winterfell ATM. What this probably means is that Melisandre and Selyse will burn Shireen to power a "resurrect Azor Ahai" spell because they are convinced that's Stannis. This will instead return Jon Snow to life. Stannis will either be dead or mad as fuck because his beloved daughter is dead.

Well he relies on her more and more though, especially with a lot of his bannermen and his wife falling under her spell completely.

>You don't have to kill someone to depose them
There's no way Renly or Stannis would let Tommen live, especially if they were unlawful usurpers, which in Robb's eyes they were.
>Acting as if there's any universe where anyone thought Tommen was the same as either of the other Baratheons is just stupid.
He thought Tommen was Robert's son, I don't know what else there is to it. Not only would declaring for Stannis be retarded as he had no men, it would be just as dishonorable as declaring for anyone else, as as far as Robb knew Stannis was a usurper himself.

My nigger Robb declared himself the independent king of the North, an open act of rebellion against the throne. Stop acting as if Tommen's potential rightful claim has fucking anything to do with it. Robb shows he doesn't give a single iota of a fuck about that the second he puts on his own crown.

Asha chapters, mate

>an open act of rebellion against the throne.
Yeah he was rebelling against Joffrey.
>Stop acting as if Tommen's potential rightful claim has fucking anything to do with it.
He had no options. He can't very well rebel against Joffrey to support Tommen, and supporting Stannis would be both illogical and dishonorable. Supporting Renly would make more sense, but Renly also had no claim.

She’s not able to act at all

>it would be just as dishonorable as declaring for anyone else
This doesn't somehow make it sensible for him to declare for himself.
>Renly and Stannis might actually be usurpers so the honourable thing to do is get all my fucking people killed in my own goddamn attempt at usurping
That doesn't make any fucking sense. I'm honestly getting infuriated by this conversation. If he's going to be a rebel anyway he might as well be a rebel who doesn't get his entire fucking region raped to death in the process. This isn't a difficult fucking concept, seven hells.

>This doesn't somehow make it sensible for him to declare for himself.
It makes about as much sense as declaring for Stannis. Less sense than declaring for Renly, since Renly has soldiers.
>That doesn't make any fucking sense. I'm honestly getting infuriated by this conversation. If he's going to be a rebel anyway he might as well be a rebel who doesn't get his entire fucking region raped to death in the process. This isn't a difficult fucking concept, seven hells.

His own region was perfectly fine. The North is easily defensible assuming they hold Moat Cailin. It's the Riverlands that were dragging them down.

they didnt hate him, they just knew he dies and is as useless as robb stark was

deal with it nerds

It's not just Stannis, it's the vast majority of the cast. ASoIaF is a character driven story. Everything interesting about it is what the characters do and why they do it, and the consequences brought on by other characters. If you fuck up the characters then there's no goddamn story, it's just a series of pretty dull set-pieces strung together in a sequence that doesn't even make sense. That's why the show is shit. Stannis is just one of the more prominent example of its failings.

>tries to take the throne for himself
Laws of the land makes him rightful heir
>has his brother murdered so there wouldn't be another pretender to the throne
Renly was literally trying to grab the throne for himself

If he declared for Stannis he would have all his own forces PLUS Stannis' forces. Stannis having the smallest forces (discounting the Ironborn) doesn't somehow mean Robb is going to have less fucking people allying with him than he would have alone. It's a net gain and means his own land won't get fucking raped, and you're completely fucking retarded if you think the North can hold out on its own (despite all the goddamn evidence to the contrary) and if you want to pretend the Riverlands aren't half his fucking forces as well so what happens to the Riverlands does fucking matter because they're still his goddamn allies. I'm not fucking talking to you anymore, you're going in circles to try and defend Robb as being honourable or not a fucking idiot despite the fact he single-handedly ruined everything, believe what you fucking want, this is just stupid.

>he would have all his own forces PLUS Stannis' forces.
Stannis had no fucking forces, he had like a thousand something men and was about to get BTFO by Renly. Declaring for Stannis would be completely pointless as Stannis had nothing to offer, and as far as Robb knew wasn't even the rightful heir.

It wouldn't help him at all. If anything it would be even worse because it would prevent him from declaring for Renly.
>you're completely fucking retarded if you think the North can hold out on its own (despite all the goddamn evidence to the contrary)
What evidence to the contrary? Have you even read the books? They state multiple times that the North is impregnable if they have Moat Cailin, especially with Winter fast approaching. The North would've been fine, The Riverlands not so much.

Even the fucking Ironborn can hold it with Moat Cailin. It's the Ironborn who fuck up the North, not the Lannisters.

>f you want to pretend the Riverlands aren't half his fucking forces as well so what happens to the Riverlands does fucking matter because they're still his goddamn allies
Allying with them was a mistake tbqh.
>not a fucking idiot despite the fact he single-handedly ruined everything, believe what you fucking want, this is just stupid.
I'm sorry you're too much of a brainlet to understand a fantasy series user. Better luck next time.

My Stannis folder is pretty much empty, post more pics

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that goes to jon, tranny

>very Young, handsome, prodigous, hated for a petty reason, talented at everything, a moral bastion in all circumstances, good fighter supposedly good commander despite rushing into battle and making retard level plays it always works out for him. Magical targ stark baby who has the best features of both and no drawbacks, rides dragons like its easy, all the prophecies around him are actually true.

compare stannis
>middle aged, has an ugly, fanatical wife he stays with regardless, leads from the rear and makes strategically sound decisions, ruthless where he needs to be and flawed enough to resort to underhanded tactics. Hes the false lord of light and dies a meaningless death in an attempt to be the noble despot he was desperate to be

>Better luck next time.
You have no interest in actually discussing shit, you just want to argue for argument's sake. You are the cancer killing all online discourse. Moat Cailin can be avoided by sailing around it which multiple people do, you'd know if you read the books. Stannis had a sizeable navy already (which makes taking KL far easier than trying by land) and Tywin feared him more than he ever feared Renly, you'd know if you read the books. The North wouldn't have achieved a goddamn thing without the Riverlands, they'd have never made it past the Twins, you'd know if you read the books. Eat shit and fucking die.

People that are too stupid to grasp that being outwardly nice and amiable doesn't prevent him from being a truly despicable person.
I can't fathom anyone who seriously thinks he didn't deserve everything he got for trying to usurp the throne; he was the only person with literally not even fabricating a claim for the throne.

>You have no interest in actually discussing shit, you just want to argue for argument's sake.
Of course I do, but you're buttflustered because I don't agree with you.
>Moat Cailin can be avoided by sailing around it which multiple people do,
The Lannisters don't have a navy, and Robb planned to circumvent this by allying with Balon. Of course this didn't work, but his plan was sound.
>nd Tywin feared him more than he ever feared Renly,
Are you assuming that Robb was in Tywin's head or something? For most observers, Renly seemed like the real threat.
>he North wouldn't have achieved a goddamn thing without the Riverlands
They would've been fine without the Riverlands, if anything the Riverlands brought them down. And it was Robb agreeing to marry Frey's daughter which let them past the twins. You should pay more close attention to the book bud.
>Eat shit and fucking die.

t. a man clearly interested in reasonable discourse.
maybe reddlt is more up your alley bud, there you can just downvote people who disagree with you.

hes talking about the books retard

>maybe the decision that is best for everyone should be left to... well, everyone!
>laughter
yeah haha democracy would be so silly
meanwhile 5 minutes ago all the major powers in the world were led by women

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>Lannisters don't have a navy
>allying with Balon is a sound plan
>a deal brokered by a Tully doesn't require a Tully

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>>Lannisters don't have a navy
They don't, it was burned in the Greyjoy Rebellion. They have the Crown Fleet, but it's not at all sizable.
>>allying with Balon is a sound plan
It was, but he vastly underestimated how petty Balon was. If Balon was at all reasonable he would've allied with Robb.
>>a deal brokered by a Tully doesn't require a Tully
Anyone could've brokered that deal, the Freys clearly had no real loyalties to the Tullies and Catelyn was a Stark by this point anyway.

And yet he plays character well above the MCs, such as Kit and Clark. How does he do it?

He's boring and a cuck. Like every annoying /pol/ poster telling you to have children, a stuffy, one note nag character

Stating lies doesn't make them true. The Greyjoy Rebellion was years ago and the Lannisters rebuilt their fleet, they just can't use it because they're forced to focus on the Riverlands. Anyone who knows anything knows Balon is not reasonable, it was stupidity, nothing less. Cat was only permitted to enter the Twins and given audience with Walder because she's Hoster's daughter, without her the bridge would have stayed closed. Have less sex and read books.

So D&D read "Stannis is disliked" and took the public perception of him by other nobles in the books as his canon personality in the show?

Why'd they remove the Northern Conspiracy?

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>Stating lies doesn't make them true. The Greyjoy Rebellion was years ago and the Lannisters rebuilt their flee
You can't rebuild an entire fleet in a few years, and there's no mention of the Lannisters having done so or having a fleet at all in the entire war.
>they just can't use it because they're forced to focus on the Riverlands.
This makes no sense, they could've used it to help defend the Blackwater. There's no way they have a fleet large enough to assault the North with.
> Anyone who knows anything knows Balon is not reasonable,
Robb didn't know much about Balon, and Theon convinced him it would be something they can do, and at this point Robb had no reason to doubt Theon.
>Cat was only permitted to enter the Twins and given audience with Walder because she's Hoster's daughter, without her the bridge would have stayed closed
It's never stated that they would've denied any other emissary. Catelyn claims she's the best fit for it because of this, but Catelyn also claimed Walder would never harm her which is blatantly untrue. But even if we accept this, Catelyn was a Stark by this point, and her loyalty isn't dependent upon Robb helping the Riverlands.

i.e. a Mary Sue
I bet you love Superman as well

he has a pp

Was he brainwashed by the red witch
>she offered him sex

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>He's at his best in the Theon/Jon chapters though.
>Clayton Suggs - "A sacrifice will prove our faith still burns true, Sire."
>Godry the Giantslayer - "The old gods of the north have sent this storm upon us. Only R'hllor can end it. We must give him an unbeliever."
>Stannis - "Half my army is made up of unbelievers. I will have no burnings. Pray harder."
>"I defeated your uncle Victarion and his Iron Fleet off Fair Isle, the first time your father crowned himself. I held Storm's End against the power of The Reach for a year, and took Dragonstone from the Targaryens. I smashed Mance Rayder at the Wall, though he had twenty times my numbers. Tell me, turncloak, what battles has the Bastard of Bolton ever won that I should fear him?"

Nobody cares about rightful anymore, it's been gone since Aerys died

At least Robert had a good personality, Stannis is basically a medieval version of the math teacher who always threatens to fail you

>Stannis is basically a medieval version of the math teacher who always threatens to fail you
lmao

I barely understood calculus, Mr. Stannis was in his rights to flunk me.