DUDE ghost army saves the day and totally undermines everything that happened with Gondor and Rohan LMAO

Maybe have that in the extended cut and not a skull avalanche.

Also a lot of rohirrim died, including Theoden. Fuck, he even said it was the last charge of Rohan implying it was pretty much their death

It makes a lot more sense in the book where they show that Mordor actually is a massive place and it takes days for it to empty

If you set up your story to basically have a nuke, you must give them some drawback.

In LotR it's that the ghost army is cursed and have a debt to repay. Aragon could've chosen to keep them, as Gimli said. But he kept his word and let them go.

Meanwhile in GoT they have a dragon that can sometimes level cities and fleets, sometimes not.

They had to, as they had not paid their taxes and the interest rate had become staggering

I remember the Elves at Helms Deep being really despised too

>muh honor
This is why GoT is better.

Yeah I was one of them, loved fellowship but the last two just took too many liberties just for capeshit tier moments. The Elves arriving at Helms Deep is one of the worse decisions

They know roughly where Frodo and Sam are thanks to Gandalf

I haven't got a problem with that one desu.
I liked the speech Haldir made.

Couldn't Sauron have defeated the Army of the Dead with his Nazgul?

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Sauron is a necromancer

Knife ear hands typed this post

>NAZgul
Real subtle there Tolkien

if a woman can kill the witch king so could a ghost since it's not a man

Nazi Ghoul?

Hackson utterly destroyed in that thread
>b-b-but LOTR had proper battle tactics!

Not him but think of it this way, fren, if you never keep your word — no one will take it seriously again.
Honour does have some points.

iirc in the book they take the fleet/set up for the battle of Pellenor fields or whatever and then fuck off even before seeing Minis Tirith.

The most disappointing part of all this is not seeing Aragorns detachment of Dunedain Rangers riding about rekkin boiz.

>they have a dragon that can sometimes level cities and fleets, sometimes not.
The dragon started as a baby and grew over time. How stupid are LotR fags?

>Aug 12, 2009
Imagine having bookmarked this to post it on an anonymous internet board ten years later.

I think "man" went like in gender, not race.

>Nazi Ghoul
>Moor Door
>HOBbling midgeT
>GIMme (li)
>Leg of Lass
>Era Gone
>MORE YEAH
>SAURon's MAN
>RIVEr DwELL
>Gal A Drill

>anime avatars on a Tolkien forum

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I understand why they did it to save time.
I'd love for LotR to get released as episodes. So much got missed out

I want my fucking knights of Dol Amroth goddamnit.

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I dislike it less now especially comparing to to RotK. The movie has the best moments and the worst of the entire trilogy. Hated pretty much everything to do with how the dead men were handled and Legolos soloing the mumakil was horrible
Anyway the movies are still good overall but these things really bugged me at the time

the only good Lotr is fellowship and the first hobbit is superior to the two Lotr sequels

>b-b-but LOTR had proper battle tactics!
better than a lot of other movies
bookfags are always the worst when it comes to film.
Most people watching LOTR would have seen the oath-breakers as the fruit of Aragon's successful quest. Of course there's a minor uncomfortable sense that maybe the ghosts are portrayed as too powerful, as they gank an oliphant. But no one winds up pissed off. Everyone is excited to see the main characters Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas join the battle. The fact that their accompanying force doesn't have the proper ratio of ghosts to rangers to gondor soldiers is something only bookfags have autistic meltdowns about. Because there wasn't time in the movie to show Aragorn recruiting anyone but the ghosts, that's what's portrayed in the movie.

>ARe WomEN
>THEODore INdoors all the time
>EY Another WomAN
>Gone Door
>Oz Give It Up

What was so bad with the elves coming to help? They didn't affect the main plot.

Gandalf literally says that they are in Mordor, that's why Aragorn decides to attack the gate

this was a mistake by Jackson’s one of his few
In the books the Oathbreakers were backed up by actual Gondor forces, and only served to spook and rout and disorganise the Mordor troops facing them before being rushed by the Gondor troops

The Barrow-Downs sequence is one of the best in the books and they didn't even try to film it. What a crime.

>I want my fucking knights of Dol Amroth goddamnit.
Literally 0 seconds were spent on the rest of Gondor; it's just Minas Tirith in the films; Minas Tirith and the flat, dead field that surrounds it.

>ywn see Galadrial tearing down Dol Guldur with elven/ring magic

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>Third age
>Wears plate

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Divide and Conquer

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From a tonal and cinematic perspective, nothing.
For a bookfag that needs the story to have the exact correct message the book was trying to send, it's bad because the point of the story is how the Men of the West are able to succeed without the elves. They view the elves joining the battle as undermining this absolutely critical point.

>complaining about the elves
>not complaining about how in the movie Theoden says "fuck Gondor we are going to hide in Helm's Deep" while in the books they were forced to retreat there while on their way

The ghosts being able to kill the enemy at all, and being used as extensively as they were, only opens up for the question "why didn't he use them against the rest of Mordor's army", to which their is no decent answer. Tolkien actually explains why the Dead-men of Dunharrow couldn't be used against the armies marshalled by the Witch-King and the other Nazgûl.

Charge of the Winged Hussars, sorry Rohirrim, is the best moment of the trilogy for me so I like ROTK

>not a single mention of any plate piece of armour except decorative bracers and helms in the entire trilogy
my fellow book-fag

>For a bookfag that needs the story to have the exact correct message the book was trying to send
It undermines the theme of the films as well, user.

This was a legit failure of the movie. It seems the point was to portray Theoden as not yet fully courageous and able to lead, needing Aragorn's help, and then completing his arc with the "ride with me" charge which you have to admit is a pretty fucking kino scene. According to the dialog in the movie anyway, this seems to have been the intent. Of course the problem there is that Bernard Hill is the fucking man and portrays Theoden like a courageous badass leader of men so even if you don't know the books this doesn't work. Nothing against based Viggo Mortensen but Bernard Hill had far more gravitas than he did in the LOTR movies. So this arc just doesn't feel right.

youtube.com/watch?v=kzvAAAHVFBI

Do ghosts have to pay taxes?

Yep this
Also if you take it out of the movie it changes nothing, you are just left with a bunch of dead elves at the end. It feels like a pointless addition that only takes away from the message

Return of the king is capeshit tier
Redditors overrated this trilogy to hell and back
Peter Jackson is a hack

Ghost were in-debted. You don't need to pay taxes then.

>those winged helms
it would’ve been kino, fuck sake

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In the books he could. The Dead-men weren't corporeal; they couldn't actually cause physical damage to anyone, as they were just spirits. What they could do was instill an otherwordly terror that worked against the corsairs of Umbar, but would have failed against the armies of Mordor, which led by the Nazgûl and under the sway of Sauron's direct will would not have faltered. The wraiths would have scared the defenders of Minas Tirith in equal measure anyhow, as they did at Pelargir (the vassal army of Gondor had to be reformed after it broke upon seeing the dead army)

Theoden probably had the highest number of book lines out of any recurring character, and Bernard Hill delivered them very well. My only complaint is that they chopped his Pelennor Fields speech in half and gave him Eomer's Death speech to fill it out; it was pretty limp of them to ignore Eomer's reaction to Theoden's death.

they have a wizard you fucking idiot

If I remember correctly, the decision of Theoden to fortify himself at Helm's Deep in the books came out of necessity. In that he wanted to give an open battle with the invading Isengard forces with the little men he had managed to master, moving towards the Gap of Rohan. But from every report he collected along the way, he learned of huge Isengard forces coming from every side and realised that an open battle would be near suicide.
Thus, the "plan B" decision to go on the defensive in Helm's Deep.

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Not substantially.
Up until the battle of Helm's Deep, the story has been a relentless descent into hopelessness and despair, particularly for Rohan. The grand climax to The Two Towers is the tonal turning-point for the entire trilogy. Up until then, the feeling is really that the armies of evil are enormous and unstoppable.

The story is about how they're able to overcome these incredible odds due to the heroics of the main characters. In this case, characters who had met the elves earlier in the story and pled their case. No, it doesn't really make perfect sense, but it's also not crazy out of left-field and does have setup in the movie for it to happen.

The Elves arriving with a small contingent to help is the first small glimmer of hope foreshadowing the upcoming victory. The elves wind up NOT being the deciding factor, they fight heroically and mostly all die. The images of the immortal elves dying are some of the more tragic moments and if you really want to send the message that the age of elves is over, that's not a bad way to do it. Ultimately the battle is won by Aragorn, Theoden, the men of Rohan, Gandalf, and of course Eomer and the Rohirrim.

To really show how solid Theoden's little bits of alliterative verse are: (alliterative verse being the traditional way of composing germanic verse, present both in norse and anglo-saxon poetry).

>At that sound the bent shape of the king sprang suddenly erect. Tall and proud he seemed again; and rising in his stirrups he cried in a loud voice, more clear than
>any there had ever heard a mortal man achieve before:

>Arise, arise, Riders of Théoden!
>Fell deeds awake: fire and slaughter!
>spear shall be shaken, shield be splintered,
>a sword-day, a red day, ere the sun rises!
>Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor!

>With that he seized a great horn from Guthláf his banner-bearer, and he blew such a blast upon it that it burst asunder. And straightway all the horns in the host
>were lifted up in music, and the blowing of the horns of Rohan in that hour was like a storm upon the plain and a thunder in the mountains.

>Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor!

He does this earlier too, after Gandalf heals him, declaring his intent to marshal the riders of Rohan to wage war on the enemy.

>Arise now, arise, Riders of Théoden!
>Dire deeds awake, dark is it eastward.
>Let horse be bridled, horn be sounded!
>Forth Eorlingas!

You have a fair point about the structure of the film and how the elves showing up affect it, user.

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>implying the worst part is not how they butchered Faramir

what was the standing tax on the ghost army?

Faramir and Denethor were both demoted in the film.

It's almost as if honor is the main plot point in the ghost army story.

The dragon sure had difficulty taking out 20 ships one episode, and then took out 200 ships the next episode.

Oaths being a huge deal is a recurring theme in Tolkien's work, after all. To swear an oath is to do far more than just make a promise in Middle-Earth; it's like the universe itself will either see that you fulfill it, or that you are justly punished should you break it.

He last knew that they had taken the path of Cirith Ungol, he probably suspected the presence of Shelob.

In the extended edition, there's actually a scene where Gimly thinks it's a bad idea to let them go and they should keep them for the next upcoming battle, but then the Ghosts are about to fuck the shit up out of Gimly, and Aragorn decides to respect the oath he made to them and liberate them, he basically had no other choice or they would be next to bite the dust.

So it's kinda addressed, the only problem would be the oath, Aragorn should've said he needed their help to defeat all of Sauron's army, not just help them defend the Gondor

The justification just falls kinda flat. Aragorn asked them to fight for him (and Gondor); no specifics about the number of battles, or where. And they *are* untiring ghosts; if they could slaughter an entire army like it was nothing, why couldn't they do the same again and then be released from their ancient oath? The Dead-men could not have killed Aragorn; he was the only person who could give them peace, who could let them finally leave Middle-Earth. The leader demanding to be released just doesn't do it for me. It doesn't make sense within the context of the films, even if we do ignore the books and the context they give us for the Dead men.

Jackson rushed to finish the movie by the deadline and I think a lot of stuff was unfortunately cut as a result. On the other hand he wasted time with pointless added conflict (Frodo vs Sam for example) that ate up screen time.

They could have had a scene of the ghosts running off the Corsairs, then Aragorn recruiting actual guys to fight but that would have of course cost more money in sets, extras, filming, etc , while the ghosts were all CGI and them showing up could all be done on computers. Sadly it was almost certainly a time/money change that weakened the story.

There aren't supposed to be any ghosts, the ghosts in the books just scare the pirates into jumping off their ships and drowning.

Aragorn and the rangers then use the ships to pick up reinforcements in Gondor to break the siege. No ghosts are at the battle in the books.

>that part of the book where the vassals of Gondor appear at Minas Tirith and Tolkien acknowledges them like a lite version of the Catalog of Ships
>that part where the armies stuck at Pelargir are relieved and sail north
Gondor is practically nothing but Minas Tirith in the films, it's a shame.

Pretty based

LOTR movies are made for children. I mean how fucking OP is a damn ghost army.

based Bernard Hill.

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Aragorn with a group of a dozen tall dark rangers who look like him fucking shit up would have been kino.

Bartle for middle earth 2

You being angry won't ever make this not a great film

Why they didn't use ghost army to invade mordor and destroy the ring afterwards?

Sauron would've swayed them to his side

In that case Aragon could simply say "lol you are forgiven" and they would disappear

Endgame >> return of the King

Why Sauron is not making his own ghost armies
>get some orks/ring wraits/trolls/whatever elligible
>make them swear some bullshit oath
>they fail
>now you have an invincible army
Seems logical. Get some ghost eagle armies in case they use eagles to bypass your land ghost army

There was point in even trying. Sauron was a necromancer since the First age.

He actually could have done it theoretically speaking. I have no idea why he didn't. Maybe thought that orcs were enough.

Why didn't Sauron put a door to stop people from entering Mt. Doom

lotr is literally "plot devices the story". Tolkien was a hack

If Sauron is able to make invincible material like the one ring, why he is not making an armor out of it?

You don't know if they would dissappear unwillingly, if sauron gave them a reason to continue existing

Why Dwarves didn't dig a tunnel under mount doom and access the lava to destroy the one ring?

He never thought that anyone would try to destroy his precious.

He doesn't need the armour. You can't kill him even if you destroy his physical body.

The orcs would have noticed them in the process.

Well, you can sure suppress him. An invincible metal glove would protect his fingers.

Btw, why he is putting his only weak point to his fingers and point his finger at their enemies during battle? Would ring work if he wore it as an amulet? Or put it on his cock?

But it already happened that someone entered it and almost threw the ring, if Isildur slipped and fell the ring would have been lost. That's pretty much what happens later when Gollum falls into the lava. A big giant door that only opens with the right password would have prevented that.

Or he could put a balrog or two next to entrance of the mountain.

it's actually a turkish womans name tolkien learned sounded evil as fuck (as women are) and so he used it

Only Jackson's silly movie version made that an issue. In the books Sauron got beat up by a gang of legendary warrior-kings who were also mortally injured in the fight, Isildur just finished the job by taking the ring.

>Btw, why he is putting his only weak point to his fingers and point his finger at their enemies during battle?
This has never happened in the book. But I also think that it was retarded to put on the Ring over his fucking glove.

That scene was only in the movie.

the movies are better than the books

Aragorn's mana ran out so the ghost army enchantment ended. He had to tap Arwen's sweet punani to recharge and she was in Rivendale.

Why they are so afraid of him when a gang of strong warriors can handle him?

Here's the deal. There's a limited amount of screentime in a movie. Aragorn's subplot has to affect the outcome of the final battle somehow. There's not enough room in the subplot to portray the ghost sequence, the boat sequence, and picking up reinforcements.

Now it's theoretically possible to write, film, and cut the story to perfectly portray all of these events in the limited amount of screentime in a manner that is not confusing to people who haven't read the books, and have Aragorn arrive at Minas Tirith with the book-appropriate forces to save the day.

But more likely, trying to do all that shit in one brief subplot would have resulted in an incomprehensible clusterfuck that wouldn't make sense to anyone who hadn't read the books. There's only time for Aragorn to recruit one new ally. It had to be one or the other. They chose the ghosts, probably because it makes Aragorn seem more special. This pisses off a lot of bookfags but nobody else really cares.

I don't get why Gandalf didn't simply teleported to Mount Doom with the ring and end everything in seconds

Because there are no warriors of such caliber in Middle-Earth anymore.

Those strong warriors were Elendil and Gil-Galad. Sauron's strength doesn't like in his abilities as a warrior anyhow, but his ability to enslave and dominate. He wasn't about to conquer the world all alone; he has vast armies.

Why did Iluvatar allow evil in the first place, why couldn’t he control his creations?

>This pisses off a lot of bookfags but nobody else really cares.
Have you spoken to a single adult who've seen the films but not read the books? I think the people who like the ghost assault are in the minority.

Then use the double/triple amount regular warriros

return of the king extended is 4 hours long and it still didn't include everything in the book. these retards don't understand things need to be changed and cut from book to movie, so they just complain and bitch like a woman instead

He can't teleport, 'magic' in Arda doesn't work like this. Also Sauron would notice him immediately.

This was the moment in the films I looked forward to the most as a kid. It was always really epic to watch.

hey at least it's a high fantasy world where it's established that high fantasy shit like ghost armies exists and comprises major plot points

unlike game of SHIT where it's omg so realistic muh tax policy muh diplomacy and muh intrigue but all plots get resolved with asspulls anyway

No, there are none that could fight Sauron in the end of the Third age.

it would have been a very bad idea since Sauron is a Necromancer

Why? He killed and died to balrog and leveled up returned back in somewhere else entirely. Sounds like a teleport to me.

Also "a wizard is never late. he is wherever he is needed" sounds like a teleport spell to me

>Lord Seaworth is a man of humble birth, but he reminded me of my duty, when all I could think of was my rights. I had the cart before the horse, Davos said. I was trying to win the throne to save the kingdom, when I should have been trying to save the kingdom to win the throne.

stannis is a better written character than anything in lord of the deus ex machina

Those complaints generally just focus on the ghosts being portrayed as overpowered. Those types also probably complain about Legolas soloing the Oliphant despite Gimli clearly pointing out that it only counts as one.

Sauron was right though, no being could willingly destroy the ring. It too God pushing Gollum into the fire to get the job done.

he's trite, mundane and irrelevant, like 99% of GoT characters

user, there is no teleportation in Arda. And Gandalf power is not even in his physical strenght or magic tricks, it's in his wisdom. He is not Harry Potter level wizard.

i think you should sincerely consider transitioning, you already have the mentality of a woman

The first time was an ambush, the second time the dragon initiated combat and was zig zaging, didn't think it was that unbelievable

This. In the end Frodo couldn't do it. You can't really blame Sauron that he didn't predict a Gollum factor.

What about this then?

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real men like manly fantasy like lotr where brave exemplars of manhood inspire to greatness
only women and faggots like you like game of thrones and its unlikable characters: generic king #42, scheming noblewoman #56, and smarmy asshole backstabber #864

>an ambush
In the open sea. That's already retarded. Anyone would nave noticed if not for the shitty writing.

he should have just put a giant safety net just too be sure, better safe than sorry.

real men don't overrate bedtime stories that are for children where the good guys win because they are good guys. i think its time you grew up honey

>i-it doesn't m-matter anyway
nice backpedalling nu-male
I accept your concession

>no being could willingly destroy the ring
Why didn't he casted same spell on his self then? Sounds like a good buff

or a door. or some fucking guards. why Sauron canonically dumb?

lotr *puffs* now thats a proper fantasy

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It's a lighthouse, how smart can he be?

>why Sauron canonically dumb?
because the plot needs him to be dumb

oh yes as opposed to
>dude it's so amgibuous and realistic there are no good and bad guys
>good guys win anyway
fuck you and fuck got

so why can't legolas hit a ghost with an arrow but the ghosts can hit living people? what's the logic here

You need at least +3 weapon to hit ghosts

ramsay being purely a bad guy is ambiguous? i guess i see now why you stick to children stories hahaha

The ghosts only kill some pirates in the books.

Wasn't the ambush near King's Landing behind a big rock? They positioned their ships towards the north where Dany was coming from, scouting with their dragons. It was a prepared barrage of arrows towards an unsuspecting, slow and straight flying target. Lucky but not impossible.

STOP QUESTIONING LOTR YOU ARENT ALLOWED TO QUESTION THE INCONSISTENCIES REEEEEEE TOLKIEN IS A GENIUS AND A WW1 VET REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>completely misses the point
ramsay was purely a bad guy that's why he lost
because bad guys lose in GoT, and good guys win just like in LotR
the only difference between the two is that brainlet GoT fans pretend it isn't like this because they have been memed into believing it's omg dude so mature and not like other fantasy (because they are brainlets)

>it's entirely possible to obscure an entire battle fleet from the view of a flying opponent by hiding behind a 'big rock'
From the deck of a ship the line of sight is like 10 miles or so. How far do you think you could see from the back of a flying dragon?

Don't put it on Tolkien, that shit is on Hackson

you have the spergy mentality of a child. how does the red wedding fit into your 'bad guys always lose' take on asoiaf? that is the end of robbs story, he's dead and gone. cat gets brought back but she's not really a good guy anymore. ramsay also won against stannis in the show, and stannis is more of a 'good guy' than ramsay. they're all still alive in the books anyway. you're just screaming about character complexity because apparently you don't understand it

It was the style at the time.

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very intelligent poster here

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Good guys win IN THE END, retard. I never said they always win.
Robb died because the fat fuck hack didn't know what to do with him, like most of his worthless characters. And his brothers and sister won everything in the end (with an asspull).
By that logic Frodo got stabbed 3 times, Gandalf died, etc good guys get set back but win in the end in both cases.
The fact that you can't understand this point to you, not me, having the intellect of a child.

robb dying isn't a set back, he's gone. ned dying isn't a set back, he's gone. tywin dying isn't a set back, he's gone. kevan dying isn't a set back, he's gone. joff dying isn't a set back, he's gone. and that's all from the books. the show kills off plenty of other characters too, like hodor and jojen.
the fact you have to overlook all of these deaths of both good and bad guys and try to label them as nothing more than set backs is pathetic. learn how to argue sweetie

This is the most brainlet question of all

You can't answer it though.

Sauron was very smart in the past, but he really got kinda dumb after he lost his beautiful body with the sinking of Numenor. After that he was driven mainly by his desire of revenge and literally didn't think straight. So, you have to take that into consideration and also the fact that,as user said, he was right and nobody could destroy the Ring by his own will in the end. So there was no need for the door in the mountain or the guards, and Sauron became too arrogant to think about it anyway.

lmao all these excuses for a plot hole hahaha.

The answer is
>Can you think of even one reason why God would let paradise falter
Because God only needs one reason. Is it better to experience pain so that comfort feels sweeter, or to always be comfortable? Is it better to experience sadness so that happiness is sweeter? Is it better to fall from greatness, so that the climb to reclaim that greatness is a more meaningful feat?

The fact that those elements pull on your emotions are why God would let evil into the world; because all of Christianity, whether literally true or not, serves the purpose of explaining the truth of the human condition and the cure for it's problems. The story of Genesis was written to tell us how human beings are, what is good, and what is bad. Evil entering the garden allows humanity to fall so that God can send Jesus down to save us. The beauty of God's mercy on the cross would not be made possible if there was no evil to begin with. Men could not live their lives with their hearts set on Christ, to love as he loved and to fight evil with mercy if there was never evil and always paradise.

It's because whether it's literally true or not does not matter. It teaches about the heart of mankind and what we should value.

thanks jordan peterson

Ah, I see, so you are simply retarded.

tl;dr
>God intentionally makes people suffer
Ok, he is just a tyrant then.

The Bible begins and ends in paradise. Suffering is only temporary. What's the problem with that?

>muh characters dying = better storytelling
based brainlet
who gives a shit about any of them. competent writers don't have to kill off 90% of the cast to create drama
only hacks like GRRM

Suffering can be so horrible you wouldn't even want a paradise after that. Suffering can destroy your soul and personality. Only evil creature would make people suffer for some 'greater good'.

>no knights of dol amroth
>no imrahil
missed opportunity desu

>create drama
lmao. you mean like the nazgul? aragorn scares them off weathertop with a torch and later on in the series i'm supposed to take it as a given that they are incredibly dangerous foes. hahahahah holy shit its so bad

Literally 99% of Silmarillion characters die painfully. So what was your point? Tolkien also can kill his good characters and did it.

Because they swore to fight ONE battle, they were cursed to un-death because they backed out at the last minute.
Fighting a battle for aragorn satisfies their debt.

why are you talking about a shitty history book? should i start talking about a world of ice and fire now? because those characters are all dead too. what kind of dumb fuck argument is this?
which good characters die in lotr? do i really need to be this specific?

Nazgul became stronger after that. Their powers were slowly returning to them as Sauron was slowly regaining his power again. I guess it's too difficult concept for someone who are used to shounen-tier powerlevels shit.

You need either enchanted, silver or deadric weaponry

This must be bait or you are genuinly retarded. I'm talking about Silmarillion because it's part of Tolkien world. Arda is not limited by the Lotr.

>GIMme (li)

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He also gave them armour, more weapons and deadly fell beasts. Sauron originally sent them to the Shire as spies, as secret agents; not as warriors.

Return of the King? More like Return of the Incel

the nazgul are driven awayby aragorn, a descendant of the gods, their antithesis, weilding a source of light. both the symbolism and the basis on worldbuilding escapes you because you are a brain dead GoT fan who thinks "characters randomly die in the middle of their character arcs" = "good writing"
this happens because LotR has actual world building unlike GoT's (((subversive)))
>hurrrrrr the lord of light
nothing comes out of it
>dude ice and fire!!!!!!
has no relevance to anything
>durrrr the old gods and the new
is not relevant to anything

you're bringing the silmarillion into this because you can't answer a simple question. basically you're ultimately saying lotr can't stand on its own as a story. nice one

This. Game of Thrones' worldbuilding is superficial and disconnected from its themes. GRRM is an amateur writer.

lmao tolkien made up languages

nazg means "(finger-)ring" or "magic-ring" in the Black Speech.[1][2]
nazg was an early loan from Elvish words derived from root NASAG.[2]
nazg was inspired by the Gaelic (Irish) word nasc (Scottish: nasg), also meaning ring.[4][5]

he waves a torch at them and they scurry off. aragorn is a descendant of a god? gandalf is a demi god, and gandalf can't make them scurry off.
doesn't work, you can't tell it doesn't work because you have the brain of a child

>Era Gone
Kek

didn't this literally happen in the shitty hobbit movies?

>and gandalf can't make them scurry off.
But Gandalf did make them scurry off at Weathertop before Aragorn and the hobbits reached it. He also makes them fuck off later on.

also why can't aragorn make them scurry off in the final battle at the black gates? how does this make any sense?

>good guys good
>bad guys bad
bravo tolkien

well GoT basically fucked its source material in the ass, so no wonder it doesn't appear to add up yet

>fucked its source material in the ass
What source material? The books are like half-finished. Where does Azor Ahai or Ice and Fire come into play in ASoIaF?

the show fucked off with the source material after a storm of swords...

if the fat fuck ever finishes writing them we'll know

the cgi in this dated very poorly

That's wrong though. There is always redemption, always hope

don't worry user, we'll just LARP our own LOTR with all these plotholes fixed

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The Witch-king was made vulnerable and weak by the Merry's magic blade. I see it less of "gotcha" based on gender and more halfling wankery that Tolkien was keen on, since halflings are more "no Man" than a cockless member of the race of Men

>gandalf drives the witch king away with holy light from his staff
based speedwatcher

that doesn't happen in the books you mental midget

the fuckin thing people get wrong about it all
is that it isn't that a man couldn't kill the witch king
it is that a man *doesn't* kill the witch king
glorfindel foresaw the witchking's death, and it was not by the hand of man; hence no man will kill him: no man CAN kill him.
it's got nothing to do with being a women, or women stronk, or hobbits with magic swords. They were just lucky and happened to get the witchking.

>In my head it'll be great
Whoah...
Do we know what happens with Stannis'? No? Thought so.

The 2 major battles were the weakest parts of the movies and not the focal point anyway.
They didn't do justice to the witch-king breaking the gates of gondor only to be faced with Gandalf alone.

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>Do we know what happens with Stannis'? No? Thought so.
i do because im grrm. stannis calls you gay and then you cry and he laughs. story over the end

I believe it

were we not talking exclusively about the books you autistic faggot

>Do we know what happens with Stannis'?
You never will because the fat fuck hack will never release his next book and if he does it will not further the running plots in any way and half of it will be about some new retarded character and not any of the ones with an ongoing plot.

i was hoping you would say this. so how do you explain the fact aragorn chases off the witchking and all the nazgul on weathertop with a torch, but then in rotk the witchking breaks gandalfs staff?
youtube.com/watch?v=2TTB5t_4Nlc

Better yet, why wouldn't they just do it willingly? It would have cost them literally nothing and potentially saved the world. Were they assholes?

What about Glorfindel and the twins?

Would have been better if it was a skeleton undead army.

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The whole point of all the battles was to distract Sauron from the hobbits.

because you are a nitpicking fagnut, that's
if it was game of thrones the witch king would have died by accidentaly choking on sauron's dick and aragorn would like fall of his horse and die and grima wormtongue would become king of middle earth because hurrrr look how realistic and subversive and mature it all is. fuck you.

Closer to Mordor, with full focus of Sauron

>nitpicking fagnut
maybe tolkien should have written something more consistent sweetie
holy shit are you saying he was buffed because he was closer to mordor like some fucking rpg? LMAO

tolkien doesn't have to explain why magic works the way it does, brainlet
not so with GRRM's objectively bad writing and broken, unfinished plots
>sweetie sweetie sweetie sweetie
based brainwashed incel faggot

>tolkien doesn't have to explain why magic works the way it does

>based brainwashed incel faggot
absolutely seething. have sex

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EN LOUIE LOUIE

Kek

>a debt with no interest
Makes me wonder what Aragorn's tax policy was if he was too stupid to negotiate at least two battles payment for one missed battle hundreds of years ago

>interest
(((oi vey)))

GRRM is a terrible writer. His prose is verbal wallpaper paste.

he literally throws fireballs

Well lets see retard how about you starve to death in a cave after likely cannibalizing your fellow friends only to then remain there as a spirit for decades believing you are eternally damned for your stupid act of cowardice
They are spirits but they are definitely fucking completely insane at this point nonetheless, the faggot probably wanted the fuck OUT of Middle Earth and Aragorn had very little bargaining power considering they could just threaten to murder all of humanity if Aragorn doesn’t release them, since they are out of the cave. Maybe Aragorn had faith in the Hobbits (obvious recurring fucking theme in these films) and thought he was asking just enough without just getting fucking slaughtered

The debt repaid was one battle, not multiple. The ghost almost fucking killed them collapsing the cave as it was, Aragorn had literally no bargaining power to ask for more. If he asked for more help in the field, the ghosts probably would have just started slaughtering everyone until he yielded. They clearly had no honor. They spent years murdering innocent travelers for literally no reason lmao

BRAVO, TOLKIEN, BRAVO!

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Fuck Haldir. The movies are too "pro-elf" at times when elves are actually getting the fuck out of dodge. Also, they did fuck-all in the battle, except creating the idea that Rohan was fucked but now it stood a chance because a few hundred elf archers came to help.

Are you fucking retarded? The Witch King literally derives all of his power from a ring that channels part of Sauron’s life force. At Weathertop, they believed 1. Their mission was largely accomplished, and 2. They were at a fragment of their power because Sauron at that time was far weaker than in RotK. That’s the only reason they got BTFO and left.

Did they chop some of Eomer/Theoden's lines to give them to Aragorn in the movies? I always thought that was the case but never bothered to actually check, and I don't have the books on hand.

Best movie is the first. Second one continues more of the first. 3rd one becomes overkill. Long. Lots of short good bits scattered throughout. Many "didn't this happen in the previous films?" moments.

>They were at a fragment of their power because Sauron at that time was far weaker than in RotK. That’s the only reason they got BTFO and left.

its funny as hell how every explanation for the holes in lotr are just a bunch of vague headcanon that is not explained anywhere in the books or movies. fragment of their power lmao holy shit lotr fanboys are hilarious

>Were they assholes?
Well, yeah.

In Tolkien's universe, the power to stop Sauron is inversely proportional to the amount of fucks given.