Why are so many people in this show pseudo-atheists?

Because magic is something that waxes and wanes in their universe. There hadnt been magic in westeros for a long time

watch the last kingdom is you want to see a show where religion is taken seriously... it's quite annoying tho

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TLK is great, not annoying at all.
>not enjoying Alfred's muh God autismo

It only gets annoying if you're a spiritlet

>magic obviously exists in this world

where?

nobody believes anything north of the wall.

thoros is a drunk.

melisandre is one person who can do parlor tricks with fire and claims she sees things.

where is this obvious magic?

I noticed this as well. It's simply the writers. We just don't know how to write superstitious characters that don't sound retarded anymore.

GRRM is an actual Fedora

>Jew pushes atheism into the West

That must be a firs-

Davos believes in the faith of the seven in the books while Stannis is the atheist

And like people said magic is something that exists but no one truly knows how it works

Stannis just follows the fire god because it benefits him for now

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>where is this obvious magic?
The fucking Night King you utter spastic?

>So much wrong information in this thread and the only right answer has gone ignored despite being written early on

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Apart from magic must have always been pretty fucking significant, considering the night king being formed thousands of years ago, the hall of faces isn't exactly new and, y'kno, fucking fire breathing dragons.

Beric died how many times and confirmed there is nothing after death.

WHO HAS SEEN THE NIGHT KING????

nobody from Westeros other than Jon has ever seen the Night King (or a dragon) until s6/7. When Jon takes 7 idiots north of the wall to catch a zombie.

If your question is "why are people still atheists after s8e3?" then you might have an argument (not really) but in s1-5? there is no fucking magic in the eyes of the random peasant.

>or a dragon
Yeah forget those skulls in the red keep, they aren't anything don't worry about it.

>In Qohor [they worship] the Black Goat...he feeds on blood offerings every day. On holy days, he is offered condemned criminals, and in times of great crisis, he may even be offered the nobles' children of the city to beg his protection. Does he accept their gift? Well, the city still stands.

Human sacrifices, sounds atheist as fuck in Qohor.

Stannis is also the only convinced atheist in the books. Jon is another one who's described as "unbeliever by nature" (like Stannis), but he has never really examined his faith or lack of thereof.

>Since the Dawn Age, the ironborn have followed the Drowned God, who plucked fire from the sea, and made us to reave and sack, and carve our names in blood and song.

Sounds atheist as fuck in the Iron Islands.

>R'hllor, alternatively known as the Lord of Light, is a deity widely worshiped on the continent of Essos. The Lord of Light has been described as a "fire god" and its clergy "fire priests", as His worship centers around fire and light.
>The faith of the Lord of Light is the majority religion in several of the Free Cities, and extends to Asshai in the distant east. Worship of the Lord of Light is almost unheard of in Westeros.

Sounds atheist as fuck in Essos.

>The Old Gods of the Forest, or simply the Old Gods, are a pantheon of innumerable and unnamed spirits of nature, which are worshiped by many people of the North and small numbers elsewhere in Westeros.

Sounds atheist as fuck in the North.

>In the far east [they worship] the Lion of Night, who fathered the world's first emperor on the Maiden-Made-of-Light, and whose wrath nearly ended the world.

Sounds atheist as fuck in Yi Ti.

At the begging make sense but it was ridiculous to not worship the Lord of Light (aka LoL) since he was clearly a real god and a protector of mankind.

>The Seven (also known as the God of Seven, the Seven-Faced God, or the New Gods) is the deity of the Faith of the Seven, the dominant religion of the Seven Kingdoms.

Sounds atheist as fuck in Westeros.

>dragons exist
>therefore god exists
so god doesn't exist in our universe?

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>The Weeping Woman is a deity worshiped in Lys, one of the Free Cities in Essos. Hers is one of several religions and cults popular in the city. She is sometimes also called the "Weeping Lady".

Sounds atheist as fuck in Lys.

>so god doesn't exist in our universe?
correct. however, the point was that magic wasn't visible in the universe until late on in the TV show, when this is patently false considering dragons are quite clearly fuelled by magic.

Just because there is minor proof about a God existing doesn't mean you will be inclined to follow it. If you've been living in absolute misery your entire life, then that just gives you a reason not to be part of a religion whose God is responsible for all wrongs in your life.

In the books Davos is a follower of the 7 which is pretty much a Catholic while Stannis is an athiest because he saw his parents die as a child and refused to believe in gods after that.

>written by a militant anti-Christian

Big yikes

So why did the show make Davos atheist and Stannis religious?

We have faceless man. All the stuff dany encountered in that weird city. We have Dany that is immune to fire. And we have a soup that can fix shanked guts thar went through sewer water.

Small scale magic is probably all around the world.

In the books anyway, rezzing swiss cheeses your memory, Beric doesn't remember a lot of what happened when he's alive either so it could just be amnesia. If you can't remember shit you did last week you're not likely to remember the afterlife either.

Or...what's brought back isn't really the person. Their soul has moved on, this is just a re-animated corpse.

Wrong. Magic has suddenly returned to the world mysteriously, all these red wizards had no power, dragons weren't magical and were either extinct or next to extinct for thousands of years. The hall of faces is an exclusive temple where few are allowed in and george has yet to explain what is going on there.

>Turns Davos, Sansa and many devoutly religious characters atheistic for no reason

You're confusing atheist/religious with pro/against the Lord of Light. Davos is clearly a follower of the Seven and Stannis' conversion is a plot driver.

Not in the show

Sansa stops praying after the red wedding

Yes. There is a lot of religious lore, but a lot of the main characters constantly express lack of belief.

Probably because there are alot of adult characters on that show.

dragons do not provide evidence of magic and magic doesn't necessarily provide evidence for gods.
the only magic you witness(iirc) in the show through a pov character is jon(warg and lord of bones/mance rayder), stannis(mance), bran(ultra warg) and davos(melisandre's shadow child)

in the books* not the show

And the swords on fire. And the resurrection and and and...

I also don't see fire immune white girls as magical.

>muh intelligent characters can't be religious

Fuck GRRM. Glad he's never gonna finish the books

Glass candles

I would imagine the immense majority of people in this universe has never seen blood magic or dragons. It's all just fairy tales until they see it happen. Pretty much why people got together to watch daenerys' dragons when she came to westeros, they could not believe their eyes.

In the books it is made pretty obvious that real magic is dependent on dragons being alive in the world.

The arguments about magic don't even matter here. Most religious people irl have never witnessed anything magic. Still, atheism wasn't very common in medieval times, so it's weird how so many main characters constantly spout pseudo-atheistic one-liners.

Why? It is an extra power that has no explanation. We burned witches that has much much less

Right which is why Jon snow is still the same person and remembers everything

G.R.R.M. is an atheist, but the books aren't worst agnostic about what's up with the gods and what they want. D&D are the preachy, overbearing kind of atheists who think even in myths and fantasy, you should rewrite it to take the mythical and fantastic parts out. Think of Troy.

Fuck, I'm a lifelong atheist, and it's annoying. Magical fictional words can have gods. If there were real miracles like you see in the books and followers of various gods had actual powers, I would consider the existence of gods. I might not like or worship them, but I'd take this evidence into consideration.

I feel like this is a mistepresentation of atheism. Atheism is just not concerning yourself with the whole question unless evidence pops up. It's not about life being fair (some religions the gods are evil or they're huge cunts at least) or rejecting any particular religion or shit you were taught as a kid or being edgy. If evidence of spiritual shit appeared, atheists would reconsider their beliefs. Of course, there can be supernatural shit but no gods. But yes if the Red God seemed to be bringing people back to life and shit, I'd think maybe he, maybe some other gods could be real.

>>muh intelligent characters can't be religious
Deeply religious people born after 1970 cant be intelligent.

Not really, the magic came back before the dragons. It seems to have been tied in with a red comet
The Others also started coming closer to the Wall before dragons hatched

Does ASOIAF have a 21st century setting?

Are you capable of expressing an opinion without vague sarcastic bullshit?

Only 2 people in Westeros use magic. Then that old crone on the hill can see the vision's and freaks out when sge sees Arya. In Quarth a guy can climb on a fire rope, for about a month when Danny sees him.

I think his point is this is "based on" the Middle Ages, when people were religious. Fuck, they were religious without real magic showing up. I know it's not everywhere but even before the dragons come back, there are wights, people have heard Faceless Men have magic. That's more to go on than the real world ever had.

Maybe because most people who go through intense trauma lose faith

>Why are so many people in this show pseudo-atheists?
Written by a commie. There's your answer and you don't like it.

Why is it the blood god that's cool with slavery and blood sacrificing that proves he's existence? Why it can't be the 7 or the old gods or that one Shepherd god one of Dany's squires believes in?

>swords on fire
I guess magic exists in our world as well because I saw a guy that swallow a sword that was on fire
>And the resurrection
I had forgotten about that one but you're right. Was that through arya or the hound?

wtf was that op guy in the city?

>most people who go through intense trauma lose faith
only weak, emotional people or people who didn't have a proper grasp of their faith in the first place
makes sense for Sansa really

Any other fantasy with subtle magic? That's probably my favorite part of asoiaf and lotr.

Kill yourself, kike.

b&r

Also, they wanna sell it to China and they don’t like religion or ghosts.

For something that is supposed to be based on medieval European history there was very little expressed religiousness on display. The exception being the high sparrow stuff

So was it the show, or is it like this in the books?

Anti organized religion more.
A spiritual libertarian of you wi

Ha
I gotta work that line into conversation.
Also Odda the Elder did nothing wrong.

>Anything that has been documented to have happened is automatically not magical, it's just how it is
You lack the IQ needed to even begin thinking about this subject, you reductionist, materialist brainlet.

>or are the writers just pandering to modern audiences?
You answered your own question, bro.

>moves goalpost
and you're still wrong. fucking A, stop posting during class, you little shit.

Stannis never really converted in the books; he sees R'hllor as just some random magic that may or may not work as advertised. Even Melisandre admits he's a born unbeliever.

Stannis outright says dargons are magic.

he's right though.....
magic died out with the dragons and for a bit religion was basically same as in real life.

Magic started to return to the world after the birth of Dany's dragons

Depends on the character. Some pray a lot and don't doubt their gods exist, others don't pray much but do believe in gods unquestionably. Only a few characters genuinely question gods' existence, though.

stannis 'the menace' is hardly an authority on neither magic nor religion

And he's right: they come back just as all the other magical stuff starts showing up.

>Dragons being magic is demonstrated and discussed repeatedly throughout the show even tying into the themes of the show
vs
>nah bro they're not cause i'm being argumentative on Yea Forums.

Think about it. Their civilization is a total garbage heap where uncaring lords and ladies rule over them with an iron fist, yet bandits and pirates rule the countryside. Your children have a high chance of being raped or killed or freezing to death during the long winters. Even if they survive all that all they have to look forward to when they grow up is being a dirt scrabbling peasant or becoming a bandit, there's no industry or guilds to join. And all the pre established religions are corrupt organizations with one single church located in a medieval New York type city, with no satellite churches and no members going about doing good work or charitable missions or preaching a brotherhood. And that's just scratching the surface of the shithole that Westeros is.

These people aren't athiests. They're depressed nihilists, and frankly they have every right to be in that shit universe.

>Dragons being magic is demonstrated and discussed repeatedly throughout the show even tying into the themes of the show
>the show
it's never even explicitly speculated. dragons could be fully natural for all you know

please concentrate really hard at around 1:11

youtu.be/KwpyWHDrL8A?t=65

What about mixing religion and politics? In the real Europe pretty much every side in a war would try to claim they had the backing of God, and the church had his influence because of this. There wasn't really any of that in the show

>It is no mere storm. It is God's storm
Imagine being btfo so hard you convert to christianity just because of Alfred's grand bullshittiing

>The right answer has quads

>the main characters constantly express lack of belief.
No they don`t, are you retarded?
Catelyn, Jon, Sansa, Davos, Brianne all sincerely believe in the Seven or the old gods.

its post modern schlock its why they removed all the supernatural elements and left only the dragons and the night king white walkers
theres no prophecy or anything that makes you think that there are higher beings involved in all this, no old gods, no drowned god, no azor ahai no nothing

>reddit spacing

>Like how Davos' son is portrayed pretty negatively for being a religious freak.
you said it right, he's portrayed negatively for being a religious FREAK, a fanatic, a zealot. Just like other characters such as Lancel. Beric and Thoros aren't portrayed negatively for believing in the same god as Davos' son. Catelyn and septon Meribald aren't portrayed negatively for believing in the same god as Lancel and septa Unella. The show/books don't treat religion as bad in and of itself, just religious extremism.

I'M NOT GOING TO RAPE HEH, I'M GOING TO FOOK HEH

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middle ages had sceptics in every culture