What a shitshow. How is it possible to be so faithful yet so flat?

is it actually bad? one of my favorite books growing, what a shame

I watched the film but was only paying half attention, so I was right confused by the ending.

I tried reading the book, but the author obviously hates the reader. I got halfway through before I gave up.

The only funny parts were Major Major Major, and the section where he uses exclusively pronouns while four different people are speaking and you have barely any clue who is actually talking.

Adaptations of books have to somehow make up for the lack of narration if they're going to stay faithful to the books.

If the show wanted to be great (haven't bothered watching) then it would likely need to add comments in between major scenes similar to how Farscape would do, just generally entertaining banter which I doubt many writers are competent enough to do.

I just finished it like two minutes ago. It was pretty good.

Is it told in media res like the novel?

Im halfway through episode 2 does it become shit later? enjoying myself for now.

I disliked it immediately. If you like it so far, that's good, expect more of the same.

i havent read the book so the jokes are new to me maybe thats why.

Could be! I highly recommend reading the book after.

Careful anons, LA-based comedian Sean the audio engineer may very well be lurking in this thread...
Also this is a TDS thread now

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>the author obviously hates the reader
its more that he just can't write

No. Its runs chronologically and the hospital sequence is paired way way down.

I can't believe that, the writing is too well planned to annoy and confuse the reader.

Like how he keeps mentioning the dead guy in the tent, but never explaining it. And that one chapter where he hypes up the dangerous bombing run that turns out to be a cake walk, and closes with "Actually it was the next one that was a massacre"

He was a pretty minor character in the series, and he did alright has the right face but I imagined someone a bit older.

And yeah it was good yo-yo was well cast. Wish aarfy was fat and Orr I imagined being dumb and pudgy as well.

Right off the bat I can sense a difference from the novel. In the first real bombing scene in episode 1 Yossarian is portrayed as a stoic, serious, and focused bombardier not the pussy who drops as soon as he feels it's justifiable to do so and scrambles out of from the bombardier's chamber.
That's a shame. A lot of the mystery will be lost.

people who can't write or tell a story also annoy and confuse the reader.

Oh yeah and the best part was no quips

>implying you've read the book
>implying you've ever read anything
LMAO

This wouldn’t fly at all ever desu I liked that they still made him have PTSD but not a complete yellow belly coward

I stopped listening early because everyone besides the man himself was such a drag and the only thing besides Dick giving the show any gas was drama surrounding the old show or the retards he brings onto his new one.

I feel like it undersold the humor in favor of the existential terror. Yossarian is annoying but it's a lot easier to take when everyone else is so zany. The show is way more annoying. I just watched the first episode though.

>Orr I imagined being dumb and pudgy as well.
Orr and Milo are the smartest people in the book.. they did quite well at portraying them

they also don't go into the different pilots he has to deal with. The one who just flies straight and true, directly into flak, and doesn't take a scratch, but everyone is losing their shit despite the fact they don't take flak. Then the one who practically does loop-the-loops and barrel rolls, all but killing everyone else on the plane, also without taking any flak. With yosarian being unable to decide which is worse. Then with the people in the middle, who neither fly straight in or perform absurd acrobatics, not surviving a milkrun, because flak is designed to expect pilots to try to avoid it, but only a certain amount.

downplaying the cowardice worked, because actual cowards aren't crying, screaming, and running around in circles. But he is still a coward, and to get over it, he finally goes as insane as everyone else.

Wasn’t Orr the one that spoke absolute gibberish until they realize he flew the coop at the end of the novel? Imagined more of an idiot savant. Actor still did well tho.

But in the novel he literally would just drop his bombs ASAP, which really would not translate well to tv

why not

Bc it’s a nuance which is hard to capture in film in which the protagonist is also screwing over lives on the ground and ur supposed to root for him

I read about 100 pages in before realizing how jewish this book was.
>joseph HELLer
nope

I would rather they stayed a little more faithful to the books. I believe changes need to be made for an adaptation to be good, but to change the portrayal of Yossarian is ridiculous. It feels like a different story.

>the dead guy in the tent
Uh that was perfectly well explained
>"Actually it was the next one that was a massacre"
That's the joke. It's also why this is unfilmable.

But he’s still a sad and dry humor sorts character, i think it was alright

Ha ya Jews can’t write anything t. Brainlet

it really isn't, though. It just can't be shown and would require exposition to explain. As the other side of the fact that he dropped them as soon as he possibly could was that's how you're supposed to drop them, and it made him an effective bombardier. all dancing around the idea his fear made him effective, so being a coward kept him from getting demoted, but the only way they could punish him, effectively, was with more missions. and they couldn't punish him anyway, because that would mean acknowledging something had gone wrong.

>It's also why this is unfilmable.
The 1970 movie had a lot of flaws but captured the atmosphere very well and had decent portrayals.

Orr was operating on an entirely different level.
The 1970 movie was better cast desu ne.

its also unwritable.

the biggest problem is yoyo is the only real character everyone else seems to be competent with a minor quirk.
reading the book everyones fucked its reno 911 every person in reno911 is fucked.
in this the only crazy person is yoyo. everyones else has minor quirks but for the most part they seem ok. yoyo just seems like an coward sabotaging the war effort which he is but the rest of them are batshit too it balances out.

dangle wouldnt work if he was in law and order.

that what it is the others have their book personality but it doesnt show through in the majority of scenes. it comes across like yoyo is the only crazy guy.

>>the dead guy in the tent
>Uh that was perfectly well explained
Eventually, after half a book of mentioning it, never explaining, and have the reader wondering what the fuck is that all about.

Which implies planning. A bad writer would have never explained it, or explained it right away, instead of just having it there in the background taunting the reader.

The waiting is part of the fun of it being in media res. Did you seriously find that annoying?

I really think George Clooney doesn't get the book.

It’s not a book that relies on character development tho, it’s absurd dark comedy. Anyone who thinks otherwise and criticizes the book for being poorly written... well it’s certainly not. If u say heller is a one trick pony, then yes as are most writers.

there doesn't seem to be much that george clooney understands. He's a pretty awful director.

He's the Google translate of source material adapters.

I think with this book you're either too stupid to get it or stupider and too stupid to not get it

and the tv show sucks because it's not funny

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Are Nately's Whore and Nately's Whore's Kid Sister in it?

I liked it but it is VERY different from the book, which I also liked. It's almost the complete opposite while keeping everything just familiar enough to call it an adaption.
For some reason I just got a lot of catharsis seeing someone constantly trying to attain a relatively simple goal and the universe doing everything it can to keep him from it.

thats the thing though theres to many straight men in the show that happen to be crazy at certain points lifted from them book. thats why it feels flat
the other characters that arent yoyo are competent for the majority of the time. they arent crazy the whole time

Each ep should have been about a character, with flashbacks and cutaways as necessary. Coen Bros could have done it.

Watched the first episode and I was very underwhelmed
I read this book in high school, and I remember laughing my ass off on almost every page
But the show is extremely dry. Everyone is a Calvin Klein model and has 0 comedic timing nor capability to be funny. The production is there, but the script and delivery fail to return anything but a mediocre product

It wasn’t awfully directed but it was quite repetitive which at the same time is kind of the concept of the book, esp with the concept of how boring bomber squad runs are.

That being said if anything I wished they would take some more liberties in adding in some dogfights on the side alongside the bomber runs idk if they happened in Italy not a wwii buff but it would add a bit variety.

Also, remember in the book milo actually bombs the shit out of his own company resulting in quite a few deaths.

it wasnt ptsd enough

Yeah...no.

"“Havermeyer was a lead bombardier who never missed. Yossarian was a lead bombardier who had been demoted because he no longer gave a damn whether he missed or not. He had decided to live forever or die in the attempt, and his only mission each time he went up was to come down alive."

Excerpt From: Joseph Heller. “Catch-22.”

You missed the entire point of the book. I don't know if it's even worth explaining, because I don't think you'd understand. Cowardice? It was never an issue, or even discussed.

Ya but no stabby stabby and she doesn’t end the series as she does in the novel. Theres a funny scene with the kid sister tho.

I really liked the actor who portrayed nately. Milo and McWatt had good portrayals as well.

I see you didn't understand that post.

That’s actually exactly how I felt— that Clooney was ripping off the coen brothers. I agree they would have done it much better. Didn’t Clooney also direct the men who stare at goats? I remember that movie having some really good scenes but then the second half just fucking sucked.

>That being said if anything I wished they would take some more liberties in adding in some dogfights

Jesus fucking christ. Why do I come to this godforsaken tibetan picture trading forum. Why? Why do I do this to myself? Why?

because otherwise you would forget how retarded the average person is. and if you did that, you might develop some level of hope for the future/humanity.

>Everyone is a Calvin Klein model and has 0 comedic timing nor capability to be funny. The production is there, but the script and delivery fail to return anything but a mediocre product
this

In ep one where Hugh Laurie gives his line about sardines i laughed for the first and only time and was like -hold on- no one else in this comedy series is funny. What the fuck?

Then I saw David Michod had written the screenplay and was an EP and was like - HOLD ON -... Animal Kingdom? The Rover? Kinos yes, but not a funny ounce to them.

to be fair, hugh laurie could make the dictionary into a comedy.

The only really crazy characters in the novel I remember was Orr who stuck crabapples or something in his cheeks and said a bunch of gibberish, McWatt who flew batshit or just flew straight thru the flak (maybe these were two diff pilots), aarfy who literally raped and murdered a chick and thought he was gonna be aight and he was, and yoyo who kept tryna say he was crazy but was actually the straight guy but also had major quips.

Oh and milo who actually bombed his own camp and made a bunch of nice meals n shit.

Actually now that I write this all out the tv adaptation did most of this except for Orr, but it wasn’t as funny.

>The Rover
it was pretty funny how robert pattinson discovered his true talent was in portarying the mentally retarded.

Nah dude I was gonna post the same thing but just decided to ignore ur brainlet post.

i miss veep bros

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there's a decent argument for the idea the only reason the book was funny was because it abstracted the war away from the reader, and could focus entirely upon the absurdity.

The ending of the book was a little rushed anyway.

Dawg idfc bomber runs don’t translate well to tv fuck id rather watch someone play that desert storm tank game on Super Nintendo

>tail gunner but no German pilots to shoot

Fuckin why

It's not like comedy and pathos can't benefit each other
Although it be easier to make it just funny

Nah Laurie’s only funny scene was when yoyo moved the line and he ends up in the Nazi occupied church

I deleted it after ep 1
i'm not prepared to watch a comedy show that isn't funny from a book i didn't like much and the fact that it's an ensemble cast of white men and ostensibly about war or something else manly isn't what i choose things to watch based on.

Ya honestly I couldn’t remember the end aside from stabby stabby

Uh ok

>wwii bomber squadron in Italy
>Too many fuckin white men

>animal kingdom
>kino

Wtf r u on

I think it's the opposite. It starts off as just the silly adventures of silly people with war being an afterthought, but then things just spiral out of control while that comedic tone is still intact. You get horrific shit like McWatt's death written like a comedy sketch. Things are so bad that you can't really do anything except laugh at them. Like how Yossarian keeps dodging Nately's Whore, never actually confronting the brutality and emotion of it all, or even giving it a proper name, just dancing around the problem because it's the only way you can stay alive and sane.

>Actually now that I write this all out the tv adaptation did most of this except for Orr, but it wasn’t as funny.
thats the thing they did it but it doesnt feel right. its more of a check box where they do this but its only during that scene for the rest of the part where that guy is minor or in the background they arent on. they default to a normal army man.

It's not a criticism, i'm happy to watch something with an ensemble cast of white men, i just don't care either way. It's not how i pick things to watch, like many people here.

are we talking about the same animal kingdom? the straya film?

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that's the thing, a good adaptation is faithful to the spirit not the letter.

Oh, nah lol

idiot

the spirit was the absurdity. the letter was the war.

helo

you should watch it user
it's brutal crime kino

it's the reason Ben Mendelsohn gets work in hollywood now

this show seemed almost like gaybait with the scene of them all diving off the pontoon

war is always pretty gay

I was not aware there was a shitty remake of this. That soldier in fear the walking dead with the plastic face plays a main character I think it was very bizarre. I was pretty stoned as well.

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Where’s my fuckin dogfights then

>What a shitshow.

Are you a child or just retarded because I'm over half way through and the show is fucking great.

Don't listen to OP. Check it out.

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>book about bomber crew
>expects dogfights
Try actually reading the book, zoomy.

I did tell me tho what’s the purpose of a tail gunner if there’s no planes to shoot down?

Catch 22, what a battle axe!

Couldn't they get any authentic Italian actors?

OP confirmed for Nately

Now I’m curious anyone know how bomber squad positions were assigned during training?

I would assume gunners to be pretty low rank compared to navigators/pilots/bombardiers.

That seems fair, but if there’s one person who can keep talking about the same subject matter over and over again (the lolsuit) and make it funny every time, it’s Dick. Some of the people he brings on are just batshit insane like Chris the Kiwi. Jesus Christ I think Chris the Kiwi is an actual psychopath

They needed a framing device. Some situation that would make it possible for characters to narrate a little. Like the death of McWatt:
>But Yossarian understood suddenly why McWatt wouldn't jump, and went running uncontrollably down the whole length of the squadron after McWatt's plane, waving his arms and shouting up at him imploringly to come down, McWatt, come down; but no one seemed to hear, certainly not McWatt, and a great, choking moan tore from Yossarian's throat as McWatt turned again, dipped his wings once in salute, decided oh, well, what the hell, and flew into a mountain.
>Colonel Cathcart was so upset by the deaths of Kid Sampson and McWatt that he raised the missions to sixty-five.
You can't just show him crashing into the mountain. You could have a court martial, or characters being interviewed in limbo by the CID man who menaces Yossarian in his fever dream, then disappearing as they reach the point where they die. You need a way to keep cutting from character to character and seeing their reactions and seeing how everything rhymes. You can't just plod through plot point after plot point in a straight line.

Yep on point

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showing the events chronologically was bad decision

How did they even work out which order things were supposed to happen in?

Wasn't the novel chronological too? Pretty sure the only frequent flashbacks were those about Snowden and his funeral.

Man it would change time frame from one paragraph to another.

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>Wasn't the novel chronological too?
lolno that's like one of the defining traits of the book

>American literature
Lmaooooo

Moby Dick is the best book ever written and Pynchon is the best living writing. lmaoing at every other """""country""""

You mean
>jewish literature

HIS NAME IS YOSSARIAN STOP CALLING HIM YO YO

I just don't want to see it, I'm sure it's not TERRIBLE but from the trailer, seems nothing like as charming as the book

Apu would make a good Aarfy.

they were all crazy

>CHAPTER 32 - YO-YO'S ROOMIES
Wrong, everyone calls him Yo-Yo. He loves it!

Except Orr.

Any pics of Nately's whore?
>tfw no italian yandere gf

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Catch-22 seems like a really pointless novel to adapt. It's largely absurd and intentionally farcical. Did they actually shoot live action scenes like Major Major jumping out the window and clawling in ditches, or when Yossarian was meeting people in the bush every night?

>'*Caro*,' she murmured hoarsely as though from the depths of a tranquil and luxurious trance. 'Ooooh, *caro mio*.'
>One caressing hand on his back slipped deftly down inside his trouser belt while the other groped secretly and treacherously about on the floor for the bread knife and found it.
>He saved himself just in time. She still wanted to kill him! He was shocked and astounded by her depraved subterfuge as he tore the knife from her grasp and hurled it away.
>This time she wept with no other emotion than grief. He could have walked from the room safely then. But he chose to remain and console and help her. 'Please,' he urged her inarticulately with his arm about her shoulders, recollecting with pained sadness how inarticulate and enfeebled he had felt in the plane coming back from Avignon when Snowden kept whimpering to him that he was cold, he was cold, and all Yossarian could offer him in return was 'There, there. There, there.' 'Please,' he repeated to her sympathetically. 'Please, please.
>She wiped her cheeks with a tiny, polite smile and gave the handkerchief back, murmuring '*Grazie, grazie*' with meek, maidenly propriety, and then, without any warning whatsoever of a change in mood, clawed suddenly at his eyes with both hands. She landed with each and let out a victorious shriek.
>'Ha! *Assassino!*' she hooted, and raced joyously across the room for the bread knife to finish him off.
>A noise behind him made him turn. His senses reeled in horror at what he saw. Nately's whore's kid sister, of all people, was coming after him with another long bread knife! 'Oh, no,' he wailed with a shudder. He lost patience entirely with the whole grotesque and incomprehensible melee. There was no telling who might lunge at him next through the doorway with another long bread knife, and he lifted Nately's whore's kid sister off the floor, threw her at Nately's whore and ran out of the room, out of the apartment and down the stairs.

>when Yossarian was meeting people in the bush every night?
This could have worked if it was done more like a skit that you keep cutting away to. You can't plonk the camera down and film away.