Have video games killed cinema? Why would anyone pay $20 for a linear, two-hour movie when they can enjoy a playable...

>No computer game has ever come close to being art
Unlike Marvel, GoT and all other capeshit discussed here at all times. Right?

piracy and "youtube" and proliferation of streaming platforms has killed them both.

no one plays games anymore, they watch fags on youtube play games then shit posts .

>Kojima
>Miyazaki
>Taro
>Rockstar
>CDProjekt

Brainlets

Film is a direct unchangeable artistic expression with the focus on the work itself.
Games are non direct changeable programmed expression with the focus on the player.

What was the last game you played that delivered a 200 hour playable experience?

Spiderman ps4

all laughable garbage compared to any legitimate filmmaker

Literally the OP image, for one.

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I've bought 3 AAA games this decade. Gaming is dead.

Videogames (((industry))) is shooting itself on the foot too (woke, no fun, rushed gambling), so if everything is going to shit nothing matters every standard is fucked downhill, and that's the trick.

>200 hours

people have jobs and gfs user

when i dont tho yeah ill sink 200 hours into a game

RDR2>Thor the dark world
bruh

If Red Dead were a movie your eyes would roll out of your head from all of the cliches and contrivanves. But because you play along with it your marble-smooth brain convinces itself you're part of the story and so the events feel more significant to you.

>with film, or a book, or a painting you get an exact fixed unchangeable artistic expression delivered to you just like it is intended
Imagine believing this. Read Susan Sontag.

I saw something where you can get RDR2 for like $35 this week

That level of engagement makes them an even deeper form of art.

wow riveting info user
please proceed to slit your wrists

>playable
That's the problem. I'm too old and lazy to press buttons. These days I'd rather watch a letsplay than actually play any vidya.

Nope, the literal opposite. The more a game is considered "art" it has less interactivity in it.

>film
>direct unchangable
So everybody also fapps at every rape scene? Everybody also cheers for every villain because goody2shoes heroes are boring as fuck? Everybody not only understand but get every nuance of a film?

Nice. I'll check it out. I enjoy both movies and games.

FPBP
Will does it again, bros.

I'm just saying it, you autist. It's a better deal. an hero

Yes obviously people have different interpretations, but they all saw the same exact film, the artist's expression stays exactly the same no matter how you watch it. Same with books, a sentence remains that exact sentence which the author wrote no matter how you read it, it's only how you interpret or feel from it is what changes. Same with any other actual art form. be it film, music, paintings etc. All fixed unchangeable direct artistic expressions.

But not video games.

Who are your favorite directors and writers user?

Because modern video games are even worse than modern movies.

Zulawski
Bresson
Clouzot
Angelopoulos
Glazer
Herzog

To be fair the cinema experience is fucking awful. It's the movie equivalent of a console exclusive. A pricier experience that is far worse than watching a movie at home/playing on PC but you are forced to do it anyways because they are holding the movie/game hostage.

>Kojima
>Rockstar
>CDProjekt
How embarrassing. You know those games are pretty much the video game equivalent of a marvel movie right?

But that's wrong. There isn't a single work of art that dictates how it is allowed or able to be experienced. Viewing a painting from a different angle, against another background, or under different lighting conditions changes the piece significantly from what the artist "intended." Modern video games provide a carefully curated artistic experience while encouraging freedom and control. You're stuck in this brainlet, two-dimensional mindset where you think only what's shown "on-camera" or "in-frame" can be counted as part of the work. Video games exist in a three-dimensional space, every inch, foot, and angle of which stands as its own work of art.

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That's true but video games aren't about the story but the interactive experience it offers, if all you care about is a good story just watch a movie or read a book, playing a game for the story by itself is just like watching a movie and taking a pause every 5-10 minutes to solve a puzzle before continuing watching.

Minecraft, any rockstar game, any strategy/grand strategy game, Borderlands, any Bethesda game(no matter how shit they may be), Stardew Valley, L4D

Glad to see that you have the ability to decide what the definition of art is.

>Pretentious visuals stapled on weak narratives
>Muh interpretation

What a surprise

>two-hundred-hour

maybe years ago but all vidya is short broken not finished shyte
Cos the Kikes investing game companies not feminazi /capeshit shyte fillums now

Yes, you can have individual pieces of art within a game, like a great soundtrack or fantastic artwork, but those aren't inherent to the video game format itself because the players input is the main focus. A video game can contain great art, much like a museum can contain beautiful paintings or a library fantastic works of literature, but neither the museum or a library are arts in of themselves as much as the pieces they are presenting, and neither are video games (or rather the act of playing a video game)

I wish I could be rich. I'd buy a house with trees just like that in front of it. Or maybe they dont exist like that in real life; it looks great in the game in any case.

>Yawn
But really vidya been ruined by the Kikes

Hand holded shitty auto aim console bollocks

Just buy a plantation house.

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The sad thing is though, those games that try to be art are also the games that are by far the worst and least interesting.

The value in video games lie in gameplay. Much like sports or other analog games like chess. The more artsy a game becomes the worse it gets. Shit like Uncharted and TLOU will always be far far far far worse than games that don't try to be art, and just want to be good games first. It's like trying to turn soccer into art. It's just pointless.

Besides, art as a concept is a dead word that has no meaning anymore so it's pointless to discuss it.

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>RDR
>playable experience
Kek.

So a movie isn't art because it's just mixing photography and literature?

Video game as an artistic medium is still in its infancy. The unprecedented level of interaction between the art and its audience is still very much unexplored but still shows up in a few projects where they weave narrative element with visuals and gameplay.

Thinking the gameplay aspect of video games cannot be used as a way of expressing art is grotesquely stupid.

Not even remotely true

>I'm too old and lazy to press buttons
But you are not too old and lazy to shitpost.

the only games i've ever played like that are world of warcraft (which is literally and unironically the most important cultural work of this century), pokemon, and civ 5

>architecture and interior design aren't art
Just stop, dude. Claiming the act of experiencing an artform disqualifies the artform from being art is tautological faggotry.

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>architecture and interior design aren't art
No one said or even implied that. Nice moving of goal posts though.

>WoW is the most important and best cultural work this century

Please explain before I go kill myself from having to live in a world with someone as dumb as you who also gets to vote.

name 1 better

But soccer is already the beautiful game so it's already art

>Imagine thinking anything made in the last 50 years in any medium is art
>imagine being this much of a brainlet

go fuck yourself, brainlet

THIS
Morrowind /half life games

Actually, the post he replied to literally said that a library or museum is not a piece of art, which is implying that architecture, the buildings in question, isn't art.

I literally put 200 hours into BOTW.

tell me how Mirror by Tarkovsky isn't art

It said that a library or a museum are not art as the pieces they are presenting you mental midget, not that they aren't art themselves.

How can I take you seriously if you're literally too stupid to understand a simple quote? You wouldn't describe a bleak, grim, post-apocalyptic game as fun in the same way you wouldn't describe a break, grim, post-apocalyptic novel like The Road as fun. The entire appeal of Uncharted is that it's a crazy 80s action B-movie that you actually PLAY instead of watch.

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Literally anything

It's not even as impactful as Minecraft, let alone better than literally every book, movie, tv show, art piece, video game, occupy wallstreet, whatever. It's fucking world "there must always be a lich King" of warcraft

Important cultural works tend to be dogshit, though.

>Video games will never be truly art
I'm sure people used to say the same thing about movies when they first became popular.

wtf is this garbage tomb raider ripoff

same could be said about kinos/books, yet people still watch kinos

I'll be 30 this year and can tell you a few things about why I prefer movie over video games these days:
>takes much less time to "get into" it - a movie starts and hooks you within the first 5 minutes. a game frequently won't hook you until you're 3+ hours into it
>games used to be ~10 hours long, which meant it only took 5 2 hour sessions to complete. current games with 100+ hours of main story are simply too tedious
>I multitask a lot more than when I was a kid. I have to make dinner for the family or work on the car or patch the roof. During these moments putting a movie on my phone or listening to a podcast is infinitely more preferable than trying to play a game
>none of my friends play games anymore, meaning it's less of a social experience. in the old days even single player games came with parties where guys would pass the controller whenever they died or we'd talk about it at lunch. now it's just you and the game... more like masturbation than anything
>too much filler... this goes back to the 100+ comment, but there's simply too much in a game (even... or maybe especially in older titles) that's specifically designed to slow you down and not tell the story. if I'm looking for storytelling media, I'll go for the one that doesn't make me work for it - I work 80 other hours out of the week. just let me have this one

>So a movie isn't art because it's just mixing photography and literature?
Careful, there's some faggot that posts here occasionally who unironically believes this

>not even as impactful as Minecraft
bait
i think it's dramatic to call them dogshit. they're probably mediocre in a lot of ways though.

Put is the core ok ?

> you own forever
not if steam/epic/stadia

>press triangle to cook this fake meat
>then press circle to pitch a tent so your character doesn't get tired
is there anything more pointless in life? you're simulating reality by pressing a button on a controller, in which case you aren't really simulating it at all. I think I had an existential crisis playing RDR2

Uncharted is high art, brainlet.

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WOT IF YOUR STAKE IS THE MATRIX STAKE?!?!??!?
WOT IF LIFE IS A SIMULATION?!?!?!?!=!=!!111

yeah, vidya aren't art but everything in them IS.

not even capeshit flicks are this ridiculous

Are you a shill? That was pathetic.

no it's garbage for zoomers too young or too faggy to play tomb raider

>films aren't art because they're just a combination of photography, music, and theatre

>Have video games killed cinema?
Endgame broke box office records....

I agree completely when you mention The Last of Us. It's the only videogame story written with the delicate touch of the best film/television writers.

I don't agree with RDR2, though. In terms of atmosphere and aesthetics, it's on par with any film you can mention, but Rockstar's scripts and dialogue are unwieldy, overwritten and overwrought. Comparisons with the best films or shows would be absurd.

>won't break domestic
>won't break international
>won't overtake avatar
seethe more, capeshitter

This is on the same level as that King Arthur movie a couple years back. Aka trash

That's not the point. Films are still popular.

Sounds like you just picked the wrong games, play indie games, literally all AAA games are shit designed to waste your time and trying to be more movies than actual games, indie games(most of them) are still just games, they are not even in that long and most have simplistic stories so you can concentrate on the actual interactive part of them.

>indy games
>some retarded basement dwellers 8 bit garbage

Hard pass

i like playing games but i hate this new idea that all games need to be open world story driven cinematic bullshit. a bloated committee of game devs that clearly can't write a compelling story end up putting all their effort into something which always ends up being unfun trash when they could be putting out games that are actually fun to play. the only good story game released in the past decade was the witcher 3, and that's because the characters are already established in a book series.

Holy shit you were serious when you called world of "sargeras isn't a badguy" warcraft" the best thing of the century

Video games trying to imitate movies is just cringe, this is why people can't take video games serious as it's own art form, because devs keep trying to imitate other art forms instead of making their own.

>what's planescape torment

Tomb Raider was never good.

It's unironically high art, I'm not joking.

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books are not art because they're just a bunch of letters stretching for a few hundred pages

>Have video games killed cinema?
>the top 10 most played games on PC atm have barely any story

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Paid shills and braindead console cunts will do that for you

And the thing that makes Uncharted not fun is that it's video game with shitty gameplay because the developers though that telling a story, and showing of fancy graphics, and trying to be movie instead is better than making something that is fun to play. They tried to imitate art, and the product suffered for it.

for 1, OP has only talked about AAA games
secondly, of the few indie games I've played they've been about 50% good

this
the last game I tried to play in any serious way was that weird cell shaded prince of persia game
once I saw they went with a faux open world concept instead of just doing a linear game, i knew the industry was fucked

This is peak reddit, but they are right on one thing: this handiwork they insert into every game gets tiring. You know, collect 140 of random object.

>being such a retard
Superhot, Ori and the blind forest, Hellblade, Stardew Valley(the only pixel game in this list), Divinity and Hollow Knight, just to name a few, are way better than any shit big companies could make.

"Cinematic games" are not art. Real video games are art tho.

Those games are multiplayer, you create your own story ever game. A single player game you finish and never touch again.

The entire industry is moving away from single player games. The idea is to turn games into services and not products.

I agree with you 100%, Kojima is a huge example of this that I don't want to get into explaining. I don't play the PS4 movie shit but they follow this exactly too.

Here's a game with its own style that doesn't take any inspiration. The director literally didn't watch any movies or play any games throughout the production of this game IIRC. He says it in a interview I believe.

The Killer7

youtube.com/watch?v=e6BmgK5s5to

youtube.com/watch?v=vDygmIrovFU

youtube.com/watch?v=dTZO60PaFTc

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isn't that just more evidence it's an inferior art form?
I'll watch a good movie 5+ times

True enough, follow the whales and the big money like the slimy cunts that they are. But there is potential, if you manage to make a very expansive multiplayer game where you create your own story it will have way more impact than any television show or movie. It's just difficult how you achieve it, because when you're playing multiplayer you're focusing on the game and can't really "enjoy" it.

I finished fallout new vegas like 7 times now.

>slow hand clap for the tard

tell me which movie you watched more than 5 times and i can mock you faggit.

No. It's evidence that he's a zoomer who only ever plays the currently heavily marketed video game of the moment.
Not that video games aren't an inferior art-form. Which is a damn good thing.

I will never understand why people are so obsessed about wanting video games to be art so much.

how many other games have you done that with?
personally I've only played the following multiple times:
>Ocarina of Time
>KOTOR (the first one only)
>New Vegas
movies? countless.

No Country for Old Men

Video games occupy a cultural ghetto similar to comic books where in theory the medium could express any number of things, but in practice 99% of what's made is escapist jerk-off power fantasies, to the point where just like comics are synonymous with one genre, superheroes, video games are defined within the narrow confines of the FPS, the third-person adventure game, the racer, the fighting game, etc.

A lot of the debate around video games being art conflates whether or not they ARE art with whether or not they're GOOD art. And on the latter count, again, 99% of them aren't. "Video game culture" is incredibly insipid and juvenile and unimaginative. Just like with comic books, this will probably never change, and any truly interesting or worthwhile work will probably be done completely outside the margins and have an audience a hundredth the size of whatever mainstream crap.

kikes killed cinema like they killed video games

Wow, what a retard. Fucking autist, with your stupid cowboy movies.

Okay, that movie is actually based but fuck you anyway.

Not him, but they are far to many to list in my case.

If anything re-playing a video game makes more sense than re-watching a movie since with a video game you always get a slightly different experience.

... Bro, fucking Halo or Call of Duty have the same levels of writing as a Marvel movie.

Yes there are video games with good writing

Capeshit isn’t art either, but at least some films are. No computer game is art.

>imagine being this much of a brainlet

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>I will never understand why people are so obsessed about wanting video games to be art so much.
I will never understand why people are so obsessed with putting video games on the same standards as a movie, they are completely different art forms that mains to accomplish different things through their representation. Saying that video games are not art because, unlike movies, they are not "direct unchangeable" or whatever bullshit they may come up with is the same as saying that movies are not art because, unlike books, they do not challenge the watcher at a mental level needing them to actually imagine the shit they are reading instead of spoonfeeding the actual action.

I'm not going to devote an extra 10+ hours to an experience that's "slightly" different. That's the same reason I only watched LOTR once.

Yes and no. There are video games with good dialog. But there are almost no video games with a good story. Mainly because the story is dependent on the players actions while the dialog is not.

>No computer game is art.
The level of delusion it takes to say that there is no artistic direction in video games. Toplel. Where do boomer plebs like you even come from, anyways?

Dunkirk origional , Bridge too far , Scarface , Godfather 2 , Casino , Dead mans shoes , Kes , Zulu , The Italian Job , 2001 Space Odessy ,The Man Who Would Be King , Alfie , Get Carter , One flew over the Cuckoos nest ,
I could go on
but a mere plebittor zoomer transfag like you might NOT know these Classics
KYS sad sack of shite

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Euhm
>Baldur's gate 2
>Paper mario the thousand year door
>i finished all halos multiple times but more because of the gameplay and atmoshpere
>any multiplayer game
There is a lot, more than in movies overall.

wow such a patrician.

... You do realize that a lot of video games have a linear story line you can't change, right? Zelda Ocarina of Time and Majora's mask are good examples of that.
>Inb4 sperging about how films have better stories than the best video games
Sure, but a good amount of video games have competent, well made stories

none of those are worth playing more than once, m8
maybe halo, but only because it's so short (comparatively)

NO Vidya will ever be like old games
Even cyberpunk/outerworlds will have hand holding linear shyte , an loot crates an pay for extra content BOLLOCKs
Only small devs will do better
Please tell me this aint true

You'll be dead before me and your arrogant ignorance will never have any impact on anyone or anything.

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Yeah Thanks
Im a based alpha stuck here in the swamp

True, but who gives a fuck if something is art or not?
These days everything is considered art, whether it's a beautiful statue someone spent 40 years meticulous carving or a bunch of close up pictures of buttholes some retarded art-school graduate took. It's a meaningless word.

Perhaps. But many would and do. Similar to how many people like spending countless hours painting or playing chess or any other "repetitive" hobby.

literally no one would claim chess is a better art form than a film

>Capeshit isn’t art either
Fuck you!
Don't get me wrong tho, I never watched any capeshit and nor do I intend to ever do but I stand by my opinion that anything a person can conceptualize and then bring into reality for the purpose of recreation for oneself or the entertainment of others should be considered art. Even the objectively terrible stuff should be considered art, bad art but still art.

And this is different from movies because?

Breath of the Wild
DayZ mods and Standalone
Arkham trilogy
Rainbow Six 3, Vegas and Vegas 2
Splinter Cell Chaos Theory
Dragonball Xenoverse 1&2
BF: Bad Company 2
Left 4 Dead 1
Killing Floor
Turok and Turok 2: Seeds of Evil
Any GTA game after and including III
Saints The Third
Deus Ex and DE: Human Revolution
The Elder Scrolls III, IV and V
Dragon's Dogma
Total Annihilation
Star Wars Dark Forces - Jedi Academy
Ark: Survival Evolved
RE Director's Cut, GC REmake and RE4
Diablo II: Lord of Destruction
Stellaris
TF2

All games I've played over 200 hours

>Why would anyone pay $20 for a linear, two-hour movie when they can enjoy a playable, two-hundred-hour experience of equal or even better quality for only $60?
Becuase eventually you turn 16 and stop playing video games.

>Doesn't play video games but spends most of his life watching TV and movies
Wow what a functional adult

>best game of all time has no voiced protagonist, no open world garbage and no forced message

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Just like God intended.

list your favorite movies, faggot

Let me put it like this, video game stories are built around the fact that player action is a thing and are paced with that in mind. Especially longer games that have a lot of "padding".

A "good story" wouldn't include the part where the hero in his dire adventure to save the land runs off to some random farm he sees in the distance and races with horses just because it seemed like for a couple of days before continuing on like nothing happened for example.

Yeah, me neither. I was talking about replaying games.

Stfu cocksucker

>playable

They aren't playable though. They're at absolute best interactive movies and I'm being loose with "interactive". They're more of a fucking annoyance.

>Wait for it to install
>Wait for it to load
>Sit through 45 minute cut scene
>Press X to continue
>Press X
>X
>Cut scene while loading
>20 minute cut scene
>"Navigate" along linear passageway to door
>60 minute cut scene
>Press F to pay respects
>F
>10 minute cut scene while loading
>30 minute cut scene
>Press X
>X
>45 minute cut scene
>Loading
>3 hours of credits

You know what it's more or less the same thing as?

>Put on movie
>20 minutes in it asks me if I'm still watching
>Yes
>45 minutes later it asks me if I'm still watching
>Yes
>Etc

Hence annoyance and why I was being loose with "interactive".

... You do realize that a lot of video games have a linear story line you can't change, right? Zelda Ocarina of Time and Majora's mask are good examples of that.

youtube.com/watch?v=Zlng4zvNsJA

what did you feel during this scene, Yea Forums?

stop playing trash games

name the actual game you're talking about

>Videoshitters think this is "art"

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How about music in games?

youtube.com/watch?v=y5CFE-Zdlfs

the body swapping scene in SOMA can never be translated to film

DOOM has better story than most modern action movies

Most people don't even call those types of games games tho and everybody except people with shit taste, filmmakers(and even then not all) and game journalists hate those types of games.
Go play a good game.

why are movie soundtracks so forgettable these days?

>music
>direct and unchangeable

You're trumpeting your ignorance right now. A single recording is direct and unchangeable but that is not the goal of music as an artform. How a written piece is performed is one of the most important aspects of

Videogames can be artistic primarily those that rely on clever level design that expresses atmosphere and mood (Dark Souls pre-Sens). But most are not.

That said you're a pseudo intellectual clod.

People are missing the point that the whole idea of video games is competing against other players. Its essentially advanced boardgaming. Thats why online multiplayer games are the most played.

No one really gives a shit about the single player and why should they. Its 50 hours of a shit paced story stocked with 40 hours of filler "puzzles" and interactive drivel

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You are using the wrong definition of art, or judging video games as if they were another medium.

Deus Ex is a very, very interactive game, yet also one of the best examples of games as art. Same goes for Yume Nikki, which has no exposition, cutscenes, hand-holding or railroading at all.

2 games ok others all hype an muh shilled to fuck

depends what movies you watch. watch movies scored by Jonny Greenwood if you like good soundtracks, he's the most interesting current composer i can think of

>the whole idea of video games is competing against other players
I guess singleplayer doesn't exist then

quality > quantity
fucking 200 hour story-games
can't stand them

this is all Console . TOP TIER POST HERE

That's not true. Plenty of RPGs have better writing than most popular books or movies

t. Someone you've probably called a try hard hipster

mass produced, corporate mandated products are by definition not art

>Deus Ex
inb4 I missed this SUBERB Classic
an Vampire Bloodlines Masquerade

he literally addressed that in the post you're replying to
why don't people just read all three sentences before replying? it's mind boggling...

>Video games will never be truly art on the same level because of the interactive part specifically.
>Interaction diminishes the artistic value immensely
But increases value in many other was. Games are unironically more important than art in many ways.
That said, if we're talking about expression and stories, movies are still superior to most games, a although better comparison to a lot of the story content in games is a TV series. An RPG with 20 hours of cutscenes is probably more like a season of a show than a 150 minute movie.

They've always been mostly forgettable. It's by design, actually. If you want very noticeable soundtrack music, anime is where it's at.

Videogames haven't been good since Final Fantasy IX

Important aspects of music as an art*

>These days everything is considered art

It isn't though

>a beautiful statue someone spent 40 years meticulous carving

This is art.

>a bunch of close up pictures of buttholes some retarded (((art-school))) graduate took

This is (((art))).

It's easy to differentiate between the two because one takes skill and the other doesn't.
It isn't that it's a meaningless word, but more it's a (((corrupted))) word. Once the word has been (((corrupted))) then the goys don't know what's what, but thankfully (((you))) are on hand to give them the (((new))) (((definition))).
Sure, you could say "well it's only (((redefining))) art, it's not like something relevant is being (((redefined)))" and I might agree with you, although it depends on how strongly you feel about art. But with that in mind, just imagine what kind of (((chaos))) you could cause if you (((redefined))) something that was relevant and had much wider ramifications. I don't know what like, but imagine if there were more than two genders. Imagine if you (((redefined))) what gender means wouldn't that be crazy? Just think, you could redefine it to the point where gender doesn't exist at all or to the point where there are an infinite amount. Is there a (((television scientist))) anywhere who can give us a straight answer haha!
You see, just because you're changing the definition of something that's perhaps subjective, that doesn't mean it doesn't have wider implications that make a difference to the objective. It's why a 40 year meticulously carved beautiful statue and close up pictures of buttholes have the same (((merit))) now. Or why little boys are chopping their dicks off, and why it makes you a bigot if you DISAGREE with that. How do you reach such a retarded degree? Easy, by (((redefining))) the subjective and letting room temperature IQ people run amok with them because they by proxy destroy the objective (to (((your))) benefit, but that's pure coincidence).

If not, then prove me wrong.

here's the thing, though
plenty of kids can watch a movie from the 70s, 60s, or even earlier and enjoy it without having to say "it was good for the time." the same thing simply isn't true about video games. even games like Deus Ex have such horrible mechanics compared to modern games they're unplayable by all except nostalgiafags who played them new

Final Fantasy IX is one of the worst games there is in terms of ruining gameplay for the sake of a mediocre story.

Just because it's linear doesn't make it good user.
OoT has a lot of weird shit that only makes sense if you are playing it, but written down as it's own story would just be stupid. And that goes for most games.

>Then Link reached the end of the forest, but there on a tree sat and owl, he spoke to the young would-be Hero.
>"Hoo Hoot!" went the owl, turning it's head.
>Link stood on watching, as the owl started teaching him how to press the START button and find the map subscreen.
>"Did you get all that?" the Owls finally said. To which Link accidentally replied "No".
>The Owl then began to repeat his wisdom to the green clad warrior. Once again it reached the end of it's lecture and gave the query, "Did you get all that?", and yet again young Link accidentally responded with "No". And so the dance went on, and the sun fell in the skies and the starts glistened above, only it didn't because time also stopped while the owl was talking for some un-explainable reason.

This.
And 95% of gamers don't finish games like The Witcher 3 or Red Dead Redemption 2.
They do a little bit of story, a few side quests, wander around for 50 hours, then quit.

People have been playing singleplayer for decades, and singleplayer games still pull in big sales numbers and lots of attention. Like RDR2 and the Souls series.

?reddittards falling for this shitty bait

The amount of (((echoes))) in your post makes me think you are a 32nd level schizo.

No because video games are cringe bluepilled fake gay low-test s o y faggotry, and films are only sometimes those things.

>Final Fantasy IX is one of the worst games there is in terms of ruining gameplay for the sake of a mediocre story.
FFIX is certainly not the best jRPG, but it's a fine game. Yes the story is mediocre (I would say good at best), and the gameplay is slow. But I would take it over the 30 minute unskippable cutscene fests that came after it.
Actually, replace FFIX with Suikoden 2 from my original post.

This. Even RPGs should top out at 30 hours to see all the content max, and have extra hours of playtime come from replayability.

No. They are playable by anyone who has some taste, just like old movies are watchable by anyone who has taste.
An 11 year old kid who loves Marvel won't appreciate Doctor Zhivago just as an 11 year old kid who loves Fortnite won't be appreciate Deus Ex mechanics.

Name ONE (1) film more kino than Bloodborne

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No. They're not fun. They're annoying, unintuitive, and frustrating. I loved Deus Ex and Morrowind when they came out, but don't ask me to start either today.

youtube.com/watch?v=C8kZ3HfeqtA

can't play old games because they aged badly
can't play new games beacuse they became industrial mono-products, barely-interactive movies with scanfaces and bad design
fuck...

In the Mouth of Madness

Well you see that's because you have shitty taste user and prefer brain dead entertainment where you don't have to think.

welcome to adulthood

I re-played Deus Ex after not having played it in a long time and I had no problems in particular.

haha what bullshit
anyone watching random movies from the 60s and 70s are going to find that shit dated as hell. Of course if you only look at the timeless masterpieces, they'll be great. But that is 100% absolutely true for videogames as well.

The original Legend of Zelda is an absolutely phenomenal game. Zoomer tastes might be warped. They might have to get over some learned helplessness and get over the fact that they won't be impressed by sheer spectacle. But the reward is a fantastic, challenging game with a design stands the test of time.

Timeless games have timeless qualities. The NES Zelda game has expertly designed content. The sprite art is excellent. Despite the limitations of 8-bit low-resolution graphics, the artists for TLOZ generated numerous iconic and memorable images. The balance of openness and freedom and progression is something few games even today even come close to matching.

And no, I'm not saying it was just "good for its time." It's good, period, although it was designed with the technological constraints of the era.

Hourglass Sanatorium

It unironically inspired the makers of Bloodborne

no, I like entertainment that makes me think
what I don't like is "entertainment" that plays guessing games where the on button is

Name one. And when you do we'll tear it apart.

>he likes to work as an entertainment

Video games suffer from pacing issues due to the fact that the user has to interact. The world is ending in 24 hours? That's okay, go ahead and take on as many side missions as you want.

Video games do offer something better than books or cinema through world building and immersion. You can put a bunch of background shit in a game that adds to it, whereas books and cinema are limited to how much information they can give you at a time.

people are saying videogames are not art for the wrong reasons. the biggest problem with gaming today is the committee situation that has evolved within every gaming company. the games are made to make money, so every level of the company and the production are thinking of ways to maximize sales. at least with movies you usually have 1-2 people writing, one director. in most modern games there is a committee involved at every step of the production that waters down the game until it is boring, safe trash that will make millions of dollars.

So none of them?
Or are you saying you are to retarded to figure out basic control methods and mechanics?

not him
I'm just leaving this bait

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Movies are shit next to games
Games you do the adventure, movies you just stare and always the same shit

Japanese games still seem to have some guy at the helm who decides what's what, so people know for example that the Souls series is Hidetaka Miyazaki's series, and they know who Shinji Mikami is and what kind of games you can expect from him.

It's actually the same situation in animation. Done by committee in America, done by directors in Japan.

you can say similar about movies
plenty of indie games don't have the problem you describe
but the real problem with this whole "can video games be art" debate is the frame of "art" being something undeniably superior to whatever games are.

But I disagree. I think that art and games both serve different roles and while games can include art, we don't need to worry about whether they "are" art to value them. Art is primarily about expression, games are more about modeling some aspect of life. Both are valuable, neither is inherently superior to the other.

Games should stop trying to achieve being considered "art" and should just strive to be the best games they can be.

The Witcher 2 has better writing than any marvel movie. It has better characters, character interactions, overarching plot, logical and value based decisions made by all characters, MC included. It's one of the better examples of video game writing this decade. Saying that even the worst movie is better than the best game in terms of writing is outlandishly retarded

Holy shit you have too much spare time on your hands.

Absolutely based taste.

Memo to open world game designers: Including an overly complicated crafting system that forces the player to pick leaves and berries from bushes and plants has never once made a game more enjoyable.

Based as FUCK. Especially for Jedi knight.

I'm saying I'd rather be challenged by tasks that further the story and not ones that are in the game because the developers didn't know what they were doing.

100% true

I think it depends on the game, but the crafting feature is put into most games because they need to tick that checkbox on the feature list. Same with collectibles and skill trees. Gotta put them in there, it's an AAA game after all.

youtube.com/watch?v=jPqwDGXxLhU

Personally I'd rather be challenged by tasks that are fun to do and provide some satisfaction for completing them rather than just being there as a hindrance to watch more cinematics. Being more of a glorified commercial break than actual entertainment because they are so bland and simplistic.

I'm actually baffled that you're the first to bring this up as an example of game as art. It's a thoughtful, profound exploration in a deep and complex world. It compares to classic literature in its depth and scope.

the japs are the only ones producing good games in the current year so it's no wonder

I was a pretty satisfied adullt gamer until 2010 or so, tho

marvel movies (capeshit in general) are not-interative videogames written by other videogame characters (probably the left bar from pong)

This kind of shit isn't an argument. And saying "adults who play games are losers" isn't either, unless you define loser, and you can't just say "people who play games as adults".
I know plenty of adults who play games and also have successful relationships with women, their parents, long lasting deep friendships, a job, secure finances, and are generally happy and healthy. It's fine to believe video games aren't art, and a person is entitled to his own opinion, but if you can't explain why you hold an opinion then you just look ignorant and stubborn.

MODs .....
END HIm NOW !!!

Great Games are That ok !

audience killed cinema because they can't stop paying for bad products
same for games

Interaction is the art. Plebs I swear.

>unless you define loser
An adult male sitting down with a plastic controller in his hands, watching numbers and colors splash on the screen. Some people actually consider it a skill too lmao

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But we're comparing it to the worst Marvel film though. And I'd say it's better than that at least. Certainly better writing and acting than anything DCEU

I am an oldfag, though.

Sea Dogs,
Baldur's Gate
Dayz (Arma 2 version, not standalone)
Arma 3
Heroes 3
Sudden Strike
Freelancer
Dwarf Fortress

Haven't play them myself, but I heard that Space Rangers and XCOM are awesome as well.

>A video game can contain great art, much like a museum can contain beautiful paintings or a library fantastic works of literature, but neither the museum or a library are arts in of themselves as much as the pieces they are presenting
This is what you said, and it's wrong. The Louvre, the Ca d'Oro, the Clementinium, these are beautiful pieces of art, every bit as impressive, spectacular and heart wrenching as any piece of art the resides in their walls.

There are those who spends $20 for popcorn and sit next to idiots or are said idiot who scream like animals at every little thing.
Fucking incels man

Did you read the rest of my post where I reminded you that circular logic doesn't work and just makes you look like a jizz-eating retard? Oh I guess you can't concentrate on one thing for that long unless it's been pounded into your throat you fucking faggot.

It killed cinema, not by discouraging people to see movies, but by encouraging movies to become more like video games, with endless technicolor CGI spectacle sequences and empty, easily digestible characters and dialogue

Describing an adult male partaking in a pathetic exercise designed for children isn't circular logic, seething gaymer. It's your reality.

Monster Hunter World

There is skill involved.

It's really weird that even in 2019 there are still non-boomers who have no idea what video games are.

lol dude. every art is BOUND BY THE MEDIUM IN WHICH IT IS CREATED. i can play a video game without sound, too.

cringe

Yea Forums unequivocally BTFO

>There is skill involved
Lmao

There is. It's just a fact, and facts don't care about your feelings.

No, it's circular logic. You said that people stop playing games at 16, implying that if you don't there's something wrong with you. Loser is the word I assigned to that inference, and I described people who are generally successful and also play games as adults, and asked you how you define a loser. I specifically explained that you would need to define it as more than "somebody who plays games as an adult" because that's circular logic (eg only loser play games as adults and if you play games as adults you're a loser). If you can't understand that, you're too stupid to deal with. If you can and just choose not to because "lol this guy is getting so butthurt on Yea Forums haha I'm just gonna keep pushing his buttons" then you're just a fucking loser (which I define as somebody who has nothing productive or interesting in his life to enjoy, so he has to get his kicks from pretending to be retarded online).

This is true art, incels can never understand its breath taking beauty and meaning.

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Quads of truth, undeniable

I played Resident evil 7 in VR, it gave me the pukes, I had to take off the headset and continue like a normal game

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why the fuck do americans pay 20 dollars for movies?
in europooristan I pay 3.5€ for the ticket and sneak in my own snacks

Last time I went to the moving pictures it was something like €15 for the ticket.

>For entertainment and action: videogames
>For story and interesting characters: series
In both of those you get more for your money
Cinema fits a awkward and small place between those two

that must be europooreststand, here in Spain I'd have to pay around 10€

Rdr 1-2 is one of the most kino stories easily

Second Life did for me.

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Rdr 1-2 story is better that every oscar movie since the 2000s easily

Action movies and action games are both entertaining in their own ways. A TV series is at least in theory better for story-telling because there's more runtime, but the production quality is inferior and it can't put as much care into everything like a movie can.

is there any rp in second life at all?
I logged like twice, years ago, and people were literally talking as themselves, most were boomers too

Bro how old are you?

>A man lit three candles on a certain day each year. Each candle held symbolic significance: one was for the time that had passed before he was alive; one was for the time of the his life; and one was for time that passed after he had died. Each year the man would stare and watch the candles until they had burned out.

Yes, tons of it. But due to trolls and griefers you may have to join groups. There are plenty of RP sims that allow newcomers as long as you respect their rules. Just depends what you want. Sounds like you went to the Hubs. Where you see this sorta shit:
youtube.com/watch?v=RB3hAZMp0MU

There's a /vg/ group also just be ready for a lot of them to try and get you to erp because it overlaps with the /d/ group.

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>best game of all time has no voiced protagonist, no open world garbage and no forced message
damn straight, Tetris is a masterpiece

I wish movies stuck with practicals and games with cg and ontop of that no halfmeasures inbetween so matte painting for the screen and no motion capturing and such in games.

Cyberpunk 2077 will shut you haters up

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Chapter rankings
6 > 3 > epilogue > 2 > 4 > 1 >>> 5

Absolute pseud opinions
Cringe

The debate over whether videogames can be art is ridiculous.

It seems intuitive to me that a videogame that makes use of its medium to deliver an impactul experience which only that particular, interactive medium can deliver, an experience that actually leaves you thinking about it afterwards... that is is surely art, like for example Journey, or Near Automata, which blindsides you with the realisation you've been unknowingly interacting with other people through the game, and they've been offering a meaningful contribution to your playthrough. That's some good shit, , and I reckon it probably doesn't need to be that high-concept to be art either, just that if there's a debate about where the threshold is for art, those sorts of games are surely above it.