Why are "Good to Evil" arcs always shitty and poorly executed?

I ship them

>what would i need to say or what would need to happen to you in order for you to do a 180 and shift the completely opposite direction?
13% of the population...

>waste of fucking quads

If you're gonna bitch about the books, go to Yea Forums. This is a based Yea Forums show board and we collectively LOVED THE EPISODE

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George Lucas hung around the set for the last season.
Maybe his decaying talent rubbed off on them.

Checked. She was never good though

Because jumping off a cliff is never really anyone's objective in life

Who the fuck is talking about the books here, you sperg?

1. This bitch was never good to begin with.

2. Vader was right about the Jedi. The problem was Sheev and only Sheev.

It lacks realistic motivation. It's always "someone close to me died and I like genocide now" or some other dumb shit.

Writers need to study history and politics to write something more convincing. A good example of such arc playing out irl would be people like Robespierre, who start with great intentions but grow violent because that's what implementing their ideals in a chaotic situation not immediately suited for them requires, and with time these actions clearly have an impact on their psyche and makes them paranoid, thus more violent, creating a pattern.

People who do evil, unless they're completely psychotic (in which case they'd never have been 'good' in the first place), need something to convince themselves that they're doing good-by-whatever-means-necessary. Religion, tribalism, politics, something.

>Dany
>Evil for killing smelly peasants

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Breaking Bad tho

>Writers need to study history and politics to write something more convincing.
Agreed. Instead all they seem to study is other shitty movies and TV shows, creating an endless cycle of crap.

could you imagine if they had put stingers or anti air in the middle of dense civilian areas and Dany had to make the decision to raze everything to save her dragon?

Are the writers even capable of writing something simple like this?

Fuck off and stop thinking your popcorn television show is any good

This implies Danny was ,good, and normal. She is not, she has dragon ego. She thinks she is good,why? Cause I have dragons bitch, fuck cersei fuck the red keep they belong to me, they symbolize those who stole my throne.

thats kind of a stupid take. If you are in America you are subject to teamsports politics, because the other side literally hates you and enacts policies against your interests. So you stick to whoever is even a percentage point closer to what you want.

>good to evil
u wot

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they were playing with the whole feminist hero angle the last 2 seasons so even though all of her actions were hypocritical and egotistical. Now when her hypocrisy is exposed there is quite a bit of whiplash.

I can spot a bookfag when I see one.

Because focusing in-depth on a character makes people sympathise with that character, so they overlook the gradual procession to evil that would be clear to someone who isn't so emotionally attached, all the way until the moment the character does something even they can't ignore. To preserve their ego and not admit that they're easily manipulated dumbasses the people then say "wow, what a terrible and abrupt transition from good to evil".

It's why women stick around in abusive relationships, initially they're too emotional to notice all the warning signs, and by the time they're being beaten up they're so invested in the relationship they excuse it.

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she was always hypocritical, plebs just ignored it because of aforementioned feminism

That would make Dany the good guy. She never was. From the time she sat back and watched her brother mutilated to stringing men up on poles to burning a man to death for daring to honor a deal to abandoning her followers on at least two occasions to burning men for being loyal to their word to turning on the very people she brought in to advise her to outright killing them too.

Dany wasn't mad until recently but she was a stupid, brutal conqueror that never cared for anyone that followed her. As seen by how few are left. She got the entirety of the Dothraki, Unsullied, Second Sons, and the slaves of Mereen butchered by her actions and hasn't so much as stated regret much less shed a tear or erected a shrine or anything that would show this love she supposedly has.

>executing some very specific people for sensible reasons
>holocausting a tens of thousands because you don't like bells
same thing really

more like the straw man of what good or evil is

You haven't been paying attention

its a nepotistic and incestous jewish cult in hollywood.

The problem with Anakin's fall was like 75% terrible wooden acting. Redo it with a director that can make the actors shine, sets that aren't 110% CGI, and polish up some of the dialogue and it's perfectly fine.

The problem with Dany's fall is that it was super rushed AND it doesn't really have a good justification. Sure, she has a history of burning people alive, but Jon and Tyrion and Varys all thought she was sunshine and roses until exactly one episode ago. Dany's fall also suffers from occurring in episodes that are also garbage in almost all other respects. The absurd inconsistencies, the plotlines that went nowhere or were dropped wholesale, the complete evisceration of almost every major character, etc.

because asinine rats are too busy trying to shock the viewer with their forced nonsensical edge instead of telling a remotely realistic and enjoyable story

Real life people don’t act that way. Real life people have been in control of weapons more dangerous than dragons, too. She’s just nebulously “crazy”, in the way people are “crazy” in fiction.

In theory, the decision to destroy King’s Landing is a sound military decision. Horrifying, yes, but something done countless times before in war (e.g firebombing of Dresden). Those generals weren’t “crazy”, and that’s potentially interesting drama to explore on television, how a person could justify that. But it really does look like the writers are going with “Targ madness”, so that’s boring as shit.

calm down.

Only a sith deals in absolutes.

What are some other exceptions to this rule?

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it was done pretty nice in GoT though. She was always mad, they have dropped hints for entire seasons. You are just mad your favorite character is the bad guy

Even if burning the city was a sensible choice, it made zero sense to do so while your own army is inside the city.

The Northern soldiers randomly getting bloodlusted and slaughtering innocents was also just ridiculous. Is Targ madness contagious now?

Congrats, you are smarter than like 95% of people watching

Burning the Masters was a clear sign of her madness. Can't compare the night watch Jon killing Dessidents to Dany killing the masters.

>ahem

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>Burning the people who crucified children as a warning was a clear sign she was mad

lol.

She didn't have trials to ascertain the actual criminals but burned EVERYONE.

Arthas through TFT was pretty good, and even into WotLK is alright.

Illidan Stormrage also had a pretty decent run up until they took him to retcon city and turned him into elf Jesus for Legion.

Arthas was good up to TFT because he literally did nothing wrong before taking Frostmourne and being corrupted by it. Culling Stratholme was the only logical choice. It just made Jaina and Uther come off like complete retards and results in everything being their fault.

WotLK Arthas is complete shit though. Anything past TFT in regards to Arthas is dogshit.

The point is she feels justified whenever she commits atrocities(that's how most atrocities happen IRL)

not always

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burning people alive is a clear sign of madness. She has also been shouting ''with fire and blood i shall take what is mine'' for 8 seasons.

user, Dany crucified those Mereenise noblemen just because the slaves were crucified
there even one's son who kept telling her to put his father down because he wanted to stop the slaves crucifixion

She was always kind of psycho, do you remember how she freed the unsullied? Crucified the masters? Freed those other slaves? They literally always played evil music whenever she did something important. She was never "good"

Where are the Burlington bar reactions?

>implying dany had an arc
She was always insane, she just accumulated more power.

Sauron did nothing wrong!

This.

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haha nigga he aint evil da fuk?

He's a bit freedom crazy just like Dany.

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he killed innocent civilians even children, poisoned his own military, has the power to destroy the world and he might actually do it he's pretty evil compared to the rest of the character

characters*

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Arthas in wc3 is one of the best case i can think of.
The cinematic where he kills his father blew my mind at the time.
Too bad WoW ruined him.

So hes typical power triping self insert chinkcel character like in 99% of manga? Good thing I never started reading this shit.

>Robespierre
>good intentions
kek

Because it would be politically incorrect. Lets take the exemple of Anakin. Instead of a stupid whiny teenager romance, we would have a story about how an extraordinary jedi, propulsed thanks to his gifts in charge of a civil war, would have been little by little consumed by this. How to deal with deserters? Sacrifice a few to save many? Torture in order to get crucial intel? So many bitter choices. And when you commit so much for something that is in fact a lie, the republic, whose weakness is responsable of all that mess, you could get why Anakin would fall for the dark side and serve the Empire of palpatine.

But well, we got a teenager of damned himself for boobs.

The problem is they present a black and white ideology and show someone going from genuinely believing in white to genuinely believing in black and that's just inherently unrealistic. When good people go bad it's almost always a slippery slope that they usually have no control over, they aren't deciding, "I once believed this was right, now I believe this is right instead," they're just trying their level-best to keep themselves from sinking, either getting caught or getting killed. The most popular example would be Macbeth, but my favourite is DCI Ian Reed in Luther. He makes some mistakes but can't face up to them, and in trying to fix everything he loses control of the situation and feels he has no recourse left but to roll with it until the end. It also works when the 'good' guy was actually 'bad' the entire time and their journey is just figuring out who they truly are or revealing themselves for who they truly are, like Walter White or Ozymandias.

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They are literally the best pieces of cinema when done correctly.

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Best portrayal of a villain I know is Frank in Once Upon a Time in the West. He's a villain who doesn't know he's a villain.

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Was danny ever good? She literally only freed slaves and the unsullied so they could serve her.

what are you talking about? 90% of manga protagonists never even kill villains let alone kill innocent civilians and children, he's a pretty unique protagonist.

FROM MY POINT OF VIEW IT'S THE LEGION PEASANTS OF GIN ALLEY THAT ARE EVIL!

This. They were all drunkards and whores

>fuck you Lucas why wasn’t Anakin born with Vader’s helmet and cape on him already. I wanted a badass Sith Lord killing everyone on the left and right.

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he didnt kill anyone. he freed them from the material plane

No no but you see the prequels were meant to be a homage to 1930s matinee romance movies for some reason

I like his continual descent into madness in Human campaign, from "I want to save everyone" to "I need to kill those people to save them" to "stop questioning me, I really just want this asshole dead and to hell with everything else" tupe of reasoning. It was quite well done.
I just never understood why he joined the bad guys he was fighting all this time in the end. Yes, I get it - magic evil sword, but it was kinda weak from motivational perspective.

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You missed my point. I m not interested in an edgy Anakin. What I say is, war is horrible. Show how it twist a good person with excellent intentions into something harsh. Show consequences and how such a charecter would react.
Exactly just like this user says

Chris Metzen had a hardon for corruption. Motivation not required. See Kerrigan in Starcraft.

Revenge of the sith was good

>be a slave until you're 9
>be separated from your mother and indoctrinated by emotionless, celibate monks
>jedi treat you like shit because you're different (joined too late) and masters don't trust you (as seen in episode 1 where they judge him like a piece of meat)
>be told to suppress all your emotions
>be groomed by the greatest manipulator in the galaxy, and he's your only non-jedi friend and the only one that's not stupidly hard on you all the time for your humanly mistakes
>be given a god complex because you're told you're literally the chosen one and soon to be most powerful person of all time
>have nightmares about your mother suffering and dying, but be told by jedi to ignore it
>finally get the chance to see your mom
>she was tortured and raped and dies in your arms
>have to fight on the front lines of a galactic war for 3 years
>have premonitions about your wife dying the same way the ones about your mom came true
>freak out
>jedi still don't trust you, ask you to spy on your best non-jedi friend
>put you on council but don't promote you to master, even though you're top 5 strongest jedi in the galaxy, making you seem like a joke
>still turn in sith lord who promised to save your wife because of your loyalty to the jedi
>jedi don't trust you again and don't take you to arrest the most powerful villain in the galaxy
>go to help anyway and see jedi, who was a dick to you your whole life, about to break his own rules and murder a prisoner, fucking hypocrites
>see last chance to save your beloved wife, freak out in a split second decision and cut douchebag jedi's hand off
>now feel like you've fucked up so hard you have no choice but join the dark side, hey at least you can save your wife
He had gotten plenty of motivation in my opinion.

Dany isn't evil. She is just another conquerer.

Maybe the writers don't know what it's like to have conviction. The knowledge that going down a darker path is a "High Risk, High Reward" system. That if you do go down a darker path you aren't coming back and that thought haunts you everyday. You might have to burn whatever bridge people tried to extend to you to get what you feel is necessary.
Imagine thinking like this every day, of every month, of every year and given no choices that lead to peace of mind.

Almost no one in the industry knows about this, thus writing it is hard.

Yeah. The characters Anakin has plenty motivations. But the prelogie fails to display those, wich is why his fall seems so artificial and focused on a dumb romance.

It doesn't matter that Anakin has hundred of reasons to become evil, if the movies do a terrible job in showing the process, it will be stupid.

>S1
>burns witch alive because her husband and child die for her participation in blood magic

>S2
>murders Pree for stealing her dragons and trying to arrange a marriage in Qarth

>S3
>buys slaves, uses slaves to murder the people that she bought them from

>S4
>executes the 100+ former masters of Mereen by nailing them to posts

>S5
>ignores the culture of Mereen, puts down revolt by feeding nobles to her dragons

>S6
>captured by Dothraki, burns them alive when they refuse to join her

>S7
>invades Westeros, executes anyone that doesn't follow her

>S8
>burns a city to the ground after it surrenders
B-B-B-BUT IT'S NOT IN CHARACTER

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It’s there, just some people don’t like to look into the details.

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Fuck off, retard.

the way theyve been doing it all along was a bluff, presenting her as a heroic saviour character that is really filled with hatred and just needs a little push. also targaryen genetics

It doesn't matter if the movie does a bad job portraying that. Just like the empire 2.0 in the "force awaken". Yeah there is a book and other sources that explain why there is still those guys around, it s still sounds retarded when you jump from 6 > 7.

Anakin snap looks dumb for the same reason, the movie doesn't show that process.You can throw thousands of reason behind the character, it will still look silly when you look the movie.

Matt Stover's RotS novelization does a pretty great job at showcasing Anakin's motivations and explaining why he became Darth Vader - his continual frustration and resentment of Jedi Order and his admiration for Palpatine. Somehow the novelization managed to make sense out of all those stupid plot points in the movie.
Is it a sign of bad taste, if I like the RotS novelization way more than the movie?

If they pull this off it will actually be a masterpiece