There's no way the main protagonist can die like this

Ned die because of his actions.

He stick to his Honor Code and did what he think was right.

- Meeting with the Queen first so she can "run away" and save her kids.
- Staying loyal to the law of succession and by that refusing Robert's little brother offer of him becoming king instead of his older brother Stannis
- The continuation of investigation to save his friend the king of the mischiefs and cheating of the queen.

Meanwhile the Night King didn't had any of those.

He was supposed to win since Winterfell defence was garbage. He didn't even expose himself much, he was surrounded by their other white walkers and whights to give him protection while killing bran, and just because the writters wanted the fuckin girl appeared flying and killing him.

Is enough explained?

Season 1 vs season 8

It genuinely interesting to subvert expectations at the beginning of a story but doing it after 10 years of buildup just leaves you unsatisfied

Ned's death progressed the story in a meaningful way, made sense both from the characters and viewers perspective and it didn't shit on any previously established lore, plot points or character arcs. It was also executed extremely well compared to whatever the shit that nothing personnel kid sequence was.

yeah like approaching a cripple while being surrounded by the undead and have the entrance blocked by other white walkers

>dude the ending didn’t suck because remember that time Ned died?
You’re a fag

the whole episode was setting it up to end in a dire manner only to end with a huge asspull.

He was surrounded by all his allies and zombies. There is no way to predict that a mary sue ninja would "sneak" at the speed of light. And even taht he could defend but WHOOOPS she throws the dagger and now she kills her.

pic related

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It feels like GRRM didn't really have anything planned for after Ned's death and just winged everything.

The issue isn't that the NK's death was a surprise, it was that it was nonsensical and was done by a character who played no part in the NK plot until that point. Imagine if the death of Ned went like this.
>Ned is brought up to the Sept of Baelor for his sentance.
>Cersei urges Joffrey to send Ned to the Wall.
>Joffrey agrees, declares that Ned will be sent to the Wall.
>Suddenly, Robyn Arryn somersaults down from Baelor's statue and beheads Ned.

>Ned's death
Is the culmination of all the important events of the season and his 10000x folded fantasy honour meeting medieval reality which basically flipped the genre on its head for normies.
(and in the greater context of the story we later find out pretty much everything could have been avoided if he took the throne which again he only turned down because of 'muh honour muh norf').

>NKs death
last second YAS QWEEN asspull by hacks killing off a force built up since episode one in a single episode.

If you need to get this explained better go back to watch one piece.

Ned Stark still has more screen time than most characters and he was only in Season 1. His death was gradual too. He was attacked, Robert was killed, he was imprisoned, he was executed. It didn't just happen suddenly.

The Night King finally got his moment and it was all over instantly. Killing him that quickly would be like if Ned Stark slipped on a rock and fell on his sword in Episode 1.

Damn

Ned's death influenced all the plotlines in an interesting way

based

cringe

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>asspull
Bran gave her the dagger and chose to sit there
Arya's whole story is about killing and being a stealthy assassin
Arya's dagger move was shown when she fought with Brienne

jesus this really puts into perspective how terrible this scene was.
I haven't read the books but the show was good until it started outpacing the books.
>Suddenly, Robyn Arryn somersaults down from Baelor's statue and beheads Ned.
kek, this really isn't even more absurd as what we just saw.

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>which basically flipped the genre on its head for normies.
>nobody killed main characters before
GoT fags are insane. They're watching the same network that aired The Sopranos and they still come out with shit like this.

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Oh for fuck sakes

Ned's death was the logical result of his decisions and the situation. Ned tried to dethrone a psychotic boy king, but got caught. The psychotic boy king executes him which is both a) a reasonably foreseeable outcome and b) furthers the main plot.

Keep in mind that the main plot, since the opening scene, was that the white walkers are coming, but Westeros's civil war is causing too much death and division to effectively combat the main threat. People are too focused on playing the game of thrones, seeking personal power at the cost of the small folk and the realm at large. Ned's death was an important part of that plot since it made peace between the Starks and Lannisters virtually impossible. The War of the Five kings happens, and severely weakens the realm.

Arya killing the Night King and leaving Cersei as the series final boss is NOT a logical result of anything, nor is it good storytelling. Arya's big target, if anyone, is Cersei herself. Arya's been praying to Death itself to smoke that bitch, and has been training herself as an assassin to personally do the deed. She didn't even know about the Night King until she got to Winterfell, like a few weeks before the Battle.

Jon Snow, on the other hand, has been positioned against NK since season 1, ever since he encountered his first zombie. Jon has taken the threat seriously and dedicated his life to eradicating it. The lengths that he's gone through to protect the North from the WWs is staggering. Denying Jon a final fight against NK wastes his entire character arc. Yes, he's heir to the throne, BUT HE DOESN'T WANT THE FUCKING THRONE.

Also, now that NK is dead and we've got 3 episodes left, the overarching moral of the story has just been obliterated. We spent 8 seasons watching what happens when people fail to unite against a common threat, but apparently they've learned goddamn nothing because they're all going right back into the same civil war. The apocalypse is apparently just a side quest.

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The asspull isn't the dagger drop, its running from the keep to the tree past an army of the undead without creating a distraction for free.

Its still irredeemably shit writing to the core but they could have at-least had someone help, hell even have theon see her in a tree before the sucicide charge to distract him.

Stark’s death is an early trigger for storylines and plot to ramp up and change direction. It was inevitable given his mistakes, but it was foreseeable. Led to a lot of good things. And people who didn’t realize he was going to die were the same way excited as Psycho. Grabs people’s attention, tells them it’s no fairytale late night television, and throws them back in.

Big Bad on the other hand was set up since fucking ever. But not his death. And whereas Stark’s death leading to more plot lines, the death of the big bad doesn’t open up any, leaving an inept villain of the week sort of feel instead of a genuine threat. And this wouldn’t be good for a Saturday morning cartoon, and it definitely fails here.

Basically it leaves the feel of “Is this what we’re all afraid of? A bedsheet!” Sort of deal, or “Darkseid tripping on a banana peel. I guess we won?” The antagonist shouldn’t be unkillable or unbeatable, that sucks. But he shouldn’t go out like a pussy either because on the opposite spectrum, it makes the heroes look bad for considering him such a great threat in the first place. “Oh great, you defeated a glass cannon, how hard that must’ve been.”

I personally blame nu writers, as they can’t write a good villain. Somewhere we forgot how to write compelling villains and started putting “plot device villains” who do nothing but spout some sort of non-sequitur about their undervalued philosophy, to be defeated and never be heard from again in order to advance x character without being a legitimate obstacle or adversary.

Great. None of that shit has anything to do with the NK storyline. Also, quick question user, how did Arya become a stealthy assassin god anyway?

No, Ned died for plot convenience. His plan was much, much better than Cersei's. King Robert used to hunt drunk for several years and nothing happened. So, in the day Cersei would be fucked if Rob came back alive the destiny made the boar hit him in a way he was severely injured AND neither Renly or Barristan could help him. The odds were astronomical.

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>Sapranos is the same genre as GoT
Ok.
In any case I was talking about fantasy, before got basically the only fantasy property ever that got serious mainstream attention was LotR.

This is startlingly accurate jesus fuck

>when did Arya learn all these skills entire seasons were based on?
Why are you watching the eighth season of a show you clearly haven't watched in its entirety?

>Arya's whole story is about killing and being a stealthy assassin
How is this a foreshadowing? She wasn't even using her stealth powers. The Mountain's whole story is about being a mindless killing machine too, why didn't he kill the NK?
As for the other:
>hey let's put some random foreshadowing in a couple of scenes and shit on Jon's entire character arc and all the prophecies and themes that started this whole story in the first place

Mopping floors and selling clams. Honestly if it's so easy to create a super assassin and the super assassins are strong enough to kill legendary monsters, it's a wonder that at no point in history they never tried just ruling the entire world from the shadows.

>Ned dying
Good subversion
>NK dying
Bad subversion

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>The apocalypse is apparently just a side quest

Fuck me that's painfully accurate. The whole cop-out with everything dying if the Night King dies really fucks the whole thing too.

Like *poof* that's it, they are all gone and its never going to be an issue ever again. Basically as if there never even was an army of the dead or White Walkers to begin with.

tfw the Maesters at the Citadel still won't believe any of it because there's literally no proof and there wasn't even any sort of widespread effect from the dead.

Bravo!

>in any case I was talking about this show where people literally come back to life
Such shattering"consequences". You're watching kiddy shit with blood and tits. It's neckbeard anime, dude.

fuck women fuck niggers and fuck jannies

I did watch it in its entirety. Arya was never trained to pull off the level of shit she does in the show now.
This guy gets my point. A shame you couldn't figure it out.

The first expectation is created by lazy, shitty writing. It's normal in stories for the main characters to have so much plot armor that nothing bad every really permanently befalls them. So when GOT subverted this expectation, they avoided a shitty trope, which is a good thing.
The latter expectation was created by the good, realistic writing of the book/show. People expect Game of Thrones to be "realistic" and like it for being "realistic," so when it subverts its own expectations, yes, that's a bad thing.
You need to get it out of your head that "subverting expectations" is always a good thing. If people are expecting something good and you give them something bad, it's a bad subversion of expectations.

Only people with sub 80 IQ thought that ned or the NK dying would be a subversion, the big baddie dying is the most obvious fantasy trope ever, the way they did it was absolutely retarded and insulting the intelligence of anyone that isn't in kindergarden.

This

I'm sorry I don't really follow your shit post.
Do you honestly believe most people has been exposed to a large amount of sword and sorcery fantasy other then LotR before Got?

>Arya was never trained to pull off the level of shit she does in the show now.
Lmao, what did she do that was so impressive? Why do you keep watching something that clearly isn't for you?

Agreed, the Great War should have been more than a single, one-night battle.

Maybe the Living should have lost the Battle of Winterfell. The survivors should have been forced to flee south, and get caught between Cersei and NK, and forced to make some hard decisions about what to do. Maybe Cersei offers an alliance if Dany bends the knee, forcing Dany to choose between herself and her own people (answering the question Sam asked Jon in 8x01). Maybe Cersei offers leniency if the survivors hand over Dany and Tyrion and the dragons, or some other important characters. It would have kept NK as the main bad guy while underscoring the series' central theme of "division = bad against collective action problems"

When she went to go train with the stealthy assassins in Braavos. It was like season 5 or 6.

Read this article, it sums it up better than I can. theconcourse.deadspin.com/cersei-lannister-is-smarter-than-all-these-morons-1834386681

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You, good sir, have my upboat!

>its running from the keep to the tree past an army of the undead without creating a distraction for free.
We see wind blow one the general's hair, which means she passed him at that point and he didn't see anything. Nobody moved. Then we see Arya appear from darkness mid jump.

The information we have right now is that they literally couldn't see her, she was probably cloaked somehow.

Yes, Conan and all it's derivatives you dumbass zoomer.

Also
>lotr
>sword and sorcery

fucking retard

>Kills a trained assassin with a gaping stomach wound.
>1v1s Brienne and wins.
>Assassinates an entire house, impersonates a lord for at least a week, bakes two full grown men into pies, nobody notices.
>Teleports behind the NK.
I still watch the show because it fascinates me to see what an utter trainwreck it has become.

>Bumps head
>Forced to do a metal gear solid stealth section because she lost her powers
>Gets a pep talk from a witch
>Learns how to become the fucking wind
We anime now boys.

Ignoring the fact kiling the night king should always have been a group effort. Doesn't it seem odd that the one person there who doesn't believe in the god of death was the one that threw out the nostalgia bait line?

cant die by steel or dragon fire. killable by dragon steel.

youtube.com/watch?v=sUrJdsN_-B0

All Arya did with the faceless men was get beat with a stick and scrub dead dudes' dicks. Somehow this made her a terminator in 2 years.

>There is no way the main protagonist can die like this, and indeed no main protagonists died like that because Ned was only a decoy, whose death was amply foreshadowed from the second scene of the series.
>There's no way the main antagonist can die like this because the whole deal with taking out Dark Lord's whole army by killing him personally was a bottom-of-the-barrel cliche, and trying to make it not so by giving the kill to a character who had basically the least possible connection to the whole plotline, and making it a result of a retarded trick did not improve it.

>the night king is basicly a god of death
and what do we say to the god of death?

brainlets need to realize that subversion in of itself does not = galaxy brain IQ

You were expecting one thing and got something else. That is the definition of clever and incredible

Great analysis. I personally consider it to be my favourite episode due to the visuals but I can't bring myself to defend Arya's *teleports behind you* bullshit.

no, I was expecting something epic and cool and what I got was underwhelming and gay

Ned and Robbs death were good subversions because in generic fantasy, they get saved by some asspull, like how Sam and tons of other character surivived while being mauled.

Just like villains get defeated by some asspull like aryas shitty leap n dagger stunt.

Yeah a movie that came out in 1986 is way more relevant to the social conscious in 2011 then the most expensive and successful film series then yet released
also
>no magic in LotR
Consider suicide.

Robert was poisoned by Lancel, retard. That's why Lancel repents and joins the faith militant later in the series. It's just plot convenience if you see this as "it was written by people and it's fiction therefore everything serves to further the plot" but unlike the shit we have now there is no logical thread to follow and everything happens because reasons, the good have to win and the bad have to lose, throw a little subversion and that's it.

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>Arya's whole story is about killing and being a stealthy assassin

You mean, a Mary Sue, who can recover from multiple stabs to the stomach and a bath in sewer water by taking a night's sleep.

>Arya's dagger move was shown when she fought with Brienne

Brienne fight was almost as retarded.

The fact that Arya became one of the most awful characters in the show after getting to Braavos, breaking verisimilitude worse than dragons and zombies just makes it all worse.

The dark lord is defeated, his mindless minions perish with him, the good guys escape certain death at the last moment or die heroically and the magical kingdom is saved from a supernatural evil at long last

>brainlets call this subversion

How much american education do you need to know realise 'died hunting' has been code for 'fucking assassinated' sine 1100AD.

Kek

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Thanks! I feel the same, the Battle itself was actually rather enjoyable for its desperation and tension, despite the ending and idiotic military formation at the start.

The only way they can salvage this plot rape is if the Night King somehow survived, like maybe he reforms or maybe he warged into another body, or maybe there's just more than 1 NK and nobody realized it because they're never together in the same spot.

That would allow the show to redeem itself by having NK as the final boss again, and underscoring the futility of realm politics in the face of the apocalypse

Extremely correct.

What do you think his icecicles are gonna slide together and form again like he's the fucking t1000? He's dead dude. Dead as fuck.

Put me in the reddit screencap or else your mother dies in her sleep tonight.

and that's the problem. Idk if the show can be salvaged at this point, and the only way to do it is to do something fucking stupid like you just mentioned. D&D wrote themselves into a fucking corner, and wasted all of our time.

Bravo. Ya did good, kid.

>Hundreds of male heroes recover from near death situations and injuries with movie magic
>...
>Female hero male hero is recovers from near death situatuions and injuries with movie magic
>MARY SUEEEE!!!!11
You're embarassing

It means that Jon’s resurrection meant nothing.

It means that the tourney at harrenhall, r+l=j etc meant nothing.

Jewish fanfiction goys

The wine wasn’t poisoned — it was just extra strong wine. How could Cersei have known that a wild boar big and strong enough to gore him to death would appear? How could she guarantee that his senses would be dulled enough for the animal to kill him? A cup less might’ve kept him good enough to avoid fatal injury, and a cup more might’ve made him call off the entire thing.

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>Hundreds of male heroes recover from near death situations and injuries with movie magic

Okay. Name just three. The conditions must be the same (something that should be as 100% fatal for a human being as multiple penetrating stomach wounds and bath in the severs, recovery without any sort of explicit miracle, magic, superpower, or supertech being applied).

Because the context is completely different. Early GoT was all about sidestepping fantasy cliches like "deus ex machina saving the main character from inescapable odds at the very last second". The thing that was great about upsets like Ned's Head or the Red Wedding or Theon getting JUST'd or Jon getting betrayed by the Night's Watch was that these were all things were their missteps carried weight and consequences.

Now it's just "HAHA SUBVERTED XD" meaning "we're going to do things that make zero sense at all, because fuck you". When before it was all about having things done that actually DO make sense in the real world that simply don't usually happen in fiction to main characters because of plot armor. But now it's the exact opposite, where all the main characters have tons of plot armor and kill off enemies and the save the day like it's badly written fanfiction by a school child.

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LEROY JENKINS!

Absolutely exquisite.

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>Jon getting saved by Benjen beyond the wall.
>Really everyone not dying beyond the wall.
>Neither Jamie or Bronn dying in the battle vs Dothraki.
>Everyone not dying in battle of Winterfell.

The thing is though all of these were criticized just as much as Arya's Braavo asspull. So idk wtf the other guy is talking about.

I think GRRM’s working the long con, and if he is, God love him for it. I think he’s already completed the entire series and is sitting on it until the show is over. I say this as a proud bookfag.

It’s the ultimate “fuck you” to all you low-imagination, ADD cunts and the fucks who write tv shit for you, shortcutting important character arcs, spoonfeeding you with insultingly dumb exposition, robbing you of the experience of reading and truly letting your imagination soar. I hope I’m right. I hope GRRM enjoys the satisfaction that comes with proving beyond refute that he’s a better, more imaginative storyteller than the hacks who’ve been writing the vast bulk of Hollywood’s output for the past couple of decades.

The problem with Arya's ass pull is that it upsets what everyone believed was the greater narrative, how the fighting and warring of the kingdoms didn't matter in the grand scheme of things because the white walkers were coming and threatened everyone regardless of who sat on the throne. Instead, the unifying thread of the story has been severed early and rather easily because of really bad writing decisions. Cersei was entirely justified now to sit in King's Landing and not short-sighted at all.

>Ned gets himself in an unwinable situation
>All logic points to his death
>Audience suspects he will live as it goes against common narratives
>Dies anyway, but justified because it makes sense in the context of the situation, and leads to interesting narrative developments
vs
>Nightking attacks with an unstoppable army, only exposes himself surrounded by 100s of allies
>Basically impossible to die in the current situation, no one expects Arya to TP behind him and execute him because it's impossible
>Does it anyway
>Unjustified because it doesn't make any sense in the context of the show, and was done only to service the writers laziness. Any logical and interesting narrative developments are immediately ended

Not the same

>something that should be as 100% fatal for a human being
Pretty much every gunshot wound, stab and even concussion could lead to immediate death depending on the circumstances. These circumstances aren't relevant because you're not watching real life happen on screen. Until you understand this vital element in the role of fiction, you'll always be a nitpicking faggot.

imagine going to great lengths to defend that shitshow? clearly you agree with us but for some reason, most likely you're a woman or libtard, you've convinced yourself this was an ebin moment that fits in the show

This, it's a huge part of why it leaves such a sour taste in my mouth. I've never truly given a shit about which noble sits on the throne, in and of itself. It's only ever mattered in the context of who's actually going to do something about existential threats to mankind like the White Walkers. But now that this threat is completely gone in the biggest ass-pull of the century, why the fuck should I give a single shit about who wins the iron throne?

In earlier seasons there were actual tangible reasons to be in favor of one person or another. Now it doesn't matter at all.

That’s exactly how I feel about it. They unintentionally made Cersei look smart instead of the insane, besotted, short-sighted cunt that she is.

She wouldn't know about an specific boar but she knew for sure that he will face wild animals in his trip. And being the seasoned hunter he was, she knew that he will aim for the big game, and that means danger. The wound for the animal served to disguise the poison, as it is evident he died from the wound.
This was Cersei plan for years, and she sped it up because she knew Ned was smelling her farts.

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OP here. I was baiting but ended up getting some pretty based replies.

>she just knew, okay??
Right on.

>Arya's whole story is about killing and being a stealthy assassin
Surface level fucking pleb
Arya's story is the death of innocence
Arya's arc takes her from naive wannabe hero to murderous psychopath
Arya's arc is wholly concerned with the battle for the throne and totally irrelevant to the battle with the ice zombies
Arya and Sansa shouldn't even give a fuck about them because by this point they're supposed to be gunning for the throne.
But because they're the "good guys" (which the show has now) they all team up together to avengers assemble the baddies
Fucking joke.

And you know why they had it be this way? Because this writing is daytime-soap-tier. "WILL THEY OR WON'T THEY??" "WHO WILL WIN THE GAME OF THRONES???". These are the more important questions in the writers' minds. What? That whole literal battle between life and death itself? Nah, that's not important. What IS important is whether you're #TeamDany or #TeamCersei!!!

And we gotta have the fight be nail-bitingly against-the-odds for the "good team" by having them retardedly losing all their forces against NK and then suddenly having Cersei's army bolstered by Deus Ex Golden Company.

I think the people crying about "feminism" and shit over Arya are just retarded. It could have been Ser Daavos who stabbed the Night King for all I care.

The fact that the entire series led us to the "Great War", only to have it end immediately with no real cost is the problem.

The Night King is the ultimate looming threat that has been built up since Season 1. He spent thousands of years preparing for this invasion only to get stabbed once. There was no further complexity, he just died, the white walkers died, and the army of the dead "died". Poof all gone

This and also the story of revenge. Her entire thing was about seeing her father killed by the lannisters and their cronies and then falling asleep each night chanting the names of the people she wants dead.

And now they're also stuck in a lose-lose scenario. It actually would've made sense for Cersei's death to be at the hands of Le Sneaky Assassin Arya, but now if they do that it'll be BOTH major antagonists getting killed by the same character in the same way. But if they don't do it, it's ruining Arya's arc just as badly as Arya killing NK ruins Jon's/Bran's arc.

That's all 100%, but it's also a annoying cherry-on-top that in additional to all that, they had their capeshit-tier Arya character be the one to deliver the coup de grace. It's just that extra little "fuck you" on top of everything else.

She does the kind of twirly graceful fighting that game of thrones is explicitly against.
Game of thrones always took the point that that shit doesn't work. You can't fight like that or you get twatted by a big bloke with armour and a big facking sword.
See: first sword of bravos vs merryn fucking trant
See: oberyn vs the mountain (came closest, brute strength still won, lesson learned?)
But for some bizarre reason (writing incompetence) this theme has been completely dropped, and now it the best way to fight in the game of thrones universe is by spinning and being a ninja. Everyone with swords and armour and shields and tactics was doing it wrong. Genuinely.
This occurred at some point after the writers ran out of book material. Hmmm.

shit like this proves 4channel is the superior web forum for wasting time

That's not what i said retarded faggot. It's completely understandable to die while hunting in this context, where Robert went to hunt drunk with a sword and a bow against animals bigger and faster than most men. Any non retard that wants to kill Robert and make it seem like an accident would make the same as Cersei.

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There was no poison, user. It was just wine. You sound just like the people trying to justify the Night King's death.

FUCK OFF

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Blessed high IQ Yea Forums poster.

>Ignoring the fact kiling the night king should always have been a group effort
30 second fix - have Theon's charge and Arya's leaping stab occur at the same time.
Theon charges, Night King matrix parries him. Theon and NK lock eyes. Over NK's shoulder we see flying ninja child. Stabs him in back, he shatters and Theon lives.
Or if Theon had to die (which is fitting) have Arya stab him while he's stabbing Theon.

Yeah, I would've been massively disappointed even if it was Jon or Jaime. Having it being Arya is just the icing on the cake made of shit.

Are you retarded? Do you really think killing off the main character before the first season even ends is the same as killing your main character at the very end if the series?

Yeah plus there's nothing left. The Kings Landing scenes in S7+S8 showcase it perfectly. It's just Cersei alone in the throne room with the 1-2 characters left in the city.

Daenerys doesn't have a house. It would just be her sitting alone in a throne room in a city of strangers. Jon (Aegon) is in the same boat.

King's Landing was one of the most interesting parts of the show early on because nearly all of the most important characters were there. The city was brought to life by their presence.

With the way it currently is, I don't even see why anyone really cares about the Iron Throne in the first place. Are there even seven kingdoms anymore? It doesn't even feel like there is a King/Queen anymore. Who even needs one at this point

>606
more like 404'd

Yep, the writing has been thoroughly capeshitified.

For example, if this were early-seasons-Got, instead of Little Lady Mormont getting picked up and crushed, but not before she's able to epicly take out the zombie giant with a dagger to the eye, she would've just been stomped under its foot like an insect and that would've been the end of that. Now everything needs to be some epic "haha take THAT!"

top

fucking

cringe

do NOT put me in the screenfetch

based

Agreed. The Great War should have been at least a few episodes, and multiple battles, with the Living taking severe casualties from named, long-established characters. Sam Tarly absolutely should have fucking died at Winterfell when all those badass soldiers went down. It makes zero sense. The epic final battle should have seen the the WWs defeated but at the cost of basically the entire Army of the Living, all major characters included. The survivors would have built a new society out of the ashes, Ragnarok style.

Fuck. *Sips*

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A big reason behind why things have sunken this low is because all the good characters have either
a) died
b) been neutered and rendered useless by the plot. Such as how guys like Tyrion, Varys, and Jon used to be strong compelling characters but now just stand around doing nothing and acting like 70 IQ simpletons because the writers fear that having any of these guys doing anything would undermine their "YASS QUEEN" narrative of their Queen Khaleesi

So now we're just left with a bunch of boring 2D cardboard cutouts of characters and none of them fucking matter anymore.

she knows every secret of that castle where she grew up she probbly climbed the tree or some shit like that
after all she's a skilled assassin + she know the location very well

The fight at Winterfell should've been a complete slaughter with the surviving characters needing to retreat south and buy themselves time. Meanwhile the army of the dead continue ravaging southward. The surviving armies of Dany reach King's Landing with the army of the dead not far behind, and Cersei has to choose to either let them die but then have the White Walkers at her gates, or do an Enemy Mine teamup with Dany first to fight them off at her doorstep.

There are still cliches in what I just thought up right there, but it's certainly more compelling than the shit we're getting now.

One was done well and one was done really poorly.
How is this hard to understand?

> #
>>Hundreds of male heroes recover from near death situations and injuries with movie magic
Whomst?

Wtf? based as fuck

Hi, guy you're talking to, I literally posted this here: So yes, I obvi agree with you

yeah maybe SHOW THAT in a VISUAL medium?

I was saying that everyone at the moment that scene happened knew something was off. They felt it in the back of their mind or in the pit of their stomach. Everyone knew that it didn't make any sense and was horrible, but the sheer magnitude of how horrible it was wouldn't be fully appreciated until more thorough analysis and discussion took place.

This is a great example of that. When you look at that picture it just conveys how unbelievably retarded those spoiled trust fund fucks D&D are. The comparisons to nu-wars and Walking Dead are great. It's like there is some conspiracy to create all entertainment in this same fashion that exudes contempt for the audience and even the job of writing a good show itself.

>crazy-eyed Euron Greyjoy, a one-dimensional cartoon pirate animated solely by his bottomless horniness for queens

that made me sad

To be fair oberyn lost more because of his own arrogance and need for humiliating the Lannister’s got the best of him. He made a complete joke out of the mountain and basically left him an autist

Clever but unironically true.

desu I think Jon has always been a 70 IQ simpleton though.

Tyrion and Varys were so important while they were smart. Same with Littlefinger. Tyrion didn't become a fan favorite character because he is a dwarf with a cock. People loved him because he was always the smartest guy in the room while simultaneously being the drunkest

don't post again, visitor

t. Night King

>end immediately with no real cost

Their armies are fucked and Cersei is probably waiting just around the corner with hers.

The white walkers have been doing nothing but walking over everything and growing in numbers. Would you have wanted more of that then? Because this is what every battle against the white walkers have been and would have been. Plenty of stuff happened before they breached the wall and if someone hadnt offed NK there wouldnt have been anyone left to fight him.

OP is literally S E E T H I N G right now

Ned made a number of fuck-ups that lead to his death. The Night King didn't play a single card wrong.

Do you have any fucking clue how dangerous wild boars are? Have you never wondered why the English fucking eliminated them like wolves? Cersei had watched hunts before. Everyone within upper society would know how a boar hunt worked. The whole point is that you chase and pester the boar until it charges and you kill it. It's like fucking bull fighting. If you make a Bull Fighter drunk, you bet your ass he's going to get impaled. Death would be as certain as making a skydiver drunk.

yikes

It must legitimately be cheaper to write a shitty show and pay shills to defend how shitty it is than it is to write a good show because this is like history repeating itself. We're a couple days away from articles like "Here's why Arya Killing the Night King is a Good Thing" or "Why is the Alt Right Defending The Night King?"

He went to the battle of winterfell instead of just letting the white walkers and commanders stomp absolutely everything. The decision makes absolutely no sense though, the only reason he did it is because DABID wrote it this way so he dies. It's completely out of character for the NK to do something this stupid

Jon went from being a character I wanted to see the most from s1-5 to giving no fucks about at all. He literally sat on the dragon for about 10-15 minutes just watching everyone beg someone to light the trenches. Did he suddenly forget the plan? Why wasn’t he using the dragon to clear the front lines so the unsullied wouldn’t just die? It was fairly obvious the NK wasn’t nearby and even when the NK did appear he threw himself so far out of position it didn’t matter anyway.

Upboted

Ed's death has a tragic story arc where many interesting things happen. NKs death has no story arc,we know nothing about him , his goals origin or motivation, unlike ned he's hyped for 7 seasons in the show and for thousands of years in the show world and dies having done nothing more interesting then having marked bran in a vision.

It's not a conspiracy. It's just what happens when you get possessed by an idea. It's just poor writing. It's as simple as that. The show had been built on realism in small moments so that the heightened politics and magic felt grounded. After the books ran out, the show has turned more and more to emotional scene building. It works for Spielberg to have irrational scenes, because the whole work is built with a similar style. It doesn't work for this show, because we've watched how many season where this doesn't happen.

OP BTFO

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But if Melisandre didn't light the trench, she would have had no legitimate purpose to be there at all. And if Melisandre wasn't there, who could've have reminded Arya that the whole point of the battle was to kill the Night King? Everybody knows strong female characters can't think for themselves.

fpbp

>the most basic enemies can sense a fucking blood drop hiting the ground
>All their senses get amplified by the presence of their lord
>A fuck ton of them gathered around a tree
>even fucking commanders watching
>DUDE JUST CLIMB A TREE BRO

Ooh, here's an idea. Cersei let's survivors in, because she likes the idea of having meatshields soak up the zombies. Meanwhile, just like Aerys years ago, she has KL's sewers lined with wildfire bombs (not the Red Keep, mind you, but everything between Red Keep's walls and the walls of the city proper, where the fighting is happening). Her plan is to fight the battle normally, have her rivals, both living and dead, kill each other, and if they all happen to wind up in the streets of KL, she wildfires the whole fucking city, because she's a crazy bitch who likes to kill every fucking bird with one stone. Cersei only cares if *she* lives, everyone else is only important to the extent that they satisfy her urge to dominate and will be discarded the instant she feels they've become a threat. Jamie finds out, recreates Mad King scenario, tries to kill Cersei, but Mountain kills him first or something. Idk where it would go from there, but having internal division literally DURING the final battle of life vs death would perfectly underscore the show's top theme of how internal division is harmful to overcoming larger threats.

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The scene just kind of ends up with Bran and the Night King sitting there, ready to say something, but nothing actually happening. There was no big reveal of any kind. Ultimately the NK was just some silent big bad.

I can't even express how disappointed I was with the complete absence of dialogue. We had seasons of leadup to this moment. Towards SOMETHING. And all of it was to show off Arya's noscope oneshot kill and for the NK and his whole army to die like a fucking redshirt.

I'm mad because I feel like a fool for being invested. This series is just wish fulfillment at this point. And good writing or pacing isn't one of the wishes fulfilled.

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>Arya kills the Night King
>Jon kills Cersei

It's what they're doing and you all know it.

>The apocalypse is apparently just a side quest.
when you get skyrim special edition with all the DLCs

Hey post me to Reddit with my message:

Fuck gays, fuck trannies, fuck minorities

D & D completely ruined Hot Pie. What a waste of a great character. They clearly had no idea what to do with him after they passed all the book material. Instead of giving him a clear end game, they instead just had him double down on his "Making food for Arya" bullshit and have him make stupid dishes that really didn't lead anywhere. The culinary mastermind from the earlier seasons (and probably the one truly great pastry chef of the series, along with the white walkers) completely disappeared and was transformed into a chubby little bastard whose end goal was to bang Arya to get back at her for not appreciating food. The man that fed the whole series hot pies, did it just to get a revenge bang.

Hello r/Yea Forums

Or when you focus entirely on the main quest first and knock it out at like level 15, then have all those fucking bandit caves to deal with

first season of a show is all new and devolves plots, after like 2-3 seasons i'm cynical it is just cash grab.

Jon wasn't the "clever" character, but he was a compelling character. Very much like Ned in the sense of being honorable, pure, just, but naive.
But his character went to shit in S6 upon resurrecting. you'd think he'd be profoundly different upon waking up, but no. Same old same old. Then he just acts like a submissive little bitch to Sansa. Then he acts like the biggest beta fuccboi of all time around Dany.

Based, preach

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Man I got that and accidentally beat the whole Dragonborn dlc got an amazing axe and defeated the cuthulu like Dragonborn in another dimension. Come back to the main quest line and it’s all so low bar with no stakes comparatively

At least have Jon arrive somewhere before Arya jumps in. Maybe have her strike as Theon dies or is about to die, and Jon looks like he's going to be next

I don't even care so much about Jon not being there. What disappoints me the most is I was expecting some kind of interesting plot development once Night King confronted Bran. Instead they just autistically stare at each other blankly and NK reaches for his sword to kill him. That's it? All that buildup of some kind of special connection between Bran and NK and that's all we're going to get out of their meeting?

In a handful of minutes, you came up with a better plotline than a team of highly paid professionals could come up with over the course of years.

Yeah it actually confused me in S8 when people weren't referring to him as "Your grace". I did not get the impression that he bent over for Daenerys. I thought he was going to marry her and continue being king while she would be queen at some point, but not stop being King in the North in the meantime.

I don't see why he even did that. Didn't Daenerys straight up say with no strings attached that she would fight for the North after the whole Beyond the Wall plotline?

fucking this, even the normalfags see this. the only one that are praising that horseshit conclusion of the WW arc are the "yasss qweeenz".

Only Theon and Jorah died. I'm mad more mains didn't die.

all sins would've been forgiven if they at least had Brienne die too. But no, we still have that giantess romping around despite the fact that she hasn't had a fucking plot purpose since like Season 4 or 5.

Ned dying led to more story

Arya killing the NK leads to no more story for half the cast

If you think about it. The Song of Ice and Fire can be interpreted many ways. One way can be character arcs.

Arya's song(Ice) was primarily getting revenge against the people who screwed her and her family over. With the big target being Cersei(Fire). Losing her innocence in this harsh world and becoming a master assassin works well with her arc. This scared little girl grows up to be a sadistic murder that Cersei inadvertently created.

While Jon's song(Fire) was against the Night King (Ice). That's what his arc was, to stop the blue boogie man from beyond the wall. For the idiots that claimed he was a Gary Stu or whatever fail to see that Jon just wants to defeat the NK. He doesn't want the throne. He just wants to vanquish evil and live a nice life with his remaining family. His destiny is to rally the troops to make a stand or die trying.

>The apocalypse is apparently just a side quest
And that's what hurts the most. All 8 seasons of tension and shit, just end up being the footnote of a book hidden away in the Citadel.

A final stand of humanity at King's Landing to prevent the Night King from landing(heh). Would've be cliche or cheesy, sure, but at least it would create interesting dynamics to see what would be done. Hell even if they do win, the scramble afterwords and the backstabbing would be glorious.

The only possible way any of this can be saved, is that by killing the NK, it actually turns out to be a terrible idea. A "You didn't win" scenario. But I doubt it, and we're getting three episodes of Finger in the Bum.

how do these writers not think these things through? its not hard for fucks sake.

the best part about this is that it repeats cersei's greatest moment of blowing up everything in the sept of balor that she didn't like and it flips it. she would definitely resort to that again if it worked so well the first time

I don't get it

It's funny because people died.

It was fortified wine, getting him drunker faster than he realized, throwing off his reflexes, slowing him down, making him less-coordinated. Hell, it probably wasn’t even the first time she’d tried it.

Right there with ya

Rush B

She'd absolutely pull that shit again. I dont recall if the show mentioned this, but the books definitely do; King's Landing has a fucking ocean of wildfire beneath it. Aerys stockpiled that shit like fucking crazy. KL is like the most dangerous place to be in Westeros, and none of the WF seems to have been removed. If anything, Tyrion actually stepped up production for the Battle of the Black Water in season 2 when he trashed Stannis's fleet. It's KL's best weapon, and Cersei would absolutely use it again, especially if its proven itself effective in her eyes (which it did). If she has all her rivals in a single killzone, she would not hesitate for a second to torch the entire fucking city and be Queen of the ashes, or even just to spite the rest of the world if she thinks she's dead anyway. In Cersei's mind, either she wins or nobody wins.

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Nice pun but this is unironically correct

Maybe instead of shattering when he's stabbed like the rest of them, he reverts back to a normal man, and Bran is able to use his 3-eye raven abilities to have the first and final conversation before he dies

>It's completely understandable to die while hunting in this context
It still relies on incredible circumstances that JUST HAPPEN to occur while Cersei JUST KNOWS it will happen. It's shit writing, user.

>getting him drunker faster than he realized, throwing off his reflexes, slowing him down, making him less-coordinated
Lmao, that's what regulsr alcohol does. Are you telling me that it just wokrs because it's MAGIC wine?

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Finally somebody with sense

I was legit hoping that Melisandre and her necklace were going to turn out to be a callback to Dragonslayer, a movie that GRRM clearly loved. I thought she was going to give her necklace to Davos, tell him to smash it when it began to glow or something, then walk out among the dead, becoming more frail with each step.

Then when she got taken down/out, the necklace would flare to life, Davos would smash it, and Melly would explode like a tactical nuke, releasing basically a fire elemental out there to ravage the army of the dead.

screencapped

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Ned was just a man, Night King was an unstoppable mysterious force killed by psssh nothing personnel *teleports behind you* ninja girl from naruto

Fuck, man.

Yes, because Robert drinks like a fish. You up the alcohol content, he gets drunker faster.

There are more factors to consider than the surprise element.
Ned's death was logical, what made you believe he wouldn't die is an alleged plot armor, it was an interesting surprise and refreshing experience. On the other hand night king's death was abrupt, nonsensical, and pure deus ex machina, there was nothing good about it.

>Early GoT was all about sidestepping fantasy cliches like "deus ex machina saving the main character from inescapable odds at the very last second.
This is also exactly the reverse of what happens in the latest episode. Bran is shown to be in an inescapable situation, completely surrounded and cornered, with no way out and nobody reasonably being able to save him. A '(deus ex) machina' is exactly what would have been employed to put Arya where she needed to be if the scene had been acted out in in a play, but for some reason it's more acceptable due to camera perspective and TV stunt shenanigans where she comes flying in and people don't see the machine.

Dis nigga right here tho. lol

Clever and based AF

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If you need it explained, you probably shouldn't be roaming free in public.

>missteps carried weight and consequences.
If the writers were to logically deduce their initial battle formations, war tactics and the retarded bran bait plan to the final and correct conclusion, then every person in Winterfell should be dead, and the Night King should be marching to the south.

then who is the main antagonist ? the jews?

How retarded are you actually?

it is so bigoted of you to think a woman could not prevent the apocalypse by herself but instead needs a man's help

She did serve one purpose though, vouching for Jaime in front of Dany, Sansa and Jon. It was implied her support was what made them accept his assistance. Not that it fucking mattered anyway since Jaime was completely inconsequential for the battle and served no other role than saving Brienne once. The fact that he's now buddies with them will undoubtedly play a part later with Cersei though.

I like how you have to remove the context of those two storylines for your dumb point to make any kind of sense.

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Devastating

>Has time to dumbly look down
>Doesn't just crush her throat
Okay

the grr martin subversion
>seemingly happens out of nowhere, but follows a strong line of logic, and the story is written around it well
for example, the red wedding was sudden and brutal, but you can trace all the fuckups on robbs part and it makes perfect sense why it happened

the rian johnson subversion
>seemingly happens out of nowhere, but makes no sense or is totally pointless and just makes the story worse
for example - all of the last jedi. it has moments where it seems like major elements of the star wars formula are subverted, but the story doesn't develop any of the themes these subversions raise, and it just makes the film weird and disappointing

can you guess which of the two the NKs death was?

On one hand, I'm glad the whole night king plot is over because it was always the least interesting part of the show(well it was neat as a background element in the early seasons), but god damn.

I was expecting some shitty annoying "it was all just a vision/time travel" thing where just as the night king were about to kill Bran he woke up before the battle and told everyone to get the fuck out or something. Even that garbage plot point would have been more satisfying than this shit. Even the fucking Mass Effect 3 ending was less of a joke than this.

he cute

This is reddit now
have sex

This bothered me too. He's shown to be able to throw a spear at inhuman range and speed so he's obviously much stronger than a normal human, but when he grabs arya by the throat he apparently holds back just enough to not crush her windpipe so she can do her move.

An hour earlier a giant crushes Lyanna Mormont's body but still pulls her up to his eye. It's just dumb.

I think that these zombies just forget that humans have two hands. So when they incapacitate one of them, they think the threat is over.

After never once having shown the dead eating the living or being anything other than completely utilitarian in dispatching them. No, this one hulking giant chooses this moment to demonstrate actual sadism instead of just crushing her underfoot.

Cersei will just be the Scouring of the Shire.

Yea at this point they've gone full action movie in regards to how much damage their characters can sustain and still be fine.
I'm also sure I saw Brienne and some of the other mob squad characters get stabbed multiple times over the course of the episode and assumed they died, but then they just suddenly popped up again 10 min after and seemed relatively fine.

Consistent with both Ned and Joffrey's characters
NK fucks up, just because, and Arya foregoes all stealth at the last moment becuase it's a 'cool' shot.

Beric and Jorah each get stabbed like 5-10 times. Everyone else gets surrounded or covered multiple times.

Game of thrones is not subversive for the sake of it. Its a show with consequences for the good guys, thats it. Mistakes made by Good characters in average shows ussually don't matter. Its grrms critique of lotrs not being realistic not a tlj shit. Not anymore though.

Everyone outside of the walls when the 6ft tide of wights crashed into them should have died almost instantly followed by an hour of every single person in the castle dying, leaving the hopes and dreams of humanity in the hands of Cersei who is a character we're not meant to like.

There you go, subversion that works and doesn't leave me feeling like I've wasted a decade on this shit show.

A TIDE OF FUCKING ZOMBIES, A TIDE OF DEAD ON A GODSDAMNED OPEN FIELD AND THEY SURVIVE IT.

>bunch of zombies swarm the survivors in the crypt
>death sounds goes on forever, the death toll sounds catastrophic
>nope, almost everyone survived against a zombie horde for 10+ minutes by standing still in a corner twiddling their thumbs