M.A.R.Y.S.U.E

100%
No
No

Mary Sue=female character I don't like.

Rey - Without a doubt
Captain Marvel - Yes because she is too OP and all the previous films have some distinction between the characters and how they work together to win. With CM you don't need that.
Arya - no

I'm so tired of women's SHIT

1. Yes, she is the most Mary Sue since the original Mary Sue (named Mary Sue)
2. Yes, nothing is earned.
3. No, whole seasons of the show are about her gaining her powers.

I understand you idiots want to muddy the water but you cannot change the meaning of Mary Sue it's a descriptor and a very good one at that, same with Gary Stu.
Understood? understood.

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/thread

What do you mean?
Rey = Have
Brie = Sex
Arya = Incel
Arya had just sex the night before.
And what does "Have" mean for Rey?

Everyone in GoT became Mary Sue.

>Yes,no,yes

Let’s make one thing very, very clear:

A Mary Sue is not a perfect character, full stop.

A Mary Sue is a character who is so perfect that it DETRACTS from the story.

Mary Sue
noun
noun: Mary Sue; plural noun: Mary Sues

(originally in fan fiction) a type of female character who is depicted as unrealistically lacking in flaws or weaknesses.
"she was not a ‘strong woman’ so much as an insufferable Mary Sue"

It's in the dictionary you know

I find it funny how Captain Marvel is considered a Mary Sue but this guy isn't.

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>Rey
Bland Character
100% Mary Sue
>Marvel
Just a Shitty Unlikable Character more than anything else
Some Mary Sue elements
>Arya
Decent Character
Slight Mary Sue elements

everyone who says arya isn't a mary sue is retarded.

even if we accept she's the sneak god it makes no sense that she can jump like that or that she didn't freeze from being touched. literally can do everything and is invincible. definition of a mary sue.

Nah.
They just gave each female a mutant power.
>Sansa, they gave her the power to make everyone else stupid, thus making her seem smart
>Arya, so ugly she can pass off as an undead
>Bree, mutant strength
>Cat, ability to breathe without using mouth or nose

Who uses Mary Sue?

Mary Sue is most frequently used as a noun (a Mary Sue) or modifier (a Mary Sue story), although it may also sometimes appear as a verb, to Mary-Sue, meaning “to insert oneself into a fictional story/character.”

Male Mary Sues are sometimes called Marty Stu or Gary Stu, often associated with James Bond and Superman.
Can you not use the internet?
dictionary.com/e/fictional-characters/mary-sue/

Most superheroes fall into the category, really. Batman 66 did good job poking fun about it with Batman having just the right tool in every situation in his belt.

People have been bitching that Superman is OP for almost a century you fucking moron.

>Beats General Zod, a trained soldier, in hand to hand combat
He literally died fighting Doomsday though.

Not really Mary Sue, but the whole cast has plotarmor now.
Bran is a Mary Sue, if you consider Arya a Mary Sue.
Jon just fails too many times to be one. Sansa didnt show a Mary Sue moment.

Yes / No / No

Supermans flaws are that despite being the strongest being in the universe he is not able to save everyone and has to live with the guilt of not being able to save people. Also cryptonite.

He is OP, not a Mary sue.

how the fuck is Arya a mary sue??? She was trained by the faceless man himself.

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Since Mary Sue has become a misused term here is a helpful list of common Mary Sue traits, while not every character that has those traits is a Mary Sue, if they have all of them then chances are that they are one
1.Considered attractive in universe
2.Talented at everything
3.Loved by all except villains and people who are clearly wrong
4.Flawless
5.No struggle
6.No character arc.
7.The rules of the universe are ignored to prop up the chracter.

That's not what being a Mary Sue means.

A Mary Sue is a pattern of behavior. A character that every other character bends over backwards for and has nothing but good things to say about, whose failures can always be attributed to someone else. Her flaws are not "real" in that they do not make the character weak, they simply endear others to them even more. Arya, and most GoT character by extension aren't Mary Sues, they are simply victims of bad writing.

you have trannies on twitter saying ayra isn't a mary sue because she had training. their tranny brains can't comprehend that she's been given the big moments time & time again, & freys, littlefinger & now Jon who was working with the night king plot for 8 seasons. it isn't that she hasn't suffered hardships, it's that ever since the writings gone down hill, she's a literal mary sue to appease this braindead morons, cause no matter how sad she may look don't get confused, her actions don't have negative consequences.

Going by the angry, seething, literally shaking comments in the social media sphere that she's NOT a mary sue...she's a mary sue.

Her entire story arc was thrown away for a manufactures 'wooo!" moment for braindead TV watching zombies.

That Martin allowed them to do that to a character he was building the way was, he should get ass cancer.

I don't think anyone is actually retarded enough not to know what a Mary Sue is while BEING ON THE INTERNET.

Yes I know disney ridley or whatever the fuck fucked it up but let's be honest she didn't want to answer the question she wanted to be indignant and huffy that it was "suggested", and was likely coached to do so.

The other 2 were born with powers/gifted powers from a cosmic accident

Arya spent years otherseas honing her skillset = not a mary sue

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Rey-Yes
Brie-Yes in her movie, but not so much in endgame (mostly because she was hardly present)
Arya-Initially i would say no, as we've seen her develop through the seasons, but she does have Mary Sue-ish moments. Like jumping into a sewage laden canal with 5 stab wounds and then going on a long parkour chase/assassin fight with just a day or two of rest and some basic bandaging...
...and that time she beat an opponent in full plate armour and a broad sword with her piddly little pokey stick...
...and that OTHER time she teleported behind a superhuman lich-lord and killed him with a cheap knife trick...
Personally I blame the writers...

>discord trannys
>yasss queen slayy
>mary stu gary larry stu boo

Is it possible for you brainlets to form a sentence without the use of meme syntax?

>Rey
most obvious mary sue ever, awful
>Captain Marvel?
I don’t watch cape shit really but I assume she is born with powers? So a super hero can’t really be a fucking mary sue
>Arya
Actually, yes. She was supposedly trained as an assassin but that still doesn’t make up for it. Though it was fine until she fucking had the strength to literally push over and topple like 5 wights, sprint miles in short minutes and perform above olympic tier leaps.

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>Weakened by kryptonite and magic and loses power in a few days without a yellow sun.
>a mary sue

>what is kryptonite
retard

>misses the part where he trained for six seasons to become batman

Trained to move as fast as sound too?

This. Arya became characteristics of a Mary Sue as they left the books and she a fanfavourite.

The training was a mixed bag. It wasnt that good, but it implies many off screen lessons.

1st: Yes, somehow being more powerful than Luke fucking Skywalker, I wouldn't be surprised if she was retconned to be the actual Chosen One instead of Anakin
2nd: Yes, being able to go toe to toe with Thanos while the male heroes are struggling against him was bogus, thank god she didn't get the killing blow on Thanos
3rd: Can't say since I don't watch GoT

she trained so hard the laws of physics don't apply to her and she's not bothered at all by the NK touching her. definitely not a mary sue

arya had lots of struggle but her arc is similar to luke's. her skills were too advanced for what we see her training was about. regardless of the definition of a "mary sue", that's just bad story telling

Nigga got his ass beat in MoS, got his ass beat BVS and nearly died at Batman's hands, and was killed by Doomsday. On a social interaction level he was always running into adversity and conflict. Snyderverse Supes is powerful but he is not a Gary Stu.

t. inflatefag who never read batman stuff

have sex

My door is unlocked bb

Anyone who says anything other than yes is wrong. Did they have any realistic struggle to gain their skills? Arya was weak and she went blind for a bit and suddenly becomes the best killer?

It's funny coz all these leftist are all about inclusivity and diversity when they're ok with all the popular female heroic characters in modern media being exclusively white women.

Rey - YES
Captain Marvel - YES
Arya - no. She suffered from poor writing of a paramount episode. Her character up until this season was well developed in my opinion.

>discuss
What did OP mean by this?

>arya was temporarily blind and swung around a staff a little bit, therefore she should be able to instantly teleport 20 meters and kill a semi-immortal creature that has divine powers

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But rey is literally just an expy of luke. captain marvel is an expy of thor, and arya is an expy of legolas. I'm not disagreeing with you but maybe it's less of a gender issue and more that lazy writing has always been prevalent in characters specifically designed to be power fantasies for impressionable children (and adults with too much free time on their hands). There's a potential argument for men writing mary sues because they can't relate to women so the only way they know how to make a female character likable is to make her pretty, competent, smart, and just give her absolutely no flaws. Unironically the solution is to hire more female writers, but not anyone who identifies as a feminist. These days companies are hiring vocal women who shout diversity from the rooftops but those people see a skewed image of women too and get caught up trying to write a power fantasy for women to get back at the man when what we need is just a three dimensional character.

All 3 of them, especially Arya. At least it wasn't Rey that killed Snoke.

I didn't mind the Captain Marvel movie but in a universe the writers now make out that Thor, the guy who threw his hammer through the combined power of 6 infinity stones, can't touch Thanos, yet Captain Marvel, a character who is in her second movie appearance and who's best feat is destroying a Kree Warship, can now nosell a hit from Thanos, the guy who we've seen smash heavy hitters like Thor, Strange, Wanda, Hulk, Iron Man and yet she doesn't even flinch at his headbutt? Bearing in mind he's been set up for 7 years as this Saga's main antagonist and they bathos him in his last few minutes of screen time. Also plot point, Korath, the black guy in Captain Marvel and Guardians of the Galaxy says to Ronan in 2014 'Thanos is the most powerful being in the universe' yet 2014 Thanos is weak compared to Captain Marvel. So if Korath knew of and worked with Captain Marvel in the 90's, why the fuck would he call Thanos the most powerful if he was shit tier against Captain Marvel? Shit writing at it's finest.

Carol & Arya are not mary sues, stupid incels throwing the term at any strong fictional female characters are really muddying the term & making it seem by proxy that Rey isn't a Mary Sue

Rey is 100% a mary sue, her powers are never explained, everyone instantly trusts her, she always wins, she teaches her mentors, she instantly learns abilities that took others years, she claims Han & Luke's weapons as her own (so fanfictiony holy shit)

Carol got her powers in a freak accident, few people trust her (Warmachine & Rocket didn't like her in End game) she gets her ass kicked all the time, she drinks heavily, shes more arrogant than Vegeta, gets her powers stolen by Rogue & yes Carol is quite overpowered but that doesn't mean mary sue

Cmon, it's easy to compare them

Well i haven't seen Captain Marvel but Arya Stark and Rey i like.

Arya is driven by her strong desire for revenge, she protects the weak unless they are in her way for revenge. No compassion for bad people at all, death is swift, brutal and unexpected if you are her enemy.

Rey is insecure, driven by her emotions, compassion and love. But she seems to lean towards the light side and she will not give up, not even the most hopeless cases. If cornered between a roch and hammer she is the most deadly.

I had. And now?

Right now anything that is not white, male, straight will be considered a "marginalized" person. Overtime however, the left will reject the while, straight, females. Eventually the left always eats its own.

being overpowered is a part of his character. Mary sue is overpowering character as a plot device

They run on death god powers so technically whatever. It's not like any of the shit the faceless can pull off can be the result of training.

The CIA is run by neo feminist women and they manage your propaganda. Doesnt take a genius to figure it out.

Carol is a Mary Sue. All these failures and "obstacles" are so small its like "That is no crocodile, because it has red paint on it".
Andd as long its book Arya she is fine, but when the writers explore her she gets a fanfiction Mary Sue status!

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Batman is and is not a Gary Stu, depending really on who writes him. It has also varied greatly from decade to decade, like with every long existing comic book hero.

>millennia of history of how the right turns on itself and eats itself up
>right's projections about how the left will surely do this one day in the future
Which to trust...

Firendly reminder: Being a Mary Sue doesn't mean that your character is bad.

Yes No No
Nothing to discuss.

Nah Carol isn't even a mary sue in the MCU movie, which is the most flawless version of her yet for obvious reasons

>communism was the right

>seemingly perfectly
but anyone who has ever read or seen anything about batman knows that he is far from perfect

You are insanely wrong. Carol's powers are not weighed equally to other characters who also received powers from infinity stones. She was written to have unexplicably more power than what is reasonable. Also, she has never made a mistake or fault, either in Captain Marvel or Endgame. She was written with no emotions or depth, yet achieves virtually everything without work. Classic Mary Sue.

This is only somewhat true in the MCU, in the comics she is balanced, wait until the MCU inserts people like Silver Surfer & see how Carol pales in comparison

>discord trannys
>yasss queen slayy
>mary stu gary larry stu boo

I didn't even say "discord", so whatever's in your head is filling in gaps for you to be offended. & it's a literal tranny bluecheckmark ranting n raving on #marysue right now, you discord tranny.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Please explain.

low quality bait but still worked

>Rey
Mary Sue
>Cap. Marvel
Mary Sue
>Arya
Not mary sue, it’s just an utterly retarded scene.

I don't read comics, so I can only go by the MCU. Had Brie Larson been a better actress, or they chose someone fit the role better, maybe it would have been more forgivable.

This happened for me regarding Rey. I still enjoyed The Force Awakens, but was hoping The Last Jedi would have developed Rey into a fleshed out character. Unfortunately we know what happened...

>Brie-Yes in her movie, but not so much in endgame
Even then she's pretty blatantly still a Mary Sue in Endgame.
>Trusted and accepted unconditionally by people she's only just met (only Rhodes and Rocket really question her and they quickly get shut up) or even never met ("She's got help")
>Ridiculously strong, does better alone against Thanos with all of the stones than Captain America, Iron Man, and Thor combined against Thanos with no stones, and literally just flies through armies of mooks
>Steals the spotlight in moments that would have been better off given to or shared with other characters, like Tony and Nebula's rescue and destroying Thanos's ship
Honestly this character should just never have existed, at least not as a part of the wider MCU.

im a nigger.
i fuck and do drugs.
tried to kill myself many times.

all 3 are fucking mary sues.
fuck capeshit, fuck disneywars and fuck that 8x3 ending!

>trained for six seasons to be an assassin
She spent one season "training" by sweeping the streets and half a season blind and failing to do a hit.

Captain Marvel is a worse case then rey....the fuck you talking about?

I feel like Mary Sue just became a cover word for sexists who are too cowardly to be openly sexist. If you don't want to be challenged you'll just say Mary Sue and have people argue with you over the definition of the word while you dogwhiste to your friends that you also hated the character.

Nothing about it is reminiscent of the original definition.

She is ne Rey, but she is a mary sue in the mcu movies. Not as her rebooted comic version, but a toned down mary sue is still a mary sue.

Correct!

3000x Yes.

Endgame really showed how pointless and unnecessary Captain Marvel really was to the whole saga. I honestly wish she wasn't introduced until phase 4.

I dont watch television or movies.

That's a load of bull. She has far more training than her and her powers are in line with the MCU standard.

Rey - beyong any hope of salvation
Marvel - you are an idiot. It's just a shit movie. Only in the end did she powered up. She's basically the most inept in her squad. Is Goku a Mary Sue? Is Superman?
Arya - Beyond any hope of salvation. She's Batman Solid Snake Super Mario Coldteel the Hedgeheg and Legolas all put into a flawless goblin.

Geez, reddit is really getting angry at these threads. I think we should keep going.

S.T.A.L.E.M.E.M.E. discuss

Im a racist and a sexist.
But Ray, Carol and Arya are Mary Sues.
Checkmate..

youtube.com/watch?v=V1ZEDNG3eAo
I wish I lived in a previous decade where you could knock some humility/sense into a bitch and nobody would look twice, all this girl power shit makes me hate women even more. I wish I was a fag, it would make things so much easier

So what are these girls flaws that make them NOT Mary Sues?

>I feel like
guess what sex wrote this post

I don't understand what you are saying. Do you mean that only sexists use Mary Sue as a term? Or do you mean sexists like to use Mary Sue as a term?

I know that I am not a sexist, but there are a lot of female characters that are horribly written, and those written to be inexplicably powerful with no depth or character development may appear to be 'Mary Sue's.

trained under him for a few weeks.
beats his apprentice.
beats him.
matches Brienne of Tarth fighting skills.
kills the night king with a simple knife trick.

Arya struggled and suffored like crazy to get to where she is
Literally the opposite of a Mary Sue

>Rey
confused, chaotic, bold, obsessed
>Carol
headstrong, emotionally stunted, egotistic, manipulable
>Arya
If I want to be entirely honest I haven't actively watched GoT since season 4 or something so I can't comment on that.

She had powers just inhibited by the chip. She's literally stronger than fucking thor scarlet witch, and thanos. If nick paige her during the first avenger the she wowouwowoulwowouwowould have won single handedly. Hell she even gave them the name avengers.

Arya isn't Mary Sue, her whole storyline has been about her learning to kill

turns out learning to kill humans is great experience for killing non-humans

Did you just have a stroke?

Thor in his prime 1 shot Thanos (but missed his head for the lethal) & Captain Marvel gets thrown into the moon by the power stone

Honestly the fat boomer Thor seems to be because they knew they made Thor way too overpowered

Especially if they were humans.
>Come on now, even I'm not dying on this hill

The second one. They like to use it as a cover word. Which means there's still a percentage of the usage that cones from genuine people. That's what makes it bad because when you attack the usage of the term the first people who come to its defense are those people, while the sexist sand in the back, but at he same time none of these people are going to police the usage of the word so a bunch of people just get away with bullshitting while spreading the general misuse and degenerating the definition of the term. Until eventually nobody remembers what the correct usage was.

Marry Kill Fuck

>Xenomoprh
>Mushroom
>Quasimodo
Modern heroines. What a time to be alive.

>She's literally stronger than fucking thor scarlet witch
>scarlet witch
Had me till then. Cool bait.

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Amen.

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Fuck Arya
Marry Rey
Kill Captain Genderstudies

the characters or the actress?

I guess Marvel counts because everyone inexplicably likes her in Endgame despite the fact that she's the least likeable person in existence. She's obviously ludicrously overpowered, that aspect of being a sue isn't even in question.

Go home Lucas, you're drunk.

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wrooooong
fuck captain toe fungus
marry rey
squash the goblina with a rolled up newspaper

I don't know the statistics on the use of the word 'Mary Sue', so I can't say who or what type of people use it the most. Regardless, just have people explain what they mean by Mary Sue and you'll know if it comes from a reasonable or logical perspective, or simply a sexist hatred.

Problem is they learned the definition and can recite it, they just don't care about applying it properly. Like someone will say that a character is loved by everyone, while in truth nobody can bear said character and she gets on everyone's nerves. Captain Marvel is a good example of that. Everyone in the show basically only tolerates her because of her powerlevel. The only time someone is shown happy that she showed up is the final battle where the cavalry is really needed.

>I like this one

This.

Batman is probably the least Gary Stu of all the superheroes. Dobson could have picked literally anyone else and been more correct, but then he wouldn't be Dobson.

Arya is justifiably one of the best killers in her world. In GOT's universe, physique, intellect, inherent talent aren't all that relevant. Jon Snow and Brienne are top tier fighters simply because that's all they did while growing up was training swordfighting. In the confines of the show, Arya's power level makes sense, as she has trained the art of killing every day. In the very first episode we see her nail a bullseye from a distance. She is then trained by the first sword of Braavos, a master swordsman. She then follows the skilled Yoren of Night's watch, and the Hound - a killer of renowned skill. She then spends years training with faceless assassins, and adapt to their skills so quickly she earns the right to leave. She then spars with Brienne, one of the greatest fighters still alive in Westeros. Arya has earned her skills through dedication, and as compensation, she's ugly and disliked by most people. Not Mary Sue.

Captain Marvel got intensely strong powers out of luck. They grant her obscene offensive powers and the strength to tank any blow inflicted on her. That being said, she inhabits a world where a metal suit can protect a human being from extreme physical trauma, and a drug or radiation blast makes you withstand extreme cosmic forces. Despite her strength and actions, she isn't revered among her peers, as her personality is too condescending and standoffish. This gives her character a flaw to build an arc on. Not Mary Sue.

Rey apparently comes from nothing, and has inherent abilities far beyond any character in her universe. Everyone she ever meets find her endearing, love her, trust her, and tries to please her. Even the villains admire her and want to claim her. Her character is based on how amazing she is, and from the moment she finds her powers, she never loses a battle or suffers any consequence. Rey is a Mary Sue.

That's not true. Captain Marvel is immediately loved and accepted. Thor likes her. Iron man likes her. Rocket gets owned by her and than respected. Rhodes gets owned by her and then respected. She is literally written to be loved by all, with Rocket and Rhodes being the only possible confrontation that is immediately squashed.

She never felt like a team member, more like the members just accepted she was there.

>female character is competent
>incel faggot: REEEE REEEE mary sue REEEEEE I'm butthurt REEEEE

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love me a good stroke post

So you're just a contrarian retard who bases his opinion on what other people on social media are saying? You're still being led by the masses, you just default go in the opposite direction.

moral of this thread: she's not a mary sue if you have actually seen the series/movie she is in

No
Rey is a mary sue

At least Rey is hot desu

Because he's a guy.

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Tell that to Zod's snapped neck

no. mary sues are successful and good at everything
rey is good at using the force but fails at most everything she does

Any time a female character does something great in a show/movie, people on Yea Forums get assblasted and call her a Mary Sue. Sometimes justified, sometimes not so much. Point is that they don't care when it's a male character. Luke Skywalker in the OT trains for a lot less than Arya did in GoT and pulled way crazier stunts than she did. Luke Skywalker has no character flaws in the OT, Arya has a-plenty.

Yet Arya is being touted as a Mary Sue because she did a thing that nobody else was able to do and people here hate when that somebody is not a guy. I hate feminism as much as the next guy, but this is just plain fucking retarded. If they would now be all like: 'WOMANS ARE STRONGGG' then, yeah, I'd hate that. But this is literally just a woman doing something that she has literally trained for for 10 seasons. If you cant even have that in shows without everyone here REEEEEEE'ing their ass off then maybe SJWs have a fucking point.

Because shooting an entire movie in a jail is boring.

>Dobson

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I agree. The episode was utter shit and the Arya was dumb ass-pull, but that's not Mary Sue at all. It's just moronic story-wise.

incels confirmed to be bing using retards

>Luke Skywalker has no character flaws in the OT
Here we go

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It makes absolute sense story-wise. Arya's storyline would otherwise be complete and utter garbage. There would be no sense to it at all, while all the other characters that had a shot at taking the Night King down have other purposes to fill.

From a storyline perspective it makes absolute sense. She also has the ability as has been shown since the literal first episode, especially against a character that she only needs to stab once.

Training with stciks and being blind for a while means she can beat trainned knights (brienne, season 7) and be a better warrior than all the professional fighters (Battle of winterfell)

Sure, totes not a mary sue

they ruined the faceless men so much.

>maybe SJWs have a fucking point.
t. SJW

Don't bother trying to argue otherwise, any tranny that uses the false "b-but luke is mary sue too!" defense is a fucking degenerate retard.

and that's a good thing.

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You are making the wrong assumptions. A lot of people don't like the Arya killing not because the character is poorly written or a Mary Sue but simply because the execution of the episode and her killing was poor and ineffective.

I have seen almost every mainstream movie that has come out for the past few years (thnx MoviePass and AMC A list) and I can unequivocally say that many films have clear and pronounced feminist narratives. It should be understandable then that many other people can also read into that as well and may draw conclusions based on the current cinematic environment.

I agree with this. As much as I actually like Arya as a character, they really overpowered her to a ridiculous level by the end.

If they wanted to go this route I think they should have done this:

They shouldnt have included the Night King knowing where Bran is at all times. Just that the Night King has a vague idea of where Bran is.
Then they should have let the NK just injure Theon.
Then when the NK is just about the kill Bran, Theon rushes the NK again. The NK easily kills Theon, but in doing so, takes his eye off Bran for a second, where it's then revealed that Bran is actually Arya and she stabs him.

You are retarded. Luke is a literal God even though he only grew up as a fucking farm boy.

>Fails miserably in every single movie
>Father kills the emperor
>Luke is a Mary Sue
Kek, stop overdosing on antidepressants, tranny.

>A lot of people don't like the Arya killing not because the character is poorly written or a Mary Sue
People in this thread are calling her a Mary Sue. That's the point of what I said. It's a retarded gripe with her character.

>and I can unequivocally say that many films have clear and pronounced feminist narratives. It should be understandable then that many other people can also read into that as well and may draw conclusions based on the current cinematic environment.
Unless there is a clear feminist agenda behind it, it's dumb to proclaim feminism is ruining your media just because a woman did something on-screen. Look, if there would be some sort of exchange like: 'No man can kill the Night King.' and she'd reply: 'But I am no man'. Then yeah, go nuts. At this point it's just a retarded criticism.

Except flying
And fighting
And all technology
And languages
And surviving alone on tat- Jakku
And porging
And learning

No idea who the lightsaber girl is but since it's Star Wars you must be right
Carol got her ass kicked by Thanos in the end and didn't save the day at all
Arya spent years training to be an assassin but since I don't watch the show she might be able to do shit she shouldn't, I dunno

>Fails miserably in every single movie
Lol, when? He literally doesn't fail a single time.

>Father kills the emperor
With the power of unconditional love and incorruptable morals from his son

>Kek, stop overdosing on antidepressants, tranny.
You sound like you're happy and fulfilled.

rae- yes
captain marvel- yes
arya- yes, but literally for that one scene, and at least there was a reason for her being able to do that, albeit a shitty one.

Episode 4, the only thing Luke does of note is destroy the death star, and only because dead Obi-Wan helps him. Episode 5, he holds his own against Vader after skipping out in the middle of training with Yoda and gets his ass beat for it. Episode 6 takes place sometime after he has finished his training with Yoda, he kills some mooks in the beginning, then barely defeats Darth Vader before getting fucked by Palpatine only for Vader to save him. How is he a god, you dumb faggot piece of shit?

lmao I forgot how dumb people on this site were

Imagine repeating a joke you’ve seen repeated hundreds of times on the internet and thinking that’s the same thing as having a sense of humor

Every other mortal also needs to be stabbed once. She could've killed Cersei, or helped kill her. Finish the list.

What the fuck will Bran do now? Jon? What will anyone do now? It was a shit move unless they do time loop magic shit and fix it.

>SEETHING incel with no arguments
you brainwashed faggots are just as bad as SJWs

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Probably you have missed two movies and an half in which he starts as an actual redneck and becomes a full fledged jedi in the last three minutes of the movie.
Me too

>best friend hated him for letting his fiance die
>reputation ruined because people thought he is a murderer after killing his friend in self defence
>get spine snapped by bane
>get stabbed in the gut by someone who he trusted
>sacrificed himself to save gotham
>mary sue
>dobson

Except that mortals in this show have survived a lot of attempts on their life. See: The Mountain. Shit this episode was full of people getting hit fucking hard without dying (immediately or at all).

The Night King literally only needs to be sliced once and it's done.

>What the fuck will Bran do now?
His purpose has been served.
>Jon?
The fucking Iron Throne?
>What will anyone do now?
Kill Cersei and then either rule or just do whatever the fuck they want? The story is over by then.

rey: literally is best at everything, never a moment of challenge, 1d character
captain marvel: loses many battles and her memories before she becomes powerful, still development.
arya: complete struggles for many season, nice development. she's the least mary sue. in fact more scenes are about her failures and losses than her success. good character.

>women aren't allowed to do anything or i'll scream "mary sue"
so she can do things? does that trigger you?
>And surviving alone on tat- Jakku
she's not even allowed to survive without you getting butthurt and crying "mary sue"?

plus all of this resulted in the resistance losing and being reduced to a handful of members, several planets being destroyed, the jedi dying out. in general, it resulted in her, and her allies LOSING

oh but she's "fighting" and "learning" what a mary sue

>Rey
Mary Sue
>Captain Marvel
Sueish tendencies but doesn't really harm Endgame. Might be full-on Sue in her own movies but if so who cares? If people want to watch that shit let them.
>Arya
no idea I dropped GoT during S5.

>first sentance when alita was literally just months ago still with generals about it.
Stfu onions filled bitch.

reminder that right-wingers are the new SJWs

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Rey, yes because she is omnidiscipline mastery with no explanation, in fact counter explanations as she doesn't receive training and she is revealed to not have special origins.
Captain Marvel, yes in the sense that all the Marvels movies are retroactively being written to have her as important and despite being the most powerful person ever, we only now are hearing about her for some reason, Thanos had more build up as the main villain than she does as this heroic savior.
Arya, this is just bad writing, not necessarily mary sue traits, just poorly executed.

Based

I'm surprised you know what sex is

Only reddit tourist here is you since you took the bait
Lurk more retard

F.U.C.K.A.N.D.S.U.C.K.

How is Arya a mary sue? She had an actual development to get where she is. The other two are terrible Mary Sues tho

Movies with clear feminist narratives:

Ghostbusters 2016
Wrinkle in Time
Incredibles 2
Alice Through the Looking Glass
The Nutcracker and the Four Realms
Dumbo
Widows
Annihilation
Ocean's 8
Mortal Engines

(these are only the most blatant from the past few years)

stop being sexists anons

>twitter.com/AmandaMarcotte/status/1122963350026170368

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The problem isn't feminist narratives, its movies (or entertainment as a whole) now and days being just mostly bad and Hollywood marketers gaming the system. If Jackie Brown came out today, most people would love it because it's a good movie; barring contrarian fags here who shit on Fury Road and what not.
The problem is using feminist narratives not only as marketing tool, but as an excuse for not being a good movie. Just look at the Ghostbusters fiasco where dissent / criticism = "you're an incel and racist go back to your basement"

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>Any time a female character does something great in a show/movie
Nope. Wanda has a great moment in Endgame and nobody complains about it. Because she's a good character and that's a good scene.

Wanda appears in front of Thanos in dramatic fashion. With her voice full of controlled rage, she says "you've taken from me, everything" her eyes blaze and she proceeds to fuck up Thanos shit so hard he has to order his ship to rain fire on the entire battlefield hitting their own troops just to stop her. And she breaks his weapon.

People like that because Wanda is a real character that people have seen suffer and struggle. They are excited for her to finally have a moment to unleash her full power and get her vengeance.

You wouldn't understand because you are a complete fucking retard.

kys

>A Mary Sue is someone without character flaws
>Having a tragic past and being sarcastic and emotionally damaged somehow make someone not a Mary Sue.

Nigga that's literally the fucking defining characteristic. A Mary Sue isn't someone who's damaged or had a tragic past with stories of "going through struggles", it's someone who always comes out of every situation better than they started regardless of the obstacles or challenges because s/he is never inconvenienced or challenged or forced to sacrifice anything to succeed because they're handed success by the writer where everyone else either fails or can't measure up, or even worse never actually tries.

>Mortal Engines
I'm still mad because the books were pretty much the exact opposite.

Arya had a lot of development leading up to that moment. She's not a Mary Sue.

This, the whole point of the faceless men is that they have no identity. Arya could either choose to let go of her revenge/identity and lose out on the training, or become a FM and lose her revenge/identity. Instead, she says fuck it and kills a FM and not only keeps her revenge/identity but also her training and becomes a FM. There were no consequences AT ALL to her choice. She gets to keep being a FM and her revenge/identity. Then she comes back to Westeros and is now the best fighter on the planet because I guess the FM also kill their targets by cutting down their targets through brute force.

You hit the nail on the head. I haven't heard anyone complain about Wanda, Pepper finally accepting the iron suit, Black Widow, or any other female characters. It really is only Captain Marvel, and there is good reason for it.

Yes yes no

Episode 3 was shit and Arya killing NK made no sense though

lose weight

Not OP, but all three were obvious and extremely blatant Mary Sues. Not only was Captain Marvel a shining example of everything you can do wrong with a superhero movie, but it was possibly the most heavily shilled property ever to grace Yea Forums, and we have entire containment boards just for people who shill Pokemon weeaboo shit or Ponyfag discussions.

It was blown WAY out of proportion for a single movie and to this day, idiots use it for the "Have sex incel" argument.

>Nope. Wanda has a great moment in Endgame and nobody complains about it. Because she's a good character and that's a good scene.
Doesn't count. It's not pivotal to the story because she isn't the one ending Thanos. If she would have ended Thanos right then and there, then you'd have a point.

Let me help you with that. If a female lead doesn't have to struggle at any point in the series, can do everything by herself, everyone loves her and basically the entire movie is a female empowerment fantasy complete with stronk wymin who don't need no man, it's a Mary Sue. That's what it means.

Moron. She isn't saying that Arya isn't a Mary Sue because she has a tragic past. She is saying Arya isn't a Mary Sue because she has a lot of character flaws (such as being cold-blooded) that make her unlikeable to many of her peers and to the viewer.

This

Nobody complains about Wanda, Pepper, Black Widow or Captain Marvel in Endgame because none of them are the one to save the day. That was Iron Man. If it would have been Captain Marvel or Black Widow people would have complained.

The entire point of Supes' character is that he's a Marty Stu brought down by the struggles of everyday people. Physically, he can do everything perfectly. Outside of that, he's an immigrant from another planet struggling with identity, belonging, and all sorts of interpersonal shit that normal people have no problem with. He was meant to relate to normal people with normal problems in a strange way, because those are the only kinds of problems he can have.

Also, it doesn't count unless its a woman. Any male character is going to have to struggle by default, only a woman is going to get a free ride in hollywood.

you literally don't know what that term means

Based Brie giving incels strokes

If we were going with realism here, she would have trained for two months, broken a hip, decided it was too difficult and then whined and complained until someone sent her home. Nothing and nobody can change this fact.

That being the case, six seasons of Le Evil Assassin Training Maymay is absolutely Mary Suedom.

I don't buy this at all. People who use the term "Mary Sue" simply want characters to struggle in a meaningful, human way.

In the real world, we all have to work for everything we have. Nothing is given to us - not social status, not advancement, and not magical superpowers. We have to fight tooth and nail to get where we are, and people expect that struggle in forms of media. Its one of the most basic parts of the human condition, all of our stories, even the oldest stories in history, are full of people struggling to triumph.

None of these three characters have ever struggled to do a damn thing since their inception. They perform feats well outside what is possible, everyone loves them, and they go through entire movies without being reminded a single time that life is cruel and you don't always get what you want. People fail sometimes, but they don't. That's why they're Mary Sues.

You, sir, are absolutely full of shit. Did you even watch this movie?

Rey - yep.
Cpt marvel - no idea, haven't seen her movie
Arya - I'm pretty sure she dies this season

here's a "redpill" for you incels: there's nothing inherently wrong with being a Social Justice Warrior
you've just been brainwashed into thinking there is

can someone explain the mary sue meme to me? i dont get it

Are Mary Sues inherently bad though?
Why wouldn't they fit certain situation? Not every character has to be complex and deep to be fun.

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characters with shit writing mostly used for the purpose to shoehorn self inserts, propaganda or diversity quotas.

>there's nothing wrong with fighting an invisible non-existent battle based on the insecurities of women and blacks
yikes

i've only watched season 8 of GoT (gf making me watch) but it seems like that chick actually was developed based on what i've read. cm and rey for sure though were just thrown in and given power status out of nowhere.

Rey is a very poor expy of Luke.

When Luke meets 3PO and R2, R2 runs away and takes a bit to warm up to him. BB-8 instantly loves Rey and thinks she’s the bees knees.

Luke is given his father’s weapon from his father’s mentor, Rey is given it just because.

When Han and Luke rescue Leia, she is initially wary of wanting to go with them. Everyone who meets Rey falls in love with her or wants to sacrifice everything for her.

Luke gets his ass handed to him in ESB because he didn’t listen to Yoda and engaged Vader before his training was complete. Rey beats a fully trained jedi/sith without ever having swung a lightsaber around.

Luke downs the Death Star after having multiple characters talk about his piloting skills, and he still needed help from Han to do it. Rey instantly knows how to fix the Falcon better than Han and Chewie while is able to blast down people effortlessly despite it being her first time manning a turret because she collected junk.

It took Luke until the second movie with lots of training with Yoda to barely stack some rocks. Rey uses a Jedi mind trick out of thin air with no training.

>No, whole seasons of the show are about her gaining her powers.
Yeah, man. Her begging and cleaning and doing literally nothing fighting related for 6 season definitely set her up to be the best fighter in Westeros, able to fight off 10 Wights at once, spar Brienne, while parrying her fucking broadsword with a god damn rapier, and then almost beating her, and of course also being completely silent and just teleport behind the Night King. Uh-huh.

>In the end
>They were all just poorly written
>Most likely due to too much female input
*Dab*

jk rowling is one of the best writers.
its not a female thing its just shit no talent writers

>jk rowling
"No!"

>But rey is literally just an expy of luke.
rey still got her limbs on. nobody knows who her parents were. luke's parents both died and the people that raised him were burned to a crisp in front of him
>captain marvel is an expy of thor,
thor was rejected by his own people and werent considered worthy to wield his hammer in his first movie

Have you read anything else she wrote its bad and jk wrote fantastic beast and it suck.Harry potter was a fluke.

People bitch about Supes all the time, snyder decides to make him a human fuck up with commitment issues and folks want to go back to bland perfection.

she wrote harry potter. a muggle bastard which both his parents killed by voldemort and was raised in the shittiest upbringing in tower hamlets then he got into hogwarts where he made shitloads of close friends only to lose them one by one later by the same people who killed his parents

confused is just temporary state
chaotic this is a trait spider man has it and is not his flaw
bold dude that is a virtue
obsessed ye it is a flaw but she is obsessed in what exactly ?
carol headstrong when? egoistic ? she literally helping galaxies just because.
manipulable everyone can be manipulate.
i dont watch GOT

>harry potter
>muggle
yikes

Rey is textbook mary sue.
Captain Marvel was a mary sue in her own movie but she's just a plot device in Endgame.
Arya doesn't have a story for the last two seasons and also became a plot device, but she wasn't really a mary sue beforehand.

Rey is cute

i wish it somehow came down to

Edd, Jon, Tormund, and Sam as the last line of defense for Bran. this has been their fight all along and Edd deserved a better death. The nights watch deserves better bros

>and that OTHER time she teleported behind a superhuman lich-lord and killed him with a cheap knife trick.
But but but....
She sit and begged for coins while blind.
And, she once chased cats.

In your mind, what is the relationship between having sex and enjoying shitty entertainment?

I dont think arya is a mary sue.
Id say she wasnt the most satisfying person to kill NK but she also wasnt the worst.
My issue with it is that the NK was built up to be the biggest evil in the land and then arya kills him with "up high, down low, TOO SLOW! XD"
It felt WAY too easy considering how big he was built up to be

Nobody who actually paid attention to comics liked superman, he's considered boring as fuck specifically because he's a male mary sue. This is why DC specifically tried to make him darker psychologically to provoke some interest in his character which backfired horribly because normies want everything black and white in their capeshit.

and cis dont forget

Thanks disgusting Hollywood rapist men

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Batman is a highly functional psychotic and a large percentage of the DC universe dislikes him. The fact that he's rich, a genius, and capable of attaining such a high physical capability is a little gary stu-ish, but it's balanced out by his portrayal as an obsessive autist who is unable to truly engage in any other aspect of his life.

also comics are full of rich and fit geniuses

>sike just kidding, it's actually midichlorians

I.N.C.E.L
Discuss

have sex

kill your sjw fag you hero is a mary sue and brie will die alone

rent free

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>gets capture and has a dream of failure in your path

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sex free

Arya didn't start off as a Mary Sue, but D&D made sure that she became one. She is smug and arrogant, a master at combat for no fucking reason and a master assassin despite not even finishing her Faceless Man training. She can be stabbed several times in the gut and still run a marathon afterwards. She can fight Brienne to a draw despite the decades of experience that the latter has. She destroys a 100,000 zombie army by killing The Night King, who is the 10,000-year-old embodiment of death (LOL DEATH NOT TODAY XD!), the very first time she encounters him.

Does Arya have any noticeable flaws? It doesn't seem like it. Her psychopathy has only benefited her so far.

fuck off jewish shill.

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This. Fuck all these incels talking about capeshit 24/7 you are all fucking plebs

"A Mary Sue is an idealized and seemingly perfect fictional character. Often, this character is recognized as an author insert or wish fulfillment. They can usually perform better at tasks than should be possible given the amount of training or experience, and usually are able through some means to upstage the main protagonist of an established fictional setting, such as by saving the hero."

Mary Sue does not mean "having skills out of nowhere". The fact that she trained in Braavos does not make her automatically a non-Mary Sue.

Witnessed

Daisy is cute and pretty awesome tho

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he had way more time adapting his powers in earth's environment tho

Marvel wasn't a sue in endgame.
>movie doesn't try to make her seem liked/beloved by most of the cast
>doesn't get much screentime
>tries to defeat thanos in single combat (like cap and Tony and Thor also tried to do) but fails
>shows up at the end out of respect, but stays out of the way at the back because she didn't have the emotional attachment everyone else did

Haven't watched her solo movie, maybe she's worse in that but she was fine in endgame.

How are they making money out of me pirating this stuff?

I thought the whole anti-piracy argument was that it hurts the producers or whatever.

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DAMN
UNDERRATED AF

no and no you are both subhuman

okay now THIS is epic

>People who use the term "Mary Sue" simply want characters to struggle in a meaningful, human way.
true, although I'd say more accurately that they want the characters to struggle in a meaningful human way when that's what the story seems like it should be about. A key aspect of the Sue is that they seem intended for the audience to identify them as a true human hero, despite their not having earned it. A character like James Bond isn't necessarily meant to be viewed like an archetypal hero.

Well no shit they would have complained, Tony has been the main protagonist for all the Avengers movies.

Plus this was set up in Infinity War. Strange gives the Time Stone to Thanos specifically to save Tony. This is obviously signaling that Stark will be the key to victory. That's what that last look between the two of them was on the battlefield. Strange held up his finger "one" to say "yes, there's one and only victory outcome, you know what you have to do."
>Doesn't count.
Yes it does. Captain Marvel doesn't beat him either. Seriously just stop you're embarrassing yourself.

the Hunchback had to train to get her japanese anime powers
shes not a mary sue

>week to kriptonite
>week to magic
>week to sharp bones
>week to brute force
>cant save everybody
>has character flaws
>has doubts and people dont love him by default

Trained to jump 10 ft vertically?

Chekt kekt and rekt

asians dislike brown people almost as much as they hate other asians

It lost meaning because its now the standard for female heroes

Captain Marvel is just boring. She isn't particularly special, unlike Rey. They had enough sense to not go with her new comic backstory, she is just someone that was at the right place at the right time.

Post gary stus to prove youre point. a character with no arc and muh abilities is shit no matter which of the 63 genders they are

it depends on the type of movie. John Wick doesn't need a character arc.

cause it's all written and produced by white dudes that don't want to step on anyone's toes and lose their job by potentially giving women character flaws.

This leads to boring, condescending characters that no one wants to watch.

Especially in Endgame

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it's still a useful shorthand term to use among people who aren't blithering idiots.

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Snyder's Man of Steel is the exact opposite, dipshit.

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Filesize test

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Imagine still getting mad at it tho.

t. incel

This shit gets worse every time I watch it

YAAAAS

Embarrassing.

The only one I've watched is TFA and I can definitely say she's a Mary Sue. Excels at everything. Loved by everyone. I don't see how anyone can defend that she's a goodly-written character.

>THIS is a 10/10 Aryan specimen according to white people

I just rewatched this scene, Wasp is indeed working in the van with Scott.
Imagine placing politics over continuity.

The battlefield being smol as fuck is disturbing. Tony, who's next to Thanos, who's next to the time machine in the middle of the field, can clearly see Strange who's holding back the flood at the border.

>Rey
pull her powers out of her ass and have almost zero character development.
100% marysue
>CM
i dont know i didnt watched the movie.

Arya
>Trained for years with the god of death and then rebel against them to keep her identity. Later goes back home and sneak attack the villain.
2% marysue tops.

lmao at seething incels. Have sex.

I've noticed this too but was more concerned about what Mantis is going to do in open combat against I doubt even sentient beings.

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Bend over

if anything jon snow is like rey skywalker. learns how to fly a dragon in like five seconds because he just does. a lot like the complaints on here about rey's piloting. like rey he's the chosen one because of some secret parentage (that is guaranteed to be the reveal in rise of skywalker). at least arya's abilities are earned, even if that learning process isn't shown particularly well it actually fucking exists in the writing

jon made a terrible battle plan, just like he did in the battle of the bastards before sansa saved him. plus he'd already shown his hand twice beyond the wall to the night king, who wasn't ever going to put himself in a 1v1 situation with someone he knew had valyrian steel. he's also a terrible fucking leader who got killed by his own men and is shown to never learn from his mistakes. the only reason arya was able to kill him is because unlike jon, and the dragons, the night king had no idea she exists

Holy based batman

JON IS THE BIGGEST MARY SUE

ANAKIN IS THE BIGGEST MARY SUE

IRON MAN IS THE BIGGEST MARY SUE

If Rey is a Skywalker, then I'll forgive her for being the Mary Sue type.

AND THAT:S A GOOD THING

>I just rewatched this scene, Wasp is indeed working in the van with Scott.
Bravo Russos

I think being on Yea Forums has given me brain damage because now I love these retarded shit bait threads and all the retarded posts in them.

Since this is getting out of hand, here's the handy guide for a Mary Sue. The pic lacks one thing
>None of the three ever experiences a crushing visual defeat for all audiences to see, the plot will always find a way to bail her out
Pointless to say, all three fits.

Attached: mary sue 3.png (397x790, 458K)

mary sue wasn't invented until like 50 years after superman was

he did blow up the death star with no targeting computer.. not a complete failure

fuck/kill captain marvel is the same level for my but I really don't want to have to fuck goblina

you can see her in one shot putting something to sleep, it's pretty cheesy. also her eye stalks can now shoot lasers

I agree
Rey is cute
Fungus is insufferable
Arya is tight as hell

idaf this is sexy as hell

Arya isn't a Mary Sue, the Night King is weak as fuck.

Mary Sue must be a character that's being introduced into already existing group of characters, right? So Rey and Fungus fit in there but Arya doesn't.

capeshit heroes in general are mary sues

based cuppa poster

Attached: download.png (212x200, 6K)

he literally is, they had to make him not perfect and immortal to make his character interesting.

>Dumbo
You're fucking me
I didn't bother with it, how

>his moral character that he never breaks is exactly why he never truly defeats the joker
>also constantly gets him into dilemmas and indirectly gets more people killed
>not anywhere close to the strongest DCU hero
then again
>expecting logic from inflation bear
not being a mary sue doesnt mean getting your shit kicked in constantly like mumen rider.

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>The White Cliffs of Dover

>its about women its a clear feminist statement!

Why do people like Scarlet Witch again? She's literally the most boring ass character in the entire movie. She's just waddling around with her hands and then magic shit happens. Wow. She's like a female Dr. Strange but with 0 charisma. Fuck, she doesn't even look hot.

Why don't they smile?

...

fpbp

OP btfo

Arya isnt a Mary Sue given the fact you actually see her go through being repeatedly beaten during her training. I hate Rey and Marvel as much as the next logical person, but say what you want about the GoT finale... compared to the other two, a Mary Sue Arya is not.

BASED
Unironically though arya isn't a mary sue, her last few seasons have been shit but she actually trained and struggled

Based and redpilled

Arya is the least mary-sue of those 3, if any at all.