Last episode was retarded

I don't see the problem.

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You could have used Warhammer, at least they have actual zombies.

>Use seige weapons until you can't (and they should fire flaming boulders)
Wasn't there a time and ressource limitation?

>Horses should run in circles around the castle, like a giant sawblade.
Wouldn't they just get buttfucked at some point?
This would work if the undead weren't constantly moving towards the target.

>caltrops of dragon glass (pic related)
Oh I see what you mean, then you'd just have to push them and make them fall.

>soldiers should swallow a diluted liquid mixture of dragon glass
Holy shit this would have been great, powdered dragon glass in the water.

>multiple pits and stoppage points (far enough away from the castle for seige weapons), then later dragon fire
Exactly this.

>needed burning oil for the walls (even if they don't kill the dead, it would make it slippery)
The climate is pretty rough wouldn't the oil just freeze but yeah they used some on the trenches and it didn't freeze so this could work too.

Don't forget to leave a few archers to protect the three eyed raven too.

They stuck dragonglass all over the merlons on the wall, but didn't put any on the crenels because they're retarded.

Also they should have had pots of oil/pitch to dump over the walls and set on fire.

Honestly, mostly the same as original plan, just not retarded.

1) Keep as many people inside Winterfell's walls as possible, absolutely the artillery and the archers, have them constantly shooting into horde, don't stop.
2) No Dothraki suicide charge at all; either keep those guys on the flanks waiting to charge to mop up, kite as horse archers, or dismount entirely and have them on the walls.
3) Anyone who can't fit in castle goes on ground, with fire trench IN FRONT OF THEM to blunt zombie charge. Unsullied phalanxes especially would be useful for plugging gaps
4) Trench should have been bigger. ~30 yards wide, 5-10 yards deep, lined with dragonglass spikes, so zombies couldn't just do what they actually did
5) Dragons prowl for Viserion, try to ground him and NK, then does strafing runs when opportunity presents itself.
6) All best fighters, armed with valyrian steel and dragonglass, hiding in godswood, waiting to ambush NK and his WW dudes. Coulda been an epic battle between all the mains (Jaime, Podrick, Hound, Arya, Jon, Jorah, etc) and the WWs themselves, but they fucking wasted that opportunity.

>army of undead

Didn't we already see this in LoTR?

All this about bigger or more trenches would be limited by the time and manpower available before the fight desu

just sent in arya
then she can go to kings landing and kill everyone else
ez

Yes you're right but that's not the only problem we have about this whole battle.
The undead army grows with every victim.
The main objective of the heroes was to avoid direct confrontation as much as possible.
What did they do? They did exactly that, direct confrontation.
Even worse, danny landed fucking her fucking dragon all of a sudden on the fucking ground for 20 minutes like a retard (and he got almost fucked)

>white walkers are a metaphor for ecological change, one that requires the people of westeros to completely revise their entire way of life
>they just beat them in a big battle and then go back to their petty bullshit
God, GoT really started to go off the rails after S3 but this is a new narrative low

They had thousands and thousands of Unsullied and Dothraki. They could't dig a bigger fucking trench in a day?

1. Use Bran to warg ravens to find location of white walkers and NK. Presumably Bran doesn't find the night king since he will already be high in the air at this point so instead bran's raven will locate the white walkers.
2. send crack team of bloodriders and knight cavalry with strongest dudes guided by Bran warging a horse to flank or circle around the undead army and try and attack the white walkers which is where they think the night king will be. After positioning the cavalry as an ambush, Bran leaves them then wargs Jon and Dany on dragons to their location by having them follow a raven or by warging one of their dragons. The castle would be set on defense while Dany and Jon tried to destroy the white walkers and the cavalry would be there as back up. This would be the strategy I'd use.
2. don't use fucking trebuchets. TRebuchets are for destroying fucking buildings, not for firing at infantry. Why the fuck would winterfell have a dozen trebuchets, something used for attacking other castles, but no other ballistics? Ideally I'd have time to have dug more trenches and built more palisade walls and not meet them on open battlefield at all, simply tried to defend from behind palisade while firing flaming projectiles with mangonels to hopefullt thin numbers until we need to retreat back to castle
3. Don't defend castle walls with fucking swords. use dragonglass spears to stab and kill and topple over undead trying to climb the walls before you're in range of their swords. This would have made wall defence much more effective and held out much longer
4. prepare bonfires very close to the outside edge of castle walls so that undead would have to put them out or smother them before climbing

Would've given each man a small shard of dragonglass with explicit orders to jam it into their arm if they feel they are about to die to prevent them from being turned after the fact

Yeah, they where pretty dumb and a lot could have been done differently, but I don't know if avoiding direct confrontation would really be possible.

The undead army doesn't need anything in the way of supplies and has absolutely every advantage in a game of waiting them out. The human army could have have tried to use maneuvering to avoid unfavorable engagements, but would eventually tire. They could have waited for the undead to attack them in a favorable defensive position, but they would eventually starve. They could attack the undead to press the issue now, but they would lose and it would not offset the undead's gains when they go on to ravage the countryside.

The situation was frankly unwinnable and the only reason they could have been victorious is the Night King being tricked into the open. I just wish it was more a clever trick than it was just the Night King doing something stupid like showing up personally before the battle is over.

>not using dragon glass buttplugs.

Have fun fucking up your battlefield squats retard.

I'd put dragonglass traps in the godswood

Agreed, if the next three episodes are just more realm politics as usual, then it's pretty fucking bleak. Nobody seems to have learned anything about cooperation and blood feuding, it's shitty and depressing.

What else would you have them do? Cavalry are meant to charge ahead into battle to weaken the front lines. Sure, this strategy does dick all to a tsunami of insensate drones, but they wouldnt have done much if they waited for the dead to charge either

The dothraki did the only thing they know how to do. Turns out theyre completely useless in a battle like this

why do they only have one fire trench? Why not make a few more lines of fire?

That's not at all what cavalry are meant for.

I wouldn't have had them on horses at all. They can fight just as well on foot. Put some of them in the castle grounds and some ahead of the unsullied.

Throughout the entire show the army size fuckery has possibly never been as bad as this episode. There should have been:
>10s of thousands of Dothraki (the # 100000 is used at least once in the earlier seasons)
>5-10k unsullied
>few thousand vale troops
>few thousand northerners

But from the battle it looks like they have no more than a couple thousand troops total. even worse is when they retreat inside the castle and you can clearly see hundreds pour in, yet later it looks like the entire fucking castle is manned by like 50 people. It’s insane

>Cavalry are meant to charge ahead into battle to weaken the front lines.
Wrong, ranged fire is meant to weaken, cavalry is meant to mop up/break by charging flank/rear. Charging a full strength enemy, head on, is highly lethal typically to the charging cav. Cav is usually expensive to field, so few commanders would be willing to risk such costly fighters on a reckless head-on charge.

>>Use seige weapons until you can't (and they should fire flaming boulders)
yes except trebuches are the wrong siege weapons to be using, too long range . they should have been using shorter range catapults and onager/mangonels or even ballista to try and thin numbers .
>>caltrops of dragon glass (pic related)
this is a pretty good idea
>>soldiers should swallow a diluted liquid mixture of dragon glass
I don't think it's soluble and I doubt it would work with a little bit of ground up powder in your tummy. Although it is a thought depending on how toxic dragonglas is to undead. if any presence of dragonglass disrupts the NK reanimation spell then yeah that would work and they should have just just dipped their normal weapons into glue then into ground up dragonglass to get a coating of sharp dragonglass flakes without the need to smith a bunch of dragonglass weapons.
>>multiple pits and stoppage points (far enough away from the castle for seige weapons), then later dragon fire
I'd say that there might not be time but given they had time to forge thousands of dragon-glass weapons without that many smiths, yeah.
>>needed burning oil for the walls (even if they don't kill the dead, it would make it slippery)
yeah. Also use spears to defend the walls to topple over people before they get within range of you. the undead seemingly have no engineering and seemingly no archers so it would be possible to defend the walls almost indefinitely if the defenders had spears. and were disciplined soldiers like the unsullied.

>What would you have done Yea Forums?

Make them wear helmets and give them armor that isn't penetrated by rusted out spoons.

>cavalry are meant to charge ahead into battle to weaken the front lines
>what is flanking?
The unsullied should've been behind a much deeper/wider flaming trench with their long spears. The majority of the army should've been archers on the walls. Trebuchets and catapults should've been behind the trenches and going nonstop. Cavalry should've harassed the sides and the rear and continued pressing them into the fire/dragonglass tenches and the unsullied with dragonglass spears. Why the fuck would you just zerg rush your entire cavalry straight into an enemy who massively outnumbers you and cannot be demoralized because they're mindless zombies?

Why was artillery in front of the Unsullied?

Why are they standing in front of the trench instead of behind it? Why did they only dig one trench?

Why did they charge one unit of their army instead of all at once?

How did Arya get so close to the Night King?

Why did no one realize that the corpses in the crypt were going to come alive when they know that their enemy has the ability to animate the dead?

Same thing really, although light cavalry like dothraki is supposed to be shock troops, even if shock element doesn't work on the dead they still should've kept the whole bite the enemy force then disengage tactic, they weren't supposed to skirmish in the midle of the enemy formation, that was just retarded, but I guess they needed to get rid of dothraki for plot reasons, otherwise you'd have to deal with the whole "what are dothraki supposed to do after the war" thing.

>Wasn't there a time and ressource limitation?
Considering they had time to forge thousands of dragonglass spears, dragonglass swords, dragonglass axes, dragonglass arrowheads without that many smiths working, they should have had several days to prepare. They should have atleast placed the catapults in more defensible positions behind trenches and palisade. These are siege weaponse which winterfell ought to have in stock already.

>The climate is pretty rough wouldn't the oil just freeze
You're right but you could heat the oil in cauldrons so that it would vapourise and be nice and flammable then pour it over the undead towers and light it.

>Cavalry are meant to charge ahead into battle to weaken the front lines.
user no.
You let the cavalry charge from the sides or from behind into the enemy lines when the enemy is already occupied with your footsoldiers. And immediately after the charge when the damage has been done you pull the cavalry out. This is just one technique or method using cavalry.
Biggest mistake would be to lose the cavalry at the begining of the battle (or be the first side to lose its cavalry).
Besides, the NK can revive fucking horses. Why would you give horses to the enemy?

Like many anons have pointed out, the cavalry shouldn't have been used. Dothrakis would have been more useful on foot.

>they should have just just dipped their normal weapons into glue then into ground up dragonglass to get a coating of sharp dragonglass flakes without the need to smith a bunch of dragonglass weapons.

Nice, don't know if they had access to glue though. And now that I'm thinking about it.

>make as many arrows as possible
>make it so the arrow's pointy tip isn't entirely made of dragon glass

This would have worked so much better but I don't know if there is a restriction on the composition of the weapon. Does it still work if it's not entirely dragon glass?

I was thinking that the corpses in the crypt would come alive but not be able to smash through the stone sarcophagi and just kind of do some scary banging.

Stand by your wall and defense with archery support. Similar to this battle when they were out number 1 to 3

youtu.be/NEDWpbmFY6o

Get Tyrion and Davos to smuggle as much wildfire from KL as possible and bring it north.

Fire that from the trebuchets.

Don't send in a fucking cavalry charge alone as my first move.

>Mongolboo
fuck off already

>cavalry on the flanks further back unseen but still in front of trenches
>trebuchets behind trenches or in city constantly firing
>cavalry don't charge out like retards
>archers on the walls constantly firing
>once undead break the lines and they fall back to the trench light them
>lighting of the trench triggers the cavalry who come around the back and hit them from the rear
Probably would have ended the same with the dragon destroying the wall and everything being overrun but at least it'd look more correct instead of a clusterfuck of visual shit that a commander with the brain of a pea would do

If you know that people are useless , you don't send them out to die because that will just ruin the morale of the rest of your men. A cavalry charge should never have happened. Either instruct them to harrass safely or send them on a specific mission e.g. to white walker location (which bran should have been able to see with a raven and which he should be able to guide them to) or don't have cavlary on the field at all.

>dig one trench
>zombies build a corpse bridge over it
>dig 12 giant trenches
>zombies build 12 giant corpse bridges, one for each
>all your soldiers' arms and legs are shot before the final battle from the effort of digging through the hard, frozen ground

Also, that trench already literally failed twice in the episode. First it failed to ignite according to plan, then it failed to stop the undead wholesale.

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dragons were the only advantage of the living, they needed to focus everything around the dragons to win without killing the night king
the most effective defense would have been trenches, fire and earth walls funneling the dead into two giant corridors that the dragons shoot fire directly down like machine gun nests
the dragons would not fly but be sitting behind stone defenses the ice javelins could not penetrate
this forces the night king to either retreat or use his dragon to destroy those defences, every living soldier would be manning ballista and trebuchets waiting for the dragon to approach and they would all open fire on command killing the dragon and grounding the night king
once they know his location the living dragons would take to the air and form a fire perimeter around the night king killing any dead coming to defend him while the unsullied form a proper pike formation and march toward him with the cavalry defending their flanks, a pike phalanx is unstoppable if the enemy has no projectiles, they would reach the night king easily and without any casualties

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Why didn't they just use the dragons to light the entire field on fire. That's the most retarded part. You're fighting an enemy which is weak to fire and you have these stupid giant lizards that do nothing but spit fire yet they're just flying around doing absolutely fucking nothing for half an hour. The dragons should have been doing circles around the army thinning their ranks and dividing them. If you run into the other dragon you retreat and try to lure it back to a spot where you set up a ballista.

>use dragons
>NK snipes one of them again
>use other dragon
>NK snipes it
>yfw you gave everything to the NK

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>Cavalry are meant to charge ahead into battle to weaken the front lines
I literally cannot have enough sex to get over how fucking stupid this post is

Spinning is a neat trick after all!

what pissed me most was the fact that there was not a plan to deal with dragons on either side.

There was no reason in both armies to engage if a dragon has not been dealth with. The risks were huge.
sending a cavalry without air support is 100% suicide, even if they could damage the front lines of the dead.