Why is the Normandy scene in Saving Private Ryan so iconic?

sneed

This

Utah beach was kinda hard too 2bh

If i were a vet, id get so fucking tired of being thanked by young idiots. I wonder how they really feel about it, they tolerate it because its out of a good will i guess

True, but that was also covered by US troops. The canucks and teebs literally just walked up their respective beaches, for the most part

MOOOOOOM

There are no doubt vets like this but there are also drama queens that get offended if you dont thank them, then it's a scandal

Sneed Day

Revisionists gtfo.

buttmad euros out, the only thing you guys did was fuck up market garden

America was effectively in the war on the Allies' side long before the formal declaration of war

Americans need to be able to see these things.

Providing material aid is not the equivalent to acts of war

And protecting convoys which meant engaging German forces

MR. CHARGE D'AFFAIRES:

The Government of the United States having violated in the most flagrant manner and in ever increasing measure all rules of neutrality in favor of the adversaries of Germany and having continually been guilty of the most severe provocations toward Germany ever since the outbreak of the European war, provoked by the British declaration of war against Germany on September 3, 1939, has finally resorted to open military acts of aggression.

On September 11, 1941, the President of the United States publicly declared that he had ordered the American Navy and Air Force to shoot on sight at any German war vessel. In his speech of October 27, 1941, he once more expressly affirmed that this order was in force. Acting under this order, vessels of the American Navy, since early September 1941, have systematically attacked German naval forces. Thus, American destroyers, as for instance the Greer, the Kearney and the Reuben James, have opened fire on German submarines according to plan. The Secretary of the American Navy, Mr. Knox, himself confirmed that-American destroyers attacked German submarines.

Furthermore, the naval forces of the United States, under order of their Government and contrary to international law have treated and seized German merchant vessels on the high seas as enemy ships.

my grandpa walked outta saving private ryan

>On September 11, 1941, the President of the United States publicly declared that he had ordered the American Navy and Air Force to shoot on sight at any German war vessel.
source?

Why?

because the movie had ended

Attached: tenor.gif?itemid=12699075.gif (498x359, 408K)

Juno and Gold both saw heavy resistance. Juno's first wave experienced ~50% casualties.

Because americans spent a shit-ton of money to make a movie about how important it was for them to join the war that already was won in 1944

>heavy resistance
>got fucked by two understrength battalions
pick one, dogfucker.

Is it true that theaters had to buy poop shovels to clean the aisles out after the vets were done watching?

I was an usher at the time, it's true. I saluted every poop on the floor after they made their early exits.

Die.

>Why is the Normandy scene in Saving Private Ryan so iconic?

Mostly because of the cinematography (simulating ww2 combat footage) and the graphic depictions of sudden death during war. Also the sound design played no small part in the experience of that scene.

We'd seen several DDay movies long before that, but none quite like that.

Because it's a fundamental pylon of American military history which, because of some mistakes in the photographic process of the only American photojournalist on the beach that morning, has extremely rare photographic documentation.

Most Americans consider the Normandy scenes to be the most accurate portrayal of D-Day mostly because we don't have much concrete information of what it actually looked like

Department of State Bulletin, December 13, 1941.

avalon.law.yale.edu/wwii/gerdec41.asp

That’s the German declaration of war on America I’m asking for a source on their claim within their declaration that America was shooting German vessels on sight.

Just telling people that there were once army men who charged into machine gun fire is pretty crazy. Being able to capture it with incredible cinematography and sound design only makes it better.

Shit like this is prime cinematic goodness.

It may seem like a brainlet question but why weren’t the Germans capable of shooting down every soldier that landed? It seemed like shooting fish in a barrel. Is it just a matter of flooding the beach with infantry until they can’t keep up?

glad to know these men died so that job less doomers can walk around at night while listening to the smiths

It was a pivot point in history, after D Day everything has slowly went to shit.

They did what they did because it their duty. What happened after is irrelevant

It's not even a matter of contention that the Kearney engaged German U-boats without being attacked itself, it was protecting British ships. The Greer and Thompson are "he said / she said" situations

Not him but it checks out.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Greer_(DD-145)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Kearny_(DD-432)
youtube.com/watch?v=DHiirBXfwn4
youtube.com/watch?v=jU6Pf-KrlBU

Pretty much, the vessels the allies arrived in only has the door opening in front and when it opened they were fish in a barrel.
The only way you could possibly survive was pushing forward up the beach.
The D day invasion was quite sadistic in that regard.

thanks user this is interesting stuff

>The "Greer incident" occurred 4 September. By all accounts, a German submarine (later identified as U-652) fired upon the Greer, but made no contact. When news of the encounter reached the United States, public concern ran high. Initial reports reported that a British aircraft aided in repelling the attack.

It seemed like the Germans fired first. This incident was in September and the Kearny incident was in October so I can see why America took a bit more of an aggressive stance.

A lot of the men defending the beaches were poorly trained Polish conscripts, because Germany fucked up and thought the Allies would try to penetrate another stretch of beach due to effective counter-intelligence and general fog of war.

By the time the paratroopers were hitting the soil, there were thousands of boots in the sand, supported by mech and heavy armor that basically made Normandy a stomp. You have to remember that D-Day wasn't JUST infantry, there were also lots of armor to supplement them; the commanding forces weren't stupid, they optimized their units with combined arms tactics.

Also, actually shooting something is pretty difficult. If the beaches and the pillboxes were separated, 300 meters apart, that's pretty much bordering on the effective range of most modern day rifles in the real world, and that's with steady breathing, ample time, and controlled aiming at a stationary target. I'm unironically a good shot, but even I don't think I would have done any better; it's really not that easy to put all the blame on them.

So you got terrified, untrained, overwhelmed, outnumbered Polish conscripts, given heavy, fast-firing German machine guns, under huge amounts of stress, with very minimal training, getting surrounded on all sides by paratroopers, armored support, and men quickly traversing their defenses, AND on top of that, there are accounts of men who refused to kill simply out of the inability or willingness to take a life, OR because they assumed (half-accurately, and half-inaccurately), that the Allies would spare their lives if they showed little resistance and a penchant for passivity.

Read the article for the USS Kearny as well.

I read it the Kearny incident was in October. It seems the U.S took a more aggressive stance when they were fired upon in September.

They went out of their way to help the British in that case. I'd understand them going on the attack if it was their ships being attacked but it just seems like a partisan action while they were still at least militarily neutral in the war with Germany.

It's somewhat ludicrous to think you can freely sink american merchant vessels without reprisal. German subs were active since 1939.

Israel in the early 40s?

It seemed like a reprisal for the Germans firing upon Greer.

>it just seems like a partisan action while they were still at least militarily neutral in the war with Germany.
You have to apply the same standard to Germany. They fired on an American vessel first they had to have known something like that wouldn't go unaddressed

Can you show American merchant vessels sunk before October 1941?

sneed

Germans firing first upon Greer is a completely uncorroborated report by America

That is what happens with unrestricted submarine warfare and there are good reasons for why Germany went with unrestricted submarine warfare.

source on that?

Sure but they need to be ready for the consequences. The fact they cry about American engaging U-boats in their declaration of war while having themselves fired on American vessels seems kind hypocritical

I'm the one saying there is no source. The Americans always claimed the Greer was attacked first, the Germans always claimed it dropped death charges first. Don't take it as gospel either way

Was gonna post this. lol

*depth charges

Considering Germans used false flag operations to incite war and repeatedly broke treaties they signed I don't find their word good for much

death charges sound cooler

Is it even?

Then again the Americans were aware of the Germans usinng this tactic so they could have stayed out of the Atlantic with their destroyers and I'm not sure why they didn't.

history.com/this-day-in-history/the-uss-greer-is-fired-upon
Not sure how trustworthy this is but it would add to the point the other user was making.

Because murica

That's kinda shaky to me. If Germany is gunna go all out with unrestricted warfare they have to be ready for the diplomatic fallout. They can't just expect fellow world powers to abide by their rules

Other nations have done so as well. Just take a look at Israel. It's not out of the question that the US could have stayed out of the war by their own accord.

Your removing all responsibility on Germany's part here. Unrestricted Warfare is effective but it has its consequences and diplomatic tension faced by Germany shouldn't have been a surprise considering it was that very thing that played a role in Getting America involved in WW1. Germany should've learned from its past and not even tempt the Americans. Perhaps if their foreign policy wasn't such a sorry joke they could've worked with the Americans. Most of America was actually against getting involved in another war in Europe so public opinion was on their side.

I'm saying that it's not unheard of a nation killing American sailors and there being no retaliation.

Of course not otherwise every friendly fire incident would be treated as an aggressive act of war

Can we stop pretending like the US was trying to be neutral, at all? We can't really bitch too much about our ships getting dinked when they're literally running defense for British ships which are the literal targets of kraut war efforts. It's not fucking rocket surgery

Because the only thing Americans know about the war is storming the beaches of Normandy and Pearl Harbour

Sure but any friendly fire incident or killing of another nations soldiers could turn into a war if there is retaliation. I'd say the retaliation is more of an escalation than the first incidence of violence, there are plenty of examples of military incidents in which one nation accidentally or delibaretly killed soldiers from another nation without it leading to a war.

Can we stop fucking pretending like Germany dindu nuffin and got war forced upon it by the Americans? They knew the tactics they were using and knew the diplomatic fallout that would result. I don't think Americans are completely innocent, I think there is a case to be made Roosevelt had an interest in assisting the British but Germany escalated tensions with America which their foreign policy did nothing to attempt to ease. In fact early to mid 20th Germany foreign policy has been pretty consistently terrible throughout. Only chads like Bismark knew how to play the game.

>Why is the Normandy scene in Saving Private Ryan so iconic
It encapsulates the insanity of modern warfare in a single scene depicting a battle that is historically important, especially to Americans. Most civilians will never seen anything that brutal in their lives but they still want to understand what war is like. In the consciousness of American culture that scene is the closest thing there is.

>I'd say the retaliation is more of an escalation than the first incidence of violence
That's silly this is literally dindu nuffin mentality. Do you expect America to just turn the other cheek? The Germans knew a purposeful attack had to be met with some sort of consequences weather diplomatic or otherwise. It wasn't an accident, I don't know what excuse could really be made for the initial attack

>there are plenty of examples of military incidents in which one nation accidentally or delibaretly killed soldiers from another nation without it leading to a war.
Obviously a nation like Belgium would be much less inclined to retaliate against a country like Germany or Russia. Circumstances must be taken into account as well as diplomatic relations. For example if a Russian sub were to fire on a German boat in 2019 Germany would be much less inclined to do anything about it considering Russia supplies them with the majority of their oil.

>It was up to that point the most realistic portrayal of modern combat from a personal perspective ever put to film.

Fixed for you. Because from historical perspective The Longest Day was more accurate.

>Do you expect America to just turn the other cheek?
No but you can't blame Germany if they declare war on the US after they retaliated. Every discussion about WW2 at some point involves "...but Germany declared on the US...". And if you read this link you'd see that it's not as simple as "Germany deliberately attacked the USS Greer out of nowhere.".
>if a Russian sub were to fire on a German boat in 2019
There's no need to come up with a hypothetical incident. Plenty of military incidents in western eastern and central Asia could have led to a war, they didn't because most nations don't like war unlike the US.

based wiki marketing reading retard.
do you also believe people fainted watching Frankenstein in theaters?

>No but you can't blame Germany if they declare war on the US after they retaliated.
You can't blame America for retaliating in the first place

>"...but Germany declared on the US..."
This entire thread I've been discussing German aggression before WW2.

>it's not as simple as "Germany deliberately attacked the USS Greer out of nowhere.".
No I don't think it's that simple either which is why I have stressed the diplomatic and historical relations between the countries

>There's no need to come up with a hypothetical incident.
It was merely an example.

>Plenty of military incidents in western eastern and central Asia could have led to a war
Any that come to mind specifically?

>most nations don't like war unlike the US.
You kidding me dude? Nazi Germany was far more militaristic and aggressive than the U.S ever was.

Learn some history you fucking faggot. Google ‘Gold, Juno and Sword’.

Have my upvote good sir. :)

>You can't blame America for retaliating in the first place
You totally can, retaliation is never a good idea unless you want a war.
>Any that come to mind specifically?
India-Pakistan border conflict, just recently there was a bit of fighting. North and South Korea could have gone to war plenty of times. Iran-Israel is another example.
>Nazi Germany was far more militaristic and aggressive than the U.S ever was.
That doesn't mean that the US doesn't love war.

30 SECONDS!

implying you can waver his arrogance, he will most likely die for israel like all other american retards

Why didn't the Americans dress up as German soldiers so they could land on the beach without being shot?

There was no Isreal back then you fucking brainlet.

You’re only supposed to solute if you were in the military. Civilians aren’t supposed to do that FYI.

Why didn't they have a couple of guys go out first with a big thick steel shield and the other guys could hide behind it and then they could plant it in the sand for cover and have successive boats push further up with their shields while the others provided suppressing fire?

I live 5 mins away from the beach where this was filmed. Curracloe Strand in Wexford, Ireland. My parents always tell me about how there was no proper roads, amenities or electricity infrastructure in the area since it was so rural and empty. This was in the mid 90s. The big film crew came along and changed the whole area for ever. Spielberg and the local council pumped money into building all the facilities they needed. Now there's a growing village and a decent tourist trade to this day.

Based.

Attached: 1519494417005.gif (1100x450, 326K)

It was somber and gritty. It showed a proud people fighting for a just cause and all the horror and death involved in the struggle for justice, peace, and a united and pure Germanic race.

because it was dramatized and over the top and people think that's how it actually happened

>just cause

Attached: 37hhsvd231qrngjjjt5j54.jpg (708x800, 64K)

because its satisfying to watch zog slave amerimutts get gunned down by the good guys

Aside from weight, practicality, cumbersome equipment and conspicuousness, I would say pre-sighted mortars are the best answer

>saving private ryan
inferior movie in an inferior battle
youtube.com/watch?v=hrZxBMTQO0c&t=58s&ab_channel=Movieclips

Patton > Saving Private Ryan
SPR is everything wrong with modern war movies

Attached: hero_EB20020317REVIEWS08203170301AR.jpg (1200x500, 56K)

but there were jews u moron

Attached: 777960.jpg (640x480, 72K)

>be us ww2 vet
>fight 13 year olds and wounded veterans of the eastern front
>occasionally come into contact with armor
>60 years later watch a movie
>get scared and walk out

god i didnt know amischweine were such pussies

Amerimutts love it because it was the only moment of them doing something relevant in WW2

As opposed to you dying for your Muslim overlords.

based

Attached: 58970.jpg (220x293, 7K)