The Rings/Hobbit events are actually just incidental side issues compared to all the other shit that went down in the...

the entire reason why the third age is such a wimpy little freakshow with everything going into decline is because the higher tier angels went ballistic in the previous ages, and did more harm than good, and then basically just said 'whoops lets not do that again'
their bad decisions echoed forward also, causing everything bad in the third age also, but at least less people died?
the really pertinent question is why Morgoth was ever allowed to add his discordant noise into the song of creation

the lord of the rings signifies pretty much the utter and final end of morgoth's bullshit up until the prophesied end times, so its a pretty big deal.

Ah yes, winter of 2911 of the Third Age. The orcs crossed Brandywine river without paying the toll for the bridge or the ferry on account of the river being frozen and sought asylum, but the offices of the mayor of Hobbitton couldn't process said applications on account of the bloody mess with the redundancy checks that had to be made on the income taxes of everyone west of Wood End.

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> why Morgoth was ever allowed to add his discordant noise into the song of creation
Because Eru used up all his power in creating the Valar and couldn't do shit about them afterwards. It's a theme in the series that when you create something, part of you goes into that creation. It's why Sauron's life was bound to the Ring of Power.

Eru is a kind father and didn't want to quash Melkor's independence while it wasn't particularly harmful

It was just a prank bro
-eru

So much for omnipotence. Like everyone else that's grown up, he doesn't believe in the whole sky daddy thing too.

Is Tom Bombadil secretly Eru?

What was Morgoth's view on farming subsidies?

tom is a dumb character, like sherlock holmes and batman
"the rules don't apply to me because I'm so unique"
at least tolkien contained in a few chapters and didn't have tom dancing into mordor slapping orcs and singing to nazgul

He's staunchly pro-volcano.

Morgoth ran what was essentially a commune, there was no taxation in the traditional sense since everything went towards a shared pool of resources, redistributed to each according to his need.
Angband's economy was largely supported by metallurgy though.

Sauron is the already-defeated-once miniboss at like 1% health. Legolas isn't even overpowered, he's a weak little bitch compared to the real elves and men of ages past.

Is Tom Ilúvatar and is the Arkenstone a Silmaril are probably my two biggest Tolkien questions that will never be answered. I like to think yes to both as I find it more interesting.

So Morgoth was a socialist? Is that why he was defeated?

yeah the numenoreans, the children of Elrond's mortal brother, were such badasses that they basically marched up to Mordor and sent a messenger to Sauron commanding him to appear before them, and Sauron had to obey
that eventually ended pretty poorly for them of course

Think about it. Stealing the Silmarils was a fine example of the redistribution of wealth that someone like him would be into.

Gondolin a star wars story when?

>Because Eru used up all his power in creating the Valar and couldn't do shit about them afterwards
Tolkien was such a hack.

HELLO ELVES
I'M HERE FOR YOUR SHIT

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All Valar were socialist, that's why they had no concept of private property and thought they were entitled to Fëanor's work.

FUCK EVERYTHING

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Melkor was intentional. Eru doesn't give a single fuck about the people in his reality, only aesthetics.

Is there anything more pathetically autistic thank Tolkien lorefags? Trainspotters make fun of you nerds.

>enters the thread full of things he doesn't like
>lol i dont like you guys you're wrong about stuff and stupid
Ebin post my faggotry friend

meant for

Eru was just Tolkien trying to solve the problem of evil and failing because it can't be solved.

Yeah, it was very meta but you definitely need badness for drama and that handwaves it effectively.

"the battle of unnumbered tears" literally the final defeat of all the allied forces (bar gondolin) and complete victory of morgoth. what follows is morgoth slowly moving south destroying everything and everyone - depressing shit

Against boredom even the gods fight in vain. - some german dude

>the problem of evil
I thought he was a Christian? Christians believe in free will and that God cannot interfere in anything bad happening so there's really no problem.

This

If you were god would you create a world that was perfectly good and peaceful with no conflict whatsoever? It would be boring as fuck right?

That's why it's retarded to trying to fix it by making God less powerful.

If I were Eru I would just create a world with more productive conflict. No one profited from all the shit that happened between the Ainulindalë and Melkor's demise in the Dagor Dagorath, except maybe the reader I guess?

>productive conflict
>profit
I don't get what you mean by that user.

The arkenstone is explicitly not a silmaril. We know the fate of all three.

whole lot of pottery with the morgoth challenge

And further, Tom is definitely not Eru, either. Just a very old guy with his power tied to the region of land he lives in, and a reference to a toy his kids had.

Everything goes back to the original state, Melkor was just a drawn out inconvenience in the grand scheme of things. The idea of progress is absent, the closest thing being Sauron's agenda and that was bad because Greed is bad in Tolkien's mythos thanks to his Christian worldview, so profit is a no-no.

You're no fun at all.

No one can take your headcanon from you user, but you phrased those as your two biggest questions, I thought you'd appreciate that the answers were out there.

Shut up shut up shut up

Hey dol! merry dol! ring a dong dillo!
Ring a dong! hop along! fal lal the willow!
Tom Bom, jolly Tom, Tom Bombadillo!

I dunno, If I were a deity with the power to create a universe I would probably have pointless evil in it to create drama and conflict for my entertainment. Of course good would have to win in the end because the show must go on and a happy ending is always the best ending, but the drama created by evil is what's interesting.

But then you would be watching the same story over and over again. Why do that when you're God and can watch events unfold ever more complex throughout eternity? I'd rather watch thousands of Saurons trying to out-innovate each other forever than Frodo destroying the ring for the nth time in the endless span of my godly existence.

>Is Tom Bombadil secretly Eru?
km-515.livejournal.com/1042.html
This is my headcanon for Tom, something akin to Ungoliant, outside of the order of Eru

How can Ungoliant even exist if Eru made everything? What the fuck Tolkien, you a Lovecraftfag or something?

Not gonna open your STD-ridden shithole of a link sorry

Tolkien stated in a letter that he admired HPL and that his universe could potentially exist in the same multiverse as his Both Eru and Ungoliant are eldritch abominations if that's true.

So that's why Elrond dismissed the idea of dropping the ring in the sea.

kek

Reminder:
>We fought far under the living earth, where time is not counted. Ever he clutched me, and ever I hewed him, till at last he fled into dark tunnels. They were not made by Durin’s folk, Gimli son of Glóin. Far, far below the deepest delving of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he. Now I have walked there, but I will bring no report to darken the light of day.

>km-515.livejournal.com/1042.html
>
Now, it is canonical in Tolkein that powerful magical beings imprint their nature on their homes. Lorien under Galadriel is a place of peace and light. Moria, after the Balrog awoke, was a place of terror to which lesser evil creatures were drawn. Likewise, when Sauron lived in Mirkwood, it became blighted with evil and a home to monsters.
Interesting take but that's where it falls apart. Those realms aren't that way because of the ruler's personality. ALL the world is decaying, Galadriel's ring stops it in Lorier. Moria is a place of terror because it's at the base of the mountains where teeming hordes of goblins, who hate dwarves and were happy to occupy the fallen hold, live. Dol Guldur went to shit because Sauron hates elves and it made him happy to blight them with spiders. Treebeard reveals why some huorns went black, and the barrow wights are human shit. Bombadil just bombachills with his river wife loving his life.

Gandalf the Cock Tease

If I recall, they just asked for it. Were they going to use 9x39 magic if he didn’t comply?

yeah, that one is buried with thorin

>one in the sky, one beneath the sea, one beneath the earth
>beneath the earth
Like where the arkenstone was found!

Probably. They needed the light from the Silmarils and argued that he should give them because he used the light from their magical christmas trees to make them.

Nothing supports that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>cast into a fiery pit in beleriand
>arkenstone is in the vault at the top of a mountainhold in Dale
>both under the earth :^) they're the same :^)
The only thing they have in common is being very shiny.

>he doesn't know the earth moves
user just give it up.

They obviously didn’t give too much of a shit since Ulmo and Manwe didn’t Wrestlemania their ass before, during, and after their boat-shoah.

Best vala coming through.

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This is the triology the real fans are waiting for.

>not tulkas

Could it be that the Watcher in the lake was a lesser eldritch abomination that somehow got washed up to the surface?

Fuck Tulkas.

Ulmo was a chill dude and Manwe can't leave his chair because reasons

t. Morgoth. Upset a real chad bound you in chains while you were playing with your fucking rock collection, nerd?

NOBODY WANTS TO WRESTLE NAKED WITH YOU TULKAS
FUCK OFF

>Ulmo was a chill dude

He really is. He’s the only one of the Vala that gave a shit about Ilúvatar’s kids.

>give the knight an early 20th century tench coat and call it a lovecrafts story

t. Melkor. You don't want to wrestle at all, valcel. You cried like a bitch after a spider bite and had to have your boys pick you up.

Why are LotR threads so comfy?

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Aulë > Tulkas > Mandos > Ulmo > Oromë > Irmo > Manwë

IT WASN'T A SPIDER IT WAS AN ABOMINATION FROM OUTSIDE ERU'S CREATION YOU FUCK

Tolkien wrote them to escape the horrors of our world.
>Irmo
Explain

>anything at all outside of Eru's creation
besides what the fuck would you know about creating anything melkor LMOA

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Explain what?

Ever seen an Orc? You're welcome!
Ever seen a troll? You're welcome!
Ever seen a volcano? You're welcome!

Your ranking obviously.

No thanks, nigger.

>splash some rape on an elf
>splash some stupid on an ent
>splash some fire on a mountain
brilliant inventions bro

Aulë was the broest, had his own thing going for him. Tulkas was also cool with the boxer shit. Mandos had an interesting role in the story. Don't really care about the rest to be honest.

not an argument. state facts or fuck off

That's what I've been trying to tell everyone!
Also check out my new dragon. It's bitchin'

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What happened to the entwives?

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acacia_melanoxylon

Hardly. He's much more likely to be one of the lesser Maiar.

Ulmo was the best friend he could be to our rash and benighted peoples. I bet he'd have liked to do much more but was resigned to working within the prohibitions laid on him.

>bombadil
>lesser Maiar
nigga what

Guys, I've been thinking, why didn't the Eagles just drop the ring into Mt. Doom?

It's what I think. I really don't know what else to add.

Because the eagles, the moment they crossed the threshold into Mordor, would’ve been peppered by anti-air missiles as well as harried by Nazgul.

> as well as harried by Nazgul
That could be easily solved by mounting women on the eagles.

That only applies to the Witch King, the other 8 weren't misogynist.

Customs fees for international cargo airlines such as Eagles LLC would be exorbitant due to Mordor's protectionist policies, so Ellrond's Council Inc opted for a less expensive option of contracting private carriers without forming a society.

Who would win if the Watcher fought the Balrog?

Balrog, his fires are not put out by water.

the watcher. imagine all that tentacle penetration

Balrogs BTFO Ungoliant, why would the Watcher be any different?

there were 1000s of balrogs (before the retcon) each balrog was equivalent to Gandalf the white and ungoliant was more annoyed at them lobbing fireballs at her rather than ever being threatened by them. ungoliant was literally annoyed into retreating lmao

Disgusting and blatant exploitation of the hobbit working class. Where they adequately compensated? No. Pension? No. Life insurance that would go to their families? No. Gandalf is the worst kind of capitalist pig.

The fuck am i looking at

no tentacles to fuck the balrog in the ass with. also that story about the invasion of gondolin really had its effect on me what with balrogs being massacred all over the place

Ulmo, basically god of the sea.

I'm not sure Balrogs have asses, user.

It is implied somewhere (I think by Gandalf) that that the Watcher is indeed a nameless one and somehow through bodies of water ended up where he does in Fellowship.

Ungoliant got uberbuffed from eating the light of the two trees of Valinor. Pretty Ungoliant just left because of how much time it would've taken, like yeah I could fight for 100 days and eat all these Balrogs eventually and then MAYBE have a chance to eat those Silmarils after mopping the floor with Melkor. Or I could just fuck off to the forest and fuck and eat things until I get so bored I just eat myself.

>Arkenstone a Silmaril
lol no
Arkenstone is a nice rock
A Silmaril is The Light of The Trees

the baddest vala in the entire legendarium

>never gave a fuck about the council of valar
>openly helped men against the other butch boy valars wishes
>literally manipulated cause and effect so the valar would take action
>morgoth was most afraid of him
>loves men above all the other shitskins
>ulmo
>morgoth was

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What exactly is a "Silmaril"? How does the half elf half god guy use it to defeat the huge dragon in just one day? How can he make his ship fly? How does drowning Sauron take away his shape shifting abilities? Why are the elves leaving Middle Earth during the third age? Also why does Aragorn marry his ancestor?

Damn... sounds based as fuck. Did Eru ever tell him to stop?

>What exactly is a "Silmaril"?
Imagine someone creating a miniature sun (in brightness) that not even the fucking angels (valar) could do

Silmarils are three jewels made by Fëanor, the greatest artisan who ever lived. They were stolen by Morgoth, Sauron's boss, and this resulted in Fëanor leading his sons and followers in pursuit, becoming the people known as Noldor, or the dark elves, in the process.

"Be he foe or friend, be he foul or clean,
brood of Morgoth or bright Vala,
Elda or Maia or Aftercomer,
Man yet unborn upon Middle-earth,
neither law, nor love, nor league of swords,
dread nor danger, not Doom itself,
shall defend him from Fëanor, and Fëanor's kin,
whoso hideth or hoardeth, or in hand taketh,
finding keepeth or afar casteth
a Silmaril. This swear we all:
death we will deal him ere Day's ending,
woe unto world's end! Our word hear thou,
Eru Allfather! To the everlasting
Darkness doom us if our deed faileth.
On the holy mountain hear in witness
and our vow remember, Manwë and Varda!"

Oh, and Gandalf gave the hobbits a taste of the ring's power, made the addicts, and had them working for free. When it was over and done with, the hobbits were so traumatized that even the elves took pity on them and invited the worst cases to live out the rest of their miserable lifes in their methadone ring clinic.

Not even Sauron was this much of a shitbag. At least his orcs were well fed and even had meat on the menu.

Well then how were they created?

probably from pure rage, something Feanor knew a bit about

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Oh nvm just read thanks anons.

that oath was probably the single bastard thing that feanor ever did. he knew that it was impossible for his sons or his kin to ever fulfill it and he still made them swear on it - literally doomed all his followers to death

why did he do it?

Give *swears oaths* me *kinslays* my *burns boats* fucking*swears more oaths* gems *bursts into flames*

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>How does drowning Sauron take away his shape shifting abilities?
Sauron was being a cocky shit and manipulating the Numenorians. They'd been forbidden to set foot on Valinor, even though they could just about see it on the horizon. Sauron told them they could go there, so they did. Eru got so mad he reached down from outer-space and tore Numenor from the fucking world, and then folded the world into a sphere afterwards to make up the difference. Sauron was on Numenor when this happened, and got fucked up.

Because FUCK MAL'GANIS

>Feanor burst into flames from sheer-rage
based.

I remember Tom Shippey (a Big Man of Tolkien scholarship) insisting when Frodo and Sam were out of water in Mordor Ulmo sent 'em a stream to replenish their supplies from. It wouldn't surprise me.

>Is the Arkenstone a Silmaril

If it was, would the descendants of the Noldor (Elrond, Galardriel etc.) be oath-bound to pursue it?

Ex-wife took his gems in the divorce

The oaths were sworn by the sons of Fëanor, not sure they'd apply to someone who hadn't sworn it themselves, or Elrond who wasn't directly related (afaik). Galadriel is not a descendant of them either; she's basically the same generation as Fëanor himself.

If the Arkenstone had been a silmaril though, you better believe Thranduil would have been far more interested.

huh? Morgoth wasn't Feanors waifu, that was Nerdanel (the most fertile redhaired smith-tomboy-elf there ever was). Shame that she stayed in Valinor, they could have produced an army of Feanor-kins.

eru didn't use up all his power, you pulled that out if your ass.

>Dad murdered
>Gems stolen
>trees eaten
>Valar: lol just chill

Burn the boats because this train has no breaks

Because discord is a necessary part of life. It was also necessary for the beauty of the song to become recognizable. Eru knew all this. Melkor was just a tool in Illuvatar’s design.

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Boats = burnt
Kin = slayed
Rage = engaged

Yep, it's gamer time

But he's then beaten in the war of wrath

You mad because big T whooped your ass twice over, and gonna whoop your ass for the last and final time at Dagor Dagorath.

PICK UP THE SOAP, DARK BOY, AGAIN.

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Because it was funny. Feanor just wanted to see the look on Fingolfin's face when he saw the ships burning. If anything the Noldor who marched over the ice are more retarded, they could have easily turned back and apologised to the Valar but were driven on purely by pride. At least Feanor had a decent reason, justice for his father and recovering stolen property. Also, I bet lots of elves ate Turgon's wife after she froze to death but didn't tell him.

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Eru knew that the all strife/chaos/death caused from Melkor would only make the good in the world even more beautiful.

finna throw dem hands

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Is this an achievable body?

stand your ass UP, MEEK MEL.

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not really, since it was less likely the Valar would get involved in the war of the ring and Aragorn was also the last chance for the line of Beren to succeed and lead men into a new age, without him men would be pretty fucked. Also had Sauron won he would have started working towards the last war and probably owuld tip it in Morgoths favour and extinguished creation.

>It's a theme in the series that when you create something, part of you goes into that creation. It's why Sauron's life was bound to the Ring of Power.

>morgoth's ring
Arda itself was morgoth's "ring"; he put so much of himself into it, the autist.

underrated and best answer so far

>t. discord tranny

Was Sauron a tranny? Because all those Annatar pics are super gay.

I really wanna fuck that tree!

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder friend

Compared to the events of the First Age and during the Years of the Trees and Years of the Lamps the Hobbit and LOTR are smaller scale events. The wars between Morgoth and the Valar literally reshaped Arda's continents and landscape. As an example, the many mountain ranges in Middle Earth (Endor) were made in protection of Aman, while the Iron Mountains were made to protect the strongholds of Angband and Utumno. The most Sauron alone did to reshape Arda was it's transformation from a flat disk to a sphere, making it only possible for Elves to go to Aman ( who get there literally by flying ships into space, refer to Earendil).

S-shut up! It's not gay if you're the one getting your dick sucked. Honestly, all these homos make me sick with their perfectly toned buttocks and hard throbbing cocks, disgusting.

Yeah, there's also a fucking weird Tolkien story where an Englishman travels to Aman after getting very lost in his boat while fleeing the Danish invasion.

I wish I was that guy