I'll never understand the extreme hate towards this film. it has some of the best moments in a comic book movie...

not ironic at all. I feel you. I haven't seen some of his movies yet but I like what I've seen so far. at least he'll be better off now that he's moved on from DC. hopefully Army of the Dead will be good as well

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Moive would of been kino if it instead of Death Of Superman, they went World's Finest at the end.

Zack Snyder wanted to do Death of Superman similar to the actual but studio did want him to make Doomsday go into the city because of the MoS backlash. also it would have played well with the 5 story arc they had initially planned

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>city destruction
>backlash
In God's name, why? I torrented MoS to watch it and I didn't follow the drama.

many felt that Superman was partially responsible for the destruction of Metropolis and that he did not stop mid fight to save any citizens with Zod

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If Superman stopped even for a moment Zod would be free to ravage more destruction.
Are people retarded?

There will never be another one more intimidating.

I'm with you but it's one of the complaints you see. also many dismiss this Superman saying he's depressed during the whole movie and people who can't move on from the '78 version

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They made him angst because females love angst.

it was a combination of him having to control his powers and finding out his purpose and where he came from.

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Yes, angst. Put there to appeal to female audience.

visuals alone ≠ good movie

Doomsday was the first capeshit antagonist in a while where I was like, "Oh shit, how the fuck are they gonna defeat this thing?'
>kryptonian
>nearly indestructable
>comes back to life if killed and is immune to the thing that killed him
>fuck....

the sentinels from dofp did a better job

at least that's something that you'd like in another movie, yeah?

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Nah. For some reason Doomsday was more impending.

You realise you don't have to exclusively consume the lowest common denominator trash spewed out by Hollywood you fucking cretin

thats when i lost all hope to western audience who freakin criticizes supes for not being able to apprehend or stop zod in an instant when hes actually fighting a person with the same powers as him but with more combat experience and also fueled with revenge.

i also hate the fact that other "critics" kept saying that killing zod was a poor choice, and im like "in what way??" no prison/person can hold zod at this point other than supes (and supes doesnt even know how the phantom zone works). theres literally no other choice when zod said "never" which basically gave supes an ultimatum, either kill zod or he kills most if not all of the humans in earth, it wasnt just about the family whos being held hostage by them lazer beams. its so funny how other people said that the family could've move the other way, then i guess theyve never been shooked by something that their body actually seizes to function.

Snyder is an idiot

Yes

Yeah nah, it was obvious from the beginning that they'd beat them using time travel

sentinels: yes. doomsday: no

a cave troll vs a pack of unthinking ever adaptable killing machines... you need your head checked

the sentinels were far more menacing and provided greater stakes for the heroes to overcome

This is why I have always preferred DC over Marvel. These are comic book action movies, of course the plot and story are going to be shit. But if the movie is visually entertaining than it makes up for shitty story. The issue with Marvel is that the stories are mundane, predictable and shot like a high budget soap opera.

it's kept evolving which was cool. would have liked to see it in it's full form

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even if army of the dead is good, the critic will still hate it

>hurr durr picture books are better than novels

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they are used to seeing the plot helping the heroes not take any hard decisions. also they saw Zod in the older superman when they were young

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They were robots. Just not as scary nor as interesting as a living creature.

yeah people see them for the character and the interactions. nothing wrong with that but seeing DC criticized for doing something different did not sit well with me

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yeah but other movies in the same genre are treated as intelligent as the critics and audiences as well

>
personally it makes more sense, Doomday in this movie is basically a big baby. the thing that make up for it was him being able to evolve every time he dies. wouldve been awesome to see him evolve to its comic book form

yeah I understood that but the comments about it looking like a cave troll or abomination could have been avoided

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imagine unironically legitimately caring about capeshit lmao

fpbp

i could've sworn doomsday looked worse in the film

it looks really ugly when it just comes out of the genesis chamber, i still feel it's movement animation wasn't as good as it should have been

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It was a mess. A few neat CG shots don't outweigh the god awful script, boring performances, bleak and boring cinematography, pointless plot, hamfisted worldbuilding, edgefag bullshit, terrible adaptation of the source material, etc.

Based

Same OP. I really enjoyed it

I'm not a fan, but that shot was cool.
Also the scene right when wonder woman appears then superman re-enters and smacks the fuck out of doomsday was one of the coolest superman shots in cinema history.

this desu

That looks great though.

you say a lot of things but I felt it worked. also source material was just an inspiration for the movie. watch the Ultimate Edition if you haven't you may feel differently

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this was at a later time. yeah it looks better than everyone gives it credit for.
pic related is baby Doomsday

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JL was robbed from us

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yeah that was cool

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Amazing film. Actually felt like real life and not some fantasy world.

capefags btfo

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rooftop scene was kino and you know it

Why didn't batman brand lex?

It got shat on for its anticapitalist themes. Same for Star Wars Last Jedi, though overall it is a worse movie than BvS.

The ingredients were there. Affleck was an amazing batman and a good bruce. The visuals were fitting. It needed a more balanced script, simply put...a better written one. Even the underlying themes of the conflict were thought out through. But the movie suffered from its atrocious pacing. It felt fragmented and unfocused. It was one big theme after the next, man against god against devil against god against man. It was too much. It should have centered on the conflict between those two, should have developed a far better luthor and kept wonder woman and doomsday out.

that smirk
>you're not brave

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by the end of the movie Batman changed his ways. he stopped branding altogether

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what anticapitalist themes though

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Because it's showing he's not the same as he was. He isn't the one who gets to make the call on who dies and who lives.

agreed on that might have been better received if it focused just on man v god.

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The antagonist is a megalomaniacal businessman who fosters hatred against an immigrant through media that he owns, has a politician eating literally out of his hands and creates an uncontrollable monster at the end.

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Hate is a strong word. I just think it didn't work. It was a mess, but not a mess of entirely bad things. There are a lot of interesting ideas being put forth, but they are often limited to the duration of the scene and there's very little connective tissue. Knightmare, on its own, is interesting and unlike what we've seen before. I'm into the idea of a post apocalyptic Batman movie. But this was trying to be that and fifty other things. I know people will say I'm a Marvel shill for saying this, but just imagine if Knightmare had been either at the veeery end of the movie, or a post credit sequence... just imagine it for a second. Everyone, DC fanboys included, would have been shitting their pants with anticipation and the internet would have lit up with people analyzing and theorizing and you know it. It would have been a masterstroke. Instead, it's just right in the middle of the movie for some reason and it completely interrupts everything else that is happening. And then when Superman dies it just becomes confusing. So, he has to come back to life and THEN he turns evil? It's just convoluted, pure and simple. But it's not dogshit, I don't think anyone is saying it is. But it's a LONG way from a 'misunderstood masterpiece'. It routinely misses the mark by a mile.

given the current political climate shouldn't the people who shat on it have appreciated it more. i wasn't sure if you were referring to Lex. Superman who is good is pressured to be kept in check but people don't bat an eye to Lex's rise in power

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My only question. Superman shows up for the showdown and calls batman Bruce. How did he know?

That sequence would have made no sense at the end of the movie. It was a visulization of Batman's fear of what he thought Superman might become. By the end of the movie he had already gotten over that fear.

This and the Disney Star Wars movies are the worst movies I have ever seen in a cinema.
In fact, they might have been the worst movies I have ever seen

Everyone knows everyone's identities and they determined that off screen. What, you want an explanation some kind? You want coherency? That shit is for babies, dude. It's not full of plot holes and unrealized ideas, it just doesn't hold your hand bro.

Not according to Zack Snyder.

He could overhear Bruce talking to Alfred at the party they both attended.

Wow, Superman can't even manage to save like a few people. What a fucking chump, I though he was supposed to be, I dunno, like a Superman or something

nigga you should watch some of those spoof movies, they will put that shit in perspective

he finds out at the party Lex throws. Batman speaks to Alfred in earpiece all mysterious
only Lex knows everyone's identities.

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I mean, superman can see through skin? He can probably see through clothes

That is such a lame excuse.

There's a point in the movie where Zod throws a huge tanker truck at Superman, and when he dodges it he doesn't even check to see if it's going to hit anyone. It's almost comical how much it completely misses the point.

I understand what you mean, but that scene with Flash drives Batman's paranoia more. he says Bruce was right in fearing him.
what good is it if Superman is already dead

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>movie people were really excited for, even if they say they weren't, was not even mediocre
>people get pissed off
Shocking.

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I don't go out of my way to watch bad movies or movies that I know will suck.
TLJ being an exception because some friends wanted to watch it and they ask me if I wanted to go too. Friends were a mistake. Funnily enough, the same friends wanted to see BvS too.

yeah he just managed to save only the world. what a loser
what would you have him do, there were people in front of him, there was no one behind him in the parking lot. it was already in motion. evading was correct and safest response. see the guy in the right

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People hate things that make them feel stupid. And rather than entertain the possibility that they're not as smart as they like to think they are, they project their own insecurities onto the film. You can see them doing this every single time someone answers one of their "why's" with information from right there in the film they dismiss it as coincidence or "headcanon."

These are the same people who cherished Miller's TDKR for years without ever realizing that it was social commentary on the contemporary sociopolitical climate and the depiction of violence in the comics medium.

This is such a beautiful film.

i have noticed them dismiss every answer and saying it's made up but calling them stupid won't do any favors I guess.

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The reason why you like BvS is because it is designed to make nimrods feel intelligent. You are the very sort of person who hates things for making you feel stupid. BvS panders to you by being a dumb explosion fest that masquerades as insightful so you can pretend you're an intellectual. And of course, once the reviews are abysmal and everyone hates it this just leads you to double down. The last thing you'll ever do is admit you were wrong about something or that maybe, just maybe, you don't have the best taste.

You sound like me. It was the flood scene in BvS where everything finally clicked for me. It made me realize what he was doing, what he was using his visuals for. I went back and watched MoS, a film I'd originally enjoyed without devoting much thought to, and now it and BvS are among my all-time favorite films.

The man really is a misunderstood genius.

Agreed.

no reason to attack other mate. why do you feel the movie didn't work?

Snyder’s only mistake was making this movie during a period in time where people like to recreationally be offended. Men are viewed as dangerous/toxic and so on.

first post based post

After years of directors giving us deconstructionist pieces that are essentially asking "What if this character were real?" then proceeding to show us the characters in a world thst might as well be ours, Snyder went next-level and gave us a depiction of "What if the comic book world were real? How would it function?"

Then he gives us that world with a thin deconstructionist veneer and over the course of the two films, he peels that veneer back to reveal that beneath it lies the real comic book world, larger than life, both a darker and a brighter place than our own, where all our myths, ancient to modern, all have room to live and breathe.

And he let it be Superman who awakened that slumbering magic that is mankind's greatest power - our imagination. Snyder is too good for us.

Because once you've found redemption, it's not so easy to look on others as being past finding it themselves.

The movie clean kino, political circumstances held it back. Also the dumbing down of Hollywood.

It's not anti-capitalist. It's anti-elitism. Lex is the representative of that elite - a man orchestrating events, spinning narratives, fueling hatred and xenophobia all for his own benefit.

Any anti-elitist work of fiction made in a capitalist society is by extension anti capitalist.

Probably figured it out at the party. At the very least he knew Bruce was more than he appeared to be. Couple that with X-ray vision and you've got your answer.

Here's the problem, though:

Nothing ever makes me feel stupid.

I'm not lazy and complacent. I like being challenged. I look for answers instead of insisting there are none to be found. If I can't find those answers, I ask around to see if anyone understands and I entertain their explanations. I don't dismiss their explanations out of ego and insecurity. If no one has an explanation that satisfies my curiosity, I shrug and move on understanding that whether their reasoning is valid or not, it doesn't work for me and thus neither does the film in question. I don't hang around for years trying to tear them and the film down, calling them stupid fanboys.

There are bad-to-mediocre films that fall apart under the slightest scrutiny. And there a great films that hold together better and better under increasingly granular analysis. TLJ is the former. BvS is the latter.

Fair point.

>a movie is made by a retard, for retards
>literally everyone not retarded: wow, that's retarded
>retards: WHA U MEAN AM RETARDED MOOBEE AM GUD U RETARDED

>Martha
This

what's wrong with that scene mate?

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>he fell for the martha meme and shamelessly uses it as a legit argument even after 3 years.

How did WonderWoman know that superman is named Kalel?

wrong movie? anyway Zod announced Superman as Kal-El to the world

I don't remember cave trolls in other movies having spikes grow out of them, shooting eyebeams or spontaneously discharging massive amounts of electricity. And Doomsday was intentionally referencing fucking King Kong and greek titans, not Harry Potter or whatever

The theater version was a butchered mess that made no sense. The whole plot was cut out, only restored in the Ultimate Edition BD. It fixed everything and it went from a 5/10 to 9/10.

>original: everything conveniently goes lex luthor's way and lois lane exists only to be saved over and over
>UE: Lois figures out Luthor is behind everything and her investigation explains in detail how the villain turned Batman against Superman, making her just as vital as a character as the heroes

>original: superman didn't notice a bomb right next to him, what an idiot
>UE: the wheelchair was filled with led, which is known to block his vision

>original: wonder woman appears out of nowhere in the final fight
>UE: we're shown what she was doing and how Bruce's words changed her mind

etc, etc

Snyder recently said that the UE was the one originally intended cut. although I've seen people complain that it doesn't fix the actual problems of the movie

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>no mention or build up of any of this
Lol

Based and, might I add, redpilled

>HE fell for the Martha meme

>how Bruce's words changed her mind

I think this is a factor that isn’t discussed enough:

It’s not just that Bruce’s words change her mind. Think about the statement that makes about the Batman himself. In this setting, he spent his whole career in gritty “Batworld” with only his own allies to rely on, his own family. It isn’t enough to keep him pure. Essentially, that’s saying that deconstructionist Batman could never make it without the inspiration and support of the other heroes.

Pic related always gets me. Bruce fought the good fight for twenty years all on his own. It left him flawed and broken but still recognizably heroic. That’s sad, beautiful, and inspiring to me all at the same time.

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It’s right there in the movie. The General damn near says that verbatim.

Holy fuck. Well said.

Hysterical fags screeching because Card is a Mormon.

That and only that.

>capeshit

I don't understand how someone can watch the Ultimate Edition of this film and genuinely say with a straight face that it isn't ten times better than any of the cookie-cutter garbage Marvel has been pumping out for the past decade. When's the last time there was a thread with in-depth discussion of any of the Thor movies, the Cap. America movies etc.?

I personally believe that the MCU would have been a completely different beast had Disney not bought the IP. I think Favreau and RDJ had a specific arc in mind for Tony Stark, and I think it was very, very different than what we got and RDJ and Favreau have been making them pay bleed through the wallet for that affront ever since.

I think they were setting up Armor Wars with the finale being a confrontation between Stark and Rhodey. I think that based off of subtle things in the first two films. I think that’s part of why they let Terrence Howard go - he knew that his original role was going to be bigger and more pivotal and wanted a paycheck that reflected it.

Is there literally any chance of these movies coming back? Aflecknis gone, Cavil is gone, Wonder Women in limbo, Flash in limbo, and Synder has been all but give a restraining order for the WB film lot. It’s all dead isn’t it.

Interesting theory

The only possible good outcome at this stage would be the Snyder cut being released to give us all some closure. Just count yourself lucky that we even got the UE of BvS

that's the thing, many MCU fans would consider phase 1 to be weak but I always liked it.

snyder cut would be better than what we got on screen but it what they initially planned would have been off this world

just got back from SnyderCon and watched this movie with the boss man himself. literally a masterpiece

was the football jersey guy planted there to derail it? all the audience questions were lame in BvS panel

nah i think he was just a sort of annoying guy.
I'll agree though the BvS panel kinda sucked, especially that Spider-Man nerd, although Im not going to complain about Zack talking about stuff that would have been, no matter how little.

sorry wrong reply

Literally nobody thinks Iron Man was a weak movie, and with good reason. The films that were released under them were all a solid foundation to build on. If I’m right, Iron Man’s films would have delved into substance abuse, man versus state, and intellectual property rights. Cap’s would have followed a time-displaced “man of the people” trying to figure out what had become of the country he used to love. And Thor’s would have been grandly cosmic in scale, possibly featuring a more impactful fight between him and the Hulk. I think the films would have been a lot more thematically and morally complex, which is a lot more in keeping with the comics. Disney opted to give us enjoyable, if low-effort live-action Pixar.

I envy you so much. Any particular moments you’d like to share?

it's just that people have been waiting for a long time for some confirmation and it's not like Zack was shy to talk about it.
did he mention anything about the 4 hour cut of BvS?

What did Jersey guy do?

first iron man movie is the only one that gets praised all the time from Phase 1. even then some people complain about Ironmonger. maybe you are a part of the fandom so you think otherwise.

>Two heroes fighting each other become friends in order to fight a big monster
Literally shit you see in cartoons for 7 year old kids.

ZS was talking about the original plans they had and how the Knightmare scene would have played out and everyone were blown away by it.
it was followed up with a question about the Football Jersey they wore in the Gotham v Metropolis match in BvS

Any movie can be reduced to child quality if you are reductive enough.

So Snyder cut is all but confirmed dead now correct?

It exists.

Jesus wept. Are you the guy who got to attend? If so, did you get a chance to ask any questions?

no I just watched it live from the stream

But we’ll never see it...

It wqs absolutely fucking terrible that's why. It didn't JUST fail. It was a train wreck of poor decisions and casting choices.

Anything that really stuck out to you? I think I’ve heard most of the stuff relating to the longer story. Did anyone ask him about the thought they put into the world-building, about how their world and Heroic ages and stuff function, or were they too busy asking about football jerseys?

I 'm not going to pile on about my dislike for fhese films. As I read this thread it seems like I watched completely diffrent movies. I am starting to think Snyder is the cilantro of filmaking. Though I do want to see his Justice League movie, maybe it would have clicked there.

It exists but it was already under a script rewrite after BvS reviews. We were robbed of the entire story because of 2016's CURRENT YEAR bullshit, Michael Brown, feminism, and liberal double-think driving most critic reviews at the time.

no it was wasted opportunity. at least the one girl asked about Justice League. god bless her

twitter.com/smcolbert/status/1110017858153660417
here's how it went down, if you want to glance quickly

it's okay to talk about your dislikes as well, it might lead to a good discussion.
yeah we want see as well but you have to understand he made a different film than originally planned

Amen user

Thanks for that. I’m still laughing over Butler’s clip. I’d never seen that.

Snyder’s a Raimi Spiderbro. Why am I not at all surprised?

Big and true

Keep this trash on Yea Forums where it belongs

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>Editor praises Zack's system of storyboarding. He says normal directors you get a script and dailies, but with Zack you always have a script, dailies, AND a storyboard concepting everything.

Absolutely fucking based. He really is too good for us.