Lets settle this once and for all Yea Forums, who was in the wrong here?

reminder that Ross was correct about Mark and even when Mark told Rachel he was going to go home and masturbate over her, she still didn't realise.
If she wasn't so hot and didn't dress so good she'd be an utterly despicable character.

Rachel, obviously. They even brought in Hugh Laurie to explain this.

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youtube.com/watch?v=sXNd99IhdmA
absolutely /ourguy/

This. Rachel was the one who suggested it and let Ross walk away thinking that they broke up.

Was House on his way to a medical conference in London?

thats exactly what she asked for, unbeknownst to her though, Ross is an absolute alpha and flipped the script on her. too bad he ended up having oneitis. could have given joey a run for his money otherwise.

They were on a break. Rachel was wrong.

Based Hugh Laurie.

Rachel did it so she could fuck the other guy behind Ross's back without making it looking like she cheated on her but the entire thing completely blew apart for her

Rachel is always in the wrong, but Ross is a whiny little bitch. Those two deserve the Hell they will put each other through

i fapped to this

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rachel was a spolit bitch and girls of boomer generation looked up to her. ross was prototype of todays cucks

Based Laurie.

They are both in the wrong but Ross is slightly more in the wrong.

Since Rachel called the break it is also her responsibility to establish the rules of the break. Is it an 'we are effectively broken up so we should consider other options' break? or is it 'I just need space to re-think the relationship break'?

Since she didn't establish the ground rules she holds partial blame. HOWEVER, break or no break, Ross shows he doesn't value the relationship as he immediately goes and fucks around as soon as he's off the leash. That is a clear violation of trust and leaves Rachel to call into question thier relationship before the break.

If Ross truly wanted to get back together with Rachel he shouldn't have done it

Phoebe, as usual.

He heard Mark on the phone offering Rachel some wine, got drunk and fucked a random slut

Rachel. The whole situation is her own fault. What is she, 14? What did she think a break was for? Ross just happened to stumble into another woman that night, which was okay since they were on a break.

Exactly, he fucks a rando in a petty 'tit for tat' move based on nothing but conjecture from an overheard phone call.

Look it works in a comedy world but if it's real life we're talking here he's clearly more at fault.

Is being "on a break" different than being "broken up"?

Therein lies the crux of the arguments, and that's where people disagree. We need to establish this first before moving on to who was in the wrong.

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The THOT

Both, but Ross was more wrong.

All six of them were horrible pieces of shit.

Don't you talk about my Monica like that.

Ross did absolutely nothing wrong. Rachael send him away thinking they were on a break (which basically means I want to fuck other people while your fight for me). If they're broken up, then Ross can do what he wants, he shouldn't even have apologised to Rachael afterwards desu

>(which basically means I want to fuck other people while your fight for me)
Except for the part where she had the opportunity to fuck another guy and didn't.

That's irrelevant since Ross wasn't there to observe that interaction

It's actually interesting from the psychological perspective - because it totally flips the power dynamic in the relationship.

Initially, Rachel has ALL the power - because they both have arrested development from their late teens. In Rachel's head she is still the most desirable girl in school, and in Ross's head he is still an awkward nerd. These self-images do not reflect the reality of course. In reality, Ross is young, handsome, educated & professional. He has a PhD, has been married and is a devoted father to his son. He is a "grown-up". Rachel, by contrast, has no qualifications, no life experience and is just a waitress. She is the social inferior. Neither of them realise this, so the relationship is built on a false power dynamic.

The tension comes from Rachel desperately wanting to focus on her career - she had been reliant on her father for so long that she felt the need to be on her own. She deliberately stokes conflict with Ross, who has become her surrogate father - an older male who loves her unconditionally & makes it his duty to look after her.

Ross's appeal to Rachel is key here - he is older and caring, so can be a surrogate dad. But unlike her actual father, he is also soft & subservient emotionally. His undeclared (but obvious) infatuation with her has placed her on a pedestal in his mind, which gives her total power in the situation.

She rejects & humiliates Ross re: her career, because she resents male authority, but feels comfortable that Ross will always be her whipping boy. She does this manipulatively, by playing on his (understandable) paranoia, which he suffers as a result of his first marriage. Notice, Rachel never once volunteers to understand Ross's phobia on this issue, instead treating it as an annoyance.

1/2

2/2
When Rachel declares she wants a "break", she is demonstrating her independence both to herself & Ross. Her intention is to then invite him back (with or without having a fling with someone else first). This period of severance is designed to scare Ross. Force him to realise he COULD lose her, unless he becomes more docile.

The copy-girl throws a wrench in the works - not just because of the natural jealousy, but because she destroys some of the false self-images that were holding the couple together.

She is younger and more sexually assertive than Rachel, breaking her own self-regard as the pinnacle of female desirability. Rachel, although emotionally vulnerable in many areas, has never felt physically insecure. Jealousy, and a feeling of being threatened in this area, are new in her experience.

On the flip side, this young girl actively pursues Ross, treating him as an object of desire. This is also new to Ross - who still sees himself as the dope who was made fun of in school and who married a lesbian. Copy Girl wipes all that away.

This totally flips the power dynamic - now Rachel needs to be appealing to Ross, or face him running off with a younger girl. She cannot handle this, the relationship ends.

Rachel's choices of boyfriends from then on that she is seeking to be "in charge" of the relationship. There is the brainless college boy in S4, Joshua who she dresses up like a doll, Tag who is literally her employee, and Joey who is mentally a child. These reflect Rachel's need to be superior to the men in her life.

Throughout this time, Ross remains the most significant male in her world. This is shown dozens of times. The same is true of Ross, who routinely turns his relationships into mere exercises in making Rachel jealous.

Time apart teaches them to see each other as people rather than ciphers. Ross learns Rachel is a person, not a goddess and Rachel learns Ross is a man, not a puppy.

...

The make or break for me is that when Rachel first says "break", Ross actually understands the purpose of it.

He says, to take some time to cool off. Like, yeah, a break.

But then Rachel says "No, a break from us".

Which sounds a whole lot like break-up.

is that from Leprechaun?

It's from that romcom she was in with Adam Sandler IIRC

>arrested development
is this actually a term outside of the show?

Brilliant. I should save this like the Batman psychoanalysis on Yea Forums but I won't.

there's no such thing as "taking a break". If you're "taking a break" it's over, you're exes. You may get back together but during that period you were exes.

Nah -- there's a difference in going on "break" when someone screws a rando vs. someone that screws their old-friend-who-just-happened-to-be-in-the-neighborhood-while-we-were-on-break. One is a crime of passion and the other was attempting to grant legitimacy to cheating.

Chandler was based though (pre marriage)
Despite a shitty childhood he was successful, rich and got married to the cutest girl from their group.
Based and gellarpilled.
Monica was the best girl. Prime Cox was hot as hell.

That was pretty good. Nice job.

The one thing I'll say in regards to other people's opinions is flip the genders around and see if you think and feel the same way.

>ross thinks rachel wants to shag mark
>rachel gets angry at ross objecting to her spending time with him
>rachel tells ross they should go on a break = "I want to fuck who I want"
>ross leaves, despondently drinks in bar
>ross, showing pure decency, calls rachel to reconcile
>but as soon as ross left rachel called mark round for wine
>ross realises rachel has betrayed him, finally gives in to the slut who he's been resisting valiantly all night
>rachel realises she's being a slut, too late, claims the moral high ground despite every single thing here being her fault

The real question is whether Chandler and Kathy were on a break.

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Ross obviously, he had no empathy for what rachel was going through, constantly belittled and ridiculed fashion. I don't get why people can't see that rachel's "break" wasn't about bieng with other people but getting to work in peace. Ross constantly nagged her, was needy and bitchy. Granted, they should have both accepted mark's situation for what it was: a non-aggressive slowplay which isn't in issue if you see it clearly. Instead Ross saw cucking around every corner and Rachel saw nothing but somebody being a good samaritan. Now that I think about it the thing came out of both of them having a limited life experience in related areas: they were exposed to a limited amount of partners at that time so they should have listened to their whore-ish friends (phoebe and joey) but because they were mostly joke characters it made sense in-universe to not listen to what they were saying. So no-one's fault I guess, unavoidable, should have moved on peacefully to fucking other ppl or continued fucking with each other.

Ross was. At least that he tries to justify it, if he wanted to fuck that girl from the copy place that's okay but he shouldn't expect Rachel to be okay with it. You can't police someones feelings and she didn't feel right being with him when he went and banged some random girl like a minute after they decide to take a break.

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Damn. This is accurate. Solid work user.

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>a minute

Later that evening after rachel invited mark, the object of the row, around for chinese food

Also reminder that Mark literally tells Rachel that Ross was right and pursues her romantically once he's out of the picture. Ross is fully vindicated. Rachel made everything worse by being deliberately obtuse.

Objectively, inarguably Rachel. Only women and white knights disagree

Rachel wasn't romantically pursuing Mark and she's the one that's actually responsible for the relationship. Mark is an outsider, sure it's a dick move to go after a girl that's in a relationship, but it's not Rachels fault that he was. Also nothing happened so it doesn't matter, Ross didn't trust Rachel and if there's no trust in the relationship it's doomed to fail.

You want to know who was truly in the wrong?
Phoebe. Phoebe sucks.

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They weren’t IN a relationship. There is no relationship to value. The second Rachel declares they’re on a break she loses any say whatsoever in how Ross interacts with women. When Ross hooked up with the copy girl, he was a single man. He did not cheat on anyone. He did nothing wrong.

Nigga fuck you lmao dont talk about my kudrow like that

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seek sunlight ya simp

Phoebe was nice in the early seasons. Ditzy , naive but still tough.
Later they made her into an annoying, mean spirited bitch especially when dealing with Chandler.
My theory is that Phoebe secretly liked Chandler but didn't like him hooking up with Monica.

Both were wrong.

Ross was wrong for sleeping with a woman literally five minutes after you "broke up", if you truly love someone you don't do that(only okay if you're like fuck that bitch, i'm better without her). Rachel was wrong for breaking up in the first place.

This exactly.
The on a break question is the best way to screen for crazy girls.

>chandler hooking up with monica
Tag that shit bro i'm not done watching yet

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Rachael is in the wrong for being angry at Ross for sleeping with the photo copy girl.
Ross is in the wrong for not understanding that regardless of them being on a break sleeping with the photo copy girl would understandably.

THE 90'S BORN QUEERS WHO WATCH THIS SHOW FOR TEENAGE GIRLS

You want to go?

I have yet to come across anyone who actually finds Ross relatable or likeable, so Rachel wins by default

>Ross was wrong for sleeping with a woman literally five minutes after you "broke up", if you truly love someone you don't do that
He was upset and angry. Rachel drove him into the arms of another woman.

>have yet to come across anyone who actually finds Ross relatable or likeable,
Find better friends, weirdo

They were on a break, but it doesn't mean immediately fucking someone less than 12 hours into your break was 100% okay for Rosstopher to do. Not cheating though, just maybe a dick move.

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>sleeping with the photo copy girl would understandably.
You're an understandable guy for you

What the fuck it’s Ross and Shawn from Shawn of the dead? Is this a comedy?

>Find better friends, weirdo
think you better check your friends chum, Ross is the biggest cunt on the show by a fair margin

You for watching the Virgin Friends instead of the Chad Seinfeld.