Is lobotomizing a serial killer morally wrong?

No they went too far. They ripped all power and happiness from the people they claimed to be protecting, and because humans naturally chafe under that lifestyle they were beginning to protect, and the Justice Lords were cracking down on them harder and harder - they'd taken everything but the people's safety and in the end took even that. Plus there was clearly a level of deep corruption of the law considering businesses were apparently unencroachable by citizens, even for legitimate grievances.

That is literally how the law works.

Lobotomies are always morally wrong. Like, shit, just execute the guy or something, don't turn him into a vegetable.

>If you kill him you'll be just like him!
>But turning him into a barely sentient vegetable incapable of forming coherent thoughts is okay

>Before he's lobotomized, Joker leaves himself a mixtapes of his "greatest hits", which he's allowed to keep for entertainment, but in reality it's a coded set of instructions to follow for Loboto-Joker to keep on committing crimes and pull gags, his "greatest hits of crime". Joker's no longer in control of himself, just a puppet whose strings are being pulled by the ghost of his own former self. Batman stops him and destroys the tape of course, but the stinger would reveal a secret recording studio where Harley and Joker's gangs had decades worth of material recorded to play for him on live radio broadcast.

>not raping them until they're mind-broken
You're slipping up, Commissioner.

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I wanted to see more lobotomized Batman villains

Maybe, but what about regular electroshock therapy? Does that reduce violent tendencies, or just anxiety? I'm not a psychologist.

People do not lose their rights when they commit murder. They are still allowed counsel and a fair speedy trial.

I dunno, turning utterly repugnant and irredeemable psychopaths like the Joker into some sort of zombie-like creature is a bit fucked up. Just put a bullet in their head and dump them in a ditch somewhere.

Not that guy, but would that be because they are innocent until proven guilty? Once you’re found guilty of murder what rights do you have? Like they straight up kill you in some states once you’re convicted, it doesn’t seem like you have a right to much if anything at that point

I don’t know. On paper, it doesn’t sound like shocking people is helpful.

Lobotomizing them is better than killing them because they’re being forced into becoming constructive members of society. In some cases it’s practically torture for them like Ivy being the gardener of Arkham

Even inmates have rights. It’s why guards are not allowed to beat them.

I beg to differ.

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>is lobotomizing a serial killer morally wrong?
Yes because by leaving the killer alive you are taking money from normal people to feed, house, wash and clothe him, and he can't even do work to help compensate the cost. The moral thing to do is kill him.

And you aren't writing for DC because...?

Some serial killers become Christians and shit in the slammer

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Capital punishment is wrong. Destroying a human being's personhood and leaving them a husk to be taken care of for the rest of their life is justice.

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Unpopular opinion: no. In my dream Batman movie, Joker shows himself to be completely irredeemeable and Bruce uses his social standing to make sure Joker gets lobotomized in the end and funds his caretaking.

No it isn't, because there's nothing they can do that a normal functioning member of society can't do. They've absolved any sense of "self" when they decided to kill a bunch of kids and use their skin as book covers. Kill them and get it over with, I don't want money to go towards keeping people like them fed, bedded, and clothed. This should only apply to the worst of the worst, of course, the purpose of any system is to rehabilitate as many people as possible, serial killers and the like don't deserve that.

Bleeding heart faggots, certain people deserve to die

In the case of the joker though i feel this is warranted, i mean im of the opinion batman should just kill him but this and raping him works too.

It's wrong in that it tasks an otherwise productive member of society with caring for the lobotomized. That caregivers time could be better invested elsewhere.

Just fuckin ice him.

Yes its morally wrong they are alive while their victims lie dead. Only moral decision would be the death penalty.

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This happened to Stan Berkowitz, The Son of Sam.
He become a Born Again Christian and now calls himself The Son of Hope. He writes apology letters to the realtives of his victims

I hope hes faking it, born agains disgust me, i have more respect for him if he was still a murderous sociopath.

There’s a simple answer for them. Quick drop and a sudden stop.

>All these these retards saying it’s wrong
Outside of killing them which is better there’s nothing wrong with this whatsoever

>I don't want money going towards keeping people like them fed, bedded, and clothed
Due to the judiciary system it costs 18 times more to kill a person than keep them alive.

The US had a proud and rich culture of social eugenics and lobotimization that have been lost to us.

Take my money.

I hate american politics

No.

obviously because it's a good and cool idea.

yes. because if it's the joker and you succeed, you're probably just lobotomising some guy who's been joker gassed into looking just like him. most likely, your boss, your dad, or the mayor.

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you suddenly add a very very solid reason for why Batman won't kill him.

You think Professor Zoom has been helping Joker out?

source please

Sauce?

isn't that exactly what the Indigo Tribe does
Only with lantern bullshit instead of braim surgery

At the end of No Man's Land Gordon shot Joker in the leg, with Joker commenting that he'll probably never walk again because of it. He got better.

what's wrong with you

Yeah, that's exactly the sort of cop out they'd use if this happened.

Superman did it one time

but that's the main downside of vigalante justice and dispensing with judge and jury. you could get the wrong guy. and the where are you?

>Bruce uses his social standing to make sure Joker gets lobotomized in the end and funds his caretaking.

I love this idea, seems very "Batman" to me. Like Batman is so fucked in the head that he won't break his rules by killing The Joker but lobotomizing him is an acceptable alternative cuz it's not killing. And then he funds a mental ward that genuinely cares for and attempts to rehabilitate Joker because batman is only trying to help him.

I don't see the problem

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>what's wrong with you
I went to catholic school growing up so im not too fond of jesus freaks

imgur.com/a/f84vY/

It's dumb. What's the point of the no kill rule, in that case? You can turn a guy into a mindless automaton through surgery; how is that morally better than killing him?

Batman isnt about logical morality, hes a crazy thanatophobe who wants to stop everyone from dying because he saw his parents get shot.

Why not just kill them instead?

>lobotomize every DC villain on Earth
>no more death
>world peace eternal

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With Joker, it's definitely more practical, now he has the potential to become a somewhat productive member of society at least.

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Waste of time and money. And inhumane.
Just use Dr. Gun.

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Trips of truth.

You have no humanity then. Holy shit.

More like waste of trips.

>Harvey Dent still manages to function with half a brain
>now he's 100% good

Has the Joker ever been an Indigo Lantern? That seems like it was made for the exact kind of person he is.

No it's completely retarded that you could get the wrong guy in a world where people like Martian Manhunter exist.
Just get MM and Zatanna to make sure you have the right person.

b-but that's not humane! it's better to just throw villains in jail so they can break out again

thank you

>went to catholic school
I love the irony that catholic schools just make people hate Catholicism, instead of making any of them catholic.

Ah, so you're one of the retards that doesn't get the character. Carry on.

This happened in one of the short stories in The Further Adventures of the Joker novel.

Marilyn Manson went to a Catholic school and hes totally religious.

lol

>An idea so perverse and depraved that SHIELD had no choice but to accept and implement it within the week, completely unbeknownst to the government or superhero communities.
Never read this comic, but how close did I get?

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>guards are not allowed to beat them
It's the best part of the job.

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>Once you’re found guilty of murder what rights do you have?
There's this little thing against cruel and unusual punishment. And I'd say driving a spike into your brain, rendering you either a retard or a vegetable, falls under that.

>The guy you've placed in charge of lobotomy has decided since Plastic Man is a former criminal who still feels kleptomaniac tendencies, he should be lobotomized just to be on the safe side
>Green Arrow, who was already strongly opposed to this idea, says enough is fucking enough and throws down the gauntlet
>Now authorities have rounded up Oliver to lobotomize him too
>Black Canary won't stand for this shit and breaks her hubby out of jail, but due to the guards mishandling the situation dozens of lobotomized supervillains are freed and fall under the sway of Lex Luthor, who begins using them as his kill squads to wage war.
>Your authorities continue wasting resources pursuing Black Canary and Green Arrow despite the greater threat, because they have not yet been lobotomized and are thus the greater threat.
>It turns out YOU CAN'T FUCKING LOBOTOMIZE PLASTIC MAN, so he joins them too along with the entire Justice Society of America, who have stood by and watched this perversion of justice go on long enough
>Suddenly half the superhero community is rebelling against your botched project, Lex Luthor is a greater danger than ever before, and even the guys who support your plan refuse to go against their friends and teammates.
Have fun with your new Crisis Event, retard.

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if you kill, you remove yourself from the paradigm of morality, and are therefore no longer entitled to ethical treatment. fuck him.
>inb4 muh subjugator / punished equivalency
don't even start brainlets

And people wonder why they're stupid.

the whole 'should superheroes kill' debate wouldn't be a thing if they were punished properly.

This.

lobotomized poison ivy was pretty cute

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>justifying lobotomy on any human being
Absolutely sick.

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JFK's father had his sister lobotomized.

yes

how?! how does it cost that much more to just shoot one bullet (or just starve them to death) or twist their neck rather than to keep feeding them, I don't know what prisons do with dead bodies but like come on

Why not just kill him?

wouldn't her brain eventually heal up

100% on the mark.

Sounds like it'd be a fun ride for an alternate Earth story, honestly.

Not all of them apparently

Does she have a healing factor?

For someone like the Joker No. For Ted bundy Types it would be a waste of money, and would just be easier to kill him

>non-existent nowadays
actually lobotomies do still happen, it's usually for a very specific reason though

No

/thread

>this thread

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It’s due to the man-hour costs from processing appeals; the evidence considered might all point to him deserving the execution but it still needs to be looked over, researched, and processed which requires a lot of billable hours. It’s still a better system than immediate execution because there are innocent people on death row, a case that stuck with me was a father that got accused of burning his kids alive in a satanic ritual. The prosecution brought it up because the fire trails, which were incorrectly identified as being due to an accelerant, were in a vaguely pentagram-like shape. The guy got put on death row and then executed on the governor’s orders in spite of a fire expert testifying and physically recreating the burn pattern, showing it was due to a faulty space heater and the placement of the windows which directed fire in the shape when they burst and sucked in air along that pathway.

It isn't Batman's or any superhero's place to kill, you can't be judge jury and executioner(unless you're Judge Dredd, but he's sanctioned by the government). Logically it would be best to kill them, writing wise it isn't obviously, and in world reasoning should really just be that.

Might as well fucking kill em

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>if you kill
Finally, I can kill those homeless vets. Now they won't suffer. Also fuck those self defense laws. Killed a mugger? Time for the chair.
>don't start
Then make a more nuisance stance rather then "punish bad people" unless you think there are people who are advocating for serial killers to get a pass.

What if you mind wiped the joker, turned him into a baby, and dropped him into the lap of Batman? Kind of like a punishment for letting him live that long

This user knows his shit.

What if people became literal outlaws again?
People outside the protection of the law and thus vulnerable to mob/vigilante justice?
Happen to know how many death-row inmates turn out to be innocent? Just interested in the statistics.

jesus just kill them at that point

You know they could've fucked up the supervillains and left the citizens alone. The slope isn't THAT slippery.

He was specifically asking about the scenario shown in the episode, where they did not leave the citizens alone. Your comment is irrelevant.

Who cares?

google.com/amp/s/time.com/79572/more-innocent-people-on-death-row-than-estimated-study/?amp=true

the justice lords did nothing wrong

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Indigo Tribe does it all the time

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Morals are just a construct invented by society to prevent undesirable (Read:Independent) thoughts from tainting and uprooting a pathetic and delicate system. In a perfect world everyone can kill who they want, and take what they want so long as they have the power necessary to keep it all.

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Ew it’s a gamer

bro even at the time lobotomies were considered crazy.

Even if you factor in a healing factor, Supes' lobotomy method lobotomizes AND cauterizes the wound at the same time, which would essentially prevent healing

If you scraped away the then scar tissue then would it heal over to pre-lobotomy?

Hmm, good question. Then it becomes a fresh wound again. Issue is doing it without killing her first. Assuming Ivy has a healing factor, I doubt its Wolverine tier, which means you'd have to perform brain surgery such a way as NOT to leave her braindead

>tfw never lobotomize a cute girl
>or be lobotomized by one
god lobotomies are fucking hot. why do they make my dick so hard?

Injustice for all

Because when you lobotomize someone, they essentially become a living doll. It basically means user that you have automataphilia

The lobotomized supervillainesses could even serve the community at the local brothel to atone for their sins. A fitting end for their kind!

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Shut up, Cadmus

Congratulations, you have some things in common with Jeffrey Dahmer (he attempted to lobotomize his victims).

In Under the Red Hood they mention that Batman's beaten Joker to the point of being put in a full body cast at least once.

Lobotomize Univdrse when?

The "y Batman/Superman no kill?" thing gets super boring when you realize it only exists because comics companies want to use the same villains for a hundred years so they have to invent a universe where the most maximum security facilities in the world are somehow unable to keep a non-superhuman clown contained for more than a week. And we're also supposed to assume that not only will Batman not kill, there's no police officers who'll decide it's about time for the Joker to "resist arrest" if you know what I mean.

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are you calling the joker a human being?

>the fucking puppet

The issue with not killing off the most heinous supervillains at some point stops lying with the vigilantes and more with the system itself. Honestly, if the system is so inept that bad guys keep getting loose and committing mass murder, then the stories where a superhero becomes the head of a new government and goes full draconian gain some legitimacy. If it's the system's fault, someone has to reform it, superhero or not.

It's just like my grim and gritty comics where unchecked authority is inherently corrupt, except there's no superheroes to save the day.

Obviously we need to give an unaccountable bureaucracy even more power to lock up and mindfuck scapegoats because otherwise I might have to accept that we live in a world where sometimes bad people do bad things and some of those bad people work for the government. How can I ever go on living if society doesn't ramp up its oppression just to hide its imperfections and sanctify the delusion that people with badges are morally superior to everyone else.

Don't even get me started on the persecution of pedo priests. It was absolutely horrific. How can I blindly believe in a feel good faith-based ideology if the religious authorities are actually held to any standards of humanity and accountability. We should've long since brought back witch-burning to deal with such morally repugnant heretics, heathens and nonbelievers, amirite?

Nope. It's better everyone IMO since you can use the lobotomized criminals as free labor while sending a very strong deterrent to any potential lawbreakers.

I'm not into dolls, though. I think it's because it's essentially the most horrific thing you could do to someone, in my mind. You are literally destroying a piece of who they are as a person, and making them into some less-than-human retard in the process. And it's completely, and utterly, permanent.
Oh, I know all about Dahmer. I read about him before I knew I had this fetish; I remember that reading about how he poured boiling water and injected acid into the brains of his victims made my dick get a bit tingly, but it took something else for me to realize I had a fetish for it.
I remember there was some Australian horror movie I watched once, I can't remember the name anymore, but it was about this geeky psycho chick and her dad kidnapping boys she thinks are cute but won't date her. When she decides they aren't perfect enough, she drills a hole in their forehead and pours boiling water into it to basically cook their brains and turn them into vegetables. When she was describing what it was going to do the guy she was about to do it to, I literally had to pause the movie and jack off to completion right then. I jacked off again, even harder, when it showed the other guys she had lobotomized in the past and was keeping in her basement.

Unless they're going full "Batman has a phobia of people getting killed", it's because Batman wants the legal system to be the ones to decide if Joker dies. He doesn't want to start being the one to decide who lives and who dies.

I could see some incarnation of Batman deciding that Bruce Wayne is allowed to try to talk the courts into it, as long as he doesn't do it as Batman (he's testified on behalf of Harvey Dent before, so it's not like he's ever been above influencing the court).

Soon they will be arresting innocent people, blaming shit on them for free labour.

Oh wait, that already happens

So I don't understand why you're still bitching about it.