Could he beat Superman?

Current one punched the World Forger and destroyed his anvil that he makes universes on.

Darkseid’s Omega Beams kinda do the same thing though.

Right, but that seems to require ki control, which Supes obviously lacks.

Omega Beams is just plot device vision.
>see: them sending Batman back in time

Better question, would Superman be able to forge and maintain an amicable relationship with Beerus?

Beerus' destroy ability ought to be able to effortlessly disintegrate pretty much anything.

And I guess if he gets annoyed or bored enough, he'd just destroy the solar system and then Superman would basically lose his battery.

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No way in hell, Beerus is just a spoiled brat who does whatever he wants because no one is there to stop him.

>batman
X gon give it to ya

They’re actually better than Hakai due to being able to recreate what they destroy.

>yeah but mortals can shrug off divine abilities if they're powerful enough, as was shown with Frieza and Vegeta

I'm sorry, what? When did Frieza and Vegeta get hit by the destroy ability? I'm pretty sure Jiren can't do that shit.

In the manga adaptation, Goku was almost capable of mimicking the ability against fused Zamasu, but it didn't work because the ability got cancelled halfway through and Zamasu regenerated his mostly destroyed body.

That's the only other time I remember someone other than Beerus using that ability.

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The problem with the DB franchise is that there's a lot of stuff that isn't defined or even properly planned. Toriyama was asked about Goku fighting Beerus in Earth's atmosphere and if Goku was able to breathe in space. He didn't even know and then Toyotaro clarified it just recently. We don't even have an official name for Frieza's race.

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Nope.
Yeah just like Darkseid. Doesn't work.

I think Toffee used it on Frieza and all that happened was him turning back into his original final form

In the manga, Beerus is weaker than Buu, according to Old Kai.

I find the anime pretty hard to watch. Do you know if that scene was in the manga adaptation?

Depends on which superman we talking about.

I already said current.

Also, who the fuck is Toffee? I can't find any reference to this character?

Yeah, well, we know that doesn't make any kind of sense.

The character that’s super strong but is the fake out for Jirens “surprise” strength

Nope, and Superman would beat the ever-living shit out of him, because Beerus, an asshole god of destruction that genocides entire planets for no real reason, would offend Superman's strong sense of morality. Beerus is basically Brainiac but worse in Superman's eyes. Unlike Goku, he would never be able to get along with Beerus and would not rest until he's stopped, he'd be fucking pissed off.

Wait, so Superman's "vulnerable to magic" but is impervious to divine intervention? Comic books are bullshit.

Do...do you mean Toppo maybe? The fat guy with moustache? In the same outfit as Jiren?

Top hit bot Frieza and Vegeta with Hakai and they shrugged it off

Oooh you mean Toppo. That's only in the anime. He's stronger in the manga but doesn't have those powers so he gets taken out a lot easier. The ToP arc was rushed to keep up with the anime. The whole handling of Super was a mess. Toriyama gave the same notes to Toei for the anime and Toyotaro for the manga and they both ended up with different versions of Toriyama's notes. So now we have the manga forging ahead and the anime hasn't be announced, likely to avoid the same problems from happening again.

That’s like saying god ki is just plot device energy. Besides you can apparently overpower hakai energy in it’s non-fully mastered if Vegeta vs Toppo was any indicator. Which may or may not explain why Jiren is stronger than a guy who should be able to wink him out of existence.

But I mean, I don’t think Darkseid is a good example when every time I’ve seen them fight I’ve always thought Darkseid should’ve ended the fight in seconds by telefragging Superman into a black hole.

That's a good point. Goku and the gang may be sociopaths that don't mind hanging out with unrepentant mass murderers that fully intend to commit more mass murder, but Superman would never stand for it.

Vegeta’s never really talked about any of the planets he massacred under Frieza’s command, has he? Be surprised if he even remembers which species he slew.

Beerus just doesn't stick out compared to the usual Superman or Justice League villain. Even the whole "destroys planets" thing isn't that big of a deal compared to the real heavy hitters that Superman has faced.

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Beerus can just destroy Dork-Sinead too.

Be fair, a LOT of the cosmic worldenders Superman has fought conveniently fail to use their reality warping powers to yeet the big strong flying man they logically should have been able to. Darkseid, Mageddon and the Anti-Monitor aside, I’m still bothered about the time Superman fought Mordru and Mordru didn’t instantly turn him into a duck.

The Super anime is a fucking nightmare of nonsense.

I had to look up the Frieza scene. So he cops a hit of this Hakai shit and it just reverts him back to his normal perfect form.

I've got a couple points that are maybe worth making, although I think it's generally pointless to debate the anime shit.
>If memory serves me right, there's meant to be a No Kill rule to this tournament. Maybe Toppo toned it down on purpose to abide by the rules.
>It's not displayed the same way as Beerus's version of the attack. Beerus simply extends a hand, says "Destroy" and his target disintegrates to dust/sand. There's no energy ball.
So maybe Toppo doesn't have a perfected version of this ability.

But in actual fact, Super is a completely inconsistent piece of shit anime.

I've been following the next arc in the manga and it's not very interesting. Some random ram-themed wizard guy who can absorb life energy to make himself strong.

And some fucking random Space Patrol guy like Jaco is effortlessly at least as strong as SSJ3 Goku without even attempting to powerup

Making Super was a mistake. The whole series should have ended after Perfect Cell.

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He can't be erased from reality. The Source protects him from it.

He can, however, be beaten to death or otherwise murdered. Source doesn't give a shit about that, it just won't let him be erased, because he's somehow "necessary".

But then you have Superman's intelligence and ingenuity in beating much stronger opponents. He's been shown very capable of using an opponent's strengths against them and outsmarting them.

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>spoiler
His gun, you mean. His gun is strong enough to bitch ToP level fighters. Just like some random goat wizard who missed all the events of Dragonball can surpass those two SSBs by absorbing energy near them

>The Source protects him from it
Wait what? Since when? How is that reconciled with all the Perpetua shit and the revelation that all multiverses are subject to it’s judgement and destroyed if they aren’t justice enough?

>The whole series should have ended after Perfect Cell
It's a shonen dude. Each villain gets stronger than the last. Sure, rewriting the Buu saga would've been great, but Super and even GT has some good stuff in-between things like bad animation or retcons.

DBS never takes itself seriously, it's all for fun. Just like the ToP was a kid's entertainment show for Zeno.

Zeno is basically a representation of the fans.

Pretty much
He's much more bareable in the manga

Reminder that eventhough Goku is more powerful, Superman is more bullshit, so...
Bullshittery > Power
youtube.com/watch?v=M0YgR_YXjfI

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Nah, mate. It's not just the gun.
In the manga, he spars with Goku. Goku can't lay a finger on him up to SSJ3. Goku's power is literally destroying the room while the random dude has full access to his power in his most base state.

Goku thinks he's just doing an ultra instinct thing all the time.

Zeno is a total retard child so I'd say you're probably not wrong.

Zeno is a fucking mosnter in the manga who would've let literally anyone run roughshod over the multiverse with zero care if they won the ToP.

Say what you want about the anime, but it's version of Zeno as basically being a nicer Presence is by far the best interpretation.

Current Superman survived weaponized hypertime in Action Comics 1000.

What's wrong with Goku finding someone whose stronger than him. Broly, Beerus,and Jiren weren't complaints. They are all stronger in their base form.
The Jaco lookalike is no surprise to me, he might as well be untouchable in a fight against Jiren. Cue stronger villain and rival because shonen rules.

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But what about the space prisoners who are stronger than SS3?

Manga Zamasu Arc >>> Anime Zamasu Arc

Isn’t Beerus like a Galactus situation? He has to do it?

Yes and no. He almost destroyed Earth because of a prophecy

Jiren already surpassed time. Just like Goku surpassed Guldo's time freeze and Hit's time skip.

Even Jon can surpass time stop. It’s not hard.
What a dick

In the newest arc of the manga it shows that 20 years on he's pretty guilt-stricken with how he treated the Namekians during the Freiza arc.

Since like the 80's I think, the point is he can't be erased, but he can be physically killed. So hakai is simply useless.

Beerus' entire philosophy in destroying planets is
>If the food sucks, he'll destroy the planet
That planet being slated for destruction is just an added perk

>Is a god.
>prophecies are from gods.
I'm very sure Beerus wrote the prophecy himself or is fulfilling another gods wishes.

>Goku is more powerful
False.

The whole Battle of the gods started because of an old prophecy that a Super Saiyan God could be able to destroy a GoD
If it was never brought up Beerus' would've never went to Earth in the first place, let alone know about it
And what saved Earth was it's food

How so?

Brian DON'T!

Sort of. Its potentially part of his job, but he mostly just blows shit up that pisses him off in some manner rather than what he is supposed to do. That or he acts like a lazy shit. He and Supreme Kai also don't really collaborate either and that's part of the reason why the 7th Universe is next to bottom tier according to Grand Priest

>A literal God of Destruction
>A flying boy scout that dies when exposed to rocks FROM HIS ORIGIN PLANET

You tell me bruh.

I know, that poor god of destruction, never stood a chance.

I'm not watching some whiny voiced autist's video because you're too lazy to make your own point.

Seems like Superman’s got enough leeway to kick his ass.

Based.

>That or he acts like a lazy shit.
This is really important since he ends up sleeping through years at a time, leaving shit to basically go wild
He was awake during planet Vegeta pre-Frieza but was basically asleep straight until recently. He didn't even know Frieza was dead, let alone Majin Buu was awakened

Personally, I see it this way...
Goku and gang have been training pretty much all their lives. Sometimes they do a 1 day = 1 year hyperbolic time chamber to boost even further than normal.

Then there's Frieza who trains for 4 months and invalidates all that progress. That's what I call bullshit.

I don't mind Buu because he was a magical entity created to be all powerful.
I don't mind Cell because he had to travel back in time and also was designed to absorb the androids.
I find the designs of Jiren and Toppo incredibly boring, but whatever. I can buy that people from other universes are as strong as they are.

Ram guy hasn't had much backstory and fills like a filler villain.

The Space Patrol guy is also just unreasonably strong for no good reason.

World Eater Morro at least has an excuse for him power being maximum since he eats planets and basically drains energy from all living things
Space Patrol Luluco dude makes absolutely no sense

Here's the thing about Morro, why doesn't the old Kai just seal him, he has magic powers because of his fusion same as Buu but didn't lose his divine energy unlike Buu.

One thing I've noticed is that Goku fucking sucks at fighting stronger enemies. At best he holds his own but most all the time he's getting his ass beat until someone helps him and/or he gets a power up that makes him stronger.

yes, well that's the problem with DBZ at the end as well, instead of Goku learning new fighting techniques he just gets a power boost, it was a huge problem with GT because he was just straight up stagnant until 4 and then 4 was a huge letdown, then with Super he gets power ups that make no sense and the rules change all the time.

He should be going back to learning new techniques at least this Morro arc is eluding to someone learning some new skills.

>Seth has gone full tsundere and started begging to be let onto the research team

Pfhahahahaha what the fuck, how was Buu even a threat and why didn’t they step on Frieza

Yeah that's the thing. Jaco is terrified of Frieza when in reality, the whole time they had an agent on their Patrol team who could have destroyed Frieza's entire empire within a matter of days.

They're not even trying.

Huh, he really does doesn’t he? It doesn’t help that he has a bad, bad habit of enjoying fights too much to want to start out sandbagging to get a feel for his opponent before whipping out his greatest hits. You can tell Jiren was a challenge simply because he started resorting to actual strategy right before he finished mastering Blanco.

Meanwhile Android 17 the real MVP here got the ACTUAL first significant hit on Jiren apparently just by aiming where he wasn’t guarding (even though Jiren “being on guard against attacks” just looks like Jiren noselling a direct hit so...he flexes? Ki flexes?) and later uses forcefields to bring down a weakened Jiren.

You know people always talk about Goku vs Superman, but considering in RoF one random Frieza mook nearly brought down Goku with a pew pew laser gun from behind you know who would really wreck face there? Green Lantern. Any of them, even Jessica or Baz.

>Meanwhile Android 17 the real MVP here got the ACTUAL first significant hit on Jiren apparently just by aiming where he wasn’t guarding (even though Jiren “being on guard against attacks” just looks like Jiren noselling a direct hit so...he flexes? Ki flexes?) and later uses forcefields to bring down a weakened Jiren.
I had theory to explain this. Jiren is just like everyone else in that he's a glass cannon. If you get him while he's not paying attention you can hurt him because he's not built up his ki to protect him. So how do you do that? No ki to detect but also by being fast enough to counter it. Hit has time stop and is fast but he has ki so his attack was sensed by Jiren. 17 is on par with ssj blue and he has no ki to detect. So what you have is a moment where Jiren lets his guard down and has no time to react. I think Jiren's speed is significantly lower than his strength so if he's not upping his power and takes it easy for a second then someone can get the drop on him. This is also shown when Frieza tackled him from behind. Jiren got hit but it didn't do him damage.

Yeah the most damning evidence against Goku was made canon by Toriyama himself. Nobody is invulnerable and have to reinforce their bodies with ki and create barriers to take hits. Superman can be taking a nap next to a nuke that goes off and he'll at worst get hurt pretty badly but shake it off after a while. Goku taking a nap would be obliterated.

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You got that backwards. Pew pew laser will wipe the floor with the JL. It's not Goku getting weaker, it's enemies getting stronger. If you take a random enemy like Broly and shove him to the front of Dragon Ball Super, he WILL be stronger than everyone before him.

I still remember the chat threads when it was SS1 vs Superman. And because defeating Frieza = most powerful in the universe back then, Goku was thought to be WAY stronger.

It’s more Goku letting his guard down

Oh christ. That was such a fucking stupid moment.
It'd be one thing if it was a surprise Frieza beam, but it was just a run of the mill standard shitty laser gun that would normally not phase anyone in the Z roster at all. It's not even a Ki attack.

The whole "letting his guard down" thing is atrocious.
Most of the Z characters should be bulletproof at all times. Their muscles are superhuman in nature. Otherwise Vegeta wouldn't bother with insane gravity training. If Vegeta's asleep and someone shoots him in the chest, the bullets should bounce off.

>But Krillen hurt an unprepared Goku with a rock!
I think that's just Toriyama making a joke. He puts a lot of dumb shit jokes in his work which contradicts what should be possible.

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Bump

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Not much need to bump anymore, mate.
Can Beerus physically beat Superman? Probably not because Superman is broken as fuck, as we've established many times.

Can Beerus beat Superman if he gets annoyed and blows up the sun? Probably, yes.

Can Beerus beat Superman if he uses Hakai or Destroy? Maybe, maybe not because Darkseid something something divine.

As long as a yellow sun is in play and there's no kryptonite, Superman pretty much wins all fights outside of a couple magic bullshit scenarios.

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