Why does Yea Forums seem to hate Mark Waid so much...

>moorefag hates someone that writes wholesome superhero comics
gee who would have thought

>DD in particular was BY FAR the worst run ever on that character
it's cute when people who know fuck all about comics pretend that they do

Anti SJWs aka fake comic book fans who know very little about comic books tend to hate the guy cuz he’s talked shit about them.

Kingdom Come
Flash
JLA
Superman: Birthright
Daredevil
Irredeemable/Incorruptible

He’s written some top tier stuff. Kingdom Come and Irredeemable/Incorruptible in particular show he has a better understanding of superheroes than most out there.

Nah it’s near the top tier of DD runs because his run actually stands out in style (not 24/7 grimdark like all the other Miller/Bendis/Brubaker classics) and substance (very creative scenarios for the character.)

>Superman: Birthright
never was too crazy about this one desu. out of all the available superman origins (man of steel, secret identity, morrison AC, superman year one [currently ongoing]) I think I like it the least. doesn't help that lenil yu is on pencils. really dislike that guy's art

>He might be the writer that undestood the superhero genre better than anyone else.
>Mark Waid
That's a really weird way of spelling "Otto Binder".

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>secret identity
er, meant to say secret origin

Kingdom Come is shit.

>Kingdom Come
>JLA
>Superman: Birthright
Those weren't good.
>Kingdom Come and Irredeemable/Incorruptible in particular show he has a better understanding of superheroes than most out there.
You got to be kidding me. KC shows you he doesn't anything about the characters. Much less Superman that he sees as being Mr. Always Perfect.

His JLA:Year One, Fantastic Four and Captain America were also all very good. In fact, I don't remember ever reading a bad comic by Waid.

total machild sperg
peaked awhile ago
SJW panderer
feeds trolls

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Agree. Waid is just a name on the front of the book that guarantees quality. It might not be a masterpiece, but it'll never be bad. He's a first rate second class writer.

>Much less Superman that he sees as being Mr. Always Perfect.
Sometimes i wonder how KC would have turned out had Ross done the book the way he wanted, instead of having to fight Waid every step of the way.

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Then you never read his Incredible Hulk or the back half of his Daredevil run

Idk my dudes I feel it gets to the point while doing good on portraying the themes. I think it’s second only to the four panels in ASS, but ASS is kinda in its own tier.
You clearly either skimmed, didn’t get, or didn’t read Kingdom Come if you really came out of it thinking Supes is perfect considering a big part of what’s mentioned in the first few pages is the dude giving up.

I read both. I wouldn't describe either as bad. The Hulk run that immediately preceded Waid which was by Aaron was bad.

It's like the idiot who said Waid's DD was the "worst ever" when it was immediately preceded by fucking Diggle's crap. At least PRETEND you know about more than 5 comics

>You clearly either skimmed, didn’t get, or didn’t read Kingdom Come if you really came out of it thinking Supes is perfect considering a big part of what’s mentioned in the first few pages is the dude giving up.
That only happened because of Ross, not Waid, and even then to Waid Superman only mistake in the book was giving up and that was mostly the humans' fault. Not really Superman's.

This. His Doctor Strange is cash. His only recent dud was Champions but that's forgiven now that Zub did well by them. His Captain America was decent but too nostalgic, and Ant-Man & The Wasp was bananas.

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He killed Ice… he deserves to burn for all the eternity

Also wait, did you seriously call his Strange one of the worst runs in history? After Aaron and Cates shat on it? Holy shit.

Impulse was fun but you can see signs of "how do you do fellow kids" even back then.

I read that shit when it was coming out. His DD peaked with Ikari, it was all downhill from there.

>Kingdom Come
Ruined Superman and Wonder Woman forever.
>JLA
Ruined Batman forever.

That's enough for me.

>ruined forever
you hyperbolic retards are good for 1 thing: a hearty laugh

>He might be the writer that undestood the superhero genre better than anyone else.
They key word there is understood. His current work isn't anywhere near his best.

He also seems to have decided to become a vocal left-wing crank and burnt a lot of professional bridges by being an asshole.

I nothinged him until all that shit about how much of a fag he acts leaked out. I still don't think much of him. Him being the way he is doesn't stop me from enjoying when he used to put out but it does make me disinterested in his future prospects. Especially given that Humanity First has yet to impress me.

Kingdom Come is literally mostly him reeeing at a part of superheroes he doesn't understand for 100 odd pages.

Yea Forums is generally really fucking bad at separating art from artist. Probably because most of you don't actually give a shit about art on any sort of level. But Yea Forums, man Yea Forums is worse than any of them. Worse than Yea Forums, worse than Yea Forums, Yea Forums, Yea Forums, whatever. You people can't even talk about the art of a comic. You'll go on about why a comic is good or bad and not even mention the art, in a visual fucking medium. It's maddening.

He's a legit sperg and it can get annoying and he has lost all ability to write anyone younger than 30 believably but as long as he's in his element he's a steady hand for sure

After he shoehorned his Trayvon-related asspain into his Daredevil run, I'll never buy something with his name on it ever again.

A combination of his crazy unstable behaviour being more public and him being involved in some random retard youtuber drama.

Care to explain your reasoning?

>My Superman is infallible
Why do Superfags think that Superman should be like this, it's really creepy.

>He's a legit sperg and it can get annoying and he has lost all ability to write anyone younger than 30 believably but as long as he's in his element he's a steady hand for sure
To be fair, this is a lot of old people.

>(DD in particular was BY FAR the worst run ever on that character)
Stop pretending that you read comics.

>is different
>so it’s automatically good
People like you disgust me

Because you're creepy

THE PUNISHER IS A VILLAIN, WHY WILL NOBODY BELIEVE ME?!

Jeff Parker > Waid

The book clearly has him be in the wrong until he unquits. Even the way he reacts in the last part of the book is juxtaposed with his reaction to normal ppl in the beginning. Supes has too much growth in the book to ever come off as infallible.
Very few superhero books ever take into account psyche of the characters through the events they go through the way Kingdom Come does though. Post time skip Magog being a perfect example of that.

Messner-Loebs might be the writer that understood the superhero genre better than anyone because he wrote the best Flash and Wonder Woman stories, two characters who have gotten 99% crap since

That’s why I said style and substance. I hope you don’t read your comics this halfassed, you would be missing out on a lot!

>Much less Superman that he sees as being Mr. Always Perfect.
He believes that Superman should be always perfect, but his beliefs weren't forced into the story. As this post's image points out Superman made a lot of mistakes in KC

Ever since KC Superman is portrayed as this all powerful hero who's fault by being too indecisive until he's given shit by the rest of the trinity. Meanwhile Wonder Woman is nothing but this ruthless and blood-lusted barbarian who thinks the end justify the means.
Ever since JLA Batman is portrayed as an arrogant who knows best and spends all his time devising ways to kill all his friends, and that no matter how many times his misguided plans blow up in his face never learn the lesson or excuse his behavior.
Not to mention that ever since KC the trinity dynamic started to revolve all around Superman with Batman and Wonder Woman just being there to give Superman crap in order to motivate him.

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>Supes has too much growth in the book to ever come off as infallible.
Because of Ross. Now look up Waid's opinion on it.

It just sounds more like you only read Infinite Crisis rather than any other comics that came after lmao

The whole period leading up and Infinite Crisis, almost the entirety of the New 52, several Elseworlds that followed. How much do you think is enough?

>Very few superhero books ever take into account psyche of the characters through the events they go through the way Kingdom Come does though. Post time skip Magog being a perfect example of that.
The only psych that mattered in the book was that of Superman, everyone are mere plot devices to push him forward. They've very little characterization or even reason for existing. For example all the Justice Leaguers stopped being heroes and went bad merely because Superman wasn't there to guide them. The world-building is very shoddy. Shit is full of contrivances. Even Magog blames all his shit on Superman.

>Ever since JLA Batman is portrayed as an arrogant who knows best and spends all his time devising ways to kill all his friends
Nah, this is Miller's and Morrison's doing.

No, that's Waid's JLA run. Tower of Babel.

Imagine thinking Said Strange is bad. He was one of the first in a while to get back to Strange just being...strange and different than everyone. This entire Galactus arc has been fucking awesome.

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Threatening comic shops and small publishers. He gives off a lot of hate.

Basically G. Willow Wilson without the tits.

He's liberal and outspoken and it pisses the tourists off.

Miller started the trend of portraying Batman as a renegade that got into odds with other heroes while Morrison turned Batman into the master of all keikaku in his JLA run. Tower of Babel was just the logical conclusion of what Miller and Morrison started.

never meet your heroes on twitter

Shut the fuck up Waid.

Hes fine but not the best. His post tower of Babel JLA run is boring as shit

best Doctor Strange writer of the century

>Anti SJWs
Only actual SJWs use that term, you could just say “everyone else” or “normal people.” You are so warped you don’t realize you are part of a lunatic fringe. Atleast all of the weirdos on this site know they are outside of the main stream.

>You are so warped you don’t realize you are part of a lunatic fringe
Oh the irony

Stan Sakai
David Peterson
Mark Miller when he is phoning it in.

Captain Marvel has a little journey in KC. A dilemma and a climax to said journey too.

You know what he had was nothing, user. Superman went on to impregnate Wonder Woman and be the self-proclaimed king of the meta-humans while Captain Marvel remained a dust in the wind. He was just another plot device to push Superman development further like all the other characters.

Google “anti sjw” and try and tell me this is a mainstream term.

>Anti SJWs aka fake comic book fans

I like to call them people who don't buy products from people who try to insult and shame them.

He's a NPC faggot crybaby that hasn't written anything decent in 20 years. Hope he gets rectal cancer.

He's a sperg who thinks its his duty to gatekeep the industry.

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Just needed some "dilate" and "tranny" to complete the buzzword bingo. Damn it.

And the comicsgate brigade just arrived to the thread.

>Gatekeep
DnC gatekept himself by being retarded and devolving into personal attacks. Knowing how to critique without personally attacking people and flaming people is the difference between a professional and a manchild.

they used personal attacks too.
regardless Waid should not have contacted the CEO to drop the book.

How many nightlights do you sleep with to chase away the boogeyman? Is there one in your bathroom so you can see the toilet when you sit down to pee?

Anyone know how the stupid lawsuit against him is going? Thrown out yet?

It's going poorly for DnC.

Everyone shares some story where he got pissed off and was smashing his phone but its A. from long time go and B. heresay

This.
WML is so fucking underrated. IF anyone deserves a gofund me, it's him and not PAD.

All creative people tend towards wackiness. Waid is no different.

Waid is a pretty extreme example of wacky as most adults don't throw tantrums where they punch holes in walls and scream until they pass out. I feel bad for people who have deal with his shit but he's a good writer.

I read the first volume of his flash run. Its okay. The writing doesn't shine but his ideas and science fiction does. His Kingdom Come is good, it says what it needs to say. I reread it not too long ago and its still good. I'm currently reading his Irredeemable and Incorruptible and those are pretty interesting themselves. Everyone on this site and in the comics industry put all these writers on pedestal when all they're writing is superhero comics. Even Moore and Gaiman were just writing superhero comics, they were just better at it than most.

Just because something is different doesn't mean its automatically good but that does mean it differentiates itself from others in the genre. It certainly beats the homogenization of style and art in marvel comics. When everything looks the same it ceases to become that interesting

How so?
Seriously, I haven't been paying attention but last I heard (months ago) it sounded like Waid was the one that might need to settle.

Morrison in the start of his JLA run was able to beat most of the Hyperclan even though he was a normal human and they were white martians. Batman has had a power creep for a long time. They have to keep justifying why he can take on all these unstoppable forces when hes a puny human. Morrison was just the catalyst for reasoning how he would do all these insane things

Here is how you spot people who never read Champions.

>regardless Waid should not have contacted the CEO to drop the book
That was his sole error that I'm sure he regrets (even though the case might have been dropped already). But it's a minor error compared to the stream of bullshit that DnC and the rest caused.
I just know that Nick Rekieta went and took Vic's case (the VA) and that one is losing too so clearly the guy wants to be known as the lawyer of "anti-PC" folks and failing hard at it.
>it sounded like Waid was the one that might need to settle
After the last deposition came out in which AP openly admitted they weren't influenced by Waid to drop the book (the crux of the case), everything went downhill from there.

Wilson doesn't really do anything. As far as I know she hasn't said or done anything hatefull or assholish. The only thing she seems to be guilty of on this website is being a muslim. Then people share that image of her eyes wide open to portray her as some radical muslim

Magog was literally Waid and Ross reeeeeing at the popularity of Rob Liefeld and Cable.

In all fairness Liefeld negatively influenced a bunch of shit that still pervades the scene to this day.

The phone story comes from someone that worked with him, but the Man of Steel story comes from Waid himself.

The moment AP said waid wasn't responsible was the moment the case had no validity. Tort interference requires the third party to be the direct cause of the break in contract.

I don't know about that. Magog was a tragic character. So powerful but with no concept of his consequences. After he accidentally nukes Kansas he is traumatized by what he caused. He apologizes to superman and sets out to right his wrongs. Hes like spider man learning responsibility after indirectly causing his uncles death

He blames Superman for all the tragedy, actually, and then is imprisoned by Superman's Justice League to the Gulags.

DnC's case was done the moment AP said that they'd already made the decision to drop his book before Waid contacted them and that he had no influence over their decision whatsoever.

Complaining about Liefeld's influence over the comics industry was a lot more legitimate in the mid 1990s than it is in 2019. Are you upset about the continued existence of Liefeld-created characters like Cable and Deadpool, or upset about the existence of Image?

He blames him at first because he blames himself and is trying to deflect blame. The justice league imprison him but captain marvel breaks his cell and he assists with saving peoples lives during the battle with captain marvel. Magog then lives on Paradise island caring for one of his teammates that was injured

>Are you upset about the continued existence of Liefeld-created characters like Cable and Deadpool
Nah, they were made better by better artists and writers, to be fair.
>or upset about the existence of Image?
Never. I get your point, but I see some usual suspects who truly lament the end of the 90's stuff and how things used to be, and it's never the decent stuff, no... It's Liefeld and McFarlane. Honestly I'll never understand.

Waid is still stalling trying to say TX has no jurisdiction, Judge initially threw out the defamation claim but agreed that the tort interference claim can continue, Meyer appealed on defamation citing Waid's comments at a Houston Con.
Now they are waiting for Waid's response again. (he will most likely fight it to continue to stall)

not its not, unless Meyer runs out of money he should make it through Waids stalling tactics.

he is being sued for Tortious INTERFERENCE
meaning the act of interference is what he is being sued for, he does not need Waid's actions to be the sole reason for him to claim damages.
Otherwise the judge would have tossed out the claim a while back.

Vic case is another reason to choose Subs over Dubs.
and so far it looks like it is going in his favor (text messages, emails and 450 tweets make it a slam dunk.)

>Magog then lives on Paradise island caring for one of his teammates that was injured
Being imprisoned and indoctrinated by amazons that believe that might makes right.

They certainly were popular so I think its the availability of stuff. Its only recently in the past two decades that you can collect various runs more easily and completely in paperback form. Im finally reading Peter David's Aquaman and Chuck Dixon's Robin and Nightwing

It's more about his design, deliberately intended to resemble Cable, and his role as a modern antihero that kills villains, ushering in a new age that the classic heroes have to come back to stop.

It needs to be a reason and it clearly wasn't a reason.

He's not imprisoned or indoctrinated. Hes helping care for an injured teammate. He bares witness to wonder womans crowning. Hes free and trying to learn from his mistakes. There's no gulag

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Yeah, but its about the conflict between the killer idealogies(Magog) vs peaceful(superman) and the conflict being put aside when everyone realizes they're doing more harm than good

Paradise Island is a prison for the "reckless" metas. They are there to be taught by the amazons. The same amazons that Wonder Woman confessed to Superman had disposed her of her title for being too soft because they believe in enforcing peace through force. A philosophy that Superman and Batman constantly talks against throughout their interactions with Wonder Woman.
Oh, and Wonder Woman gains a crown when she does exactly as the amazons had wished - by becoming more ruthless, pragmatic, and forceful. Imprisoning and killing people everyone deemed a problem.

Shit isn't going to change for the better.

That is for the judge to decide.
all evidence points to it being a reason.

>but I see some usual suspects who truly lament the end of the 90's stuff and how things used to be, and it's never the decent stuff, no... It's Liefeld and McFarlane. Honestly I'll never understand.
None of us get to decide what other people like, or what they're nostalgic for. If you don't like Rob Liefeld or Todd McFarlane, and the current extent of their influence over comics is that they have fans that are nostalgic for their 1990s prime, and some of their creations are still around, but have changed a lot over 30 years of being handled by other people, you don't really have a lot to complain about there.
There's more of a problem with casuals who complain about 1990s comics by assuming Liefeld and artists copying his style drew everything for the entire decade.

Minna Sundberg

Al Ewing for a modern one.

No. It's going to discovery to see if there's a reason and to see if AP is lying. Waid is stalling because discovery is expensive. It's like burning piles and piles of money into the legal system and it's why people settle out of court. Because it's cheaper than the massive cost of discovery. if they do it and find nothing. Waids still going to be out possibly millions. If he doesn't sue meyers for the frivolous lawsuit.

I don't get why Waid would want to stall.
He's the one who hired the ridiculously expensive lawyer. Its going to end up costing him even more than what Meyer is even asking for.

Morrison doesn’t. Johns doesn’t. Hell even Millar doesn’t and he’s a fan of the shitty SuperJesus interpretation. It’s only really a Waid thing and I still don’t see Birthright Superman as being infallible.

When H3H3 had their lawsuit they said there was months when the bill wasn't that much because they where just waiting, then when the bulk of paperwork and research had to ramp up they had to pay 50k in one month.
I am guessing that is when people decided to settle once they start getting further along and the bills start to skyrocket.

there is literally no one Yea Forums likes

Yea Forums likes Jack Stauber

Unironically based.

Continue eating shit Slottfag.

He hasn't written many bad comics, but he hasn't written anything good either, maybe outside of first half of DD.

Millar wrote the best Superman. Eat shit, Johnstard. Tomasi wrote an infallible Superman, for all that relatability meme. Superfags are the most self inserting fanbase.

One of Moore's most wholesome stories was about Superman.

We never get pre-time skip Magog to juxtapose, even the flashback is narrated by post-time skip Magog. I could claim that outside killing villains Magog was every bit a bonafide boy scout who, when the rest of the the heroes abandoned their missions and the next generation started brawling in the streets with abandon, actually continued fighting supervillains until the fateful attack on Parasite and there is nothing in the comic that would actual refute that.

Waid wrote a terrible Wonder Woman in KC because he thought her canon characterization didn't make sense.

The worst part is that WW is vilified in the comic itself for doing so yet when you consider the actions of everyone else she's also the only one actually working to make things better. Superman is passive, indecisive, and imperious while Batman is contrarian, myopic, and hypocritical. WW is the only proactive character in the comic. As far as the actual plot of the story goes, it would not be hard to write out Superman completely in favor of making WW the lead.