Redpill me on this guy:

How does that work with Apocalypse?

Maggot exists and neither of them are competition with him around.

He’s obsessed with Cyclops and does clone shenanigans

I think he’s like 200 years old somehow? It would be du

Why Sinister would still care about Apocalypse in modern era? With apocalypse being now one of X-Men punching bags, the guy would go out in a vacation, retire to some 3rd world shithole to perform his experiments in peace...

It doesn't. I don't think TAS ever established a connection between Sinister amd Apocalypse, nor the existence of mutants before the current generation. I think Beast even mentions the possibility of pollution being responisible for mutations in the first episode.

For the record, I prefer that too. Age-old mutants are stupid. The late 90s comics fucked up a lot of canon if you ask me.

But didn't Apocalypse exist in the TAS? He was from ancient Egypt righT?

Age-old mutants still seem reasonable with all the advance alien tech litter on Earth.

he's basically Aizen before Aizen
If Aizen was also 2nd fiddle to a bigger threat

I don't remember that being established in the cartoon. Just that he was supposedly powerful, but no origin was ever given, I think.

Reasonable, but completely unneceassary

There are only a handful of old mutants as long as you ignore the whole lupine humanoid thing, so you can have it both ways really.

Yrue, and it doesn't really bother me that much. What does bother me is that Sinister has been retroactively tied to apcalypse, while he used to be a serious villain in his own right

Sinister doesn't care about Apocalypse anymore. Now he's more concerned with fucking around and making the perfect species.

Why is Apocalypse a joke now?
Wasn't he the strongest mutant?

THE EXTERNALS! I WAS ALREADY OLD WHEN THE CONTINENTS WERE SPLIT ASUNDER

I'd say Sinister is a more, well, sinister villain now than Apocalypse.

When you are the big bad for thirty years you just get overused to the point you become a jobber. He's been used to show how tough other people are, killed off a bunch of times, had clones and rebirths and any number of other versions, and never really progressed as a character, other than adding unnecessary complications to his backstory.

So then why is Sinister a threat to the X-Men if his only goal is to breed a perfect mutant?

He's obsessed with the Grey and Summers families and believes it's from their line he can produce the perfect mutant. He's also basically immortal and indestructible (because clones) so he never really goes away as a threat.

I want a Sinister vs Sauron comic. Go!

Because he is obsessed with some X-Men and everything happens in New York?

because he's really weird about it

>So then why is Sinister a threat to the X-Men if his only goal is to breed a perfect mutant?
Apocalypse didn't stay dead, but Sinister achieved the goal he worked towards for a century. This user is right Sinister moved on and is just a mad scientist villain but is still obsessed with the mutants, the X-Men and Cyclops.

>Stop turning my clones into Dinosaurs!

Juggernaut and Apocalypse are the two X-Men villains known for being physically powerful, so writers will have them get defeated a lot to prove how powerful another character is. Marvel periodically reminds everyone how powerful Juggernaut can be, but the same never seems to happen to Apocalypse, instead his concept gets diluted by children, clones and imitators, or copying the Shadow King's gimmick of surviving inside hosts. Apocalypse is the X-Men villain handled better by the cartoon than the comics, and no writer ever thought to just copy what the cartoon did.

The cartoon literally turned him from a survival of the fittest darwinist into a Lord Zedd knock off who believed he was the personification of evil and that fate, i.e. the writers, wouldn't let him win. Evil Deadpool.

>a Lord Zedd knock off
>X-Men cartoon where Apocalypse sends a new Evil Mutant to Earth each week to fight the X-Men

>who believed he was the personification of evil
"Evil? I am not malevolent, I simply am."
youtu.be/WuVxCwNdWhg

Claremont is a hack

Yeah, he said that juust before he started pondering and decided that he was a Saturday Morning cartoon villain.

That hack is the reason people care about the X-Men at all.

they care in spite of his shittiness

Sinister's whole thing is that he's a mystery box villain who massively fucked up the X-Men and does REALLY fucking bad shit to their allies.

He massacred the Morlocks for shits and giggles, had a psychic parasite possess Dazzler (and then Polaris, the later of which would have been permanently reduced to a meat puppet for Malice had Sinister gotten his way), tried to murder Maddie Pryor twice (and stole her son) and then turns out, wanted her dead because she was a clone/sleeper agent created by Sinister to breed a super powered mutant with Cyclops because he's gay for Scott.

Claremont made him because he wanted a new big bad to replace Magneto but dragged out the reveal of his true identity, because of X-Factor fucking shit up.

Later writers reduced him to generic mad scientist obsessed with cloning and gay for Gambit along with Scott, which ruined the character.

In theory, Mr Sinister should be written as a gothic villain, the type of anime uber big bad who sits on his thrones while his henchmen do his evil for him. And not just generic evil, but the type of beyond the pale shit where you kill one of them, they cripple five of your guys.

He has an army of the most ruthless murderers on his payroll, led by a psychic parasite who can possess you and irrevocably fuck you up mentally even if you manage to free yourself from her. Oh and fucking SABRETOOTH is on his payroll.

Thank you. This is the closest to what I was looking for.

>Sinister's whole thing is that he's a mystery box villain
While Big 2 comics as a whole have suffered in the last 20 years from a decline in adherence to continuity or consistent characterization, and few writers lasting longer than 2 years on a book, one of the positives is writers know they have to resolve their mysteries in the time they have, they can't expect to still be there in 5 or 10 years and drag stories out that long.

You know I never understood why Mr. Sinister let Captain Marvel walk all over him in Secret Wars? He should have been in charge but was reduced to a lackey.

That explains why Xfags are such masochists.

cause he loves Carol like the rest of Yea Forums

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Sinister is a noted misogynist who sees women as only good for breeding. His deferring to Captain Marvel and serving obediently is intended as low-key confirmation of the Carl Manvers theory.

Age old mutants should only be time travelers. That would actually makes the mutants monicker “children of the atom” makes sense.

>Oh and fucking SABRETOOTH is on his payroll.

Remember when it was a thing that Sabretooth was a big deal? Remember when Wolverine would fucking lose his shit and actually be fucking scared when Sabretooth showed up because Sabretooth could not only fuck Wolverine up physically, but mentally? Remember how it was a thing that Sabretooth would just find Wolverine on his birthday and beat the shit out of him, leave him in a bloody, crying mess and then leave with a parting shot to the effect of "see you next year, runt."?

Because x-writers cannot resist slapping an x on a villain.

so he's just a really intense shipper?

>Sinister is a noted misogynist who sees women as only good for breeding.
Fucking Based. I loved his little NuVictorian Castle. Pity there aren't any characters similar to him.

lol sabretooth is more or less a grunt for mystique now.

It's practically canon that he hates Emma for this reason. He probably hates Wolverine as well.

>that manjaw
What the fuck?
But yeah I was talking about this. I thought Sinister would betray her or something but then he just did what she wanted like a little bitch and then got killed for his trouble.
They even built him up earlier as not to be underestimated.

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That'd involve the x-men fighting supervillains and lol that hasn't been a thing for nearly two decades.

Sinister doesn't hate Emma lol

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good times

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What if he was kept there in the fire?
Would he die eventually?

>He has an army of the most ruthless murderers on his payroll

And when they die he just makes clones. The Marauders have been killed what 3 times now?

Honestly no idea. I think the main canon way to kill someone with a healing factor these days is to completely deprive them of air. Like in Remender's X-Force Wolverine was nearly drowned to death in a tube and he eventually kills Daken by just holding him face first in a mud puddle until the bubbles stop

Who wants to read about the X-Men fighting supervillains and evil mutants when they can fight evil humans who hate them for no reason because no mutant ever did anything wrong? Or the X-Men can be supervillains and fight superheroes while remaining oblivious to their being the villains?
>Marvel: "Why doesn't X-Men sell as well as in the 1980s and 1990s?"

Wasn't decapitation?

>from a survival of the fittest darwinist into a Lord Zedd knock off
Sounds like a massive improvement.

Why does Apocalypse shill for survival of the fittest when he himself isn't the biggest guy around?

they have always done both, X-Factor's biggest villain was Cameron Hodge, and at the same time X-Men would be fighting supervillains or aliens

>the biggest guy around?
For you?

There have always been human X-Men villains, but you cannot deny the last 20 years have seen a massive decline in the use of supervillains and of mutant villains being used as villains. The popular mutant villains all joined the X-Men.

It's implied that he put a mind control disk on her to control her but she overpowered him mentally and basically made him her personal bitch. Especially after Carol found out that Sinister watch itching for a chance to overthrow Doom

that is across the board at Marvel though, ever since Civil War it's all been heroes vrs heroes

I should note that the cloning thing was a 90s thing.

The original stories implies that Sinister outright raised the dead Marauders from the dead via black magic.

>good enough
Based Sinister