What is the Evangelion of Yea Forums?

What is the Evangelion of Yea Forums?

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Steven Universe

Would have to be a show that people will claim is a decontruction of a genre when it clearly isn't made by a creator that fucking hates the fans of the show.

Watchmen?

This user gets it, it fills all the criterias

You know it always is. Always was. It's pretty much spot on.

But for once can we name something else?

Also attract a massive horde of pseudointellectuals in doing so, allowing it to be milked to kingdom come.

Can you name something else that is the Evangelion of Yea Forums?

Rahxephon

Invader Zim?

Cerebus.

Homestuck, then.

Coonskin. It's a deeply personal breakdown of society and animation. It's hard to follow and uses both mixed media and music to great effect. Also there are tits.

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Define "Evangelion" as a descriptor of a work.

Gets really weird toward the end because the writer came down with depression

Read the damn thread, people already did.

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Yeah. This:

Star vs. Im not even fucking joking

Heavy Traffic is better.

Stop forcing this meme.

Star vs the Forces of Evil.
youtube.com/watch?v=XAh4pnTeWbQ

I still haven't managed to get my hands on it. American Pop is my favorite film.

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Watchmen

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Rick and morty.
Fans of both claim it's very intelligent when in reality both were random shit randomly written just because.

And people lap it up like a dog

sahm-uuuuu-ry jack

Makes sense, they're both pure shit and both protagonists are whiny effeminate faggots

We have had this thread a couple of times before, and the ultimate answer is that there isn't one. Evangelion was a weird combination of factors and runaway success that impacted the industry that hasn't even happened again in the context of anime.

Western cartoons don't have the foundation of being taken seriously and the merchandising base aimed at adults to create the environment needed for something like Evangelion to take root in the first place. Evangelion was a deeply personal story that hit the right note at just the right moment in the culture it came from, and made a splash that extended far beyond the boundaries of its expected audience and its success had a huge wave of secondary effects on how the anime industry targeted and promoted its shows.

There are western comics or cartoon properties that hit one or two check boxes for what Evangelion did, but none of them managed to get bingo. Watchmen had a noteworthy impact on the comics industry, but it had nowhere near the cultural splash that Eva did and it lacks the raw author blood-on-the-page mess that made Eva what it was in the last third of the show. Steven Universe might make an occasional reference to scenes from Eva, but they are just that: references. The greater context and impact is lost.

The west doesn't have an Evangelion, and as long as the west considers cartoons to inherently be for children, we probably never will.

Bojack Horseman then

Definitely either Watchman or Homestuck.

I meant that bit's hardly Evangelion-esque, noone ever explains their plans in Evangelion because their goals and motivations change every episode.

"Anno hates his fans" is such a fucking awful and wrong interpretation of eva, almost as bad as the "Anno hates fanservice" interpretation.

Evangelion is for children. It has brightly coloured lobotomized godzillas piloted by quirky teens fighting video game monsters and the show’s message is aimed at younger teenagers.

>because their goals and motivations change every episode

What? No. The big plans don't really change, there are just multiple sides pretending to be on the same side, talking in code.

Seele's plans from the start to the end of the show don't change. All that changes is how much they feel they can trust Gendo and how much we, as the audience, understand the references that they are making.

More like lobotomized ultramen.

>isn't made by a creator that fucking hates the fans

thats naruto, an inferior avatar (DBZ.) that fills the spot somehow. AT was one piece.

i gonna have to agree with this.

Evangelion is important because of its impact on the industry, not its story.

I terms of posapocaliptic bullshit, always return to nothing moral and "muh psyco stuff"? Unironically Adventure time.

>Gets really weird toward the end because the writer came down with depression
Megg Mogg and Owl, then.

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>I terms of posapocaliptic

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>posapocaliptic
6/10, got me pretty good.

The story is nice, the lore and mysteries interesting, half of the show is barely animated and reused animation that I can't stand, but that's more a thing of japanimation as a whole, so heh. It gud, but the thing is people treats it like it was the second coming of Jesus.

What's the impact in the industry that Eva left? Never heard of that before.

You know, I never watched the show despite being a big fan of anime in my pre-teen/teenage years. I still have no idea why it's a such a big deal.

I was a big fan of anime in my teenage years too, but I think I just watched like three shows.

The only difference is that Shinji actually goes through decent character development.

Watchmen.

>Surprisingly good genre fiction that's actually a completely different genre and shits on writers who embrace the cliches thinking it's meaningful instead of doing their jobs.
>Was a hit beyond anyone's wildest dreams, goes years without proper new material.
>Causes such a stir it changes the medium forever, but arguably for the worse as dipshits copy surface elements lazily.
>Tons of merch money is made.
>Eventually new adaptations and continuations are made, they all suck despite talented artists.

The state that anime was in when Eva hit the ground was that mecha anime and stuff like it had been king for a while because of the merchandising machine behind them, stuff like Gundam was designed from the ground up to serve as advertisements for the toys and model kits, mostly for kids. But the strength of that business model was on a downturn.

Enter Eva. Eva wasn't backed by a toy company, so the Evangelions were no designed with toys in mind. In fact, their design was very much something that didn't work for toys at all (too skinny and topheavy, with tiny feet. An Evangelion model almost never stands on its own without a base or a stand. Compare that to Gundams that are build like a brick with enormous feet so they are easy to pose). The Evangelions are also more bestial in appearance, especially during certain scenes in the show. The OP credits sequence of NGE introduces the Evangelions alongside scenes of teeth and blood and violence, making the Eva seem monstrous. This ain't Gundam or Voltron with clean explosions.

Eva's story is more about the characters than it is about the robots, because ultimately the entire conflict with the Angels is just an immense pressure that drives a wedge into the psychological cracks already present in these characters until they start to break under the pressure. The climax of NGE isn't Shinji beating the Angels, its Shinji resolving to try to reach out to others even if it means risking rejection or other pain.

The character focus of the story was uncommon at the time, as was the depth of the character writing. Each main character is given a solid foundation and backstory for why they are the way they are, and how they crumble is a direct result of those faults.

[cont]

What's the Gunbuster of Yea Forums?

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He's a whiny little bitch and will always be a whiny little bitch

The end result, whether this was Gainax's plan at the start or not, was that Evangelion thrived based on audience attachment to the CHARACTERS of the show, not the ROBOTS. You can find Asuka, Rei, and Shinji themed merchandise of almost any product. But compare that to models and merch of the Evangelions themselves, and you'll find much less than you would imagine in comparison.

Evangelion's success inspired copycats, so pretty much everything about Eva (from major plot twists to themes to character details) ended up getting rehashed by other works to the point that each of the 3 pilots basically ended up starting a whole character trope in and of themselves. If you ever wondered why every single Tsundere in anime seems to have pigtails, the answer is Asuka. And so on.

For the industry, realizing that the characters could be even more popular than the toys was a wakeup call, resulting in a greater business focus on that going forward. This over time grew into the formulaic structure of building up waifu casts in order to try and shotgun out character designs and personality combinations in the hopes of hooking otaku.

Originally the thought was that these character-pushes were just a spice to add to an existing anime genre, but this slowly grow a strong enough push that they no longer needed to be anything other than character shows. The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzimiyah is a character pushing show, but it still operates under the context of a scifi mystery. By the time that you reach K-on, the studios have realized they don't actually need that scifi stuff at all, you can just have cute girls doing cute things.

And thats how Evangelion started as a mecha anime but kicked off a domino effect that snowballed into the moe anime boom that defined the 00s, and even though that boom is over the influence of those changes and lessons learned are still present throughout the industry.

so mewni and earth merging was third impact?

Something that subverted a genre while making commentary on society and unintentionally inspired future works in the genre, but following an existing superior subversion as the more socially biting and edgy counterpart, while mixing in a metric fuckton of stuff people think is important but only existed to look/sound cool, while also leaning heavily in on any random interpretation or interest from people believing that you were foretelling the actual end of the world to people that just fap to your characters all in the interest of money?

Michael Moorcock’s stories, in comic form. Nothing else matches as well.

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Except that you haven't even watched the full series.
But I digress, what do you think a protag should act like?

>Muh bad writing
Begone, faggot. Back to tumblr with you.

Unironically Rick and Morty

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Except it's not an interpretation, Eva is a fuck you to Otakus and shows how fucked up it actually would be to be a kid mech pilot.
And End of Eva is the biggest fuck you ever created because it was just made to spite people that didn't like the TV show ending.

You know what? Yeah that fits. Both are considered by many to be the best of their respective mediums, both deal with realistic very human characters dealing with world ending bullshit, both are presented creatively and influenced the medium as a whole forever, and while many shit on it for various reasons, they're both well liked.

I think they mean a relatively accessible show that, while it does have a degree of depth, it's extremely overblown to the point where it's a posterchild for the 2deep4u meme. It also has to be popular enough to warrant a fandom and influential enough to have defined a genre/generation even if it wasn't the first. And it's also got to be somewhat clusterfucky and bombastic in ending and at least 1/3 presentation of the entire show. Or those portions have to be unique enough so that they stand out enough to be copied over and over again.

So like a famous and derivative show that's not surface level enough to be entirely schlock, not abstract enough to be truly arthouse, not intelligent enough to have absolutely no criticism, not dumb enough that everyone could call out on it, not slow or realistic enough to be completely boring all the time, but also not completely fun or fantastical to watch the whole way through.

Serenity.

what the fuck are you talking about? are you trying to say that steven universe doesn't have bad writing?

I would call this a really decent write up on why Eva became a big thing and how it basically frankly ruined anime.

But I think you do undersell how much of old mecha was actually about the characters, now yes, many, many mecha were just toy commericals, I will not deny this, but many mecha still were about the characters, the mecha were kinda just a part of the setting.
But I will admit that Eva was the first really major work that made it internationally.
>You can find Asuka, Rei, and Shinji themed merchandise of almost any product.
This is also true of a lot of Gundam merch, Char and Amuro are basically as iconic as the mecha they pilot.

But otherwise yeah this is a pretty good sum up how NGE basically killed anime, which is ironic since Anno really hated Otaku culture.

I fucking knew this will be fp.
FUCKING END YOURSELF!!!!!!

SU is Darling in the Fraxx of Yea Forums.

>Anno hates Otaku culture
>Anno creates a cornerstone of Otaku culture
>Anno further ruins Otaku culture by sending it down a downward spiral it never recovered from, killing any form of quality it once had

Anno truly is a master of 57D-hypercube-interdimentional-suicide-chess.

makes sense.

>Gets tons of cash and cred from Eva
>futher insults the fans by making the remake movies
>still cockteasing them with the 4th movie
>meanwhile uses his industry cred to make stuff he actually want to make
>makes Shin Godzilla
>and now making Ultraman
The ultimate madman

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>This over time grew into the formulaic structure of building up waifu casts in order to try and shotgun out character designs and personality combinations in the hopes of hooking otaku.
This is just the typical Western projection narrative. "I don't like anime girls, so that must mean nobody else does either, and that means anime producers are just ruthless businessmen trying to trick stupid gross otaku into buying things."

>By the time that you reach K-on, the studios have realized they don't actually need that scifi stuff at all, you can just have cute girls doing cute things.
K-On was not the first of its kind by a long shot, and K-On isn't supposed to be plot-driven any more than it's supposed to be horror-driven or mystery-driven. Anime has many genres and many kinds of shows, and there wasn't some de-evolution from Evangelion to K-On. The industry didn't make nothing but Evangelion-type shows in the late 90s, and it didn't make nothing but K-On-type shows in the 2010s. Nor does it make nothing but isekai today.

>it basically frankly ruined anime
This basically frankly never happened.

>Anno really hated Otaku culture
Anno was himself an otaku and along with the rest of Gainax at the forefront of making otaku anime and culture.

>Anno further ruins Otaku culture by sending it down a downward spiral it never recovered from, killing any form of quality it once had
Yeah this never happened.

but Fraxx was trying to push the fucking/breeding topic

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tpbp

>This basically frankly never happened.
Have you seen the shit anime pumps out? literal trash
>Anno was himself an otaku and along with the rest of Gainax at the forefront of making otaku anime and culture.
So he was a selfloathing Otaku, it makes sense

Don't forget "it's brilliant because the creator had a breakdown while doing it!"
Tom King's recent Batman?

>Have you seen the shit anime pumps out? literal trash
I am one of the few people who actually watches it substantially and on a seasonal basis. Almost nothing people claim about it is correct.

I have no stake in the Anno memes, but I will absolutely assert that commercial anime has gone down a spiral of shittiness. The lack of 'timeless classics' being made, the throwaway 1 or 2 seasons of random LN adaptations being made every month, the battle school harem -> isekai 'genres' - all anime is nowadays is advertisements for LNs, mangas and the occasional merch. It lost any ~~soul~~ it once had.

>The lack of 'timeless classics' being made
It takes time for something to become a timeless classic, it doesn't happen instantly. And classic according to who?

>the throwaway 1 or 2 seasons of random LN adaptations being made every month
There has always been forgettable anime, and the numeric amount of anime has increased tremendously since the 90s.

>the battle school harem -> isekai 'genres'
The battle harem trend ended already, and isekai contrary to popular belief isn't automatically bad or the only bad kind of anime being made.

>all anime is nowadays is advertisements for LNs, mangas and the occasional merch.
There's original anime every season and we've had a number of great ones in the past few years. The advertisement meme is miseading; the publisher isn't the only member of the production committee, and the fact that they are interested in boosting their sales doesn't mean that the anime production crew is somehow magically forced into making a bad anime. Haruhi for example is a classic anime.

>muh soul
Totally meaningless drivel.

W.I.T.C.H. was EXPLICITLY based on Evangelion in art style at least

Y'all can go home now.

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Either this or preacher

Nice try W.I.T.C.H user, but not quite
Also the show sucks, only the comic is good

Witchfag, just fuck off

kek

This.

> This is just the typical Western projection narrative. "I don't like anime girls, so that must mean nobody else does either, and that means anime producers are just ruthless businessmen trying to trick stupid gross otaku into buying things."

I never said anything to imply that the shift to character focused shows was a negative or a devolution of the genre, just that there was a shift in the production of anime as they grew to realize that this was where the money was.

But just like there was a formula to mecha shows that Evangelion broke, there was a formula to moe shows that grew up down the line, and that formula owes a fair amount of its math to principals proven from the success of Evangelion. This is neither a good thing or a bad thing, its just a thing thing. Kind of like how the current isekai boom also has its clear formula.

This transformation of anime was also, obviously, a gradual process over time. What I said should not be taken as the only steps in the progression, I was just highlighting recognizable milestones to point to obvious stops along the way. If you want to really deep dive into this shift of anime culture, you are not going to fit it into a couple of posts on Yea Forums. I gotta condense shit.

what is the dark souls of Yea Forums ?

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>moe shows
An extremely vague and large category of anime, spanning anything from Madoka to Lucky Star. There's also many examples of non-"moe" series spawning popular female characters.

> There's also many examples of non-"moe" series spawning popular female characters.

Correct. You can apply the commercialization of character to almost any genre, because most shows have characters in them and its really a matter of how those characters are written and presented to the viewer. Moe as a genre is just a good example of the logical end result of the commercialization of character in anime, because its widely regarded as a genre where the primary point is to sell the characters, with story or other merchandiseable aspects as a distance second.

You can even apply the character focus 'posthumously' for a show. As in the case of Gundam. When Gundam first aired, it actually wasn't that popular. It saw a resurgence and became a marketing powerhouse for the toys when the compilation movies came out in theaters. But the characters of early UC Gundam didn't get their big character push to audiences until long after the show was over, capitalizing on the existing investment in that franchise among its fans. This isn't to say that audiences didn't already care about Amuro and Char, but production companies were not thinking to capitalize on that emotional investment until much later.

Doesn't exist, because you can't git gud at Yea Forums.

>Moe as a genre
It's not a genre. There's basically nothing in common between Princess Principal and Asobi Asobase.

>its widely regarded as a genre where the primary point is to sell the characters, with story or other merchandiseable aspects as a distance second
Most of it originates as manga. There's very little if any merchandising going on at that stage, and there's no telling if the manga will ever get an anime adaptation. Merchandising is a standard part of monetizing anime whether it's an adaptation or an original, and whether it's a late night or daytime anime. I have two scale figures of girls from Gegege no Kitaro, and that's a family show.

stop it.

LMAC

What does that stand for?

>make stuff he actually want to make
>it's trash
tale as old as time

>dark character drama about people with serious, emotionally destructive issues placed in a grandiose setting

Watchmen is as close as you can get but I don't think Yea Forums's gotten its true Evangelion yet. I can't wait for the day someone has the ambition and skill necessary to go through with one.

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As far as movies are concerned, Toy Story could be considered Yea Forums's Evangelion since it significantly changed the industry.

You fuckers

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What is the evangelion of Yea Forums?

Avatar?

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sauce?

nvm found it.

The artist used to call himself Gunsmoke4, but naming yourself after your own band wasn't apparently the best choice when you draw underage characters. I think, he's calling himself Sunsetriders7 now.

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It unironically is Ren & Stimpy

Is the Evangelion creator a pedo, too?

Denying the truth won't make it go away. (Or even me, for that matter.)

Show >>> comic (comic's very good too tho)

>And End of Eva is the biggest fuck you ever created because it was just made to spite people that didn't like the TV show ending.
end of eva unironically has an incredibly optimistic ending about self improvement and hope did you even pay attention

Anno's built his career from doing fan-service works of those exact otaku sub-cultures Evangelion is supposedly attempting to ""spite"". Everything Gainax has done since is continuing those exact same otaku trends Evangelism was allegedly meant to ""criticize"", with the exception of maybe, FLCL.

This. Unironically, the entire 'Anno hates Otaku' thing traces back to assblasted Reifags who were really mad at EoE because they felt that Rei was treated unfairly in the movie and took it as a personal attack against the entire fandom (because, of course, they consider themselves representative of the entire fandom).

Seriously, thats where this whole ''Anno made EoE just to spite us" shit comes from.

Gainax has done more than most people realize.

vndb.org/p292

Someone, remove the stairs.

>how fucked up it actually would be to be a kid mech pilot.
The original Gundam did that better

Thanks for the link, I'll check it out

>Influential and famous?
Watchmen.
>A direct equivalent?
None that I can think of, and it's due to the very different cultures. Yea Forums media doesn't tackle the bulk of evangelion, teenage depression, in the same way or to the same degree in anything I've experienced. Teens are thought as still too young to either experience that or be confronted with that, so very rarely will you see a western story driven by a bunch of teens who are very depressed and a mental mess, but also reflect the damaged adults around them.
Another main theme in evangelion is miscommunication, which is also absent in a lot of Yea Forums media because of the lack of niches, opting instead for general audiences, who are never depicted as incapable of communicating.
The giant robots and religious imagery is simply coating on those other main themes, in my opinion.

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If you followed the live action opening, it's basically the mad ramblings of some escaped con.

Hey Yea Forums, what's popping?
Hideachi Anal here, of all the gaijin capeshit and calarts bullshit I've watched, the only one to be as shit as my creation was Sonichu.

Pretty sure it was death threats painted outside Gainax’s office which he added photos of in EoE but okay. Anno didn’t start Eva with hatred, it was slowly stewed into him by anime fans

teen titans

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In terms of influence probably nothing. Evangelion essentially changed the entire perception of what anime is and I don't think anything in western animation has done so. Maybe The Simpsons, but the way it changed perception of the medium in the west isn't quite the same as what Evangelion did. Not to say that Evangelion is better than any western cartoon ever. I just don't think anything has ever had the same sweeping effect.

Also shinji and Morty are kinda similar.

How?