Western cartoon equivalent of Neon Genesis Evangelion?

Wasn't it so fucked up that traumatized fans made the tsundere archetype and Rei Ayanami look-alikes to cope?

I always feel like Eva and Watchmen share some similarities in that they are both deconstructions of genres that were seen as being mainly for kids at the time.

That’s really the only thing they have in common though.

Anyone who calls Eva a deconstruction is ignorant of mecha anime as a whole.

moral orel

>philosophical and psychological theme
That's a meme and you know it. Eva is the first anime for most normalfags (or at least different from their regular seasonal bullshit waifubait) so they think it's the second coming of christ, while this kind of weird shows was a everyday thing in the 90's.

Watch Aeon Flux, motherfucker, the show is pretty confused, but the twist is it is done on purpose the show is tricking the viewer to give some explanation to something where there's nothing at all, and it does the exact same shit that Eva does: Flashy shots, slow pace.

Yes, I've seen it, it's pretty good, but I'm fucking tired of you all, motherfuckers, the 90's had far better shows but you all only overglorify this one because it has bleeding robots and shiny crosses in the backgrounds.

By the way only weebs call "western" to everything made outisde of japan, just call them cartoons.

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What an elitist cunt you sound like.

Birdboy: The Forgotten Children

No giant mochas in it, unfortunately

And when they do have depth the animation shit...

>That's a meme and you know it.
Self-actualization, existentialism, and hedgehog's dilemma are central to the show. The series goes into unreasonable detail on the background and execution of these topics.

Stop ignoring them just so you can craft your gay little strawman.

If you want shitty-written human-filled stories go watch live action Japanese soap opera and live action as a whole
It annoys the shit out of me when people consider "non-serious: bad" when the entire point of animation is that surrealness something like NGE doesn't have

Wasn't the finale of NGE surreal?

But I get you, though. I want the Western, cartoony surrealness with solid, deep writing.

I mean, there's Adventure Time but the style isn't really for me.

You can go to anywhere if you say your character has a mental disease, that's not good execution, that's mediocre writing.

>Self-actualization, existentialism, and hedgehog's dilemma are central to the show
You can say the exact same shit to fucking R&M, don't be a delusional.

it's funny how the so-called "depth" of Evangelion boild down to its choice of naming convention.

it's just giant robots fighting aliens, but if you use religious-themed names for the robots and aliens, you'll trick the impressionable 13 year old into thinking your shitty formula cartoon is more nuanced than it looks.

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>Wasn't the finale of NGE surreal?
One thing is getting surreal, and another is getting out of budget, Eva is the second one.

>I want the Western, cartoony surrealness with solid, deep writing.
Dude, I watch cartoons because the animation, not the writing, I don't think you an have both. The first thing that comes to my mind is Anomalisa, but the story is pretty straight forward.

>I want the Western, cartoony surrealness with solid, deep writing.

Milo Murphy's Law attempted to do that.

Emphasis on "attempted".

Oh, yeah, good point. That show is a lot like evangelion.

>I want the Western, cartoony surrealness with solid, deep writing.
watch Summer Camp Island. you'll be surprised at how under-your-skin it can get.

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Oh wow "elitist cunt" sounds like an interesting show.

looks interesting thanks bro

not really looking for movies desu

The idea of being turned into a baby against my will kinda freaks me out.

UFO is probably the closest you're going to get, but it isn't animated.

>deconstruction
Please stop

Unironically Steven Universe

GET IN THE FUCKING SAILOR SUIT, OSCAR

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The culture of western cartoons isn't developed enough for our NGE to arise.

NGE started as a reaction to the toy-motivated cartoons that had grown to dominate mecha anime in the 90s (specifically Gundam), shifting to a more sinister and adult take on the classic setup of 'teenage boy falls into super-robot, fights monster of the week'.
But then, famously, Evangelion delves way deeper into its psychological themes, with the depression of the director creating a feedback loop there, untilt he show ran out of budget and they had to make some really creative decisions to try and stretch what little they had left into a clip show that could even hope to serve as a conclusion. An ending that infuriated fans so much that they made a movie to serve as the ending instead.

In the end, if we want to find the Yea Forums version of Evangelion, we need to hit the following notes:
- it needs to be an adult animation, not for kids. But it needs to be an ACTUAL adult animation, and not what that phrase usually means in the west which is just comedy where people drink and say fuck a lot.
- it needs to start with the same premise as a popular genre, but then go in a convention-breaking direction with it
- it needs to hit the audience where they live, psychologically
- it needs to be majorly ambiguous, because ambiguity is a big part of what has kept Evangelion alive as a franchise. Every person who watches NGE for the first time has so many questions that they are compelled to seek out conversation about it, which keep it in the public consciousness. Evangelions lore and mindfuck ending accomplished this for NGE, but you don't need those two specifically if you can accomplish the level of ambiguity in another way
Bonus Round: Optional, but you preferably you would have really good visual direction. Evangelions imagery, borrowed though it may be, is iconic as fuck and grabs people from the word go. This helps keep people engaged with the show before the reveals.

>story about a mentally stunted boy learning to live himself for who he is and growing out of the shadow of a sinister parent
Sounds like Steven Universe to me.

Can't wait for the scene where Steven Jacks off over an unconscious Connie when the movie comes out.

So thats a pretty specific list thats hard to do, even on purpose. Which is why even in the anime community where companies have been trying to make that Evangelion lightning strike twice for the last 2 decades, few have managed to capture anything like the same feel.

Western cartoons suffer from a lack of western adult cartoons that are not stoner comedies in general, so that narrows the field pretty harshly right from the start. But on top of that, western cartoons don't have enough creator independence to allow for the deeply personal shit that made Evangelion what it was happen. The studio would step in and stop the director before it got that far.

So, despite shows like Steven Universe which might superficially copy visual components from NGE, I think the closest thing we actually have is... Bojack Horseman? And even that, I think we can agree, is a poor fit. But nothing else I can think of is a better one, for lack of options. But its the only adult cartoon I can think of that tries to tackle anything emotional or psychological with any weight to it, even if Bojack's attempt at it often falls flat and it keeps regressing back into a comedy instead of commiting to it.

I'm tempted to say Ren & Stimpy, as they both did things unconventional and controversial things for kids shows that would open the floodgate for future artists. And yes, Eva was marketed as a kids show (TMNT took over its spot).

twitter.com/Mendinso/status/1142926691356086273

It's easy to think of Ren & Stimpy as nothing more than boogers and farts, but no other cartoon for kids had their main character go through a mental breakdown that almost led to strangling his best friend to death.

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Aeon Flux i guess?

Have you seen The Maxx?
It's been a long time since I watched it and I don't remember it having any real conclusion, it didn't get a second season... BUT I do remember it being pretty fucking rad and hitting on a lot of psychological themes.

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>tl;dr

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I know people are shitting on Netflix for their shitty dub, but are the subs there fine?

There is none in cartoons. As far as the impact it generated, Watchmen in comics is the closest thing.

>make a half-assed deconstruction of toy commercial cartoons from the 80's
never gonna happen because the Transformers movie killed that model when kids didn't like Optimus dying and being replaced by Hot Rod. so we don't need the Yea Forums version of evangelion because "To Sell Toys" never got as bad in the US as it did in japan.

JL/JLU

Really inconsistent and make a lot of odd choices.

op here, i was actually thinking of something quite like bojack horseman except i don't like that show, the characters are unlikable but not in an interesting way

Watchmen ruined the industry thanks to people misunderstanding its message.

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I take it you only watched the first 3 episodes and got bored

Ren and Stimpy Adult Party Cartoon.

Exo Squad

Sad horse show

Star vs. the Forces of Evil

I watched it in highschool, looking back at it it really was robots vs aliens but with bible names.

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If you watched it in highschool, what the show was really tackling probably went over your head.

Morel Orel>NGE

What a worthless thread.

do tell so I can pretend to give a shit

>what the show was really tackling probably went over your head.

...are you talking about the shallow pretentiousness in general, or the hamfisted biblical allegories specifically?

Invader ZIM

>First half: Epic robot fights with religious references
>Second half: Slow paces, and budget getting low.

ITT:
>not having watched NGE
>giant robots and religion meme
>cowboy good, ching chang bad

Learn english, evatard.

ITT:
>can't explain why eva is good and gets butthurt when people disagree with him

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This guy is right, it's Bojack Hroseman.

Eva is really about people who are shit at dealing with life, especially in high pressure situations.

South Park, season 21, episode 9

>Eva is decent, but it's not really a masterpiece
>NO IT IS A MASTERPIECE
>I've watched once in highschool
>NO NO WATCH IT AGAIN AND YOU'LL NOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT

Are evatards really this idiot?

Angry Beavers did it better

Its not that we can't explain, its that you have already made it clear (, ) that you are not interested in having this conversation. Whats the point of writing up a well thought explanation if you have already told us that all you are going to do is meme at it?

>can't explain why Eva is good
It depicts teenage depression, loneliness and hopelessness in a very relatable and accurate way. The writing manages to bring a cohesive arc for every character, and all of them feel human in some way.
The subtle storytelling keeps the viewer engaged by constructing the show as a series of puzzles, not for the characters, but for the viewers themselves, encouraging second viewings and rewarding attention.
The story manages to explain well enough even the seemingly stupid things, like for example there's a reason 14 yo's are given the giant robots, and though it may not be scientifically accurate, it serves the plot and suspends the disbelief.
Other aspects in which the show excels above the competition are charavter design, direction, music and in some instances animation.
One of the things that personally appeal to me is that everything falls into place and makes sense by the end once you "get" it, giving a feeling of relief and of being smarter than when you started watching it (though that might not be the case)

TL;DR: excellent writing and characters, great direction, good enough coating for general appeal.

>"I-It's not that I can't explain, I j-just don't want to!"

Wow, totally unexpected.

Batman the Animated Series, Batman Beyond, and Superman the Animated Series is the western cartoon equivalent of Neon Genesis.

Static Shock gets a honorable mention, but it moved away from teenagers dealing with gang and real world problems to crossovering with DCAU

Evangelion is entry level mecha. Also, stop saying it """""deconstructed""""" a genre where it's all been done before. Anno is just a mechatokuscifi nerd and incorporated a lot of things that he liked from the genres.

>oh no!
>something from [location/genre/group/medium] I don't like is being called a masterpiece
Boy I can't wait to hear what's a masterpiece for you
>inb4 watchmen and sandman

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Mobile suit gundam

>can't argue shit
Good boy.

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>There's only one person ITT who thinks I'm a eva fanboy
Eva is pretty good, the animation is godlike is some scenes, but, again, it's not realy far appart from the 90's regular basis. Watch more shows.

>excellent writing and characters
HAHAHAHAHA
Bitch, learn about writing, as I said before ITT, if you start from mentally ill characters you can go everywhere, you don't need to write something consistent, you just have to say "lol he's have depression XD" and you can justify everything and your mindles audience would praise it.

Surprise surprise, every primary character in eva is fucking mentally ill.

Faggot I do like eva, I'm tired of overglorification. It doesn't deserve it.

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>Faggot I do like eva, I'm tired of overglorification. It doesn't deserve it.
I watched EVA and while I do like it, I wasn't actually floored by it. Then again, I watched Utena and Serial Experiments Lain so I was probably desenstized.

Moral Orel.
It's far less abstract and has a happy ending though.

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>One of the things that personally appeal to me is that everything falls into place and makes sense by the end once you "get" it, giving a feeling of relief and of being smarter than when you started watching it (though that might not be the case)

That you felt smarter for "getting" something that the show was slapping you in the face with for its entire run speaks volumes about you as a person.

Christian cartoons can beat Evangelion in terms of writing when they put som thought into it. The Bible stories and lessons really make for good drama.

>Christian cartoon
I mean, you're not wrong but I wouldn't classify it as that entirely and I feel the type of people that unironically like Christian Rock and Christian genre's won't appreciate some of the messages of this one.

Wonder Showxen but that's not a cartoon.

Its worth pointing out that NGE came out in 1995. Utena was 97, and Lain was 98.

So at the time that NGE came out those other examples didn't exist yet, and while I wouldn't make the comparison for Utena I would absolutely say that Lain came out in no small part as a response to the success of Evangelion's themes.

>is there a western cartoon out there that is thematically similar?
So
>child abuse
>pedophilia
>philosophical lightweight trying to sound deep
Steven Universe.

Xavier is and it's arguably better.

>boy do I like talking out of my ass
You're not making sense, are you actually mentally ill?

i skipped most of this thread but actually su is the only answer bc it's the only show wherein some crazy person amassed enough creative control to interject all their personal problems -- which is, objectively, was nge IS -- anno's depression diary

Where's the pedophilia in Steven Universe? I get the child abouse ahd philosophical bullshit tho.

Akira came out in 88, which predates NGE, Utena, and Lain. Being the inspiration of NGE would also explain why I wasn't floored by it (still enjoyed it though)

>never gonna happen because the Transformers movie killed that model when kids didn't like Optimus dying and being replaced by Hot Rod.

BASED 80s kids rejecting that faggot jobber Rodimus

Xavier makes fun of pretentious cartoons by having it's main character come off as obnoxious than insightful

Mostly, the fans.

>when anno and his staff explicitly stated that none of the religious stuff in Eva is actually meaningful and were put in because they thought it looked and sounded cool
>the evatards started writing essays about how Anno and his staff must be wrong about their own show

Good fucking times

I thought I was the only one who thought Rodimus was lame. It didn't help that Optimus made a pretty ballsy last stand in the first 30 minutes of the movie.

>You're not making sense
How so? Explain yourself, kid.

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There it is.

Why would you say that Akira is the inspiration behind NGE? NGE took inspiration from a lot of things, from Ultraman to UFO to a mishmash of various mecha shows that the creators grew up watching. But I'm struggling to find anything in Akira that I would connect to Evangelion.

Watch the maxx

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>Felt
Yeah, I pointed out it doesn't make anybody smarter, it makes them feel like they are, why else would they shout "deconstruction!" and "deep analysis!"?
You sound like you never put a puzzle together and felt relieved and accomplished for doing it.

>The only show wherein some crazy person amassed enough creative control to interject all their personal problems
That's not true though.
Hell probably the most famous animation doing that is Waking Life. It's basically just a podcast of a guy talking about dreams and his fear of death.

Oh shit, son. Did you not see the episode where Pearl pins Connie down and just goes totally ham bananas on her butthole?

That was some raw, disturbing shit. Made me feel sick the whole time I was jerking off.

Tetsuo is proto-Shinji, showing what would realistically happen if scientists gave a kid with massive insecurities god like power.

Batman: The animated series.

Anyone who talks about Evangelion like its a mecha short or that the religious imagery matters beyond visually stunning window dressing is missing the point. Evangelion is, at its core, a character study and the story of Evangelion is entirely about Shinji. The only core members of the cast, and the larger conflict for the fate of the world with the Evas, only matter as tools to explore Shinji's flaws from different angles and to enact stress and pressure upon him.

The mecha fights and Angel designs are cool, and Third Impact is a shocking mindfuck the first time you watch it, but none of those things are what makes Evangelion good or well written. The religious imagery is shallow, and the lore is basically unexplained in the show proper. Its in the character writing that Evangelion finds its depth.

Okay. Thats not a connection I would draw myself, and I feel like its more a happenstance of convergent ideas than a direct point of inspiration, but its a valid comparison.

Well Anno also said that people should find their own meaning and not have someone dictate what it means. So I'm pretty sure he said that to avoid any religious backlash and to tell people to fuck off and think for themselves.

>if you start from mentally ill characters you can go anywhere, you don't have to write anything consistent
If there's one thing that the characters in Eva are is consistent. All they do is fuck up all the time. Shinji is scared of getting in the robot from episode one to EoE, Asuka is a smug bitch from her introduction to her last scene, Misato is a slut from episode 1 to her death. Of course they do change, but mostly at the very end of the series and it's implied, not even shown.
I have no clue where you saw anything inconsistent with them and what that would have to do with anything, is like calling toy story 3 lazy for bringing back the prospector: that didn't happen and how is that lazy?

Speaking of characters, why do they look so much better in 90s fashion?

>no children's cartoon recs pls
Kek, i find amusing you think Evangelion is not a Children's cartoon,
Another idiot that think Eva was some sort of attempt to elevate the cartoons to "art". Let me tell you something. By the time Eva aired, the anime has moved from heavy relied in toy sales and expaned to other markets. Colector cards, clothes, CD-dramas, all that shit. Eva was the one that successfully capitalize that trend and push it to the next level. All the great technical aspects of Eva fly over the heads of the japanese and certainly from much of the westerns.

youtube.com/watch?v=V5FmFaK7pMU

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Western writing, comics in particular, use mental illness as a weak writing crutch to do whatever they want with a character without needing to establish a consistent internal logic. think The Joke, where the excuse that 'he's curaaaaazy' justifies everything he does no matter how logical or illogical it is. The Joker doesn't have a mental illness, he is just some fantastical version of generic insanity that has no defined symptoms or patterns to it.

Once you get fed slop like that for long enough, you tend to just associate mental illness in fiction with poor writing directly, especially if you don't get actually good examples of it being used well to counterbalance that notion. So user just automatically associates mental illness in fiction with characters not having defined characterizations, in this case incorrectly.

How did Evangelion successfully market their merchandise to adults?

I feel like a lot of Western Cartoons expect to create a groundbreaking show by not relying on toy sales, video games, and other promotional material, which may have contributed to it's death.

does this count?

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Only Rick and Morty and Family Guy does this.

The Joker in Batman Animated series is explicitly shown to be a failed comedian who worked as a mob hitman before becoming a supervillain.

>Shinji is scared of getting in the robot
>LOL I'M SO SAD I'M SO SCARED CRAWLING IN MY SKIN THIS WOUNDS SEEMS NO HEAL
>Writing 10/10 would fap everytime
This I why I can't fucking stand """""""""""""mature"""""""""""""""" comics and cartoons. Damn, I've just watched berserk and there's a like 10 minutes scene of guts talking about how fucking edgy he is.

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Eva didn't 'try' to elevate animation to art. But it was a phenomenon emergent from an established culture that modern day western animation doesn't have. You can't start with 'animation = adventure time' and get to an Evangelion type of show from here, that's just not a trajectory that makes sense.

> Eva was the one that successfully capitalize that trend and push it to the next level

Correct, because Evangelion fell ass-backwards into marketting the characters instead of the robots on a level that anime hadn't managed before. And part of that is accidental. The more exposure you have to a character, the more you care about them. fan's attachments tot he characters grew to such noteworthy levels because they were invested in the show first, so the strengths of the show turned into fan investment in the characters, which turned into a merchandising machine hawking those characters that lasts to this day.

Evangelion, though it never intended to, started a snowball effect that actually lead to the moe anime boom where the character-advertising formula was refined and directed at the audience without being couched in more high-concept shows. There were a lot of steps in between, notably including the Melancholy of Haruhi Suzamiyah, but from an industry standpoint you can trace that domino chain back towards Eva's financial success and the form that financial success took.

This is why Dragonball is so good. Watching the characters act cocky and bring the bantz mixed with violence is just so fun.

>hedgehog's dilemma are central to the show.

That was essential to the Sonic cartoon as well.

>because Evangelion fell ass-backwards into marketting the characters instead of the robots on a level that anime hadn't managed before
>Evangelion, though it never intended to, started a snowball effect that actually lead to the moe anime boom where the character-advertising formula
This is actually complete bullshit. Evangelion didn't revolutionize/deconstruction/invent mecha. Evangelion didn't revolutionize/deconstruct/invent character pandering/moe. It was just a popular anime and one of the west's first mainstream exposure to mecha. Stop being fucking idiots.

>This is actually complete bullshit. Evangelion didn't revolutionize/deconstruction/invent mecha. Evangelion didn't revolutionize/deconstruct/invent character pandering/moe.

I never said that it was. Read my post again, perhaps more slowly this time.

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>Evangelion fell ass-backwards into marketting the characters instead of the robots on a level that anime hadn't managed before
>Evangelion, though it never intended to, started a snowball effect that actually lead to the moe anime boom
You. fucking. retard.

Who has that webm that has the source of Eva's abstract freak out collages. Some 70s anime

By looking cool and hip. And having almost every imaginable product avaible for their otaku crowd. Gainax was pretty aware of them, because they founders were the same. But the looks of the products gained atention to the normalfags and thus the boom. Is a classic case of style over substance. Much like Gundam endured it axing because the gunplas were masively popular, even if the people how buyed them never saw a single episode.

character is depressed
>so he's mentally I'll? Hack writing
character who suffered everything from rape to alcoholic step dad and is literally a mercenary opens up to someone
shock, he's not happy about his life
>pff this is edgy

If you only get the most surface level stuff from everything you watch it's no wonder you only answer with smug calarts girl pictures from a Netflix children show.
Just in case you need it spelled out, I'm not calling in question the quality of that show, just your failure of reading into things.

>Shinji is scared of getting in the robot from episode one to EoE
Actually he becomes confident in piloting the eva in the middle of the story with no problems doing it until he almost killed his classmate which reverts him back, which was suppose to be the hedgehogs dilemma that was mentioned earlier in the show.
>Asuka is a smug bitch from her introduction to her last scene
She changes from smug bitch to stupid depressed bitch.
> Misato is a slut from episode 1 to her death.
Fair enough
>Of course they do change, but mostly at the very end of the series and it's implied, not even shown.
They do show change tho, pic related. If you mean a character arc, Shinji has one.

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>character who suffered everything from rape to alcoholic step dad and is literally a mercenary
You're certainly not describing Shinji.

It's true, I won't deny there are character arcs, but they never were so sudden you'd call them inconsistent like that user said

You're just continuing to prove my point, man. Here, I'll spell it out for you: there is no puzzle.

He mentioned Berserk. If you don't know it's a really good manga (all 3 adaptations are shit and worthless). It's either recommended to hell and back or dismissed as edgy shir for depicting rape and gore.
In my opinion it justifies the use of edgy elements, which shouldn't be a praise but it's more than a lot of manga do. And yes, it has other good aspects which I'm too lazy to discuss, look it up if you like dark fantasy and autistically detailed art.

I know that the comic counterpart is Watchmen.
for some reason when i watch Batman: TAS it feel like a vibe of Evangelion in it.

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If we are going with comics, there are a bunch that put Eva to shame

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>It depicts teenage depression, loneliness and hopelessness in a very relatable and accurate way.

so it's every anime ever

The Buddha Box episode in latest South Park season
Funny that it made people angry when it was just saying that people are being silly when they run away from human contact and hide behind excuses ("anxiety")

it was not my point but Watchmen is the counterpart of Eva concerning comics, it has the same feel, the same atmosphere and the same kind of ending.

im super surprised this thread isnt beleted but im glad. Eva threads on Yea Forums are pretty rare and i love how this show makes everyone so hostile and defensive to this day. Truly a master piece.

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So you're telling me neon genesis evangelion was influential?

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It's a good show with nice waifus and EoE is kino.

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>evangelion influenced everything before it too
So you're telling me that you're clinically retarded?

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Evangelions aren't robots. This is a major plot point of the series and something that was revealed extremely early on. There is only one giant robot in the entire series, and Misato is the only one to go into a robot.

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>mechanical implants
>piloted by a human
They're robots, biomechanical, but still robots.

There isn't one, and there never will be.

>every anime ever
Oh we have an anime historian here, do tell me when the "depressed anime schoolboy" trend was this popular before evangelion?

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1979+

No, they're Angel clones with human souls stuffed inside that allow their children/clones to direct their movements. Sometimes they go a little crazy and do stuff themselves.

Yes! These guys get it.

Correct. The evangelions themselves are technically giant cyborgs.

But while technically incorrect, its a useful and almost necessary shorthand to refer tot he Evangelions as mecha, because while they are not actually robots they are presented to most of the world as such in-universe (with their true nature being revealed only late in the series) and in a narrative and structural role they are indistinguishable from a piloted machine outside of a small number of scenes.

Its like saying 'Superman doesn't have super-powers, he is a perfectly normal Kryptonian. There isn't anything super about him.' It true on a detail level, but its not a useful definition in terms of function or interaction with the rest of the world.

> Amuro had a single episode where he was upset and acted like a child
> this equates to Shinji Ikari's defining character feature and character arc across his entire show.

I hope you don't mean this.

They have mechanical implants, you retard. They have a literal mechanical plug interface embedded in their spines.

protip: that doesn't make something a robot

Oh yeah, all the popular anime from this time were about depressed schoolboys, like Dragon Ball, Yu Yu Hakusho, Ranma, Fist of the North Star, Urusey Yatsura...
They all scream depression and loneliness.
>but there was this one obscure show
No shit really? Is the sky also blue?

>mass produced eva are good guys
Prove this kid wrong
youtu.be/V5FmFaK7pMU

Yeah, it actually does. Especially in the context of mecha.

Except every word of what he said is literally fucking true, you nonce.

They're like Stilt Striders in morrowind

So... they are angel cyborgs. For example Robocop is not a robot but a human cyborg.

>(with their true nature being revealed only late in the series)
TRUE nature? Sure. But you learn they aren't robots in the second episode.
No, it actually doesn't, you dumbdumb. I think you need to look up what a robot is.

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>Robin Williams isn't with us to see the giant upward surge of popularity that anime experienced in the streaming era

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I don't know but Yui Ikari is closer to an evil character than a good one.
and most people don't even notice it.

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replies:154
posters:66
alright then

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humans are considered robots albeit horrible ones.

Good. Fuck normies.

Nobody cares about crosses. Only people who are so focused on christian imagery in Eva are the haters because they have no better arguments.

That other guy never mentioned mental sickness. And how is having character with mental disease a mediocre writting if it's portrayed properly?
Inb4 No it isn't potrayed properly

>You can say the exact same shit to fucking R&M, don't be a delusional.
So, both shows have it and that somehow makes it's inclusion in Eva bad?! What a fucked logic.

She nothing personnel'd the world for her boy

>Gundam (79, Zeta, 80, 83, Victory, etc)
>Tekkaman Blade
>Devilman
>Cyborg 009
>Kikaider
>Grendizer
>Casshern
>Kotetsu Jeeg
>F
>Berserk
>Ashita no Joe
>Ideon
>Phoenix
>Kamen Rider
>Mutant Sabu
>Mars
>Inazuman
>every shoujo anime/manga bishi ever
Just off the top of my head. I'm only going to spoonfeed you so much, faggot.

Take the L, bitch.

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>wanting that your son became the new god of the world deciding what it should looks like.
>meanwhile you just keep inside an immortal cyborg monster forever floating in space void.
>ruining the lives of a lot of people just for getting away with your shit.

Reador don't you fucking retard.

Take the L, bitch.

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what was the point of that?

Williams wanted to remind everyone of who the real good guys were.

And she got away with it

Eva IS a deconstruction though. It's not as aggressive about shattering the tropes of the genre as something like Watchmen, but it does deliberately criticize the tropes of the genre by carrying them to their logical end, which is all that deconstruction does.

That's not true and that's actually not even what the word deconstruction means.

We aren't discussion if Eva is categorized under the Mecha genre. We are discussing if the Eva units can actually be considered robot, which they aren't. I'm not even gonna bother with you nigger, you clearly don't want to understand.

>berserk is about a depressed schoolboy
Oof

It doesn't say mecha, stupid EOP. It say R O B O T

"Nuh uh"
Welp ya got me there bud

stop derailing the thread you fags

Not one of those is about a depressed affeminate school boy or similar enough to Eva for you to say they're the same. If your description of Eva is "an anime that has bad people in it" then yes, every anime ever, have a gold star.
Is Eva typical? Of course, because it combines a billion things that came before it in a way that has been copied to death, don't be an idiot.

>a philosophical or critical method which asserts that meanings, metaphysical constructs, and hierarchical oppositions (as between key terms in a philosophical or literary work) are always rendered unstable by their dependence on ultimately arbitrary signifiers

>the analytic examination of something (such as a theory) often in order to reveal its inadequacy

Now, you need to back up your claim of how Evangelion "shattered the tropes of its genre". Because for anyone familiar with Mazinger Z, Gundam, Ideon, Mars, Getter Robo, Votoms or any number of mecha anime, Evangelion did absolutely nothing new.

>Not one of those is about a depressed affeminate school boy or similar enough to Eva for you to say they're the same.
You've never read or watched anything on that list, shitposter. Take your rambunctious goalpost and shove it up your faggot ass.

There isn't much left to the thread but derailment, sadly. OP's question has pretty definitively been answered: The west doesn't have any cartoon with the style or impact that Evangelion had in the anime industry.

AND NOBODY SAID NOTHING ABOUT IT!

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It's pretty obvious that you don't even know what Evangelion's actual impact was because you keep claiming it did things it did not. Why do newfags like you always love to talk about about how Evangelion changed or radicalized so much about topics you know nothing about?

Gundam had a single fucking episode about Amuro deserting, and I feel safe betting that every other big mecha series you just listed put about as much time into that story idea.
That's what makes it a trope.
Evangelion explores that idea by applying it to a more realistic depiction of both giant killer robots and their pilots, and lets the story develop in a way that defies the trope. Namely, Shinji doesn't just realize he should pilot the robot to protect everyone - he does it for entirely selfish reasons and ends up often hurting people and adding to the destruction of the world because he couldn't stand up for his own limpwristed 'morals'.

>Gundam had a single fucking episode about Amuro deserting
So now you're talking about deserting? You're a slimy, shape shifting, reptilian motherfucker.

I'm talking about deconstructing tropes you dense tard

Oh my god dudes! Third impact just happened already!

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What """""tropes"""" are they """"""deconstructing"""", retard?

It seems that the two entity can communicate, and we still can post from inside the black moon.

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Literally addressed one at length in my post. I'm not here to babysit illiterate children all day. Read nigger.

Oh no they not agree with cosmic problems.

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You're just better off watching anime for anime equivalents. NGE is just extremely Japanese (apocalyptic Tokyo, kaiju, mechs, schoolkids) and nothing in the West is going to be remotely close to that. I can't imagine a westernized EVA and I don't want to.

Watch Darling in the Franxx if you want something like "spiritual successor Neon Genesis Evangelion." Some of the animation staff in Studio Trigger is leftover from Studio Gainax. In my opinion, they're really "cartoony" for anime and you'll really see it in Franxx at times, gif related.

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>refuses to clearly state his claim and keeps changing his arguments
Fuck off, shitposter

damn now we are all controlled by a wimp kid.

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Kid protagonist's super robot is in hands of a organization/corporation. That's a deconstruction right there. (Deconstruction meaning applying reality to certain tropes)

>Kid protagonist's super robot is in hands of a organization/corporation. That's a deconstruction right there.
Literally Mazinger Z, the first major piloted giant robot series.

>Gundam, tekkaman blade, cyborg 009, kikaider, grendizer, kotetsu jeeg, ideon, Kamen rider, Mars, inazuman...=Eva because robots and young protagonist
You are a literal child that can't tell the difference between genre, trope and setting.
>F=Eva because young and misunderstood protsginidt
>Phoenix=Eva because artsy
>berserk=Eva because depression and edgy
>ashita no joe=Eva because you say so
>mutant sabu=Eva because you didn't read it

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it's the end boys, we are all fucked up.

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I know Gundam is a long-running series, but which ones are actually worth watching?

You're proving that you aren't familiar with any of those series.

0079, Zeta, CCA, 0080, 0083, Turn A

Literally what I said about you, did you run out of arguments because instead of watching anime you take your hot takes from YouTube?

Thank you.

>Literally what I said about you
No, it isn't. You said
>You are a literal child that can't tell the difference between genre, trope and setting.
You made a claim. I proved otherwise. Now you're throwing a tantrum. Typical braindead Evafaggot. You've already made up your mind than Evangelion is a super radical deconstruction of silly giant robots and that it was super new and super original and and and and and
You fucking retard

Pink Floyd’s The Wall?

>LOL CALARTZZZ CHARACTER THEN YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID LOL
Cope it, faggot, take some more.

But let's return to the main problem.
>A cartoon filled with a bunch of traumatized faggots and confusing lore has good writing
Elaborate, go on. And before you mention the hedgehog bullshit.

>Take a character
>Makes him asocial, then social, then asocial again
That's not good writing, mah man.

>NGE is just extremely Japanese
In what matter? I mean, the characters are a bunch of drepessed traumatized faggots and there are bleeding robots fighting, how's that japanese?

>I can't imagine a westernized EVA and I don't want to.
I do can imagine, unironically would watch these and I would enjoy more than eva.

youtu.be/FckkZihQUaU

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>Evatard
>So stupid that doesn't even get a simple definition like "robot"
Imagine being THIS fucking RETARDED, holy shit.

I would instanly kill myself If I were you.

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>implying
You didn't prove anything, you literally pulled a Wikipedia list of mecha shows and said mecha=Eva
Evangelion is as much a deconstruction as OPM, as in not at all.
>new and original
No. You failed twice to understand my point, which is evangelion popularized its ideas and presentation. All this derailing of the thread started because you couldn't accept that Eva clones didn't come before Eva.
>depression and loneliness is every anime ever
Good job in failing to distinguish the most basic of things. Is every comic ever a dude in a cape?

>avatarfag really wants to not look like a retard and fails completely

Surprise surprise

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Western animated films like Watership Down, Plague Dogs, and When the Wind Blows also deal with darker themes like isolation, nuclear war, the search for home and meaning, etc. The Wall is probably closer to Eva in terms of its focus on isolation, loneliness, Etc. When the Wind Blows is probably the most bleak, though.

Fuck You1 You've never watched Berserk! Mature cartoons are better faggot!

>You didn't prove anything, you literally pulled a Wikipedia list of mecha shows
They're not even all mecha. The simple fact is that I backed up my claims and now you're screaming LA LA LA because it doesn't fit your newfag narrative. You are exceedingly pathetic in every sense. No, Evangelion did not popularize "its" ideas and presentation. Anime and mecha had been around thirty years before Eva and it had done it all before. Multiple times. In hundreds of titles across anime and manga.

It didn't even have the first tsundere

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You'd unironically watch low quality, shitty crass fan parodies that rely upon you knowing the source material? More than the material itself? Just make a fucking Youtube playlist then and keep your retardation contained within it's binds.

I didn't say calarts=bad, just that it makes you look like a sad contrarian. Like what you like but I bet you can't watch a single thing labeled "adult" without nitpicking, and yet you're taking the persona of a children's cartoon character (which I haven't watched and I'm sure it's the best thing ever and you're so intelligent...)
Why is Eva well written? The story plays out well and barely misses any beats, the characters are believable, well rounded and interesting to watch (maybe not to you, but so far you haven't showed anything but surface level understanding), the structure and pacing fit the narrative and play off each other very well....
I'm not a published author and critic, there's a limit to the ways I can say "this resonated with me and many others", but you're not Roger Elbert either. In fact when you try to explain why the writing is bad you show a lack of attention.

Bitch I've said it many times before, I do like eva I've watched eva like five times + the movies in the past ten years. Yes it has awsome and beautifully animated scenes, like the Unit 02 vs mass production, but It doesn't deserve that following, or at least if evatards would be glorifying the action scenes and the mecha design instead the fucking writing they would be less annoying.

>The character are believable
>LOL I'M A SAD BOI
>LOL I'M A SAD 20 SOMETHING WOMAN
>LOL I'M A SAD SMUG BITCH
>LOL I'M A SAD AND MISTERIOUS CLONE
Yeah, pretty believable.

>Lol you stayed on the surface you didn't pay enough attention
If you keep repeatin that crap I won't be true, fren.

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Ignore that other user, Gundam is absolutely mediocre and not a single episode or movie is worth watching unless you dig military-use robots.

The series is listing are only appreciated because japanese boomers decided they're the only gundam you're allowed to like and shitpost everything else; it's literally the dadrock of mecha anime and born on le wrong generation faggotry.

>"I do like eva"
>Strawmans characters
Yea, you could actually try next time

>user doesn't understand what context is.

>newfag
Oh boy, now we're pulling the buzzwords. I'm not gonna pretend one word invalidates your argument but it sure makes me hard to take you seriously.
The fact is, you can't admit that Eva was influential because you think that means that Eva invented robots. It does not, it means that the specific way and style it had has been copied directly from Eva countless times since. It's not the best thing in the world, but it sure as hell changed things.

>Strawman character
What did user possible mean by this?

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>gets blown out
>so instead makes a shitpost rant about the term newfag
You're dismissed.

>An intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.
I'd say Google is on point. You taking the most basic concept of every character to make a bad argument doesn't make them like that.

>I'd say Google is on point.
What did user possible mean by this?

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>Can't read 2 paragraphs
>dismissed
I actually laughed loudly, thank you.

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Not worthy of my grace

>It was just a popular anime and one of the west's first mainstream exposure to mecha
It got insanely popular in Italy, too, even though it was far from the first Mecha anime that had been broadcast here.
You can't say that the mindfuckery going on in it didn't have a part in its success, and that people didn't try to emulate it. Can you bring any examples of previous (pseudo)mecha anime who capitalized on character's merchandise, instead of the Mecha's?

If there's one word I'd describe Evangelion with its's "discomfort"

Heard they went too hard in pure translation instead of interpreting the lines to make more sense in English

You know Eva came out before Hey Arnold, right?

Are you mentally retarded or just pretending that you don't know how to read?

Anime quite off-putting? Why?
There are so many. Also not all the same.
Just go to Anime-Planet and use the filters/tags and recommendations:

anime-planet.com/anime/all?include_tags=178

anime-planet.com/anime/neon-genesis-evangelion

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Add recommendation

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Something western (Comics only) you might find at indiecron.com though I didn't find anything tagged as psychological. That also might rather be exactly what they try to avoid, since SJW and Basedboys put that into their stories.

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Angry Beavers did nothing better.

It's no more mediocre than NGE or any other anime. The fact is that anime just sucks, though they suck differently.

>no children's cartoon recs pls
The main characters of Evangelion are children because that's who the show was aimed at.

As something adult from the west I actually recall Heavy Metal Animated Movies. There are two, I have only seen the second one and want to watch the other. Well, they aren't psychological. That's quite rare.

Western animation for adults, with psychology? Hmm. South Park? Rick and Morty? :) Yeah, Bojack Horseman is something I saw Youtube vids about. This might what you are searching for.

Evangelion explained (spoilers of course)
youtube.com/watch?v=rHIvs0Q-uKI
youtube.com/watch?v=USKzAj1dOq4
or just youtube.com/watch?v=FW4y7jolPu8

You're over simplifying and misrepresenting the characters from Evangelion. It's fair if your take on eva is that stupid mecha show with "mature" themes, but it seems like you boiled the characters down to the memes associated with Evangelion rather the actual characters in the show. Like Ex: "Shinji get in the robot" doesn't make sense since he almost always gets in the eva.

you peons have forgotten Xavier Renegade Angel and The Shivering Truth.

as far as a surreal coming of age story id say Over the Garden Wall but something that is as culturally impact full of Eva would be The Last Air bender.

i cant think of anything that is thematic, surreal, visually stunning, a coming of age and has cultural impact all together on the same level.

Samurai Jack and last airbender is almost all of the qualities but lack surrealness and wilst they do go far in their themes they dont go on the same level of deepness as Eva, Xavier or The Shivering Truth.

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inb4 grammar mistakes. im sleepy as fuck

Last Airbender had no impact on cartoons. The custerfuck that was Korra killed any good will or ideas that Bryke were good writers. The only character left unmolested was Zuko

everyone copied the anime style

and how many show runners have switched the show direction to be serialized (even if it would damage the show) and said they were inspired by avatar?

every show is serialized and has an anime style because of avatar but they dont know why it works.

Avatar worked because there were execs and smart people to reign in Bryke.