First good thing DC has done with magic in years

>first good thing DC has done with magic in years
>gets cancelled due to gross incompetence

Why?

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>DC
>Gross Incompetence
Yup, checks out.

They’ve butchered their trades as well. Killed their Archive format in favor of Omnibus, then pulled the plug on half of their Omnibus output...leaving their fans with huge incomplete gaps. LOSH has been left unfinished, Brave and the Bold was one volume shy of completion, JLA stopped just as they got to the satellite era. Can’t manage to collect Starman in any format and actually keep it in print.

...they can’t even collect Batman in sequential order!

And the fucked up thing is, for the most part, the creative staff is completely innocent of all this shit. All anyone that's actually creating shit wants to do is make good products and entertain their audience and everyone in editorial on up keeps fucking things up. Every episode of Swamp Thing is so damn good, and there won't be anymore after this one, truncated season, and they're setting shit up like the Dreaming and the Rot and Anton Arcane and I just want to know who in specific needs to get fired for everything to be okay again.

Agreed, from the first trailer for Swamp Thing I was hooked...and I usually despise comic tv shows including Netflix. The fact that it colossally fucked up on the production side is just fucking great. Whatever the opposite of karma is really.

On the comics side the rot extends to the creative people involved though. It’s all vanity projects and IP farming.

>why?
Not enough Batman, obviously

>Agreed, from the first trailer for Swamp Thing I was hooked...and I usually despise comic tv shows including Netflix. The fact that it colossally fucked up on the production side is just fucking great. Whatever the opposite of karma is really.
I just don't get where the fans are on it. Just cause it's just getting this one season doesn't mean that it isn't worth watching, or even fighting for. But everyone's just resigned to it, and there's no excitement over it, despite how good it is. If we fought for it, we might be able to get the story to continue by getting an Animal Man series next year (tax rebates for filming in California are guaranteed, Buddy lives in San Diego and is a Hollywood stuntman) but there isn't even a single petition with more than a few thousand signatures.

>Blaming the show's cancellation on DC only but not blaming WB or AT&T

Fucking brainlet

>the opposite of karma is really.
Karma doesn't really have an opposite? It doesn't have a good or connotation

>swamp thing cancelled
>vertigo cancelled (again)
Coincidence?

Or North Carolina.

You actually got 4 season and a dark Justice league spin-off, but I made some deals with the devil to get my Goon movie. So we had to change some things in the universe

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>first good thing DC has done with magic in years
That's not Doom Patrol Which I fucking hope doesn't get cancelled

You answered your own question. Anyway as much as I love YJ and DP, a streaming service that exists solely for dc content was never a particularly good idea.

No one's blaming North Carolina because you would have to be the biggest fucking retard to still believe that bullshit

It did

Only reason that Doom Patrol won't get a second season is if the streaming app goes belly up, which is definitely in the realm of possibilities
Also, Doom Patrol doesn't have anything to do with magic. Everyone in that show has a metagene except for Cliff.

Yeah, Vertigo is closing because they don't have any books while swamp thing was cancelled because some suit wanted a police procedural show.

Oh, with Magic I thought you mean good, sorry.

Oh no, with the exception of Titans, that term of art holds true to all the content we've been getting from the streaming platform. Young Justice season 3 has been great so far, really looking forward to the second half, Doom Patrol is possibly the best tv show adapted from a comic book period, Swamp Thing is not only a great adaptation, it's also great horror fiction independent of the comics connection, and even Harley Quinn looks like it'll be great.

My biggest hope is that they'll continue making specialty content like this, if the streaming platform gets cut off. But then again, if anyone's more incompetent than the higher-ups at DC, it's the higher-ups at Warner Bros, so I'm not holding my breath.

>and even Harley Quinn looks like it'll be great.
Haha

I never said it wasn’t worth watching, heck I’ll buy the Blu-ray for it when it’s out but no petition is going to get it extended for season two. That’s just naive. A few thousand signatures is not going to convince the bean counters at Time Warner to throw more money at a project that cost them 40 million dollars.

DC is owned by Time Warner. They have a “little” experience at film and television production. Somebody missed a trick and cost the company 40 million dollars, somebody at DC/Time Warner is at the very least partially responsible. When you enter into a contract it is the responsibility of BOTH parties to ensure everything is carried out to the letter. North Carolina fucked up but somebody probably should have double checked before committing thousands of man hours and millions of dollars to the project.

..but, regardless, my original axe to grind was with DC’s publishing wing due to the eternal mismanagement of their trades. My point being that I have been burned by DC Comics, so I’m not entirely surprised when DC Productions fucks up.

I realize that, if there was a word for it I would have used it. Karma is the reciprocal reaction to an individuals actions, good events follow good actions and bad events follow bad actions. In this case DC had noble/artistic/entertaining actions and were met with nothing but crap.

I wish some of the more negative responses to my comments had read said comments a little more carefully. I wanted the show to succeed more than any other comic based television show ever. EVER. I don’t usually get excited at all for these shows, Doom Patrol trailers got me curious but Swamp Thing made me look into buying the damn DC streaming service. It pissed me off when the show was announced as dead on arrival and I was furious when they presented us with the reason for its cancellation...but I guess I’m not surprised.

Laugh all you like, they have a three in four record at this point, which is pretty damn strong. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Titans' second season was an upgrade from garbage to 'watchable.'

>A few thousand signatures is not going to convince the bean counters at Time Warner to throw more money at a project that cost them 40 million
That's what I'm saying, though. Fan petitions have moved production studios before, which is why I wonder why petitions aren't getting circulated, and why they aren't getting more signatures. Cause, yeah, a few thousand signatures isn't gonna do shit, but get that up to a few hundred thousand, and it might.

Now now, it's not DC gross incompetence.
It's usually WB gross incompetence.

>"We need to cancel this Superman movie made by Tim Burton in his prime so we can make Wild Wild West"

>They have a “little” experience at film and television production.
I don't get your logic here bud, you think some suits who think police procedurals are the hot ticket in this post GoT world can do no wrong?

Precisely one response in this thread that mentions AT&T, the true reason.

New managers come in and they gotta show the old guys who is boss. New bosses will do the dumbest shit just to lord over the people on the way out.

Wild Wild West is indefensible, don't get me wrong, but cancelling that Superman movie probably saved the character and DC itself, after Batman and Robin. I have a Nic Cage shrine in my closet, but even this picture alone makes my heart hurt.

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>DC
WB

>it saved the character
Being ignored in today's world and considered a relic is not saving the character.

You've got to listen to Kevin Smith (who wrote the script) talk about the movie. The badness of it cannot be understated. The guy that produced Wild Wild West was also going to produce Superman Lives.

Part 1: youtube.com/watch?v=Wo2KB1dEDdk
Part 2: youtube.com/watch?v=53hMYw8LX60

>Good
>Gets cancelled due to gross incompetence
Pick one.

Why is this happening? Why is DC/ WB fucking up so bad? Why haven't they got their shit together after all this time?

Does anyone know why they butchered their trades? It doesn't make sense to me.

People thought Batman was ruined because of schumacher but people's memories are short. You need exposure or else you'll fade into the background of pop culture.

Again...you people need to READ better. I’m saying the opposite!

If the reason for the cancellation was Time Warner’s excuse about NC tax rebates then it’s Warner’s fault for not doing their due diligence. If the fault is due to the rumor that a bunch of brainless suits at WB/AT&T shut the show down because it didn’t make sense to them then it’s STILL their fault.

No matter the excuse the fault lies on Warner/AT&T/DC/whoever.

Batman and Robin came out in 97, there wasn't another Batman movie until Begins, which came out in 05. Prior to that, we had Batman in 89, Returns in 92 and Forever in 95.

But it didn't ruin him

It made it damn near impossible to get a movie about him off the ground. If Superman Lives came out, and it would've come out after Batman and Robin, I think movie execs would be paranoid about making superhero movies PERIOD. It could've even killed Raimi's Spider-Man. Besides, Superman is the most recognizable American symbol, right up there with Mickey Mouse. He isn't going anywhere from the public eye. The idea that we have to keep IPs fresh and in the public eye is how we get shit like Fant4stic and that latest X-Men movie.

Some of the reasons for canceled trades are due to the creator contracts that were handed out in the Bronze Age. DC wanted to look like the savior of the industry at a time when Marvel was fighting ugly legal battles with their creators. Flash forward a few decades and now DC either can’t or won’t pay the fees they negotiated with the creators for their work. Batman in particular gets screwed because they rotated a lot of top writers and artists through the various bat-titles at the time, some creators are willing to renegotiate and others aren’t so DC just puts out scattered offerings under specific writer/artist banners. It became a hodgepodge of overlapping issues and large missing chunks (see pic).

Other title sold well as omnibus volumes, so Didio & co. realized they could issue the remaining issues in smaller more expensive (on a page basis) books.

No idea why some volumes become OOP almost immediately. Titles like Suicide Squad and Star Man just randomly drop volumes.

Forgot pic

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>It made it damn near impossible to get a movie about him off the ground
It took about 8 years.

>Flash forward a few decades and now DC either can’t or won’t pay the fees they negotiated with the creators for their work.
Levitz was the man in the ear of the young and inexperienced Jeanette Kahn. He convinced her that creatives should get better page rate deals and royalties for reprints. She agreed, and thirty years later the market did NOT grow in the way that they assumed it would.
One of the contracts changed it so creatives got paid PER PAGE, instead of a cut of the cover price for collections.
It's no shock that they just solicited a Bronze Age Omni of Jonah Hex one year following the death of his creator and main writer. That omni collects mostly pre-royalty stuff, but now any further omni will be royalty free because the creative is dead.
Didio also seems to have backtracked on his "don't call them Bronze Age" titles for that one, possibly because Hex is his favourite character.

But Shazam came out this year, OP

Shazam's a solid 8 out of 10, and Swamp Thing is a nine.

it wasn't their fault. Their sponsors(michigan? wyoming? i don't remember which state was) gave them less than half the money was accorded and everything went downhill from there.

You’re really surprised? They’ve tried Swamp Thing before. Live action and animated. It’s been cancelled before Season 2 every time.

>Live action and animated. It’s been cancelled before Season 2 every time.

>debuted on USA Network on July 27, 1990, and lasted three seasons for a total of 72 episodes. It was later shown in reruns on the Sci Fi Channel.

Alright, so I wasn’t happy with just 72 episodes.

You got me

If so. That makes Swamp Thing the second good, magic based DC medium

My petard has been hoisted!

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user i dont understand......

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There’s letters sealed; and my two schoolfellows,
Whom I will trust as I will adders fanged,
They bear the mandate; they must sweep my way
And marshal me to knavery. Let it work,
For ’tis the sport to have the enginer
Hoist with his own petard; and ’t shall go hard
But I will delve one yard below their mines
And blow them at the moon. O, ’tis most sweet
When in one line two crafts directly meet.

—Prince Hamlet, in Hamlet, Act 3, Scene 4.

>Good thing
ummm episode 4 was complete boring filler trash my dude

No it doesn’t. Just because you disagree with their decisions doesn’t make them incompetent.

Yeah...it’s pretty obvious that something fishy is going on at DC.

First they announce 5 Bronze Age Omnibus: JLA vol. 3, Brave and the Bold vol. 3, Joker, House of Secrets vol. 2 and Doom Patrol.

Then they cancel JLA and BatB only. They state that Bronze Age branding is the problem. Joker, HoS and DP continue on with no change.

Then they proudly announce a smaller (much more expensive) JLA hardcover that covers a scant few issues from what would have been volume 3. Weeks later they announce Bronze Age Jonah Hex and House of Mystery vol 2.

So, essentially, Bronze Age branding is only a problem if they think they can squeeze more money out of the fan base.

If the bungled the contract with North Carolina then yes they are incompetent. When you are expecting someone to gift you $40M you should probably make sure every “t” is crossed in the contract.

If they cancelled the show because they didn’t understand it and ignored the fan base they were desperately trying to cultivate then, again, they are incompetent. DC is trying to get their streaming app off the ground, this is the time for them to be pandering HARD to fans but apparently they just decided a show wasn’t to their liking.

One crappy episode doesn't mean the whole damn show is bad

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North Carolina has literally nothing to do with anything

No but it highlighted the flaw of this series. Without Swamp thing and Abby on screen nobody else is interesting. Blue Devil had some good moments but still everything is stupid.

If they really wanted to make this a good episode they would have had the cop shoot a black kid or something. It would be one of the only times a cop shooting episode could be done without being political trash.

This show is so boring with Swamp thing fighting someone

Even the Swamp Thing/Abby things were trash because Abby actress is such trash.

Kevin Smith only did the first draft, and he admit his script sucks. The other scripts afterward were better.
And even if it was on par with early X-Men movies or Batman Returns, it would still be fantastic for finally giving us Brainiac.

Hey dude you should know that that was confirmed false. north Carolina had to issue a statement saying it was even impossible to give them 40 million rebate because that is more than the entire tax credit budget for the whole state. At most they would have gotten 12 million. Probably not even that. It's been confirmed that the guy on twitter who spread that rumor was wrong and even he acknowledged it

not to mention regular trades are like 7 months back now.
Hawkman vol 1, collecting the first six issues, came out last week.
Hawkman #13 came out this past week as well.
I think AT&T is asking them to justify their existence, and Didio's scrambling

>DC is owned by Time Warner.
Which means Time Warner is primarily responsible, you fucking brainlet

"DC" doesn't really exist anymore either. Years ago "DC Films" and "DC Comics" were placed under "DC Entertainment," but now DC Entertainment is gone. They are just a division of "WarnerMedia Global Brands" now.

Then why did this happen?

Is this about gay threesomes?

Because there is no god

AT&T/ WB need to be punished for this heads need to roll!

What are you talking about?

Yes, I’m aware but the people defending DC keep repeating the same excuses. I tailor my responses to counter both arguments (because I have no life).

This guy summarized it for me but in case you didn’t get the memo: when I say DC or TW or whatever I am referring to the company as a whole. I don’t care who reports to who or what division does what, or what the company name is on their paychecks. The people involved with the comics are fucking up. The people involved with the movies are fucking up. The people involved in the app are fucking up.

I say this as a DC fan since I was 6, I don’t take delight in their failures. I’m not trying to attack the fans or start company wars, I just want them to get their shit together so I can enjoy my funny books dammit!

No. I think you severely don’t understand the term incompetent. Cow towing to people who want you to change the direction of your own company would be incompetent.

I believe he’s referring to the perceived delay in converting floppies into trades. Marvel tends to flood the market with trades almost immediately after the story arc has wrapped up in the floppies. So most stories are set at 5 or 6 issues specifically to fit neatly into trades.

DC usually allows their floppies to breathe a bit before collecting them into trades. The theory being that once you release a trade there is less incentive for fans to buy the standalone issues, which in my mind is flawed because I suspect the overlap of fans that buy floppies and fans that buy trades is relatively small. I wouldn’t call it a flaw in DC though.

So...catering to the fans that are buying your product is incompetent but trashing a product you spent millions of dollars creating because you don’t “get it” is not incompetent?

Is that what you’re saying?

Is there any chance DC will get their shit together? I’m starting to get very blackpilled. AT&T/ TW make it real embarrassing to be a DC fan sometimes.

Who tf are you quoting?
Nobody said that. Nobody said “because we don’t get it”.

Well I wouldn’t have put it that bluntly, but yes that’s right.

They've been wholly owned by TW since the 1960s.
That's never happening

I would have to agree. It’s my product I don’t have to cater to anyone.

But secondly, they’re already buying. What more do I need from them

What’s never happening? Them getting their shit together?

Bad shows get cancelled.

>bait

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If people stop buying your product eventually you will have no money. Am I being trolled?

I keep seeing the story being repeated that some exec greenlit the show because they thought it would be a police procedural and when they saw the result they were confused and annoyed, so they cancelled the show despite the positive buzz.

Please

That’s not true at all. I didn’t have fans when I first started, so you don’t lose all of your money.

That isn’t the exec not getting the hype.
It’s the exec not caring about the hype.
Two different things.

I know. I specifically said he didn’t “get” the show and didn’t care about the hype.

The DCUniverse forums are a shit show. People demanding answers and DC representatives just ignoring things/probably not knowing what to say (since the truth seems to be off the table).

Starman softcovers got cancelled because orders were low. It's like with ongoing series, the first issue is always the highest ordered, then orders drop for every issue after. After the third volume they realized they would lose money continuing to print them.

There's always the hardcovers but I know the later volumes go for a pretty penny.

At least he got that giant spider

They misunderstood the success of the hardcovers. I think if they waited a few years and then tried softcovers, the line would have continued. Instead, the people who had been clamoring for collections bought the HC's, and wouldn't double up on softcovers. One would assume that more people would buy cheaper softcovers, except Starman wasn't quite as popular as they thought it might be.
Robinson quitting DC and running to Marvel probably didn't help in the professional relations either.