I just finished watching The Sweatbox, and I'm curious has there ever been another animated movie completely retooled from the ground up like Kingdom of the Sun? Where the final product isn't even recognizable to the original concept?
Also, has there ever been a concrete reason for why Kingdom of the Sun didn't work? While watching the executives simply kept saying that it wasn't working, was there just too much going on? While I love the Emperor's New Groove, I would have loved to see the original idea completed as well.
From what I've heard KotS just had too much shit happening. You had the Prince and the Pauper plot, a romantic subplot with a llama herder girl, Yzma wanting to lasso the sun, AND llama transformation shenanigans on top of it all. It just never gelled.
Nathaniel Powell
This. The Emperor’s New Groove was better and funnier than KotS. KotS was too generic, like Princess and the Frog. My only problem is that Yzma didn’t keep her villain song.
Jace Reed
I heard it was originally conceived as “animated GoT” then got retooled as a Disney ripoff at the last minute.
Good Dinosaur took a pretty big stripdown, though certainly still to a lesser extent
Kayden Stewart
Both Zootopia and Frozen are way different from their original drafts. Zootopia is particular was about Hunchback level in dark themes and edgyness.
Owen Evans
That makes sense, the plot does seem bloated. I'd love to see the work print to see if it was as bad as the execs thought it was. And I agree, it sucks Yzma's song was lost. The clips of the storyboarded scenes set to it looked pretty amazing. The love song was pretty catch too.
Interesting, but thinking about it that makes sense.
Daniel Nguyen
Emperor's New Groove is remembered today for being much more zany than the Renaissance films, so Kingdom of the Sun wouldn't stand out as much, but the 2D division was in decline due to the rise of 3D and the end result would be the same.
Zootopia, Frozen, Brave (They removed Brenda Chapman and dismantled half of the film into a mess) Bolt, and I think Toy Story 1 got retooled as well
Hunter Gonzalez
Another user, but the problem was the movie got changed JUST BECAUSE a few powerful executives decided it was not good enough. NOT because an actual AUDIENCE disliked it.
Cameron Johnson
Zootopia is the closest to that, I think. They spent years developing the world around the extreme oppression of predators and Nick making a theme park where they can take off the shock collars that hurt them when they get too excited. On the surface it's not a bad plot; how do you rectify the disparity between species especially when it comes to the fact that some survive off killing others? The racism allegory is a little more lost when the animosity and fear are more in the forefront and we see the movie through Nick's perspective, but all that darkness makes it a world that you hate. It took Lasseter to work his Pixar magic to "save" the film, helping everyone realize that Nick can't be the main character and they can't have the shock collars if that was going to sell well.
Ian Price
Pixar used to do it all the time to polish the final product. Now they just throw them out for the milking
Alexander Flores
Yeah wasn't Frozen in development for like almost a fucking decade as they went through more and more drafts and ideas?
Connor Perez
narrative sucks but those illustrations are nice
Mason Price
Shrek, I think. Always heard the Farley version was way different than the Meyers one.
Leo Jenkins
that really is a top tier villain song.
Ian Miller
Toy Story 3 was suppose to be about a recall of the Buzz Lightyear toys.
Alexander Edwards
Yeah I kinda like Nobleman Gaston.
Blake Flores
Well, Pixar have tried to make a cult around itself, to be the next Disney (the family friendly quality entertainment company that can do no wrong). They succeeded. By eventually becoming one with Disney. Therefore, failing to take on the giant.
Kevin Diaz
Frozen literally
Jackson Howard
Wow, just wow.
Camden Scott
Not quite, they where trying to do the SnowQueen since Walt's times. The project got started and shelved many times until the last version got made.
Xavier Murphy
In what way is that a disaster?
Andrew Collins
I dunno, I pretty heavily prefer this Maurice over the one we actually got
William Myers
>emperor's new school was canceled because izma's voice actor died
well fug
Josiah Cook
If The Emperor's New Groove gets a live action, they'd insert Malina/Mata/Nina for feminism points
They fucking better, I need a sweet brown cutie to jack off to.
Nicholas Russell
Goddamn, Lasseter looking looking like the pussy grabbed him back
Brayden Rodriguez
It ended literally just a month before she died, do you really think the fact she had terminal colon cancer didn't factor in to their decision to end the show knowing she'd be dead within the year? Like come on, use your brain.
Parker Phillips
So fucking weird to think this is one of the few situations where the more corporate project ended being more widely beloved and appreciated than the version with creative freedom ever would have been.
Luis Garcia
I'll be honest, the shock collar thing shouldn't have made it past the pitch phase. The whole crux of racism/bigotry is fearing or disdaining something different regardless of the reality. It involves creating an alternate reality that justifies the hate. When you have the marginalized group actually have the real scary power or proclivity to violence, you then have to jump through insane hoops to make the bad guys unreasonable.
Juan Moore
It ended with Kuzco graduating and becoming emperor again. Where else could they go with the show?
Evan King
In regards to Zootopia and Frozen, how far in production were they? I know Elsa, at the very least, went through many overhauls and ultimately Let It Go (as a villain song) changed their mind. I'm just curious if the production was as far along as KotS. The script, storyboards, voice work and musical numbers were all complete and the animation was 20% complete. Years of work completely thrown out the window plus tons of workers laid off.
Maybe it's the fact it was all done by hand and quickly waved away like that. It's mindblowing to me.
I guess that's what I wonder - would it really not reasonated with audiences? The footage seen looks great, but it's hard to say what the end product would have been like. It's hard because I wouldn't want to trade Emperor for KotS, but I want to see what KotS would have brought to the table.
Asher Bailey
I think they decided to write that as the finale when they took Eartha Kitt's situation into account, which is why it's "cancelled" but the last episode makes sense as an ending.
Bentley Myers
honestly this happens pretty often with Disney animated films, stemming all the way back to the 40's(pretty much every Canon film from between Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty originated from projects Walt was tinkering with after Snow White's success, similarly The Shaggy Dog started out as an animated film project during the early 40's as well before being retooled into a Live Action project in the 50's)
and this isn't even going into the concepts Disney's tried developing that never materialized
can't remember if it was Lasseter or someone else who was quoted as saying that Zootopia had to be a society worth saving or else all the audience will want is to see it be destroyed, which obviously Lasseter understood considering how things went with Toy Story 1's development
It was originally meant to be about penguins that played in a band mirroring the early year of the Beatles playing small clubs and trying to get by before they made it big. And the idea was to get the cast of Seinfeld on board. Jerry was brought on with a pay or play contract so when that project fell apart they had to do something since they owed Jerry a lot of money regardless if a movie was made at all. So they went with the B-Script and retooled it into something of Seinfeld's own design.
Adam Ross
Yea I don't know why they did not just drop the less important parts of the plot. Either Have Yzma remove the sun and darken the kingdom, or have Yzma replace the emperor with a llama herder. Or Have Yzma turn the emperor into a llama. But all three together made no sense.
Dylan Sanchez
Brave changed a lot.
Merrida was supposed to just run off and go be a wandering adventurer. But abandoning her responsibility broke the truce between kingdoms and some kind of agreement with the forest spirits and the entire kingdom was cursed again. Also the whole thing took place during winter.
I'm pretty sure this happens with most media, things rarely look exactly like they did during the concept stage.
Well for once they were right there.
Robert King
>Bakshi pitched Cool World to Paramount Pictures (where Bakshi had worked as the final head of the studio's animation division) as an animated horror film. The concept of the film involved a cartoon and live action human having sex and conceiving a hybrid child who visits the real world to murder the father who abandoned her.[2] Bakshi states that Paramount Pictures "bought the idea in ten seconds"
>As the sets were being built in Las Vegas, producer Frank Mancuso, Jr., son of Paramount president Frank Mancuso, Sr., had the screenplay rewritten in secret, and gave Bakshi a new screenplay by screenwriters Michael Grais and Mark Victor that "was barely the same".[2] Larry Gross also contributed to the script, but his work would later go on to be uncredited. In interviews at the time of the film's release, Mancuso, Jr., who was best known for the Friday the 13th franchise, stated a desire to move away from horror films, and wanted to produce a film "about what happens when someone creates a world, becomes defined by it, and then can't escape [...] a film about being trapped by your own creation."[1] Bakshi remembers that he got into a fight with Mancuso, Jr. and "punched [him] in the mouth."[4] Paramount threatened Bakshi with a lawsuit if he refused to complete the film.
Kinda shit to know we'll NEVER get another documentary like it given the current state of Disney and how secretive they are. Personally I'd love a doc on how this film went to hell, it seemed like such a clear winner on paper. For it to just have been shelved entirely still baffles me. >inb4 muh porn Bitch, Disney's directly influenced countless of fetishes. You think they care after fucking Zootopia?
Does no one remember the OFFICIAL Disney porn vault?
Owen Russell
It's just a rumor, albeit one I don't think anyone would ever be shocked by if they found out it was true.
Michael Green
>Sweatbox >Death of Superman Lives >Jodorowsky's Dune Any other great documentaries like this?
Ryan White
I forgot what exactly toy story 1's plot was going to be, the biggest changes i remember were woody's design (he was a lot more like a ventriloquist doll) and that woody was a total asshole and just bossed everyone else around rather than being the cool leader from the final product.
Gabriel Gonzalez
I'm more upset about King of the Elves being cancelled. Gigantic just seemed like a predictable road trip story.
It was a matter of no one could make the story work. It had the same problem as Zootopia that the story was just bad. You could not help but hate the giant girl and they could not change that perspective. Then after they took too damn long in the planning stages Disney shelved it since they did not want to keep paying for a movie that had not even gone to modeling yet. Not when they had at least 5 other projects that were progressing faster and would be ready to go before Gigantic at that point
I'm pissed about both. And not like we'll ever know what the fucking story was anyway.
Kevin Hill
This project really left Roger Allers a broken husk of a man didn't it? The last thing of note he did was fucking Open Season and then he whooshed out of the industry for good.
Carson James
Lost Soul: The Doomed Journey of Richard Stanley’s Island of Dr. Moreau
Hunter Wilson
Thank you!
Josiah Young
The book it's based off is quite adult.
Executive meddling is not always a bad thing and TENG is Exhibit A for why this is so.
Landon Williams
I bet this movie had something to do with it (just like what happened to Newt/Rio).
>Executive meddling is not always a bad thing You're absolutely right. However, there is no way of knowing if a movie is actually bad unless you let a public judge it.
Camden Roberts
Holy shit. This is genuinely one of the best Disney songs, and it isn't even on the final product
Carson Martin
>Looks at all the mediocre-to-awful films that were box office smashes Yeah, nah.
Bentley Robinson
What the fuck, this is actually great
Eli Baker
It's a Disney villain song, of course it is.
Benjamin Davis
This video goes into detail about what the whole premise of the Zootopia's Tame Collar story would have been like. youtube.com/watch?v=tmU1_Ou90Z8
Jordan White
>Daddy was no dummy >Did outrageous things with a mummy How did they get away with this?
Camden Perez
Because the context doesn't point to sex at all unless you're a complete degenerate.
Connor Bennett
This is Disney, it's always about sex.
Nathaniel Robinson
I thought you were defending producers who did not want financial failures.
Honestly the whole thing came from the fact that they had to make a B Movie since the first one fell through
Ryan Gutierrez
Top 3 Disney villain songs for me with Hellfire and Friends on the Other Side
Henry Young
The idea behind a producer is that they are theoretically supposed to want to make a good movie both because of artistic merit and profitability. The only way for an audience to "judge" a movie in any tangible way is by voting with their wallets. >there is no way of knowing if a movie is actually bad unless you let a public judge it Lots of good movies have flopped and lots of bad movies have hit it big. I'd trust those actually involved in the moviemaking process sooner than the public.
Henry Reed
But you would trust those who possess lots of cash, but never made a movie in their lives.
Adrian Reyes
>never made a movie in their lives Yer wot
Juan Carter
Imaging Zootopia, duh.
Ayden Adams
>Phenomenal villian song >Excellent love song Huh
Jeremiah Wood
there's a really good documentary about Canon Films called Electric Boogaloo, also Shout Factory's streaming service has quite a few interesting documentaries as well
Owen Mitchell
What a fucking dick move. No one could ever fault Bakshi for socking that dirty weasel.
Noah Mitchell
but this is nonsense, that would be like saying that we must represent the 50's with it's racism more harmless and friendly, so that the 50's are worth it to be saved.
Matthew Collins
The MUH RACISM allegory nearly killed my ability to enjoy Zootopia, and thank whatever gods the original version kicked the bucket. The final movie is just fine, the original is preachy as fuck. I don't want to watch a movie only for the movie to shout "RACISM IS BAD PREDATORS ARE BROWN PEOPLE DON'T BE RACIST WHITE BOY!" That will kill the escapism I wanted.
tl;dr I don't care if original Zootopia was darker and edgier, that is not inherently good.
God it's a shame that Sting got shafted so hard during production and only got two songs released out of the film. Heck even My funny Friend and Me is pretty damn good considering it had to be made literally last minute. I'd kill to hear the rest of his sample tracks because what was presented in the sweatbox sounded pretty sweet.
frozen was very far along, they had finished the models of 'evil elsa' and alternate anna and some locations. those versions of the character even show up in a very old trailer. lord weselton is a reused model- originally he was the regent that looked after the girls. they also had a whole bunch of discarded songs. youtube.com/watch?v=DNeRM2yuh9U
I guess that's the advantage to the switch to CGI, it doesn't completely hault production when there are huge script rewrites.
It's a shame we lost Life's Too Short, it was nice seeing Anna have a bit of a backbone.
Colton Wilson
That's more true to Zootopia. They could change Hopps chasing Nick Wilde to Judy chasing Weselton, change Taming Party into Shrew Wedding and so on. Frozen rewrites were so late and sudden some scenes feel unfinished and out of place, like Trolls song or mismatched textures.
Andrew Martin
Yea since the models and background exist you can just reanimate a scene quickly, or alter scenes. Heihei in Moana was originally a dick that kept trying to drown the pig over and over again. But very ery late in production they decided to drop the pig and make the chicken retarded. This was a eleventh hour change in the movie.
Elijah Jenkins
>Heihei in Moana was originally a dick that kept trying to drown the pig over and over again
what is with disney and their love for mean spirited humour?
also, lots of promo material have old heihei images.
Yea the movie came out in November, the Heihei scenes were altered around July. Extremely late to redo a side character.
Jace Martinez
I remember reading somewhere that the protagonist's name was changed because one of the producers or executives wanted her to be named after his daughter.
Poor kid.
Ryan Watson
iirc that movie was micromanaged by execs to hell and back.
i know execs want to make money off the movie, but it's primarly art, a story artist want to tell. unless it's illumination product
Joshua Jackson
>Giant girl was unlikeable In what way? And how were the so-called top of the heap in animation unable to fix this? That sounds less like a reason and more like an excuse. If she really was unlikeable then I'm pretty sure they could've fixed it if they wanted to put the effort in.
Nathaniel Wood
zootopia also have leftovers from the old script in the merch
I actually know someone who worked on that movie. He seems to have enjoyed himself on the project but almost everything he says about it is laced with this slight resentment for the final product. Literally he prefaces it with 'yeah, I know, I know' every time.
I get the idea from a lot of what he said that not only was there executive pushback, but there were a lot of behind the scenes issues too. One of the animators got into a car crash and all of their scenes had to be done by another animator, on top of what they had to do. Some of the animators didn't seem to agree with the decisions about how the animation was being done. Really I'm shocked it made it out at all between shit like that and the executive meddling.
Charles Carter
>mismatched textures Do you have examples of that?
Joshua Ortiz
Happens all the time. Story isn't working or it's mediocre and not up to the standards. Writers rework it and make up some boards to show off to the producers. Still not working they try again. If this process is taking too damn long the suits will pull the plug because they greenlight a script they think can go straight into production now and have a movie made on a very short time table. If they have to remake their concept two and three times then they are wasting precious production time, obviously they don't have a solid script, and likely lied to the executives about being able to have X movie complete in time for Holiday next year or two years down.
They will then go to the next guy they have who claims to have a completed script, complete vision and is ready to go to modeling. A company like Disney will have no shortage of guys waiting to have their concept greenlit.
Cameron Gonzalez
Disney recorded the first part of We Know Better on the soundtrack but completely left out the part where Anna and Elsa start drifting away because Anna start seeing her sister, her best friend, as a burden just like her parents does.
I assumed he must have performed some kind of black magic to make it into a slave or something. Didnt yzma have zombies singing along in this song?
Brody Powell
Not that user and I don't know if it happened more than once during the movie, but I know there's at least pic related. Look at the stones on the structure that's in front of the large ship.
I like the little touch of color that gives Judy the illusion of hair. It's a nice touch, shame they took it off.
There was an animated sequence in the song where there is something undead (either zombies or mummies) taking their heads off and passing them along in a line.
Luis Gonzalez
>something undead (either zombies or mummies) taking their heads off and passing them along in a line That's from Corpse Bride.
One of things I love the most about New Groove is how unique the character designs are from other Disney movies around that era. It goes with the kind of humor it brought which makes this movie so distinct from Disney's overall library. It felt more WB than anything
In the original draft, Yzma had three colorful skeleton underlings who served as extra comic relief and her muscle (like a cross between Kronk and the Lion King hyenas). That line is about how her father would decorate his undead underlings, which Yzma found to be beautiful and inspired her to take up necromancy.
Kayden Jackson
And Kronk is the best Disney-villain sidekick ever.
Dominic Mitchell
it's a shame there isn't even an official instrumental of it. or a good fanmade one(?) fanfiction.net/r/10038789/
his voice actor is amazing. patrick warburton should be in more things.
Bentley Lopez
I think Let It Go is the most obvious mark that the film was retooled. In the final movie, it's weird as shit that she's so bombastic and confident for that one scene, then immediately goes back to being awkward afterward.
William Davis
MY SPINACH PUFFS
Blake Kelly
youtube.com/watch?v=enblcH0MaOY There's this one, i wouldn't call it the "best" but it's still something. I'd be nice to hear it being sung.
>everything you create while working there they own jesus h christ
Daniel Perry
This was his breakout VA role, wasn't it?
Tyler Edwards
Honestly, I'll never forgive how they canned the original story, Elsa wasn't born bad, she was made this way by the people who should have cared for her. She was just a little girl and yet, people had already decided she would be a monster. Arendelle created their own villain.
I feel for that one animator in the doc who said he basically lost his passion working on the project when they retooled Yzma, I really do. But it's pretty hard when Yzma ended up being so beloved anyway. "PULL THE LEVER KRONK" is easily one of the most memorable quotes from any WDAS film in the 21st century and she's still fondly remembered as a character. I hope that guy knows his work didn't go to waste.
Brayden Young
was that andreas deja? yeah, he loves his srs diney villains, i think he animated scar.
Nathan King
Yeah it was an eastern European guy. It's bittersweet for me, I'm really sad his passion for the old Yzma was never fulfilled but Yzma turned out so great anyway. That could go for the whole project honestly. The crew was clearly more passionate about the older version they had but the end product was still fantastic. Weird stuff, but it was for the best I think. The old version looked like it was trying to cram in a lot of ideas at once that didn't work well together.
Luis Morales
An older version of Russ Cargill from The Simpsons Movie was given out in Burger King Kid's Meals promoting the movie.
Not gonna lie, that would have been a much more memorable design. I just looked him up to remember who you were talking about and I just forgot what he looked like right after.
I just really wish there was a way to see the workprint to see what the actual trade off was. I can't imagine liking the original more than Emperor but just from what little there is you can see the love the team had for Kingdom of the Sun. I want to see at least what the originally intended, and if it's really the convoluted as it seemed to be.
So there was some kind of prophecy about a ruler with a frozen heart and the kingdom would be in an eternal winter. Elsa was born with Ice powers and was assumed to be that ruler for as long as she lived.
Leo Anderson
>the stoat on the lead kek
she's superpowered for no reason yeah. there was a big prophecy about a queen covering the land with eternal winter, only to be freed by a sword sacrifice. which is why everyone takes her striking anna very badly, they think it's proof she's future evil.
There was the making of doc they had after the movie released. Of course, it was covered up in all the typical mouse shlock they always put in their bts stuff. They're doing a whole fucking docuseries on Disney+ for Frozen 2. >Walt Disney Animation Studios chief creative officer Jennifer Lee announced the project to investors. Per her remarks, the documentary series will be "real and raw." Lee described a series that "showcases our collaborative environment in a way we have never shared before." Rather than just focusing on one or two elements of the film, or giving a shallow overview of it all, the series format allows for more to be seen and said about various elements of the filmmaking. "Nothing is off limits," Lee said. Sounds like a load of crock to me, it probably won't be anywhere near as revealing as Sweatbox was.
Cameron Johnson
Sweatbox was filmed by Sting's wife wasn't it? I doubt it'll be an "amateur" movie this time around. Disney knows what they don't want you to see.
Colton Clark
Well duh, if it was they wouldn't want it getting out like Sweatbox did.
Jace Ward
It is. I wonder did she ever anything more "realistic" for the movie like she did for Tangled?
The novel begins with the day of Lynette and her sister Leonie's dual wedding to the brothers Gaheris and Gareth, respectively. After the festivities are over, the two sisters are dragged to their bedrooms and prepared by giggling bridesmaids for the first night of their honeymoons. Lynette is miserable, as she is in fact in love with Gareth, her sister's groom, and thinks with envy of them in the next room. She is also terrified of what is about to happen, as it is revealed in a flashback that she was raped by a friend of her father's who was like a mentor to her.
WHAT
Cameron Peterson
holy fuck, was this originally supposed to be a kids film before they retooled it?
anna would be justified in murdering elsa for that cold bathwater is no fun
Eli Sullivan
I HAVE A PLAN IT INCLUDES YOU
Christopher Bailey
The nanny give this look of "Awn, not this shit again".
Also, I REALLY wondered how we ended up with the movie we got when I kept reading the synopsis of the book :
When Gaheris finally enters the honeymoon suite, he merely comments that he does not want this, either. He sleeps next to her, without touching, and leaves before she wakes. In a flashback, the events leading up to the wedding are summarised, essentially retelling the corresponding Arthurian legend. In short, the Red Knight, a knight who claims to owe no loyalty to King Arthur, attacks Lynette's home in the absence of any male figureheads, essentially holding the household hostage until her older sister, Leonie, consents to marry him and make him Lord. Lynette escapes, going all the way to Camelot and pleading with Arthur himself to help her rescue her sister. With the help of Merlin (who had appeared to her once before, after she was raped), she receives the king's blessing, but he only sends one man with her – Gareth, who she presumes to be a kitchen boy. She is quite rude to him, feeling very resentful towards Arthur for his choice. However, Gareth soon proves himself and in the course of rescuing Leonie, Lynette realises that she has fallen in love with him. Unfortunately, upon the group's return to Camelot, it is arranged that Gareth shall marry Leonie as his reward, and Lynette shall wed Gareth's older brother, Gaheris. That's like not even half of it.
Hudson Nelson
that's indeed some game of thrones shit
Evan Ross
Damn I want this movie now. How does it end?
Elijah Bailey
Ok so : Lynette acts so bravely and gracefully in the course of this work that she earns the respect of all those who travel with her (Lancelot). She is separated from her party in strange lands and kidnapped; she eventually finds her way out through a network of caves with the help of a very peculiar young man named Lucius. Lucius has lived in the dark so long that he is completely blind and very pale, with light blue hair. He was imprisoned along with his mother, who subsequently died, but he met a sort of witch just outside the caves who befriended him, and he is happy with his simple life. Lynette spends a considerable amount of time with the pair, and eventually falls in love with Lucius. She feels simultaneously pleased that he can not see how plain she is, and guilty because she is convinced that he would not want her if he could see her. Eventually, the witch sadly informs Lynette that Lucius is dying. Lynette is completely horrified, and decides that she will seek out the Holy Grail, so that Lucius can use it to save himself. She sets out with her travelling companions from before, and after a very long and decidedly strange journey, she actually manages to retrieve the Grail. She hurries back with it to Lucius, resolving that she will let him do with it as he pleases. Upon receiving the Grail, Lucius wishes for sight rather than life, so that he can finally see Lynette. Upon opening his eyes, he cries out with delight, telling the startled (and heartbroken) Lynette that she's beautiful over and over. The pair have a little more time together, which Lynette tries very hard to make the best of. Lucius dies, and she and the witch bury him before she sets out once again, to resume her post as the King's Damosel.
That's kind of depressing. Also she met and rapist, and kills him. He start following her around, she ends up "forgiving" him and letting go of what happened to her.
This one didn't make it has far as some of the others mentioned here did it? I thought this one was still in it's infancy stages when this particular concept was scrapped.
Ethan Morales
Glen Keane talking about Rapunzel Unbraided:
"I started developing this story in ‘96 while I was doing “Tarzan” and “Treasure Planet” and then started to work on it in 2002 full-time. At that point, the studio was looking for more of a twist on the fairy tale. That was the way the wind was blowing and I put up my sails and blew in that direction. That version was called “Rapunzel Unbraided” and I worked on it for three years. It was a fun, wonderful, witty version and we had a couple of great writers. But in my heart of hearts I believed there was something much more sincere and genuine to get out of the story, so we set it aside and went back to the roots of the original fairy tale."
Justin Walker
>could very likely have been a deep canvas project Interesting. I'm still super happy for the way it turned out though, Tangled is basically a renaissance era film in a 3D body, none of the other revival era films capture the same feel it has. I wonder what other post-renaissance films were scrapped that could have used Deep Canvas?
Christopher Wright
NOW WATCH ME CREATE
Samuel Roberts
youtube.com/watch?v=kRO6EHhPr5g I think this is the only "completed" clip of it we got? I wonder too. But honestly, I'm glad Rapunzel only came out in 2010, technology got better and Disney got better with computers. I fear it would have aged like Meet the Robinsons or Chicken Little.
Aiden Bell
When I think about it... The real Rapunzel getting turned into a Squirrel... Kind of remind me of The Princess And The Frog, could it be they reused some of the plot?
Luke Carter
Oh shit, it wouldn't have been 2D? Nevermind then, I'm absolutely more than satisfied with what we got. This probably would have aged like milk with older tech, 2010's still holds up thankfully. It honestly looks better than Frozen.
Parker Barnes
You're implying Brave would have been any better had they not removed Brenda, in which case you are wrong.
Adrian Allen
The problem isn't that having a flawed and "racist" setting is bad, it's just bad if you like money and want a Disney hit that could be part of a theme park in China (but don't go there, they harvest organs from executed wrongthinkers). If you hate the city of Zootopia, no happy ending can undo decades of torment and oppression. It's a place characters leave, not one that you want to visit or see again in a sequel or series.
Sure, you could see it that way, but it still doesn't have to be "muh racism" as much as it is just being hard sci-fi about talking animal settings. Don't take it personally.
Ryder Nelson
Everyone that worked on brave claims the original version was really dull and could not make the viewer interested in Merrida at all. Somehow Brave had a less selfish stuck-up bitch Merrida than Bear and the Bow.
Disney should release the complete storyboards with voices and music, a-la Recobbled Cut.
Or else I bomb Disney HQ. If South Park taught me anything, is that violence is the only thing that works.
Luke Ward
The original intention was to have the film look like a moving oil painting.
Kevin Mitchell
DID DISNEY TRY TO KEK THE DUCK IN THE SEQUEL
Justin Howard
>midst of a love triangle. On one side, is his childhood sweetheart, Abby “Ugly Duckling” Mallard. On the other side, is the very attractive newcomer, Raffaela, the French sheep. Abby’s at a tremendous disadvantage here, so she goes to great lengths to give herself a makeover.
It seems they switched to the sheep being Italian in the script process
Probably would have been neat, but very expensive.
Hudson Garcia
What is this?
Samuel Wright
How much do you want to bet she wasn't a real sheep but an alien?
Luis Gomez
Or they would pull the wolf in sheeps clothing like they were going to do when chicken little was a girl orginally and there was a sheep who was a wolf
Hudson Rogers
I remember a story that tells about how Disney was about to choose between an Chicken Little series or approve Phineas & Ferb, and how John Lasseter canceled several Walt Disney Animation Studios projects at the time, Disney chose P&F.
Man had no idea chicken little had a cartoon in the works
Jordan Barnes
We sure dodged a fuckin bullet there
Carter Cox
I had no idea it was that successful enough to convince execs have a sequel and a series made
Alexander Turner
It must have done decent enough to get that many options for a sequel and a cartoon
Jason Ortiz
Nowaday, when I hear Chicken Little, it's from people hating the movie. If they really thought a sequel and serie was possible at the time... What happened? Did people actually like Chicken Little or was Disney full of illusions?
Christian Sanders
Have to say I like the sheep better then the duck
Gabriel Rogers
If the moral really was wolf in sheep clothing... They were doing an extremely bad job on that one. Abby turned into a Bitch in Duck clothing.
Xavier Nelson
Heck that would have been a interesting take
Hunter Thompson
I liked it as a kid. I probably have to rewatch it some point.
Carter Parker
>Did people actually like Chicken Little or was Disney full of illusions? I think the fact that Mark Dindal was able to make a successful film with Emperor's New Groove and gave too much leeway with Chicken Little due to that.
Gabriel Hughes
Lost in La Mancha
Luis Sanders
>moving oil painting Like the old man and the sea short?
Jayden Price
Chicken Little was another victim of executive meddling, initially it was supposed to be a story about female chicken living on a farm who's trying to find her confidence. Then Eisner wanted the protagonist to be a boy, and then to add aliens, and then add pop songs, it was a horrible attempt to make a DreamWorks kind of movie.
Daniel Martinez
That makes sense. Actually at the time there was more of that irreverent jukebox music animated movies like Doogal and Hoodwinked trying to match that level of success. The idea of fractured fairy tales blended with pop culture was so pervasive even Disney had their awkward try.
It’s sort of true, there are a ton of lewd/porn drawings circulating at every single animation studio (I’ve seen a handful of Disney ones thanks to acquaintances who have worked there) but I have never heard of Disney actually keeping physical copies of them.
Ryder Davis
This Elsa looks like she would build snow Morrisseys
Will Frozen 2 be able to recapture the craze without "Let it Go" to carry the film?
Michael Stewart
dont forget about snowstorms that trapped the audience in the cinemas
Jace Adams
At the time everyone was imitating Shrek, making their own fractured fairy tale type of movie. Hoodwinked, Happily N'ever After, Enchanted, they all happened around the same time
Cooper Johnson
Hoodwinked and Enchanted were fine.
Joseph Reed
>implying they won't do a reprise
Isaiah Cox
Did not say they weren't.
Just everyone wanted to make a parody of a fairytale in 2004
Brody Wood
Yeah, as much as I love Snuff out the Light, I'd never trade the actual character of Yzma for a more plain villain just because of a great song. youtu.be/KdB_zJXx_AE
You just listed them as movies you hate. Don't backpeddle the second someone calls you out.
Aiden White
How did all that even get built?
Nolan Evans
Not that user but at no point did that post say anything negative about those movies, you're the only one seeing things that aren't there.
Elijah Thomas
Hell, forget the design of Russ. We could have a whole new thread on all the executive meddling that fucked the Simpsons Movie.
Camden Ward
Why didn't they use Scorpio again?
Jonathan Carter
YOU, LYNETTE WILL LEAD ME TO ORGASM
Benjamin Collins
Because executive wanted people who didn't watch Simpsons to go see the movie, too. That's why Wolfcastle is called Arnold despite clearly being Wolfcastle.
Logan Perry
But what's the logic there? Literally every character would be unknown to someone who doesn't watch The Simpsons.
Colton Baker
>mfw the entire plot of The Emperor's New Groove was started by fact that Yzma didn't want to pay for postage
>patrick warburton should be in more things. I agree with you user, I love Patrick. But the man has already been in a shit ton of animated projects. >venture bros >family guy >happily n'ever after >buzz light year of star command >home on the range >bee movie And that's just off the top of my head.
>"I practically raised him! >" yeah you think he would have turned out better" It really is the little things...
Liam Mitchell
Didn't they want to make en Enchanted 2
Camden Murphy
>Kronk nonchalantly moves the bust to face towards Yzma before she smashes it.
I dunno why but that little detail is just so funny.
Justin Garcia
I can't fucking believe they made me pay to watch Brother Bear 3. Fuck this movie.
Jaxon Perry
>Seven years and he's still mad. Give it a rest.
Gavin Powell
The documentary will be edited and filmed in presence of a dozen PR and marketing execs along with Iger. Disney needs to maintain their happy image. I doubt we will ever see something like Disney War again
If you've ever seen the Paperman short, that's the technology was originally planned to be used to achieve the effect. But as production went on, it became increasingly obvious that the software wasn't going to be capable of what they wanted for a LONG time.
Anthony Lewis
I'm honestly surprised that there were little bits of footage from the making of The Last Jedi indicating the clear concern of some crew members about Rian's decisions. Honestly, I wasn't expecting anything so revealing in this day and age of carefully controlled PR releases.
Jonathan Carter
Man, Eartha Kitt was a fucking treasure. She was a triple threat, and made one hell of a Catwoman. Rest In Peace.
Disney's Dinosaur too, the original concept for that was way darker and more violent. The only part of the movie that still had a remnant of the original tone was the opening scene where none of the animals talked.
Dylan Allen
That is.. Something.
Christopher Myers
I love how long they kept the onion Elsa concept.
Isaiah Gonzalez
Wasn't it also supposed to be something like Zoootopia where predators and herbivores did not get along and the civilization was in trouble from it?
Ian Peterson
>naked anna and elsa bathing
oh god can you imagine the threads we would have gotten on Yea Forums if they did this scene
Brave was Brother Bear 3 in all but name, just switch North America for Scotland.
Noah Cox
So it was a joke...... damn.
Brandon Phillips
First time I seen this, Reminds me of a Barbie movie.
Gavin Sanders
Wow, that sounds nothing like the movie at all. It would be like saying that Kamandi is Based on the Jungle Book just because they had some barely similar things in common.
Jacob Price
Its amazing how much money do they waste at Disney even before getting the green light on the project. You would think they would make a script first and get it approved before spending on animation and songs.
I just watched The Sweatbox, and early on when every is still optimistic, you see the cracks starting to form when Sting is talking about how weird it is that they're having him write the songs when there isn't a complete script yet.
Bentley King
revenge
Samuel Cruz
Wasn't Wreck it Ralph in the production line since the 90's?
They have been saying that since 2013 but the filmation hasn't even started as far as i'm aware
What I find really fascinating is after dropping 30mil that they elected to clean slate it opposed to trying to salvage why they could from what they had. Clearly it all worked out, but I guess to a huge corporation it's no big deal.
I wonder how much financially retooling Zootopia cost. I imagine significantly less than KoTS since they don't seem to employ as many individuals for 3D vs 2D. How much of the original Zootopia was completed before it was scrapped? Was it as far along as KoTS?
So it was comparable to the work done on Kingdom of the Sun. I wonder if the costs were anywhere close to 30mil.
Aiden Murphy
Ruber's inspiration in The King's Damosel is such a generic ass villain, thank god or Taranis that whoever decided to remake this into a Disney rip-off completely changed his character.
Jose Jones
Well the beauty of CG is that is easier and cheaper to change things compared to 2D.
Luke Diaz
How they managed to hide the StarWars buyout is a testament of how secretive and scary Disney can be.
Xavier Garcia
Its hilariously deceptive
First five minutes seems like a baby's rendition of pre-Columbian cultures, then the conquistadores show up and kill everyone.
Nathaniel Mitchell
>hide the StarWars buyout It was hidden?
Brody Reed
*half an hour.
Lincoln Rodriguez
It's said that Scorpio was too likeable to be made the villain.
Camden Williams
Nobody outside of the company knew until Disney announced it, not a leak not a single rumor. Just imagine one of the biggest media companies acquires one of the biggest IP in history and nobody from the inside dares to say anything. Either the lawyers where super discrete about it or everyone was afraid of being black listed if the company found out they leaked the information.
Joseph Murphy
Waking Sleeping Beauty's pretty fun.
Anthony Brown
In 1993 Fox had plans to make movies of the first three Nicktoons.
Eventually plans fell through and The Rugrats Movie ended up being made by Paramount, Disney made the Doug movie and no Ren & Stimpy movie was ever made.
Jonathan Carter
By which you mean to say Disney made Doug's FIRST movie.
Adam Davis
This. The resources from the original were all still there; the villain appearing as an extra a few times and one of Nick's friends now that scientist working for Lionheart.
Camden Hall
the adventures of sting and piano guy make sweat box amazing.
Charles Torres
That sounds better
Dominic Turner
Oraybe it was 40% my memory is becoming more and more foggy.
Either way running these rendering farms cost way more than some pencil tests.
Lucas Cook
>Oraybe
???
Alexander Robinson
Speaking of The Simpsons Movie, they had been trying to make a movie early in the show's run, but couldn't figure out how to translate the show into a 90min movie.
Kamp Krusty was based on one of the plots they considered.
Landon Russell
*Maybe
Dylan Sanders
>Horror revenge plot narrative of half cartoon daughter crossing over to real world for patricide..
Fuck, I want THAT movie. Not the hot mess we got.
Really the only thing that bugged me was the "random" animations that popped in for no reason. Otherwise this film was an okay "trying too hard to copy Roger Rabbit's sucess" detective noir style film. I wish execs would have a little faith in a good story idea..
Andrew Powell
like the weird little moaning heads that float by and make noise all the damn time?
Noah Robinson
>Wasn't Wreck it Ralph in the production line since the 90's? I think the earliest concepts for it did initially emerge in the late 90's, but outside of Disney wanting to do a movie based on video games it didn't have much development till around 2006 or so if I remember correctly
Nathan Roberts
Hey Good Lookin' was originally supposed to be animation combined with live action, with only the main characters being animated.
Supposedly the original version is still out there somewhere.
I don't understand his obsession with live action. I get it, it makes the cartoony violence more meaningful in the context of real life crime, but it's jarring and ugly, not to mention lazy.
