I'm glad the world has forgotten

>>Remember Pandora? We're bringing her back for Trinity of Sin and her own comic. Will we answer the question of what the fuck she was doing in Flashpoint? No, because she herself doesn't even remember Flashpoint!
They actually did answer that and gave her a conclusion in the Future's End tie-in, they just proceeded to ignore it afterwards (since the conclusion being so low profile meant that none of the higher ups cared about it anymore).

Basically, the "sins" she had liberated in the past were alternate universe counterparts of her, and there was a cycle where they fought and the winner got to reboot the world. However, this time, she stops her other selves and breaks the cycle, avoiding another reboot.

>and Vertigo (which isn't even a timeline, but ok) have been split,
Seriously. By 2011, the DC properties that Vertigo still held on to amounted to
>Madame Xanadu
>The Unknown Soldier
>Shade, the Changing Man
>Hellblazer/Swamp Thing
Even Hellblazer barely counts because they made second versions of John and Swampy for Brightest Day. Madame Xanadu itself was firmly set in the DCU since the first third of the series is secretly about setting up the JSA
Sandman (according to editors) was separated, but Johns continued to use related things until Infinite Crisis, then Didio did that big advertising campaign about how Death was going to make her DCU debut in Action Comics in 2010! Except, Sandman was in the DCU in 1988 and she also appeared in Captain Atom and LoSH.

It went nowhere. Dr. Manhattan kills her in the Rebirth one-shot

Yeah, the way I always saw it, Vertigo is an imprint, not a universe. Some of its titles (like Sandman and Swamp Thing) just took place in the regular DCU, but just didn't crossover with DCU titles very much because these were your serious, sophisticated comics doing their own thing in their own corner of the universe. Other titles, like Y: The Last Man or Fables, just took place in their own universes.

I know it was just an excuse to relaunch Swamp Thing and Hellblazer as DCU titles and put them in Justice League stuff, but the whole "MERGE THE THREE TIMELINES" thing never made sense.

>Lilith from LOSH

Ah fuck, her name is Glorith.

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It not only went nowhere, it was revealed that she had nothing to do with the New 52 reboot and thus everything surrounding her was entirely pointless.

they wanted to push Renee Montoya instead of Vic who is waaay more popular

I think the reason as to why her character got less important was because the event right before that shitty event where Pandora causes all the leagues fought each other that I don't remember and I doubt anyone else does, was suppose to happen much later than it did.

There was suppose to be a major Wildstorm event with the daemonites, but that got cancelled when ComicAllience and assorted other whiners complained about VooDoo. So that may have caused DC to rush the league event.

I thought the part where his mouth got magically sealed was cool.

Remember when New 52 magic Question only spoke in questions, until they realized how retard hard it was to do that so they dropped it?

Was Question still magically towards the end up the New 52? Because we say a Question in HiC, but we don't know if it was Vic or Renee.

The Question is back to normal now and is a semi-recurring character in Bendis' Action Comics, and will likely be a major character in Leviathan Rising.

That was Trinity War where there were a bunch of things in 3 fighting. The big twist was it was all a set up from Earth 3 CSA and led to Forever Evil.
Don't know why they dropped the daemonites stuff, even if it was about Voodoo they de-sexed her after like 4 issues.

>but that got cancelled when ComicAllience and assorted other whiners complained about VooDoo
are you sure it wasn't the bad sales that every Wildstorm related book had?

That also had a lot to do with it.
It's really fun to go back to see what the New 52 introduced and only to see them drop it or quickly get rid of it. Like everything involving the Wildstorm universe. I have no idea what happened to Grifter, he was getting a major push then just disappeared. Mr. Majestic may or may not have been around in the New 52 Earth, because I vaguely remember him appear like 1 one time and we never say him again. VooDoo, Gen 13, Wildcats

fake news, even back in 1992 DC was saying it was a different universe

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Also, Helspont was suppose to become a Superman villain, then he disappeared, reappeared in Redhood and was killed off. Midnighter and Apollo have disappeared since their book got cancelled. Martain Manhunter was awkwardly apart of Stormwatch to keep him off Justice League and it's never been mentioned since.

Gen13 did have that random tease at the end of a Supergirl issue. Their ultimate fate is in some basement freezer though.

Midnighter was in Grayson and got his own series for a bit, long time after the rest bit the dust.

I know, he and Apollo had a book. First it was Midnighter, then Midnighter and Apollo, Once that got cancelled, they fucking were gone.

It's weird, Didio kept the book alive way longer than the sales warranted and it got great reviewers and some awards.

>There was suppose to be a major Wildstorm event with the daemonites

I remember them setting that shit up. Some Daemonite shit in Superman, and Martian Manhunter (who was with Stormwatch at the time) randomly showing up in a Green Lantern Corps issue to warn the GLs about some presumably Daemonite threat, and then never talking to them again. Also, some completely non-sequiter panel with some alien blowing a horn in the first issue of Superman that had nothing to do with the rest of the issue got tied into the Stormwatch story, I think? It's so hard to remember, but it was all so weird and went nowhere abruptly.

DC gave the Wildstorm book to Lee and Harras' friends to set up the Daemonite event: Rob Liefeld, Scott Lobdell, Fabian Nicieza, Tom DeFalco, and so on. The problem is that some of them started to get angry about the editors always forcing shit on them or telling them to rewrite their scripts. Liefeld pretty much had a meltdown over it.

That's what made the whole Daemonite event go sideways.

Trinity War originally was going about the be a nasty break-up between Superman and Wonder Woman that was going to affect everyone, but then DC told Johns that he couldn't separate the couple anymore since they were planning to release an ongoing about it.

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Christ the original Apollo and Midnighter new 52 outfits sucked.

Did either Apollo or Midnigther ever meet Batman or Superman post Flashpoint?

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Lmao, remember this dude?

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I recall also reading that Darkseid War was gonna have a gigantic love square tug-of-war between Steve, Batman, and Superman over Wonder Woman that would've ended with Superman going back to Lois and Diana going to Steve, but editorial said he couldn't do that.

Or maybe I'm confusing that with Trinity War, I'm not sure.

Trinity War. Johns plans for Steve, actually, was for Steve and Selina, Catwoman, to end up together. KEK. I don't know what Geoff Johns was smoking back then.

But i think he tried to pull something like that again in Darkseid War. I don't know. Have to search about it.

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I think the bottom right was Vibe staring at Selina.

He was actually this guy.
I'm not fucking kidding

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I totally forgot Justice League of America was a thing.

Remember Jason, WW's uberkewl brother who was stronger than her and ended up being the main character of Wonder Woman?

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No,it was the sjws and aids-infected khouri

Man, they really wanted for the Justice League to be like the Avengers, didn't they? Full of relationship drama/cuckoldry and in-fighting.

So how did a native American ended up becoming that?

Fun fact, did you remember that Dr.Manhattan obliterated Metron? I don't think they have mentioned it one time since it happened.
In fact, I would bet Metron has appeared since that happened.

He technically appeared in Mister Miracle, but since Scott and Barda have both made several appearances outside of that despite its ending, I'll assume that's an AU version.

Out of those 3, only Phantom Stranger got a good book and it's sad it died so quickly. Didio gave it a solid start and DeMatteis just took it and made it amazing.

They weren't pushing Renee at the time though. You're confusing 52 and the New 52.

>DeMatteis just took it and made it amazing.
by plagiarizing himself a bit. Many of the beats are similar to his Hal Spectre series

Montoya was missing for a long time after the Nu52 started.
She replaced Vic after the original 52, and it was great, but that was not the reason they did that mystical shit with Question here.

Brainiac made him into a caretaker for his collection of cities from across the multiverse, and eventually he rebelled.

are the Olympians still Darkseid food

Remember when the Creeper became a Discovery Travel & Living type of TV host that was also drunk fuck-up, and he became possessed by a Japanese Oni that would take over his body whenever he blacked out partying too much to take the body on joyrides where the Oni would go through rampages killing everyone in his path by producing tornados or something?

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The Constantine and Swamp Thing in Brightest Day were the same old classic ones. Why do you think they were different?

And then after that they had Daniel show up in JLA, Death in Action Comics, Constantine show up a few times, Swamp Thing too, etc.

Remember how people bitched about Azz's WW run being too different, despite being great and WW having been complete shit for like a decade prior?

I hope you guys have enjoyed Finch, Rucka, Wilson, and Robinson.

Hey remember when the New 52 books were all teasing some Wildstorm Demonite or whatever they fuck they were thing as a villain and then nothing ever happened because nobody ever cared about any of that shit?

I wonder how hurt Jim Lee is that nobody gives a shit about a single thing from his universe but the stuff Ellis created.

To be honest, the Finches did that version of amazons justice for how Azz wrote them.

Since this has become a thread mentioning everything that the writers forgot during the New 52. I'll just mention that one of the original members for the teen titans, Spiderling, was last seen crawling in an air duct and never mentioned again. Also LOSH appeared, but they got lost according to the narrator and they killed off Artemis.

I also remember New 52 superboy having won the award for most complicated superhero origin story from Hawkman. Also Gen 13 is apparently canon in the New 52.

New 52 has some of the most incoherent writing I've seen published from a publisher.

John was pushing sixty in Hellblazer, and was significantly younger in Brightest Day

Remember how they made Beast Boy red?

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He appeared in three issues of Aftermath. I chalked that up to artist mistake.

Or they were planning to crammed in some sliding timeline stuff.

Not to mention Hellblazer ended with him dying.

>With the long-standing wall between Vertigo and the DCU now seemingly crumbling away, CBR News spoke with DC Co-Publisher Dan Didio about exactly how the return of these characters to DC books proper will play out both in "Brightest Day" and into incoming stories like "Brightest Day Aftermath: The Search For Swamp Thing." Below, Didio explains DC's reasoning for bringing the characters back to their origin point and how that move doesn't shake up the work still being done at Vertigo.

>CBR News: Dan, first it was Swamp Thing and now Constantine. Overall, bringing these Vertigo characters back into the DCU is something that I think I've seen fans ask after at conventions more than almost anything else in DC's cosmology. Who led the charge and stood up in the past year to say "We need these characters back in DC books," and why did you think that was a good idea?

>Dan Didio: It was a constant discussion we'd been having. This is something that Geoff [Johns], Jim [Lee] and myself have been talking about since we first took our new positions with DC. It was always an interesting discussion for us because there were so many exciting and important stories with Swamp Thing in the day that were associated with the DC Universe that we thought of fondly. And we understood why there was a distinction between the DC Universe and Vertigo, but since some of these characters actually started in the DC Universe, we didn't understand the reason why we shouldn't be able to migrate them back at a particular point.

>That was the primary goal, though what happened was that Constantine fell into a rather strange zone. When you look at Swamp Thing and all the big stories you think about with that character, John Constantine is an integral part of those things. But we have a very long-running and very successful series in "Hellblazer" that's still our longest running series at Vertigo.
1/?

>So when we thought it through and looked back to the early days of Vertigo when the Phantom Stranger would go back and forth and nobody seemed to bat an eye in the process...well, what better character to do that at this moment than Constantine? That's one of the reasons why with the return of Swamp Thing, you see the reintroduction of Constantine to the DC Universe.

>The question most people are going to be asking is simply "How does this work?" With Constantine, there are horror elements, language elements and sexual elements that have been in his stories that I'm sure you don't want dropping into the middle of, say, "Teen Titans." Was there an idea of the pieces of the Vertigo cast you knew would carry over, or is each story done in its own way?

You have to take each story in its own way, but there are two very distinct approaches to how we're bringing Constantine to DCU and Vertigo simultaneously. First, there's not a thing that will change about John Constantine's "Hellblazer" book at Vertigo. That book has a particular voice and a particular style, and it's nothing we want to upset the apple cart on. It's a very successful series for us, and we don't want to do anything that would be detrimental to it. So it will continue with the same flavor, style and tone it's always had. Nothing changes at all. And then when you look at how Constantine fits in the DCU, well...we have a template for that, and it's the Constantine that was in the DCU when he first appeared. He had a voice, a style and a tone, and we're going to use that particular style and voice for the character in the stories we plan to tell with him.
2/3

>We have a template for both versions, and there's quite honestly no reason to merge them. Constantine in the Vertigo universe is in his 60s, and what you have in the DC Universe is a character who is markedly younger. It's something where if you looked at him when he first appeared, he hasn't aged a day. Go figure! [Laughs] You can come up with some story reason for that if you want, but we like to think he's just been waiting for us to bring him back in the DCU.

hat brings up a question we'd been talking about over here when Swamp Thing came back: namely, what parts of the characters history will impact them as they appear in the DC Universe moving forward? Aside from "Hellblazer" affecting Constantine's status, Swamp Thing has had a number of Vertigo series over the years. Can we assume that these versions will take their history primarily from what happened up to the DC/Vertigo split?

>I would say absolutely. That's not to say that there may not be places within those stories that become inspiration for a story idea now, but like I said before, there's a particular tonality and theme that is unique to Vertigo. That's why we have a separate imprint. It's not because they can curse or there's some sexuality that's not shown in the DC Universe. There's a maturity in the storytelling and a deeper focus and examination of the characters. That works extraordinarily well for that kind of universe. Meanwhile, in the DC Universe we have things that are much more rooted in the action adventure realm, so therefore there's a different style of story that will be taking place with these characters as they'll be used in the DCU that'll be separate from the way they're portrayed in Vertigo. So if a story subject works for the DC Universe, we can use that for story material, but if it doesn't, it can stay -Â and it's important that it stays - with Vertigo.
cbr.com/dan-didio-digs-into-brightest-days-finale/

I did, Rucka was unironically amazing (again).

To be fair, Dan is an idiot.

I never read N52 Teen Titans but was this to try and tie him into the red from Animal Man?

Unpopular opinion: Street-level characters going full-out cosmic/mystic, like Question here or Daredevil Heimdall, is fun

He's an idiot who's also a publisher. He gets to make these calls from his position, like how Jim Lee declared that nothing written past Sandman 75 is canon (so no spin offs like Lucifer are considered canon)
Yes it was. Some little bits of it remain, but he is physically green again

It can be done right, this was not a good way of doing it.

>the kid who pulls the fire alarm for the lulz but didn't realize a teacher was watching so now he's about to get in trouble.

>and it was great,

no it wasn't. Renee was never good.

Vic being implied to be some kind of Magic Space Hitler is probably my favorite dropped Johns plotline.

And then Ellis proceeded to shit on Wildstorm even further in the same-titled book.

god this is ugly to look at

Can someone redpill me on what the fuck DC was thinking with this shit?

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Scott Lobdell thought he was writing Cable.
Seriously, Lobdell was pretty much writing the Teen Titans, and even Red Hood and the Outlaws somewhat, as if they were X-books.

kept saying WHAT? to everything

really the straw the broke the camels back with Liefield was them allowing him to finally get to play with Lobo only for the editors to tell him it was pretty much Lobo in name only and the new lobo had to 1000% more badass and evil with an evil girlfriend girl Lobo.

Liefield did the entire Lobo vs Deathstroke storyline as ridiculously shitty as possible on purpose and the editors ate it up and demanded more.

And then he got POOCHIE'd, to never be used again.

Wasn't Captain Comet reconed into an edgy evil teenager?
> At the end of issue 12 of Action Comics, Comet was revealed as the first Neo Sapiens, enlisted by the Oort-Kind to find others similarly evolved, including Lois Lane's niece, Suzie.
Don't think he was ever mentioned again.

He tried to rape Lois' sister, right? Something weird like that. Then he got to be Supergirl's boyfriend.

> Phantom Stranger gets a definitive background origin

No DC, what were you doing?

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Is he still around? I have no idea what the fuck was happening with Superboy in the New 52 and afterwards. It felt like there have been at least 4 Superboys.

It wasn't even a good origin either. He was Judas, how lame.

This stands out as one of the worst plot thread drops in comic history. All that build-up and mystery, only for DC to say LOL JK they didn't even do anything important.

Red Ring Lobo was never followed up on.
Lord Malvolio was suppose to have a major major impact on the DC universe and he was never seen again, so that's probably worse.

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I think this was eventually resolved, but it was years after it was set up.

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>Lord Malvolio was suppose to have a major major impact on the DC universe and he was never seen again
He really wasn't. Priest himself said he'd planned to write a follow-up arc where it's revealed that Malvolio used the ring he swapped with Hal as a beacon to get back to earth, but before he could do that there was a huge editorial shake-up to make way for Emerald Dawn, and Priest wound up quitting rather than continuing.

People like to bring up that the run swap could've been used to explain Hal's craziness, but that really was completely coincidental.

Remember when the spent ages hyping up this guy just for Superman to fly out of nowhere with a beard or some shit, and KO him with a single punch?

Well, Wolverine failed and they never followed up on it.

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Speaking of Red Hood, there was that time Lobdell tried to 'fix' characterizing Starfire as the team bicycle by recharacterizing her as a gas stop drug addict who accidentally burned Roy Harper alive while taking off in a drug-fueled bender.

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who was this?

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It's funny because in universe it makes sense, but his design had become so iconic that it just didn't work

guys...i want DC comics to be good and it makes me very sad that they are not...

It doesn't really. The Red is called that not because of the color, but because it's something that connect all living beings. It's meat, and blood, and muscle. You're not supposed to take it literally. Before that it was called as the M-Field.

Making Beast Boy red because of it just... shows that DC was really retarded back then.

Never forget that this had zero resolution along with the rest of Brightest Day

The Question is a great example of both doing it right and doing it wrong. Renee slowly uncovering mysteries and helping the league of Supermen was natural and a climax for the character. New 52 Question was forced and confusing.

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New 52 was weird.

They probably wanted a mystical trinity and thought Question would be their Batman.

>What was even the point of this Pandora character?
>nu52
>having a point at all

Oh... fuck. That was it, wasn't it? Oh, God. That's so silly. So goddamn silly.

Ambiguous death that even in context made no sense. He just disappeared and everyone believed he died and he never came back and likely never will. Which is a shame because someone else cleaned up the whole Superboy thing by making a really convoluted story that somehow worked.

Now we just have Jon and kind of Kon, I don't think Young Justice is canon.

The Azzarello-Finch WW was shit just as the Robinson's one.
Second Rucka gives the victory to Rebirth, tho
Fuck Azz and Didio for creating th problem in the first place

DC has been pushing trinities for a long time. Rarely works and the only good one in recent memory was Red Hood, Artemis, and Bizarro.

Vertigo already had its own trinity: John Constantine, Deadman, and Zatanna. Why not use them?

The fucked up thing is that Azzarello only accepted to do the Wonder Woman because one evening he sat to lunch with Didio, and Didio told him their plans for Wonder Woman in the reboot. Azzarello said it was so bad and offensive, that even despite not being that into the character he felt he needed to do something because otherwise the character would have been completely destroyed. He then begged Didio to give him the Wonder Woman and let he have free reign.

Now imagine what must have been in the works for the character that got Azz so scared.

They did become their official magical trinity in the Trinity book

You kinda can by taking in to account that the minute Azarello left, they gave it to Meredeth Finch who almost fucking instantly drove it in to the ground and wrote hands-down one of the worst Wonder Woman runs in decades.

History repeated with Rebirth when Rucka finished his relatively competent reboot in Rebirth...and DC then gave the series to Robinson, who also instantly drove it in to the ground and also wrote hands-down one of the worst Wonder Woman runs in decades.

The Daemonites are the reason why Pandora linked the three time-lines - DC, Vertigo, and Wildstorm - creating the New 52 universe. The seeds and intended plot was this century old invasion by the Daemonites were they control everything, are everywhere, and are about to cash-in. You could see this in pretty much every DC book published at the time with Daemonites being disguised somewhere.
Remember as well Pandora showing in the first issue of every ongoing of the line? Heh.

None of them meant nothing eventually.

None of that meant nothing eventually. In the end in some Superman Annual written by Lobdell and Nicieza Helspont simple beats Superman up, kills all the Daemonites in disguised that lived on Earth, and goes back to his planet or whatever.

>Now imagine what must have been in the works for the character that got Azz so scared.
Meh, knowing how much Azz cares/knows about WW, it's entirely possible that the canned version was going to be true to the character and comicbooky in a great way.
But then it was a Didio idea so was going to be 100% shit.
It was a lose-lose scenario
And we lost

Johns probably didn't want to or they were used elsewhere. Pandora was new, Phantom Stranger was being built up to having a larger role, and they likely wanted to use Question in an elevated role. New 52 was about taking the established and using them differently. Constantine was in that weird shift as he was being mainstreamed into the DC universe. I think Deadman was in something else at the time. And Zatanna seems to be a Dini exclusive character.

John, Deadman, and Zee were being used at the time by Peter Miligan in Justice League Dark.

Rucka's reboot was a massive NOT MUH spergfest that didn't really add anything beneficial to the character and arguably detracted from her villains. Robinson's run was snoozefest and obvious filler arc burning off editorially mandated plots, but at least had the decency to be completely ignorable once it finished.

Rucka gave us a new origin, that was nice and very respectful to the character lore.

I liked that

Ah, well there you have it. So basically a magic trinity but not on the grander scale that was envisioned for Pandora and friends.

Only thing I've ever heard about Lobo and the red ring was that originally it was supposed to culminate into a DC Cosmic storyline involving all the space characters vs. the new cloned Czarian race out to conquer the universe and get revenge on Lobo for killing their species the 1st time and was end with Czarians vs. an army of Lobo clones composed of red lantern napalm blood.

As far as I know nothing ever came forward to backup said rumor and it could be a nice fanfic but DC did literally scrap much finished artwork and early drafts for many of their comics that was finished upto almost a year in advance including series that weren't initially cancelled when Flashpoint was announced.

What the fuck happened to Gen 13?

So the Kon in YJ isn't the same Kon from New 52?

Also, slightly off topic, but how old is Tim Drake suppose to be in YJ? I don't read the book, but isn't he at least 23 years old?

The Madame Xanadu book even had Phantom Stranger, Death of Endless and even Martian Manhunter in it. It was set in the DCU.

>Dat feel when we'll never see the Demon Knights gang ever again
>first time Etrigan shows back up in the present timeline he's been buried in the earth for an untold amount of time and fights Apollo and Midnighter before fucking off into the wild blue yonder before showing up a few years later back to normal with Jason Blood

if ain't broke

Why did Resurrection Man get a book at the launch of the New 52 only to never appear again? Were there any plans for the dude?

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The Kon in YJ resembles his pre-Johns version with the coat but he's older and has a wife and kid. And I don't think the comic is canon because even for Bendis it is completely different from canon. Robin is still Damian and the book has no mention or impact in other books.

New 52 had a system where low selling books were cancelled and new ones took their place. I'm willing to bet that since it failed they had no interest in trying to push him again.

Rucka just tried turning his EO script canon. Besides, it's not like we're short of WW origin retellings.

oh fuck Earth 2 was filled with dropped plot points

>A Lobo-centric crossover event

I kinnda want this

What was in the fucking box

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>Dat feel when we'll never see the Demon Knights gang ever again
Thank God. That ruined a ton of characters. Specially Madame Xanadu who now is only ever used as Jason Blood/Etrigan's cocksleeve.
>tfw newfriends still think that Ystin is a futanari

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why did Paul Cornell quit the book?

Dude, Johns' Justice League was the definition of dropped plot and editorial mandated decisions/cockblocks.
Remember Lex killing a teenager Ted Kord's dad and taking the Kord company for himself?

"Why don't you put the whole world in your dead parents?"

Robin's balls.

Work for TV stuff.

something something something daemonites is all anyone can really figure.

>yfw someone thought it was a good idea to reboot Amanda Waller as a sexy fit young black woman with near Deathstroke and Deadshot tier weapons and combat ability

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Remember the female Metamorpho who was in every fucking bit of promotion as a new JL member? What the fuck happened there?

And now an adult team is running around with no explanation.
It's like they really want to have Ted Kord, but never want to go to the trouble of explaining his resurrection, cause I'm 90% sure he was dead at the start of the New 52.
If ou want him so bad, why kill him off?

She joined Johns' reboot Doom Patrol then vanished along with that iteration of the team.

Oh, fuck. You just reminded me of New 52 version of Team 7, that counted on its team young versions of Deathstroke, Black Canary, and Amanda Waller.

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Shame. I thought she was cute.

remember when Booster Gold from before Flashpoint turned into Waverider and the new52 Booster was erased from history?

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I had to google that shit
>Team 7 was assembled by John Lynch, to prevent future metahuman threats. Members like Black Canary, Deathstroke, and Grifter gained their superpowers while working in the team. The team was disbanded after a mission retrieving Pandora's Box.
Lol, fucking what?

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Rucka should just have done a recap of his version of the classic origin in few pages and never mention the nu52 shit again.

Can someone tell me what the fuck happened to Captain Atom in the New 52? He went to the moon, was briefly a bad guy, than just came back

Justin is better as a reverse trap than a tranny.

That was a great moment in a pile of shit honestly. Booster finally completed his arc. Shame it came in Convergence.

Didn't Booster Gold disappear horrified because he saw Superman and Wonder Woman kiss or something?

The Team 7 version of Amanda Waller had a completely different appearance, body type, and background to SS Waller as well.

She also had a romance with Deathstroke or Grifter. Can't remember which. Shit was wack.

Yes, it was explained years later in a very convoluted fashion.
It was probably Deathstroke

yes

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It was also written by Geoff Johns in an annual give to the Justice League International ongoing that debuted with the New 52 relaunch. It was the book last issue before its cancellation.

Johns was so passive-aggressive about this.

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Yeah, that was fucking great, I thought.
Clocked his ass so hard he felt it across time, space, and reality.

Plus, in my opinion, this is one of Superman's best looks.
All the appeal of the early Morrison run look, plus beard.

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Never followed up on as far as I know.
Grail was also original first mentioned to be here, but she made her first appearance, they never acknowledge that the US government had her locked up.

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Given the nature of DC Camelot, Justin, Ystina, and Ystin are simultaneously canon and nothing actually prevents all three of them from being featured in stories together. Also tranny Shining Knight is better than crossdresser in love with sempai Shining Knight but I don't dislike Morrison's version, I just like Cornell's more.

Seriously DC, give me a goddamn Shining Knights book featuring a classic, High Middle Ages Justin, a gonzo high fantasy Ystina, and a Dark Ages Ystin being too chivalric for all this shit and dealing the fact that they're technically the same person.

Anyone happen to remember the Weird World Tales and My Greatest Adventure miniseries that happened before N52 happened.
>Weird World Tales 6 issue mini
>introduced new space character Tanga and told half of her story.
>was supposed to eventually branch out and encounter other space DC characters in their comics before joining up with em
>Introduced GarbageMan, think same shit as Swamp Thing but garbage instead of swamp, told half of his story.
>created solely because DC didn't want to bring back Swampthing but wanted a similar charachter.
>Lobo story that was fully finished by the end of the miniseries
>Brightest Day happens and they decided Garbageman was no longer wanted, they're bringing back Swampthing
>My Greatest Adventure 6 issue series
>included the 2nd half of both Tanga and Garbagemans stories
>along with a new Robotman
>Flashpoint and the company wide reboot happens
>new Robotman never seen again, Tanga never seen again, Garbageman never seen again.

the new Robotman was a bit iffy but Tanga and Garbageman both were interesting at least

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>Besides, it's not like we're short of WW origin retellings.
This fucking happened to mud the nu-origin controversy. She always had one origin and should have stayed that way

The funniest thing to me about the reboot was about how much Didio, Lee and Harras wanted for DC to be like Marvel and Ultimate Marvel.

The aliens and meta-humans were now feared and hated despite the existence of Superman and the Justice League. Even Superman and the Justice League are treated as controversial entities.
The Justice League now answered to not-SHIELD (ie: ARGUS), that in turn was created by the US to deal with alien and meta-human threats. The Justice League teammates were all younger, rougher, edgier. They only ever saw each other during moment of crisis and there was a lot of in-fighting between them. This was lifted from Millar's The Ultimates.
The young meta-humans are all reckless now, constantly creating havoc whenever they develop their powers. They're also being hunted by shady organizations.
There are several shady organizations, all spying on each other and having major in-fighting.

The funniest moment to me came in Lobdell's RHatO book, with Starfire complaining to herself about being hated and feared by humans, while baiting almost in the nude in a pool which is being recorded by a little boy who can't take his eyes off her hot body. I mean, really? REALLY? She's a hot orange babe. What's there to hate? Not even the context in the book is making any sense.

I'm fairly certain she was never intended to be anything more than a gag for that issue, but given just enough elements that someone could use her again if they wanted.

Forgot to mention the cities! Gone were the fictional cities like Star City, now Oliver lived in Seattle. Even the Flash lost his, before gaining it right back because everyone realized how stupid it all looked. I forgot which real world city they gave Flash.

>There are several shady organizations, all spying on each other and having major in-fighting.
I know there are a good amount of shady organizations in the DCU, in the new 52, they felt like it went into overdrive.

>Also tranny Shining Knight is better than crossdresser in love with sempai Shining Knight but I don't dislike Morrison's version, I just like Cornell's more.
You're wrong and should feel bad about yourself.

after a point it felt like everyone and their brother was running a shady operation

Lets try to count:

ARGUS (Justice League)
SHADE & Project M/Creature Commandos (Frankenstein)
Agents of NOWHERE (Teen Titans)
Outcast & Untitled (Red Hood and the Outlaws)
Team 7 (Team 7)
Checkmate & Project Cadmus (OMAC)
Suicide Squad/Task Force X (Suicide Squad)
Spyral & Leviathan (Batman Inc, Grayson)

Aside from ARGUS there weren't many spy organizations featured in the Nu52 that weren't pre-existing. About the only thing bigger than the number of DC spy organizations is the number of international terrorist and criminal organizations.

>DC released over a half dozen origin retelling OGNs and minis in as many years, most of which were just variants on the classic origin, to force people like the Nu52 version

I still wish they'd done something with my nigga Pariah in the back there.

Remember this?

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>>DC released over a half dozen origin retelling OGNs and minis in as many years, most of which were just variants on the classic origin, to force people like the Nu52 version
unironically this

They fucked themselves when they gave the control of the "teenage" books to Scott Lobdell thinking he'd hand them 90's X-Men goodness. He just ended up making everything needlessly convoluted.

Reminder that Nu52 Tim Drake wasn't actually Tim Drake, his real name was something else, Timothy Drake was just the name the Witness Protection program gave his family in order to escape Penguin, that in his case proved to be pointless because he escaped the cops and his family to go find and live with Batman, something that placed his family in danger in the first place.

There was a rumor that Lobdell wanted to reveal that Tim's real last name was actually Napier. Wanna guess why?

Because they were trying out new things. Question is a niche character who can't support his own title and barely appears anywhere. So why not try doing something different with him? That's what you need with D-list characters. It was an interesting take, it's just a shame it didn't get more time to see where it might go.

This isn't even getting in to the clusterfuck that was Bar-Torr

Nigga, most of my normies friends know the Question as that weird but awesome as fuck guy from the Justice League cartoons. You've no idea how much DCAU Question is beloved. He's up there with John Stewart.

Remember how they deliberately tried to bring Superman 'back to his roots' by making him and confrontational but instead just made him an incel beta orbiter who got mad that Lois got serious with her boyfriend even though he was fucking Diana at the time?

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DCAU Question was nothing like the comic version, which kinda cuts to the heart of the matter. While different, DCAU Question retained enough similarities to the original to not make people feel like its an OC wearing the skin of an existing character and, most important, it was a really great take supported by good material. Nu52 Question didn't have either. For the same reasons its why no one really cares about the Question mini from the early 00s where he's basically Jack Hawksmoor.

Pretty much all the romance shenanigans involving New 52 Superman was bad. They also had him mad and jealous of Wonder Woman about every little thing. Not to mention the cucking. Both Lois and Diana cucks him in very embarrassing ways.

I honestly don't know what the fuck were the writers thinking. What the thought process were. I remember Bob Harras mentioning the Twilight books and movies a lot in press releases, so that may be it.

It's not that hard. A lot of writers hate Lois, a lot of writers hate the SM/WW ship, a lot of writers hate Steve Trevor, a lot of writers have some pretty fucked up takes on how Superman should be, and a lot writers don't give a single solitary fuck about Wonder Woman.

Lobdell did this shit for some reason. He liked to write Superman as a cuck. He framed the whole H'Ell and Supergirl thing as H'Ell taking Supergirl from Superman, despite them being cousins and Superman and Supergirl at that point being pretty much strangers.

He writes Jason the same way in the Red Hood books.

Was it Lobdell that took that single moment in Azz run between Orion and Diana, that wasn't even supposed to be romantic, and ran with it in the Superman books trying to bill some love triangle between Superman, Wonder Woman, and Orion?

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Yep, seems he did it partly to morally 'justify' Clark creeping on Lois and Cat pretty hard in his run.

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Poor Supes.

...And then later in Johns' run, Diana revealed she considered her relationship with Clark as just being a friends with benefits thing, while clearly reciprocating a still hung-up Steve's attempts to come on to her.

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The only stable relationship Superman had during the New 52 was Batman. I don't know if that's sad or not.

It'd kinda hard to tell exactly what Lobdell wants since the man has spent his entire career bending over backwards for editorial.

And as mentioned earlier, Johns in JL and Soule in SM/WW also heavily hinted that WW had a prior fling with Batman that Superman was still very insecure and hung up on.

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Well, Johns made Rucka do that Wonder Woman mini during Blackest Night that explored that whole Batman and Wonder Woman thing, so i can see why he'd dislike the New 52 status quo. Though doesn't Johns hate Batman? Never figured that one out.

But doing shit like this is still dumb. If the writers aren't happy with the status quo, then band together during a writer summit or something and tell the editors. Johns has enough clout he can make such demands. And if there's no way of convincing the editors, then just accept that's how thing are now and work with what you have.

>didn't trust each other at first
>ended up being best of bros
I don't have it but there's a couple pages of Batman calling Superman and asking if he wanted to have a lunch date and they were shown beating up on prisoners in Arkham. JRJR also wrote some issues of Justice League and he made them super gay.

>Though doesn't Johns hate Batman? Never figured that one out.
He 'hates' him in so far as he doesn't suck his dick constantly and occasionally portrays him as fallible and capable of making stupid decisions.

>DCAU Question retained enough similarities to the original

In that he's a detective and dresses the same. That's it. Trinity of Sin did basically the same kinda similar but not shit, only he's dealing with more mystic stuff now.

>Johns has enough clout he can make such demands.
Johns has never had as much clout as Yea Forums likes to think he does.

>Rucka gave us a new origin, that was nice

It was fucking boring.

Johns just hates batgod and writes a shitty batman to compensate. He claimed he likes batman but within the limits of what a human is capable. He absolutely detests "PREP TIME I BEAT ANYONE" Batman because it makes the other superpowered characters redundant.

Like whats the point of super speed if Batman can beat you easily with prep time?

It might have been editorially mandated. There's this Harras quote during that time and this is what he wanted:
>Harras, talking about Superman and Wonder Woman's relationship says "I think it's one of the more interesting things we've had happen in the New 52. I think it's intriguing for a lot of readers that he didn't go right to Lois Lane. While Superman and Wonder Woman have found each other, Superman, especially as Clark, still has unresolved feelings for Lois. So will there be a triangle, will there be pursuit, will they just remain friends? There's a lot of intrigue. I'm interested to see how these guys fight in their personal life."
newsarama.com/comics/c2e2-2013-dc-superman-batman.html
So it seems editorial always wanted to push for love triangles or quadriangles or whatever.

Johns' Batman is an asshole. Not entirely unpersonable, but still a dick.

DC Question: dogged detective with a Zen philosophy
DCAU Question: dogged detective with conspiracy theorist philosophy
Trinity of Sin Question: guy who had his face removed and memories erased by wizards for crimes against humanity who only cares about getting his memories back

>Johns' Batman is an asshole
You say he's an asshole, I say that unlike most other writers he actually has characters in-universe acknowledge that Batman is an asshole. Remember how almost everyone has let the fact that he's mostly to blame for Dark Knights Metal and Heroes in Crisis slide.

Well, shit like that can only be addressed if they're happening in an ongoing. That's why events feel so cheap when all is said and done. Because you know that the writers of the characters ongoings are going to ignore most of the changes unless the book is launching from said event.

New 52 was supposed to address major complaints about DC so that people would be more open to read the comics again. Turns out most of the complaints were fucking retarded petty shit.

O'Neill's Question wasn't much of a detective, he was a Zen vigilante who kept walking into different types of situations in a crime infested shithole of a city. Fundamentally different from conspiracy nut DCAU who was investigating everything.

Do Stormwatch count?

Completely forgot about them.

>Soon, random-guys will take the world!
>Nothing happens

LOL Was New 52 supposed to mean 52 lost stories?

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This thread.

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Not entirely true, DCAU Question had some hints of his original objectivist personality.
Most notably his "A is A" speech to Lex Luthor.

Was that supposed to be a direct reference to Mr A?

>So why not try doing something different with him?
Why not make a new character that suit the role?
Treating characters like product is stupid.

Sometimes it works, other times it shows an impressive lack of understanding. But it's worth remembering that throwing characters into new, weird status quos was what gifted us the Starlin/DnA era of Marvel Cosmic.

A common firearm.

True but at the same time it felt like DC editorial was purposely trying to force something as different from the source material as possible at times.
After a certain extent of drastic changes across the board to a character when does it stop being said character and become something new.

Oh, yeah. They were indisputably asleep at the wheel. I just meant it's not always folly to try and throw a character into a vastly different situation.

Yes it was, mostly because he wasn't allowed to erase nu52 with a "that shit it never existed, now back to the real deal", and had to endlessly dance around the problem.

Johns.
>Why X happened?
Johns
>B-But for what reason?
Johns
He thinks he is god.

>Oh, yeah. They were indisputably asleep at the wheel. I just meant it's not always folly to try and throw a character into a vastly different situation.
Yeah, but taht would stil be the character, but in a different situation. What they did is creating new characters and slapping a known brand on them.

He is.

This monkey paw wish keeps getting worse

>he wasn't allowed to erase nu52 with a "that shit it never existed, now back to the real deal"
But that's literally what he did. About the only thing he wasn't allowed to retcon and had to dance around was Diana being a demigod, but he was still allowed to retcon her powers to being blessings from the gods again rather than from Zeus being her father.

Here's the problem, donkey brains: THAT IS ALSO NOT THE FUCKING QUESTION AND IT'S A RESULT OF THEM TRYING SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

The Question is a completely different character almost every time he shows up, that doesn't make all the disparate versions not the Question.

The question is that the DCAU Question is closer to the standard Question than the New 52 Question ever was. Hell, it's closer to the Steve Ditko's Question, the original Question, than the pre-Flashpoint Question was. Question.

I will never not be mad about Pandora. great character idea, absolutely godfuckingawful execution.

>great character idea,
She really wasn't.

No, he's not. All you have is that "well,, um... uh, they're b-both street l-level!" but even that's a load of horseshit because DCAU could barely throw a punch while O'Neil Question was not only an excellent combatant but he had some Batgod level feats.
They are legit totally different comics, DCAU was a shut in that couldn't get any and comics version made bitches drip just by entering a room.

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I said Ditko's Question.

DCAU Question had DCAU Huntress. Dude was fine.

out of pity

Hey the N52 run of Phantom Stranger was great.
Pandora was okay.
Question was shit.

Question was good in his few appearances in PH and ToS. Pandora 100% sucked ass though.

When did this happened? Also didn't Grudge got killed by superboy?

I liked Pandora.
An immortal learning everything she can so she can battle the evil magic entities is pretty cool.

New 52 was so messed up. Writers were disposable assets according to Didio. Also, I'll never forgive Morrison for his selfishness regarding the backstory of New 52 Superman.

The idea had potential, the character was not very good.

Does new 52 earth two still exist?

This was after Scott Lobdell had managed run the Superboy ongoing to the ground. It was when DC was trying to salvage the Superboy character and ongoing with that Kuder run. Because Kuder's run was getting some buzz, DC decided to try something with the character. Apparently there were plans for a Superbou & the Gen 13 ongoing. That page was supposed to hype it up. Never happened.

Superboy ended up being canceled and next thing you know he shows up when Lobdell is about to ruin the Teen Titans ongoing a second time.

Oh fuck off

Morrison is notorious for not doing well with others. His work is best when it's self contained and he likes it that way. The only problem is when he's writing characters that are strictly part of the greater DC universe. This was shown in Final Crisis when he retconned Countdown, Arena, and Death of the New Gods. Now all of those were bad but I don't know how communication was so bad that everyone was on the wrong page. Even a lot of the tie ins had nothing to do with Final Crisis and he put the first appearance of Mandrakk, the final villain of FC, in a tie in. So naturally people were confused when he showed up suddenly at the end of the event. As for New 52 itself, he continued to do things his way in which he continued Batman Inc. even though it was mostly non-canon and never reference outside of its own book. Only Damian's death and the creation of Leviathan was taken from all of that.

I like Morrison and he did a great collaboration on the 52 series. But he's best when he's not interacting with other writers and that became very obvious during his Action Comics run.

Presumably. That's still where Power Girl comes from, I think.
I doubt we'll revisit it anytime soon, though.

Oh yeah, he's a real scumbag for not bending over to hack writers.

He's the kid with the straight A's but the report card says "doesn't play well with others."

Just like my Japanese cartoons.

You shouldn't play well with the straight F kids.

I'd say he plays great with others, it's just that other writers sometimes struggle to follow his lead. The Bat-line was just about the best it's ever been during his run until New 52 when the editors decided his new status quo wasn't good enough.

It was pretty rancid saved for his B&R and Inc and Snyder's Detectice Comics.

His Batman itself was great. There was also Batwoman Elegy, and Dini Tec.

It was last seen completely destroyed.
They flew away and found the planet that Brainiac was using to house bubbled alt timeline Earth cities.

There was a big CONVERGENCE event, and then everyone left except the Earth2 people who got to keep the planet as their new Earth2.

That wasn't on Morrison, but Didio. Morrison went to work for DC after already being burned by Marvel over editors trying to control his script because of sales or criticisms. So the only thing he'd ever ask Didio and editors was to let him have a degree of control over his work.
FINAL CRISIS Final Crisis operated on the same deal. Grant Morrison would be able to do his work in peace. The problem was that Didio out of nowhere decided to turn COUNTDOWN into a lead-up to FINAL CRISIS. He didn't even consult Morrison on it. He just took whatever outline he had about the general plot and whatever else Morrison was planning on doing eventually, and decided to do a patchwork based on pure guesses. Not only was COUNTDOWN based on what Didio thought Morrison would eventually do, but several other minis and one-shots that were all supposed to be serve as a lead-up to FINAL CRISIS as well as tie-in to COUNTDOWN "TO FINAL CRISIS". So of course it was a mess. Later on he even went on to butcher FINAL CRISIS by dismembering the comic to turn into several separate minis and one-shots instead of a single maxi-series. Because fuck it we need to make more money.

New 52 ACTION COMICS was more of a case of Morrison being pissed off about Didio butchering his Batman run with the reboot and demanding to write his dreamy Superman run to remain working for the company. The AC run was a compromise. That's why Morrison was shielded by all sides. Because Didio knew Morrison was already pissed off about things as it were.

Morrison doesn't have any problem working with other writers. He just have a bad history with editors and Didio tends to be a fucking moron.

He's got no face

Even though he is a niche character he has a character
This isn't the same as turning an obscure character like Booster Gold and making him the most important man in the DCU, or bringing back Animal Man and slowly building him to have a meta relationship with the reader or even making him a horror based character a decade later

This is randomly deciding to make a detective character who's had several ongoings into a god

Pandora who?

Shit, I never read that. He was a teen in the last Supergirl arc before that book was cancelled. I don't think he was villainous though

This was pre flashpoint, but who was this?

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Is ARGUS even still a thing?

They reused this when Batwoman was relaunched during the reboot. Lots of comics were produced before the reboot became a thing and were simple held up to be launched together with the reboot.

Ironically enough, they were the best books of the reboot. Animal Man, Swamp Thing, Aquaman, Batwoman, and several others.

Only ever referenced in the Wonder Woman ongoing because Steve Trevor is nothing without it, but more in passing.

>several

>>yfw someone thought it was a good idea to reboot Amanda Waller as a sexy fit young black woman with near Deathstroke and Deadshot tier weapons and combat ability
It is.

What ever happened to Legion Lost?

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>Seriously DC, give me a goddamn Shining Knights book featuring a classic, High Middle Ages Justin, a gonzo high fantasy Ystina, and a Dark Ages Ystin being too chivalric for all this shit and dealing the fact that they're technically the same person.
Congrats, as shown in the page from HiC, King is now writing it.

Nothing indicts that. The picture of Ystin was only in HiC because King thought the picture looked cool.

Oh, so that's the first villain from the opening Batwoman arc? Cool.

Yup.

>Specially Madame Xanadu who now is only ever used as Jason Blood/Etrigan's cocksleeve.
In the 1980s she was The Spectre's cocksleve.
And through the power of a later retcon (her being Nimue), also fucked and had a kid with one of Constantine's ancestors.

Who's she going to be paired with next!

Also a New 52 thing, isn't her kid Doctor Destiny?

trannies are mentally ill. seek help.

>Also a New 52 thing, isn't her kid Doctor Destiny?
Yes.

I don't mind Xanadu sleeping around. In Wagner's Vertigo solo she was a huge slut that slept around. I love that book.
I just dislike the fact she's now glued to Jason Blood/Etrigan. She used to be much more than just a "love interest".

well like 2

DC editorial was screwing with him. Demon Knights and Stormwatch were suppose to be two interconnected book with Stormwatch and the Demon Knights being the same team with one in the present and the other in the past. Except they kept screwing with it and trying to build up Jim Lee's Wildstorm crossover that never materialized presumably because sales of New 52 were in the gutter.

>Remember Lex killing a teenager Ted Kord's dad and taking the Kord company for himself

But he didn't. The entire point of Forever Evil was Lex Luthor changing and trying to be a better person at the end. So he turned down taking over Kord Industries and left it to Ted even though he was ready to blackmail/threaten Ted's dad for the company in the beginning of FE.

same thing that happened to the legion

>But he didn't. The entire point of Forever Evil was Lex Luthor changing and trying to be a better person at the end.
The one-shot that served as a led-up to Forever Evil had him cruelly killing his own assistant. Lex also did throw Ted's dad out of a helicopter. Lex was still very much a villain, user.

Hell, in that same annual, John had sex with a hippie woman who kept telling him to look at the moon.
The moon stuff fits in a bit with what Ostrander would write about Xanadu's past in The Spectre, so there's a chance that she has also had sex with John.

isn't this Earth-3 Alfred?

>Hey the N52 run of Phantom Stranger was great.
Making Trigon a regular Hell Duke and not an alien was not something I was fond of.
And at the same time Didio wrote that Belial was Trigon's son, which makes Etrigan Trigon's grandson.
And Raven as Etrigan's aunt.

Trigon is a perfect example of a character that needs something new.

just a card that says MARTHA

>>So when we thought it through and looked back to the early days of Vertigo when the Phantom Stranger would go back and forth and nobody seemed to bat an eye in the process...well, what better character to do that at this moment than Constantine? That's one of the reasons why with the return of Swamp Thing, you see the reintroduction of Constantine to the DC Universe.

No shit Dan, that's because it was THE SAME UNIVERSE. Those books got protection as being under "suggested for mature readers," meaning that they, outside of Swamp Thing, were allowed to sit the big events out. The editors specifically didn't want a kid picking up Hellblazer after seeing John team up with Batman or something.
Shade, the Changing Man had a bit of a funny situation. A throwaway response to a letter said that the book took place on an alternate Earth as a way to answer "why didn't superman just fix things." This continued into after Vertigo started, with some reader's letters declaring how proud they were that they were reading the only DC published book that took place on a different Earth. To which Shelley Roeberg (aka Bond) said "yeah, sure."

IIRC the Crimson Men turned out to be militia/doomsday cult headed by Saturna, which means they're in Wonder Woman's wheelhouse, which means no will ever care.

> LOBO-GEDDON #1
GET READY FOR A MAIN MAN EXTRAVAGANZA, FEATURING THE RED LOBO CORPS, THE JUSTICE LOBOS, L.O.B.O., THE LOBOS OF SUPERHEROES, AND SUPERMANS NEW LOVE OF HIS FRAGGIN LIFE LOBOIS LANE

A gun. Knowing Bruce's dramatic ass it's probably the same kind Chill used on Thomas and Martha

Some day we'll get a tell all book written about all the editorial fuck ups and fights between staff and writers during the New 52 period. It will be years though, because the same guys are still in charge over there.
Hell, some things that we already know about include
>Paul Jenkins quitting working for the Big Two altogether after his fighting with editors over Finch's The Dark Knight
>Andy Diggle getting hired for Action Comics and quitting before his first issue even came out
>Jim Zub getting fired from Birds of Prey before his first issue came out, and was replaced by Didio's friend Christy Marx
>Maguire getting hired to do Justice League 3000 with Giffen and Dematteis, only to get fired over Facebook and replaced with Pete Woods.
>Simone getting fired via email and then rehired
>all of the Liefeld stuff

What am I forgetting?

like number 5 on my list of reasons i wish i had a time machine is so i can go to the far future and get the tell all book about this. it's gonna take like 20 + years to get it

Ron Marz getting booted from Voodoo shortly after he used Kyle in it.
That wasn't actually Kyle, but the covers pretended it was

China Meilville had a 30+ issue contract with DC, but Dial H was cancelled at 15 due to low sales

Remember Justice League 3000?
Remember how shit Justice League 3001 was?

James Robinson quitting Earth 2 and the series getting progressively worse because of it.

>Remember how shit Justice League 3001 was?
Yep. It was kind of funny watching everyone die though, especially the Harley Quinn stand in

>There are several shady organizations, all spying on each other and having major in-fighting.

honestly i know Yea Forums hates to do it but we should probably give Bendis a little credit for cleaning all that shit up with Leviathan, it was ridiculous

Also, apparently Diggle wanted to cut Superman's hand off.

There was Also WIlliams and Blackmon quiting Batwoman because DC wouldn't let batwoman get married

Death of the New Gods came from Morrison asking Didio to not let anyone use the New Gods so it was a surprise when they were dead in FC and then Didio did the DOTNG series

He can't support his own title because the industry is dead not because he's an non-viable character.

Shut the fuck up Geoff

I liked a lot about the Phantom Stranger book, none of them the main focus of what the book was supposed to be.

Special guest appearance by The Demon?

I'm too tired to look up more but you're missing some, for example:

H.I.V.E.

But the New 52 was filthy with Alphabet nobodies

Because DiDio outright stated that Hellblazer was no longer canon as of Brightest Day's ending and exiled to it's own side continuity. And that they were only going to acknowledge American Gothic and Constantine's appearances in Swamp Thing and Swamp Thing alone, in terms of the version of Constantine running around in the mainstream DC books.

>DC wouldn't let batwoman get married
I forgot about this I also remember everyone saying its because they're gay and not because DC put a ban on all marriages

The actual plan for this was horrible, so much so that you can forgive DC for shelving Booster like they did.

They were going to reveal that New 52 Booster was a "paradox echo" of the original Booster and that he was wiped from existence in the annual as part of an organic "time-space" reboot clearing up anomolies/paradoxes that survived the original Flashpoint reboot.

The timestream would then "recreate" Booster, but he'd be a total blank slate in terms of zero memories and constantly be moved through the timestream, "fixing" paradoxes or removing traces of the pre-New 52 continuity.

This was done because DC was ditching the Legion/moving them to Earth 2 and putting the JL3K team into place as the new canon future of the main DCU. And they didn't want to deal with the issue of reconciling Booster and his future to the new one being created, plus recreating Booster as a time agent for a movie, since by this point there was just starting to be rumblings about adapting Booster for the big screen.

>I know there are a good amount of shady organizations in the DCU, in the new 52, they felt like it went into overdrive.

I don't mind having a bunch of fictional U.S. government organizations so long as it's clear what their purviews are and how they are related.

In my headcanon, the DEO is in the Department of Justice, analogous to the FBI. It investigates crimes that have "extra-normal" elements.

The Captain Atom project under Weiling was under the Department of Defense.

Task Force X is under an intelligence agency similar to the CIA. My headcanon is that it's a taskforce that is run by Checkmate, but of course Checkmate has never been consistent in DC, and it's even been a U.N. organization rather than a U.S. one.

Project Cadmus is more like NASA, or even the parts of the Pentagon that fund research and development into shit that doesn't even end up having military applications, and is just used for general scientific and technological advancement. But I like my Cadmus being the fun psychedelic Kirby shit, not some generic shady amoral government group.

A.R.G.U.S. doesn't exist in my headcanon, because it's always come across as poor-man's S.H.I.E.L.D.

>LOBOIS LANE

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>China Meilville had a 30+ issue

Not to mention it was supposed to be a Vertigo book and it was edited by Karen Berger personally

>Never forget that this had zero resolution along with the rest of Brightest Day

You can tell how unplanned the New 52 was by how it interrupted a bunch of shit that was happening. I believe the rumours that it was a frantic response to WB telling Didio to do something to increase sales or face consequences.

>Introduce new Aqualad and promote the character as being the first to be introduced in comics and a television show (Young Justice) at the same time
>Reboot happens and he disappears from comics, despite continuing to exist in TV show

>Ressurect Hawkman, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman, Firestorm and others; set up arcs that will probably be jump-off points for either solo series or their arcs in team books
>Rebooted versions' stories don't continue at all from their arcs in Brightest Day

>Have two Batmans, Grayson continuing from the Batman & Robin series, and Bruce returning and headlining Batman, Inc.
>Grayson suddenly goes back to being Nightwing without a storyline detailing why and how he switches back to his old identity, and no indication that he was ever even Batman; despite this, Batman, Inc. and Batwing are ongoings and canon

>I believe the rumours that it was a frantic response to WB telling Didio to do something to increase sales or face consequences.
It also coincided with WB installing their own president (Diane Nelson) as head of DC, instead of the last couple being people from the industry.
Outside hirings are not bad, like Kahn, but Nelson was focused on synergizing the DC properties with what the rest of the company was doing.
I think by the time she resigned she realized it was a bad idea, and now the new woman in charge (also from outside the industry) seems to be making the same mistakes as before.

Yeah. Retards legit thought they didn't want gay marriage when it was obvious they just don't like marriages.

>Batwing
Holy fuck, what the fuck happened to that dude?

The original, David Zavimbe, gave up being Batwing for some reason.

Then Lucius Fox's son, Luke Fox, became the new Batwing.

The entire draw of Batwing was the idea of having a Congolese Batman who deals with the corruption and social instability in a developing nation. But DC must have thought "so long as he's a black guy, right?" and so gave it to another Gotham guy who happens to be African-American.

Why would a red ring choose Lobo? He never seems particularly angry

Ive always liked the idea of the Question having a full life story, starting with his violent Objectivist days of Ditko, then under Oneil he starts to see the world as less black and white, but ends with him losing and saying there is only good and evil with no in between, which takes him to Gotham and Huntress before he has a spiritual reawakening that takes him to Metropolis in the Veitch series which ends in his talk with Superman that brings him back to zen philosophy, so when he realizes hes dieing he goes looking for his replacement in 52

I can't help but notice that most of this thread is DC, so to slightly change the pace... Do the Unkillables ever appear in anything again after that Wolverine maxi?

remember when they tried to make Guardians of the Galaxy for DC?

was it even any good

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>remember when they tried to make Guardians of the Galaxy for DC?
That was L.E.G.I.O.N.
Which was also created by Giffen.
And Giffen's the one who wrote Annhilation, and Annhilation: Conquest - Star Lord (proto DnA GotG)

guess he just really likes the idea of misfits in space

The idea of an all-purpose "Cosmic" book designed to jump around a wider, stranger galaxy was such a good idea. It's a pity that it stumbled straight out of the gate.

Love the way it was wrapped up, though.

It didn't choose him. Atrocitus gave him one in exchange for helping to fool Hal Jordan into helping the Red Lanterns because of reasons during Brightest Day. Lobo kept it as an "in case of emergency break glass" thing. Then the universe rebooted and Lobo was turned into Donte.

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Remember how they tried to give Power Girl a new costume in World's Finest that everyone hated? To the point where the writer and artists also hated it and kept giving her clothing damage in fights that would reveal her cleavage?

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>Rebooted versions' stories don't continue at all from their arcs in Brightest Day

Worse they kicked off the original writers for some of the books. We know that Brian Clevinger was the original planned writer for Firestorm (he has his firestorm pitch on his website) and Robinson was the planned writer for Hawkman according to the artist.

It wasn't a surprise. The state of the New Gods were already known thanks to Seven Soldiers Mr. Miracle as well as interviews Morrison had done promoting that book.

The problem is that DC has seen repeatedly that outside of GLs, the other cosmic side stuff doesn't sell. Adam Strange, Captain Comet, Omega Men, etc DC has repeatedly tried to build them up only for low sales to kill the momentum. The Hunted was just another one of these failed projects.

They did change it eventually.

Shame Huntress didn't get her midriff back, though.

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>LOBOIS LANE
You know if DC was Marvel you know the'll had at least one special where everyone becomes Lobo. The same ways everyone became Hulk in the 00s.

>Diana revealed she considered her relationship with Clark as just being a friends with benefits thing

The way they wrote everyone in all of that was a complete cluster fuck. Everyone came off poorly because everyone had to push their ship.

Editorial should have taken a firmer hand.

different huntress though. Wayne didn't have a belly window

Remember when Supergirl became a Red Lantern?
I actually really liked this and made sense for her to become one, I liked nu52 Supergirl maybe its because its the only run of her I've read and I don't know how bad she was butchered or how much she was improved. Also Silver Banshee that was dropped plotline

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La Llorona (The Crying Woman) a ghost from Mexican folklore who drowned her children and now haunts the world stealing children and drowning them.

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Are there any comic Question runs as fun as animated Question?

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Remember when DC tried to introduce Volcana from Superman:TAS but she only showed up on two random issues of Superboy and Supergirl and she was never named?

Forgot pic

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hmm?

it's just the usual kryptonian christmas, burning the christmas tree, user

Batman/Huntress: A Cry for Blood is a quick mini with a decent amount of Question and Huntress interaction. Otherwise, you're pretty much limited to the JLU comics themselves.

Question has had some fantastic comics in the past, but they usually aren't what you can call "fun".

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What if ARGUS is an in-universe poor-man's SHIELD by design? A bunch of bureaucrats, policy wonks, and congressmen capitalize on superhumans to create a new government agency intentionally patterned after how pop culture perceives such organizations and capitalizing on the restricted purview of existing public agencies and clandestine nature of the top secret agencies to build a narrative that America isn't doing enough to deal with superhumans?

Bendis has literally repeatedly said its canon and even tied in what happened with what happened with Tynion’s Tec. You are a fucking retard.

It’s why I’m actually happy Bendis is culling them

Morrison was right to tell DC to fuck off and just do his Superman origin. It’s the best Superman origin ever and editorial completely fucked Supes after Morrison left anyway.

me too op

Threshold was fun in a Keith Giffen sorta way.

REBELS vol. 1 I can see being GotG but LEGION and REBELS vol.2 is pretty much Bad Boys 2: Space edition

Was Threshold getting canceled the moment that finally killed Giffen's comics enthusiasm?

I think thats actually happened in one of the Lobo annuals from the 90's.

Sad but true, really makes for one consistent read though from Omega Men first branching out of Green Lantern in the early 80's to Vril Dox II forming L.E.G.I.O.N. outta the fallout from the Invasion storyline and further into Adam Strange, Comet, and the Stranges adventures on Rann, Thanagor, and Hardcore station.

>L.O.B.O.
Are ya bastiches ready for the world that's coming?

no that was probably his Larfleeze series getting canned.
Giffens the type to get burnt out and just sleep walk through the shit for a while then go right back to full on fucking with Didio

Idiots
There are no dropped plot points.
It's all part of HIS plan

Who's he?

How's the magic face, Vic?

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