Can we have a No-Face thread?
Can we have a No-Face thread?
Landon Reyes
Levi Adams
Have Two-Face and the Question ever met?
Isaac Wood
I should add, pre-Question Renee doesn't count
Samuel Cook
I don’t think so. He did run into the Riddler once, who was robbing a bus (Eddy was in a bad place), that Question was riding out of costume. Question chased the Riddler away with a bunch of Zen koans.
Ian Hall
You would think that they would've, but no. They haven't. Probably happen in Leviathan cause Bendis' hands are made out of ham.
Ayden Moore
Who???
Christopher Howard
That is the question
Jordan Powell
That sounds fun. What issue?
James Sanchez
It's a really good read, but as I remember it, it's also very weird.
Colton Lopez
Renee as Question doesn't count either
Noah Jenkins
Benjamin Martin
Damn I love when people do miniatures, city. Especially if they make it look grimey
Adrian Rogers
As much as I want to say that's a lazy bastardization of Vic's character it makes sense. He's well read, and presenting a question that even the one asking doesn't know the answer to would be enough to screw up logical types like Eddie and pic related.
Plus its a total dick move.
Caleb Rodriguez
That is some dumb shit. Just because he's a robot doesn't mean he would hardlock at spouting some nonsense at him.
Jose Nguyen
>Plus its a total dick move.
Pretty much everything you said, yeah. Like, Eddie totally deserved it cause he was seriously sticking up a bus and deserved to be humiliated by some no-face d-lister, but it really did feel oddly like punching down.
Adrian Butler
What is that from? And is No-Face still into Zen? Please say yes.
Julian Walker
Charles Cooper
Nicholas Flores
Didn’t someone try to logic bomb Bender, and he just rebooted and was totally fine?
Chase Evans
It really is sad that Justice League Unlimited is the best depiction of Question, dude needs more love
Colton Martinez
I think that was Robot Santa, and he exploded but he had an extra head that was program to ignore it
David Gonzalez
>best
Nigga I love me some paranoid!Vic as much as the next guy but don't go disrespecting O'Neil's run like that.
Anthony Lopez
I love that you used his actual name.
Renee wouldn’t count anyway since that’s not her code name.
Grayson Nguyen
Has there been a superhero whose civilian identity has never been revealed to anybody, not even to the readers?
Luis Roberts
Brainy isn't a robot
Dominic Carter
mfw I read that as punished!vic
>why are we here tot?
>just to suffer?
Brayden Williams
I liked the Question tie-in for Blackest Night, where Tot was still just living in his lighthouse as if nothing had changed.
Dominic Long
No it isn't.
But yes he does.
Sebastian Fisher
I liked how his emotion was Avarice. Its not a trait I'd think a 'good guy' would have.. but a scientist? Fuck yeah, he's thristy for Knowledge.
Also the fact that Tot could still zen himself enough to be invisible to black rings. Such a tacit way of saying "yes, he has selfish/bad traits, but that doesn't doom him" Honestly that tie-in faithful to everything Question. It even had a cameo from top notch waifu bait Lady Shiva.
Michael Cooper
>a lazy bastardization of Vic's character
it's from O'Neil's run, though
Isaiah Lopez
>tfw no Question point-and-click detective game by Telltale in their prime
Kevin Miller
Except it isnt.
Tyler Edwards
He seriously is one of my favorite supporting characters, whenever I think of him. Tot and Richard Dragon, really that bit in the final issue where he just gets out of his wheelchair and walks away, while everyone stares after him. And yeah, that really was one of the only good Blackest Night tie-ins; it felt the most faithful to the original.
William Gomez
Is this a the blank thread?
Mason Jackson
Yeah Renee’s codename is something else entirely.
Connor Miller
Landon Hall
I love how Renee and Tot both need to concentrate to disappear, and they also have a bit where the Black Lantern Vic loses contact with them. But Shiva just disappears. There's no blurry contact lost thing, she's just gone. And she does it after getting shot. It took her twenty seconds of fighting Vic to figure out a way to completely disappear and less than one to implement it. Whotta gal.
No matter how good my life is, I know I'll never be as happy as when Greg Rucka found out O'Neil was co-writing it with him.
Jordan Torres
As good as Lemire’s run on Green Arrow was, I cannot get over how much DC has dropped the ball with Shiva and Dragon. It would be somewhat forgiveable if the characters were better for it. But now Shiva has gone from having a vague but concrete moral code while being the most deadly woman on Earth to the head of the League of Assassins(?), while Dragon has gone from mysterious kung fu master and philosopher poet to an international ancient cult dedicated to fighting? Again, I like what Lemire did with Green Arrow, but couldn’t he have used someone else, or an OC? Maybe then we wouldn’t have Richard Dragon as a drug crimelord who is also a kung fu master on Arrow.
Good lord.
Easton Garcia
>no opening monologue spoofing Rorschach's speech while also playing it straight
>no Wolf Among Us level sexual tension between Vic and Myra that can actually leads to a sex scene
>no martial arts quicktime events vs Shiva who is so tough all the subsequent thug fights are laughably easy
>no morally grey ending that leaves you feeling depressed but centered in a wierd way
why even live?
Not gonna lie, I put that line about Shiva on the end to see if I could summon you into the thread.
John Martinez
Oh shit it’s Judge user
Oliver Allen
What's even worse about Shiva is that they can't even decide how to fuck her over. She went from mercenary working for the highest bidder to League trainer to League leader for a hot second to hating being in the League but owing them some vague debt to being SUPER into the League to the point where she had her own League that was even more League than the League... and it all fucking sucks.
At least when Lemire created RZArd Dragon he left a window open with the whole "I killed my teacher and took his name" thing. Shiva is just a fucking mess.
Now what's the next step of your master plan?
Jace Mitchell
You should put Rorschach somewhere in this
Kayden Kelly
True. But one of the good things about super amoral characters like these is that they can do a heel turn back into becoming mysterious kung fu masters, as, prior to the nu52, both of them were known for having super vague motivations and plans of their own that would require them to work with disreputable people. Like it was all part of their plan to let everyone think they’d become idiots for awhile.
Daniel Hughes
I don't think Shiva at her best was one for really making plans, but it's true that right now they have a golden opportunity to roll it all back by just having her come out of the Lazarus Pit like "Hey, this whole League bullshit sucks, I'mma do me." Like dying clears all the shit from her head and she just decides to live however she wants. So you can have her be like her 80s Zen/Taoist way again, while also having to deal with the LoA constantly sending people after her head. All you need is someone who's read O'Neil's run and cares enough to make it happen.
Jason Powell
>Now whats the next step of your master plan?
...impromtu storytime?
Hudson Sanchez
... sure, why not?
Evan Gutierrez
Jayden Clark
>tfw you'll never get kicked in the fucking face by Lady Shiva
Cooper Clark
Something I really love about Vic and Renee is that they both had the same tendency to try and force the world into making sense, of diving deep into violence when life got too complicated for them, but they had completely different reasons for it. It made their connection feel extremely organic.
Gavin Lopez
While it's not the best (see ), it's great because it shows how people can care for a z-lister if he's given proper care and good writing. I remember when those episodes aired, everyone in my gang (including myself, who only really knew x-stuff at the time) was fucking hyped for the Question, I remember there were even crazy schoolyard theories about him being future Robin or whatever.
But nah let's milk Batman even more.
The worst part is that every iteration (that I know) of the Question would work, even the Ditko randian crazyness could work if we consider Rorscharch's success.
Justin Thomas
[Muffled Wu-Tang Clan music playing]
Daniel Davis
Ian Rogers
>Cowan AND Sienkiewicz
fuark
Ryan Young
I never really thought of it that way, but yeah, they both do have that same kind of anger. Renee for having to live in the closet so long, and for losing her family when she came out, and Vic for being constantly surrounded by lies and people willing to cut their mother’s throat for a quick buck. And they’re both looking for the right nose to break in order for the world to be set right.
Carson Morgan
Ayden James
>Spend that team on a fucking event book
I hate DC I fucking hate the big two I fucking hate comic books as a whole I just want to become a billionaire and fund my own personal pet projects which I will never share with this ridiculous public anyway
Cowan actually did the Liquid Swords cover
Cooper Gonzalez
The motherfucking dream team. Look at how they draw rain. Hot damn.
'xactly. They both had that moment where the world seemed to be closing down on them and they had nothing to do but break their knuckles on the wall. And like nearly every addict who's Been There, Vic recognized that on Renee and tried his best to help her.
Henry Sullivan
>Hot latina and asian babe kung fu fighting under the rain
>Nah fuck that we gotta go play mad doctor
Damn right he did.
Andrew Campbell
Nathan Walker
Kayden Thompson
JLU introduced the character to me, but I didn’t fall in love until I read 52. He totally popped off the page in a way that no one else did. Here you have Lobo as the triple bishop of the fish god, Amanda Waller building the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse because fuck Black Adam and the Question is quietly dying of lung cancer. It was human and tragic and it fucking tore my heart out.
It wasn’t for awhile until I actually sat down with O’Neil’s Question, but when I converted to Zen Buddhism, I ran out of excuses and I’m glad I did. How O’Neil frames his conversion as an extension of his pre-existing philosophy, of his burning need for knowledge extended metaphysically. How he rebuilt himself philosophically and physically at the same time. Someday I’ll get to Tot’s reading list.
Hudson Thomas
I don't see why not
Logan Morris
Isaac Watson
>It was human and tragic and it fucking tore my heart out.
My favorite part of his death is that it happens inches away from a literal magical cure, but Vic's body falls apart before he can get there. So instead he dies this painfully small, human death that's still the perfect death for him.
Anthony Gutierrez
Goddamn what a gorgeous fuckin page
Ian Cox
Colton Stewart
Austin Evans
Jack James
>"I have never been shot before."
Uhh, well, ackshwally, in Richard Dragon: Kung Fu Fighter #14... Although I guess pre-Crisis doesn't count.
Nathaniel Nguyen
God, I love Black Lantern Vic's dialogue in this page. You can hear it in your head, cadence and all.
Caleb Harris
Well, shit. Denny O’Neil is #cancelled
Aaron Nguyen
>It was actually written by O'Neil
Brandon Jenkins
Ok, pay attention.
Shiva? Instant disappearance. While standing.
Chase Butler
And while moving.
Luke Roberts
Renee has to sit down, concentrate, and the Lantern takes a moment to lose connection.
Mason Richardson
That is an amazing one,shot
Matthew Peterson
And Tot needs to get his closure, say his goodbyes, and the Lantern still has the bit of static going on before he disappears.
Ayden Barnes
Sick.
>you can hear it in your head, cadence and all
I imagine its different for everyone but he sounds angry and petulant in my head. Clever, but way too eager to show you.
>"Maybe! Maybe Ive got answers!"
>"Beg for them"
He's still the angry self conscious orphan, looking for answers, at heart.
Nathan Miller
So like, every Buddhist monastery would’ve been completely untouched during Blackest Night while all the monks meditate their way through it?
Jordan Brooks
And that's why Lady Shiva is the motherfucking best. tfw this issue came out in 2010 and is still the last good thing Question and Shiva have been in.
Levi Watson
Yeah, I think the same way too. He's finally managed to stand toe-to-toe with Shiva and now Tot is the one desperately coming to him for answers and he's just milking it for all its worth.
Adrian Garcia
The ones who saw the game for what its for, yeah, I imagine.
I know that feel.
Carson Sanders
Here’s hoping Bendis doesn’t fuck Charlie up too bad during Leviathan so someone else can write him afterwards. And besides, maybe a miracle will happen and he’ll treat the character respectfully. A worldwide conspiracy is the sort of thing any version of the character would be interested in.
Asher Barnes
HA HA YEAH WOULDN'T THAT BE NICE
Xavier Brown
I think she could just be referred to as the Question. But I don't remember anyone referring to her as anything other than 'Renee' or 'Montoya' even when she was masked.
Julian Perez
>You sought less for the answers than to ask better questions.
...fuck. I've been doing this life thing for a while now but that seems to be the whole trick to it to me. Ask better questions. Shit, its like life is just a struggle to understand or at least trust in simple truths.
Mason White
That, to me, is the key difference between O'Neil's Question and pretty much every other Question. The questions they ask are usually just "Who's behind this evil scheme?" or "Who controls this or that?". They're questions about the world around them that they have to answer to save it.
O'Neil's Vic asked those too, but he also asked, well, who am I? Where did I come from? Where am I going to? How would it feel to kill? How hard can I keep going? What do I do when everything around me is coming apart at the seams and I'm powerless to stop it? He turned those questions inwardly, but could never detach himself from the world around him enough to pursue them as much as he wanted. So he fell back on violence, on trying to tough it out, ask no questions, just keep on fighting, until it broke him. And it's to O'Neil's everlasting credit that it never felt navel-gazing or pointless pseudo-philosophizing. It genuinely read like a guy trying to walk another way and become a better person while being constantly held back by his own flaws. Just fucking great comics.
Matthew Martinez
The book on Tot’s reading list that I most heavily recommend to you specifically is Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. There’s a huge chunk of it that’s just about how the best kind of questions, in science and in philosophy, are the ones that breed more questions. And then I think it was Karl Popper, one of the twentieth century philosophers of science, who said a theories conclusions are less important than their falsifiability (or something like that. Philosophy of Science 101 was six years ago), again suggesting the importance of asking questions even when we think we have the answers.
Noah Kelly
I'm halfway though the book actually, and I can't help but think the author is a terrible douche.
Like, he's got some good introspection, the kind that make you think too, but he's so at peace with himself he just seems detached and superior. Especially towards his son.
I'm running out of Q images, take my last one.
Josiah Robinson
Now I want there to be a gritty Question show on the DCU, but everyone would accuse it of ripping off Daredevil.
I love how O’Neil really showed that Zen pairs with detective and noir stories, as they both suggest detached stoicism in the midst of chaos is the best way to arrive at Truth. I’m shocked no one’s ever thought of it before.
Jace Walker
I think that’s how you’re supposed to feel about him at that point in the book, I did too. Even put it down for awhile, but keep going. I know it’s more philosophy than fiction, but I still don’t want to spoil it.
Jack Williams
Logan Kelly
I should give that book a look. And yeah, I think that's also where the idea of the Zen Koan comes into play. There are questions that don't have answers, but by pondering the question itself you can learn more about how you perceive the world around you, and through that, about yourself.
Vic is never going to find the answers he wants. He's never going to find his parents, his real name (if there is such a thing), his identity. But it's by searching for it that he learns more about himself.
Also, I like to think of Lady Shiva as a living Koan for people like Vic, because even right after spending a year with Richard in the mountains he still can't figure her out. He can never quite reach the level of sheer detached abstraction necessary to really "get" her, but by trying, he begins to break free from his narrow worldview of black and white, good people and evil people, and in so learns more about himself.
Kayden Evans
I would rather go with something like “Q”, or (somewhat more derivatively) “Lady Question” or “Det. Question”, something like that. Maybe. She really needs her own identity though.
Luis Stewart
I super need to collect the rest of that run. God it’s just so damn good, and mindful. Like, a thought that just came to me is the detached stoicism of Zen probably saves his life in the end, as it gave him the ability to walk away, when previously he would’ve stayed, fought, and died eventually. And I especially like how then koan that broke him, and rebuilt him, “what was your face before you were born?” (Incidentally, that’s my favorite koan, and one that breaks my thinking when I sit to meditate every time I need it) is woven throughout the run.
Gavin Bennett
Lowkey, Detective Question is just cheesy enough to be a nickname gotham thugs give her that just sticks. And it would give her an edge that Vic didnt have.
He was damn fine at finding the answers to questions, but he didnt advertise it. If Gotham knew the second question was a questioning type that add a whole new layer to the fuckery thar would go on.
Austin Evans
i can only hear it as Jeffrey Combs; to me even before justice league, he was the voice of the question. he just sounds i dont know beyond good/evil he just wants his goddamn answers
Carter Cooper
Yo is this a real thing? Do people irl really do this?
Nicholas Baker
Of course not! Hub City is just one of the worst places in the DCU. It’s far worse than Gotham has ever been, with corruption reaching into every part of the city to the extent that firefighters can be paid to ignore blazes.
Joseph King
I expect a place called Hub City to be less horrifying than Gotham. What are some examples of the crime there?
Jonathan Green
one guy wanted to slice himself off a hunka nigger
Hudson King
Yes. Then we could have The Question, No Face, and (newly christened) Detective Question going around Gotham digging up conspiracies. They could be the Expressionless Inquisitors or some extravagant group name.
Logan Lopez
One guy got shot in his own store and had to walk to the police station to report it because the cops were afraid to go out.
Elijah Bennett
Hub City’s version of commissioner Gordon (the one good cop in a corrupt police department) is on the take, a dysfunctional alcoholic and is either killed or flees the city with Charlie, the mayor and her daughter. Oh yeah, the democratically elected mayor had to flee for her life after numerous assassinations attempts were made against her, and I think she was kidnapped too?
Josiah Walker
It's nice to see him pop up in the comics again.
Cameron Hill
She didn't win by popular vote, either. Hub city just had an old rule still in place that gave the runner up the office should the winner die suddenly. You can guess what happened to the winner.
Ethan Hill
It sounds so extreme and over the top, like when there was a really bad storm and the only ‘law-keepers’ were outlaw bikers that were barely interested in keeping the law. Oh yeah, and that was during the mayoral election. Like, it sounds almost like it’s supposed to be funny, but it seriously plays out like a horror story.
Eli Evans
is this hypercrisis?
Michael Nguyen
I've never really seen much with the Question, and I started reading 52 to see how post-crisis Batwoman was, having my proper introduction to him being his slow death from cancer while he stealth-trains Renee was an unfortunate one. Does he come back to life before Nu52 launched? Because reading late-Post-Crisis people are dropping like fucking flies. I honestly didn't remember so many people dying.
Matthew Cooper
Man, I'd hate to be a woman, or kid, or even a weak guy living there. It sounds like a hench factory with all the rape and petty crime you can ask for. I'm surprised it doesn't have it's own Punisher expy.
Liam Sullivan
Now that's an impressive idea.