Ohnonononononononononon

why would he need to project on an anonymous iranian coloring book

he's just telling it like it is

Why did this need its own thread you drama queen?

man Yea Forumsmblr leftwing biases really has gotten out of hand if you are so far up liberals asses that you can´t even understand watchmens message

and yet he was still right and not a coward
based

Death of the Author means Moore can go pull his dick on the subject once the book is published.
He can go sit with J.K. Rowling in the special area where authors mumble to themselves 'But I really did mean that to be in it originally ;_;'

>today: on stuff that never happened...

The based Snyderkino presents Rorschach as far more of a hero than Alan Moore's shitty postmodernist "every uncompromising idealist is a suicidal hypocrite" ever did.
The film is indubitably a much greater treatise on ideas-as-superheroes than the comic ever could have been.

>Broken clock

Because she would go insane if her boogeyman turned out to be well-adjusted compared to her.

>misogynist
Really going to throw that word at a guy raised by a prostitute who fucked clients in the room next door. A guy who called girls names behind their back in the same book that has rape in it?

>assuming their gender

This is legit. /pol/ is massively into race play and cuck shit.

Moore wrote him to be a lunatic

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Rorschach has always been way more loved than Moore intended. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that he assumed everyone believes in compromise for a lie that can bring more good. Relativism is a hell of a drug though and a lot of people differ on how they feel. Personally the trait that I liked about him is that he is loyal to those he cares about, but he is a FUCKING LUNATIC. Now that doesn't mean he can't be a useful lunatic, but he is not the type of guy most would want to see. That being said his unrelenting values help show how important honesty is to him and what drives him to be who he is.

Rorschach had a strict policy about bad people facing consequences. Ozy's actions were basically like if England covertly proposed and funded the holocaust in order to better unite the allies against Germany. Good intentions didn't change the fact that Ozy committed the greatest atrocity in human history, and Rorshach wanted people to know.

Rorschach was a bad person, but he was the only one who stood by their morals at the end. Death Of The Author and all, but I think the book paints Rorschach as the hero unless you're willing to take Ozy's side and concede that sometimes a little genocide gets the job done.

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/pol/ fag here, I’m into traps and monster girls. Also torture

There are no heroes in Watchmen, Ozy and Rorschach are both just people who can't deal with a world more complex than their own window of it. Rorschach's heroic venture into the ice to tell people is really a suicide, he knew it was never going to actually happen.

Well to be fair Ozy's points were valid and we see that it was functional (at least at the end of the comic) to a point. That being said I definitely side with him in regards to his view of Ozy's actions. Blood spilled secretly will always end up with more blood eventually.

Rorschach absolutely hates himself and is at least implied to be a little gay for Nite Owl.

>Rorschach absolutely hates himself
Semi valid for certain

>and is at least implied to be a little gay for Nite Owl.
I want the Fujios to leave.

>fascist tendencies
I don't even remember this. I saw him as a libertarian-anarchist type.
The movie didn't have any references to him being fascist either.

>smelling
>not having a girlfriend.
Both of these apply to me, so, uh, I'm gonna say those aren't the real problems with Rorschach. The problem is that he uses excessive force.

I like Rorschach for the same reason I like Batman. They're both lunatic vigilantes that badly hurt, cripple, or kill people they don't like and they get away with it. Fucking based.

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people keep thinking Watchmen was about heros when in reality its about deranged people with too much power and time on their hands

Rorschach's absolute black and white morality spread out to his views on politics, although it's only mentioned in passing a couple times. He only saw the pure and the sinners, and whatever it took to control the sinners was justified.

That description is closer to Punisher and Wolverine than Batman

>I wanted Rorschach to be like "this is what Batman would be like in real life", but it turns out everybody with an intact soul still sympathizes with someone who strives for honesty in a world of cheats and won't "compromise" with a genocidal maniac who thinks he's saving the world, even if they're rendered abject by my own deeply demented view of what reality is like – remember, kids, I'm a wizard! This alarms me due to my own severe mental problems so I choose to blame it on him being stinky

I don't even fuckin' LIKE Rorschach. I'll be goddamned if every time Moore opens his braying retard mouth he doesn't make the character MORE sympathetic, though.

Rorschach would consider himself a misogynist. It just means you hate or dislike women, which is basically par for the course here.

You know the quote isn't real, right?

I am not a native english speaker but...there say nothing about be a fascist

see
There are interviews where he talks about Rorschach, though.

>see
Not really, is nothing about be a fascist

>smelling
>Not being a problem
Take a fucking shower, JFC is not that hard. Get a cheap membership to a shitty Mcgym and use their facilities if you have to.

I just liked that he stood his ground.

>He only saw the pure and the sinners, and whatever it took to control the sinners was justified.
Which has fuck all to do with fascism. By that metric, Doom would be a fascist. Doom is all sorts of fucking crazy authoritarian, but he isn't a fucking fascist.

Sons of Batman

It's a surprisingly short path from AnCapism to fascism. AnCaps want an orderly society full of people who don't need the state fucking around with them. Eventually, if you take the ideals seriously, you start noticing there are certain categories of people who are fundamentally opposed to that.

>imaginary battle against "the evil"

except it wasn't imaginary, he was 100% right.

>The problem is that he uses excessive force.
Women fantasize about rape.

>single best argument against Veidt is he used mass murder to buy a temporary peace that definitely wouldn't last long past his death making the entire plot a vanity project on his part with Veidt just a villain playing the hero because he can
>write a sequel where the peace held, proving Veidt right and creating a moral debate where there shouldn't even be one, while actually shitting all over Rorschach's attempt to expose Veidt as this now genuinely endangered a lasting peace and with it billions of lives
I don't think HBO understood jack and shit.

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>It's a surprisingly short path from AnCapism to fascism
That's just cause anarchists are mentally ill and therefore don't need to follow logical progression to get from point A to point 132, not that there is a logical progression to fascism in the first place.
>you start noticing there are certain categories of people who are fundamentally opposed to that.
Except fascists don't make a scapegoat class out of people who support a strong centralized government. They generally do it out of minorities as a way of controlling the masses. By creating an us versus them mentality, the us become more loyal and failures can be blamed on the them. You saw this with the Italian fascists' targeting of North Africans.

>>single best argument against Veidt is he used mass murder to buy a temporary peace that definitely wouldn't last long
While everything else you said may be true. There are far better arguments. Like the fact that even if his heinous plan works, trading innocent lives away is still fucking evil.
Using an innocent man as a scapegoat without his knowledge is fucking evil
Giving people cancer is evil
Ends don't justify means

It is a real quote from 2008 conducted by LJ Pindling of Street Law Productions. That's his genuine opinion.

It's called having good taste and it scares the plebs

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>uh oh i made an anti-hero and it turned out to be popular

WHAT A TWIST.

>posting about politics on a north antarctic epub
>well-adjusted

ok son

Horseshoe theory isn't real. You don't go from "literally no state" to "the most controlling state possible" with just a single logical bound.

>I don't even fuckin' LIKE Rorschach. I'll be goddamned if every time Moore opens his braying retard mouth he doesn't make the character MORE sympathetic, though.
You sound like the people who voted for Trump because people made them feel stupid for considering voting for Trump

Friendly reminder that Alan Moore liked the dark knight rises and grown to hate occupy Wall Street as much as Frank Miller.

why does Moore write like a valley girl?

Please look up what horseshoe theory actually is.
>You don't go from "literally no state" to "the most controlling state possible" with just a single logical bound.
Would be a fairly obvious corollary of horseshoe theory.

Friendly reminder that Moore and Miller are both as mentally ill as Dave Sim.

Fascist, misogynist. Words have lost their meaning after they started being used as instant win cards.
I've only watched the movie and from what I saw Roachguy was just this weird intense dude. He had more spine than the entire team combined, and even at his shittiest he held onto his ideals and practices. That is admirable integrity. I didn't like the part where Night Owl found him in his house because the guy deserved better than this low. But I did like the part where he beat criminals in the prison. Not just because of how badass it was, but also because he wasn't afraid. He had a certain view of how things should be and he put that tiny corner of the world in order. I dunno how to better describe it. It's like Roachguy has autism and comprehends things in a certain way without fear or taught values.

>why does Moore write like a valley girl?

Shit, fellas. user doesn't know

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Post proof.

>Not liking the dark knight rises
Go back to tumblr

>liking The Dark Knight Strikes Again
Seek counseling.

No surprise there. Also, nice digits you two.

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It's a Tumblr quote.

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>Ozy's actions were basically like if England covertly proposed and funded the holocaust in order to better unite the allies against Germany

Holy shit.

Now I can't NOT believe in that.

The videos are gone from youtube which is why it should have been transcribed in its entirety, but it has been cited by serious people stevensurman.com/rorschach-from-alan-moores-watchmen-does-he-set-a-bad-example/

>I wrote a well-written character with dubious morals and numerous flaws and somehow he's popular
Wowie zowie, what a retard.

>I really like the character that retard wrote, what a retard!

Sounds based amd redpilled.

If he can't understand what made the character, as well as others that we were obviously supposed to hate like Veidt and Comedian, so compelling then maybe he just got lucky with this one? What has he put out since? League of Edgyrape Gentlemen? Fishrape?

Great dodge. You almost suffered from self awareness, good thing you can just keep dropping buzzwords.

Cool nonargument.

I mean why should I try to engage with you beyond just openly mocking you? You don't even realize what an ass you're making of yourself.

>Hur! That shitty writer uses edgy rape. HAHA, RAPE RAPE, I'm totally edgy.

I mean you're so retarded you can't really comprehend that people might think a creator is an idiot, or disagree with his or her views but can separate their work away from that and enjoy the work itself, so I don't know, go be a child elsewhere.

Another great dodge. I'd love to watch you play Dark Souls.

Politics have potentially game-changing effects on your life. It's very important discuss, certainly more than children's cartoons. Especially when you're over 14.

Not in Yea Forums

>Cops are racist pigs that will shoot black people on site

Come to think of it, what actually were Rorschach's shortcomings, beyond being a socially maladjusted autist? In his role as a crime fighter, he remained committed to fighting crime, of all things. I guess he "went too far" when he killed the child murderer? Help me out here. What moments were supposed to really damn his character, in uncle Alan's eyes?

>What has he put out since? League of Edgyrape Gentlemen? Fishrape?

Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow
Batman: The Killing Joke
V for Vendetta
From Hell
various Judge Dredd works
Lost Girls
Tom Strong
Promethea
Top 10
Terra Obscura

My personal likes

fuckin this

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Possibly homosexual? Must remember to investigate further.

He called other women whores, that was rather rude. I think he was okay with what happened between the first Silk Spectre and Comedian

The allies did put the kaibosh on the plans to deport them to some shithole like new zealand.

Rorschach was a wacky guy who went around greviously injuring people and dropping them down elevator shafts. It's only natural that other wacky guys from around the world would take interest and try to emulate him. Especially after his journal leaks and everyone reads his manifesto.

You don't have the mindset to see Rorschach as a villain. We've grown too familiar with killing people that deserve it. If you wanted to frame, you should as a boy who grew up with upstanding heroes holding the line, never crossing it. An utterly merciful hero living in a world of camp villains.

Butchering someone with a cleaver in some seedy appartment, and murdering their dogs for good measure is as unapologetically grimy as a hero can get. Rock-bottom basically. I can understand Alan's apprehension over it. He just didn't account for a more cynical generation in more cynical times.

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Madagascar, Hitler wanted to deport the German Jews to Madagascar.

The relaly damning thing though is that when that didn't work out his plan was simply to deport them to *other European nations* and France, Spain, England etc. refused to take them in because they didn't want any filthy Jews.

I don't mention this to somehow soften the Nazis' responsibility for the Holocaust or anything, they were sick fucks and they were the ones who opened the gas canisters. You should just be aware that no one is free of sin.

I agree although it's obviously gonna be more complicated than that. They're gonna inevitably show how it's necessary to expose Veidt on moral grounds and shit. Also, I like that there are now branching paths that the Watchmen universe takes after the book wraps up.
Besides being psychotic, he's actually an ok guy in a world like Watchmen where life is cheap. He's literally the last hero left and if not for him nobody would have looked into Veidt's plan in the first place.

I guess I can sympathize with Rorschach there, a little girl was murdered and her corpse fed to dogs, I can’t see any sane person react calmly to that.

That's not the case with libertarians; they wanted the freedom to exclude and democracy itself wouldn't allow that, so they go fascist because it really wasn't about freedom at all.

>HBO Watchmen
>Doomsday Clock
I gotta say I'm liking all this Watchmen talk.

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Thank God he uses teenage girl terms.

Sane people react better to worse. Rorschach was abused and his mental health was neglected. PTSD is real, but people who experience horror don't all have a collection of piss bottles organized by date.

>Butchering someone with a cleaver in some seedy appartment
You mean it would somehow have been less sordid in a fancy penthouse? Using a Thinker statue to bludgeon the guy to death maybe?

Seems like a real superficial factor to me, no moral weight in it

Why do people cling to one poor analogy like it derails an entire argument?

The good guys are unironically pigs, and the bad guys are anonymous/gilets jaunes esque protesters.
This will be great.

I think the dude above had it right. Moore bet on people being real into living a lie, and while we do that every day we admire honesty, if only for the novelty.

For all of his clear faults, Rorschach is perhaps the only person in the comic with real integrity. I thought that was the joke, that the homeless guy who murders dogs and hides in fridges is the only real ass hero among them and he dies for it.

Like if you didn't want us to sympathize with the guy why write him sympathetically? I honestly think Moore's just being disingenuous in the later interviews for whatever reason because there's no question Rorschach isn't written like, say, the Comedian where one of the big shocks of the book is SOMEONE remembers him fondly and it's the woman he raped the shit out of.

Like, what was I supposed to do? Rorschach made the choice Superman would have made, Hal Jordan would have made, he was willing to against the the words of a being that dwarfed him and all the other heroes, because he knew it was wrong.

Mark Waid's Doom begs to differ.

>For all of his clear faults, Rorschach is perhaps the only person in the comic with real integrity. I thought that was the joke, that the homeless guy who murders dogs and hides in fridges is the only real ass hero among them and he dies for it.
This. His refusal to back down even when he knows 100% that it's futile and he WILL die for insisting on doing the right thing is the most heroic, maybe the only genuinely heroic act in the entire comic.

>I honestly think Moore's just being disingenuous in the later interviews for whatever reason
My take is it's not disingenuousness, it's just that Moore wrote Rorschach as being a right wing conspiracy nut and he himself sees this as the nadir of all brainlet memes, so he can't conceive of people sympathizing with the character anyway. To his mind he basically has Rorschach going around saying BLEHHH DURR LUH LUH I'M A MORON, and he's frustrated that not everyone is pointing and laughing like he intended.

You can be a misogynist and be right at the same time

Punisher is also a committed crime fighter but to any normal person he's a dangerous psychopath who butchers people. Rorschach is a hard right stereotype nutbag of a similar fashion whose only real redeeming quality is that he believes in a rigid right/wrong system and fights crime. It's admirable until you realize he might easily break your kneecaps for jaywalking or speeding if his it fits into his current interpretation of morality is black or white system.

>write character with a concrete set of morals and the strength to adhere to them no matter what
>be surprised when he becomes the most popular
>"oh shit my retarded liberal ass needs to correct the record"
>"HE WUZ FASCIST AND SHIEEET"

Why are cucks like him so scared of people who stick to their guns

They were both wrong. Adrian was a fucking lunatic for what he did, but once it's done, the pragmatic thing is to not risk world peace.

The one thing I could sympathize with is that the lie and the act are so beyond imagination that it would be hard to not scream your lungs out about it. I think that's why Rorschach wanted to die. There was no good answer and he wouldn't be able to live with himself either way.

>Bombing Civilians in Japan is ok if is for the greater good.
>Bombing Civilians in Jew York is not.
Rorschach was an hypocrite

Rorschach's only issue with Veidt's plan is that it's based on telling a lie and murdering people in secret to cover it up. He would 100% behind it if Veidt had just bombed New York in order to stop WW3, as he thinks Truman did nothing wrong bombing Japan twice with a nuke. He's entirely about might makes right.

So, this is why Rorschach is a tiny ugly hobo that stinks, Alan Moore thought that write him that way would make him unappealing.

I still say that if Rorschach could have stopped Truman, he would have.

He literally wrote that it was a good thing.

He can say that because he wasn’t there, even he knows he couldn’t have changed shit.

No, it was deliberately put there to show that he is an hypocrite, same how he defended the comedian despite trying to rape and abuse Silk Specter. If it doesn't fits his narrative he just ignores it.

I think you really hit the nail in the head.

He meant in comparison to superhero comics of the time and before hand.

I always saw the ending as Rorschach committing suicide by cop. He wasn't actually standing for the things he was saying but using them as an excuse to finally end it.

The snapshot posted above and the transcription on the site you posted have a couple of minuscule differences, but they make all the difference, meaning I found the snapshot completely unattributable to Moore but the other more conceivable. Still, I stand corrected and I shall go fuck myself.

>I don't even remember this. I saw him as a libertarian-anarchist type.
He's basically a "conservative" (used here in the generic, as someone trying to maintain a status quo, and NOT as any sort of association with any sort of political partisanship) True Believer who has a set of balls. He is also, of course, mentally ill with violent tendencies but when discussing vigilantes that's generally the rule rather than the exception.

Based. As a true /pol/ack I can't imagine what it would be like had I lacked these things.

Rorschach wasn't a hero, he was just righteous to a fault.

>Alan Moore, the master of subtlety

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It's for research.

I am a writer in need of a digital artist to bring my characters and stories to life.

I mean the dude is named Rorschach.

I love comic book subtlety though

Based Moore btfo'ing smelly capetards once again.

There are implications that he dislikes or is discomforted by women, but he also saves a woman from a rapist iirc and goes light on a prostitute that actually attempts to shield her kids from her poor lifestyle, unlike his own mother.

Problem?

>be libertarian
>realize that it's mostly white people who care about liberty
>wtf I'm a white nationalist now
Wouldn't say it's the same as fascism, but that's how it happens.

watchmencomicmovie.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1358
It's from a YouTube video that apparently no longer exists.

>screaming like an abbatoir full of retarded children

Actually video games are the gateway to fascism.

Heroism is a term we use for a category of non-pragmatic conduct, user.

Thanks to the original book, people think he's a fascist

>implying this is bad

He held on to his integrity? He stood by his beliefs? So those things are an acceptable excuse for his actions? What kind of mental gymnastics is that?

absolutely based. Bless this beautiful man.

>accidentally make the "evil crazy character" the most likable, upstanding and correct
Was Rorschach the original Red Skull?

>little gay
You mean actually trusts him to a degree? Because Nite Owl is the only other guy who's willing to champion for good, not greater good.

What were his actions? He went after the worst of the scum of humanity?

I know many hate the movie and such but desu he was the same in the comics. It’s just different now because we live in the pussy generation where everyone get offended just because they exist

>facist
he's just an autist, ffs

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>All this TDKR hate
Somebody get these hotheads outta here, TDKR is probably the biggest and best film in this decade even if it's just because of the plane scene

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Autism corrolates to Fascism though :^)
t. autistic natsoc

Is always right twice a day.

>Moore
>He can go sit with J.K. Rowling

Considering the blistering hate he's shown for Harry Potter in his LXG comics I don't see that happening...

Yeah, why exactly did he have a problem with them?

>h-h-h-h-h-he's actually pretty redpilled when you think about it
>oh god please don't cancel your subscription to HBO after GoT is over pls

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Fucking this. Is like the retards didn’t read it.

Based Moore

He's a hypocrite who hates everything except himself.

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I think Moore just became a grouch and decided to hate anything popular with 'the kids'. I'm not a Potter fan by any length but he really seems to hate Potter and James Bond on a personal level.

tbf James Bond is a chauvinist and a rapist in both the books and the movies and was conceived by Ian Fleming as a reaction to what he considered Britain becoming a wimp of a country (which tbf is also true)

>his actions
he wasn't the one who killed millions.
he beat up and killed bad guys.

>meme parroting
You have never actually read Fleming have you?

>overwhelming complexities of modern existence
life aint complicated, be good, do good, and when appropriate have fun.
That, despite all the flaws in MCU is something they understood, they didn't write edgy characters who learn "sometimes killing a millon people is justified," but instead that self-sacrifice and dedication can save millions. That's why for all the praise his works receive from idiots even the most mediocre works about these children's characters, including one's he's written have had more cultural resonance than stories like Watchmen
It's amazing how safe, progressive, and decent the world is when we're all apparently one bad day away from madness.

No, but I read the excerpts from Goldfinger where he rapes Pussy Galore and I'm aware of his general attitude from secondary sources (e.g. his hatred of tea and calling it responsible for the downfall of the British Empire which was a genuinely good thing in his opinion).

>It's amazing how safe, progressive, and decent the world is when we're all apparently one bad day away from madness.
Why are you using what a serial killer villain argued as though it's what his writer is arguing?
>life aint complicated, be good, do good, and when appropriate have fun.
Go volunteer at a hospital or something. You're disgustingly sheltered.
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>He just didn't account for a more cynical generation in more cynical times.
Or that his own comic would influence comics in that direction...

Waid's Doom is no standard, though.