Harley Quinn

Alright Yea Forums villian Harley or anti-hero Harley?

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I fail to see the difference.

Both are equally terrible in the hands of edgy writers.

In what way was she ever an anti-hero?

I will forever be grateful that they didn't pull that "muh reformed Harley" shittery in the Arkham games.

Her series now a days consists of her being neutral and occasionally helping Batman.

At her core Harley is a mentally disturbed person who was coerced into evil by a highly manipulative psychopath, so it's not so much that I mind her being an anti-hero as it is that I dislike the execution. In my mind, Anti-Hero Harley should have an extremely warped and inane sense of justice which hinges on both her insanity and her tendency to fixate on people as support systems and idol figures. She should only ever do good because the person she's obsessed with wants to do good, and she should almost unfailingly fall back into evil whenever the Joker dangles his approval over her nose. Her methods should earn disapproval from any conventional heroes, also. That said, I'd also be open to her gradual development into a more heroic character overall if it was done in a believable and narratively significant way, and if she remained a complete screwball.

In short, anti-hero or villain, it's just the writing that matters in my books.

Literally just reform the Gotham City Sirens and you're fucking perfect with the Harley, Ivy, and Catwoman. Great chemistry between all three of them, open to either villainous or heroic acts depending on the situation, and no need for this bullshit where Harley is somehow acing Superheroes who would otherwise stop her no problem. Relegated to street level shenanigans and when shit gets the fan, Ivy acts as the powerhouse.
Why the fuck did they even can that team?

i'm so fucking tired of harley these days 2bh

Take Catwoman out. She's a non-character and not needed.

Villain. Always villain. Let's not pretend Harley is a good person. Please for the love of god, just have her hook back up with The Joker. Her entire madness was centered around the fucking guy! There is no hero or anti-hero Harley because that should just be fucking Dr. Harleen Quinzel.

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Everyone occasional helps Batman, even the Joker and Lex Luthor.
>she's neutral
You misspelled amoral.

no

You need a spectrum of good to bad for the Sirens.
>Catwoman is the noblest of them
>Ivy is the most apathetic
>Harley is the one who ultimately determines how the Sirens swing

Yes. She has no chemistry with Harley and Ivy. That's why she's rarely paired with them. She just makes things awkward.

i like right more :)

no

I see you Harlivy scum, go back to your fucking tumblr headcanons.

Again, there's no need for Catwoman. You can easily have your whole Daria thing with just Harley and Ivy.

>Selina! Commander and the leader!
>Harley! She is the joy and the laughter!
>Ivy! She's the toughest fighter!

I fucking hate that pairing and how it the characters have been portrayed as of late. I just don't see the point of Catwoman in the group. Not even the DCAU cartoons paid any attention to Catwoman when it came to portraying Harley and Ivy as a comic duo.

Catwoman only exists to drag down Batman. That's it. She has no place everywhere else.

Best Harley coming true

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>I just don't see the point of Catwoman in the group
To round out the team dynamic, duh?

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hero. but i don't like the redesign

>clips through downed cop
>floating weapon
>best

Not liking a character doesn't mean she's a non-character or a bad one. It's just that you personally dislike her, and other people may or may not share that opinion. Okay, user?

See every comic where writers tried to remind people Catwoman exists. The comedic timing doesn't flow. You only need Poison Ivy as the straight woman and Harley Quinn as a the oddball.
This all started with Paul Dini pretty much copying the whole Brain and the Pink dynamic. Ivy being the deadpan and serious schemer, and Harley being the annoying and dumb troublemaker. Harley then would always mess things up and ruin Ivy's plans, setting Ivy on Harley. That was the fun.
Catwoman there is just a plus one with no purpose that can't really interact in any meaningful way with the other two because you can't sully Catwoman character otherwise Batman won't be able to be paired with her anymore and thus Catwoman won't have any reason to exist as a consequence. So to play safe she's just there.

She's a non-character outside of the BatCat romance.

Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true

What's her character then? What's her purpose? Playing a poor woman's version of Robin Hood? She can't even be a proper criminal anymore. Or even selfish.

What's the point in wasting my time labouring over this issue when all that's going to happen is that you're going to say "no you're wrong" and continue to stand by your opinion that she's a non-character. Why can't this just be your opinion?

>See every comic where writers tried to remind people Catwoman exists.
Oh yeah, Catwoman certainly isn't one of the most recognizable character from Batman.

>What's her character then?
Sexy cat burglar with redeemable traits.
>What's her purpose?
To be a sexy thief.

Why isn't she used as much then outside of Batcat stories? She hardly appear in the Harley Quinn ongoing, Birds of Prey ongoing, Batgirl ongoing, and so on. It's just Batman and Detective Comics as Batman on-and-off love interest whenever they need a damsel in distress to move the plot forward or a convenient "thief" that could have been performed by any other character.

See, no character. If her only role is to be "sexy" and be a "thief" then she's not needed among Ivy and Harley, since they're already eye-candy and are already all about stealing stuffs.

>Why isn't she used as much then outside of Batcat stories?
Because she has no superfriends, no motivation to piss off other supers, and no longstanding grudges with major villains.

Seems like she has nothing to really define her or make her pop out as a character, other than being Batman's main squeeze. That's exactly what i have been saying the whole thread.

You really gonna point to the character who got her ongoing before Harley quinn?

>See, no character
Oh so you can't actually read.

The ongoing that was pushed by the Batman Returns movie and rested sorely on the art to sell itself?

>two idiots who don't read comics agree with each other

She was shitty in the Arkham games even without that, though. She had no charm and every time she was onscreen was basically "muh Joker".

Oh, yeah. Sexy thief. It's not like Ivy and Harley aren't sexy and steal stuffs.

Arkham Harley was a shitty character.

So you're saying she's a popular comic outside of comics.

Harley and Ivy are not defined as thieves.

She's popular as Batman's love interest. I will never dispute that fact. But outside of that she has not much going for her.

>Harley will never take a dump on your chest
She's a villain who people wanna make into a battered wife.

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Catwoman is a burglar, her character is centered around the art of stealing.

But they still steal stuffs, no? Like... pretty much every Batman's rogue.
And that makes her boring, when every other Batman villain does the same and have another gimmick to make them stand out outside of just stealing stuff.

She's popular as her own character, that's why she gets her own title.

Her gimmick is her feline grace.

The problem with that is the title sell terribly as is often mediocre as fuck with every writer trying to reinvent her within their run. The best you can showcase is Brubaker and that's Brubaker being Brubaker. DC was never able to recapture that quality.

Her gimmick is getting to fuck Batman, actually.

No actually her gimmick is cats.

>her title sells horribly
Her title sells better than Nightwing and Red Hood.

You know very well the current title is being kept on life support by shippers waiting to see if she and Batman will get married. The moment Tom King stop hinting at it, it will drop like an anvil.

Tragic idiot villain harley.

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Anti-Hero Harley for me thanks. I actually enjoy her being DC Deadpool, anything less would be sad given how popular she is.

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>I know my arguments have been torn to shreds but I'm still mad that Catwoman knocked out the flash.

It's just a fact.

/ss/ Harley is best

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>after shaving
His pores were open and he got bacteria stuck in them

Harley definitely makes him call her mommy.

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>blushes

>The virgin taboo Quinn vs The chad fendom hookup

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If she'd go back to her old costume I'd be fine with her as DC's Deadpool too. Hell, they can even just modernise it like pic related.

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Anti-hero Harley with the appearance and moxy of the classic Harley.

You guys really don't get tired of seeing the same costume all the time?

It's not the costume so much as the bleached white skin and danger hair. I'm not opposed to a new costume design, but the New 52 look is too Hot Topic for my taste.

If it's not broken, don't fix it.
New costumes are fine from time to time, but there's a reason why the best character designs always return to their roots.
And Harley's original costume is one of those costumes.

I know right? The new designs aren’t that bad I don’t know why people actually complain about them.

Not when the alternative is garbage

What's the point of change if it isn't either an improvement or a lateral transition?

Except It wasn't that good.

It was a pretty great look

>but the New 52 look is too Hot Topic for my taste

It was done on purpose to make it easier for fans to cosplay her.

She actually raped him. What a slut.

>modernize
>remove everything
I fucking hate this trend.

Just look at his reaction after she did it. Those are the eyes of a victim. Truly horrific.

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Eh. Bruce Timm just covered it up.

Harley×Dick= Unnecessary and gross pairing ever

Cope harder ivyfag

Villain of course and you can say whatever you want about the jester costume but that Harley on the left looks stupid

The Arkham games were great and that aspect was a good idea, Harley had to be a villain and she had to be with Joker, she wasn't even the abuse survivor and I'm grateful because of that

Shut the fuck up turboautist, Antihero Harley is better in every way

Your idea of charm must be farts in the Batmobile

Sure, "Men are bad blah blah blah"

I hate this empty stupid Harley

some of her best friends are men

The hooker

Im against Harlivy too. Both Harley and Ivy tried to kill each other too. Harley doesnt deserved Dick Grayson. Dick hooking up with Harley is character assassination. Im a Dickkory shipper.

who hasn't tried to kill each other at least once in any cape ship?

She sleeps with several guys but the rest of the time she's fighting against bad men cause men are bad

Shes called Whorely Quinn for that

that many men are bad doesn't mean all men are bad, a point Harley herself makes

The thing is still that "OH they're men" is often the point. Humphries is a little better but still a bad comic, idiot feminazi and they forget Harley isn't a teenager she's at least 30

Not true

I've met 30yo's that still act like that

>Harley isn't a teenager she's at least 30

Huh, I always thought Harley's was mid-20, like 24-26 years old

26 is not a teenager and Harley was normally 28 while she was with Joker

>wanted a comfy harley thread
>turboautists ruin it by arguing about catwoman

This is why no one likes you

So that would make Ivy late 30s?

Ivy was 28-30, but more probably 30 it has always been like that, Bruce wasn't a Teen Titan and Ivy was originally a love interest for Bruce (he had many). Ivy used to be in love with Bruce, once in the 90's Ivy saved Gotham in exchange for a kiss and Bruce accepted the deal, she was similar to Catwoman but with plants

>
That doesn't make sense. Ivy and Harley can't be of the same age because Ivy has a few years if experience ahead of her when it comes to being a villain. Harley was still Harleen when Ivy was terrorising Gotham as a well-known name. If Harley is 28 then Ivy should be around 33-36

your 20's are just season two of being a teenager anyway.

Villain.

All those are blackheads?
Looks shopped.

Cant rape the willing

Poison ivy became poison ivy pretty early, she started college early because she is a bona fide genius.