Villains being kind

keeping him safe is the best we can do. Change is risk, do you recall that reboot in which he was a diamond theif stalker with Nora as his target?

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That´s kind of cringy

I remember the Nu52 version by Snyder it was awful

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At least fucking help Nora, there's enough magic and technology in the DC Universe to bullshit some kind of cure and I'm sure he'd willingly give his life for hers

I think right before Infinite Crisis Freeze threw her into the Lazarus Pit... and it did not end well

I'm so glad this was retconned. Who thought it was a good idea?

Wasnt there a story were he protected people in the sewers?

The Rev is a minor if powerful Punisher villain with healing power who leads a cult if you don't know who that is.

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why is he mr. freeze and not dr. freeze
that's dumb

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Pretty sure there are several where he takes dudes in and basically watches out for them

the same kind of people who thought it was good to have spiderman make a deal with fucking satan to bring back aunt may and end his marriage.

Man of FEELS.
DC never redeems the villains that deserve it, they always try to redeem based on popularity with terrible results.

it is, kinda. Very hamfisted, like

>"Did you know I have the record in this very specific kind of show of affection? It's because I don't want them."
>Next panel: "You broke your record in this very specific kind of show of affection! It's because you don't want them!"
>"I don't want them."

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Poor Victor....

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I see what you did there

It was a test. Or atleast that's my interpretation on why he is so glad.

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Who?

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He's been doing that since the 90s, I think.

Kid Miracleman, he did show kindness even only for a false moment.

It's realistic. There are real life examples of the same thing. Chicks dig guys who will murder for them.

It works on the level of making him an actual antagonist. Otherwise you're just recycling Heart of Ice over and over again for twenty years, which is what everyone did. And it is that great, admittedly, but after the thirtieth time you replay it you should either just cure Nora or kill him off, you've taken it as far as it can go. In the middle of another pretty shit Arkham game plot Arkham Knight did get that much right at least, Nora herself begging Victor to just let her die peacefully with him rather than go back into the ice.

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The only good thing about Gotham Underground was it's depiction of Penguin

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Croc is generally an okay guy as long as you treat him like a person.

I thought they retconned Mr Freeze into being an actual insane psychopath whose "wife" was a woman who didn't even know him? Or did they retcon that retcon?

There were a few of those.
The best ones that come to mind are "Requiem for a Killer" and the Forever Evil one-shot.
These two, next to the original Gerry Conway saga are what I'd easily call the best Croc stories ever written.

Croc as King of the Sewers and Gotham's homeless is a really great idea with a lot of potential not just for developing him as a character but also exploring the underbelly of Gotham's structure.
Which is why you can guess that it's not used often and most writers delegate Croc to dumb muscle.

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what was this from? i wanna see how it ends

>I think right before Infinite Crisis Freeze threw her into the Lazarus Pit... and it did not end well

Fuck you for reminding that story exists, literally the worst thing ever.

Pretty much these, Croc isl iterallu just a deformed, alone in the world with the few people who threat him like a man mostly death, Asylum joker story is perfect for this, even if don't like their take on croc as literal crocodile

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I wish there were more interractions with the Bat rogues. Team ups or conversations in Arkham

Snyder really did suck ass.

FRANKD

THOT DESTROYED

Because doctors swear an oath to do no harm. And Freeze considers himself an honorable man.

It's from Gotham Underground. It's basically a story about Intergang trying to take control of Gotham with the Batfamily and Penguin caught in the middle.
After that sequence, Intergang sends goons to kill Oswald, but Batman saves him in time, and then this happens.

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Penguin is probably the most varied batman villain. In modern times the joker is written as a chaos god wannabe and kille croc as a misunderstood brute, but writers can't seem to decide if penguin is a rich scumbag gangster or a classy mafioso type dude.

>frank
Dummy

Unpopular opinion, but I don't HATE the idea. Much prefer classic of course but if DC had their own ultimate universe or whatever it would be something to change him from the main version.

Did Batman really try to intimidate the Penguin? Cobblepot is probably one of the most desensitized of all the Rogues to superhero and supervillain shenanigans. That “You work for me now” shit wouldn’t bother him.

>Years later, Victor had written his doctoral thesis on the first case of cryogenic stasis; that of Nora Fields. He became so obsessed with her that he believed he was in love with her, and that they were married.
dc.fandom.com/wiki/Victor_Fries_(Prime_Earth)
unfortunately.

umar compared to her brother seems pretty chill

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I like the idea of him being friendly and nice to his friends, good business associates, and employees, but an absolute monster to the people he sees as having crossed him.
Him balancing these two parts are always interesting.

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I think most other Batman villains are written way more inconsistently than Oswald.
Penguin gets a bad rep and is too often written poorly, but compared to characters like Mad Hatter or Poison Ivy or Scarecrow (who I do love) he's not that inconsistent.

>writers can't seem to decide if penguin is a rich scumbag gangster or a classy mafioso type dude
Oswald is classy and with pretensions of refinement, and he is a ruthless, nasty scumbag. Writers seem to think it's either one way or the other but he's been both since day one (his first story has him, in the same page, enjoying fine champaigne with his goons, throwing acid at one of them when trying to hit Batman & Robin, and then running with the jewels giggling at his own success)
Hell, I wish writers remembered that he's supposed to be a classy guy with a flair for theatrics and style, because he's too often reduced to just a punchable monster.

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What the hell happened to Mach X tho? he died I guess.

>Hell, I wish writers remembered that he's supposed to be a classy guy with a flair for theatrics and style, because he's too often reduced to just a punchable monster.
Man you just described half the popular batman rogues. Writers are lazy and want to push some deeper meaning, some retarded metaphor for chaos and evil and all that jazz when in reality its just a bunch of bankrobbers and muggers in funny outfits.

I agree that recycling Heart of Ice over and over again is bad, and really, it's never been recycled well either. No Batman work has ever managed to adapt the Dini origin without mangling it, and that includes the graphic novel Dini himself wrote to bring the Nora origin into the comics continuity. In fact, before the Arkham games, the closest anyone ever came to recapturing Heart of Ice well was fucking Batman and Robin, if only because they had the decency to let Freeze sort of reform by the end.

I have to disagree hard on
>It works on the level of making him an actual antagonist.
Because the Snyder origin was just the latest in a bunch of terrible changes to the show Freeze. First you had Dini making him accidentally kill Nora and blaming Batman, then you had Gabrych reviving Nora as a fire-spewing demon who hates Victor with every fiber of her being (an idea that could have worked with even a little bit of nuance), and then Morrison made it so that Victor has a habit of delusionally approaching streetwalkers thinking they’re Nora. Snyder was just following their trend when he reduced Mr.Freeze to Mad Hatter with a freeze gun. It doesn't make him "an actual antagonist", it makes him a fucking terrible villain pretending to be a great character.

This is why, of all things, I actually don't take issue with the way The Batman handled Mr.Freeze. Because they made him an unapologetic bastard with cool powers from the get-go, instead of dressing him up in the skin of the TAS Freeze. It made it easier to treat this Freeze as his own character, instead of another failed attempt at capturing the Heart of Ice magic.
If they are gonna keep Mr.Freeze a one-note sadist, they should just ditch Nora alltogether.

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I can relate.

At least it was a quick death

Jokers more of the absolute opposite of Batman. Batman is order to the extreme and Joker is (nowadays at least) chaos to the extreme. Or something

As related to the thread, Study Hall is easily one of the, if not the, best Scarecrow stories ever printed and instead of spoiling it I'm just gonna storytime it since it's brief

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I think of the Penguin as the Proposition Joe of Gotham City. He runs a legitimate business that he does his dirty dealings out of. For the most part, he does whatever he can to keep his hands clean, but isn't ever above putting you in the ground. Constantly out for himself, but knowing that it's best to foster a community (at least partially because then he'll be better protected). At the end of the day, he wants to believe that he isn't about that life, when in reality, he absolutely is and wouldn't have it any other way.

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Fuck yeah. Almost Got Him was my favorite tas episode.

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crane did nothing wrong, though

Crane wouldn't be able to help himself after that, though. He's legitimately sick and needs help, without that, and with him already putting the costume and playing his games again, it would only be a matter of time (probably less than a month) before he started to prey on the innocent. It's like being a recovered smoker, you can't ever have 'just one' cigarette when you're an addict.

>Scarecrow punish a rapist with fear toxin
Why is this so good?

Because rapists are meanies who deserve it

The Joker's Aslyum comic with him had him doing something similar but to a bunch of cliquey bullies, iirc

>that time Croc hunted down and murdered a bunch of corrupt police dudes because they killed a cop who was nice to him as a kid
He might be an unstable cannibal, but he can be a pretty based bro as well

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And Bats, for the most part, leaves Jones to his devices. I don’t think they ever really team up, but Croc tends to get the blind eye, which I’ve always been okay with.

On the subject of Killer Croc I'm going to storytime "Requiem for a Killer" because it deserves to be read in full.

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I'm not sure Galactus is the sort of villain the OP was going for, but alright.

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Also, for context, the reason Croc's nightmares involve Batman torturing him is because sometime prior, Rick Veitch had Batman cripple Croc after he killed 30 people with an incendiary device, which was the same story that began the depressing trend of Croc being written as an unintelligent beast.

Thank god Alan Grant at least saw it fit to restore Croc's dignity, for how little it lasted at least

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[flamethrower intensifies]

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End

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Who's the hunchback?

Freeze is too good for this world.

I remember back in the 90s, there were a TON of fix fics for him.

Because he's both.

As someone who has dealt with actual organized criminals (not Italian), the classy thing is an act. A lot of them don't understand what it means to actually have class and instead just ape their aesthetic superiors without comprehension. And yet, in every single one of their words, movements, and actions; the lumbering brute who chose to inflict violence on people is bubbling underneath the surface. Can you see a stereotypical classy mafia man hitting his wife, or watching child porn, or racing their cars with no muffler, or abusing his prostitutes? And yet, those were some of the things I've seen.

To bring it back the Penguin - he's a bitter hateful man who uses violence as a tool (although yes, admittedly far more elegantly than the average rogue in Gotham) but pretends to have class so that he can justify it to himself that despite the fact that he does violence for a living, he's better than the "commoners" that surround him. Obviously, he's deluding himself, but so it goes.

I found it hilarious.
So is your post.

I'm honestly too tired to get what he's saying

didn't he brutally murder and anally violate several people right before this because he didn't like their music

lol

is that meebeeoos

He is still my favourite and I hated what they did to him in the n52.
Make him a redeemed man... I mean there are enough ice themed villains. He deserves it more than Killer Frost!

Harold, a feral retard that Batman kept around to work on his vehicles. Turned out he was a spy for hush all along

Harold Allnut.
He's a mute hunchback who The Penguin hired for the storyline The Penguin Affair and later became the Batmobile's mechanic. He is essentially the answer to the question "who pumps the Batmobile's tires".
He was forgotten for a long time only to be killed later in Hush.
Last time he showed up was in All Star Batman.

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He was going to murder that dude before Batman stopped him. Crane's motives were sympathetic, and it says a lot about him that for all of his twisted nature he still has the capacity to genuinely care about someone else like that. But what he did was wrong, and what he was going to do was worse, and it establishes that Crane is a bomb waiting for a trigger.

THIS TIME Crane was seeking something you could describe as justice. The next time he could torture a neighbor to death because their dog keeps barking. You can't assume everything that sets him off will be fair play.

>A lot of them don't understand what it means to actually have class and instead just ape their aesthetic superiors without comprehension
This is very much true to Penguin (or was at least) since that's the whole idea behind his outfit and bourgeous pretensions and manner of speaking. He wants to be the swashbuckling rogue who quotes Shakespeare and belongs in high society looking down on all others, but he's a waddling, awkward manchild full of hate and greed who can never truly transcend his appearence no matter how hard he tries.

>pretends to have class so that he can justify it to himself that despite the fact that he does violence for a living, he's better than the "commoners" that surround him
I don't think Penguin ever really cared about justifying to himself what he does, if anything several appearences show him as someone who is not only a black-hearted bumbershooting outlaw, but someone who takes far too much pride in his deeds as one. Penguin relishes in villainy, he doesn't need to tell himself he's more than a common criminal, he knows he is and he's damn proud of it. He has no need for justifications.

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Part of what makes Galactus a great villain is that he isn’t evil. He is an enemy like an earthquake or hurricane. You can’t stop it, you can only endure it, and there is no malice.

Crane’s the sort of patient that would eventually get shit like day-passes and maybe a strictly supervised job outside of Arkham, but he would never get a permanent release for just the sort of shit you said. He can’t help himself. He’s a ticking time bomb.

>slice of life Arkham sitcom never ever

Thanks for the storytime user. Love me some Scarecrow.

Batman’s rogues rarely get along, and when they do, it’s the sane ones that team up. Arkham inmates rarely trust each other, which is why mass breakouts happen from outside forces and not from like, Tech teaming up with the Riddler or anything like that. Much more likely, they prey on one another.

>I suppose Crane was trying to help Molly in the only ways he knew how, with fear, intimidation and force
Said with absolutely no self awareness at all, huh Batman?

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I haven't a clue. I just got it off of Yea Forums.

Isn't there an Arkham animated show coming out featuring Poison Ivy and Harley?

Ya know you’ve got a point there

Poor Croc, he’s just a sad scaly boi

Source?

Yeah, he's a sentient force of nature. You can't really hate him, since he literally must do it to create the new universe.

>but compared to characters like Mad Hatter or Poison Ivy
>Poison Ivy
I miss when she was one of Batman's femme fatales. These days she's just Harley's butt buddy.

Man, Batman can really lift.

Squats, man. It's all in the thighs.

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I've seen this before. What had Tetch done?

I think it was a comic rehash of Perchance to Dream when he puts Batman in the perfect dream life.

Oh yeah, I remember that episode. Tetch was Batman in the dream. Had me convinced for the longest time that you couldn't read in dreams.

I'll admit, I've never read a modern (last 20 years or so) story with the Riddler so I have no idea how in character this is for him in the grand scheme of his character, but I loved the idea of a villain trying to maintain that Saturday morning cartoon feeling with their heists and schemes

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Ay Tony what the fuck did I tell ya bout' posting on this site, keep it up and you'll be typing with a goddamn straw

Villain redemptions never stick and are only used as a gimmick to make sales. If DC had half a mind when bringing BTAS Mr. Freeze to the main comics that would have had Nora cured and keep him as a background scientist dude that pops up every now and again to help Batman with cryogenic related shit.

'Cuda is a capricious motherfucker that will slit a guy's throat with a genuinely warm smile.

Sometimes I think I'm the only person who feels this way. Heart of Ice was a damn good story but an absolute curse on the character

You can't, you just sort of subconsciously know what the facsimile of words are supposed to mean like you would know a bunch of bullshit following crazy dream-logic.

He just said he wants the same thing so it works for him either way, plus he sees it as an opportunity. Also Penguin? Desensitized? Tell it to that poor waiter. All he did was laugh at a joke, dammit.

You can, though of course given your brain supplies the information anyway the distinction really is moot. Still the whole "cant read in your sleep" is like that old chestnut that people don't dream in color. Supposedly that has to do more with people who grew up during black and white TV/movie eras. Still I like to listen to a lot of old time radio and there's actually several episodes of The Shadow where Cranston only took up a case because the person talked about dreaming in color. As he tells Margo Lane people don't dream in color "unless fed one of the narco synthetics." Maybe the government is spiking our water with goof juice to keep us docile, right?

Shame that's complete bullshit.
Ask Gary Plauche, who shot the pedo who molested his son. In interviews he said he'd do it again if he had the chance.
Probably slept like a baby.

The irony is that until Heart of Ice he didn't really have a character, did he? He was just an ice themed dude who wanted cold hard cash. I mean that's hardly the worst villain ever, but there's not really much there to work with either.

>Villains being kind

My favorite.

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Thanks for teaching me a word today Penguin. Arteriosclerosis is a medical condition where the walls of arteries harden and lose their flexibility.

He's based on Archie Goodwin.

So where's Nero Wolfe?

Who is this quality villain who would actually be able to keep the loyalty of his minions?

I actually liked Forever Evil era Freeze where he had a completely twisted idea of love because he was a sociopath so when he escapes with everybody, he just goes and tracked his long lost dad that had abandoned him and his mother when he was little and then froze his dad and his new family so that they would always remain "perfect" and then Victor sat down and had a family dinner with them. Not only it moved him away from Nora, it also gave him an interesting psychological angle that could have been pursued more.

What's not to get? Freeze is the Arkham inmate who gets the most marriage proposals mailed in from crazy people but all he wants to do is cure his wife and wake her up from her coma.

It doesn't make sense for them to team up when as a sum they're a fractured reflection of Batman.

I wish Capcom went the Akuma taking care of a baby route in Street Fighter V. Also he's canonically friends with Elena and is a hero in Street Fighter vs Darkstalkers comics.

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That’s what I’m saying. Oswalt agreed with the idea of working with Batman. Not out of fear, out of survival and logic. If it wasn’t for that, Penguin would’ve told him to go fuck himself. Scare tactics don’t work on him.

Also, the waiter struck a nerve in his insecurities, which is different from a man dressed as a bat threatening to beat you up.

>and keep him as a background scientist dude that pops up every now and again to help Batman with cryogenic related shit.

So literally never use the character again, except when someone like Morrison or whatever wanted to use a fairly obscure now character for a brief moment. Batman doesn't need scientist support staff anymore. Batman isn't street level like that, hasn't been for over a decade at this point.

would that make Omar Red Hood?
and Marlo as Joker?..

Thanks. Good story.

Akuma is popular because he's an emotionless badass. Capcom would never put anything into their games that would imply otherwise. Consider any instance of him being a nice guy non-canoncial.

To be fair, Bruce Wayne does finance a lot of charities.

not a cape villain, but i liked this

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"Let not dwell up on that."

Fuck, that went to print....

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Gouki is, or was, one of the more interesting SF characters partially because he was the most powerful boss and yet not nearly as one-dimensionally evil as Bison. He had a unique kind of honor and integrity that made him even more twisted.

Unfortunately Akuma is just as one note and soulless as they come and Capcom has no interest in depicting him as anything else

TAS gave meaningful characterization to a lot of otherwise gimmicky characters.

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TAS actually took their characterization from another Ice-themed Batman villain, Cryonic Man. He was trying to save his wife while gathering organs needed for transplantation before Freeze.

Pre-TAS Freeze had some peculiarities in his characterization though. Most importantly, Batman 66, of all things, gave him a tragic backstory due to an experiment botched by Batman's interference, which later transitioned to the comics. Pre-Crisis Freeze eventually fell in love with a woman called Hildy. In order to slow her aging process, Freeze set out to recreate the accident that transformed him. Using wealthy people in Gotham as test subjects, Freeze experimented on them, but all the efforts resulted in failure and the victims were turned into frozen zombies, who followed Freeze's command.

This kinda reminds me of that Crane arc in Legends of the Dark Knight, in which Crane was kidnapping children for experimentation to develop the anti-fear serum, than giving them back to their families, obviously disturbed and unwell. When Batman found his hideout, Crane actually managed to beat and capture him, before Bats escaped botching up the fire system. This set the hideout on fire, with Batman managing to escape, while Scarecrow went down to get the girl he experimented on away from fire and told her to run. Then he moves to another hideout, checks out the news and it says "Batman saves the kidnapped kid from being burned by Scarecrow". That angers Crane and he goes back to the generic "gas the city with blimps" plot.

And Crane counseled the girl before he decided to go for the kidnapping.

Last 20 years we had a lot of interpretations of Riddler. From the one you pictured (used by Gaiman and Johns), to twisted fucking psychopath (King and Azarello), to Detective Riddler.

One of my dreams involved reading a poetry book in a big way, and the poems there resembled avant-garde poetry

>Freeze's Injustice intros are all him begging the other characters to help his wife
youtube.com/watch?v=qG6fug9r5J8

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i wonder what they'd do with some of the wacky characters that were introduced later. like music miester.

I really like this stlye of croc.
The two extremes of almost human and a walking crocodile are a lot more appealing to me than inbetween hulk croc and I can't really figure out why.

reformed Detective Riddler is best route for me, his ego and former villainy would make good offsets to tragic/noir detective stories.

Fun fact: the "classy mobster" stereotype was essentially invented by The Godfather. Mafiosis enjoyed the film and began aping the characters' external appearances in a case of life imitating art.

He went off with the bad guys.

Dancouga or Dancouga Nova. Forget which.

Kinda. It's these two starting a bar i believe

We can only dream. user.....

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>Mr. Freeze is literally a misunderstood badboy, and Penny Jones from highschool has a poster of him next to some school shooter on her wall.

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I miss when Atrocitus was interesting

Ive always wanted to read his shit, any recs?

The mental image of Killer Croc doing a commercial for A.A. is hilarious.

I feel like this is the best ending Freeze has ever gotten.

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Johns is really the only writer that’s been able to make the character work. I’d say, just read his Green Lanterns books and you’re pretty set.

>literally just Perchance to Dream

I always wondered why they did that story twice.

Remember when freeze was just some burglar/thugh and not a tragic villain?

When Ock tried to cure aids

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>that filename

Dammit, user.

Yes

youtube.com/watch?v=LCFVu_mVlbw

OP said villains, user.

why was he trying to cure it did his tentacles get infected with them?

>Unfortunately Akuma is just as one note and soulless as they come and Capcom has no interest in depicting him as anything else
One-note maybe, but I wouldn't call him soulless.
He's simply entirely dedicated to fighting, the same way Ryuu is.

Pretty sure him doing the occasional medial job for bus money/plane tickets is perfectly canon.

He's interested in worthy opponents, not just attack random people on the street.

Woman he was in love with had AIDS.

That was later revealed to have been Norman Osborn's doing.

I had no idea about the Season of Infamy DLC. Now I have to buy that fucking game again. If only it wasn't for the tank, I wouldn't be nearly as irritated as I am.

>Also he's canonically friends with Elena

Best part is when you notice that it is actually Akuma taking the selfie.

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>pet bunny named George
It's the little things.

Of course.

You were too good for this world, Mark

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Poor, crazy Hank Pym.

>man
>deserves something more than a woman
Sexist.

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Its not like Akuma is actually evil or anything, he wants to fight to the death with strong people, when they can't fight or back down he stops and accepts it and in his Tekken appearance he was trying to pay a debt he had with Kazumi by trying to kill Heihachi and Kazuya who are both pieces of shit

Batman 66 Freeze was literally a tragic villain by design.

>Heihachi

You try to sacrifice your son to a volcano ONE TIME...

I want a Batman arc where Bruce tries to help him cure Nora

At least he still has his ants.

Bats has tried to help Freeze plenty of times in the past, but something always goes wrong; usually, whatever’s wrong with her isn’t medically reversible and she cannot ever be made better. Victor should put her in deep freeze so the Legion can help her once they have the tech. Which is what he would do if his criminal activity actually was about her, and he wasn’t just using her as an excuse to exorcise his vengeance on the world.

It would make a great non-canon Elseworlds or something. Probably a low-tech setting where the villains are just actually crazy. I agree that it's a really bad story when canon though.

you think with zatanna or doc fate around that would be easy

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Zatanna doesn’t use her magic like that. Too many variables, too much can go wrong. She’s also prone to shortcuts, which she’s aware of, and which can backfire badly. Fate wouldn’t help like that either; it’s the natural order that Nora dies, just like anyone else would that was afflicted as she was.

I always theorised Freeze in The Batman originally stole diamonds to pay Nora's hospital bills but after she died he kept on stealing them because he got caught up in the greed of having them

>Can you see a stereotypical classy mafia man hitting his wife, or watching child porn, or racing their cars with no muffler, or abusing his prostitutes
Yes, Yes, No (Italian mobsters don't street race period), and Yes.

I also am skeptical of your credentials here.

The idea of the classy mobster is so fucking weird. Like, have the people that believe this shit even seen the movies they’re accepting as ‘true to life?’ In every single one of them, these mobsters are just as violent, just as cruel and just as venial as any other criminal.

I liked Freeze in Gotham Central. I assumed Nora had died and it just completely broke him so he turned into this monster that hated other people being happy because it reminded him of what he had lost.

With that said, I also really liked his one panel toward the end of the series where he just says "I'll told you the same thing I told HIM, don't be ridiculous" even though it's pretty much the opposite of how he appeared in the first story arc.

On an unrelated note; does anyone have the Rhino page from Origin of the Species?

While technically true, 'mobsters' are generally less violent in public (I wouldn't know about their private lives). Last summer there was an incident where a mobster's cousin and his... fiance or something got gunned down in their vehicle. That same summer there were at least two incidents of nogs opening fire on each other during broad daylight in crowded areas (one was next to an outdoor pool + playground; the other was just a parking area). Mobsters generally don't go for big public altercations, not because they are nicer, but because it's deemed a bad move. I don't know for sure but would assume it's because the cops can turn a blind eye to criminals executing each other in private, but cannot do so toward brazen daylight gunfights.

99% of all gansters and gangstas are still scum though.

In the most recent retelling, they just said Gobby infected her with a "deadly blood virus".

> all the frostbite necrosis
he really didn't have the time left for anything, but I am so glad Nora got for once an active role despite "burning demon woman".

>I liked Freeze in Gotham Central. I assumed Nora had died and it just completely broke him so he turned into this monster that hated other people being happy because it reminded him of what he had lost.

That’s what I always loved about Freeze’s last episode in the Animated Series. Nora is finally well again, and has moved on with her life without him. And so, without the only thing that made him happy, he resolves to destroy the happiness of the most people he can before he kills himself.

>he is completely unaware of the 1920's and 1930's gangsters and their public popularity
The Godfather was just a hollywoodized version of the Al Capone saga. Al Capone actually opened soup kitchens during the depression to feed poor people. Every organized criminal since has tried to be Al Capone, but ends up being more Tony Soprano.

Emperor Muge Zolbados from Dancouga: Requiem for Victims... I think.

>t. Cracked.com reader

Read ANY Golden Age comic, from Batman, to The Spirit, to Crime Does Not Pay. They all emphasize that gangsters should not be admired for their classiness, fancy clothes and occasional good deeds for the poor.

And this isn't even getting into movies like the 1932 Scarface, which were picketed by churches for making mobsters look cool or like Robin Hood figures.

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>That last panel
Fuck man this is some kino.

Even fucking Escobar tried that shit in real life. They called him the Robin Hood of Medellin. He would go through the streets, handing out bunches of money just at random, in the (very poor) areas that he operated in.

Funny enough, people are less inclined to inform on you if they’re given thousands of dollars, than if they’re in fear for their lives.

God I still remember the edit, this will never be a "clean" image to me

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Gordon, no!

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Have Batman team up with Crane and Freeze to beef up Arkham then. Crane treats the patients and does Oracle/Hannibal style rundowns on new villains and freeze handles security, storage and post fight cleanup. Throw in Riddler as the street level thug investigator like Matchsticks Malone. Parole from Arkham involves service

I personally think an antagonist being horrified over actually killing someone or seriously injuring them, or their supposed allies doing the same, to be one of the best cliches ever.

>having the inmates LITERALLY running the asylum
I wonder how that could possibly go wrong?

>can you make me a pony?
>it will make the twilight sparkle
never did liked the WB fighters

Any more wrong than usual?

>So literally never use the character again
Where the fuck else is he gonna go? You can't have him remain a sympathetic villain yet reoccurring with the Heart of Ice backstory and have him remain the same, it's just not possible. Hell, they even tried to push the character past that in the show when they made him a head in a jar but even that had it's fair share of problems. Mr. Freeze is a one-note character and the more you try to use him the more obvious it becomes. He's literally been coasting on one good story all these years.

I kind wanted to play Injustice 2 because of Hellboy but I don't like NetherRealm's gameplay

Freeze's actor often sounds like he's struggling to put the emphasis on the right words in a sentence
So do Powergirl's and Supergirl's ones
Catwoman is a bitch
Flash sounds unenthusiastic
John is based
>sad LITTLE MAN
Brainiac sounds like he's about to cry

This dumbs down his character significantly.

>Man, what were we thinking

Probably that Lone Wolf & Cub is the best thing ever, and it is.

I like how Scarecrow's VA sounds like Gary Oldman in Hannibal.

The best VA he ever had was in the Arkham games. I would love to see Cillian Murphy in the roll again, but give him a scythe and an unhinged laugh! Let him rant and rave about how the delicious scent of fear for a bit.

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It comes from the origins of the italian mob. The italian mafia basically grew out of a culture where fudalism ended but the need for it in their culture did not. The people in the outlying regions were used to going to an authority figure to pass judgements for their disputes and protect them from bandits or whatever, and the new government was weak and inefficient. Some places would only have the authorities visit as often as once a month to pick up prisoners to take them away for trial.

So you ended up with a bunch of guys that, for one reason or another, ended up being the defacto 'Lord' of their area: the one everyone came to with their problems. Because the people knew how that system worked, and democracy was at best a theory to them. So you had this power and authority structure that grew up in the shadow of the legal, official government.

So at its heart, whether or not it was ever true in practice, the IDEA of the mafioso was built around them being a respected individual at the head of the community. Thats where the idea of mafia guys being 'classy' came from, when filtered through american culture by italian immigrants.

>Funny enough, people are less inclined to inform on you if they’re given thousands of dollars, than if they’re in fear for their lives.

It is always, ALWAYS, better to be loved or respected than it is to be feared. Fear is just cheaper and easier. Any dumbfuck with a gun can get someone to cooperate out of fear.

But someone who only follows you out of fear will bolt the moment they think they can get away with it, either because you are looking the other way or because they think someone else can protect them from you. It invites competition and rivals to flip your base of support.

But if you get the people to love you, they will support you even when your back is turned.

And that’s why Escobar was able to do all the shit he did out in the open. He had the best defense possible: thousands of poor people that thought he was Jesus off the cross.

Twice. And also his grandson. And he also had a bastard he never took care of.

Thanks user.
I love moments like this.

didn't he lock Jinpachi in a basement or someshit to take over the Mishima Zaibatsu?
And get best lucha boi killed? I don't rember tekken 2 all that well

Well, you know what they say. If at first you don’t succeed sacrificing your bloodbline to a volcano...

Now of course, Machiavelli wasn't exactly wrong: if the people just love you, they'll also easily abandon you out of convenience. The key is balancing fear and love, because respect is born from the mixture of both.

Tekken has a character tossing his children and grandchildren into volcanos, while Johnny Cage, his wife and their daughter save the world together in Mortal Kombat.

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I like some of the stories in mortal combat, but I do not enjoy the actual combat, or the UIs for that matter.
Smoke best boi

Younger Johnny's gonna fuck his daughter in the next game.

Keep the bloodline stronk.

I remember once reading about a blurb Capcom published during the Alpha 3 period about a policeman who went into the woods after a missing child despite protests of the demon living in them, and found the child perfectly fine at the entrance of the cave, and then a lightning bolt struck a tree, and before it fell on them, Akuma stopped it and told them to fuck off so he could continue his training. I can't even find evidence any more that this story exists and it's only mentioned in the current plot guide, but it always stuck with me.
And there was also that part in Ryu Final where he murders a bear in order to protect kid Ryu, only to later kill Gouken and even Ryu himself, although Ryu gets better

It's stuff like this that makes me wish Capcom actually gave a damn about trying to develop a story for Street Fighter, because I find a lot of it's characters just really fascinating.

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Street Fighter's got better lore than it should, but they've always had that split with, like. They've never been sure on whether to focus on Ryu's journey as a martial artist and the people he meets along the way or the fight against Shadaloo.

Both of them are good stories that could stand alone, but the fact that they're shoved into the same game makes it weaker the more time goes on because they keep needing to come up with excuses to bring everyone together.

First it was a tournament to prove Sagat was the best fighter in the world. Then it was just the second tournament, hosted by Bison to brainwash the greatest fighters in the world as soldiers, with half the fighters there trying to kill him and the other half taking it as a tournament. Then there was a prequel where half the people are there to fight Ryu and the other half were there to fight for/against Shadaloo. Then a sequel to the prequel with more of the same except Ryu turned evil. Then there's Street Fighter III which takes place in the future and has the Illuminati hosting a tournament for Reasons. Then IV takes place before III and has Shadaloo hunting Ryu to use him as the power source for a bomb or something. Then V takes place after IV but before III and is half about taking down an evil organization and half about Ryu trying to fight off the dark urges (despite the fact that he's done this two times before).

If they'd just cut the games in half, the plots would be a lot more cohesive.

>They've never been sure on whether to focus on Ryu's journey as a martial artist and the people he meets along the way or the fight against Shadaloo.
And as a result we've been getting the two mixed and it never fucking works because Shadaloo is not Ryu's business and it's contrived as hell that he is the linchpin of two separate storylines when Chun-Li and Guile exist to carry that torch. At least with Alpha 3 it made more sense because the whole premise of that game was that literally everyone was gunning for Bison and the Psycho Drive for their own purposes, and thus everyone got to have their own story within the Shadaloo arc.

Street Fighter doesn't need complex stories. The characters and their interactions can sustain the ride. SFV trying to make this big Avengers storyline was fucking laughable and a waste of even the few interesting concepts they brough to the table like Necalli and FrankeNash (I'm still pissed Nash got cucked out of the big boss fight with Bison just so it could be Ryu)
Just give the characters cool things to do and don't halfass the writing.

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Mr. Freeze is kind of a bro.

I'm fucking tired of Charlie. Kill him off once and for all.

He ain't cute and Guile ain't dumping his wife for him, so there's no point in bringing him back over and over.

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There was an episode of TAS where he finds a group of freaks living in the sewer and they become a family. Then Batman comes looking for him and the freaks defend Croc, so Batman looks kinda like the bad guy, it's kinda sad.

Pretty sure this is just one of the Doctor Who Christmas specials.

That time Two-Face crashed Gordon's retirement party

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Eh, felt weird when in the previous game he was still built like Arnold Schwarzenegger and now he's suddenly a falling apart old man.

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Zatanna is a maybe. Fate is a hard no. Not unless you want Nabu pulling some bullshit or another.

Roids will do that

I kniw frank isnt "technically" a villian but does anyone have that MAX panel where hes telling the little girl (galina i think her name is) that he cant go with her cause that series had a lot of gut wrenching moments so if u guys have any feel free to share em too

Forgot the pic :(

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I really want the next Batman run to have more of the spotlight focused on the villains, but not in an updating and modernizing edgy way, just give them great stories to star in. Bruce Wayne hasn't the most entertaining psyche around, why does every writer insists on "exploring" it?.Give me a coll TwoFace story without retconning him yet again, give me a Joker arc without endless monologues about his toxic love for Batman
When was the last time Batman had to actually solve a case and not have some gadget pull up a facial recognition in seconds and that's it, next page you have Batman scaring the crook on top of a gargoyle? Most recent ones i can think of are Broken City and Dini's Detective Comics

>it's just Hogan's Heroes

I hope Harvey gave a speech about Gordon's service.

Maybe he would do it again, and maybe it's the right thing to do, but I doubt he sleeps like a baby every night. Taking a life is taking a life, even if it's a remorseless child molester.

You'll have to settle for villain interactions in Gotham.

To be fair, the entire thing was unnecessary for Justice. Batman would have conked him then dropped him off at GCPD with a note calling him a rapist. There was no need to do with the torture and there was certainly no right to murder him. Only an impartial jury of one's peers should be able to sentence someone to death. No one man determines life or death.
For another good Crane story, read Kings of Fear.

>When was the last time Batman had to actually solve a case

It happens quite a lot, read comics.

Fuck Identity Crisis entirely but I can’t lie I liked this moment

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Most importantly, Escobar got them young. He basically ran and funded the youth soccer program in the region

Nah. I can't find the interview right now, but it never bothered of haunted Gary at all.
In these cases it seems to haunt them more that they ever let their kids be harmed in the first place.
Here have some more fatherly justice,
youtube.com/watch?v=XCaRysCy2uU

YOU CALL THAT BEING KIND?FOOL! DOOM IS THE KINDEST THERE IS

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Yeah, the rogues having their own kind of professional conduct is pretty great.

I mean, I get the point and in-universe you could probably make a decent case for Doom, but Magneto really shouldn't be there.

>Small-ish time crooks with some damn standards
Good shit.

Depending on the time period, Magneto's a pretty reasonable guy. Sure, some writers have him as KILL ALL HUMANS, but Claremont still had him doing things like visiting Holocaust survivor's gatherings to see how his fellow survivors were doing.

He's sometimes even perfectly willing to deal with humans as long as mutants have their freedom. Like when he was the king of Genosha.

It's just that people remember him setting up gas chambers in New York or trying to flip the magnetic poles or trying to hijack the world's nuclear supplies.

No women, no children. No civilians.

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There was probably a mutant savings and loan in that building which hits two of his triggers.

If I recall correctly, taking a dip in a lazarus pit either goes really well, or goes horribly wrong. Can't blame him for being desperate enough to flip that coin.

We're talking about Freeze, dipshit!

Hmm, fair enough I guess.
Anyone know what his attitude at the time was?

Well those things ARE a bit hard to forget.

If comics were allowed to end, Batman villains could reform. But eventually they get brought back for another spin. Riddler, Penguin, Two-face, Harley, Poison Ivy, Clayface, Catwoman, have all been reformed to some degree at one point or another.

Which Batman villains are irredeemable?

Pyg, Joker, and Black Mask depending on which version we go by. Everyone else has a fair shot at rehabilitation

The Carpenter. Egghead. The Ventriloquist yes, Scarface hell no.

He wouldn't even let Clayface cure himself, what makes you think he'd let Freeze have a happy ending?

Riddler, Selina, Croc, Two-Face, Harley, Ivy, Clayface...I could see Bane redeemed, but it would take a long time for him to get there. Then you got types like Maxie Zeus, Julian Day, Firefly, Crane, Tetch and Scarface, the truly sick types that need to be held indefinitely. Penguin’s too much of a vile little shit to reform.

Since when did Batman not let Clayface cure himself? Clayface was teaching Orphan Shakespeare in the Belfry with Batman like, five feet away.

I'd like to see Wesker come up with a hero puppet to fight Scarface.

IIRC Bane was good-ish for a while when he thought he and Wayne might be half-brothers.

I like that one Dini story from way back where the Carpenter is who the underworld calls for hideout and death trap repairs and other odd jobs.

>I'd like to see Wesker come up with a hero puppet to fight Scarface.
On that day, one way or another, he's losing a fucking hand.

Oh yeah and mad hatter would probably rot under the cell. Maybe throw dollmaker in but I’m not too sure to have a strong opinion on that

Loses a hand, immediately whittles a new hand beginning a running gag where each time we see him he's replaced more of his body with wood.

Up until Flashpoint, Bane was barely a villain. He was clean from Venom for years, had run all the organized crime out of Santa Prisca with Batman's assistance, and even helped in an op or two with the Bat.

I have no idea why they decided to turn him back into The Man Who Broke the Bat, as if that was the only interesting thing about him, when in fact, he didn't get real interesting until afterwards. He turned a corner in his life after he lost to Bruce in a fair fight, and a shameful amount of writers forget about that.

BTAS: Mudslide. Clayface's condition starts to rapidly deteriorate (he's basically slowly disintegrating) and he steals money and equipment to develop a way to stabilize himself and retake the form of Hagen permanently.

Batman ain't havin' that shit. He breaks in and stops the procedure and in the ensuing fight Clayface ends up dissolving in the ocean.

That episode was all sorts of completely fucked up from multiple angles, though.

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Scarface already messed up his hand killing Socko.

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Was he trying to drive with puppets on both hands?

That's like 12 continuities ago, dude!

>Gatman
Now I want a universe where Bruce's parents were killed by Manbat so to avenge them Bruce must become Gatman, the gun based vigilante, greatest white hunter of crime.

There isn't already an alternate Bruce like that, is there?

>Ventriloquist, are you sure you don't want me to hold on to one of your puppets?
>Psssh, yeah right. You chose Barbie, you live with Barbie.

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Unironically, this is the kindest this character is going to get.

I bet if Ventriloquist was in Batman Beyond, Wesker would have ALS and Scarface would be robotically enhanced.

>Robot Scarface cares for incapacitated Wesker, Rhino takes care of them both.

Imagine if that happened. Imagine if Mufasa ended up indebted to his brother so much that Scar slowly worked his way into power cloaked in his brother's favor and gratitude.

>I like that one Dini story from way back where the Carpenter is who the underworld calls for hideout and death trap repairs and other odd jobs.
There's a few stories like that. It's all Carpenter does.

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What's the edit?

Yep, official art has him selling fruit on the street. I doubt he ever accepts prize money, fighting is sacred to him. He doesn't even accept fights from sick or weak opponents, and is annoyed by Gen, since he wants to die in a good fight because he's terminally ill.

Might as well post the whole thing.

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I miss all the world building that they were doing in Gotham prior to Flashpoint.

That was the follow-up episode, wasn't it?

Plus another time where he shot Scarface after he messed up a photo that was dear to him.

Case in point?

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Was it retconned? I haven’t read any Freeze stories in years after all of this N52 crap.

If they abandon you out of convenience then they didn't really love you. They were just fond of you.

That's hilarious. Is this from the new Justice League issue?

Sauce?

Li'l Gotham.

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Reminder that this happened because the girl at the place he worked at put Scarface there because she thought Wesker would be more interesting if he were a bit more dangerous.

I don't think she ever got punished.

yep

This is literally amazing and perfect and I’m so fucking angry it didn’t happen

I knew it was coming but I can't fathom why its still funny.

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Reminds me of that comic about the tailor who makes the Gotham rouge's suits.

Imagine James Earl Jones, panicked and out of breath, “I ALMOST DIED.”

What the hell? I get starro being new robin is weird and all, but why is Batman being...how do I put it, jolly?

The economy of the Gotham Underworld has always been incredibly fascinating. Crooks looking after, exploiting or exchanging favors with other crooks has always been my favorite sort of thing.

Like, what if there’s a hideout that’s perfect for both Julian Day and Two-Face? How do they decide who gets it, especially if all three of them decide to play nice?

And what if Firefly’s hideout is down the derelict and abandoned street from Killer Moth, and Lynns will not stop blasting his horrible Eurotrash dance techno? Where does Wesker get suits for Scarface?

Gotham, more than nearly any other city in the DCU is just rife for a bizarre criminal economy that works because it means everyone gets to play, and which Batman is always ten steps behind.

I always liked the idea that Mags was having dementia during the Morrison run

It's somebody pretending to be Magneto.

Shhhhh don’t ruin the book for me with retcons

I’ve always wanted to run a tabletop game where you start as normal crooks in Gotham and slowly go up the chain till you kill Batman. Then run a sequel campaign about being new Gotham heroes trying to stop the old pcs

Grand Theft Auto: Gotham City, man. You come to the area with nothing but a dream in your heart of killing the Bat-man. Then you get your story missions where you build a crew, decide on a gimmick and start making connections. All building to the point where the whole city is on fire and you have your final showdown.

Not really. His Injustice VA, Robert Englund, was more superior to Dino Andrade and John Noble.

Oh shit, fucking Freddy Krueger was Scarecrow? That’s some inspired casting right there.

not that into /tg/ stuff but
>mfw imagining how satisfying it would be to see your group finally overcoming a batman BBEG played straight with all his resources, skills, and plot armor at his disposal

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youtube.com/watch?v=sD7ougXQG8o

Yeah, it was pretty great cast on NRM's part. Also, getting Combs to voice Brainiac was fucking perfect.

That's a good 'un.
www.deviantart.com/terminaitor/art/Batman-The-Tailor-133622928

Everything that goes wrong in the Marvel universe can be traced back to Norman being an asshole.

Way ahead of you, man. Six minutes into that video and I don’t want anyone else to ever play the character. How did I never realize how perfect Englund is as Scarecrow?

>Crane's huffed enough fear toxin that he thinks he can fight gods

He did and yet I forgot to post it

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Yeah, I also don't hate it.

Why is the Spoiler's handwriting in comic book lettering? If she typed it, why did she choose that font?

Comics like this one are why Jonathan Crane remains my husbando even after over twenty years. I love him, even if he’s irredeemable.

Those are my favorite moments from Two-Face. When he really recognizes how much he's lost, and that the people he fights against are good, noble and worth respecting. James Robinson did a pretty damn good Two-Face arc in Detective Comics 988-993.

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>Crane's huffed enough fear toxin that he's beating gods

She learned to write in that font to disguise her own handwriting.

His ending should be him on the floor of his cell, strait-jacketed and laughing like a hyena. Arkham guards speculate over what he's hallucinating while watching the actual events of the game on a nearby tv.

>The Office but with Arkham

>Joker seals Riddler's cane in jello
>Bane just sits there doing crosswords
>Killer Croc spills his world famous chili
>Penguin organizes a fun-run after he believes Man-Bat has rabies

Who would Creed, Kelly, Ryan and Toby be?

I'd do Creed as Reverend Black Fire, Kelly would be Baby Doll, Ryan would be the Calculator and Toby...who does Joker have a totally irrational hatred towards, that he would never act on?

>setting up gas chambers in New York

Wouldn't that be like, sublimely fucked up for a Holocaust survivor? I mean, when was that?

Morrison's run.

He had Magneto get hooked on mutant power enhancing drugs, take over New York, and set up ovens and gas chambers because he felt Magneto had gone full Nazi and it'd be poetic.

Transmutate comes to mind, just because it's the only time Rampage shows compassion and empathy ever, in his own twisted way

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Dr. Arkham: Would I rather be feared or loved? East. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me.

Jesus Christ. I might look that up just for the insanity of it.

>He had Magneto get hooked on mutant power enhancing drugs, take over New York, and set up ovens and gas chambers because he felt Magneto had gone full Nazi and it'd be poetic.

It's not that far fetched considering the fact that Homo Superior is practically The Master Race.

I really hope he realizes how asinine that was in retrospect.

He was still bragging about it a few years after he wrote it. Might have changed by now, though.

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Starro is sleeping/dreaming

Morrison can really suck sometimes, at least that Magneto was retconned compared to everything he did with Talia and Damian.

The little starfish dreams Batman is his dad and proud of him, how cute.

I love Black Adam's family from 52.

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>Happy Halloween, Judeo-Christians!

Osiris is best boy forever

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He's so cute you could just eat him up.

Snyder was good at creating original villains (Court of Owls, James Gordon Jr) but terrible when using already established ones (Joker, Freeze)

Killer Croc had a 'happy ending' once where Swamp Thing basically kidnapped him and allowed him to live in his swamp and told Bats to fuck off when he tried to take him away

Swampy's a good guy.

Nobody asked you, Sobek!

I love how Swamp Thing has always taken precisely none of Batman's shit.

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that's cute

this sounds like wacky roommate shenanigans and i kind of love it

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Helps that both of them are 100% aware of how much Swamp Thing outclasses Batman.

It really must drive Bruce up the wall that there's a force on Earth like Swamp Thing, and that he has zero leverage over him. Even Spectre can be reasoned with, but Alec?

reminds me of this
all the heroes and several badguys coming to visit batman after a mind controlled superman nearly beat him to dead

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Any time I try to read while dreaming the words on the page are never the same from moment to moment and degrade into nonsense. Then I wake up.

aww

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I always liked that quote from Johns, that Guy isn’t an idiot, he’s just way more of a shitkicker.

this is so of-the-period, i love it

>NO, HIS DARKNESS ECHOES MY OWN!
>IT BELONG WITH ME!
Rampage was a fucked up cake alright.

Ackshually, that's a hallucination being had by Superman in Superman/Batman #41 while he's trapped in the Source Wall and nearing oblivion.

>DO I LOOK INSANE
This line alone justifies a second Venom movie.

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ah my bad then got it confused with something else then.

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Does Mysterio during Ends of the Earth count? He helped out of greed but still ended up helping, even led everyone to ock’s lair

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He then goes on to threaten to hit agents of the Reach with a stick until they left Earth.

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>Etrigan
>a villain

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There's a #metoo joke here somewhere, but it's probably not worth it.

There's a lot of Batman villains that could be redeemed until certain crappy storylines (mostly from the New 52 or Rebirth) made them irredeemable. Chiefly Penguin and Riddler but also guys like Bane and Mr.Freeze. If you ignore those, then nearly all the major Batman villains are redeemable.
Selina has been a full hero for a while now, and Harley and Ivy get a free pass all the time too.

The ones I can think of that are completely irredeemable are Joker, Scarecrow, Professor Pyg, Black Mask, and one-dimensional evil/crazy bastards like Hush, Hurt or every villain Scott Snyder touches.

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Even the Joker, once he thinks Batman died, gave up crime, became Joseph Kerr, and led a totally normal, average life as one of the nicest guys you could meet.

joker needs batman to function

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No, that was Paco.

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...are you mentally disabled?

"Let's not dwell UPON that", you moron.

the "do i look insane" always makes me laugh

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I miss that run of Blue Beetle so much holy shit

>the Joker, once he thinks Batman died, gave up crime, became Joseph Kerr
I read Going Sane, and that story showed the Joker falling apart even when he found a perfectly average life with a loving girlfriend and nothing to connect him to crime whatsoever, and he was still a disturbing and unstable man prone to violent tantrums.
Batman's return came across to me as the timely coincidence that allowed Joseph to leave her be and return to form, but he probably would have murdered her eventually.
I'm not criticizing Going Sane, by the way. It's one of my favorite Batman stories, and if anything that story reaffirms why Joker is fundamentally irredeemable even if there is a small piece of him that genuinely wants to be good.

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Didn't Clayface's redemption stick until he died but not really and then escaped with that tranny that wanted to help him? Have we heard anything about him after that?

He did misspell that word, ironically, but the comic did write let's as let.

You and me both, bruddah. I wonder what John Rogers is up to these days.

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I always love that Jaime's just a good kid with a solid upbringing. Loving family that taught him right from wrong, and just wants to do the right thing. At the very least, every run after that got that much right.

Even with Injustice 2, he saves the world from Brainiac and...moves back home to El Paso so he can go to school.

>Redeemed Batman villain

Yeah man, remember when Riddler was that and everyone liked it but DC and its faggot writers demanded the status quo? I remember.

The old version was worse. Nora got unfrozen and hated Victor and even became a fire-based villain to spite him. And then Batman TAS popularized Freezy as a tragic villain and DC got embarrassed.

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holy shit Harley's VA is trash

>The old version was worse. Nora got unfrozen and hated Victor and even became a fire-based villain to spite him. And then Batman TAS popularized Freezy as a tragic villain and DC got embarrassed.
That happened after BTAS. I mean, Nora didn't exist before BTAS.

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>he wants to fight to the death
Actually he just wants to fight. he's against killing.
His unleashed form is the one that wants to fight to death.

Honestly, I thought the idea of Nora Fries coming back to life and being resentful of Victor, and becoming an inhuman like him was a good concept buried amidst a load of nonsense, and I'd like to see it revisited in a way that makes her more than a ranting fire monster raising zombies for no reason.

It could be a great opportunity to give Nora some actual characterization and to have her exist as her own character and not just Mr.Freeze's lost lenore. Freeze was so driven to save her that he forced her into stasis as a half-living corpse, and whether or not his intentions were noble or selfish, we don't usually see how Nora feels about this or how much say she even had on the decision or their prior relationship
youtube.com/watch?v=GH5HB1VbWrI

So why not explore how does this affect Nora and put her in a similar position as Freeze?
You could have her be The Creature to Victor's Frankenstein, his failure given form and someone who wants to be acknowledged as a person. Maybe she is sick of being Victor's Tragic Nora. Poor Terminally Ill Nora. The Scientific Experiment Nora. All she ever wanted was just to be Nora, and now she's an untouchable monster, just like what Victor became while trying to save her.

Hell, you can even keep the fire zombie powers, just approach it with some elegance. Make her powers related to solar energy and embuing life Gold Experience-style. Make it so that she and Victor cannot possibly touch each other without one or the other dying, and see how that works out for them. Maybe one would wind up killing the other, or maybe they could even make up and get together once more and work out a relationship even amidst their physical aberrations and newfound roles in life.

If it's such a problem for writers to figure out how to keep Nora as Freeze's motivation and how to make Freeze a reocurring enemy, making Nora a reocurring character and antagonist/love to Freeze seems like a way to get around the issue.

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all that sounds nice
maybe you could even keep the loss angle by having nora be memory damaged to the extent that she is no longer really the woman fries fell in love with

>maybe you could even keep the loss angle by having nora be memory damaged to the extent that she is no longer really the woman fries fell in love with
A little cliche in my view, and it could run dangerously close to the stalker angle Snyder gave him in having Freeze be obsessed with a woman who can no longer remember him, but there are ways it could work.

Even Hugo Strange has a nice side

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Sanjay compliments Hugo's old-school pulp villainy real nicely and I wish he'd stuck around. His interactions with Hugo were my favorite thing about Monster Men as well as the fact Hugo was genuinely sad when he died.
Makes you wonder if Hugo could be redeemed as well

Strange is a hard one cause his heart is very nearly almost approximately close to the right place. Like, if there’s an especially dire situation and Strange can help with a solution, he can be counted on to help, but you need to keep a close eye on him while he does. He’s kind of like T. O. Morrow like that; shitty person that can do right every once in a rare while.

I’ve always liked Toyman II. One of those geniuses that loses sight of the shore sometimes and relies on strong leadership to keep him on the straight and narrow. Is he still around? Seems like it’s been awhile.

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I think he turned out to be a rogue robot along with every other Toyman besides the original.

But...but he did absolutely nothing wrong.

Oh shit, I remember that. If memory serves, that’s a Johns decision, if only because it brought back Toyman I.

Kidnapping and torture?

ACKSHUALLY

Good news! The android thing was retconned out of existence during Flashpoint; Hiro Okamura is now known as the Toymaster, and is a video game maker now. He released an MMO themed around making DC heroes fight. He thought it was just a game, but Mongul II fucked with it so the game players were taking control of actual heroes. It wasn’t a bad read; from the early run on Batman/Superman in the nu52.

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Not to mention pre-meditated murder if Batman hadn’t intervened when he did.

Those are all misdemeanors at worst in Gotham.

context ?

This theory links well with the Sprang Act.

I wasn't too much into Wagner handled Hugo (he came off as Rusty Venture with a height complex) but the idea that the loss of his partner is what helped make Hugo's vendetta with Batman personal is something I really liked.
While I love how Hugo become a much more complex, thematically interesting and deranged character in Prey, I also miss the grandly theatrical Hugo of old who does things like use trained attack snakes and charm henchmen into becoming his personal army

>Makes you wonder if Hugo could be redeemed as well
Not sure. Hugo is unique because he usually doesn't have a tragic backstory that made him what he is, and he's never really needed one. He lacks the defining tragedy of Batman and his villains and he is hindered by his lack of understanding at how much Bruce had to overcome his own limitations. Out of the major Batman villains he is arguably the only one who 100% embraced supervillainy, despite everything he could have done with his life and him being highly functional despite being insane. Even Joker required a chemical push and a psychological breakdown.
Hugo never expresses a desire to become Batman for the sake of being a hero or stopping criminality, hell, he is a criminal himself. He is impressed by what Batman is, his power and status, not by what Batman actually does. Becoming Batman to him is usually a matter of self-improvement, admiration, entitlement, envy, or all of these. He actively dismisses Batman's humanity (see: the many times he attacked Alfred or when he tried to get rid of Dick and Tim because he thought of them as leeches).

But there is an unexpected poignancy that's at the heart of some of the best Hugo Strange stories and a twisted sense of integrity behind them that argues for some decency in Hugo. He can and has done the right thing on occasion.
He's not interested in mass murder or domination of Gotham, he wants to be Batman, whatever he thinks Batman is or should be.

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Probably drives him crazier that any plan that might actually get rid of the Swamp Thing will probably have the minor collateral issue of "ending life on earth". Because that's a hell of a pyrrhic victory.

I would love to see a story where Strange actually is in a place where he can embrace his fantasy. Where he can really experience what it’s like to be Batman. Have him stop a grocery store robbery or something and have one of the potential victims earnestly thank him, that they would’ve been killed if it wasn’t for his intervention.

I don’t think it would change his heart, because as you point out, he’s fundamentally broken by nature. His background didn’t do this to him, he’s just not able to function outside of hospital walls. But I do think really seeing himself as a hero, for the right reasons...I think there’s serious story potential there.

Luthor managed to come up with one in ten minutes.

Yes but it's harder to entice him these days with offers of movie stardom and a chance to appear on screen with Adrienne Barbeau's tits. Mind you he'd probably still do it. I mean I'd do it.

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I just got a hardcopy of Prey, and him complaining to the kidnapped mayor's daughter that woman are all the same (while having a lingerie clad mannequin he talks to) made me wonder if Strange is an incel.

He probably insists on wearing his bat cosplay to bed, so...you tell me whether he was lucky with women or not.

With Batman underroos to bed? HE BETTER NOT BE! That's like top wooing material right there, especially if she lets him wear the cowl in bed!

Where can I read more about Doom and his reign in Latveria?

You see it mention as a modern paradise all the time but I don't remember seeing much of it in comic.

Lex Luthor can be kind of time. I really like it when he's one upping Superman by doing genuine good for people.

You mean like in preboot times when Lena had a terminal illness? He gave her the cure in front of Superboy, and...

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Or the time he killed New Krypton and tens of thousands of Kryptonian refugees?

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Or when he had a fun little hobby of ruining lives for shits and giggles?

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>that one episode of Brave and the Bold where flash comes back after supposedly dying
>flash’s rogues are crying as he comes back
I like that scene

Doesn't she later shoot him when he's trying to become the president, but he survives and his approval ratings skyrocket, and then he's in the hospital bed reading his new ratings and says something like "You'd almost think I planned this"

Capcom isn't into making actual fleshed out characters, they're just functions with one note quirks.

Holy shit that poor fucking woman. Lex’ monstrosity still shocks me sometimes.

Holy shit she kept her uniform and everything

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I mean you have to b a soulless edgelord to hate Stevie Wonder

The Cage's are Boons Pet Characters next to Scorpion. Fucking USA weeb wank and all that, all the Mary sue powers of a typical MK protag and half the annoying cynical jackass humor for deadpool..

>galactus with giant moe animu eyes
this is weird, man

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We almost got that story back when J.M DeMatteis tried pitching Last Hunt as a Hugo story (before that he tried it as a Joker story and it was rejected because of Killing Joke).
I get the sense that if Hugo thought that he needed to save people and avoid killing to beat Bruce at his own game and prove himself unquestionably superior, he'd do it until he got tired of restraining himself and began to see it as unpractical.
I guess you can argue he could reform and fight crime as another Batman, kind of like Lex did for a while, but Hugo refuses to let anyone "leech off The Batman's power" and would never agree to Bruce living as long as he was Batman.

Sometimes I like to think of Hugo as the Fredric Wertham of Batman villains, and industry-ruining campaigns and disturbingly misguided projections aside, Wertham did plenty of good for others in his life.
Hugo has a similar thing going on in universe, that he was a very respected psychiatrist who could even do good things (his interactions with Sanjay hint as much), but whose Batman obsession destroyed what little morals he had and ruined his reputation to the point that's all his career became known for (the latest Deathstroke arc seems to bring this up)

Not "incel", because Hugo is well capable of charming/manipulating women into doing what he wants outside of the Moench stories, but Prey paints him as a straight up misogynist and kind of hints at a backstory related to that.
The first thing Hugo thinks of when trying to guess Batman's background is that maybe he lost his wife, which to me suggests a similar thing might have happened to him, and he's been married with children in at least one continuity

Mysterio was great in that, it also helped how well he and Chameleon got along and complimented each other's powersets.

That plan literally just made Swampy stronger in the end

It doesn't have to be this dramatic, even with a his love Victor is still a human that can't be or do 100% of the time - and caring for a sick loved one on top of a demanding research job is bound to lead to trouble. What I'm getting it - he couldn't be always there for her, and likely would have to leave her alone while researching a cure himself. Hell, sometimes people even avoid seeing the sick family member, even unintentionally. Especially if it's a thing like... Chorea Huntington(sp?) that Nora hadin the Arkham Games.

Or how much of what Fries himself remembers is just an idolisation of her, and whether he comes to realize this or not.

Joker, Pyg, Dollmaker, Black Mask, Al Ghul, Hush.

Arguably Firefly and Penguin too

>Can't anyone help this man?
She's dead.

Mad Hatter could be redeemed with enough therapy probably

Surprised Shocker hasn't been posted yet. Love that dude

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Definitely not Joker and Zsasz

>villain sees a kid
>mindlessly rambles off a couple saturday morning cartoon catchphrases
why did this make me kek so hard

The original version of him before the robot retcon was a good guy though apart from the cliche interest on Power Girl’s breasts.

nah, hes figured it out that the best way to be happy is to use his hats to hypnotize him to be happy.

There was also the time after the Crisis that the Rogues threw a party for Leonard and Trickster sent Wally an invitation as a joke. Wally being the madman went to the party and fun was had by all. It cemented that he was inheriting the relationship they had with Barry.

Until he went for the scythe (at least, in a world where Batman exists), but he likely would go on a spree after since in the end, he doesn't know how to stop after he gets started

That's our Sobek

From what I've seen of Crane it's less likely he goes into a killing spree and more that he starts testing new fear juice on people and demanding to be fear-respected. Lack of ethical concerns and bruised ego are one hell of a cocktail.

You should read the Superior Foes, it'll fling your sides into orbit. Make a thread if you want to see uncensored panels that were posted here.

This?

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Hello.

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user please don’t

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>I good kitty.

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Yeah, fuck you Dave

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Not that I know of.
Flashpoint Batman uses guns, but I'm pretty sure that he's Thomas Wayne, not Bruce.

Who else but Sobek?

I meant the fear gas too. But also likely causing death either from too much fear or too big a test area causing chaos

this is fucking gold

Based [REDACTED] making the insecures clench their butt 9 years after the fact

...