Pick one

WonderBats.

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Wonderbat

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That's right. Now fuck off Timm.

Animated Series Harleen Quinzel.
They were cute together.

Catwoman, it's the only interesting dynamic. Wonder Bats works only in situations where he's not doing shit with Gotham. There is no reason why Wonder Woman wouldn't just fucking kill the Joker or half his rogue's gallery

Wonderbat.

>There is no reason why Wonder Woman wouldn't just fucking kill the Joker or half his rogue's gallery
Only if you subscribe to the idea that Wonder Woman isn't above killing for being a "warrior".

>There is no reason why Wonder Woman wouldn't just fucking kill the Joker or half his rogue's gallery
Then why doesn't she do it now?

Diana is the most fun but yeah super powered characters don't really fit in his universe.

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>super powered characters don't really fit in his universe.
Are we saying this after Batman himself became the gateway for an outer-world demonic entity? Or when there are character like Poison Ivy, Clayface, Ra's al Ghul, and so on?

I may be wrong because I don't read all the Batman stories but those villains still operate on street level (if it isn't a JL team up). Asking Diana to clean house is basically asking Superman except there is no kryptonite to stop her. Even if she is holding back she could take every single of them down in seconds.

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Posting a page written by Gail Simone doesn't help your argument. If that was true Wonder Woman would have no rogues gallery as well. Same for Superman. They all got rogues that also operate on a street level and elude them. Veronica Cale, in the case of Wonder Woman, for example. Or Lex Luthor, in the case of Superman.

There is a difference between characters like Luthor / Veronica who are careful about not getting caught and 90% of bats gallery who are all about theatrics which would never work against super speed and super strength. Diana doesn't have to kill them of course but can still take them down in seconds.
Sure some of their traps could work since Diana isn't that fast and don't see everything but they could never elude her because their own ego.

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What about Dr. Psycho? Silver Swan? Dr. Poison? Dr. Cyber? Angle Man? They're all very pulpy. Sure, they aren't used that much, but that's mostly because a lot of writers don't respect her villains.

Batman of China and wonder woman of China best WONDER-BAT

I like Psycho, he is the villain who could fuck up super heroes even. Silver Swan was best as Vanessa to really make her doubt what to do with it.
What am I saying is most of the Bat villains wants to show off but this requires them to be there where they could be taken down easily by a high caliber hero. Only humans have real problems with them.

Most Batman villains are mobsters that employ other people or are scientist/tricksters that don't directly face the hero face-to-face. Do you think the Riddler is able to fist-fight Batman? Of course not. Even Batman is overpowered for his rogues. That's why most of them test him with a battle of wits.

Andrea, easy.

Most Batman villains aren't idiots and are perfectly capable of changing tactics as necessary. The fatal flaw in your argument is that you assume the villains would act the same way all the time plus most of Batman's villains aren't a physical threat to him. If all Batman needed was more might Gotham would be safe as he has many armors. Batman's villain are more psychological and require a different set of skills.

Hell, most of Wonder woman's villain's aren't physical threats to her either.

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But isn'tthe point of the Bats villains they can't leave their theatrics behind? They were defeated repeatedly because of this reason. Freeze shits itself if someone threatens Nora, Two face loses his shit if he can't flip a coin etc

>There is no reason why Wonder Woman wouldn't just fucking kill the Joker or half his rogue's gallery
this is the stupidest possible reasoning for your opinion. revolving door arkham is retarded on many levels and any character that calls attention to it also becomes retarded but there's no actual connection between that and the rest of of the discussion.

Andrea is... like a real person. She's got real motives and really did love him. Wonder Woman isn't relatable. She's too superhero.

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whats going on in that last panel?

This, really.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me in a world of such marvels one of, if not *the*, most resourceful men on the planet wouldn't find a way to live forever?

Talia

Based

Where is Sasha Bordeaux?

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Yeees

Selina always

>That issue where Batman and WW fought monsters alone together for 100 years in a time pocket or something and DIDN'T fuck
Fuck you King.

>But isn'tthe point of the Bats villains they can't leave their theatrics behind?
Eh No.
>They were defeated repeatedly because of this reason.
No
> Freeze shits itself if someone threatens Nora
Well yeah, Nora is his fucking wife.
>Two face loses his shit if he can't flip a coin
Doesn't happen that often and even then Dent is one of the few Batman villains with crippling neurosis.

Wonder Bats!

I don't think he wants to be immortal

The start of the next what if. Their daughter just cut off the hand of a guy who hits his wife

Want to know what's kind of sad?

The majority of "BMWW shippers all get their cues from the JLU show.
And that BMWW relationship is just a very cheap and immature mimicry of the GLHW relationship in the show.

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>Wonder Woman isn't relatable. She's too superhero.
Imagine believing a superhero can't relate to another superhero

That was just one what if scenario of several.

THE BAT SHOULD FEAR THE WONDER WOMAN

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>I don't think he wants to be immortal
Batman wants to be immortal as the plot requires

I think everyone understands that Batman should NEVER be in a relationship because it's just DOESN'T WORK on this character at all. He should just have occasional flirt, teasing and sex with superheroines from time to time and women like Vicky Vale, models etc.
He is a playboy for fuck's sake. It's a huge part of his character. Devoting him for one woman is ripping him off. And in the end, he should have few kids, but ZERO relationships and no marrige and die surrounded by friends and sons.

Obviously Superman

Wonderbat

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>creates qt snake ww
>makes her love interest of Batman
>makes this Batman fat beta loser
What did they mean by this?

Where is Superman?

He dies alone having pushed everyone away

She was so hungry for it.

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>Where is Superman?
Home with Lois

SuperBats.

The only time JLU WW had a personality...and was kinda hot.
If WW had that personality as an adult then I would have blasted ropes to her every time she was on the screen.

like mister manlet and big berda

Thicc

Definitely the rapist. Talia is the only girl who managed to claim his mighty Bat-Seed.

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No fuck off

You can't have batman genuinely love an immortal and not wanting to be immortal himself.

Justice is best girl.

Doesn’t Superman age way slower than a regular human? So Lois and Clark’s relationship is practically the same if Wonder Woman and Batman were together.

There's the silver age The Brave and the Bold, the modern JLA, and some Elseworlds.

youtube.com/watch?v=pxIofYrt0kE

i think they mean , bats should fear the amazons

For me? It's Sasha Bordeaux.

>I don't read comics so cartoon fanfiction is the only story I've ever thought was remotely decent

BASED

Pathetic

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timm's fanfiction has zero to do with the discussion of batman

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What a cuck

Beaumont. Even if ditching Bruce twice threw him into a hole much darker than the one she thought she was saving him from. Do they ever explain how the Joker got away from her?

They're into that sorta of play.

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Wonder Woman has never been a love interest of Batman. Every single depiction of them having romantic interest in each other never actually proceeds; furthermore, said depictions are almost always not found in either character's solo title.

You don't read comics.

>Wonder Woman has never been a love interest of Batman.
But that's wrong.
>furthermore, said depictions are almost always not found in either character's solo title.
But that's wrong.
>Every single depiction of them having romantic interest in each other never actually proceeds
Like pretty much every procedural comedy-drama like Remington Steele, Moonlighting, Bones, Castle, Elementary, and so on? That's a staple of a well-built romance plagued by the needs of status quo.

Name a period in which Bruce and Diana dated.

because she's not intertwined with Batman, that's it. Because she doesn't have an inherently strong relationship to Batman, his villains live. Wonder Woman wouldn't sit idly by if she saw Batman in danger from the Joker or his family in danger if she was also dating him.

But because the story doesn't require that she's around, she isn't around.

Going on dates? Haney's Brave and the Bold and Kelly's JLA.

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Or also, just also, she isn't a killer, she's not a warrior, she's an ambassador of peace. And before you come up with New52 bullshit, every, and I mean EVERY panel that shows Diana with a sword is out of character.

>Going on dates?
Why did you change the question, you disingenuous prick? Name the period in which they've dated.

>BRAAAP

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Define dating. Having romantic interest and intention for one another and going on dates to pursue it further doesn't count as dating? Kissing then? Because they also did that.

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Come again?

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So they've never been in a relationship. It's not that hard to admit, is it?

>asks not to post New52 bullshit
>posts New52 bullshit

You sound like one those SMWW shippers were it doesn't count unless the characters are having graphic sex throughout several pages.

Why do you act as if the definition of being in a relationship was something subjective? Shippers are scary man.

And wouldn't lois want to be immortal?

Do Elseworlds count?

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Why the fuck would they?

Birds of a feather should stay together

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Superman is the best choice for Batman. But that shit will never happen.

This

Still Andrea unless you didnt watch Mask of the Phantasm which shows how to humanize Bruce and the inner conflict he carries inside of him, and instead prefer the Batwankery that was Justice League. I think Timm's boner for Batgod grew stronger and harder when he realized how many kids loved to eat that shit up. It has only gotten worse over the years.

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Or you could, you know, actually read comics and not watch Timm's fanfiction.

>Andrea Belmont
It's not any different from all the "normal" love interests where Bruce thought he had to choose between a live of normalcy or the cowl, before something happening that forces him to resign himself to being Batman. The big difference is that Andrea herself became a tragic vigilante as well that let her life be consumed by vengeance, but even that is so different from Michelle Pfeifer's portrayal of Catwoman in Batman Returns.

So basically after Lois and Bruce die the two gods shack up having no longer their mortal partners' baggage

Lots of fanfics were built upon that idea.

Superman is no god stop trying to make him something he's not

Except Wonder WOman and Batman is so very wrong on so many levels. But whatever the DCAU crap has conditioned people to view DC's major femal hero as nothing but Batman's cocksleeve.

People are under this weird delusion that Batman and Wonder Woman are closer than they really are. Name the last time Batman dropped everything to help her out with one of her problems? I'm waiting.

Obama X Red Sarah

>Name the last time Batman dropped everything to help her out with one of her problems? I'm waiting.
Why would he? That's like asking why Batman doesn't drop everything to help any of his sons with one of their many life threatening problems. Specially his 13 year old biological son.

>But whatever the DCAU crap has conditioned people to view DC's major femal hero as nothing but Batman's cocksleeve
I think you have the mental problems.

>But whatever the DCAU crap has conditioned people to view DC's major femal hero as nothing but Batman's cocksleeve.
Reminder that they were paired in the 'Obsidian Age' arc before the debut of the JL cartoon and that it was in fact comics writers that suggested the pairing to Bruce Timm & Co.

BatCat. Batman's longest love is also his best.
Also that relationship has the most depth and needs to be saved from all that Tom King faggotry.

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>BatCat
That's literally the worst choice. It makes no fucking sense despite how long they've been trying to push it. And Catwoman is a ho.

Implying Batman isn't also a bigger ho

It's just generally in relationships people do things for each other. So you're revealing to me that Batman/Wonder Woman relationship isn't a relationship at all and just a love affair with your (and Batman's) mommy issues.

Not factual.

The actual fact is DC/WB got the rights to Wonder Woman from CBS during JLU development and WB wanted her in the series. Timm didn't know what to do with her at the last minute, so he did what any average uninventive asshole did. Made her a love-interest/cheerleader.

Even Harley Quinn would be better at this stage.

The whole BatCat thing is meant to forbidden and rifled with mistrust, mind-games, and betrayal. It's your typical noir-ish femme fatale scenario. Trying to make it into a OTP type of thing is a mistake. Catwoman is not Lois Lane material.

Because of this retarded push for the pairing Catwoman has lost all her character traits and edge that made her interesting. To be honest, i'd rather see Catwoman far away from Batman. She's a much more interesting character when she's not playing a damsel in distress or charity case for him. That's why i've been enjoying her current ongoing.

You think that Batman with WW would be WW being made a cocksleeve and now are bringing in mother issues. You definitely have the mental problems.

The idea for pairing the characters didn't even come from Bruce Timm. It was suggested by comic writers and done by another one of the show writers. Because of the audience favorable response they decided to go with it.

Andrea, she's the only one that makes thematic sense, in that her leaving Bruce fits with his character, at least for DCAU/Modern Age batman.

Wonder Woman easily. One of Batman's biggest issues with settling down with someone is that they'll be used to get to him, but considering WW is practically Superman tier I'm pretty sure she'd be fine.

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>She's a much more interesting character when she's not playing a damsel in distress or charity case for him.
Unless that's what she's been her entire existence she's just not an interesting character.

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>cheerleader.
She wasn't portrayed as a cheerleader for Batman, though. She was clueless about man or romantic relationships in general and her arc throughout the shows was about her discovering the worth and appeal of both through the many relationships she established. Her first romantic interest was even Batman, but Steve Trevor. A man of valor that she came to admire and awoke romantic and sexual interest in her. So essentially the sexual awakening of a teenager.
It's thanks to that experience that she realized that Batman had feelings for her that went beyond mere camaraderie or friendship. So he began as a mystery for her to unravel and in doing that she ended up falling for him as well.

Their relationship was much more about her knowingly teasing him about their mutual attraction and trying to get him to come out of his shell about his feelings for her, than her fawning over him as if he was a golden god.

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I find it funny that Wonder Woman, who began completely clueless about everything, ended up becoming the more mature one between the two. Batman remained forever a manchild in the cartoon going all "Nuh-uh, girls are icky!"

>It's your typical noir-ish femme fatale scenario.
>Implying that's not a reason why it's objectively the best relationship.

Batman will always been a noir/hardboiled detective at his core. That's why this push to fit him with Wonder Woman come off as so forced. You end up neutering her character in order to fit her with a guy that doesn't really belong in the same world.

The BatCat thing has a lot of bad shills, but objectively hinges on more substance between the two characters, especially if you're looking at her character from the lens of Loeb, Brubaker, Jones, and even Frank Miller (to an extent).

Batman will always be an aristocrat. A knight. His whole persona is built on the fact that he can finance a multibillion dollar one man army against crime on his own bill. Selina was also an orphan, but one who was in foster care, orphanages, and ultimately the streets. She's not a knight, but more of a Robin Hood like outlaw, one who operates outside the scope of wealth and society by stealing from those who have unjustly enriched themselves. Batman always soared above the city and its crime, while Selina's persona was forged by its gutters and alleyways. That's why she's such a moral and existential challenge to Batman. She initially sees his code as a luxury, while Batman dismisses her lawlessness as mere cynicism. Both are initally wrong about each other, which means in order for their relationship to work, they have to grow where they are weak, as each character points out the weakness in the other.

This is not unlike the relationship between Jean Valjean and Javert in Les Miserables. What are the limits of justice? How does one set its bounds? From the point of view of the sky or from the streets? Ultimately, it's both, which is why the characters fit together so well when they're actually *working* together. But it's a synthesis that Batman doesn't share with any of his other female companions.

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For gods sakes look how quickly you jump at accusing someone who disagrees with you as a SMWW shipper. Dude you shippers are poison.

Also, there's no one out there that really hits Batman on the same level.
>A relationship with Batgirl would be incestuous.
>Harley Quinn is just crazy.
>Ivy doesn't work because she's half plant and Batman can't have sex with an inanimate object.
>Zatanna is close, but in the end she's more of a girlbuddy than an actual romantic interest.
>Talia is the closest runner up, and depending on how she's written, could be a serious rival to Catwoman. But I tend to go for the interpretation that's she's too fargone, too committed to the way of life her father showed her to relent from her path. She too is aristocratic like Batman, myopic in her pursuit of her goals, incredibly well trained, and totally influenced by her parents (or at least her father). But Ra's's hold on her is too strong, and perhaps she is too *similar* to Batman to actually make it work. She doesn't compliment him in the right ways.

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I sometimes feel like I am the only one who likes VickixBruce

Fuck off Tom King.

>Selina was also an orphan, but one who was in foster care, orphanages, and ultimately the streets. She's not a knight, but more of a Robin Hood like outlaw, one who operates outside the scope of wealth and society by stealing from those who have unjustly enriched themselves. Batman always soared above the city and its crime, while Selina's persona was forged by its gutters and alleyways. That's why she's such a moral and existential challenge to Batman. She initially sees his code as a luxury, while Batman dismisses her lawlessness as mere cynicism.
See, that's crap that doesn't fit either Catwoman or Batman.
Trying to make her a poor orphan - for the easy parallels with Batman - who acts as a hero with honor and her own set of codes. Catwoman started as a bored socialite that stole for fun and kept what she stole for herself.
The same goes for Batman. Batman's a lawless vigilante who operates in the gutters and alleyways of Gotham. No crime is too small or irrelevant for Batman to handle. That's why Batman exists. You make a disservice to Batman when you portray him that way.
Now you're just being petty. I can easily create tons parallels between Batman and Harley Quinn just as a fun exercise.

BASED

>Selina was also an orphan, but one who was in foster care, orphanages, and ultimately the streets. She's not a knight, but more of a Robin Hood like outlaw, one who operates outside the scope of wealth and society by stealing from those who have unjustly enriched themselves.
>She initially sees his code as a luxury, while Batman dismisses her lawlessness as mere cynicism.
So Catwoman is Jason Todd, Red Hood.

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superior wonderbat

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Honestly mate, she never started out as a bored socialite. Back in the 40's she retired to the life of a mild mannered pet store proprietress. The socialite life was only written into her character later on, and even then it was an obvious later acquisition. She wasn't necessarily born into it.

All the best Catwoman writers from Balent to Loeb, Brubaker, Jones, and all the rest, are all riffing on Selina coming from poverty. That's why she's a cat. She's an alley cat. That's why everyone from Adam Hughes to Chris Nolan have played up the Audrey Hepburn/Breakfast at Tiffany's parallels. She's a poor kid from the wrong side of the tracks that stole her way to wealth, taking advatage of all the dumb toffs who just see her as a pretty girl. Even Truman Capote riffed on that character. You do a disservice to Selina by just reducing her to someone who steals out of boredom.

And yes, Batman knowns the streets. Like you say, no crime is too small or irrelevant for him, and that may be so. But that's all he sees. He doesn't see the poverty, suffering, and desperation of the poor of Gotham because he doesn't relate to it like Selina does. That's why she compliments him so well.

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>Straight
Batman x Vixen. (My personal crackship)
I know they don't have that much interaction but I just think it would work with their public identity. He is a rich philanthropist and playboy and she is a famous fashion model/designer.
Also he need more brown sugar in his life.
I also love Zatanna x Batman but it doesn't even have to be something romantic, I also like them as very close childhood friends.
>gay
Batman x Superman
It's just this whole dark and bright, both just complement each other.
Of course they also nice as brst friends but if Batsy is going to be gay or bi someday Superman is the right man for him.

>Jason Todd turned to cyncism because of his resentment of Batman from his torture at the hands of the Joker. He was inside Batman's world and turned away.

Selina's story goes much farther back. To her childhood. She didn't need a supervillain to turn her into what she is. She just needed the City of Gotham. Just like Batman did.

And sure, with respect to parallels you can always write in anything you want depending on how you write the character. But there is far more established for Selina's character than there is for Harley Quinn. Give Harley another 50 years of development and then let's check back and see where she stands.

I like BatCat but only the earth 2 version, Kings version is shit.
Wonder Woman and Zatanna work better as his best female friends, Babs works more as a niece/daughter like person.
Talia is just his rapist.

Odd way of saying her "pimp made her", but ok

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But user, Bats doesn't genuinely love her.

Their relationship doesn't exist.

>Name the last time Batman dropped everything to help her out with one of her problems? I'm waiting.
Go read some comics pleb.

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>posting a page where it looks like WW drugged and kidnapped Bruce to force him to help her
uhhh?

>Posting the only example of the one writer who used this backstory, which was subsequently never used again.
Nice try. No one who takes Selina's character seriously pays attention to that version of her backstory.

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King's version is *currently* shit and may *continue* to be shit. But the optimist in me causes me to wait till after Joelle Jones' run is done. Maybe she'll talk to sense into him.

>No one who takes Selina's character seriously
>Taking Selina's character seriously
People do that?

Nice try but Catwoman is nothing but a thieving trashy thot the whole muh morality thing is a recent dumb addition to her character

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>He said, on a Batship thread on a comic book board on an anime imageposting website, unironically.
Bruh...

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Not him but he didn't really dropped everything since part of her problem was happening in Gotham as well.

Sure, you can keep the orphan and destitute thing where Selina steals her way to wealth, but this Robin Hood shit sucks and takes the fun out of the character. That's the usual crutch of comic writers not knowing how to write villains as protagonists without having them battling crime and helping people. Selina's better of as an amoral and unrepentant thief who steals for the thrill of it and because she likes living the good life.
>He doesn't see the poverty, suffering, and desperation of the poor of Gotham
Now you're doing a disservice to Batman again.

But Selina of all people? She's a pretty awful character to take seriously.

I always imagine she's like Oogie Boogie, except if you pulled her thread she'd unravel and just be a humanoid mass of STDs.

where were these heroes during the Tienanmen square massacre?

In the tank.

>the whole muh morality thing is a recent dumb addition to her character
>He said, forgetting that time in the 1940's when she literally worked undercover for the cops.
You lose again, man.

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>A character with a 70+ year history, more than any other female character in the Batman franchise, is pretty awful to take seriously.
No. Just no. There's more material on her than any other of the Bat's ladyfriends.

That doesn't stop her being a pretty boring character. Just because they keep using her doesn't change that, and changing her origin doesn't do that either. "Thief that Batman has a blind spot for sometimes for no reason" isn't a character I would ever take seriously.

>Posting the only example of the one writer who used this backstory, which was subsequently never used again.
Frank Miller, Mindy Newell, Ed Brubaker, Tom King and Joelle Jones aren't "one writer".

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Not at all. Holly Golightly is one of the most notoriously fun characters in movie history. She's also morally ambiguous in many ways. But Catwoman was always written with a good streak in her, so she was never concieved as amoral or unrepentant. But it's the tension thereon that makes for a good relationship.

>Doing a disservice to Batman again.
No. You can write Batman well without resorting to Batfaggy fanboying over how fucking perfect he is. Bermejo literally did a whole one shot on how he struggles with the grey area between poverty and crime. He's not omniscient, nor does his point of view capture the whole picture. That's not to say he's a brute, but you cannot really understand poverty without having lived it, and his greatest superpower, his wealth and excellence, become in some ways his greatest blindspot. That's what the whole Noel novel was about.

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where's Jezebel Jett?

>Give Harley another 50 years of development and then let's check back and see where she stands.
You don't even need any development. All you need to do is draw parallels. It's just that easy. Here i'll do it.

What's the main element of Batman that distinguish from the other DC heroes? The fact that he tries to understand, empathize, help, and ultimately redeem his rogues. Even the worst of them like the Joker. You can extrapolate that to his relationship with Gotham itself. He tries to understand, empathize, help, and ultimately redeem his hell-hole of a city. This locks him an abusive cycle, be it with his rogues or his city, where all he gets out of it is the progressive loss of his sanity, life, and even loved ones. Despite that he keeps giving more and more of himself to his rogues and city. Like a battered wife.
So because of this Harley is the one woman who can truly understand and empathize with Batman. They're the same. Two broken individuals that were molded by an abusive relationship, something that started even in their childhood - Batman first relationship with the real Gotham came when the city took his parents away from him -, and because of that now they're a little batty and co-dependent. Maybe together they can heal each other up in ways nobody else can do for them.

Now you just need an arc to point that out where it ends with Batman and Harley Queen locking lips and there you, the new status quo.

Several comics disprove this.

None of those artists ever showed her as having a pimp, nor did they connect that pimp to her rise as Catwoman. Hell, Miller even has her beating the shit out of the same character who beat her up in "Sister's Keeper." She may or may not have been a hooker (the same way Holly Golightly may have been), but she never had a pimp.

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70+ years history where she would rarely show up.

That telling make sense. But you do some serious damage if the nexus of their bonding is the fact that they both tried, and failed, to save the same psychopath. That's by definition a relationship that's destined to fail because it weakens the characters and makes them look needy.

>That's by definition a relationship that's destined to fail because it weakens the characters and makes them look needy.
Like BatCat?

So she had a break in the 50's. At least she wasn't invented by Bruce Timm and Paul Dini.

To be honest, i'm not saying you should pair Batman and Harley Quinn. I'm just saying that drawing parallels and shit between characters is pretty easy and even a fun exercise to do. The hard part of a good romance isn't so much that, but if they're fun and endearing when written together.

See below.
Each character strengthens the character where they need it the most. That's the definition of a good relationship. Not "lol we were both abused by the Joker." That's crazy talk.
Also the Joker is overrated and overused, infinitely more than Catwoman. Harley is just an extention of him, and shipping her with Batman is just for people who don't have the balls to just have Batman gay it up with the clown. This is objectively true.

youtube.com/watch?v=qfXJoAtAj8o

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This, because i want to see the kid they have. Hopefully its twins male and female and the girl grows up amazon and the boy as a robin.

Yeah I get that. And I'm not saying not to do it, nor am I against writers who try to ship Batman with other characters. But doing so relies on making up more about the characters than we might currently have. Harley Quinn is essentially a less developed character than Selina at this point, so you have be be more inventive and subtle with your writing. That's all. If you think Bats and Harley (or anyone else) could kick it, by all means write that story.

KeK

I feel you're just reducing Batman to a single word and definition: the aristocratic, all so you can sell Catwoman as a key character that provides something Batman lacks. Catwoman is not needed. That's the truth of it. None of Batman's love interests are needed. They're fluff.
Batman's not omniscient nor does he understand everything, but Batman is not the caricature that he created of Bruce Wayne either. Otherwise there's no point to Batman. Batman's something outside the bounds of societal conventions and rules. He's the eyes and fist in the dark that's there for those ignored, those in need, those who would end up as statistics. That's why Jim Gordon, the police commissioner, consults with him. Because Batman can do what cops aren't allowed or won't simple do. That's why most stories now copy Batman Begins and have Bruce abandoning his entire wealth and prestige to go live dirty poor among the bums and criminals to better understand the plights of those that live in the margin of society. Like a kick-assing Buddha. Because Batman's supposed to be more than an aristocratic.

I understand you, but i disagree with you about Harley Quinn being less developed as a character than Catwoman. Catwoman, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, even Joker himself. They aren't well-rounded characters with huge mythos and such. I'm not saying they're bad, but there's not much meat there. You can easily examine them and add to or twist them. Catwoman just have been pushed as a romantic interest longer, but those stories aren't terrible original or complex.

I feel that you can easily write a romantic story with Batman and any other character. You just have to think of parallels and think of an arc where they hook up in ways that make a modicum of sense. You can have Batman and Killer Croc, for example, and that would make sense and be entertaining, and true to their characters. You just need to think it out for an hour or so.

It's way more than that. Sure, he lives on the streets for a while, but that's cause he chooses to. And then he goes back to his wealth, and uses it to finance his crusade. Batman relies on the intrastructure of Wayne enterprises for his Batgear, and (more importantly) the infrastructure of the justice system that Jim Gordon provides. Without the Gordon's men throwing the bad guys in custody, even for a limited time, Batman couldn't operate like he does. He operates outside the law, but requires help to do so, keeping his rule about never becoming an assassin intact. Without that, who knows where he'd be?

But Selina lacks all that. She lacks the initial wealth, and she has no cops who have her back. She's totally alone with the exception of (mabe) Batman. That's why she impugns his methods to some degree. Not just because he's an aristocrat, but because he needs even a token infrastructure to succeed. Without Gordon putting the guys in custody, he runs the risk of becoming like a Punisher type character, who just kills the guys who can't be put away. Selina quells that fear in him because she, like he, does not kill.

Yeah. That makes sense too. It's all about what you look for. They're always going to be side characters in the end.

King ruining Batman-catwoman for me with bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat bat-cat autism

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BatCat was ruined for me by remembering it's fucking nonsense.

>a disservice to Batman
Catwoman's whole existence can be summed up as a disservice to Batman. The idea that Batman doesn't care about (poor) people and a fucking cleptomaniac does more to help people is absurd. In year one the first thing Bruce does is hit the streets to see how poor and impoverish people live. He funds Lezle's clinic, gives scholarships and runs the Wayne foundation. In Morrison's run he saw to it that a young prostitute got a job. The fuck has Catwoman ever done for anyone? Bitch couldn't even save Hollie.

Whenever pressed into a corner Catwoman lets out her truste; "We are both criminals", bullshit. Catwoman is the definition of a toxic parasitic thot. All she does is take and belittle never actually giving back anything.

I get what he was trying to do, making the characters seem like they care for each other and such. But it doesn't fucking work. You can't make these retarded pet names go on like that and have it not be fucking annoying.

I get that he wanted to make it lighthearted. But FOR GOD'S SAKE PLAY TO YOUR STRENGTHS THEN. He has one of two choices - either adapt the banter from Bogart and Bacall for some more serious, noir-ish banter, or go for something more Cary Grant/Audrey inspired if you want something more comic. But don't do this lame Hallmark Valentine's day card bullshit.

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Who hurt you?

Remember in Salvation Run when she ratted out MMH to save her own skin, leading to him getting killed?

That's definitely the sort of person Batman would go for.

King also turned batman into a absolute raging turbo autist
Who gets even more depressed that his sorta ex-villianess GF left him for the umpteenth time
I would have been very happy and completely satisfied if joker showed to the wedding and blew her brains out

That's probably the best way it could go. Remove an annoying character, add some more trauma to Batman, make The Joker even more of a villain. He hasn't been allowed to change something permanently for a while.

>Batman relies on the intrastructure of Wayne enterprises for his Batgear, and (more importantly) the infrastructure of the justice system that Jim Gordon provides. Without the Gordon's men throwing the bad guys in custody, even for a limited time, Batman couldn't operate like he does. He operates outside the law, but requires help to do so, keeping his rule about never becoming an assassin intact. Without that, who knows where he'd be?
See, now you got me thinking and Catwoman would be interesting if she was actually willing to get her pawns dirty and kill, then she'd truly be a counter-point to him, but she won't because that would become an obstacle to their romance and DC has been progressively blowing those walls to make their dynamic an OTP thing.
>Selina quells that fear in him because she, like he, does not kill.
But what fear? That what feels hollow in their current dynamic. Sure, Selina lacks the initial wealth and the help of cops, minus those that she bangs or pays, or the justice system, but she's no vigilante despite DC trying to make us believe so. She's a thief. It's their goals that are different, not so much their methods, so there isn't much that Batman can't relate to her when it comes to that. Because Catwoman isn't out there putting criminals away and when she does it, guess what? The justice system is there to take them away for her.

That's why i felt that the BatCat relationship in Batman Return was so interesting, and probably why it stuck so much with casuals, other than the more obvious reasons. There was a true parallel between the two in that, much like there was between Batman and Andrea Belmont in BTAS. They were both trying avenge something done to them, but while Batman wanted justice and a life, Catwoman (and Andrea) wanted revenge and ultimately death. It was tragic.

>I get that he wanted to make it lighthearted.
Lighthearted? The whole thing is based on some dumb and emo idea about mutual suicide.

I didn't say he was successful.

He didn't die tho.

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wonderbat of china and jason and artemis are the best

Honestly, if DC has kept Catwoman as a true femme fatale i think she'd be more entertaining. You could also keep the pairing indefinitely without any deviations from the status quo. You can write a seductress thief who is out only for herself and isn't above playing with the heart of the protagonist to get her way, and make it fun, endearing, and light. Make the two aware of the game, like during the golden age, where both Batman and Catwoman are having fun with their battle of wits and chase, and you won't need anything else. She can come off as a fun character that is a hero in one arc where she helps and a villain in another where she ruin Batman to keep it fresh.

But nooo, DC had to do this Robin Hood crap. If i wrote the Catwoman ongoing i'd just turn her into Carmen Sandiego. Focus on an interpol office who's obsessed with getting Catwoman and have him chase her around the globe, always getting too late to catch her, but sometimes being helped by her where he (or she) are able to arrest other important criminals with the help of Catwoman. Catwoman keeps taunting the officer by keeping things personal and friendly, and make it obvious Catwoman is ahead of the game and utter control, which just drives the office up the walls.

That thumbs up from dent as he gets cut in half is great.

Like I know its him flippin a coin, but the implication that hes pretty okay with this is a nice sentiment

I don't think they were born yet, and the group of super revolutionaries lead by Iron Dragon General who preceded them in part were spurred to action by that.

Most of DC's treatment of the BatCat stuff lately is retarded. OTPs are by definition retarded. But there's a difference between that and characters that are simply well written.

Selina's not an assassin tho, despite how she's been wronged. She's the bastard daughter of Carmine Falcone, who's mother/foster father were likely assassinated to remove loose ends. She def has skin in the game, but like Batman, chooses not to become an assassin like those who made her an orphan. You even have her flirting with a literal gunman in the When in Rome series, which is a symbol of her struggle with the idea, but in the end, she choses against it.

But none of that takes away from her being a counter-point to Batman, because in the end they're compliments, not opposites. Just like Valjean and Javert compliment each other in some dark way.

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Honestly, King was the worst thing that could happen to this ship. I feel that he pretty much killed. I mean, where do you go after a failed wedding where Catwoman leaves Batman at the fucking altar? All because she thinks that for Bruce to be Batman he must remain miserable?

I don't know why the fans don't give him crap for it.

>Just like Valjean and Javert compliment each other in some dark way.
Just want to point out that both characters are based on the same person.

That's a different way of taking the character, but that would work as well desu. More light and fun, but no less readable.

Even femme fatales have a bit more to them tho, so you can't blame anyone for wanting to make their relationship a bit more than a game.

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But when you make it more than a game you run the risk of people actually taking their time to examine the possibility of a lasting thing, and that's when problems start to pile up, while the game is ever-lasting. I feel that's the main problem of the paring currently. DC tried to make it more than a game and in their attempt ended up changing Catwoman too much and making the pairing a lot less fun.

>Honestly, King was the worst thing that could happen to this ship. I feel that he pretty much killed.
That was the best thing for it.

Exactly.

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That's fixed with tone tho. Same with the eternal back and forth with the Joker.

>But what fear.
Wanted to address this too. "Fear" is a strong word for Batman. Idk if he fears it. But it is a weakness of his that's never really been addressed. The killing Joke came close to doing it by taking away Gordon, but there's never really been a treatment of what would happen should Batman lose his access to the infrastructure of the justice system. Catwoman, I think, is a way to potentially explore that. Maybe she's the counterpoint, not to Batman, but to Gordon, the true outlaw that helps Batman be who he is, and not an assassin, without the cop's help. She helps him become not just an unsanctioned police enforcer, but a true outlaw.

KILL IT SO IT CAN RISE AGAIN.

So what you're saying is, Batman should marry Jim Gordon.

Too late. Babs already got to him first.

Perhaps. Maybe it's just but i don't find the current Catwoman fun. Look, the Brubaker run was an interesting and fun read, but i feel that it took something from Catwoman when he turned her into a discount Batman with the East End thing. It confined her to a spot in the city and Catwoman as a Robin Hood-like vigilante is so boring. Even Robin Hood himself is played out.

For me the ideal character type for Catwoman is pic related.
>Fujiko Mine (峰 不二子 Mine Fujiko) is an intelligent and crafty thief who will use her feminine charms to get what she wants from any man. She is also an expert when it comes to firearms and even rivals Lupin when it comes to her burglary and disguise skills. Fujiko is sometimes an associate in his schemes, sometimes a rival, knowing full well that his infatuation with her will mean that he will forgive her for double-crossing him at times. She will also routinely make deals with Zenigata or Lupin's current enemy in an attempt to gain her freedom or to hopefully gain a piece of the loot he is after.
This is a fun character. Even more of a feminist one as well. Because she's unrepentant about who she is and won't change herself or goals for any man. Men are tools for her to get what she wants.

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That'd be true, if Catwoman didn't always have a detective or cop that helps her out in every ongoing she has. Catwoman always have a Jim Gordon backing her out as well.

This ship is the only Canon.

No, a good woman will show up and save him. Shut up. There's hope for m- i mean, Batman.

That's a perfectly reasonable interpretation too desu. It's not the one I prefer, but I certainly don't have a problem with it.

Don't underestimate the Robin Hood stuff tho. Read the original medieval texts, like the "Geste of Robyn Hode" from the 14th cent or so. They're fucking edgy as hell, and goes way beyond the Erroll Flynn tropes. Exploring the character of a true outlaw is rarely done these days, much less a female one.

She has associates, but nothing like Batman has with Gordon.

DC's embarrassment over the Balent period is really self-defeating. catwoman was probably one of DC's pillar characters for a while in the 90's. Just make her a purple kitty with big titties again.

BIG KITTY TITTIES

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In all fairness tho, as much as I love Balent's big hair, bigger boob, supermodel look, Joelle Jones', and the recent look in general, is fucking fine. I love the black cat burglar look.

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She looks like a spider.

That is good, and the cowl helps a lot. The goggles really needed to go. I get Cooke is a legend and all, but they only looked good in his style for the most part, and they killed the cat look.

She looks like a fetish model.

Not always.

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I get why people didn't like the goggles, but I loved Cooke's take.

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So what's your point?

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Delusional Catfags have taken over this thread

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So contribute something worthwhile you faggot. We're sick of carrying this thread. Your fucking turn.

this or Zatanna X Bat

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>This retard.
Anons posted some stuff about Catwoman that created legit discussion. You got a problem with that, then bring up a compelling case that's on topic and see if you can do just as well.

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>ZatannaxBatman
You managed to find a ship worse than BatCat. Congratulations!

Why? They're both orphans with tragic past that live a double life and are huge messes of a people. They even suffer from compulsion: her to do magic and him to burst people's head.

WONDER-BAT

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It's not my go-to but Zatanna could actually be fun. Not explored that often desu, but worthwhile.

Don't listen to this fag, sho just wants to gainsay everything without making an actually interesting point.

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It looks great in cooke's style. Outside of it, , they look clunky and look best when they're on top of the head, like
Otherwise they give her a weird double ear thing in more detailed art styles.

To be honest, i'd love to write a psycho-sexual take on this duo. I'd go all 80's Grant Morrison on it. I've several ideas in my head.

I doubt DC would publish, though. It'd get weird and... uncomfortable.

What would Bruce call Wonder Woman? Hawk? Eagle? Sword?

Agreed. They can also can look bugeye-ish which doesn't do her any favors. They make sense tho in a functional sense.

My own pet theory is that her suit, goggles (with detective vision), and cowl with earlike listening inserts were all propotypes from Waynetech that she stole at the beginning of her career. So Catwoman and Batman literally come from the same origin a certain sense, being both equipped by the same outfitter.

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>So detail it here.
Or at least an outline ffs. Who knows, maybe you'll learn to draw real well and just publish it online as a passion project, totally public domain. DC can suck it imho.

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Heh. Sword.

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This image raises a lot of question, specially that evil smirk.

Cheeky.

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>Oogie boogie and not Sally
>Hurtful.
C'mon man. You don't think it's by accident that Batman Returns and Nightmare came out like a year apart and both featured sewn-up leading ladies?

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STFU BOOMER

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Another thread for WonderBat chads

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So pretty

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Every one of you forgot the original love interest. Batman and Robin, Batman is a rich bachelor who runs around, dressed in tights, with a younger man dressed in bright tights, and they look for "bad guys" all night long. Clearly its meant to be

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Sorry frend. WW straight up told Bats to stay with Catwoman. Nice vaguely fetishistic fan art tho.

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That's just Batman and Wonder Woman being too noble for their own good, which kinda sells the idea that they're perfect for each other.

Tom King messed it up when he wrote that arc to try and dismiss the WonderBat shipping in favor of his BatCat OTP. It showed to much chemistry and sexual tension between the two, and top of portraying them as correct and self-sacrificing. He should have just done what he did with Talia and portrayed Wonder Woman as a hoe undeserving of Batman who doesn't get Bruce either.

Not everyone has to be a hoe just so that Bats doesn't have to get with them.

The super friends thing works pretty well desu.

Yeah, but Tom King was pretty transparent with what he attempted to do with Talia. Or even Wonder Woman before it. Hell, even the arc preceding it with Clark and Lois. Lois before has always been the biggest detractors of Catwoman, but in that arc she was all chummy with Catwoman. King knows that the Superman & Batman friendship is important and wanted to signal that Superman and his wife were in favor of Catwoman character and the wedding.

They almost did.

King wanted to shoot down any perceived problems or obstacles to the wedding the readers and, specially, fandoms, might have, so people would buy the idea that the wedding would really happen and it'd all be perfect. He was pretty smart.

The denial of Wonderbat shippers is unreal

Not that user but I don't think you understand what he means. King was trying to dismiss Wonderbat but by his own admission, he kinda failed. He did the same thing to Talia by trying to portray her as a hoe. Going that route would have been a better strategy as all he accomplished was the opposite.

Talia's not a hoe (not unless you count that bed full of women behind her). She's just crazy.

What denial? They were too noble to act on their desires, it is right fucking there.

I was expecting more than one other person to agree with me

and apparently fucking Jimmy

And at this point Catwoman has more and consistent material than Wonder Woman—who people have trouble figuring if she should be female Thor or female Superman for the majority of her runs

I honestly don't care that much about shipping. I just think that the arcs leading up to the wedding were poorly handled. It was all too transparent, contrived, and forced. I think because of this it ended backfiring some.

Remember, Tom King had no real intention to actually have Batman and Catwoman get married either, because this whole things has been a pity party about Batman being build up all so he can be broken more and more. So he needed to get the readers, media, and so on invested in the wedding as a legit change to the status quo, before pulling the carpet.

So the arcs leading up to it tried to tackle pretty much up any obstacle a reader might voice about the wedding maybe not happening. The super-friends won't accept Batman marrying a villain/criminal. Wonder Woman (because of fandom) will pose a threat. Talia al Ghul (again because of fandom) will pose a threat. The Joker (duh) will pose a threat. The Bat-Family won't accept Batman marrying Catwoman. Damian Wayne, the troubled heir, won't accept Batman marrying any woman other than his mother. And so on.

It was all done in a very rushed and exaggerated manner, but it worked. People bought that the wedding was really going to happen. Why not after all the effort put into it? And then the wedding came... and it went, and King was probably laughing at everyone.

I know, i'm just talking about King's intentions with that arc.
This. He understood me.

So perfect for Batman.

People need to get it in their heads that Batman isn’t some wholesome dude who just needs a good woman. He’s a shitstain like the rest of Gotham. It’s just that he and Selina happen to be slightly less shitstains than the average Gotham psycho

Catwoman is just a huge shitstain that have backstabbed him way too many times and their stories are always the same. She's played out.

He literally said in several interviews that they only could include her last minute and had nothing planned for her. There was no reason for any “ prior audience approval” that you’re claiming if she was over at CBS, dumbass.

Being in committed relationships with other people and not being an asshole about it =/= nobility.

Yes, she came in last minute and they had no idea initially what to do with her, but the shipping was done in the first episode either. Dumbass.

They were decades in that realm without any idea if they'd ever get back. The fact that they decided to not give in to their mutual attraction and lust, and remain noble to their partner that they haven't seen for years and didn't even knew if they were ever going to, makes them pretty noble. Even to a fault some would say.

You just know Catwoman in the same position wouldn't have done the same.

Except Catwoman was alone with another dude that whole time and was looking for Batman. But why am I surprised, Wonderbat fans only read out of context panels to suit their bullshit. It’s like Zutara all over again

Based

Because they didn’t know what to do with her. Dumbass. The laziest thing you can do to a female character in largely male group is make her the fan favorite’s love interest. Which is what they did. How does it feel to know that crappy ship you dedicated your adolescent life to was an arbitrary decision that mangled Wonder Woman’s history and character just to justify its existence

>Except Catwoman was alone with another dude that whole time and was looking for Batman.
Did you read the comic? Whereas days passed in the normal universe, for Catwoman and the other character (forgot his name), decades passed inside that realm. Catwoman wasn't without Batman for decades.

And Catwoman always had her sexuality amped up to eleven. She's constantly having a string of boyfriends and casual hook up. It's not even uncommon for Catwoman to cuck Batman.

true answer

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They might not have known what to do with her initially, where she hardly talked in most episodes, but eventually they found out and it doesn't even involve Batman, with the shipping being a very minimal thing that happened very sporadically the throughout 4 seasons. So the shipping didn't mangle her history and character.

And it wasn't an arbitrary decision. Wonder Woman kissing Batman on the cheek as a thank you for trying to rescue her in that Gorila Grodd episode wasn't even done purposely by Bruce Timm to set up the ship. It was done by one of the show writers. Only after the positive response by the viewers and the DC comic writers suggesting the pair as a potential couple did Timm then decided to pursue it.

But hey, continue to be butthurt by a stellar cartoon that aired decades ago.

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Why is Batman so upbeat for once in this?

Catwoman. But only as portrayed by Julie Newmar or Lee Merriwether.

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This is the superior choice. I like the animated movie where Catwoman and Batman mocked the ending to Dark Knight Rises.

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You do know that there are other heroes from Gotham too right? Black Canary, Zatanna even Green Lantern. Batman may not be perfect but he ain't no fucking clepto thot like Selina.

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She's so fucking fine.

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>they didn’t know what to do with her
>but they did this specific thing to her

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If they did count you’re going to have to count Kingdom Come, Injustice and Dark Knight Returns and I have a strong feeling you don’t want to count those

I can't say that I buy it. WW and Talia weren't really given that much development overall, just one arc apiece. And beyond WW and Batman being friends who fight alongside each other who won't make out with each other after decades, there really isn't much else to go on. Sure they're both heroes, but that's not enough to make a real relationship. If anything, WW is just a good office buddy.

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Surprised to see so few Superman suggestions. I mean he is the one character he has insane romantic and comedic chemistry with above all others.

WAT? When did that happen??

No... sir, no... please.

Agreed. Idk how many people on this thread just watch the DCAU and are going off of Bruce Timms' stuff. It's cute for the show, but good Lord, it's diversify our material.

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jimmy olsen is damian father....

The flaw here is on King arguably. A) he made her basically a Talia al Ghul clone with cringe-worthy “men are children” lines B) King writes females having no motivation other than the comfort of the male hero (Mister Miracle) so we don’t know or understand how the adventure is affecting her. So when she goes all thot on him it reads like a she’s a mere thirsty cunt. They don’t even exchange meaningful conversations, unless you count chatting about animals.

Even if you’re a WonderBat fan or not, I don’t see how you look at that King issue and not think “this was a terribly written mistake”

Honestly, idk if Catwoman would've fucked another guy in a similar situation. Not in this version at least. She hasn't fucked any guy in her current run after the failed wedding, so it's possible she wouldv'e remained true. King went to great lengths, despite his bullshit, to show that Selina really *does* love Batman, *and* she has very hight standards. So don't get too down on her.

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When? In what version?

I agree. The only thing that's a real win about that issue is Jones' art, which gives the characters way more life and personality than their lines do. She succeeds in *spite* of the writing. I'm trying to cut King a lot of slack in trying to read in what he's *trying* to do with these arcs, but I grant you they're 90% cringe when they try to get serious. He can't fucking write women.

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There are daily threads on reddit how DC comics and DCEU should adapt Timms work beat for beat. If these are typical DC fans, no wonder their comics universe is struggling. They cultivated a fandom who is set on one perverts ideal, so I guess it’s on them

>Bruce Timm, a pervert.
Pls say it ain't so (Batgirl seks notwithstanding). The DCAU is top notch, don't get me wrong. Me and my sibs grew up with it. But that's far from the only source you should use for your expectations on other media, whether they be comics or film.

But that said,
>Reddit.

You mad, Redditposting Timmfags?

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Oh his inability to write WW specifically or read editorial notes came the issue after wherein he randomly added her suddenly remembering she had a boyfriend. It’s pretty clear at that moment he didn’t know who he was writing until some significant deserved backlash probably made actually look her up on Wikipedia.

Which just means to me that King used Diana as a tool. He’s not the first DC writer to do that, nor would he be the last. But the fact needs to be stated.

Truth. That's a very fair assessment.

The Steve Trevor namedrop there doesn't help the WonderBat fans. It shows that WW already had the chance to love years ago. But she's also over a hundred years old. Batman's like 30something, and this is the only chance he's had to really love someone like WW once did.

As a person who doesn’t hate the WW/Trevor relationship like the rest of Yea Forums does, the name drop wasn’t even that necessary. You could even have her and Bats go all the way as long they address the fact that she was pretty into this other dude, because, golly gee, that’s whats going on in her own book.

But to bring it up after the big “cliffhanger” exposed Kings lack of study when writing these characters. And if I was a reader of Batman or Wonder Woman I would find that unprofessional

I don't think you understand the points being raised about that arc.
What King tried to do with those arcs was dismiss both Wonder Woman and Talia al Ghul as valid love interests. I'm even quite surprised that he didn't an arc featuring Zatanna as well.
But in that Wonder Woman arc, he showed Batman and Wonder Woman as noble individuals that will always put others above themselves. First by making and keeping a promise to some random guy to go guard a realm where they'll have to fight-off demons 24/7 without respite, and then by remaining faithful to their partners despite being locked in that realm for decades together and yearning for each other. Then you also have the two working seemsly together, without even having to speak, always having each other, even to remind themselves to remain "good" for their partners instead of succumbing to mutual temptation. That all coupled with the art oozing sexual tension and you've a situation where readers just kinda find both characters too noble for their own good. It doesn't help that Catwoman constantly puts Batman down as a hero and person throughout the run.

>but good Lord, it's diversify our material.
But doing BatCat? Come on, man.

You want to diversify? Here. I give you the real DC Power Couple.

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Alright. I’ll give WonderCat a go.

>It shows that WW already had the chance to love years ago. But she's also over a hundred years old.
Wonder Woman isn't 100 years old in the comic.

Very. It was shoddy writing.
And I make that same point to you. You're reading into the arc, particularly the art, which is very good, too much. The characters as written are kind of shit, beyond the fact that they do hero stuff together. But beyond that, WW is developed that strongly in that scene. Maybe King was trying to dismiss her as a legitimate rival to Selina, but even there I think he fails because there's not a ton of depth there.

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This...this is how madmen are created.

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>WonderWonderWonderWonderCATS!!!!

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for whatever reason i really like the batman/ wonder woman pairing.

im not sure why. maybe because bruce as a character is so adept at everything, the only woman who could successfully match him is superhuman

Look, I like that you’re reading depth into that issue but I have to say there isn’t much written substance to back that up.

These implications are fine based on what we may assume about these characters but it doesn’t show much here with Kings inability to write good interaction between characters.

It’s the same thing with the “It’s been 10 years” excuse. Yeah it’s stated in text but we really don’t get the feel of that with these characters. Honestly if they left the “10 years” text out I would’ve assumed their entire adventure happened within a day.

With any other writer I may have seen what you’re seeing, but with King all we got were a string of random meaningless conversations and fighting demons that capped off with a cliffhanger.

If King is relying on this much subtext to tell a simple damn story then he’s fucking lazy. Like another threader implied artists really pull most of the weight with King

>remembers WWs Cheetah is now a lez

Maybe we’re on to something here boys

>Oh look, a superhuman Amazon with nearly limitless strength can beat up a cat burglar with no special powers.
That's a low bar you've set for yourself, son. But it doesn't matter. Selina still gets Batman, and WW doesn't.

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I'm not really talking about the writing, though, just the impression one could get from that comic based on the entire situation. I agree with you that the writing is terrible. First the whole situation is contrived as fuck, second you've Wonder Woman being written the same way his Catwoman is: constantly mocking Bruce for being ridiculous because of the Batman thing. I mean, i just don't get this. Selina is a grown woman that dresses as a cat and poor like a cat. Wonder Woman, likewise, is a fucking Barbie Princess in modern day wearing a tiara and all. Who the fuck are they to criticize Bruce for dressing up as a rodent? Nigga even have all the cool ninja gadgets and shit. Bunch of plebs these women. What i was i even talking about? Goddamn, i completely lost my train of thought.

But yeah, that arc was stupid. The art really sold the chemistry. And whatever point King was trying to make with that story... by the way, have you all realized that King write comic arcs as if he was writing fanfic? Like, he comes up with a single theme and then that to write a story that forcefully fits that theme. With this arc was bullshit: "Things you do without your special one feels boring, or "everlasting". The whole arc tries to push this stupid shit. So the guy that was married and lived in this realm found the horde ever-lasting, because he's all alone. Batman and Wonder Woman that went there to give the guy some time with his wife, also found the horde ever-lasting because they were away of their loved ones. The comic then ends with the note that next time Batman and CATWOMAN will be the ones going, and because they're a couple perhaps the horde won't be ever-lasting. Real great, King. Upvoted. But then you stop to think a bit, and wait, if Batman and Wonder Woman had given in and started fucking, would they still feel that the hordes were ever-lasting? How about that King? Did you think of that you bald fuck. But i'm joking.

No, i totally agree with you. I was going based mostly about the impression the story might lend and how that might have backfired King's intentions a bit. The arc, in all honesty, is shitty, and he just doesn't know how to the characters voice right. My girlfriend said to me "Oh, i can see that he's trying to get Wonder Woman's inflections, like Rucka writes her, but it still feels wrong." I had to tell her that no, King writes everyone as talking like robots.

WonderBat shipper reporting in.

But BatCat is canon and I have no complaints. Anyone who says otherwise is in denial.

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Cringe
Based

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Yeah. Shit just came out of nowhere. It's just sentimental crap.

BatCat is canon by virtue of not being able to remain canon. That's why they push BatCat. Because it always gets reverted to status quo with Batman alone and miserable. If writers tried to write Batman into other relationships, whatever they may be, they'd have to come up with new ways to end them. And that's hard. That's at most they'll throw a random normie who will either get fridge or pushed away because of danger.

So the actual canon is that Batman is Forever Alone.

As much as i like the pairing, i find myself giggling imagining the suffering Byrne went through when he was getting bullied by writers shipping Wonder Woman with Superman.

Daily reminder if WW had an orgasm her pussy would involuntarily clench and cut Batman's dick off.

Not so based when you really thing about it...

youtube.com/watch?v=FkHGdgDhLj8

How does Steve survive? Is that nigga an eunuch?

Also, Bat-Penis Reinforcement Mk2.

Batman fucked a New God, bro. New Gods > Old Gods. He can handle it.

Comics are naturally cyclical. Same reason the Joker always gets out of Arkham. So you can say that any trope is canon by not being able to remain canon.

But this Forever Alone bullshit is too close to the ground Tom King is standing on. He and Paul Dini push this idea that heroes can only be heroes when they're miserable. And that's just fucking tired. So far as I'm concerned, regardless of how you end the narrative, you should give Batman at least the capacity for a serious relationship.

The reality is tho that BatCat is "canon" because she's is oldest relationship, premiering only a short time after Batman himself. Batman and Catwoman have the longest history together, and therefore more material to riff on when authors are looking for a relationship.

Steve was a bad lay who never got WW off. She just loves him because he took her Wondercherry. But if she was ever married to him, Batman, or any mortal, it'd be either a orgasm-less marriage for our girl Diana, which sucks, or her hubby would have his dick sheared off in the throes of passion.

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If we're going by oldest, then Julie Madson wins. Or Kathy Kane, that was actually written to be a serious love interest by the creators. Catwoman is just a safe option because there's a fail-safe built in therein.

Sorry, user. But Batman managed survive Superman. Wonder Woman simple doesn't compare. Even Superman wasn't the same after the first experience. Now every time he folds like a deck of cards for Batman.

>He fucked a New God. Literally the New God of love and fucking.
Yeah. The New Gods have more control. Aphrodite bedded tons of mortals in Greek mythology, and they all surivived it. But Amazons always end up killing the men they sleep with. There's no getting around that.

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>Paul Dini push this idea that heroes can only be heroes when they're miserable.
Bullshit, Dini is a Batman Zana fan he was going to make Bruce confess his love to her in Heart of Hush but Catwoman ruined it

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Kinky.

Bekka is accustomed to tangle with Orion, the Dog of War.

>Amazons always end up killing the men they sleep with
Bullshit Hypolita fucked Wildcat and he is fine

Shit. Not Paul Dini. Dan DiDio. Dan DiDio's the one pushing this idea that heroes can only be heroes when they're miserable.

I had a brainfart. Got my Italians mixed up.

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Editors blocked, for obvious reasons. She's from a different franchise that the Batman Editors can't claim 100% control. It'd also be harder to come up with ways to write Zee away for any new Batman writer that wants to explore Batman.

>girlfriend finally convinces you to finger her
>towels, ziplock bag of ice and digits, and a trip to the hospital
>will never play the piano again

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>remembered that Wildcat trained and fucked Catwoman
We've to go deeper. We will eventually get to Kevin Bacon somehow.

...but she isn't. He obvs never got her off.

Too bad. So sad.

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IF THEY HURRY AND SOW IT ON MAYBE THEY CAN SAVE THE FINGER.

I won't dispute that. But Catwoman is way more developed than *either* of those two. At least for now.

Where's Mary McGinnis?

Zatanna

[citation needed from someone who sounds so sure about what you said]

Most people who don’t read WW sound way too sure of themselves when it comes to her comics.

Pretty obvious when you look at it.

This is not the face of a sexually satisfied woman...

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I hate silver WW and I hate N52 but damn that outfit slowly grows on me. I blame the pants. It looks so fitting.

Why do I love when Diana is full of herself. The angry look at the end is confusing though, she is not threatened and no reason to threaten Catwoman.

BASED

sasha or talia are the only ones for me. they understand batman on a bigger scale. diana does too but the power dynamic is dull

sasha & talia understand what bruce is and the lengths he'll go through for the mission

fuck morrison for blowing the chance to cement that bruce wasn't drugged and making it consensual

instead he reinforced it even more

piss off selinafag

she left bruce at the alter because her friend told her that she makes bruce happy and she couldn't have that because fuck making somebody happy. have to have miserable bruce because that's the bruce she fell in love with, not changing the man with a lifetime of childhood ptsd

selina is a selfish cunt and deserves a bullet from the joker

See, this is what King has done.

Selina left Bruce at the altar because Tom King is a shitty writer.

>Taking Tom King this seriously.
Hello, newfren. Good to see you're finally old enough to use the internets on your own.

Srsly tho she was never written as just a selfish cunt. She always had a streak of good in her that Batman saw and tried to work with. See supra:

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Selina left Bruce because shes a shitty person and King is a shitty writer.
Why the fuck would Selina even listen to Holly when holly wouldnt turn herself in. Hell selina is still fucking wanted by police for that shit. But king dropped that shit for his bane shit

doesn't matter. it happened, it's canon and selina is a selfish cunt for it. but it's entirely in character for her, she's always been selfish and incapable of being selfless. everything she does to "help" somebody is to make up for some part of herself trying to feel better because deep down she knows she's a whore who steals shit

at least diana is pure at heart even though wonderbats is a cancerous ship as well
at least talia knows exactly who she is and never pretends around bruce and knows who he is as well
at least zatanna and bruce have the childhood connection and she knows him before he became batman and fully shed the wayne persona

selina will always be in deinal. always the bad broken girl pretending to be the occasional vigilante, but never steals and gives it all away, it's always for her "lifestyle" first, her needs comes first because wahhh i had a rough childhood too

kill yourself, cat burglar selina is just a black cat ripoff anyway, she was always just some boring dull animal-themed villain that nobody gave a fuck about. miller making her a whore was the right call because even he knew cat burglar selina is a ripoff of superior felicia

>Selina left Bruce because shes a shitty person
Fictional characters don't really exist, user. They're only shitty if writers write them shitty.

>Black Cat premiered in 1979
>Catwoman premiered in 1940
Sorry mate. If anything, Felicia's the ripoff. The original is always superior.

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Seconded

Modern Selina still copied Black Cat, though.

Nah dude, she's just a loner. What she fears is authority and commitment, and prefers being independent.

no, it's the characterization

no shit selina came first, but she was always just a throwaway villain for batman

felicia was the actual cat burglar themed from the start. classic selina got bored and divorced her husband and stole jewelry because it "excited" her since she was selfish and didn't care about her marriage because, surprise, she's a cunt

deep down selina is the manic pixie dream girl. she was created to be a potential cock sleeve for batman but that's it. her development didn't come until FORTY! years after she was created. miller, brubaker, duffy and loeb were the only ones to really take her anywhere. meanwhile, felicia goes through multiple decades of character growth properly with her evolving relationship with peter and even mj-shippers can admit that felicia is worth competition

meanwhile, everybody knows that catbat is cancer

How so? If anything, the modern look adapted Tim Burton's look from the 1992 film Batman Returns, which was the first to give her that all black catsuit.

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Everyone got new backstories in the 80's. But she totally had plenty of development up til then. Batman always fancied her, far more than he would a throwaway villian, even letting her escape a few times back during their first encounters in the 40's.

If you want manic pixie dream girl, go check out Harley Quinn. Selina has always been Batman's femme fatale. Deal with it.

How are people still shipping Bruce with Talia ?
She is despicable and vile than Selina with no single morally redeeming quality
Also Batwonder fags there is more chance for Batanna
Than Wonderbat
Sorry DCEU kiddos
Keep dreaming

Zee is tied to Constantine forever, mate.

she had no development until the 80s, you deal with it

batman fancied her, exactly what i said, she was supposed to be his cum dumpster. she was his only token female villain, him letting her "escape" was so he could try to get his dick wet later. talia had more development in 3 issues than selina did in 40 years.

selina is about a much as a femme fatale as much as punisher is a boy scout. just because she's mysterious and bad doesn't quantify her as one. andrea is more of a femme fatale than selina and she's hardly one herself

nobody gives a single fuck about harley and her relationship to batman. selina existed since day 1 to give some t&a to the run. even modern selina exists purely to advance bruce's character with no development of her own. textbook mpdg

>He said, ignoring that Catwoman has had more stand-alone runs than any other female associated with Batman.
>Imagine being you, failing this hard.
She has more development than any other chick Batman had a thing for.

Deal with it.

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Zee was always Batman's ladybrah anyway.

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She really doesn't. Specially with the constant reboots and retcons. I mean, i everyone care about to reference is Miller and Brubaker.

but her development is still shit you nimrod

she's a selfish cunt who is incapable of true love. she's broken and had no love as a child

even as broken as bruce is, he had nurturing parents and was about to break out of his grimdark shit and BE HAPPY WITH SELINA UNTIL SHE LEFT HIM BECAUSE SHE DOESN'T WANT TO SEE HIM GROW BECAUSE SHE'S A SELFISH CUNT

the point is that no chick is good for bruce. none. but selina and diana are both tied for being the worst 2. it's just that diana at least is a better character than selina

deal with the cold truth

>No development until the 80s.
>Missing the objectively best version.
Kys retard.

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Everyone's subjected to reboots and retcons tho. You have Miller, Brubaker, Balent, Loeb, and now Jones. And that's ignoring the films and tv shows. Babs probably comes second, along with Harley, Ivy, and Talia in no particular order. But Selina is always the top when it comes to sheer *amount* of material.

You can ship whoever you want idc, but you can't argue with the evidence.

The amount of material doesn't mean anything, specially when it's just her being there for a scene or another, and that's it. Gotham TV show is the most she has appeared in something outside comics.

Babs overshadow her, by the way. Harley Quinn is getting there too.

> tv adaptation
> development
> "oh our source material is complete dogshit, go ahead julie, do whatever you want and sex it up"
> BRAVO SELINA, SUCH A WONDERFUL CHARACTER THAT HAS UNDERGONE SUCH DEVELOPMENT
> ignored in every comic afterwards
> development

why is Two-Face made out of corned beef?

Geez you didn't even read the Tom King version did you? Shitty as it was, Selina left Bruce bc she felt he could only be Batman if he was unhappy. And if he was married to her, he'd be happy. And Gotham needs Batman. That's what the whole shitshow with Booster Gold was meant to show.

Can you not even read?

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this

that other dumb selinafag thinks that quantity > quality

doesn't matter if she's had a shitload of solos, they're all boring derivative shit of writers trying to recapture/hybridize miller & loeb

>Selina left Bruce bc she felt he could only be Batman if he was unhappy. And if he was married to her, he'd be happy. And Gotham needs Batman.
This is really dumb and makes Selina look conceited.

God, i'm honest, but i feel that King's ruining Batman character for good.

Okay, I'll tell you PERFECT way to Batman having "relationships" to please everyone except for braindead shippers:
>flirting and teasing with Catwoman in Batman comics
>flirting and teasing with random sluts like Vicky Vale in detective comics, he'll do it as Bruce Wayne though
>flirting and teasing with WW in JL comics
>sex in all of these can be subtly implyed, but never shown, leaving reader clueless
>in some random comics Talia still lusting for Batcock but he rejects her
It pleases EVERYONE and keeping Batman's image of playboy and pussy magnet which he canonicly is.

What about Superman, the Joker, and Constantine?

DID YOU MISS MY POINT YOU DUMB FUCK?

SHE'S SELFISH

her IMAGE of bruce is that he needs to be miserable to be an effective batman. which means she's completely incapable of entertaining the notion that bruce can do both.

which makes her selfish. completely and utterly selfish. he's a grown ass man and he's the goddamn fucking batman, if thinks he can marry her and still be batman, then he can fucking do it.

he has a lifetime of trauma and he finally found somebody to put it past him and finally step out of the shadows and be happy and she threw it away because SHE thinks that SHE was right. she learned fucking NOTHING from hanging out with alfred, his fucking father figure, and superman/lois, his best friend/wife who he looks up to for their "normal" life.

she threw his 2nd chance away because of her own fucking ego, she didn't even discuss it with him, she just left him. she might as well built a time machine and shot his parents in front of him again, it was a beyond cruel thing to do to bruce

she's a horrible cunt

>Ignoring the time she saved Batman's life in the 50's.
>Ignoring the first time Batman marries Catwoman.
>Ignoring the birth of their daughtere, Helena.

All of that was prior to the 80's you nonreading fag. And elements from all those were incorporated into stories later on.

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I think you're taking this personally.

He's not ignore those comics, he's saying that those comics are shitty and were ignored by the producers that according to him reinvented the character from the ground up making that iteration a success.

I'll grant you Babs, altho I think Selina still marginally edges her out. And Harley Quinn is only getting there with respect to the bast 5 years or so. But you have the Balent run, the Brubaker run, the New 52, and now the Jones run, along with a bunch of one-shots, etc. That's a solid foundation for a character. Babs aside, Selina is way ahead of anyone else.

Harley Quinn had a comic series before the New 52, as well. Then you've her current multiple ongoings, Suicide Squad, Gotham City Sirens, and so on. Harley is getting there.

Helena Wayne was interesting though
I will give you that
Too bad that it isn't part of main continuity now

Not true tho. You have Selina acting heroically to save both Batman and her brother, you have the potential of a marriage between Bruce and Selina, and you have the introduction of the Huntress. All those are elements that have been woven into the stories today. Sure there were cringe elements prior to the 80's, but Selina fared just as well, if not better, as all the other supporting cast in those days between the 40's and 80's. What's really striking is how *positively* she's portrayed during those decades, really going full over into hero mode way before all this Brubaker stuff.

So this nerd banging on about the 80's just doesn't know anything.

Well, not yet. I'm really giving Tom King a chance to wrentch victory from the jaws of humiliation here, so fingers crossed Helena makes an appearance. But who knows. I'm not getting my hopes up.

Come on, i'm not a BatCat shipper, but you should be better than this. Don't give King money in hopes that he'll have Batman and Catwoman together in the end despite all the shitty writing he does. Don't excuse shitty writing in the name of shipping. Even if he end the run with Batman and Catwoman married and Catwoman pregnant, this won't change the fact he has been ruining these characters for years now with his shitty run,

If you care about Batman or Catwoman, go buy Detective Comics and the Catwoman solo, or something. Anything but King.

You're forgetting to point out that in the late 40s pretty much all of Batman known rogues had reformed. Catwoman wasn't alone. Two-Face did, the Riddler did, and so on. Then the middle 50s rolled up, continuity changed (Earth-1), and they were all back to being villains.

No. He was conivinced of that too. But it doesn't matter.

It was a choice between giving Bruce to Gotham, where he would be Batman and save the city, or keeping Bruce for herself, where he couldn't be Batman and the city would fall. She did the selfless thing and let him go.

For the record I think she thought wrong, but I don't see her being selfish here, especially if you follow her run after the botched wedding to Joelle Jones' series. All that stuff with her and her invalid sister is gold. She's not selfish cunt. Lay off.

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I know, I know. I'm not holding out for anything, much less some hope they'll be shipped in the end. But I'm over halfway through with the run and I just want to see how it ends. Might as well let the clock run. Maybe everyone will be pleasantly surprised, maybe not. But I figure it's not over till the fat lady sings.

That's fair. Idk if the Joker ever did tho. But Selina was largely taken out of the comics during the mid 50's bc of the code, so it's kind of apples and oranges there.

>It was a choice between giving Bruce to Gotham, where he would be Batman and save the city, or keeping Bruce for herself, where he couldn't be Batman and the city would fall.
That's highly conceited of her. It's as if she thought her vagina was made of gold and had the cure to all the world's problems.
>All that stuff with her and her invalid sister is gold.
Caring for YOUR relative, doesn't change anything. You can be selfish and still care for you dad, mom, or brother/sister. They're something you feel ownership towards.

Yeah that's fair. She's the new odds on fave. But Selina's record still stands.

Yeah, but even with the code them all going back to being villains have much more to do with this being a new continuity then the comic code being against unlady like characters like Selina. Everyone was back to being villains. Everyone.

When was the last time Vicki Vale even showed up?

>But I'm over halfway through with the run and I just want to see how it ends.
Come on, man. At least tell me you're not paying for this crap. Please.

>Highly conceited.
Not really. It's kind of hinted that Holly tricked her into thinking that way. But it's not grounded on some idea of her vag being the cure to all problems. All she believes is that her marriage to Bruce will make him happy, which is totally reasonable bc they love each other. But if he's happy, then he can't be Batman and the city will fall. So she gives that up, her life with a man she *genuinely* loves (no reason hitherto to think she doesn't) for the good of the city. Not a correct choice in my mind, but not a selfish one.
>Caring for relatives.
You ever read Pride and Prejudice? D'arcy's sister is the only one Lizzy sees him care for, after he's a rank asshole to everyone else. People with protective barriers on don't show their selflessness like most people. You should know this.

The internet is a glorious thing, I'll say that much.

Yeah. But then she and Bruce still got married after the code was lifted. She was more villanous than in the 40's for sure, but she wasn't evil like many of the characters were. More of an ambiguous antihero with a good streak. One that was always there.

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To be fair, originally they were going with Kathy Kane, aka the Batwoman, as a choice. They changed last minute to Catwoman because they thought her death would give more pathos to Helena Wayne, the Huntress. Since Huntress would always be afraid of crossing the line and ending up a criminal like her mother.

>That fucking spacing.

We have a redditor newfag on our hands boys. Opinion = discarded.

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Some incarnation from the 50 onward were pretty vilainous. So much that later on writers retconned those version to be another character.

Yeah I get you. It was far from set in stone. And even now our current conceptions of the character are deeply colored by Balent and Brubaker, all of which had yet to appear in the 1970s. So Selina's reputation as more of an antihero than a villian was still being established.

True. There was more fluidity back then. Things solidified in the 80s, when things became more noir again and less campy, but there were still threads in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, we find relevant today.

To be honest, about the Earth-2 thing, they still kept her as a reformed villain after the wedding. It's just one of her old henchman blackmail her into stealing shit one last time and later helps kill her. So there's where Huntress conflict comes from.

But in the main continuity, yeah, she was still very much a villain and sometimes certain portrayals of her would go full fucking villain. Like her whole sword period.

The Telltale games.

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Things solidified in the late 70s, actually. When Lee Wein and such started to write her as trying to reform herself and getting together with Batman. To the point pre-CoIE Jason Todd was jealous of her encroaching in. Then the reboot happened in the 80s and she's back to being a villain. Then the movie gets out and she's now full on anti-hero.

All these fucking timelines man. They give me a headache.

I always got the idea that she was more of an anti-hero even in the mid-late 80s. Miller certainly wrote her that way, as did Newell. The "Empowered Prostitute" is a storyline everyone's embarassed by now, but elements of it have survived, even if they've been softened.

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That was so retarded

I actually enjoyed those games. But fucking Vicki Vale as "Lady Arkham." Cmon boys.

>lucy was bruce's kid all along

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Well, during that period Batman pretty much had a harem. There was Batgirl, Vicki Vale as a Lois Lane copy knowing his identity and sometimes helping with the cases, Julia Pennyworth Alfred's daughter thirsty as fuck for Batman, Nocturna, and so on. Then Moench killed Nocturna and had Catwoman show up as a contender. No, seriously. Moench butthurt about Nocturna getting ahead of the game brought back Catwoman and killed Nocturna. It's like... the writer didn't know which one to set Batman up. So in the end right before the reboot they just had Batman with them all. All of them hanging in the cave and shit just wanting for Batman to order them around.

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Batgirl had been taken out, by marrying her to Jason Bard and setting up her at DC as congresswomen. The vampire Nocturna was killed off. Moench wanted Catwoman to win the bowl, but Vicki Vale and Julia Pennyworth had become an entertaining duo, so he was fucked. So in the end Catwoman loses, but because the reboot is coming Moench says fuck it and had Catwoman, Vicki Vale, and Julia Pennyworth all became Batman's girlfriends. I'm not even kidding.

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Talia won as well. So it is Catwoman, Talia, Julia, and Vicki.

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When the fuck was the last time Vicki Vale was even considered to be a love interest lmao

I like BatCat because they're both autistic and can't give up their lives and wont ever be able to retire but occasionally find some comfort with each other.

This
Sasha is the perfect waifu Bruce can never have

Hell I think the LEGO Movie 2 was the first mention we have of her anywhere in the past 20 years.

I mean, in fairness, that's what marriage is isn't it?

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She was in Batman Eternal and the big bad in the Telltale game. But she wasn't trying to hop on Bruce in either of those.

Or a toxic couple that end in double homicide.

Like I said. That's what marriage is, isn't it?

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batman shouldn't have a love interest.

>plasticmans literal fucking poker face

there's only one choice

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Superman.

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Said comics are non canon retard

They were canon once upon a time.

Half the things cited by both catfags and wonder-bat retards in this thread are non Canon now
Don't be an autistic Canon fag

Keeping scrupulous track of what's canon is what's autistic. DC reboots and retconns this shit all the time. But everytime they do, it just adds to the lore.

Talia. I have weakness for the families and she is the only one with a son of Batman. (the only one important) I think that comics often ruin that story just because Talia must to be evil.

> losing the argument
shout MUH REDDIT SPACING

pure cancer that have filled selinafags' brains

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where is this from?

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Every one of those posts reeked of autism. Dude came off like he was either some rank contrarian with everything to gainsay and nothing to offer, or some butthurt Wonderbat shipper feeling the ground cave in from under him.

Waste no time on autists with brainrot.

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> selinafag trying to call others on brainrot
my sides. wonderbat and catbatfags are both equally cancerous

Talia makes a ton of sense on a certain level. She has rules and a goal in a way Catwoman doesn't. And while the whole Damian-as-rapebaby line is creepy, idk if I see her as truly evil. But she's too focused on her own methods to really make it work with Batman. In the end, Batman isn't an authoritarian, and he'd much rather become an outlaw than a tyrant, which I why I see him working better with Selina.

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>t. brainlet with nothing positive to offer.
Bang on about Wonderbatfags and Selinafags all you want. It's people like you that universally shit up this whole site with your anal retentive garbage.

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kys

shippers are the 2nd biggest cancer in fandom after waifufags

ITT: autism speaks

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No, it's just that every comic Batman love story has been terrible.

>Sup is pure platonical
> Constantine is sexual tension only allowed easing in hardcore fucking of some rendome slut while yelling the name of each other in climax
>
>
>
>Joker ass belongs to Gorden

>Imagine clicking on this thread, not expecting to find shoppers, and being pissed that there are.

You do this to yourself user. Stop hitting yourself.

And honestly, beyond some Wonderbat spam posts here, there aren't that many shippers in this thread. Just people having relatively decent discussion on their options concerning the topic in OP.

So remove the dildo from your ass and breathe easy you absolute faggot.

BASED.

the point is that there are no good ships for bruce. he had a chance with selina and the dumb cunt blew it. i don't need to remove any dildos since you're so anally frustrated about it and trying to astroturf wonderbatfags as the problem when in reality the whole thread is cancerous

Well it is now that you're here. Gtfo of threads that chaff your anus. No one's forcing you to be here.

I love comfy JLA scenes like this.

I couldn't tell what it was. That's brilliant.

>the point is that there are no good ships for bruce
This is just proof your real holdup is with Tom King, who has fucked your brain so hard you now have AIDS of the mind. This bullshit that superheroes are destined to be foreveralone.jpg is just incel projection. He already has a son or the equivalent in the Robins. There's no reason he shouldn't have a wife too. Just because you're a sexually frustrated child with no hope of ever being with a women doesn't mean your heroes have to be one.

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>Welcome to Yea Forums.

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>That time Michael Caine mixed up his Batman and Harry Brown scripts

That's Michael Gambon my dude.

Ha. That's awesome.

>Michael Gambon
I'm pretty sure that's Ian McKellen

Pretty sure it's Richard Harris.

How dare you disrespect the late John Hurt like that.

king is absolute shit but it is canon now, so selinafags are going to have to deal with the fact that their otp is ruined for at least 25 years :^)

> muh incel projection
you're the one who is projecting. heroes having spouses are great, i have no problem with this. lois & clark are great, reed and susan are great, i have no problem with peter with mj or felicia. but bruce is broken, selina "fixed" him then left him at the alter, breaking him even more. it'll take another generation for a writer's attempt to give him happiness to stick

not my fault the status quo reigns supreme and dc wants their edgelord forever alone bruce

>DC
You mean Paul DiDio still wants him forever alone. Whether Bruce wants to settle down is up to him, but this idea that he can't be happy and be batman is rarted and refuted multiple times in multiple sources.

>Muh canon.
Caring about canon. In the current year.
Oh you silly, silly child. Nobody gives a shit about that. Both DC and Marvel have had drunk captains for the past ten years, and have "canonically" ruined more characters you can stick a shake at. But all it takes is a giant reset button or a well written oneshot to bleach the cancer from one's mind. Rebirth came so fast after New 52 it wasn't even funny, and that was the issue where BatCat actually hooked up "onscreen."

People's memories are shorter than yours, my dude. They don't hang on to things like you do for 25 years...

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That's fucking Alec Guinness you twatthicket.

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