Non metal fans of Yea Forums...

but 90% of blackmetal vocalists sound like an teenager with 3 months experience

>Have you ever tried to explore similar black metal bands/albums?
name some or else

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Paysage D'hiver would be the most obvious one

darkspace is pretty good atmoblack

Not exactly. Black Metal is intended to be aggressive and evil, and quite often it wants to portray emotions of hate, anger, and a desire for violence (unlike Death Metal which portrays violence in and of itself). This is where the atmospheric elements usually come since it's related to the satanic and occult imagery that it wants to project into the listener's head. Filosofem and Transilvanian Hunger are probably the most famous, classic examples of when all of this is brought together but with a great deal of focus on the atmosphere, but the atmosphere is not the point, it's only a means to an end.

So when people say they think atmoblack was a misstake it's because the subgenre generally learned the wrong lesson from these albums. The majority of atmoblack and Depressive Black Metal albums take the atmospheric aspects and then leave out the aggressive ones with the hatred and anger gone, leaving an angsty, self-pitying feel that is completely disconnected from what the originators of Black Metal had intended. It's basicallly just a hollow shell, consisting only of the fast tempos, tremolo picked guitars and high pitched vocals that sound like Black Metal but it isn't. The aggressive riffs aren't there, the hateful vocals aren't there, and the sound is polished to be as relatable as possible.

I still think Filosofem and Hvis Lyset Tar Oss are fantastic albums because the anger is still there, the hatred of the modern world shines through but it's also resigned to the fact that what we've lost is gone forever ("That which once was", "The Castle in the dream", "If the light takes us" etc). Subsequent albums in this style completely missed the point and took the genre in a direction that doesn't fit at all.

Good analysis. It really is such a shame that atmoblack subsequently never reached the peak of the 4 first Burzum albums again.

it is good.

Wolfmachine is a solid take on hypnotic atmospheric black metal

youtube.com/watch?v=HsqHb4zX-64

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Interesting. I've never heard anger in FIlosofem. More anguish and despair.

>Black Metal is intended to [...]

Stopped reading there. I don't think there's one single intended purpose behind any genre, let alone a massive one with branching sub-genres like black metal. Expand your thinking.

based Möckl posters

To directly answer you:
I generally don't like metal because I find it too cringy and musically boring. It also doesn't scratch the itch if I want something violent (hardcore punk, industrial or stuff like Techno Animal and Death Grips do it for me) or noisy and aggressive (I turn to noise, free jazz and experimental.

I do however really like Earth, Sunn O))), Murmuure, dungeon synth in general, Black Sabbath, etc. I can't really pinpoint what these things have in common that make me like it - maybe they aren't overproduced and feel much more stripped down in terms of theme, sound, imagery etc.

What metal have you listened to that you would classify as cringy and boring? What makes hardcore punk less cringey?

pd'h and darkspace totally sidestepped this issue. If anything most of Mockl's music is more aggressive or at least on par with TH, Filosofem and HLTO

You're splitting hairs. It's not meant to say that any one band drew up a blueprint for Black Metal and said "here's what it will be about" and everyone followed, because literally no one thinks that's the case.

Black Metal could - just like any culture or subculture - be identified only once it was established, which it was organically. When that is done we're required to look at what Black Metal is and what producers and consumers within the subculture are all about. Here's where "intention" comes into play. Why are musicians using the name? And those who are, what are they trying to achieve? There we see Black Metal created with an intention. Read my post again with this in mind and you'll see my point.

The big ones like Metallica, Megadeth etc.
All of hair metal like Whitesnake etc.
Metalcore, deathcore and everything related.
Power metal etc.

I agree that hardcore punk is pretty cringy with a few exceptions. I dig Big Black and Fugazi.

>I turn to noise, free jazz and experimental.
t. has heard Merbow, Peter Brotzmann and Captain Beefheart once

>gives examples of metal
>metallica, whitesnake metalcore
God damn it. I mean, it's fine if you don't like metal, but at least listen to something more than metal's equivalent of Blink 182 before you write the entire genre of as "cringy and boring".

I didn't mean to come off this stuck-up. I'd be really glad to explore and change my mind if you give me some albums or charts.

I'm a trained jazz musician for fucks sake

I don't have to many charts on me at the moment and I can't be fucked to make a proper list, but this one works decently. Otherwise, despite what one might think, /metal/ are usually pretty helpful in providing charts and entry level recs.

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And I'd say you're right. I don't write of the genre completely and I also don't think it's inherently bad in and of itself, I'm just trying to enlighten outsiders as to why people in the scene don't always see atmoblack as a natural continuation of Black Metal.

Your posts were fine man. The big thrash metal bands, hair metal, and metalcore are the most common points of entry for metalheads. If you listened to those you gave it an honest shot.

because it's easy to listen to
intro song is pretty "catchy"

I mean, I haven't even listened to them on purpose, they were just all around me from around age 12 until college, since the local youth scene was really all about metal and I was into jazz and everyone mocked me as the weird music guy.
Also, in my entire life of listening to music and attending concerts, I haven't met a single metalhead looking person that listened to a lot of stuff outside the trash/hair/core group.
People who were into black metal, sludge, grindcore, drone or nu were simultaneously also into many other genres like jazz and techno.
So yeah, I associate metal with cringe and trash/metalcore.

yeah you right. I agree with your first post by on large. A lot of new atmo-black bands (especially post 2000) definitely fall into what you talked about.

I only enjoy it with my good headphones on, sounds kinda fuzzy and warm, almost like heavy shoegaze. I've made no real effort in looking deeper into black metal so I don't know if other albums are like this but they might be.

>Paysage D'hiver
>French/Swiss band
didn't realize you where a faggot, user

It's Swiss-German actually. He just took the name from a french art exhibition IIRC.

the melodies are pretty

why is darklands the jamc album and not psychocandy, it's so clean sounding, it's basically a new wave record

>sleeping with sirens
>in the melodic metalcore section
delete this right fucking now

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My point remains the exact same way. You're acting as if "Black metal" has one unified goal that, once emerged, became fixed. I think any genre definition is naturally vague at best and can change over time, where it will eventually lose its meaning. Notice how little descriptive power the work "rock" holds today, after almost a century of erosion and splitting.

Just because a definition changes over time it doesn't mean it's made completely meaningless. Also, I'm not the one using workds like "unified" or "fixed" when describing Black Metal, essentialist definitions are lacking for precisely the reasons you're describing, it all turns into "is a hotdog a sandwich" type of questions where there will be differences of opinion regarding how you would classify certain bands. But at some point it will be necessary to have general definition of things. To use a thematically fitting analogy, there's no clear line where earth's atmosphere ends, but that doesn't mean we can breathe in space.

I was trying to answer the question why there are people that consider themselves fans of Black Metal that also don't like Atmospheric Black Metal. What separates the two? And I think my analysis still holds up.

If the light takes us is an objectively easier listen.

No it's not. The guitar sound isn't as fuzzy but that's about it. Inn I Slottet Fra Drommen alone is way less accessible than anything on Filosofem

bump

I'm listening to this album as a metal fan and this mix is fucking garbage and I'm impressed that anyone finds this engaging or ambient. The high end is so ridiculously tinny and painful I can't find myself listening passively to this, unfortunately.

>The high end is so ridiculously tinny and painful
That is literally the best part of the album you weak faggot

Who would knowingly and willingly subject themselves to actual pain for no other purpose than that of vanity and aesthetic? That's the gayest thing I've ever heard in my life.

You are completely missing the point. I have never experienced pain while listening to Filosofem. It's not really that harsh. The point of the production is to obscure the riffs in distortion to give them a sort of blury and psychadelic effect. Had the production been cleaner the songs would not have as much of an impact. I'm not caling you a faggot because "I like pain", I'm calling you a faggot because of your inability to listen to anything with production values rawer than Five Finger Death Punch.

FFDP sucks ass dude, you wouldn't know a good mix if it kicked you in the fucking dick. The FFDP attack really dates you, by the way. If you want to call the kids fags for listening to popular metal make fun of Polyphia or Architects or something.

If you want to obscure the riffs in distortion, do that. Fucking remove the noise though, it's aimless and the high end nonsense provides literally nothing. There is sonically nothing there. I would be cooler with the noise in the mid ranges if anything and it would make far more sense. This album is mixed and engineered fucking horribly. This is garbage. You're asking me to look at a painting with the portrait lights pointing right at my fucking eyes. Seriously, I just did a lowpass move in my DAW with this album and it's already 500% times more listenable. These guys had shot ears or something.

and for good measure, here's a fucking anime response picture.

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low tempo + repetition, and good recording quality, make this pretty accessible
controversy helps too