The worst thing to happen for manga/anime is that otaku became its biggest audience

That's why it mostly self insert wish fulfillment crap that never amounts to anything. It's not just destroying the medium, its destroying its audience as well. Look at this place and anime portions any SM, it's mostly coomers and self inserters.

I thought it was weird that Hideki Anno had such a hyper specific message like not wallowing in wish fulfillment but after witnessing first hand the pathetic lows that such life style and mentality would lead to, I sympathise with him. But considering that all people see in eva itself is waifufagging and coom, I know that there is no hope for either the medium or most (but not all) of its fanbase.

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>all people see in evangelion is waifufagging and coom

Nah I see incredibly depressed people abusing children and fighting a hopeless war against angels and themselves.

Most fans then* but you get the point.

Every time I give anime a shot its always cringy clichés. I legit think being a weeb in 2022 is worse than being a weeb in 2016. So much wish fulfillment thats clearly a mangaka's fetish projection about his lost highschool years. I dont wanna watch another man's perversion animated and sold to weird people, but I DO wanna watch something anime-ish

You’re falling for the ‘most outspoken is the real fanbase’ meme

My arguments are rock solid coomer. Whatever you think of my motivations is irrelevant.

I always refer to her as Seiba because I refuse to acknowledge that King Arthur is a depressed 14 year old girl who just needs 10000 folded japanese high school student dick.
It's disgraceful. Nasu is a hack.

You're too young to know what "otaku" means.

I'm not a zoomie.

I posted saber because she was one of those wish fulfillment characters in a show that at least pretended to be something more than crass fetish of the author. This was a show by a literal eroge writer and it's less base and vile than most crap out there today.

i thought gate keeping was good

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>Seiba is not from an eroge
>not eroge
user, I...

user, read what I wrote. I say it is from an eroge writer

Ah. I see. You're saying that even this eroge character is deeper.
Except it's not. Stop talking about FSN like it's some masterpiece. Except Sparks Liner High

>otaku became its biggest audience
I'm positive that it's factually incorrect.
Anime is mainstream now and otaku is a minority.

I'm not saying it's a masterpiece or even deep for that matter. I'm saying it at least gives it story some window dressing like a theme or a narrative so that it isn't just pure fetish shit. I'm saying how far anime has fallen that an eroge looks better in comparison.

But then again, so are otaku. Western youngsters are depressed, increasingly lonely, and increasingly investing in fiction. It's been confirmed that Gen Zers are more likely to report having no sexual partners than millenials and Gen Xers. They're less likely to own a home as well.

Anime is becoming mainstream at the same time as Oatkudom or maybe the two are interlinked.

There was like an audience shift 10 years ago, at least in forums, meets and chats. It shifted from having both sexes and all personality types to an all-wojak community where everyone looks like a stalker, stoner or sex offender. Or a little bit of A, B and C.
Looking at sales and advertising, people watch anime more than ever, they just don't go to communities. And people used to talk about anime all the time when I was in high school and college, now it never gets brought up as a subject.

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I just realized you can replace "anime" with "bdsm" in the post and still get the same meaning.

Can you tell me more about your planet? The one where divorce-rapes, false rape accusations, paternity frauds or feminism don't exist?

Gate keeping is good when the main audience is good. Otaku's gatekeeping is bad because they are keeping out actually intelligent worthwhile people.

Yes, user anime is for losers nice to see you finally realized this. You can fuck off back with your normalfag friends now.

Please don't engage in discussions without taking your meds.

Where is your study showing the make-up of its fandom?
Stop projecting the behaviour of some loud retards onto the whole.

it doesn't pander to otaku, wish-fulfillment and self-insertion stories panders to soulless enthicies like pajeets,SA spics, arabs and blacks.
anime is now about earning a quick buck from most braindead apes there is

>otaku
Chinese people.

Don't use your native retardese to start a thread.

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Look, I agree with you, but also want to challenge our view.
When we compare to other mediums, it doesn't seem to be an otaku problem.
If we go to literature, you probably don't realize how popular female oriented, coom self-insert wish fulfillment fantasy there are.
I do think there are nuances we should talk about regarding this specific otaku culture - which in this board, for how much we love to talk down on other communities, such as Gaia in the past, we sure don't show to be any better - but at the same time, a percentage of it must only be a "people problem".
Comparing to older times, the audience for everything will most likely be bigger now, which will attract what most people in general like, which will make it harder for works with substance to be found.
Sometimes being part of this culture doesn't mean just accepting everything on the surface level. It means, for me, to tolerate the smell of shit in order to occasionally find some really precious gems.

Anyone who can be kept out by otaku is not worthwhile. They're desperate.

Go check the catalog of Yea Forums. Tell how much of it focuses on waifus.

You dumb monkeys don't have a view to challenge, or even anything to say. You get a charge out of any form of acknowledgement.

>I legit think being a weeb in 2022 is worse than being a weeb in 2016
You tourists certainly are a different breed

But genderswapped historical figures are my thing. Same with comfy bathing scenes.

I'm glad you, the smart monkey, was able to contribute to the discussion with your beautiful projection.

>The worst thing to happen for manga/anime is that otaku became its biggest audience
Nothing directed at normalfags has ever been good

That is an awfully specific thing. Have you read Cerintha?

Hey maybe Vučić over here is right.
When I was in college I didn't have any problems meeting women. There was no passive aggression, ignoring and ghosting, you either liked each-other or you didn't.

I think, even bigger than that, is that otaku have become a major chunk of the *creators*. It’s not a bad thing to love anime/whatever medium/genre you’re working on. But a lot of these new generation guys ONLY love anime. Their whole lives, all they consume are otaku media. They don’t travel, they don’t read widely, they don’t interact with a wide and varied slice of humanity. They watch anime, play vidya, read LNs, and talk to other otaku about those things.

When they get into making media, this means that all they can possibly produce is a regurgitated slop of older media. It’s why all modern iesekai is so garbage—it’s just the same components sloshed around inexpertly.

You can’t make interesting art if you’re a boring person. A rich and varied internal life is required to produce the experience to create insightful work.

I liked Koihime Muso for the genderswapped historical figure aspect that awakened my fetish for it and its set in its appropriate period and I've seen a few more like it. Ulysses: Jeanne d'Arc and the Alchemist Knights will be on my next try.

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I think the problem is less that the creators are otaku and more that they've switched the focus of their work from the audience to themselves. Putting isekai as an example, before they were focused on creating interesting worlds and compelling characters. Now they seem more interested in venting some high school grudge about bullying or whining about not being recognized while wageslaving. Same with shounen and romcom mangaka, either proyecting failed romances or trying to justify their views on relationships.
Curent authors are way too selfish to divorce themselves from their own works. Nothing good can come from what's essentially the author's therapy session.

>Now they seem more interested in venting some high school grudge about bullying or whining about not being recognized while wageslaving.
I've never actually watched any of those shows. I'm watching 12 kingdoms right now and I don't really see it. There's definitely some author stuff there like a bunch of characters trying to awkwardly explain the concept of compatibility to a ten year old, but nothing that's overtly visible as the author's revenge towards someone irl.

12 Kingdoms is from the 90s, of course you wouldn't. The breaking point that sent everything to the shitter was either 2006 or 2009 whether you consider the bar for LNs being massively lowered or the advent of the isekai genre as the main reason for it.

>liking anime means i have to like every single anime
why are idiots like you so retarded

>anime is now about earning a quick buck from most braindead apes there is
except that those people don't buy or pay for anime in any way.
So the audience is basically otakus in japan and western nations

>creating interesting worlds and compelling characters
If only some nice user were to list some examples.

Get the fuck out and kill yourself, retarded normalfaggot.

>c**mer
You don't belong here on Yea Forums.

>If we go to literature, you probably don't realize how popular female oriented, coom self-insert wish fulfillment fantasy there are.
Thats because of how low the barrier of entry is to writing stories. Anyone can do it. And so there are authors who cater to the literature version of otakus.
With anime tho thats not the case. So its not an equivalent comparison. It would be better to compare them to movies and tv shows.
Especially since alot of the otaku pandering anime are adapted from LNs that pander to the same audience
And with this comparison its clear that anime has a large population of otakus.

manga / anime that are not otaku oriented are generally held in much higher esteem by the anime community itself.

Nah, it's just too bland nowadays.
Fire Force and Chainsaw Man were actually a good step towards fresh creative air.
But most mangas aren't like that - mainstream I mean of course. Niche stuff will always be interesting.
But the otaku mainstream is kinda blandening.
Like Black Clover for example. The MC is initially introduced to love an older woman and he wants to get stronger for her sake. Then they just drop that subplot and give him a cliche tsundere. Like what?
Current mangakas wanna be too formulaic, very few wanna show something grandeur and le KEWL. Nobody wants to leave the comfort zone and when they do they more often than not get axed so it's really an audience problem, and who's the audience? Japanese youth.
Japanese youth has stopped dreaming of grand, interesting things and implausible worlds and happenings.
well that's just my theory

Only retards pay for media, so media is all for retards. Makes sense.

Actually the Chinese market makes more than USA and France (the only Western countries that actually sizably matter as anime consumer markets) combined IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY so maybe Japan is now pandering to China.

Nah, pirates are retarded as well
look at the top manga in piracy sites, its all wish fullfilment / isekai crap
The majority of the anime audience is retarded, whether they pay or not.

>Don't fucking knowns what the fuck Otaku is
>Catering to your fanbase is bad
You are fucking retarded

>Now they seem more interested in venting
>Nothing good can come from what's essentially the author's therapy session.
user, some of the most influential works of art in hystory are people focusing on themselves and exmploring they're psyche, what are you talking about

>Sabercuck OP is retarded and wastes his life away making bait threads
Many such cases

Retard

>saberposters in charge of posting

>piracy sites
Fellow kids, etc.

I will break your spine like a twig. You don't get to dictate anything subhuman. You're watching anime because of anime that wasn't purely directed at subhumans like you.