Critics hated it

>critics hated it
>audiences loved it
>Yea Forums hated it

Why?

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Yea Forums culture is to be contrarian

I liked it

Yea Forums pretended to hate it because “he’s not the joker”

I don't think most of Yea Forums hated it. But it has almost nothing to do with Batman comics. The character's origin and personality are nothing like anything from the comics. It has a lot more in common with Taxi Driver than Batman comics.

>critics hated it

huh? didnt this movie win like a shit ton of awards

This, they should like whatever I like

I don't know why right wing tards love this film thinking like it's death wish. Do they not know Joker would kill people like them as seen with those three american psycho rejects on the train.

Yea Forums hated it because the media told them to hate it because evil Yea Forums chuds were the good guys in it or whatever
fucking yikes all around you people are pathetic and predictable

>REEEEE RIGHT WINGERS LIVE IN MY HEAAAAD

>joker has 68% on rotten tomatoes

Birds of prey has 79% lmao

68% is a bad movie

He killed 3 wall street brookers, his former friend for ratting him out(to be fair tho his boss had every right to fire him cause he brought a gun to children hospital and he couldn't even put it in place where no one would search for it before his act), his schizo mother and Di Nero. Also it has anti-capitalist message which for some reason evil Yea Forums chuds wouldn't like.

But it''s true.

Would anyone have cared about it had it been called literally anything else?

Why do you think Yea Forums nazis love capitalism. Nazism is literally state socialism

No, it was originally made as King of Comedy by a respected director and didn't even break $10 million dollars.

Absolutely not

Also, DeNiro is the star of the first version, rather than the host of a show.

I never even stated they were nazis just right wingers. And lets face it, economics was never the focal appealing thing about nazism.

I know that this might be a new concept to Yea Forums, but it's actually remarkably common in Yea Forums-proper, but a single good lead acting job CAN NOT save a film that is, by all other metrics, a piece of shit. It just can't.

You are mentally ill and you think the strawmen that live in your head rent-free are real people. Get help. Please. You are a human being and you are sick. This is not how things are. Healthy people don't think like you.

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The movie was good.

critics: it's a worse version of better movies
audiences: it made them feel smart

that they live in your head?

>economics was never the focal appealing thing about nazism.
Nazism literally sprung out of a reaction to the collapse of the German economy and hyper-inflation.

It means 68% of critics liked it; it's not equivalent to scoring 68% on a test where it means it's only 68% good. Lower critic score means it's more divisive. You could have a 90% critic score where it means 90% of critics thought it was alright and worth a watch, or a 68% score where 68% thought it was amazing. I'd rather watxh the latter. Divisiveness is not bad, especially as mainstream critics will have different values than me.

It really, really wasn't. The writing was nonsensical. The subtext was laughable. The toning was borderline plagiarized. Cinematically it was competent but all high budget films are cinematically competent these days.

Your standards just suck and you're easily swayed by lesser aesthetics.

Watch King of Comedy. Far better film that does a much better job with its subject matter. Also Phoenix is insanely overrated.

Exhibit A everyone, the way this user expose himself with his projection and I didn't even say anything defamatory really proves my statement.

It's not high budget by reasonable standards, it's just a really inexpensive premise, borderline television-show.
It is completely a crib of a Scorcese film with Joker's IP painted on top of it rather sloppily, as it really plays fast and loose with the whole idea of the Joker Character.
I don't regret watching it once, I will never watch it again willingly.

That right wingers as usual took the wrong message or is oblivious to it.

And Hitler didn't even care about the economics of ideology consider lesser importance. And as you see their economy built on warfare it shows how little he truly cared.

It wasn't.

Hitler was using the Jews "villainous" usury as a premise to unite debt-stricken Germany to his cause, and seized their property and erased their banking records as a way of eliminating debt.
Nazism was completely grown from Economic stress.

this movie is so on the nose. it's like OKAY I GET IT, SOCIETY SUCKS. I can understand why critics would not enjoy it. Whereas the audience is people who aren't as jaded.

What? cause killing people with your own two hands is cool.
Lol, Joker didnt care about brapitalism in it at all. He fucked over people who he felt fucked over him. He didnt do it because he wanted a stimulus check. The other people cared about that shit, but not the joker.

>He used anti-semetic reasons to get into power to enact anti-semetic policies

No shit.

Joker is literally a character who wants Socialized Medicine to keep his life tolerable.

>All of Nazi Germany was just Hitler
>No individual citizens, just Hitler
>Who totally didn't blame the Jews for hyperinflation and a crashing economy
>He just chose to scapegoat them for no reason

>Also Phoenix is insanely overrated
I thought his acting was incredible.

>What? cause killing people with your own two hands is cool.
He use a gun tho

>Lol, Joker didnt care about brapitalism in it at all. He fucked over people who he felt fucked over him. He didnt do it because he wanted a stimulus check. The other people cared about that shit, but not the joker.

The character in the film might not care but we're talking about the themes and message the director is trying to portray. And nothing wrong with having a stimy.

Nah, you like most left wingers, are just myopic on top of inauthentic.
yah, he wanted shit for himself. Wasn't that the whole point with people thinking he represented shit when he didn't. he was anarchic in his motivation with the bleak backdrop of fiscal depression.

Rupert Pupkin is nothing like Arthur.

I swear, the retarda aping this “hurrrr joker is just king of comedy and taxi driver” nonsense haven’t actually watched either of them.

>Also Phoenix is insanely overrated.
I hope you don't mean in general. Because that's a murderable offense.

people hate the fanboys, kind of like how people like pulp fiction but hate people who LOVE it.

yah, But even thematically, I felt that was more a backdrop to the joker as a character study. The director literally went out of his way to have it so that others coopted his shit to mean what they wanted, and he didnt share any of that. It was a rage against society, not about any particular system. I thought the subtext was pretty blatant as well as how the policy backdrop was portrayed as others projecting onto the character. Not saying it was pro brapitalism, but the focus was very much on the indivigual in relation to society as a whole rather than particular policies. His gf dillusions, his failed comedy, etc.

Joker is the one villain whose origins aren’t set in stone. They can be whatever so long as he’s Joker at the end.

You give absolutely no real argument in any of these replies. It's so bad you not only samefagged but you also have a mental breakdown.
>Aesthetic
The movie is nothing like Scorsese's style beyond having a similar setting. The color, the story, all of it goes in a different way to KoC and TD. It feels like you didn't watch either of those
>The writing
Everything in the movie has a purpose for a next scene. Every thing that's set up has a purpose. The gun, Randall, Wayne, all of it has a purpose. The whole story of the riots itself is in the background because Arthur himself is so disconnected from the world he barely even notices when everything around him is going to shit.
>Toning
Tone is not plagiarism, you fucking idiot. If that was the case every movie from a same genre would be plagiarism. 70s movies are all like that ,specially movies set in a city. Learn some history, stupid zoomer, of why that happened.
>Your standards just suck
Talking about standarts yet you can criticize, argue, or do anything but get personal because you deep down know you really have no real defense beyond buzzwords and repeating an argument that you can't even really understand. Also, stop the obvious samefagging. 19 posters and 43 replies is pathetic. Either is Ladderfag again or that crazy faggot obsessed with Joker from Yea Forums

My grandfather was a semi famous clown back in the old country.
The Joker's makeup in this movie closely resembles my Grandfather's old clown makeup, right down to the green hair.
Make the suit yellow and give him a boater hat and it's my grandfather.

Did you miss the part where he probably wasnt even sick?

The usual response to this is

>NOOOO HE ISN’T A SUPER COMPETENT SUPERVILLAIN WIRH LAUGHING GAS ITS NOT RIIIIGHT

A Golden Lion winner movie doesn't win only because acting. The movie got praised in Europe and all over the world but Europe. One reason, specially: mutts from Twitter wanted this movie to start a mass shooting, nothing happened, so now they have to find any reason they can to shit on it. But most times they don't even really have an argument. It's enough to ask them to elaborate and they start sperging and crying.

>but Europe
but USA*

>Far better film that does a much better job with its subject matter.
What is Joker's subject matter?
>mental illn-
No, that's not it.
>CAPITALISM!
Neither. Joker is about repression and media being the reason mass shootings do happen. By example, Arthur ends up being a copycat of his own killing. Most of it because the media created this whole idea of what Joker is, not Arthur. Notice how Arthur starts copying the mask the media created for his Joker persona. The story is about how these people exist for one thing, which is the media. It gives them purpose, it starts riots, it controls everything and feeds on violence like that, and ends up creating a martyr view of violence. If anything the message of the story is to NOT idolize symbols of revolution, or someone that says stuff you agree with in TV, because all of them, deep down, want nothing but personal gain, superiority, control, etc.

>Nah, you like most left wingers, are just myopic on top of inauthentic.

Stop trying to Jordon peterson your way to some rebuttal with word salad without meaning.

It's fact rightwingers lost the point of the message and film, Spree film is more up your guys ally all the incel pretentious shit tho the only downside is the main character kills a racist first.

And I'm not even left wing.

>yah, he wanted shit for himself.
So he's essentially Republican, wants all the gibs he want, what's the problem then.

Found the coastal American.

So I was right.

>T, Seething midwesterner repub on welfare.

How do you miss the point this hard? Joker is not about those things. Yes, it takes the concept, of what 70s Scorsese was, but it gives them a nice twist. See, the story at the end is mostly about a mentally ill person that has been told all his life he's nothing but a loser because that: he has no intelligence, he fails at work, he makes stupid shit, the goverment doesn't even truly see him a as a person that deserves help. The world is basically telling Arthur he should kill himself because he is not worthy of living. He can't give anything back to the system, so he deserves to die, and that's all he thinks through the movie, even when people start seeing him as a symbol.
It's only at the end, after seeing how much power he can have in that moment, that instead of killing himself he chooses to live. Because he now loves to live. He understands despite all the horrible stuff that has happened in his life, he deserves to live, he deserves to be seen, because it wasn't "god" that made him like that, it was his mother. Basically he's gone so disconnected from the world he starts believing all that happened to him is for a purpose: to be what he is, what the world wanted him to be: a symbol.
And all of this is thanks to the media. Because instead of getting any kind of help from the system, Arthur got help from the media. The media that turned him into a symbol of power against the rich. He doesn't give a fuck about it, or the poor, or anyone, as he says before. But the moment he sees people are starting to see he "exists" he gives Arthur as whole and choses to be Joker, because Joker does matter to the system, he can be someone, even if he doesn't exist. Arthur is a nobody loser no one ever loved, but Joker can be something that matters. And the "joke" of the movie is that he doesn't really care about anything at all, but feeling loved.
Joker is not about society as whole but what happens when trauma... (1/2)

?
>Myopic
too narrow of a view. a limited narritivisation. Does that clear things up?
>rightwingers lost the point
ah yes the definitive rightist opinion that the movie is....

idk. I thought people liked it because it showed a personal story of an indiviguals development into a killer who took life into his own hands. I think thats probably the appeal. It really wouldnt have the same essence if he decided to run for office or force the mayor to put more money into the mental health program through unionization. When you say "right wingers" I assume you mean people who liked that aspect of it. which I think was the main point. A dangerous but alluring personal liberation. Not cucking to something else.

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nothing. Its quite American.

...(2/2) is never truly confronted. Everything happened because Arthur has never truly faced what happened to him. He repressed it so hard and the moment he saw it he breaks down so hard he believes said trauma has a purpose in his life. If someone had told him that before, maybe he could've been saved, but he didn't. He repressed that side of him all his life, just like Bruce Wayne.

Arthur Fleck is a parallel to Bruce Wayne. Both had something so horrible happen to them in childhood, and they deal with it in a different way. Both of them "died" that day. But Bruce had a person that loved him: Alfred. Arthur had no one. His mom didn't love him. No one did love him. Bruce and Arthur have the same tragic backstory. But Bruce became a better person because he was rich, because he was someone that mattered, and Arthur got told all his life he was nothing. That's why the story fits so well to the Batman lore as whole.

>I don't know why right wing tards love this film thinking like it's death wish
A character that never gets sex is relatable for them

Agreed

Great posts

Two scenes I’d like to point out in particular

1. When he kills his mother after she has her stroke and he found out about the abuse. He tells he always hated that name (Arthur Fleck). And we see in the adoption papers his name was unknown.

He then says that the compulsive laughter he suffers from that his mother told him was a condition, wasn’t one. That’s it’s just the “real me”.

After that screen we only see him laugh in much more natural ways but at fucked up things. E.g. the dwarf failing to get out of his apartment because the locks too high, the cops getting beaten to death shooting Murray.

Which makes him taking Joker as his actual name and entire identity pretty easy to understand

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>samefaggin this hard
We can see the poster count is still the same, ladderfag. Nice try tho

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2) this scene where he specified how he isn’t involved with the protests and doesn’t believe in anything

Where Batman’s entire mission and life is dedicated to a belief in justice. Joker doesn’t believe in ANYTHING. he’s not just a “villain” because he want to do bad things. He’s a villain because he’s a empty and doesn’t care beyond the moment

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>Also Phoenix is insanely overrated
He's not but Joker fucking sucks and KOC is a great film. Only time Iever liked Gerry Lewis

Yes. It's something like what happened to Jinx. Got so traumatized he either believed that "laugh" had a purpose. Basically got gaslighted so hard he stopped seeing himself as Arthur but as Joker.
I like that both Arthur and Bruce had their innocence stolen by a person they didn't even know. I also like that at first Arthur doesn't even hate Bruce, but wants to be his friend because he loves the idea of having a brother.