How would you fix them?

how would you fix them?

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Make them actually evil instead of misunderstood turning a new leaf.

Because that's the whole crux of what the fucking show could have been about FIGHTING THE FOFCES OF EVIL.

But nah we don't get to have nice things because like any good food if you let it sit for too long it turns gotten. Sorry so have to use a food analogy but that's the best I can describe this shoe in its current meta.

Make toffee a main character and have him be eclipsa's former lover trying to unfreeze her

Toffee and Ludo were the forces of evil.
A man of taste.

sounds like a whole new level of cuck

Mostly agreed.

I'm not sure that it was impossible to make them innocent in a believable way, but they certainly didn't pull it off. It felt so forced. I'm assuming the writers wanted them to be different from the other two main villains. Maybe they felt like it would seem repetitive if Eclipsia and Globgor had a redemption arc like Ludo, or if they died evil like Toffee. Maybe the writers wanted multiple categories of villains (redeemed, unremembered, and misunderstood innocents).

I think they wrote themselves into a corner with Globgor, when they made Eclipsa good. You can't really be a good person if you love and enable an evil one.

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>You can't really be a good person if you love and enable an evil one.
There's no limit for shit writing. Granted, Virgin Soul tried to paint Hitler as totally right but still showed all his brutality and lack of compassion

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Make a simple incision to stop the flow of sperm into the semen.

More than evil, I'd make them completely amoral. Well, Eclipsa should be amoral in the way that she rejects all kinds of duty for freedom as its more hedonistic and selfish expression while Globgor is fully evil. If people suffer and die for Eclipsa getting what she wants, she doesn't care. That's not much diferent from the canon Eclipsa except the narrative in this case would paint it as a bad thing and how Star realize this is a path she can't follow. You know, the old theme from S1 and S2, freedom vs duty.

Have them playing a ruse this whole time, If they did that and were actually evil I'd love it. You could even have a sweet moment where metora is adopted by Moon or star and still raised to be the new queen.

thats a big bulge

Oh man this show was such a fucking letdown. What a joke after the glory that was SnB S1.

Rather than evil, make him a Monster-supremacist. A morally gray individual that killed many mewman combatants in the belief that his views were right. Even his "romance" with Eclipsa was an attempt at undermining the power structure of the Mewni. Everything he does is just a means to an end. He's not evil, he just really cares about his fellow monsters.

With all that said, his conflict after being un-crystalized would be adapting to a world where his views are no longer needed, and monsters are doing their best to live alongside Mewmans. To him, it would be considered betrayal given how many of his allies had fallen to the Mewmans during the war.

>Rather than evil, make him a Monster-supremacist
Ludo and Toffee were that. Just delete Globgor and bring back best boys.

Toffee belong to Moon. In any case, Toffee could be Globgor's right hand and maybe he could learn magic from Eclipsa. Maybe we can erase Meteora by stating mewmans and monsters can't breed so Toffee was like their kid

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Ludo just wanted power, and Toffee was just a more competent Ludo. He seemed to be more in it for himself than the Monsters.
But it's been a while since I watched Toffee's arc, so maybe I have his characterization wrong.

I'm mostly just gonna focus on Eclipsa, both because Globgor hasn't received the extensive screentime or hype that she has for the last 3.5 years, and because I can see how making him evil would go against what the show's trying to say about monsters getting an undeserved bad rap (after monster villains like Toffee, Ludo, and Meteora even if they were going for "b-but it was the treatment she received that made her that way," it makes sense for Mina + possibly Solaria to be used as Mewman villains and somewhat balance them out). So in that case, and I've posted some of this before:

1. Globgor's actually good; Eclipsa's the evil one and has deceived him, or at least is selfish enough or has enough of a bizarre moral code to be using him for a bad purpose that he wouldn't go along with had he known. Ex. she says "all knowledge is good knowledge," pushes the limits of magic, etc. Maybe she hooked up with a monster and gave birth to a half-breed just to see what'd happen, and didn't really give a fuck about either of them. Maybe she really wants to like enslave Mewni or some dumb shit, and wanted to get even the monsters on her side. There's a lot that could be done

2. Get rid of the dark magic, like entirely. Eclipsa is villainized entirely because she left her kingdom for a monster. That way when she does turn out to be good, it feels like less of a letdown because we got exactly what we were promised. The dark magic can go to Solaria, and make her possibly being important at the very end of the last season have more of a leadup.

3. Globgor just killed Shastacan in his rage, not ate him. Someone can easily be killed in a fight/situation that escalates out of control, but eating feels both too purposeful and too sadistic to then accept him as a good guy (especially when he still jokes about his vore fetish). Maybe have it turn out him being eaten was propaganda and he just got killed, if the crew's just THAT vore-happy that they still want to mention it.

>innocent in a believable way
I would have loved it if they kept their same shmultzy, lovey-dovey relationship while still being the villains. I know a lot of villains get compared to them now but it would've been a great Monarch/Dr.Girlfriend dynamic.

Toffee and Moon could've had so much backstory and the show chose to piss it all down the drain

Kinda pic related. Have Eclipsa be completely uncaring about the troubles of the kingdom she abandoned and of the crimes of her lover, and be completely focused on her own hedonistic lifestyle. Not even caring about her own baby after learning that she did live a full life, and not even caring about her own lover until realizing/deciding that his release would make her life easier by having someone so huge at her side.

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4. Eclipsa's selfishness is a real, actual problem that Star has to deal with and has negative consequences throughout S4. I think they are/were trying to do that, but it didn't come across well. Maybe make her actions affect others more negatively-- like she blows off even the monsters she should be supporting in favor of Globgor, or forgets about Meteora and temporarily puts her in danger. Something so that it feels like a real character flaw.

5. Don't have Star like/trust her so much, or keep a cautious distance while keeping an eye on her. Something like the end of The Monster and the Queen would be good for their dynamic. This allows Star to feel like her own character (and dials back on the sense of "sucking Eclipsa's dick")

6. If Eclipsa's SO good and SO sad, make her come off as sad and scared about being apart from her family over 300 years in the future and desperate to learn what happened to her daughter, like from the beginning. The way the show plays her, as a funny kind confident smart badass who just seems so satisfied and calm all the time, she's just a Mary Sue: she's always cool and relatable and always right BUT ALSO she has a dark and troubled past (not really) so you have to like her and she deserves everything good she gets. If we have to feel sorry for her, then at least try to make us.

7. Related to this, Eclipsa's too damn confident and smug and has every reason to be because she's written as charming. Give her a personality that'd make it clear why Mewmans might not like her: ex. she openly dislikes Mewmans now, because of what was done to her and her family, and makes that clear. OR she's just a weirdo, maybe antisocial (I got that vibe back in S2, like she's talented but a little "off" in a lot of ways) and when Star tries to do things that push her into the spotlight, ex. Ponyhead Show, her social awkwardness or dislike of the situation makes her come off badly, even though she's really not a bad person.

Toffee didn't need a fanfiction tier backstory.

Having him kill Moon's pacifist mother is enough. You don't need a complex relationship behind to antagonize someone.

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8. Festivia was Eclipsa's first daughter with Shastacan. Eclipsa was unhappy in the arranged marriage and with her situation in life, and abandoned her husband and young daughter to pursue her own interests (Globgor's huge monster cock). Same stuff happens with Globgor frozen/Meteora taken, but there's more of an actual crime she could be charged with or sense that she's failed in her obligations to the kingdom. Star could lose faith in her when she learns about Festivia, and Eclipsa could seem less perfect and more flawed for having done something that'd probably inspire a lot of mixed reactions in the audience, i.e. walking out on her family even though it was a bad relationship. ALSO this gets rid of the weird blood purity fetish that S3 pushed, where Eclipsa deserves the crown entirely on the basis of her bloodline and Star's just filthy peasant scum. I'm aware S4 just showed there's nothing really special about either bloodline, but by the fact that the entire fanbase still talks about being a "real Butterfly" and other such bullshit, the damage has been done, with the anti-racism show seeming to hold up pure blood above all else.

9. This is what I thought they were going for at the end of S3. Eclipsa just wants her family back. She gets it. She has no interest in ruling Mewni, though, as she has everything she wants and her obligation to it ended over 300 years ago. Star is now the queen, with Moon missing, the kingdom wrecked, and the Mewmans distrusting her and her pro-monster beliefs after what literally just happened, and is now expected to pick up the pieces.

10. Meteora is trash; write out Meteora.

8. Festivia was Eclipsa's first daughter with Shastacan. Eclipsa was unhappy in the arranged marriage and with her situation in life, and abandoned her husband and young daughter to pursue her own interests (Globgor's huge monster cock). Same stuff happens with Globgor frozen/Meteora taken, but there's more of an actual crime she could be charged with or sense that she's failed in her obligations to the kingdom. Star could lose faith in her when she learns about Festivia, and Eclipsa could seem less perfect and more flawed for having done something that'd probably inspire a lot of mixed reactions in the audience, i.e. walking out on her family even though it was a bad relationship. ALSO this gets rid of the weird blood purity fetish that S3 pushed, where Eclipsa deserves the crown entirely on the basis of her bloodline and Star's just filthy peasant scum. I'm aware S4 just showed there's nothing really special about either bloodline, but by the fact that the entire fanbase still talks about being a "real Butterfly" and other such bullshit, the damage has been done, with the anti-racism show seeming to hold up pure blood above all else.

9. This is what I thought they were going for at the end of S3. Eclipsa just wants her family back. She gets it. She has no interest in ruling Mewni, though, as she has everything she wants and her obligation to it ended over 300 years ago. Star is now the queen, with Moon missing, the kingdom wrecked, and the Mewmans distrusting her and her pro-monster beliefs after what literally just happened, and is now expected to pick up the pieces.

10. Meteora is trash; write out Meteora.

I like 9, I mean that stuff still could have happened in the coronation episode, that the mewmans just don't accept Globgor and Eclipsa chose to stop being queen to be able to live with him and Meteora somewhere else
I still don't get why she became queen of the butterfly kingdom again considering she left it 300 years ago at her own free will

>with the anti-racism show seeming to hold up pure blood above all else.
yea this always confused the fuck out of me whenever I think about it too hard
>Meteora is trash; write out Meteora.
I'm going to respectfully disagree with this but I'm going to admit that this may be my uptight girls gone wild/monstergirl fetishes acting up

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If you ate humans for 300 years, or did anything terrible to an entire group of people, I wouldn't keep making jokes about how much you want to do that

>hey remember the holocaust?
>I'm no longer a nazi, but man it sure would be nice to kill some jews

>KIDDING HAHA OH YOU SHOULD HAVE SEEN YOUR FACE
>but seriously, get in this oven
>HAHA ANOTHER JOKE

what the fuck is wrong with him

The problem is not Meteora per se, but how she was written in with Eclipsa. Eclipsa is the root of any problems with Meteora.

Also I guess if this wasn't clear, these are supposed to be 10 different scenarios I probably would've liked better than what actually happened, not THEY SHOULD DO ALL THIS AT ONCE

Brilliant.

How about keeping their original theme which was interesting instead of trying to be clever by subverting expectations, and turning them into faggoty dindus?

Shut the fuck up already, your ship was always wildly out of character bullshit.

maybe, but it would be a lot more interesting to have him be someone other than a solider that got a lucky hit on the previous queen

I agree that they dropped the ball with his backstory, if it can even be called that, but no backstory is better than some OOC tumblr-tier fanfiction. See

they still have their flaws, the shitty thing is everything just got dropped after coronation to wrap up their plot